“Intl. community preparing ground for full independence”

Independent Kosovo is the only way for peace in Balkans. Serbs lose a lot of energy with Kosovo. It must be better to concentrate that energy in economy of Serbia.

"That was attempted in July of last year and they failed miserably resulting in one terrorist being murdered by the local population and the Albs retreated in defeat back to Pristina doing NOTHING about that terrorists' murder."

At least you admit it was murder. And for the "terrorist": we have been called that by the ones like you since the 80s. But keep on calling us "terrorists", make us even more willing never to return to the ones like you.

But keep on talking the Milosevic talk as long as you admit that there are murderers in the north protected by Belgrade.

But I thought according to so many on here that the west was starting the reintegration of Kosovo into Serbia??? Certainly we have not been misled!

As I said before, the only way that is possible is if you get Serbia to agree which is not even the hard part. With scum in Belgrade leading the country then nothing is impossible.

The hard part would be moving 40,000 dead bodies out of Mitrovica. Because that is exactly what would have to happen in order for that area to be under this hypothetical state that cannot exist unless Belgrade is submitted.

The point is the Serbs of Northern Mitrovica are along with Republika Srpska, bastions of Serbdom. You will get rid of Serbian institutions there over their dead bodies. I personally talk to people mainly from Zvecan who have confirmed this.

Now why would the "international community" (really only USA and the crumbling EU) would help such known criminals, I don't even think I would like to know the answer to that question.

But we have gotten to this point because of SERBIA. It was our govt who took the venue of these talks to the EU it was our govt who submitted a watered down version of the draft that was voted on in the UN and our govt that purposely asked a misleading question at the ICJ. It is sabotage and all those should be held in contempt of treason.

Fortunately not the Serb govt, organ trafficking rapists nor KFOR imperialist neo Nazis will pressure the Serbs of Mitrovica. That is remaining out of reach from criminal institutions until a responsible people take control of Belgrade, and the entire occupation is lifted.

(Bilbao, 24 June 2012 14:45)

I am not frustrated at all but I thank you for showing concern. I do agree with you though, nobody forced Serbia to go to the ICJ and nobody forced Serbia to ask such a gray question that can be spinned in a number of different ways.

This is a regime that has for the most part lost all credibility among the people. Due to shady backdoor deals of parties completely abandoning their original ideology and just complete apathy by the Serbian electorate, they are constantly being voted into gov't by sham elections.

You bring up 200k Serbs in Krajina. But here is where there is a major difference. Krajina was never legally apart of Serbia. Kosovo* is LEGALLY apart of Serbia. You can spin it anyway you like it, you can say de-facto this and that but the reality is under international law, Kosovo is apart of Serbia.

Its just goes back to what I have been saying all along. If Kosovo was not apart of Serbia then why send Angela Merkel and Hilary Clinton to Belgrade to convince us of otherwise.

A. the Albanians in Kosovo do not have the physical strength to impose their wills over the Serbs of Mitro. That was attempted in July of last year and they failed miserably resulting in one terrorist being murdered by the local population and the Albs retreated in defeat back to Pristina doing NOTHING about that terrorists' murder.

B. You will never agree to KFOR massacring 40k people to suit your unrealistic wet dreams.

Can't happen. Not in this lifetime.

And I thought Kosovo is already independent after the famous UDI from some years ago? What shall this 'full' independence be like?

- Kosovo won't become a UN member and recognized state any time soon.
- EULEX will leave, transfer things to the 'competent' Kosovo authorities, and this black hole on European soil will sink even deeper into corruption, impunity, patronage and crime than it is now?

(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 13:01)

I understand your frustration but you need ot be realistic.

#1 ICJ no one forced Serbia to ask wrong question they asked the right question to leave room as they knew they could loos.
#2 Going to UN without a blessing of EU/US it would go no where and Serbias interest was to talk.

40K Serbs in the north can do as much trouble as 200K Serbs in Croatia for now they have had free rain to do as they please now they will be the sacrificial lamb, Beograd will not be able to Finance them and as a result not automaticly but step by Step this will be filled with kosovo institutions.

