"Croatia won’t block Serbian integration"

Antun, surely you must be joking.
Serbia owes absolutely zero to Croatia, it is the other way around.
Croatia was on the wrong side in both world wars, and was never punished for Jasenovac, even though the Croats were more Nazi than the Nazis. The other genocide on Serbs, which happened with Operation Storm, you not only have not apologized for but it is a national holiday in Croatia!

We will support the independence of Istra which Tito gave to you as a present for losing WWII, over the backs of the victorious Serbs.

This Mesic is a 'reformed' red communist, and his comments should be completely ignored by all Serbs. They are irrelevant.
The fact is, Croatia will do whatever Germany tells her to do.

...and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH...
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)
--
Rightly or wrongly, the Serbian President (Tadic) has already apologised. Now when is Croatia going to apologise for the genocide committed during WWII and Operation Storm?

If you truly want peace in the region then it has to work both ways.

As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

Antun,

As an Irish Catholic, I think it should be the other way around. Croatia should unreservedly apologise for ethnically cleansing 250,000 Croatian Serbs during Operation Storm, allow them back to resettle in Krajina and provide them with compensation.

Quid pro quo as they say in Rome. After all, you Croats fired the first shots.

I am not racist
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

most racist people say that. let me guess, you even have some serbian friends?

I guess Mesic is not relevant to speak about that, because once when we get to that stage of advanced EU admission negotiation he will be having absolute NO say in Croatian politics, or simply said he will be out of his Office.

Croatian position would very much depend on next Croatian President, their public opinion, their Government position on that issue, political situation in our Region at that time particularly in Bosnia and "quality" of the Serbian and Croatian inter-relations probably very much affected with that pending ICJ case.

Taking all of this in account it is very much to believe that Croatia will be very much undermining Serbia's EU effort.

Mesic is the biggest yugoslav communist out there. Seriously his mum is Serb, his wife is Serb and his children are 3/4 Serb. Of course he would support Serbia's integration into the EU cause he loves Serbia because his half Serb. I hope no other Croatian President or Priminister turns out to be the same as him.
As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.

B92 should not waste its readers time by publishing political gossip, expecially when the person spreading it is a well known communist aparatchik who creates policy as the wind blows.
Mr Mesic is a spent force (if he ever was one) and his political imaturity is bordering stand up comedy. Please, give your readers more credit next time. Thank you

it will only be the other way around.
Serbia blocking Croatia ti get Krajina back!

We will see when it comes to that (EU acceptence) what the croats will do i would not put my money on it.

Well, my dear Serbian countryman, Antun comment here clearly illustrated what more then 80% of Croatian publics think abour Sebia in EU and confirmed my bellow written theory.

So long for our EU attempt and thanks God for that.

It is a very noble gesture from Croatia. In a reverse case I doubt we could expect the same from Serbia.
(Joe, 30 November 2009 15:22)

How would you come to this conclusion?

Tiger and all croats,
Krajina is Serbian land, it always has been. When you were polishing the shoes of the Austrian empires we Serbs were dying and fighting against the turks. We waited 500 years for Serbia to back in the rightful hands. We will wait 10,000 for the Serbian lands of Krajina to be ours again. Krajina is Serbia. It always has been it always will be, none of your made up stories of Bleiburg, homeland wars, or croatian fantasy history can or will change that.

What makes Mesic think Croatia's going to get into the EU before Serbia does?

And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product.
(Tiger, 30 November 2009 18:17)

It's always someone else who is the bad guy.

Maybe Croatia should de-Krajinize their politics??

"As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH.."


This is a pipe dream at best, some compensation for the families might happen especially after the ICJ case.
But i especially think vukovar should be rebuilt at the cost of serbia completely, and they should pay for damages against dubrovnik. I mean we are giving the krajina serbs money to rebuild there lives, serbia should be paying for croatians to rebuild there lives.

"And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product." (Tiger)

-- I'm not too particularly interested in how the Ustashe and the NDH is excused in Croatian historical memory. Whatever the explanation, it is a crime against humanity and regardless of its theoretical "origins" the perpetrators of the most slavishly loyal puppet state to National Socialism were Croats and the blood of Jasenovac is on their hands. Italians didn't pull the trigger, Croats did. Were all Croats part of it? Certainly not, and a good number of them made up Tito's Partisans. But while Serbs get collectively blamed for Vukovar and Srebrenica, the Croats want a free pass when it comes to the NDH, which by Tudjman's own admonition was little more than the national aspiration of the Croatian people. So in my opinion, until Zagreb formally apologizes for the NDH, fully distances itself from neo-Ustasha nationalism and renounces its own exclusionary enthnocentric narratives that define its political culture, people like Mesic have no grounds on which to call for Serbia to do anything in regards to Vukovar, Dubrovnik, or RSK.

