Koštunica: Govt. will recognize Kosovo

Well, according to Kostunica, once Serbia accepts EULEX it will accept Kosova's Independence also. therefore dear serb commentators, when Serbia accepts EULEX do not say anymore that Kosova is part of Serbia but accept the truth that Kosova is independent as Kostunica suggests.

Canadian - You may very well be right. In fact your parrallel with 1244 and the numerous failed attempts to distort it probably prove your point.

That document is signed and sealed as tightly as a document can be. Plus I am unhappy about the way that the A Plan is being integrated without having been accepted.

The other thing that is very worrying is the way that the US is joining [US]EULEX and yet even today speaking about the new 'state' of Kosovo. Even Ban Ki Moon said last week that [US]EULEX remains under the UN umbrella and has to be status neutral.

So yes, I stand corrected. I was speaking on the basis that [US]EULEX is inevitable - but maybe not. Let's hope.

Also that the EU and US could be trusted... must just be my woolly Sunday head temporarily taking over, or maybe just a fit of optimism.

As for Kostunica, I have to say it how I see it, albeit very much from the outside in another country. That is that the guy used to make sense and come across as credible, but as Olli said, now he just seems to act on his personal agenda instead of trying to work woth Tadic.

His words may be strong and often accurate, but he doesn't appear to be acting in the best interests of Serbia.

Tadic may be unpopular among many Serbian people, but from the outside he appears to be handling the situation realistically and doing the best he can. I also think that Jeremic has done an excellent job so far.

But I am not Serbian, and just as everyone in other countries used to rave on about Maggie without understanding how she was viewed by/ what she was doing to many British communities, I may well have a different perspective if I were Serbian.

What I do know is that whichever route is taken Serbia is going to have to tread extremely carefully to avoid getting shafted.

Excuse me if I don't bother to post on what Kosutnica thinks.

Two reasons why:

1 I don't think he's an important enough person in Serbian politics (something like Ivica Dacic)
2 He's been shown to be consistently wrong on a host of questions.

Kostunica's interpretation of events are not news. In the fantasy world of this government recognising Kosovo, it would be the government that announces it will recognise Kosovo, not a two time loser at the ballot box.

On the other hand Nikolic is the future of the thinking man's centre right. Those suffering from an excess in negative emotions can just vote radical.

To think that I came out and voted for his constitution thinking he had the good of the country at heart.

No, Afrim, that is just the situation according to Kostunica who has been losing the plot for a while now. I used to respect him, but the way that he has put his personal ego over doing something constructive and pragmatic and working with Tadic is beyond belief.

There are very clear guidelines drawn up by Tadic for any acceptance of [US]EULEX which most certainly would not go hand in hand with accepting independence. The govt just needs to be certain that any agreement cannot be changed if [US]EULEX deploys - somehow they need to set it in stone, probably through the UN.

Koštunica is like a wife (or a husband)who can't let a single chance to nag pass by. I know Koštunica does this out of fear: he feels that he is slipping and sliding into the fog of history.

The fact that most Kosovo Albanians commenting here, as afri hoxha, use any opportunity to mock Serbs while staying in denial of unpleasant facts concerning their own society tells that they rather talk about neighbor's dirty carpet than clean their own floor.

Eulex has arrived to Kosovo because united nations got disappointed with results in Kosovo. Think about that, afrim. In case you'll suggest that un got disappointed only because of Serbs -think about that a second time, too.

If Serbia lets EULEX in, Serbia must also maintain the right to get EULEX out.

If it does not maintain that right it will effectively have admitted that the Province of Kosovo was taken from it by conquest.

What started as a humanitarian intervention has become a conquest by military force. NATO etc.. should not be trusted with military 'humanitarian' interventions in future.

James - Serbia will not have to 'endure the wrath of Nato' because if you haven't noticed the international community is clearly happier to deal with Belgrade than contemplate having to upset the government in Pristina.

Besides which Nato is like the EU; there are various levels of membership and the less powerful cannot just call for military action via the UN. Albania has nothing to do with Kosovo, and their membership will have no effect on the situation.

Serbia is an important trading route, an established nation and its government have already proved willing to 'turn the page' as you put it with their diplomacy and pro legal moves (as opposed to threats of violence).

The days of military evangelism are thankfully coming to an end. Blame the recession rather than those who push the buttons suddenly getting a conscience.