I hope no one dies as this is not in best interest of Serbia ( and trust me no one is going to kill any woman and children which should bring the number to 10K) there are no more than 10K Serbs able to fight it KFOR that is protecting them there.

Cheers

The problem with Albanians is that they believe anything that is said in the media.
Answer this riddle and if it’s an honest yes to all the questions then Kosovo will be independent as the US.
Does it have enough water or mineral resources? Does it have sufficient energy to meet local as well as any industrial demands? Have the internationalists established taxation model and a means to recover such monies? Have the so called Pristina authorities established what our little Albanians like to call rule of law or perhaps an independent judicial system? How are the police, schools, hospitals, doctors, government workers and so on and so forth to be funded??????
The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. The EU is in crises, the US is in a Great Recession and worst is yet to come with signs of unemployment on the rise again – some are already predicting up to 27% opps no it should be only 8.7%.
And the Albanians think this is real. When pigs start flying, that’s when. Another Belgrade tabloid with an over reactive imagination.

Kosovo won't become a UN member and recognized state any time soon.
(Comm. Parrisson, 24 June 2012 14:22)

Sure, Kosovo won't become a recognized state by Serbia any time soon; but it will continue to be a recognized state by many other countries.

And yes Kosovo will not be a UN member any time soon, first because it has not applied for it and second because it does not need it to be independent or recognized; UN membership has no relevance on either of the two.

i though all the albanians on here said kosovo was independant already since 99 lol i guess not is it now andthe north with over 60,000 serbs will still laugh just like everyone else just laughing at albanians.

This Janjic guy should move to Tirana and write his drivels there...
We Serbs do have a problem:
There are too many fifth columnists within our ranks who would sell their mother like this guy to write "realistic" articles (of course only if they are antiSerb) and get paid by our enemies(NATO & Albanians)!

Kosovo is still part of Serbia according to UN1244,Russia and China,Spain will block every attempt of Kosovo to go into UN,NATO,EU!
In their support I am very much sure since they are mature and serious countries unlike Serbia,the only thing I have doubt is in the Serbs from Serbia,the Serbian government!
They are capable of every treachery,of every move which could haunt Serbias national interests!

I can very well remember Russian Ambassador Konuzin,who in July last year,when Albanian ROSU with the support of NATO tried to ethnically cleanse Serbs from Mitrovica,went to a Belgrade based NATO conference(this is only possible in Serbia,NATO troops are cleansing Serbs while a NATO conference is held in Serbia) and famously said:

"Are there any Serbs in this room?"

Of course the liberal scum was foaming since they have been exposed brutally by Konuzin for what they were...

I must say I really enjoyed for the first time a foreigner washing Tadics head in public...

Does it have enough water or mineral resources? Does it have sufficient energy to meet local as well as any industrial demands? Have the internationalists established taxation model and a means to recover such monies? Have the so called Pristina authorities established what our little Albanians like to call rule of law or perhaps an independent judicial system? How are the police, schools, hospitals, doctors, government workers and so on and so forth to be funded??????
The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. The EU is in crises, the US is in a Great Recession and worst is yet to come with signs of unemployment on the rise again – some are already predicting up to 27% opps no it should be only 8.7%.
(sj, 24 June 2012 14:44)

Woow, that's a great description of Serbia dear as we see it everyday on the section on the right of this page labeled "Economic Crisis in Serbia". I'd suggest to the B92 staff to use the excellent analysis of the CE of B92 forums sj to further enrich that section.

P.S. CE = Chief Economist

Can't happen. Not in this lifetime.
(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 15:14)

NEither was Vojvodina part of Serbia but it was given as a present in WWI. World is funny like this it takes and gives away.

I said that KFOR is protecting the SERBS nit that is going to kill them and I said I hope no one dies. I have no such wet dreams of people dying to the contrary you are here praising people killing with sniper a police officer and saying that they did nothing after. You kow how hard it was to swallow for people that but they were forced by KFOR to go back.

We can stay here fighting with words but reality is that Serbia lost Kosovo and for that Kumanovo agreement is signed by Serbia.

