Fresh clashes break out in Ukrainian capital

EU foreign ministers will on Thursday hold an emergency meeting in Brussels to decide on what measures will be taken, and whether to impose sanctions against Ukraine.

B92

Lets remind ourselves that one point of this fabled EU association agreement was that the former PM, Madame Timoshenko ( the $11 billion blonde) should be released from jail - where she's been put for her economic crimes. That shows what sort of 'association the Ukraine could look forward to.The second point was to refer Ukraine to the IMF and get the usual medicine of austerity and selling off of whatever left of public assets
Given the state of the EU, not least their appalling vanity project the Euro and the unwanted consequences of "open borders" Putin's stand on the present troubles in Ukraine may well be doing the EU a great favour.

The whole Western "hip hip hooray" in Ukraine is carried out by the same people who were the cheer leaders of the Orange fascism and has got nothing to do with democracy or living conditions of Ukrainians.It's aimed solely at Russia(It's the only power standing against the Western atrocities around the globe).Russia called the middle east crisis right: Iraq heading into civil war; Libya total chaos and in Syria and Iran total Western surrender and humiliation.

Lets hope situation in Ukraine calms down for the sake of all, demostration is going the violent way, it is not democratic way. Ukranian minoraty demostrating against government have shown their intentions by violent way, unfortinetly incoriged by EU and their intention is clear create tragedy in Ukrein for their own interests, do not foll in their trap.

There’s a crossroad until which almost all the Ukrainians have consensus. It is the estimation of the latest history , the privatization and the lust for better life. The Left Bank regions equally hate Yanukovich as a thief a traitor a coward ect. So the crossroad is what next ? The Nazi minority is big and aggressive enough to impose on the whole country. Then millions of the Russians here will fight as severe as the western Benderasts. The problem is the central Ukraine. Kiev is already punished for the support they had rendered to the Nazi. Poor people. Poor in every meaning of the word. Western regions can exist of the Gastarbeiter money sent from Poland or Russia and the state budget filled by the eastern (Russian) regions. So the only perspectives they have are seizing the state power to keeping the status quo. Otherwise banditism on the transit routes will be their only income.

Tymoshenko was arrested and tried by Russia's puppets for signing a deal with Russia, which Russia forced her to sign in the first place. All this was as a punishment for disobeying her Russian masters in the 2004 Orange Revolution.

(Ian, UK, 20 February 2014 13:04)

Your comment is ludicrous. The woman is a criminal and a fraud. Given the means Ms. Tymoshenko used to get rich quick, she is more akin to Imelda Marcos than Ukrainian Prime Minister(similar to your own Bliar).How did she manage to amass $billions Mr Genious? By saving up her Ukrainian PM's salary?It's also interesting to note that she refuses to divulge where her massive personal wealth has been hidden.Anybody would be happy to serve 7 years in prison, if he was coming home to a fortune of $billions. Wouldn't you?

Blame the US and the EU for encouraging chaos in Ukraine and the western Ukrainians for not accepting the principle that in a democratic society rulers are elected, re-elected or kicked out at general elections.If the roles were reversed and the protesters were in power would they act any differently to the current government? I doubt it. They've already shown a propensity for violence with aims to control a democratically elected government and if there is so much animosity toward it then what prevents them electing another government they agree with at the appropriate time?

Lets remind ourselves that one point of this fabled EU association agreement was that the former PM, Madame Timoshenko ( the $11 billion blonde) should be released from jail - where she's been put for her economic crimes. That shows what sort of 'association the Ukraine could look forward to.
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Don't be a fool Leonidas. Russia held Ukraine hostage over the gas dispute and Tymoshenko was forced/ pressured into signing that 'illegal' deal with Russia by Russia. Then when Moscow's puppet Viktor Yanukovych was installed in Ukraine by Russia, he had Yulia Tymoshenko arrested for signing the deal which Russia forced her to sign.

Tymoshenko was arrested and tried by Russia's puppets for signing a deal with Russia, which Russia forced her to sign in the first place. All this was as a punishment for disobeying her Russian masters in the 2004 Orange Revolution.