What should have been obvious from the very beginning and for those that voted for DS is this sell-out "government" is there to appease the occupation and to make their life easier while pretending to protect Kosovo but instead selling it - piece by piece.

Through lies and deceit this so-called "government" has gone against the will of the people and it's actions will now cause great instability down the road. I fear Kosovo will once again become a very ugly place as the balance of power fades from the West.

Serbia should insist on the return of Serbian police and border guards to balance out any EU mission deployment otherwise the independence movement makes another step forward.

Tadic and his sell-outs are a lost cause without someone like Kostunica to provide some strength. That weakness is a recipe for disaster I'm afraid.

And to our Albanian friends, in case you haven't noticed, the Balkans is once again heading down a dangerous path. BiH is on the road to instability and if you don't play your cards right, that could easily spill over into Kosovo. Those Western plans of divide and conquer are beginning to backfire miserably.

While many here bicker whether Kosovo is Serbia or Kosovo is independent very important events are happening in Balkans e.g. Albania is becoming a NATO member, a membership this that carries with it a long list of military perks and goodies, and given its affinity with the people of Kosovo I only wonder how Serbs (mainly nationalist who live in some illusionary world as is evident by the postings on this site) are thinking to get Kosovo back?

Are you willing to endure the wrath of NATO one more time for something that most of you have not bothered to see for yourself, or have not bothered to care that it was there until it became a propaganda tool so handily manipulated by your politicians?

Many of you have already reconciled with the fact that Kosovo is lost but somehow cling to the belief that you’ll be able to divide Kosovo. Very soon you’ll need to come to terms that this is not going to happen either.

Take the advice of many posters here, turn a new page in the history of your nation and look to the future.

first time I disagree with Kate:

Koštunica is the one who did not lie to the poeple.

Tadić painted Serbia´s future black by telling stories about "Isolation" if the "Democrats" of the DS are not elected...

he is an actor, not a politician.

as for Afrim, don´t worry my friend, no matter what these "EUrocrats" do against the intereste of the serbian people, it will be null and void.

and last but not least in regard of ZK´s comment: I agree, there´s some trouble ahead, but I am convinced that Serbia is prepared for all eventualities
Serbia is getting stronger, and what is most important: Serbia is motivated.

Yes, Marko

I take the position that I understand international policy better than Kostunica. And there's no need for me to supply you list of my achievements. Just read Kostunica's. He once had promising cards in his hand but oh man, how he blew it all.

I'm sure he did read his copy of Carl Philipp Gottlieb von Clausewitz's "Vom Kriege", but most important pages he obviously missed. One is that his strategy failed. Kostunica couldn't see strategy as the use of battles in order to reach the goal, "victory" (a satisfactory if not an ideal result). In order to gain victory you don't need to win each and every battle. Sometimes a lost battle helps you to win another, a more important battle.

This is true in the international policy, too.

James, Serbia doesn't need to get Kosovo back because we never lost it. Kosovo is occupied Serbian territory and there will come a day when NATO is given the boot just like the NAZIs and the Ottomans before them, though hopefully this time around it will be less violent or even non-violent.

I'm sure there was a time when the Albanians thought there was no chance Serbians would remove their NAZI partners but it happened.

As for this comment I constantly hear about the future, let me enlighten you a bit. Those that look to the future tend to be disappointed and those that look to the past live with the dead. You see, the US offers Serbia nothing but a chance to be a servant so our future is based on our strong faith and will to be free - we live in the present and know not to trust any future.

james

i got some news for you: SC 1244 is still in force and it says Kosovo is part of Serbia until this resolution is replaced by another,this hasn`t happened so its very clear that this part of southern Serbia is under occupation like it was under the Ottomans and we got it back.
And by the way, very soon the Americans will have other problems than kosovo,believe me...
Serbia will prevail.

Some time ago a picture was shown of Mr Tadic and Mr Jeremic playing basketball together in a mountain resort in Serbia.

There was something strange about this picture, to be precise why were they both wearing sweaters while playing basketball during the summer.

Mr Tadic plays politics just like he plays basketball. Both for him are staged events whose true meanings are obscured in order to decieve the people of Serbia.

Just say no to the EUSSR!