Changing constitution in a step does not make it part of your territory but no point to argue, Alzas in France was Germany and now its France. Regardles of History big portions of Ukrain used to be part of Poland but they are not any longer and the bigest is Vojvodina historically it was never Serbian.

You win some you loos some as you see now the batle for Kosovo is for a small portion of territory and 40K people and that its how they will be controlling their fate, we know what Sertba wants a small RS in Kosovo but west learned and they will get something like Athasari with no mention of his name.

But again we can just guess as we wont be asked solution will be forced down our throughts.

I like how the West and NATO have hijacked the word "International community". They are not the international community as the majority of the world in fact support Serbia's territorial integrity. While the West and NATO have been attempting to gain independence for "Kosova"* for well over a decade, there is nothing new here. The north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide.

But I thought according to so many on here that the west was starting the reintegration of Kosovo into Serbia??? Certainly we have not been misled!
(doodah, 24 June 2012 13:52)

So why were Albanians pelting Cooper with tomatoes?

The point is the Serbs of Northern Mitrovica are along with Republika Srpska, bastions of Serbdom.
(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 13:01)

That's nice... The bastions of Serbdom in Kosovo are the best evidence that Kosovo is a multhi-ethnic society as Albanians say.

The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. sj.
thank you sj, I had never ever read that anywhere in a western paper. No one I know has a clue that there is a financial crisis going on. How bad is it really?
Of course if it were printed in the media like this article we would have automatically known it was not true because sj tells us not to believe anything in the media.

Of course if I hit European Economic crisis in google news I get 143,000 hits,
and if I hit US Economic crisis I get 1,200,000
It is amazing that no one but sj is talking about it!!!

Kosovo* was never designed to have "full independence". It was designed to have a weak central authority with enormous powers of decentralization at the municipal level, with "enhanced competencies" for Serb-majority municipalities. Even under the best circumstances, these municipalities would maintain closer ties to Belgrade than Pristina, and with limited international recognition and a staunch refusal of northern Kosovo Serbs to cooperate with a bunch of inept and corrupt Washington-trained puppets, any talk of "full independence" for a supposed country with a footnote describing its sovereignty is laughable.

as Ari said: Its just goes back to what I have been saying all along. If Kosovo was not apart of Serbia then why send Angela Merkel and Hilary Clinton to Belgrade to convince us of otherwise.

That what I have underlined all the time and jihadist can only gnaw their lips or give thumbs down (what else can one xpect from thieves), cause truth hurts: If Kosovo is not ours, why are they asking us to give it up? If it is theirs, why are they taking it by force? And if they can take it by force, why they are so circumspect about it?" Jihadists and their delusional Western supporters steal others peoples land, ethnically cleanse the owners and then try to convince victim of a crime that they must to accept utter injustice? Only fools or suicidal entities would do that...

KOSOVO BELONGS TO USA

Full independence for Kosovo and full independence for Sandzak.
Serbs must be less noisy and stop blocking solution of international problems.
After, Serbia can be some little Oblast of Russia if they want.

As you can see when you use logic with the Albanians they respond with off goes the head and on goes the pumpkin.

I ask a series of simple questions and what do I get? Some very banal and stupid answers. How is Kosovo going to become a self sustaining country? You do recall that the EU wants every part to stand on its own two little legs; ask the Croats or Slovenes or Latvians or Estonians.

The crises in the EU is slowly spreading throughout Europe like a disease and there is no answer to it this time as the Germans are being engulfed in it too. You see the German banks lent the money to places like Greece, Italy etc so they can buy their goods and now with no more loans being taken up guess what happens to German productions????

I know I frighten you people, but let’s try for the fiftieth time, please answer the questions honestly.

To those that think that the US Government has not been hiding the true economic status get a hold of Treasury papers on your budget and see if you can work out what you owe or even where your money is being spent then come back to me and tell its all on the internet.