Reconciliation must be reciprocal, and as far as I'm concerned, being neither Serb nor Croat, excusing something like the Ustashe on the "Italians", gives Serbs enough justification to excuse Vukovar on "Ottoman orientalism".

As an Irish Catholic, I think it should be the other way around. Croatia should unreservedly apologise for ethnically cleansing 250,000 Croatian Serbs during Operation Storm, allow them back to resettle in Krajina and provide them with compensation.

Quid pro quo as they say in Rome. After all, you Croats fired the first shots.
(Niall O'Doherty, 30 November 2009 17:38)

If you are really a Irish catholic, than I must be a Black African Jew.

It is a very noble gesture from Croatia. In a reverse case I doubt we could expect the same from Serbia.

Tiger and all croats,
there you go talking again, making up history, you think that because you repeat things over and over again, and because CNN and BBC repeat those lies for their own self-interests that they are true. Again, like your beloved Mesic who uses the well studied False Accusation Assault psychological mechanism to avoid the truth, you avoid the truth in a fantasy historical way. You lost in WWI, you lost in WWII, and you dont see it yet but you lost again by chosing the wrong side again. Krajina is Serbia. Those aren't your lands, you didn't defend them from the Turks, you didn't defend them from the Austrians, you didn't defend them from the Nazi's, no you helped them to try and get rid of the rightful owners us Serbs - you think it worked in 1995 when you tried to fulfill your coward hero's A. Pavelic plans. But it didnt work. Cause Krajina lives in every Serb, and we are patient, we waited 500 years, we will wait as long as it takes.

"Croatia will be in by 2011 and Serbia, if Croatia wishes, by 2017-2019..." (Gert)

-- You really think Croatia's that important? To Brussels, Croats, Serbs, Macedonians are all a bunch of seljaci. With Brussels still trying to digest Bulgaria and Romania, I wouldn't be surprised if Croatia gets stalled until it goes in with Serbia and Montenegro, or SCG's applications get sped up. I could be wrong, but aside from pretty beaches, Croats are little more tha cheap labor to the rest of Europe.

If you are really a Irish catholic, than I must be a Black African Jew.
(prizreni, 30 November 2009 19:39)

How sad most Kosovo Albanians think that the countries that recognized them have sympathetic populations...

Prizreni, do you know why so many internationals on here are pro-Serb? It is because most of us have served here and got to know people like you. That is the truth and you can try and make yourself feel better by claiming that all these internationals are Serbs in disguise, or you can be like Oaf and pretend to be a Westerner yourself (but try and do a better job of it...)

Here was your reality check.

Ranko, your over zealous comments are amazing. Did the Croats not fight the Turks as well. Was the Turkish advance not halted on Croatian soil. Did Croats not fight at the battle of Kosovo? Were there no Croats in the Hajduk pirates. Do the Bosniaks not have Croatian roots or are they just misguided Serbs? Did Croatian Serbs not fight with Croatia in the last war?

Perhaps things would be different if we agreed to submit to a Serbian King. However, we chose Western Europe and you chose the Oriental East. It must be our Frankish blood.

Kraina is now a part of Croatia and is recognized so by international law.

I find it a little strange that Serbs go on about how they were driven off these lands and that now they want them back, when Serbs drove ethnic Germans and Hungarians off their ancestral lands after WWII as well, and received portions of their lands also.

Look, as a Pole, I know we have been guilty of driving Germans and Ukrainians off their lands and taking them for ourselves also, but then again we lost huge portions of our eastern lands after the war and that population was deported from there as well to the new territories received from the Germans, so we were also victims but it does not seem so popular in Poland to go on about it.

The point is that in all these cases a war was fought and won by one side and lost by the other, winner takes all, loser does not, it has always been like that and always will be. Get over it.

Nationalist chauvinism and dreams of a "greater [insert country here]" really do get in the way of normal, rational thought.

Serbia will never enter the EU because it still has fugitive war criminals to capture.

In addition Serbia has yet to make a formal application in which the administrative process varies but for most countries it took about 8 years.

Therefore some of you Serbs need to face reality and quit going on about irrelevant things like the Ustasha and Jasenovac because these things have no impact on Croatia joining the EU. The current generation has nothing whatsoever to do with that period in time.

Lastly Croatia is nearing completion of this process and Serbia has yet to begin so therefore Croatia in all likelihood will be in the EU at least a decade if Serbia ever gets accepted so therefore Croatian can easily do to Serbia what Slovenia did to Croatia and that is to drag on the process as it seems fit. Remember that Slovenia was nothing but small fry in the EU but still stopped a future state for almost a year with its negotiations ....

Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia.

Croatia must spend more time sorting out disputed Serbian land before they have a chance of joining the EU. I know first hand that the Croatian government make it as hard as possible for Serbs to return.

an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

And as a Swiss I would love to have the all truth made on the balkan war, it is simply too easy to only blame one side whereas it is far from being clear!

By the way, if I remember well, Mr Brammertz has repeatedly said that he is not satisfied with Croatia when it comes to the cooperation with the Hague Tribunal, woundering why..

Does anyone in their right mind really think that Croatia can block Serbia’s entry into a park let alone the EU? No one is going to ask the Croats for the time of day let alone who or what country comes into the EU. The Poles learnt just how important they really are when they held the EU presidency and thought this was a good time to get even with the Russians for banning their beef imports. What a humiliating back down for them, even old Lech called it the greatest embarrassment orchestrated by the then Polish President and Prime Minister.

Croatia will do as it’s told, sit in the corner and keep quiet. Remember that the issue of borders has not been finalised between Serbia and Croatia; in fact it’s probably a very good idea for Croatia to go in the EU first. This will mean that the EU will do the real negotiations, including land reparations/compensation for displaced Serbs.

No this is not a joke! This is something that still has to be settled. Croats can jump up and down, but remember the EU feeds you and your politicians are well aware of this fact because without the EU topping up Croatia’s annual budget it would collapse.

The notion that Krajina is to be returned to Serbs is political immaturity and is voice by rabid nationalists only.
How can Croatia allow a hostile minority to reoccupy a territory. If this would happen a new Republic of Serbs would spring up and seek autonomy. Does this make any sense to allow. I have a better idea we will put all people of mixed Croatian and Serbian ancestry there. This will ensure good relations.

And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product.

What makes Mesic think Croatia's going to get into the EU before Serbia does?
(Mike, 30 November 2009 18:11)


Perhaps the fact that Croatia will end all chapters negociations next year....while Serbia has even not get SAA ratified yet (the very very very first step in EU integration process).

Once you get SAA ratified (find Mlladic first), then you should apply for a Candidate Status, then answer not less than thousands of questions, then your answers will be assessed, then you'll perhaps be given Candidate Status, then you'll have to ask for a negociations opening date, then carry out the negociations (anyway at least 4-5 years for more than 35 chapters)....etc...

You have it clear now....Croatia is at least 7-8 years ahead of Serbia.
Croatia will be in by 2011 and Serbia, if Croatia wishes, by 2017-2019...

How about Serbia de-Kranja Srpska their policies??? Why can't some arrogant Serb's look at how many Serb refugees the Croatian government have allowed to return to their home's yet how many Croatians are still not allowed to return to their homes in Republika Srpska???

Operation Storm was a genoice?? If it was a genoicide then there would be no Serb's in Croatia today. Why is the Serbian population in Croatia still the biggest ethnic minority group in Croatia???
(Antun, 1 December 2009 04:02)

Do You remember Erdut Agreement in 1995 after Operation Storm?? Under UN cover was created serbian autonmy in eastern Slavonija. But after UN withdrawal autonomy was abolished by Croatia in 1998 (year before NATO invasion agains Serbia).
Please tell me - if Croatia can liquidate serbian autonomy without any consequences, why You are against reintegration Kosovo with Serbia??

Peter,
you say that winner takes all...hmmm well according to your statement croatia shouldnt exist because as a state they lost both WWI and WWII, and guess what the Serbs were the winners and as forgiving as we are we didn't take our land back at that time. We created Yugoslavia based on forgiveness. You have to understand something and maybe you dont because you are Polish, but Krajina is Serbia. It will never be Croatian and it never was, doesn't matter if it is drawn on google maps as a part of croatia, it is in every Serbs heart, and we waited 500 years for the turks, we will wait 10,000 for Krajina. Croats think they got away with the killings and destruction of WWI, WWII, and 1995, but they don't see it yet but they lost. They will see it soon.

an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

People that go around wearing a halo tend to have them slip around the neck and strangle the wearer, so I wouldn’t rush to blame just one side, you Croats have a very dark history and people that live in glass houses should never throw stones.

How about Serbia de-Kranja Srpska their policies??? Why can't some arrogant Serb's look at how many Serb refugees the Croatian government have allowed to return to their home's yet how many Croatians are still not allowed to return to their homes in Republika Srpska???

Operation Storm was a genoice?? If it was a genoicide then there would be no Serb's in Croatia today. Why is the Serbian population in Croatia still the biggest ethnic minority group in Croatia???

"Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia." (SinCity)

-- Funny how you say this right after lecturing the Serbs over the alleged irrelevancy of the NDH and Jasenovac. So you still want a free pass for that, but you're going to push for justice in Vukovar and Krajina - two things you think are clearly relevant. Ah, the fruits of Croatian historical revisionism - clearly Tudjman's lasting legacy. No wait, tell me you're a Diaspora. That makes it even better.

Peter Sudyka

If your argument (winner takes it all) is to standup, we will need an off-side rule to ensure that fair play. We cannot have international powers deciding what should be settled as a local football match.

No; the reality is that ethnic cleansing of Serbs was as much a problem as the ethnic cleansing of other groups, and the policy seems to be not to reward ethnic cleansing if it is done by Serbs, but reward it if done by Croats, Albanians or islamisists living in Bosnia.

Serbia comes under a lot of criticism because of Bosnia. Quite rightly (in one way) because of the wicked things that were done, but wrongly in another if you take into account the historical resistance to muslim take over.

Croatia has a fascist past that it retains as part of its national history and (in my view) identity. It has not faced up to murders done in its name during the second world war, and it has an unhealthy pride in ethnically cleansing Krajina.

I very much hope that Croatia is not allowed into the EU soon. I do not think it is ready.

As Serbia has had to face up to the negatives of the last few years, I consider it to be better placed on these issues and therefore potentially a better candidate for early entry to the EU.

these are the worst news i've read on here today...

that´s a nice gesture, maybe serbia should therefore intervene at the greek brothers to allow croatia eu-entry ...

but of course, an artificial greater croatia with the still occupied krajina cannot enter eu ....

then cyprus could also allow turkeys entry, which would be similar ridiculous.

Bob,

Like it or not Croatia will become a EU member before Serbia.

prizreni,

We could assume you are entirely ignorant on Black African Jews such as Beta Israel, The Lemba and the Igabo Jews.

On the article:

Mesic seems very arrogant to think that EU would even put itself into any kind of such situation where Croatia (or another other Bakan country) would block anything or anyone.

He doesn't seem to release that once and if Croatia joines EU before the rest of Balkan they will be forced to give up any kind of veto power (if it would have any to begin with)

We Bulgarians would like our land back.

The Bulgarian nationalist party VMRO-BND has issued a declaration Sunday urging the government to reclaim territories lost to Serbia with the 1919 Treaty of Neuilly.

The call of the VMRO party is related to the occasion of the 90th year since the signing of the Neuilly Treaty, which established peace between Bulgaria and the Entente after World War I, and with which Bulgaria ceded territories to then Yugoslavia, Greece and Romania.

Peggy, you should ask yourself the same question when your not posting on Serbianna.

@Mike
Why shouldn't Jasenovac be considered irrelevant to Croatia's claim? I don't know the legal standard, but I find it hard to believe that Jasenovac will be a mitigating factor concerning the wanton destruction of Vukovar.

As I see it, Jasenovac is irrelevant to this whole topic. It just changes the scope of the argument to past atrocities. Long-time hatreds probably still exists among individuals, but that doesn't imply modern States carry those hatreds today.

"Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia." (SinCity)

"-- Funny how you say this right after lecturing the Serbs over the alleged irrelevancy of the NDH and Jasenovac. So you still want a free pass for that, but you're going to push for justice in Vukovar and Krajina - two things you think are clearly relevant. Ah, the fruits of Croatian historical revisionism - clearly Tudjman's lasting legacy. No wait, tell me you're a Diaspora. That makes it even better.
(Mike, 1 December 2009 17:00) "

I don't think that there is a need to pay too much attention to what Croatia will block, or won't block.

Yesterday, I read a statement made by Branko Zrno, Chairman of the Joint Committee for Defense and Security of the Parliamentary Assembly of BiH, MP in Bosnian Parliament and Chair of Croat People Club at the House of People of Bosnia and Herzegovina.
He was asked to comment on a verbal exchange involving Haris Silajdzic and Anders Fogh Rasmussen, current Secretary General of NATO.
(Bosnian politician vs. NATO politician)

He simply replied that in view of the Croats (quote) "He who has power is right".
He managed to present centuries-old Croatian political philosophy in a single sentence.
I believe that Croats will not give up this doctrine now.
And that Croatia will, when it comes to blocking or not blocking Serbia's path, do the right thing.
Whatever powerful ones tell then to do.

Mesic is the biggest yugoslav communist out there. Seriously his mum is Serb, his wife is Serb and his children are 3/4 Serb. Of course he would support Serbia's integration into the EU cause he loves Serbia because his half Serb. I hope no other Croatian President or Priminister turns out to be the same as him.
As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.