That is how corrupt Russia's puppets are in the Police State which Ukraine has become. And people are dying, but I suppose that doesn't bother you, just as long as an anti-Western regime is in power!

Viktor Yanukovych should have the same treatment as Mohamed Morsi in Egypt. Viktor Yanukovych should be held responsible and changed with inciting deadly violence and with the deaths of all Ukrainians who have been slain/ butchered by the Police.

This is the rational European view:

Quote:

Edward Lucas writes in a strongly worded comment piece for the Telegraph: "Ukrainians are fighting and dying for the right to be European. Theirs is not a naive belief in the EU's virtues, but a profound belief that liberty, legality and decency are better than crony capitalism and the neo-Soviet bombast of the Putin Kremlin."

It is all very well for pro Putin posters to sound off on this site, but the so called 'minority' in Ukraine have a serious point of view that they are prepared to stand up for.

which only the very few see (like the EU paying people $30.00 per head to go out and protest).
(Nikolle, 21 February 2014 00:11)

If you're referring to the point made by sj about protesters being paid to go out on the streets in Ukraine and protest I can also subscribe to its validity and also confirmed by Dr Craig Roberts(US assistant secretary to the treasury).

http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-and-eu-are-paying-ukrainian-rioters-and-protesters/5369316?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=us-and-eu-are-paying-ukrainian-rioters-and-protesters

Peter

You only have to examine the nature of the opposition and you’ll see that current troubles in Ukraine have nothing to do with democracy or the well being of Ukrainians. Opposition Groups such as “Pravy Sektor which is essentially an ultranationalist organization or the “Svoboda”& (UNA-UNSO” Neo-fascist groups derive their ideology from the Bandera’s “Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists”, the Nazi collaborators who fought against the Soviet Union and engaged in some of the worst atrocities in World War II.These groups are just Nazis aiming at gaining power by force.

I did accuse the EU & the US because of their open support of the opposition, regardless of its political character.Last two months we’ve seen leading US neo-cons such as John Mc Cain ,assistant US secretary Victoria Nuland and the German foreign minister joining the protesters in Kiev and calling for Yanukovich to be replaced.This is a blatant foreign intervention in the internal affairs of a sovereign country.

The current troubles in Ukraine are just part of the long term US geopolitical goal which is to isolate Russia through encirclement and for this reason, the US-EU-NATO alliance has, not for the first time, allied itself with fascists.As John McCain said the reason for US in Ukraine has nothing to do with democracy, is just “ business”.

http://work.colum.edu/~amiller/wolfowitz1992.htm

Do you even know that a 'fascist' is? Try looking in a mirror for starters.
(Ian, UK, 21 February 2014 13:51)

I am just about to look it up in the thesaurus dictionary.Even you should understand the actions of the fascist circles in US & UK in Middle East and around the world is not representative of its own populations.People in UK are infinitely more concerned with the floods than what is happening in Ukraine.

You never surprise me Leonidas, as to how low you can get!
(Ian, UK, 21 February 2014 11:09)

Have you ever thought why you're disliked and despised by a number of posters on this site? I will tell you the reason. Because you're a little intellectually deficient man who cannot respond to the challenges of arguing your case with other posters on this site and you retort in personal attacks.Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.

(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 20:12)

Yeah, you blame the West but never Russia. I suppose the West is to blame for Ukrainian Police firing sniper rifles and assault rifles into the bodies of hundred's of unarmed people? I suppose you think this is a good thing? You over estimate the influence of the West in Ukraine. The West is not capable of organising protests on this scale, but then again, you're blinded by your hate for the West.

You have no idea what democracy is. You actually think that Assad was democratically elected. Ukraine has become a police state, civil liberties are in serious decline as is freedom of media. Yanukovych has tried to end people's right to freedom of speech and tried to stop their right to protest too. Corruption is out of control, all the way to the highest level of government. Ukraine is no democracy, Yanukovych will do anything to hang onto power just like all the other fascist murdering rats which you admire. If Yanukovych had any honour at all, given the circumstances, he'd call for elections; but he won't because he is power thirsty and following the orders of Moscow.

