Turkey's EU bid has French president's "cautious backing"

I was personally hoping for a blockade against Turkey's membership in the EU by France, but it seems the liberals still see no sense. We have to rely on little Cyprus to keep Turkey out. Europe has a massive muslim immigrant population of 30-40 million in the EU alone, it cannot afford a massive 70-odd million muslim nation with a growth rate faster than that of Germany (of which around 20 million are not German already). This is not Eurabia, this is Europe, and it should remain so. Our ancestors did not bleed the field of Europe dry keeping the Turks out for them now to be let in through the front door! Muslims do not understand the concepts of tolerance, democracy etc., they put their faith and culture above all else and this will only bring Europe and all its principles to its knees! And those that claim Turkey is a secular and tolerant society, well, ask the Armenians, Greeks and Assyrians what they think of this notion. They have felt is first hand, not to mention the centuries of Ottoman yolk in the Balkans and Caucasus (thankfully, Central Europe managed to stop this terrible threat and the Russians helped the Balkans/Caucasus to be free of their rule).

Since B92 has a limit of 1,500 characters, here is my rant continued: No to Turkey in the EU! Not welcome! I highly doubt the majority of Europe's population (those that have a clue and are not just some drones without an educated opinion, as much of the youth is today - interested only in iPads and other rubbish) agree with this move either. KEEP THEM OUT! And then they sit and wonder why Golden Dawn, Front National, Jobbik et. are so popular in their respective countries. The EU is NOT WORKING and with Turkey in it, will sink and drown Europe.

French President Francois Hollande "cautiously backed" Turkey's aim to join the European Union on Monday

I know it's a cliche, but you really do have to wonder on which planet these people live, don't you?One has to wonder at the contempt with which the politicians and bureaucrats of the European Union treat us, the citizens, when they make patently absurd statements like that uttered by Hollande.These guys operate on the assumption of communications' systems and general information availability that existed in the 18th century. Say something to a small audience in Turkey and the chances are nobody will ever know. Even if the news comes to light, assume the proles are clueless anyway.So the French Prez, presiding over mushrooming unemployment, ballooning public sector bloat and hugely insolvent banks (all whilst striving to perpetuate the misery of the untenable EZ) is busy spinning that whopper to the Turks, who are sliding rapidly into the doo-dah themselves. You couldn't make it up.

Seriously,Mr Hollande put the Turks in EU right away to save us all from our misery.

Europe knows that turkey is not an European country. Europe is also aware that turkey doesnt really want to enter the EU. So what we see now is a theater with no meaning. Words exchanged amongst 2 politicians on their way down, no deadlines, no actions decided.

@Peter Sudyka,

A polish guy talking how Turks will migrate to Europe? I'm shocked. Not that I care abut Turkey but coming from a polish guy that was the shock, Peter please look at the figures of polish people across Europe?
(Mendo, 28 January 2014 18:25)

Poles are Europeans, Turks are not. That is the fundamental difference.

And yes, I know how many Polish, Baltic, Slovak, Romanian and Bulgarian (oh, and Albanian BTW) immigrants there are in Western European countries. What's your point here and how is it relative to my argument?

So Turkey will sink and drown Europe, because it has a faster growth rate than Germany?
(plumber buttcrack, 28 January 2014 17:29)

Yes, exactly. Would you like me to put that into even more simple terms for you to understand better?

@Peter Sudyka,

A polish guy talking how Turks will migrate to Europe? I'm shocked. Not that I care abut Turkey but coming from a polish guy that was the shock, Peter please look at the figures of polish people across Europe?

This has nothing to do with 'cautious backing'!
With over 60% of French beeing unhappy about beeing part of the EU you can be sure that the answer will be NO! as it was for the referendum concerning a EU constitution.
This applies to ANY enlargment, be it Turkey, Serbia or Switzerland!

Sorry to see that there's no investigatif journalism on this news.

French constitutional law (Title XV, art 88-5)stipulates:
"Any government bill authorizing the ratification of a treaty pertaining to the accession of a state to the European Union shall be submitted to referendum by the president of the republic.

Notwithstanding the foregoing, by passing a motion adopted in identical terms in each House by a three-fifths majority, Parliament may authorize the passing of the bill according to the procedure provided for in paragraph three of article 89."

Using the referendum, Hollande can be CERTAIN that the answer will be "NO"
The second possibility of passing a motion adopted in identical terms in each House by a three-fifths majority wouldn't make things much easier.
I can't remember ANY french law, during the last 30 years that achieved this kind of unity.

Another curiosity is that by virtue of the Constitutional Law no. 2008-724 of July 23, 2008 Article 88-5 is not applicable to accessions that result from an Intergovernmental Conference whose meeting was decided by the European Council before July 1, 2004.
This was the legal backdoor, allowing Croatia to join, before closing the door. Why? Ask your french "friends"
Encouraging Turkey to continue negotiatios is anything but "cautious backing"

So Turkey will sink and drown Europe, because it has a faster growth rate than Germany?