It is a very noble gesture from Croatia. In a reverse case I doubt we could expect the same from Serbia.

it will only be the other way around.
Serbia blocking Croatia ti get Krajina back!

As an Irish Catholic, I think it should be the other way around. Croatia should unreservedly apologise for ethnically cleansing 250,000 Croatian Serbs during Operation Storm, allow them back to resettle in Krajina and provide them with compensation.

Quid pro quo as they say in Rome. After all, you Croats fired the first shots.
(Niall O'Doherty, 30 November 2009 17:38)

If you are really a Irish catholic, than I must be a Black African Jew.

Ranko, your over zealous comments are amazing. Did the Croats not fight the Turks as well. Was the Turkish advance not halted on Croatian soil. Did Croats not fight at the battle of Kosovo? Were there no Croats in the Hajduk pirates. Do the Bosniaks not have Croatian roots or are they just misguided Serbs? Did Croatian Serbs not fight with Croatia in the last war?

Perhaps things would be different if we agreed to submit to a Serbian King. However, we chose Western Europe and you chose the Oriental East. It must be our Frankish blood.

We Bulgarians would like our land back.

The Bulgarian nationalist party VMRO-BND has issued a declaration Sunday urging the government to reclaim territories lost to Serbia with the 1919 Treaty of Neuilly.

The call of the VMRO party is related to the occasion of the 90th year since the signing of the Neuilly Treaty, which established peace between Bulgaria and the Entente after World War I, and with which Bulgaria ceded territories to then Yugoslavia, Greece and Romania.

I guess Mesic is not relevant to speak about that, because once when we get to that stage of advanced EU admission negotiation he will be having absolute NO say in Croatian politics, or simply said he will be out of his Office.

Croatian position would very much depend on next Croatian President, their public opinion, their Government position on that issue, political situation in our Region at that time particularly in Bosnia and "quality" of the Serbian and Croatian inter-relations probably very much affected with that pending ICJ case.

Taking all of this in account it is very much to believe that Croatia will be very much undermining Serbia's EU effort.

Tiger and all croats,
Krajina is Serbian land, it always has been. When you were polishing the shoes of the Austrian empires we Serbs were dying and fighting against the turks. We waited 500 years for Serbia to back in the rightful hands. We will wait 10,000 for the Serbian lands of Krajina to be ours again. Krajina is Serbia. It always has been it always will be, none of your made up stories of Bleiburg, homeland wars, or croatian fantasy history can or will change that.

Antun, surely you must be joking.
Serbia owes absolutely zero to Croatia, it is the other way around.
Croatia was on the wrong side in both world wars, and was never punished for Jasenovac, even though the Croats were more Nazi than the Nazis. The other genocide on Serbs, which happened with Operation Storm, you not only have not apologized for but it is a national holiday in Croatia!

We will support the independence of Istra which Tito gave to you as a present for losing WWII, over the backs of the victorious Serbs.

The notion that Krajina is to be returned to Serbs is political immaturity and is voice by rabid nationalists only.
How can Croatia allow a hostile minority to reoccupy a territory. If this would happen a new Republic of Serbs would spring up and seek autonomy. Does this make any sense to allow. I have a better idea we will put all people of mixed Croatian and Serbian ancestry there. This will ensure good relations.

And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product.

Peggy, you should ask yourself the same question when your not posting on Serbianna.

This Mesic is a 'reformed' red communist, and his comments should be completely ignored by all Serbs. They are irrelevant.
The fact is, Croatia will do whatever Germany tells her to do.

...and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH...
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)
--
Rightly or wrongly, the Serbian President (Tadic) has already apologised. Now when is Croatia going to apologise for the genocide committed during WWII and Operation Storm?

If you truly want peace in the region then it has to work both ways.

Well, my dear Serbian countryman, Antun comment here clearly illustrated what more then 80% of Croatian publics think abour Sebia in EU and confirmed my bellow written theory.

So long for our EU attempt and thanks God for that.

"As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH.."


This is a pipe dream at best, some compensation for the families might happen especially after the ICJ case.
But i especially think vukovar should be rebuilt at the cost of serbia completely, and they should pay for damages against dubrovnik. I mean we are giving the krajina serbs money to rebuild there lives, serbia should be paying for croatians to rebuild there lives.

Serbia will never enter the EU because it still has fugitive war criminals to capture.

In addition Serbia has yet to make a formal application in which the administrative process varies but for most countries it took about 8 years.

Therefore some of you Serbs need to face reality and quit going on about irrelevant things like the Ustasha and Jasenovac because these things have no impact on Croatia joining the EU. The current generation has nothing whatsoever to do with that period in time.