You never surprise me Leonidas, as to how low you can get!

I have already replied to your comment Leonidas, but for whatever reason, it wasn't published. Will try again.

I read that article yesterday and nearly fell of my chair laughing. Tell me, do these people get paid cash in hand or via bank? In the event of being shot, do their premiums go up? do they get receipts after getting paid to protest? you see, people who believe in this, believe in anything

Leonidas

It is easy to accuse either the West or Russia of stoking the fire in Ukraine, depending on ones political convictions/leanings, but this is purely an internal Ukrainian issue: one of dissatisfaction with the current regime.

Yes, they may have been democratically voted in in 2012, but we both know that elections always end with an almost 50/50 split between the party the Western Ukraine votes for and the party that the Eastern Ukraine votes for, yet the fact of the matter is that there is unrest in several Eastern cities as well, like Kirovohrad, Poltava, Kharkiv and even Odessa, so not just the usual Galicia, Volyn and other Western parts.

If the government has done nothing to improve the lives of the people of the country they reign over, then the government must go. There is no doubt Yanukovich had a lot of promises that he didn't live up to and now he is reaping the consequences of it. If he didn't have such tendencies towards dictatorship, he would resign instead of using deadly force against his people to try and shut them up, but since he does, then this unrest can simply be seen as a logical consequence of his own incompetence.

I fail to see why people keep bringing the West and Russia into the internal affairs of an independent, sovereign state. I guess people simply have to create divisions into East and West in Europe for things to make sense for them, I don't know.

Have you ever thought why you're disliked and despised by a number of posters on this site? I will tell you the reason. Because you're a little intellectually deficient man who cannot respond to the challenges of arguing your case with other posters on this site and you retort in personal attacks.Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.
(Leonidas, 21 February 2014 12:15)

I'm not here to make friends. This is a news site, not a social network.

I never said you supported Gaddafi or Assad.

Do you even know that a 'fascist' is? Try looking in a mirror for starters.

The second point was to refer Ukraine to the IMF and get the usual medicine of austerity and selling off of whatever left of public assets
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

That medicine worked with Serbia, or so we’re told by Serbian true patriots, when Serbia sold NIS to Russia. So it appears to be the correct medicine.
----------

It's aimed solely at Russia
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Sure, like the West has time to waste with Russia…
----------

Russia called the middle east crisis right: Iraq heading into civil war
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

OK, let’s assume you are correct… and then what?!!!
----------

Libya total chaos
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

OK, but without Gadhafi…
----------

and in Syria and Iran total Western surrender and humiliation.
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Haha, surrender to what, dear?!!! If Russia has any war going on with Syria and Iran, that’s Russia’s problem. The West has not any war underway with Syria and/or Iran to surrender!
----------

Your comment is ludicrous. The woman is a criminal and a fraud. Given the means Ms. Tymoshenko used to get rich quick, she is more akin to Imelda Marcos than Ukrainian Prime Minister
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 20:12)

Come on, you don’t have to go that far… There are people similar to her much closer; like Putin & Co…

the blame-everything-on-the-West crowd is at it again. apparently, the fact that protesters were murdered by state police (which the West does not control), is the fault of of the West. how they reach this conclusion, is unknown to me, but then, i allegedly have my eyes closed. these people see things, which only the very few see (like the EU paying people $30.00 per head to go out and protest). it seems the vast majority of Ukrainians, rather prefer closer ties with the West, than the watchful eye of 'brother' Russia. good luck to them. i'd make the same choice myself

Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.
(Leonidas, 21 February 2014 12:15)

Ok, you and the West are on the same page then in supporting the right of the Libyans to choose themselves...

I'm assuming you did not seriously believe that Gaddafi would have left the Libyans to exercise their right of choice!