@CG

james

i got some news for you: SC 1244 is still in force and it says Kosovo is part of Serbia until this resolution is replaced by another,this hasn`t happened so its very clear that this part of southern Serbia is under occupation like it was under the Ottomans and we got it back.
And by the way, very soon the Americans will have other problems than kosovo,believe me...
Serbia will prevail.
(CG, 26 October 2008 19:25)

Your wrong mate, it says Kosovo is part of the FR Yugoslavia, there has been two states since then. Can a state inherit what a UNSC resolution states? There is no exact answer for that, even though Serbia inherited 1244 after the breakup, 1244 talked of Yugoslav soveregnity being respected, not Serbia's. That's significant. Even though there's divering opinions on this, there's an argument to be made of the fact that Serbia cannot inherit something (its claim to respect for sovereignty) which it did not have.

Also remember when FR Yugoslavia said it would never recognise Slovenia, Macedonia, Croatia and BiH, but it did any way in 1995. They have said the same about Kosovo, will history repeat itself?

You can't hate somebody forever. In 2000, Tadic was pro Kosovo independence, but "he has soon changed his tune". Hes a weak leader, but I do believe he is good for Serbia. At some point Serbia will have to accept that they have lost Kosovo and there is nothing they can do, either diplomatically or militarily. Before too long Russia is going to need something from EU/ US and they will hold Kosovo's status to Russia in return for help and Russia has already recognised Abkhazia and South Ossetia, they can't so much about Kosovo whilst recognising them two.

President Medvedev stated that "western countries rushed to recognise Kosovo's illegal declaration of independence from Serbia. We argued consistently that it would be impossible, after that, to tell the Abkhazians and Ossetians (and dozens of other groups around the world) that what was good for the Kosovo Albanians was not good for them. In international relations, you cannot have one rule for some and another rule for others." Hes implying there that independence is good for Kosovo. Also other Russian politicians have stated that Russia will eventually recognise Kosovo, not to mention the Russian publics constant increasing support for Kosovo. How long will Russia with hold support for Serbia?

China doesn't really care about Kosovo, it just wants to remain neutral on the situation.

Kosovo's independence is a done deal. Period! There is too much money and support ect for it to be reversed and one day Serbia, Russia ect will have to acknowledge this, will it be sooner or later? Who knows, but it will even Koštunica knows this.

Milan Radosavljevic: "Kosovo will always be a part of the Serb nation-----learn to live with that fact."

Where did you get this from? How long was Kosovo under Serbian sovereignity? May be less than a quater of the time of the last 20 centuries!
Belgrade has been under Roman, Bulgarian, Turkish and perhaps even Hungarian rule than it was under Serbian soveregnity. There is no land inherentely belonging to a particular people! Sovereignity is derived from treaties and treaties are the alternatives of wars! So the alternative infront of Serbia is clear: War with higher or lower intensity over a land where few Serbs resude and even fewer would like to settle or a peace with 90% its inhabitance!

Kate said: > "The govt just needs to be certain that any agreement cannot be changed if [US]EULEX deploys - somehow they need to set it in stone, probably through the UN."
(kate, 26 October 2008 14:10)

Do you mean like setting in "stone" through the UN like Resolution 1244 was?

Come on Kate! Once you let these theives in, you are conceeding to them, there is no "if's" or "buts" about it.

The EU and especially the US cannot be trusted! You really surprise me on this!?

Tadic is conceding to let go of Kosovo, very slowly but very surely, by the end of his term in office Kosovo will be Albanian and not Serbian!

Kate, as usual you're on the money.

Kostunica's statements are more "scare tactics" than anything else. He's using Kosovo as a tool against his competitors in Belgrade more than anything else. No serious Serbian politican can say that Kosovo is forever gone without risking their career.

More likely, at least as I see it, Tadic is positioning himself to be far more of a negotiator with the EU over Kosovo's status than simply saying "Kosovo is ours from Leposavic to Dragas".

In any event, nothing more to comment here as others have expressed my thoughts already.

first of all, "James" ... the world is changing, and you don´t seem to realize it.

we will see who will have to come to terms with what... :)

but let me tell you one thing, if the oh so mighty NATO was merely capable of destroying some 15 serbian tanks in 78 days of merciless bombing...

what makes you believe that Serbia would be defeated???

and you say the Serbs are living in illusion? quite funny, I´d say.

as for this Albanian who is using "Ian" as a nick-name...

I can tell you that all those remarks about a "done deal" are really amusing. you know for yourself that this is only whishful thinking, my dear albanian friend.

as for this remark about UNSC 1244 not applicable because Kosovo was part of the SFJR..