Lastly Croatia is nearing completion of this process and Serbia has yet to begin so therefore Croatia in all likelihood will be in the EU at least a decade if Serbia ever gets accepted so therefore Croatian can easily do to Serbia what Slovenia did to Croatia and that is to drag on the process as it seems fit. Remember that Slovenia was nothing but small fry in the EU but still stopped a future state for almost a year with its negotiations ....

Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia.

B92 should not waste its readers time by publishing political gossip, expecially when the person spreading it is a well known communist aparatchik who creates policy as the wind blows.
Mr Mesic is a spent force (if he ever was one) and his political imaturity is bordering stand up comedy. Please, give your readers more credit next time. Thank you

How about Serbia de-Kranja Srpska their policies??? Why can't some arrogant Serb's look at how many Serb refugees the Croatian government have allowed to return to their home's yet how many Croatians are still not allowed to return to their homes in Republika Srpska???

Operation Storm was a genoice?? If it was a genoicide then there would be no Serb's in Croatia today. Why is the Serbian population in Croatia still the biggest ethnic minority group in Croatia???

As a Croat I feel that the only time when Croatia should ever normalize relations with Serbia is when Serbia repays everything back for the damaged they caused during the war. This means compensation to the victims and their families, compensation to the Croatian state, extradite all convicted or suspected war criminals to Croatia and give an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

Antun,

As an Irish Catholic, I think it should be the other way around. Croatia should unreservedly apologise for ethnically cleansing 250,000 Croatian Serbs during Operation Storm, allow them back to resettle in Krajina and provide them with compensation.

Quid pro quo as they say in Rome. After all, you Croats fired the first shots.

What makes Mesic think Croatia's going to get into the EU before Serbia does?

What makes Mesic think Croatia's going to get into the EU before Serbia does?
(Mike, 30 November 2009 18:11)


Perhaps the fact that Croatia will end all chapters negociations next year....while Serbia has even not get SAA ratified yet (the very very very first step in EU integration process).

Once you get SAA ratified (find Mlladic first), then you should apply for a Candidate Status, then answer not less than thousands of questions, then your answers will be assessed, then you'll perhaps be given Candidate Status, then you'll have to ask for a negociations opening date, then carry out the negociations (anyway at least 4-5 years for more than 35 chapters)....etc...

You have it clear now....Croatia is at least 7-8 years ahead of Serbia.
Croatia will be in by 2011 and Serbia, if Croatia wishes, by 2017-2019...

Kraina is now a part of Croatia and is recognized so by international law.

I find it a little strange that Serbs go on about how they were driven off these lands and that now they want them back, when Serbs drove ethnic Germans and Hungarians off their ancestral lands after WWII as well, and received portions of their lands also.

Look, as a Pole, I know we have been guilty of driving Germans and Ukrainians off their lands and taking them for ourselves also, but then again we lost huge portions of our eastern lands after the war and that population was deported from there as well to the new territories received from the Germans, so we were also victims but it does not seem so popular in Poland to go on about it.

The point is that in all these cases a war was fought and won by one side and lost by the other, winner takes all, loser does not, it has always been like that and always will be. Get over it.

Nationalist chauvinism and dreams of a "greater [insert country here]" really do get in the way of normal, rational thought.

We will see when it comes to that (EU acceptence) what the croats will do i would not put my money on it.

Does anyone in their right mind really think that Croatia can block Serbia’s entry into a park let alone the EU? No one is going to ask the Croats for the time of day let alone who or what country comes into the EU. The Poles learnt just how important they really are when they held the EU presidency and thought this was a good time to get even with the Russians for banning their beef imports. What a humiliating back down for them, even old Lech called it the greatest embarrassment orchestrated by the then Polish President and Prime Minister.

Croatia will do as it’s told, sit in the corner and keep quiet. Remember that the issue of borders has not been finalised between Serbia and Croatia; in fact it’s probably a very good idea for Croatia to go in the EU first. This will mean that the EU will do the real negotiations, including land reparations/compensation for displaced Serbs.

No this is not a joke! This is something that still has to be settled. Croats can jump up and down, but remember the EU feeds you and your politicians are well aware of this fact because without the EU topping up Croatia’s annual budget it would collapse.