Lets remind ourselves that one point of this fabled EU association agreement was that the former PM, Madame Timoshenko ( the $11 billion blonde) should be released from jail - where she's been put for her economic crimes. That shows what sort of 'association the Ukraine could look forward to.
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Don't be a fool Leonidas. Russia held Ukraine hostage over the gas dispute and Tymoshenko was forced/ pressured into signing that 'illegal' deal with Russia by Russia. Then when Moscow's puppet Viktor Yanukovych was installed in Ukraine by Russia, he had Yulia Tymoshenko arrested for signing the deal which Russia forced her to sign.

Tymoshenko was arrested and tried by Russia's puppets for signing a deal with Russia, which Russia forced her to sign in the first place. All this was as a punishment for disobeying her Russian masters in the 2004 Orange Revolution.

That is how corrupt Russia's puppets are in the Police State which Ukraine has become. And people are dying, but I suppose that doesn't bother you, just as long as an anti-Western regime is in power!

Viktor Yanukovych should have the same treatment as Mohamed Morsi in Egypt. Viktor Yanukovych should be held responsible and changed with inciting deadly violence and with the deaths of all Ukrainians who have been slain/ butchered by the Police.

This is the rational European view:

Quote:

Edward Lucas writes in a strongly worded comment piece for the Telegraph: "Ukrainians are fighting and dying for the right to be European. Theirs is not a naive belief in the EU's virtues, but a profound belief that liberty, legality and decency are better than crony capitalism and the neo-Soviet bombast of the Putin Kremlin."

It is all very well for pro Putin posters to sound off on this site, but the so called 'minority' in Ukraine have a serious point of view that they are prepared to stand up for.

EU foreign ministers will on Thursday hold an emergency meeting in Brussels to decide on what measures will be taken, and whether to impose sanctions against Ukraine.

B92

Lets remind ourselves that one point of this fabled EU association agreement was that the former PM, Madame Timoshenko ( the $11 billion blonde) should be released from jail - where she's been put for her economic crimes. That shows what sort of 'association the Ukraine could look forward to.The second point was to refer Ukraine to the IMF and get the usual medicine of austerity and selling off of whatever left of public assets
Given the state of the EU, not least their appalling vanity project the Euro and the unwanted consequences of "open borders" Putin's stand on the present troubles in Ukraine may well be doing the EU a great favour.

The whole Western "hip hip hooray" in Ukraine is carried out by the same people who were the cheer leaders of the Orange fascism and has got nothing to do with democracy or living conditions of Ukrainians.It's aimed solely at Russia(It's the only power standing against the Western atrocities around the globe).Russia called the middle east crisis right: Iraq heading into civil war; Libya total chaos and in Syria and Iran total Western surrender and humiliation.

Lets hope situation in Ukraine calms down for the sake of all, demostration is going the violent way, it is not democratic way. Ukranian minoraty demostrating against government have shown their intentions by violent way, unfortinetly incoriged by EU and their intention is clear create tragedy in Ukrein for their own interests, do not foll in their trap.

Have you ever thought why you're disliked and despised by a number of posters on this site? I will tell you the reason. Because you're a little intellectually deficient man who cannot respond to the challenges of arguing your case with other posters on this site and you retort in personal attacks.Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.
(Leonidas, 21 February 2014 12:15)

I'm not here to make friends. This is a news site, not a social network.

I never said you supported Gaddafi or Assad.

Do you even know that a 'fascist' is? Try looking in a mirror for starters.

I have already replied to your comment Leonidas, but for whatever reason, it wasn't published. Will try again.