(pss, 25 June 2012 10:16)

I know just how viable a place like Kosovo is. Corruption is everywhere including the US. When they sell military equipment to Middle Eastern countries US companies give out bribes to officials.
Jadranka Kosor summed up the issue of foreign investment about 6 or 7 months ago. While visiting a local factory which had expanded its production she officiated in opening the new wing and afterwards mingled with the workers. One man asked her in front of the HTV camera why wasn’t her government putting more effort into attracting foreign industry to Croatia. Kosor said past and her administration have worked hard in doing just that but foreign industry is not interested in Croatia because it is a small country and it’s not viable. Croatia has 4.2 million while Kosovo has 1.2.
Investment is not coming into Kosovo because it’s not viable and not because corporations are afraid of war. You do not have the population to sustain such investment. The EU wants industry opening up in Serbia like Fiat in Kragujevac to then make components elsewhere like in the old Yugoslavia, but it’s all up to Belgrade where they locate production. You see components will be made for Fiat but in Republika Srpska.
Actually Milosevic spent about $150 million on a biscuit factory in Pristina before the war but when Belgrade saw hostilities would take place they removed the machinery and only the shell was left and now in ruins.

Oh great, another brilliant piece of economic analysis from sj! OK, read this with care, if Kosova is this perpetually piss poor, eternally impoverished place, why on Io does Serbia want it? Seriously, it makes no sense

Just a short comment on the used language: It is not the "international community" which is in favour of independence/secessionism of Kosovo. It is the West. This should be clear mentioned. China, Russia, India, Brasil and more than 100 countries are against the "independence" of this terrorist construction. I do not understand, why serbian Politicians or Media are telling the people the "international community" wants this or is against that. Make it clear: The EU and NATO-States many - serbian politicians want to see Serbia as a member - wants Serbias complete subjugation. So please name it as it is: The West, in particular USA, Germany, France, Netherlands and Great Britain!

"And yes Kosovo will not be a UN member any time soon, first because it has not applied for it and second because it does not need it to be independent or recognized; UN membership has no relevance on either of the two."
(icj1, 24 June 2012 17:13)

Yes, 'representatives of the people of Kosovo' said 'Kosovo is independent', and Kosovo became independent. Kosovo is recognized by the 99 or whatever countries that recognized it. Life is easy. What needs the 'international community' to prepare then, I wonder?

"That's nice... The bastions of Serbdom in Kosovo are the best evidence that Kosovo is a multhi-ethnic society as Albanians say."
(icj1, 24 June 2012 17:09)

If Albanians would say that, it would be great. And even greater would be, if they act like that. Not the scumbags that throw stones or attack people only because of their ethnicity, I mean, but the official state organs like KPS which surely don't behave unbiased and tolerate ethnically motivated crimes.

So far, I only heard the international community which sponsored the Kosovo project (and 'suggested' the words of the Kosovo constitution) talking about a 'multi-ethnic society'.

Alzas in France was Germany and now its France.

(Bilbao, 24 June 2012 17:39)

But remember Sudets were given to Czechoslovakia after WWI and see just in 20 years Germans got it back. Turkey occupied Northern Cyprus and got away with that so everything is possible.

"Kosovo project"...duh! Some people never tire of writing crap. Yes Kosovo was a beacon of tolerance before those nasty Westerness decided to sponsor Kosovo. We should give it to Serbia again, after all they were doing such a good job of it

"Intl.community preparing ground for full independence"
The headline is incorrect.Some Western countries led by Washington and Brussels are engaged, from the day one, to give Kosovo full independence.
Howevr,most populous countries of the World do not support full independence for Kosovo.To date,no one including Washington and Brussels
made public, written request to Serbia to give province of Kosovo full independence.Kosovo,at present time is semi independent state(with out sovreignty)and should remain in that state for forseeable future.Kosovo do not need to be fully independent state to prosper economically.West has been more then 12 years in the province and appears to be still in first gear.Its very expensive to build the Nation.