Ian, I won´t give you lectures now about the fact that Kosovo never was a republic, but a province of Serbia, and neither will I teach you about the meaning of the term "legal succession"...

I think you will have to do a little bit research of your own, if you want to learn why you are wrong...

but let me assure you, you are wrong. and making this mistake, shows how little you seem to know about the Kosovo-issue...

Kate, Oli et al

Are you really taking the position that you understand international policy better than Kostunica or is it your position that Tadic's crew controls a monopoly on pragmatism and democracy.

Kostunica has made himself less popular in Serbia than Tadic because people are fearful of the truth.

Ian is right. The world powers rule the world. Kosova became part of Serbia in 1912 due to world power support for Serbia and it will become legally Albanian due to world powers. When the Serbs say "It's illegal" they forget to mention that if Russia agrees, it's 100% legal. China, is 'very concerned' but will do nothing. Count on Russia selling Serbs out as they did with the gas prices

ian

this is basically just bla bla what you are tossing out.
Lets stick to the facts:
UNSC 1244 is still in place Serbia is Yugoslavias succesor so 1244 guarantees Serbian integritiy over Kosovo.
Russia and China will veto any attempt to legalize this occupation of Serbian territory.Period.

Everything else you are mentioning is just wishful thinking.Period.

Pleae President Tadic give up Kosovo and move on with life. The days of the hardliners are past. Go tell someone else who cares about Kosovo. Make the deal with the EU approve Eulex, obtain strict guranntees there will not be a mass migration from Kosovo. Give those enclaves automony and there you have the peace. Serbia moves on to the EU and NATO. A better life for all and for those Anti Serb and Anti Albanian folks grow up move on and let's find something else to talk about.

If Kosovo were the end of the dismemberment and subjugation of Serbia----then we could talk. But unfortunatly, kosovo is a protocal.

The south of Serbia will become autonomus. Voijvodina will become autonomous-and eventually independent.

Many foolish Serbs believe that somehow Yugoslavia will return on the current territory of Serbia. Yugoslavia is dead in the rest of the former Yugoslavia but for some in Serbia, the foolish dream lives on feuled by western agents in the Serbian government and self serving politicians.

Just like in Gruzia(Georgia), the Western empire does not have the strength to enforce its schemes. So as in Gruzia, the west divides people who have lived together and stokes inter ethnic wars to serve thier selfish goals of domination. In this false democracy it doesnt matter what the majority of any nation believe is right for thier people----america buys the leadership of these nations and disregards the majority opinion. In the Ukraine 70% of the people polled do not favour NATO membership----but that dosent matter------the well financed CIA backed government does.

And for all the stupid people who believe what they hear from the mouthes of western liars and schemers----history will judge you very harshley. And for all the Albanians on this web site who every day proclaim how much they love america-------the Arab world is listening-in case you are wondering why so many Arab nations quietly support Serbia. Every time an Albanian or a Bosnian Muslim proclaim thier love for America on this web site-it is broadcast into the Arab world.

The Albanians, Bosnian Muslims and Israelis have put all thier eggs into one basket------and that basket is about to come apart.

Enjoy what is left of the NEO-Con dream and the ill concieved american new world order.

Kosovo will always be a part of the Serb nation-----learn to live with that fact.

Of course Serbia will recognize Kosovo.

We've been saying that ever since them ICJ case was mentioned.

What Tadic is doing right now is slowly helping the West twist the mentality of the Serbian people so that it's easier to let go of Kosovo.

First they will allow EULEX, then they will say that the ICJ gave it's opinion and there's nothing they can do about it...by that time the people will no longer care about the recognition, and everyone will be moving on.

I have said this before on other boards and will say it on this one also. There is no Serbia, no BiH, no Kosovo, no Russia, etc...Another words there will soon be no independent or sovereign rule only Big Brother.

So Serbia in reality has NO decision in which direction it's country heads. It's all in the Bigger Powers.

The whole world has become a Colony of the Haves.

Kostunica has created more problems for Serbia than he has solved during his zigzag reign. Kostunica should solve this problems first, before he is talking about others. point

Oh yeah, and FYI...preambles of UN resolutions are legally non-binding.

Toss 1244 out of your next argument list with someone, you will not look very bright by claiming that a non-binding portion of a document guarantees anything. ;)

OK, Funcakes

You say "preambles of UN resolutions are legally non-binding" and "non-binding portion of a document guarantees [nothing]".

Please, tell me what the content of this non-binding portion of document is. What is said in it? On your own words.