Nikolle, the Ottoman legacy is absolutely not the key point here, it is simply the fact that Turkey is not a European country. It has little in common with Europe mentally, culturally, socio-politically or anywhere else (aside from their obvious influences left during the Ottoman era in Balkans and to some extent, Central and Eastern Europe).

Why should a non-European country by allowed to join a European supra-national organization? Why do you think Morocco was denied EU membership (or even the possibility thereof) after they left the African Union?

And no, islam is not the only factor here, though it is indeed an important one, given that it is not only a question of religion, but how the mentality, culture and worldview are shaped as well, regardless of how secular the state may be (or may claim to be, in the case of Turkey).

Turkey will never be part of EU, it coltury politcly and religion dos not fit in europe let it be where it is right now.

if the argument for keeping Turkey out of the EU is their Ottoman legacy, then that is not a good enough argument. Germany (or more precisely, Austria) gave the world Hitler, about a billion times worse than anything any Ottoman Sultan ever did.

"..Europe mentally, culturally, socio-politically or anywhere else"

i have always wondered what this actually meant. to suggest that European mentality is the same in Romania and Germany, or Bulgaria and Poland or Sweden and Portugal is to fail to see that people think differently. my perception of European values are to do with respect for the law, respect of minorities, freedom of speech, an independent judiciary and fighting corruption. now, according to Transparency International, Turkey is less corrupt than the following EU states:
Greece, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Slovakia. According to many economic figures, Tureky is growing at a faster rate than many in the EU anyway, so how much Turkey actually needs Europe for growth is open to debate.
as far as I can tell, the reason why there is this reservation to Turkey joining in, is its Muslim majority population. probably the fact that the country itself is pretty powerful and would be one of the dominant players in the bloc also makes many people frightful

"to suggest that European mentality is the same in Romania and Germany, or Bulgaria and Poland or Sweden and Portugal is to fail to see that people think differently."

Indeed, there are differences between our European cultures, but with the possible exception of European Turkey and the touristy western coast, I see practically nothing in common with any European cultures and Anatolia (the vast majority of Turkey).

"my perception of European values are to do with respect for the law, respect of minorities, freedom of speech, an independent judiciary and fighting corruption."

Perhaps they are less corrupt, but nobody has an as horrific treatment of minorities record as Turkey has, even presently (ask the Kurds). Rule of law is the main reason they have not advanced further in negotiations with the EU. There are plenty of articles on the situation of the rule of law in Turkey. It's enough just to google it.

About the islam argument, well yes, to have a large muslim state that is not really secular (which I can say Albania is) is indeed very foreign to other European states when it comes to worldview, culture and mentality.

if the argument for keeping Turkey out of the EU is their Ottoman legacy, then that is not a good enough argument. Germany (or more precisely, Austria) gave the world Hitler, about a billion times worse than anything any Ottoman Sultan ever did.

I was personally hoping for a blockade against Turkey's membership in the EU by France, but it seems the liberals still see no sense. We have to rely on little Cyprus to keep Turkey out. Europe has a massive muslim immigrant population of 30-40 million in the EU alone, it cannot afford a massive 70-odd million muslim nation with a growth rate faster than that of Germany (of which around 20 million are not German already). This is not Eurabia, this is Europe, and it should remain so. Our ancestors did not bleed the field of Europe dry keeping the Turks out for them now to be let in through the front door! Muslims do not understand the concepts of tolerance, democracy etc., they put their faith and culture above all else and this will only bring Europe and all its principles to its knees! And those that claim Turkey is a secular and tolerant society, well, ask the Armenians, Greeks and Assyrians what they think of this notion. They have felt is first hand, not to mention the centuries of Ottoman yolk in the Balkans and Caucasus (thankfully, Central Europe managed to stop this terrible threat and the Russians helped the Balkans/Caucasus to be free of their rule).

Since B92 has a limit of 1,500 characters, here is my rant continued: No to Turkey in the EU! Not welcome! I highly doubt the majority of Europe's population (those that have a clue and are not just some drones without an educated opinion, as much of the youth is today - interested only in iPads and other rubbish) agree with this move either. KEEP THEM OUT! And then they sit and wonder why Golden Dawn, Front National, Jobbik et. are so popular in their respective countries. The EU is NOT WORKING and with Turkey in it, will sink and drown Europe.

@Peter Sudyka,

A polish guy talking how Turks will migrate to Europe? I'm shocked. Not that I care abut Turkey but coming from a polish guy that was the shock, Peter please look at the figures of polish people across Europe?

"..Europe mentally, culturally, socio-politically or anywhere else"

i have always wondered what this actually meant. to suggest that European mentality is the same in Romania and Germany, or Bulgaria and Poland or Sweden and Portugal is to fail to see that people think differently. my perception of European values are to do with respect for the law, respect of minorities, freedom of speech, an independent judiciary and fighting corruption. now, according to Transparency International, Turkey is less corrupt than the following EU states:
Greece, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Slovakia. According to many economic figures, Tureky is growing at a faster rate than many in the EU anyway, so how much Turkey actually needs Europe for growth is open to debate.
as far as I can tell, the reason why there is this reservation to Turkey joining in, is its Muslim majority population. probably the fact that the country itself is pretty powerful and would be one of the dominant players in the bloc also makes many people frightful

Europe knows that turkey is not an European country. Europe is also aware that turkey doesnt really want to enter the EU. So what we see now is a theater with no meaning. Words exchanged amongst 2 politicians on their way down, no deadlines, no actions decided.