I know I frighten you people
(sj, 25 June 2012 00:30

You really think you frighten anyone, anyone at all? You spout rhetoric some based in reality that is common knowledge and try to interlace it with ultranationalist twists to create a picture of doom for Kosovo.
Serbia has been effective in blocking a lot of free standing industries from entering Kosovo in that people are not looking at a black hole as you and others say. Corruption has never been the block to enterprise look at russia, Serbia, China etc. What worries industry is the indeterminate status of Kosovo, will the north go back to Serbia? Will there be another war?, will Serbia succeed in overtaking Kosovo. Most doubt these things but when thinking of investing millions or billions the choice will be in a more stable area. As in Venezuela, some of the oil companies and banks have learned while their investments paid off very profitably all it takes is one overzealous leader to come in and confiscate all their assets for the state. This is exactly what would happen to all that would be present in Kosovo should Serbia ever take the helm again. This was Milosevic's plan he shut down all state factories and destroyed the economy in order to drive the Albanians out.
As far as standing on its own. Kosovo has the capability of over 1/3 of the independent members of the UN. Joining the EU, It is a ways down the road but if it meets the political goals the economics will soon come

to pss, 25 June 2012 14:04)

No I am NOT Serb. Just one Serb poet has said those words and I found them a while ago, and he is darn right, otherwise you would not be tweeting on Serbian site, right?

to the one who claims to be non-albanian, pss:

it´s a typical albanian propaganda-phrase ( "the Serbs want the land but not the people" ) that doesn´t really fit into that so carefully described story of a foreigner who is just interested in the well-being of "the people"... what poeple do you mean? those who were illegally bombed in ´99 , based on fabricated lies by the "allies" , of course led by the USofA... or those who are waving american flags wherever they can, just to show their anklegrabbing-attitude, those whe desperately wish to make others believe that they are the descendants of the socalled illyrians, just to somehow, even if totally silly, create some justification for their greater albanian project?

you know, the Serbs are not that stupid. even if you should not be a k-albanian, it doesn´t matter actually. because the Serbs will not let them go. not with OUR land. because, just in case you did not get it by now - KiM is serbian soil.

and we will do everything to liberate it.

that´s something you can count on. just one hint for you, my "non-albanian" friend: the ottoman turks stayed for several centuries until they were driven out.

the US and their bootlickers will not stay that long. and we will take care of that. Serbia will prevail.

and you are free to contribute to the poeple´s well-being then. in case you should still be there.

They are not the international community as the majority of the world in fact support Serbia's territorial integrity. While the West and NATO have been attempting to gain independence for "Kosova"* for well over a decade, there is nothing new here. The north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide.
(Zoran, 24 June 2012 20:44)

Yes, the majority of the world supports the territorial integrity of Serbia, as it supports the one of Kosovo, Russia, US, etc... Thanks for reminding us of that.

And yes, the north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide because the north is independent from Belgrade as the rest of Kosovo.

With a little help from you exKfor eh?

exKfor, kind of blew your cover there dude. I think most everyone knew you were a Serb trying to pretend to be an exKfor soldier that "saw the light"
But when you write "If Kosovo is not ours, why are they asking us to give"
Kind of makes it hard to deny.

sj, I don't know about the biscuit factory, the only person I have ever heard that story from is you. I have my doubts during his heyday of trying to rid Kosovo of Albanians but if he did build one I am sure it had a Serb only sign over the employment line. But as far as stripping it and leaving a shell that was true of ever factory in Kosovo the main reason that the infrastructure in Kosovo is non existent. It is hard to build factories from nothing but empty delapidated buildings.
There is one huge reason the Fiat plant is being built in Serbia, it is because the labor force will cost 30cents on the dollar. There are not a lot of places in Europe you can get that deal.

As far as standing on its own. Kosovo has the capability of over 1/3 of the independent members of the UN. Joining the EU, It is a ways down the road but if it meets the political goals the economics will soon come
(pss, 25 June 2012 10:16)

I always wondered why such an articulate and possibly intelligent poster would undermine themselves, in fighting for a cause opposite to anything noble.

We will wait with suspense for Kosovo* to apply any semblance or notion of EU values.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/22/us-kosovo-resignation-idUSBRE85L14420120622

http://www.eurasiareview.com/24062012-kosovo-critics-target-size-of-government/

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-14/kosovo-privatization-agency-director-asanaj-killed-in-pristina.html

A plethora of evidence hinting Kosovo* can stand on it's own in the past few days.