Well, according to Kostunica, once Serbia accepts EULEX it will accept Kosova's Independence also. therefore dear serb commentators, when Serbia accepts EULEX do not say anymore that Kosova is part of Serbia but accept the truth that Kosova is independent as Kostunica suggests.

No, Afrim, that is just the situation according to Kostunica who has been losing the plot for a while now. I used to respect him, but the way that he has put his personal ego over doing something constructive and pragmatic and working with Tadic is beyond belief.

There are very clear guidelines drawn up by Tadic for any acceptance of [US]EULEX which most certainly would not go hand in hand with accepting independence. The govt just needs to be certain that any agreement cannot be changed if [US]EULEX deploys - somehow they need to set it in stone, probably through the UN.

Koštunica is like a wife (or a husband)who can't let a single chance to nag pass by. I know Koštunica does this out of fear: he feels that he is slipping and sliding into the fog of history.

The fact that most Kosovo Albanians commenting here, as afri hoxha, use any opportunity to mock Serbs while staying in denial of unpleasant facts concerning their own society tells that they rather talk about neighbor's dirty carpet than clean their own floor.

Eulex has arrived to Kosovo because united nations got disappointed with results in Kosovo. Think about that, afrim. In case you'll suggest that un got disappointed only because of Serbs -think about that a second time, too.

Excuse me if I don't bother to post on what Kosutnica thinks.

Two reasons why:

1 I don't think he's an important enough person in Serbian politics (something like Ivica Dacic)
2 He's been shown to be consistently wrong on a host of questions.

Kostunica's interpretation of events are not news. In the fantasy world of this government recognising Kosovo, it would be the government that announces it will recognise Kosovo, not a two time loser at the ballot box.

On the other hand Nikolic is the future of the thinking man's centre right. Those suffering from an excess in negative emotions can just vote radical.

To think that I came out and voted for his constitution thinking he had the good of the country at heart.

Milan Radosavljevic: "Kosovo will always be a part of the Serb nation-----learn to live with that fact."

Where did you get this from? How long was Kosovo under Serbian sovereignity? May be less than a quater of the time of the last 20 centuries!
Belgrade has been under Roman, Bulgarian, Turkish and perhaps even Hungarian rule than it was under Serbian soveregnity. There is no land inherentely belonging to a particular people! Sovereignity is derived from treaties and treaties are the alternatives of wars! So the alternative infront of Serbia is clear: War with higher or lower intensity over a land where few Serbs resude and even fewer would like to settle or a peace with 90% its inhabitance!

If Serbia lets EULEX in, Serbia must also maintain the right to get EULEX out.

If it does not maintain that right it will effectively have admitted that the Province of Kosovo was taken from it by conquest.

What started as a humanitarian intervention has become a conquest by military force. NATO etc.. should not be trusted with military 'humanitarian' interventions in future.

Kostunica has created more problems for Serbia than he has solved during his zigzag reign. Kostunica should solve this problems first, before he is talking about others. point

Pleae President Tadic give up Kosovo and move on with life. The days of the hardliners are past. Go tell someone else who cares about Kosovo. Make the deal with the EU approve Eulex, obtain strict guranntees there will not be a mass migration from Kosovo. Give those enclaves automony and there you have the peace. Serbia moves on to the EU and NATO. A better life for all and for those Anti Serb and Anti Albanian folks grow up move on and let's find something else to talk about.

While many here bicker whether Kosovo is Serbia or Kosovo is independent very important events are happening in Balkans e.g. Albania is becoming a NATO member, a membership this that carries with it a long list of military perks and goodies, and given its affinity with the people of Kosovo I only wonder how Serbs (mainly nationalist who live in some illusionary world as is evident by the postings on this site) are thinking to get Kosovo back?

Are you willing to endure the wrath of NATO one more time for something that most of you have not bothered to see for yourself, or have not bothered to care that it was there until it became a propaganda tool so handily manipulated by your politicians?

Many of you have already reconciled with the fact that Kosovo is lost but somehow cling to the belief that you’ll be able to divide Kosovo. Very soon you’ll need to come to terms that this is not going to happen either.

Take the advice of many posters here, turn a new page in the history of your nation and look to the future.

james

i got some news for you: SC 1244 is still in force and it says Kosovo is part of Serbia until this resolution is replaced by another,this hasn`t happened so its very clear that this part of southern Serbia is under occupation like it was under the Ottomans and we got it back.
And by the way, very soon the Americans will have other problems than kosovo,believe me...
Serbia will prevail.