"And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product." (Tiger)

-- I'm not too particularly interested in how the Ustashe and the NDH is excused in Croatian historical memory. Whatever the explanation, it is a crime against humanity and regardless of its theoretical "origins" the perpetrators of the most slavishly loyal puppet state to National Socialism were Croats and the blood of Jasenovac is on their hands. Italians didn't pull the trigger, Croats did. Were all Croats part of it? Certainly not, and a good number of them made up Tito's Partisans. But while Serbs get collectively blamed for Vukovar and Srebrenica, the Croats want a free pass when it comes to the NDH, which by Tudjman's own admonition was little more than the national aspiration of the Croatian people. So in my opinion, until Zagreb formally apologizes for the NDH, fully distances itself from neo-Ustasha nationalism and renounces its own exclusionary enthnocentric narratives that define its political culture, people like Mesic have no grounds on which to call for Serbia to do anything in regards to Vukovar, Dubrovnik, or RSK.

Reconciliation must be reciprocal, and as far as I'm concerned, being neither Serb nor Croat, excusing something like the Ustashe on the "Italians", gives Serbs enough justification to excuse Vukovar on "Ottoman orientalism".

Peter,
you say that winner takes all...hmmm well according to your statement croatia shouldnt exist because as a state they lost both WWI and WWII, and guess what the Serbs were the winners and as forgiving as we are we didn't take our land back at that time. We created Yugoslavia based on forgiveness. You have to understand something and maybe you dont because you are Polish, but Krajina is Serbia. It will never be Croatian and it never was, doesn't matter if it is drawn on google maps as a part of croatia, it is in every Serbs heart, and we waited 500 years for the turks, we will wait 10,000 for Krajina. Croats think they got away with the killings and destruction of WWI, WWII, and 1995, but they don't see it yet but they lost. They will see it soon.

Maybe Croatia should de-Krajinize their politics??

"Croatia will be in by 2011 and Serbia, if Croatia wishes, by 2017-2019..." (Gert)

-- You really think Croatia's that important? To Brussels, Croats, Serbs, Macedonians are all a bunch of seljaci. With Brussels still trying to digest Bulgaria and Romania, I wouldn't be surprised if Croatia gets stalled until it goes in with Serbia and Montenegro, or SCG's applications get sped up. I could be wrong, but aside from pretty beaches, Croats are little more tha cheap labor to the rest of Europe.

Bob,

Like it or not Croatia will become a EU member before Serbia.

Peter Sudyka

If your argument (winner takes it all) is to standup, we will need an off-side rule to ensure that fair play. We cannot have international powers deciding what should be settled as a local football match.

No; the reality is that ethnic cleansing of Serbs was as much a problem as the ethnic cleansing of other groups, and the policy seems to be not to reward ethnic cleansing if it is done by Serbs, but reward it if done by Croats, Albanians or islamisists living in Bosnia.

Serbia comes under a lot of criticism because of Bosnia. Quite rightly (in one way) because of the wicked things that were done, but wrongly in another if you take into account the historical resistance to muslim take over.

Croatia has a fascist past that it retains as part of its national history and (in my view) identity. It has not faced up to murders done in its name during the second world war, and it has an unhealthy pride in ethnically cleansing Krajina.

I very much hope that Croatia is not allowed into the EU soon. I do not think it is ready.

As Serbia has had to face up to the negatives of the last few years, I consider it to be better placed on these issues and therefore potentially a better candidate for early entry to the EU.

Tiger and all croats,
there you go talking again, making up history, you think that because you repeat things over and over again, and because CNN and BBC repeat those lies for their own self-interests that they are true. Again, like your beloved Mesic who uses the well studied False Accusation Assault psychological mechanism to avoid the truth, you avoid the truth in a fantasy historical way. You lost in WWI, you lost in WWII, and you dont see it yet but you lost again by chosing the wrong side again. Krajina is Serbia. Those aren't your lands, you didn't defend them from the Turks, you didn't defend them from the Austrians, you didn't defend them from the Nazi's, no you helped them to try and get rid of the rightful owners us Serbs - you think it worked in 1995 when you tried to fulfill your coward hero's A. Pavelic plans. But it didnt work. Cause Krajina lives in every Serb, and we are patient, we waited 500 years, we will wait as long as it takes.

that´s a nice gesture, maybe serbia should therefore intervene at the greek brothers to allow croatia eu-entry ...

but of course, an artificial greater croatia with the still occupied krajina cannot enter eu ....

then cyprus could also allow turkeys entry, which would be similar ridiculous.

"Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia." (SinCity)

-- Funny how you say this right after lecturing the Serbs over the alleged irrelevancy of the NDH and Jasenovac. So you still want a free pass for that, but you're going to push for justice in Vukovar and Krajina - two things you think are clearly relevant. Ah, the fruits of Croatian historical revisionism - clearly Tudjman's lasting legacy. No wait, tell me you're a Diaspora. That makes it even better.

an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

People that go around wearing a halo tend to have them slip around the neck and strangle the wearer, so I wouldn’t rush to blame just one side, you Croats have a very dark history and people that live in glass houses should never throw stones.