Uber optimism seems to be the opium of some people, but, isn't that how the West and it's financial institutions got in trouble in the first place? Soon that pot of gold will be found if I only follow Pss's rainbow map, here Mr Leprechaun where are you.....

(To catch a Leprechaun, 25 June 2012 15:07)
You know I went to Kosovo in 2006, with the thoughts that its only chance for survival was to somehow reintegrate it with Serbia and guarantee the security of its people. However, over the next few months I talked to many of the people, survivors of the war and Milosevic, I traveled the country and saw the destruction and tasks that these people had ahead of them. And then I followed the Serbian political scene and I never once even today have seen an effort on the Serbian govt to want to include the people of Kosovo in Serbia. They all want the same thing Milosevic wanted the land without the people. Then I started reading Serbian papers such as this at at first Serbianna (that did not last long) and I realized that there was zero chance for survival of these people if they ever came under the thumb of Serbia again.
Now do I ever believe that Kosovo will ever be a robust thriving economy, not in my life time. My statement on 1/3 of the UN members was just that. More than that are in as bad if not worse shape than Kosovo.
On the other hand do I think Serbia has a bright future, a mediocre one at best, it has potential but no one interested in developing it, it only comes second to insuring that the Albanians fail.

The one big thing I did learn is that most people Albanian or Serbian just want a decent life for their family. That is my interest in the cause.

To catch a Leprechaun, 25 June 2012 15:07)
I need to say more about my reason for supporting the people of Kosovo.
I was born in the 1950's one of my first memories is standing on the sofa in our living room looking out the window and seeing men in white sheets burning a cross in a neighbors yard and my mother grabbing me and taking me to the bedroom. It was years later that I learned that incident was because the man in that house had dated a black girl.
I remember the day the national guard came to our town to stand guard while the black children were brought to our all white school. I remember my wife and I watching a close friends baby (who was black) and going to town and the looks of disgust we received. I never understood the prejudice against a people for being different. Why hate someone you do not know, simply because they are different. There are too many evil individuals out there that deserve it.
So if I root for a team it will probably be the oppressed. In 2012 do I think Kosovo has the right leaders no but it is traditional that those who fight to achieve a rebellion is usually the initial leaders. (1st US President General George Washington) Hopefully after 1-2 elections a true leader will surface.

I know I frighten you people
(sj, 25 June 2012 00:30)

Why would people be frightened ?!... Your posts are a great opportunity for making big profits by short-selling stocks. People must be ignorant to not understand that you and your Malaysian friend get insider information ahead of the rest of the market offering opportunities for big profits. Keep up your good work mate :)

(pss, 26 June 2012 10:19)
Every country rode on the back of cheap labor to success it’s just that the US schools don’t teach their history very well.
Milosevic was the cleverest politician in the world who was more than capable of not only running a country but huge corporations. There was no westerner that even came close to his capabilities. Milosevic saw Albanians as a threat. Even Tito at times of crises such as the one between Yugoslavia and Italy in the late 1950s the first place he sent reinforcement was to Kosovo then the Italian/Yugoslav border – there were other incidents like this one. It sad to say that Albanians have a history in that department.
As far as industry being closed by Milosevic it was mainly due to sanctions at the time. As far as schools being closed, why should Serbs pay for schools that taught the Albanian language in Serbia? Did Albania pay for Serbian or Greek schools? No. In the past Albanians finished even at university level in Albanian but they could not get employment and not in just Serbia but the rest of Europe.
However, the question is what has the west done so far for the Albanians? Where is the industry? No matter how you like to say it in the end Kosovo is economically unsustainable. It has nothing to entice industry. Look, one of the elements of why the US rose to power was industry that rode on the back of lots of cheap electricity for production. Kosovo runs on generators.

(pss, 26 June 2012 12:12)

I was not born nor raised in a communist country. I have lived all my life in what you call a western country – Australia with the exception of when working overseas like now. My mother is an Australian whose family goes back to the first settlers of 1788; she married a Serb who studied engineering in Australia in the early 1950s.
On the issue of schools, does the US government pay for Albanian schools there? Or is the official language English and what you want to learn on your own time and expense is your business? What? that Albanian universities produce graduates that can find jobs elsewhere? Not even doctors are recognized outside Albania.