James, Serbia doesn't need to get Kosovo back because we never lost it. Kosovo is occupied Serbian territory and there will come a day when NATO is given the boot just like the NAZIs and the Ottomans before them, though hopefully this time around it will be less violent or even non-violent.

I'm sure there was a time when the Albanians thought there was no chance Serbians would remove their NAZI partners but it happened.

As for this comment I constantly hear about the future, let me enlighten you a bit. Those that look to the future tend to be disappointed and those that look to the past live with the dead. You see, the US offers Serbia nothing but a chance to be a servant so our future is based on our strong faith and will to be free - we live in the present and know not to trust any future.

If Kosovo were the end of the dismemberment and subjugation of Serbia----then we could talk. But unfortunatly, kosovo is a protocal.

The south of Serbia will become autonomus. Voijvodina will become autonomous-and eventually independent.

Many foolish Serbs believe that somehow Yugoslavia will return on the current territory of Serbia. Yugoslavia is dead in the rest of the former Yugoslavia but for some in Serbia, the foolish dream lives on feuled by western agents in the Serbian government and self serving politicians.

Just like in Gruzia(Georgia), the Western empire does not have the strength to enforce its schemes. So as in Gruzia, the west divides people who have lived together and stokes inter ethnic wars to serve thier selfish goals of domination. In this false democracy it doesnt matter what the majority of any nation believe is right for thier people----america buys the leadership of these nations and disregards the majority opinion. In the Ukraine 70% of the people polled do not favour NATO membership----but that dosent matter------the well financed CIA backed government does.

And for all the stupid people who believe what they hear from the mouthes of western liars and schemers----history will judge you very harshley. And for all the Albanians on this web site who every day proclaim how much they love america-------the Arab world is listening-in case you are wondering why so many Arab nations quietly support Serbia. Every time an Albanian or a Bosnian Muslim proclaim thier love for America on this web site-it is broadcast into the Arab world.

The Albanians, Bosnian Muslims and Israelis have put all thier eggs into one basket------and that basket is about to come apart.

Enjoy what is left of the NEO-Con dream and the ill concieved american new world order.

Kosovo will always be a part of the Serb nation-----learn to live with that fact.

@CG

james

i got some news for you: SC 1244 is still in force and it says Kosovo is part of Serbia until this resolution is replaced by another,this hasn`t happened so its very clear that this part of southern Serbia is under occupation like it was under the Ottomans and we got it back.
And by the way, very soon the Americans will have other problems than kosovo,believe me...
Serbia will prevail.
(CG, 26 October 2008 19:25)

Your wrong mate, it says Kosovo is part of the FR Yugoslavia, there has been two states since then. Can a state inherit what a UNSC resolution states? There is no exact answer for that, even though Serbia inherited 1244 after the breakup, 1244 talked of Yugoslav soveregnity being respected, not Serbia's. That's significant. Even though there's divering opinions on this, there's an argument to be made of the fact that Serbia cannot inherit something (its claim to respect for sovereignty) which it did not have.

Also remember when FR Yugoslavia said it would never recognise Slovenia, Macedonia, Croatia and BiH, but it did any way in 1995. They have said the same about Kosovo, will history repeat itself?

You can't hate somebody forever. In 2000, Tadic was pro Kosovo independence, but "he has soon changed his tune". Hes a weak leader, but I do believe he is good for Serbia. At some point Serbia will have to accept that they have lost Kosovo and there is nothing they can do, either diplomatically or militarily. Before too long Russia is going to need something from EU/ US and they will hold Kosovo's status to Russia in return for help and Russia has already recognised Abkhazia and South Ossetia, they can't so much about Kosovo whilst recognising them two.

President Medvedev stated that "western countries rushed to recognise Kosovo's illegal declaration of independence from Serbia. We argued consistently that it would be impossible, after that, to tell the Abkhazians and Ossetians (and dozens of other groups around the world) that what was good for the Kosovo Albanians was not good for them. In international relations, you cannot have one rule for some and another rule for others." Hes implying there that independence is good for Kosovo. Also other Russian politicians have stated that Russia will eventually recognise Kosovo, not to mention the Russian publics constant increasing support for Kosovo. How long will Russia with hold support for Serbia?

China doesn't really care about Kosovo, it just wants to remain neutral on the situation.