French President Francois Hollande "cautiously backed" Turkey's aim to join the European Union on Monday

I know it's a cliche, but you really do have to wonder on which planet these people live, don't you?One has to wonder at the contempt with which the politicians and bureaucrats of the European Union treat us, the citizens, when they make patently absurd statements like that uttered by Hollande.These guys operate on the assumption of communications' systems and general information availability that existed in the 18th century. Say something to a small audience in Turkey and the chances are nobody will ever know. Even if the news comes to light, assume the proles are clueless anyway.So the French Prez, presiding over mushrooming unemployment, ballooning public sector bloat and hugely insolvent banks (all whilst striving to perpetuate the misery of the untenable EZ) is busy spinning that whopper to the Turks, who are sliding rapidly into the doo-dah themselves. You couldn't make it up.

Seriously,Mr Hollande put the Turks in EU right away to save us all from our misery.

So Turkey will sink and drown Europe, because it has a faster growth rate than Germany?

This has nothing to do with 'cautious backing'!
With over 60% of French beeing unhappy about beeing part of the EU you can be sure that the answer will be NO! as it was for the referendum concerning a EU constitution.
This applies to ANY enlargment, be it Turkey, Serbia or Switzerland!

Sorry to see that there's no investigatif journalism on this news.

French constitutional law (Title XV, art 88-5)stipulates:
"Any government bill authorizing the ratification of a treaty pertaining to the accession of a state to the European Union shall be submitted to referendum by the president of the republic.

Notwithstanding the foregoing, by passing a motion adopted in identical terms in each House by a three-fifths majority, Parliament may authorize the passing of the bill according to the procedure provided for in paragraph three of article 89."

Using the referendum, Hollande can be CERTAIN that the answer will be "NO"
The second possibility of passing a motion adopted in identical terms in each House by a three-fifths majority wouldn't make things much easier.
I can't remember ANY french law, during the last 30 years that achieved this kind of unity.

Another curiosity is that by virtue of the Constitutional Law no. 2008-724 of July 23, 2008 Article 88-5 is not applicable to accessions that result from an Intergovernmental Conference whose meeting was decided by the European Council before July 1, 2004.
This was the legal backdoor, allowing Croatia to join, before closing the door. Why? Ask your french "friends"
Encouraging Turkey to continue negotiatios is anything but "cautious backing"

@Peter Sudyka,

A polish guy talking how Turks will migrate to Europe? I'm shocked. Not that I care abut Turkey but coming from a polish guy that was the shock, Peter please look at the figures of polish people across Europe?
(Mendo, 28 January 2014 18:25)

Poles are Europeans, Turks are not. That is the fundamental difference.

And yes, I know how many Polish, Baltic, Slovak, Romanian and Bulgarian (oh, and Albanian BTW) immigrants there are in Western European countries. What's your point here and how is it relative to my argument?

So Turkey will sink and drown Europe, because it has a faster growth rate than Germany?
(plumber buttcrack, 28 January 2014 17:29)

Yes, exactly. Would you like me to put that into even more simple terms for you to understand better?

Nikolle, the Ottoman legacy is absolutely not the key point here, it is simply the fact that Turkey is not a European country. It has little in common with Europe mentally, culturally, socio-politically or anywhere else (aside from their obvious influences left during the Ottoman era in Balkans and to some extent, Central and Eastern Europe).

Why should a non-European country by allowed to join a European supra-national organization? Why do you think Morocco was denied EU membership (or even the possibility thereof) after they left the African Union?

And no, islam is not the only factor here, though it is indeed an important one, given that it is not only a question of religion, but how the mentality, culture and worldview are shaped as well, regardless of how secular the state may be (or may claim to be, in the case of Turkey).

Turkey will never be part of EU, it coltury politcly and religion dos not fit in europe let it be where it is right now.

"to suggest that European mentality is the same in Romania and Germany, or Bulgaria and Poland or Sweden and Portugal is to fail to see that people think differently."

Indeed, there are differences between our European cultures, but with the possible exception of European Turkey and the touristy western coast, I see practically nothing in common with any European cultures and Anatolia (the vast majority of Turkey).

"my perception of European values are to do with respect for the law, respect of minorities, freedom of speech, an independent judiciary and fighting corruption."

Perhaps they are less corrupt, but nobody has an as horrific treatment of minorities record as Turkey has, even presently (ask the Kurds). Rule of law is the main reason they have not advanced further in negotiations with the EU. There are plenty of articles on the situation of the rule of law in Turkey. It's enough just to google it.

About the islam argument, well yes, to have a large muslim state that is not really secular (which I can say Albania is) is indeed very foreign to other European states when it comes to worldview, culture and mentality.