I read that article yesterday and nearly fell of my chair laughing. Tell me, do these people get paid cash in hand or via bank? In the event of being shot, do their premiums go up? do they get receipts after getting paid to protest? you see, people who believe in this, believe in anything

The second point was to refer Ukraine to the IMF and get the usual medicine of austerity and selling off of whatever left of public assets
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

That medicine worked with Serbia, or so we’re told by Serbian true patriots, when Serbia sold NIS to Russia. So it appears to be the correct medicine.
----------

It's aimed solely at Russia
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Sure, like the West has time to waste with Russia…
----------

Russia called the middle east crisis right: Iraq heading into civil war
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

OK, let’s assume you are correct… and then what?!!!
----------

Libya total chaos
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

OK, but without Gadhafi…
----------

and in Syria and Iran total Western surrender and humiliation.
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 11:27)

Haha, surrender to what, dear?!!! If Russia has any war going on with Syria and Iran, that’s Russia’s problem. The West has not any war underway with Syria and/or Iran to surrender!
----------

Your comment is ludicrous. The woman is a criminal and a fraud. Given the means Ms. Tymoshenko used to get rich quick, she is more akin to Imelda Marcos than Ukrainian Prime Minister
(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 20:12)

Come on, you don’t have to go that far… There are people similar to her much closer; like Putin & Co…

(Leonidas, 20 February 2014 20:12)

Yeah, you blame the West but never Russia. I suppose the West is to blame for Ukrainian Police firing sniper rifles and assault rifles into the bodies of hundred's of unarmed people? I suppose you think this is a good thing? You over estimate the influence of the West in Ukraine. The West is not capable of organising protests on this scale, but then again, you're blinded by your hate for the West.

You have no idea what democracy is. You actually think that Assad was democratically elected. Ukraine has become a police state, civil liberties are in serious decline as is freedom of media. Yanukovych has tried to end people's right to freedom of speech and tried to stop their right to protest too. Corruption is out of control, all the way to the highest level of government. Ukraine is no democracy, Yanukovych will do anything to hang onto power just like all the other fascist murdering rats which you admire. If Yanukovych had any honour at all, given the circumstances, he'd call for elections; but he won't because he is power thirsty and following the orders of Moscow.

You never surprise me Leonidas, as to how low you can get!

There’s a crossroad until which almost all the Ukrainians have consensus. It is the estimation of the latest history , the privatization and the lust for better life. The Left Bank regions equally hate Yanukovich as a thief a traitor a coward ect. So the crossroad is what next ? The Nazi minority is big and aggressive enough to impose on the whole country. Then millions of the Russians here will fight as severe as the western Benderasts. The problem is the central Ukraine. Kiev is already punished for the support they had rendered to the Nazi. Poor people. Poor in every meaning of the word. Western regions can exist of the Gastarbeiter money sent from Poland or Russia and the state budget filled by the eastern (Russian) regions. So the only perspectives they have are seizing the state power to keeping the status quo. Otherwise banditism on the transit routes will be their only income.

the blame-everything-on-the-West crowd is at it again. apparently, the fact that protesters were murdered by state police (which the West does not control), is the fault of of the West. how they reach this conclusion, is unknown to me, but then, i allegedly have my eyes closed. these people see things, which only the very few see (like the EU paying people $30.00 per head to go out and protest). it seems the vast majority of Ukrainians, rather prefer closer ties with the West, than the watchful eye of 'brother' Russia. good luck to them. i'd make the same choice myself

which only the very few see (like the EU paying people $30.00 per head to go out and protest).
(Nikolle, 21 February 2014 00:11)

If you're referring to the point made by sj about protesters being paid to go out on the streets in Ukraine and protest I can also subscribe to its validity and also confirmed by Dr Craig Roberts(US assistant secretary to the treasury).

http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-and-eu-are-paying-ukrainian-rioters-and-protesters/5369316?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=us-and-eu-are-paying-ukrainian-rioters-and-protesters

Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.
(Leonidas, 21 February 2014 12:15)

Ok, you and the West are on the same page then in supporting the right of the Libyans to choose themselves...

I'm assuming you did not seriously believe that Gaddafi would have left the Libyans to exercise their right of choice!

Tymoshenko was arrested and tried by Russia's puppets for signing a deal with Russia, which Russia forced her to sign in the first place. All this was as a punishment for disobeying her Russian masters in the 2004 Orange Revolution.