Kosovo's independence is a done deal. Period! There is too much money and support ect for it to be reversed and one day Serbia, Russia ect will have to acknowledge this, will it be sooner or later? Who knows, but it will even Koštunica knows this.

Ian is right. The world powers rule the world. Kosova became part of Serbia in 1912 due to world power support for Serbia and it will become legally Albanian due to world powers. When the Serbs say "It's illegal" they forget to mention that if Russia agrees, it's 100% legal. China, is 'very concerned' but will do nothing. Count on Russia selling Serbs out as they did with the gas prices

What should have been obvious from the very beginning and for those that voted for DS is this sell-out "government" is there to appease the occupation and to make their life easier while pretending to protect Kosovo but instead selling it - piece by piece.

Through lies and deceit this so-called "government" has gone against the will of the people and it's actions will now cause great instability down the road. I fear Kosovo will once again become a very ugly place as the balance of power fades from the West.

Serbia should insist on the return of Serbian police and border guards to balance out any EU mission deployment otherwise the independence movement makes another step forward.

Tadic and his sell-outs are a lost cause without someone like Kostunica to provide some strength. That weakness is a recipe for disaster I'm afraid.

And to our Albanian friends, in case you haven't noticed, the Balkans is once again heading down a dangerous path. BiH is on the road to instability and if you don't play your cards right, that could easily spill over into Kosovo. Those Western plans of divide and conquer are beginning to backfire miserably.

Kate said: > "The govt just needs to be certain that any agreement cannot be changed if [US]EULEX deploys - somehow they need to set it in stone, probably through the UN."
(kate, 26 October 2008 14:10)

Do you mean like setting in "stone" through the UN like Resolution 1244 was?

Come on Kate! Once you let these theives in, you are conceeding to them, there is no "if's" or "buts" about it.

The EU and especially the US cannot be trusted! You really surprise me on this!?

Tadic is conceding to let go of Kosovo, very slowly but very surely, by the end of his term in office Kosovo will be Albanian and not Serbian!

first time I disagree with Kate:

Koštunica is the one who did not lie to the poeple.

Tadić painted Serbia´s future black by telling stories about "Isolation" if the "Democrats" of the DS are not elected...

he is an actor, not a politician.

as for Afrim, don´t worry my friend, no matter what these "EUrocrats" do against the intereste of the serbian people, it will be null and void.

and last but not least in regard of ZK´s comment: I agree, there´s some trouble ahead, but I am convinced that Serbia is prepared for all eventualities
Serbia is getting stronger, and what is most important: Serbia is motivated.

Kate, Oli et al

Are you really taking the position that you understand international policy better than Kostunica or is it your position that Tadic's crew controls a monopoly on pragmatism and democracy.

Kostunica has made himself less popular in Serbia than Tadic because people are fearful of the truth.

Some time ago a picture was shown of Mr Tadic and Mr Jeremic playing basketball together in a mountain resort in Serbia.

There was something strange about this picture, to be precise why were they both wearing sweaters while playing basketball during the summer.

Mr Tadic plays politics just like he plays basketball. Both for him are staged events whose true meanings are obscured in order to decieve the people of Serbia.

Just say no to the EUSSR!

Yes, Marko

I take the position that I understand international policy better than Kostunica. And there's no need for me to supply you list of my achievements. Just read Kostunica's. He once had promising cards in his hand but oh man, how he blew it all.

I'm sure he did read his copy of Carl Philipp Gottlieb von Clausewitz's "Vom Kriege", but most important pages he obviously missed. One is that his strategy failed. Kostunica couldn't see strategy as the use of battles in order to reach the goal, "victory" (a satisfactory if not an ideal result). In order to gain victory you don't need to win each and every battle. Sometimes a lost battle helps you to win another, a more important battle.

This is true in the international policy, too.

Canadian - You may very well be right. In fact your parrallel with 1244 and the numerous failed attempts to distort it probably prove your point.

That document is signed and sealed as tightly as a document can be. Plus I am unhappy about the way that the A Plan is being integrated without having been accepted.

The other thing that is very worrying is the way that the US is joining [US]EULEX and yet even today speaking about the new 'state' of Kosovo. Even Ban Ki Moon said last week that [US]EULEX remains under the UN umbrella and has to be status neutral.

So yes, I stand corrected. I was speaking on the basis that [US]EULEX is inevitable - but maybe not. Let's hope.