And another thing, the Ustaha was an Italian by product.
(Tiger, 30 November 2009 18:17)

It's always someone else who is the bad guy.

Croatia must spend more time sorting out disputed Serbian land before they have a chance of joining the EU. I know first hand that the Croatian government make it as hard as possible for Serbs to return.

@Mike
Why shouldn't Jasenovac be considered irrelevant to Croatia's claim? I don't know the legal standard, but I find it hard to believe that Jasenovac will be a mitigating factor concerning the wanton destruction of Vukovar.

As I see it, Jasenovac is irrelevant to this whole topic. It just changes the scope of the argument to past atrocities. Long-time hatreds probably still exists among individuals, but that doesn't imply modern States carry those hatreds today.

"Croatia in all certainty will push for war compensation from Serbia." (SinCity)

"-- Funny how you say this right after lecturing the Serbs over the alleged irrelevancy of the NDH and Jasenovac. So you still want a free pass for that, but you're going to push for justice in Vukovar and Krajina - two things you think are clearly relevant. Ah, the fruits of Croatian historical revisionism - clearly Tudjman's lasting legacy. No wait, tell me you're a Diaspora. That makes it even better.
(Mike, 1 December 2009 17:00) "

It is a very noble gesture from Croatia. In a reverse case I doubt we could expect the same from Serbia.
(Joe, 30 November 2009 15:22)

How would you come to this conclusion?

How about Serbia de-Kranja Srpska their policies??? Why can't some arrogant Serb's look at how many Serb refugees the Croatian government have allowed to return to their home's yet how many Croatians are still not allowed to return to their homes in Republika Srpska???

Operation Storm was a genoice?? If it was a genoicide then there would be no Serb's in Croatia today. Why is the Serbian population in Croatia still the biggest ethnic minority group in Croatia???
(Antun, 1 December 2009 04:02)

Do You remember Erdut Agreement in 1995 after Operation Storm?? Under UN cover was created serbian autonmy in eastern Slavonija. But after UN withdrawal autonomy was abolished by Croatia in 1998 (year before NATO invasion agains Serbia).
Please tell me - if Croatia can liquidate serbian autonomy without any consequences, why You are against reintegration Kosovo with Serbia??

If you are really a Irish catholic, than I must be a Black African Jew.
(prizreni, 30 November 2009 19:39)

How sad most Kosovo Albanians think that the countries that recognized them have sympathetic populations...

Prizreni, do you know why so many internationals on here are pro-Serb? It is because most of us have served here and got to know people like you. That is the truth and you can try and make yourself feel better by claiming that all these internationals are Serbs in disguise, or you can be like Oaf and pretend to be a Westerner yourself (but try and do a better job of it...)

Here was your reality check.

I am not racist
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

most racist people say that. let me guess, you even have some serbian friends?

an official apology to Croatia for all Serbs wrong doing during the war's in Croatia and BiH... I am not racist or have anything agaisnt Serbian people and what I have just suggest is fair.
(Antun, 30 November 2009 14:52)

And as a Swiss I would love to have the all truth made on the balkan war, it is simply too easy to only blame one side whereas it is far from being clear!

By the way, if I remember well, Mr Brammertz has repeatedly said that he is not satisfied with Croatia when it comes to the cooperation with the Hague Tribunal, woundering why..

prizreni,

We could assume you are entirely ignorant on Black African Jews such as Beta Israel, The Lemba and the Igabo Jews.

On the article:

Mesic seems very arrogant to think that EU would even put itself into any kind of such situation where Croatia (or another other Bakan country) would block anything or anyone.

He doesn't seem to release that once and if Croatia joines EU before the rest of Balkan they will be forced to give up any kind of veto power (if it would have any to begin with)

these are the worst news i've read on here today...

I don't think that there is a need to pay too much attention to what Croatia will block, or won't block.

Yesterday, I read a statement made by Branko Zrno, Chairman of the Joint Committee for Defense and Security of the Parliamentary Assembly of BiH, MP in Bosnian Parliament and Chair of Croat People Club at the House of People of Bosnia and Herzegovina.
He was asked to comment on a verbal exchange involving Haris Silajdzic and Anders Fogh Rasmussen, current Secretary General of NATO.
(Bosnian politician vs. NATO politician)

He simply replied that in view of the Croats (quote) "He who has power is right".
He managed to present centuries-old Croatian political philosophy in a single sentence.
I believe that Croats will not give up this doctrine now.
And that Croatia will, when it comes to blocking or not blocking Serbia's path, do the right thing.
Whatever powerful ones tell then to do.