(Ian, UK, 20 February 2014 13:04)

Your comment is ludicrous. The woman is a criminal and a fraud. Given the means Ms. Tymoshenko used to get rich quick, she is more akin to Imelda Marcos than Ukrainian Prime Minister(similar to your own Bliar).How did she manage to amass $billions Mr Genious? By saving up her Ukrainian PM's salary?It's also interesting to note that she refuses to divulge where her massive personal wealth has been hidden.Anybody would be happy to serve 7 years in prison, if he was coming home to a fortune of $billions. Wouldn't you?

Blame the US and the EU for encouraging chaos in Ukraine and the western Ukrainians for not accepting the principle that in a democratic society rulers are elected, re-elected or kicked out at general elections.If the roles were reversed and the protesters were in power would they act any differently to the current government? I doubt it. They've already shown a propensity for violence with aims to control a democratically elected government and if there is so much animosity toward it then what prevents them electing another government they agree with at the appropriate time?

Peter

You only have to examine the nature of the opposition and you’ll see that current troubles in Ukraine have nothing to do with democracy or the well being of Ukrainians. Opposition Groups such as “Pravy Sektor which is essentially an ultranationalist organization or the “Svoboda”& (UNA-UNSO” Neo-fascist groups derive their ideology from the Bandera’s “Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists”, the Nazi collaborators who fought against the Soviet Union and engaged in some of the worst atrocities in World War II.These groups are just Nazis aiming at gaining power by force.

I did accuse the EU & the US because of their open support of the opposition, regardless of its political character.Last two months we’ve seen leading US neo-cons such as John Mc Cain ,assistant US secretary Victoria Nuland and the German foreign minister joining the protesters in Kiev and calling for Yanukovich to be replaced.This is a blatant foreign intervention in the internal affairs of a sovereign country.

The current troubles in Ukraine are just part of the long term US geopolitical goal which is to isolate Russia through encirclement and for this reason, the US-EU-NATO alliance has, not for the first time, allied itself with fascists.As John McCain said the reason for US in Ukraine has nothing to do with democracy, is just “ business”.

http://work.colum.edu/~amiller/wolfowitz1992.htm

You never surprise me Leonidas, as to how low you can get!
(Ian, UK, 21 February 2014 11:09)

Have you ever thought why you're disliked and despised by a number of posters on this site? I will tell you the reason. Because you're a little intellectually deficient man who cannot respond to the challenges of arguing your case with other posters on this site and you retort in personal attacks.Back to your claims I have never supported either Assad or Gaddafi but I've supported the right of the Libyans and Syrians to choose themselves and not the US or British fascists.

Do you even know that a 'fascist' is? Try looking in a mirror for starters.
(Ian, UK, 21 February 2014 13:51)

I am just about to look it up in the thesaurus dictionary.Even you should understand the actions of the fascist circles in US & UK in Middle East and around the world is not representative of its own populations.People in UK are infinitely more concerned with the floods than what is happening in Ukraine.

Leonidas

It is easy to accuse either the West or Russia of stoking the fire in Ukraine, depending on ones political convictions/leanings, but this is purely an internal Ukrainian issue: one of dissatisfaction with the current regime.

Yes, they may have been democratically voted in in 2012, but we both know that elections always end with an almost 50/50 split between the party the Western Ukraine votes for and the party that the Eastern Ukraine votes for, yet the fact of the matter is that there is unrest in several Eastern cities as well, like Kirovohrad, Poltava, Kharkiv and even Odessa, so not just the usual Galicia, Volyn and other Western parts.

If the government has done nothing to improve the lives of the people of the country they reign over, then the government must go. There is no doubt Yanukovich had a lot of promises that he didn't live up to and now he is reaping the consequences of it. If he didn't have such tendencies towards dictatorship, he would resign instead of using deadly force against his people to try and shut them up, but since he does, then this unrest can simply be seen as a logical consequence of his own incompetence.

I fail to see why people keep bringing the West and Russia into the internal affairs of an independent, sovereign state. I guess people simply have to create divisions into East and West in Europe for things to make sense for them, I don't know.