Also that the EU and US could be trusted... must just be my woolly Sunday head temporarily taking over, or maybe just a fit of optimism.

As for Kostunica, I have to say it how I see it, albeit very much from the outside in another country. That is that the guy used to make sense and come across as credible, but as Olli said, now he just seems to act on his personal agenda instead of trying to work woth Tadic.

His words may be strong and often accurate, but he doesn't appear to be acting in the best interests of Serbia.

Tadic may be unpopular among many Serbian people, but from the outside he appears to be handling the situation realistically and doing the best he can. I also think that Jeremic has done an excellent job so far.

But I am not Serbian, and just as everyone in other countries used to rave on about Maggie without understanding how she was viewed by/ what she was doing to many British communities, I may well have a different perspective if I were Serbian.

What I do know is that whichever route is taken Serbia is going to have to tread extremely carefully to avoid getting shafted.

James - Serbia will not have to 'endure the wrath of Nato' because if you haven't noticed the international community is clearly happier to deal with Belgrade than contemplate having to upset the government in Pristina.

Besides which Nato is like the EU; there are various levels of membership and the less powerful cannot just call for military action via the UN. Albania has nothing to do with Kosovo, and their membership will have no effect on the situation.

Serbia is an important trading route, an established nation and its government have already proved willing to 'turn the page' as you put it with their diplomacy and pro legal moves (as opposed to threats of violence).

The days of military evangelism are thankfully coming to an end. Blame the recession rather than those who push the buttons suddenly getting a conscience.

Kate, as usual you're on the money.

Kostunica's statements are more "scare tactics" than anything else. He's using Kosovo as a tool against his competitors in Belgrade more than anything else. No serious Serbian politican can say that Kosovo is forever gone without risking their career.

More likely, at least as I see it, Tadic is positioning himself to be far more of a negotiator with the EU over Kosovo's status than simply saying "Kosovo is ours from Leposavic to Dragas".

In any event, nothing more to comment here as others have expressed my thoughts already.

Of course Serbia will recognize Kosovo.

We've been saying that ever since them ICJ case was mentioned.

What Tadic is doing right now is slowly helping the West twist the mentality of the Serbian people so that it's easier to let go of Kosovo.

First they will allow EULEX, then they will say that the ICJ gave it's opinion and there's nothing they can do about it...by that time the people will no longer care about the recognition, and everyone will be moving on.

I have said this before on other boards and will say it on this one also. There is no Serbia, no BiH, no Kosovo, no Russia, etc...Another words there will soon be no independent or sovereign rule only Big Brother.

So Serbia in reality has NO decision in which direction it's country heads. It's all in the Bigger Powers.

The whole world has become a Colony of the Haves.

first of all, "James" ... the world is changing, and you don´t seem to realize it.

we will see who will have to come to terms with what... :)

but let me tell you one thing, if the oh so mighty NATO was merely capable of destroying some 15 serbian tanks in 78 days of merciless bombing...

what makes you believe that Serbia would be defeated???

and you say the Serbs are living in illusion? quite funny, I´d say.

as for this Albanian who is using "Ian" as a nick-name...

I can tell you that all those remarks about a "done deal" are really amusing. you know for yourself that this is only whishful thinking, my dear albanian friend.

as for this remark about UNSC 1244 not applicable because Kosovo was part of the SFJR..

Ian, I won´t give you lectures now about the fact that Kosovo never was a republic, but a province of Serbia, and neither will I teach you about the meaning of the term "legal succession"...

I think you will have to do a little bit research of your own, if you want to learn why you are wrong...

but let me assure you, you are wrong. and making this mistake, shows how little you seem to know about the Kosovo-issue...

ian

this is basically just bla bla what you are tossing out.
Lets stick to the facts:
UNSC 1244 is still in place Serbia is Yugoslavias succesor so 1244 guarantees Serbian integritiy over Kosovo.
Russia and China will veto any attempt to legalize this occupation of Serbian territory.Period.

Everything else you are mentioning is just wishful thinking.Period.

Oh yeah, and FYI...preambles of UN resolutions are legally non-binding.

Toss 1244 out of your next argument list with someone, you will not look very bright by claiming that a non-binding portion of a document guarantees anything. ;)

OK, Funcakes

You say "preambles of UN resolutions are legally non-binding" and "non-binding portion of a document guarantees [nothing]".

Please, tell me what the content of this non-binding portion of document is. What is said in it? On your own words.