On Milosevic, I have met people who have dealt with him on the business side before the wars and all say the same thing, he was highly intelligent and extremely capable who could have got any post he wished for. Bill Clinton is not much more than a charming but entertaining buffoon who arrived in Australia about 12 years ago and told an assembly of returned Vietnam veterans how the US won the war. He was told to go you know where. Bill is just an amusing clow.
On cheap energy, it’s a historical fact that the US rose to great heights because of that fact. This is simple business. My statements to you on Kosovo are purely based on business principles and not because there are Albanians living there. I do understand that when cut Albanians bleed just like Serbs and it’s also a red colour.

my dear pss, actually it doesn´t matter where you come from since you are wrong. it is your stance that is not only "not liked" by me as you try to put it - no, it is simply and completely wrong. a stupid and rather simple propaganda-phrase of the greater-albanian liars.

the Albanians in southern Serbia have had their own schools, their own radio-stations and -programs, they had it all, but they wanted something else...they wanted something that is not theirs - our land. and interestingly, it is the Albanians who are forcing out other ethnicities.. they want southern Serbia without the Serbs

and with poeple like you, be it albanian or not, easily reiterating these false claims, they managed to drag foreign power into southern Serbia, to do the dirty work for them.

finally, whatever you may think doesn´t matter because they will be defeated sooner or later and that is something you can be sure of.


by the way, it is not important for me or "the Serbs" what ethnicity one has - the Serbs have always lived in harmony with others who were peaceful and righteous. so, trying to present me as someone who is thinking about ethnicity or race... while it is the Albanians who are constantly coming up with these categories shows me that you either have not understood what the problem is about, OR you deliberately do not want to see what is so obvious.

but don´t worry. Serbia will prevail. it is our spirit that makes us strong. we never give up. and our revenge will be rigorous.

(pss, 25 June 2012 14:04)

Actually Milosevic was to try to keep the locals in employment and most of those were Albanian. The problem with the Albanians is they thought they were going to see the streets of Pristina paved in gold once the west arrived, but it did not happen. It would be nice for moment to admit that during the early ears there was some industry brought by Belgrade to Kosovo and as far as the biscuit factory is concerned why the Albanians would mention this fact as they have shot themselves in the foot and now have nothing.
On the issue of “as stripping it and leaving a shell that was true of ever factory in Kosovo”, when the Us left Clarke Air force base and Subic Bay Naval installation in the Philippines in the 1990s, the US stripped every building and even pulled out the electrical wiring and burnt everything they would not take, even new computers. So what did you except Belgrade to do? But even if everything was left in tacit those factories would still be idle as they were only a small component.
Cheap labor is how the US started and its how China, India and Brazil have risen in wealth. What is most important to have people working and the rest follows.
Another nail in the EU coffin – Cyprus has asked for loans now to stave off collpase.

Cheap labor is how the US started and its how China, India and Brazil have risen in wealth. What is most important to have people working and the rest follows.
Another nail in the EU coffin – Cyprus has asked for loans now to stave off collpase.
(sj, 26 June 2012 01:43)
When someone coined the phrase "Ignorance is Bliss" it wasn't really taken as a true statement. The US did not achieve their success in cheap labor as you suggest. They achieved it in advances in technology that allowed things to be made cheaper, ie the assembly line concept, etc. The US labor market has not been considered cheap for at least 75 years if ever. Japan made its comeback after rebuilding from the war on cheap labor in manufacturing. Of course with that success comes higher wages and prices. It is their concept that you first saw South Korea, now China, India, Brazil following suit. The question is will they also fall into the same problems as Japan and the workforce no longer be kept satisfied with low wages. Only time will tell.
As far as Milosevic, you are dead wrong history proves it and I have heard no one but you claim to the contrary. Milosevic's goal was never to keep the Albanians working, he is the one who closed the schools, the factories, and instituted most of the programs to try and drive the Albanians out of Kosovo.

sj, 26 June 2012 11:44)
I yield, there is no competing with deep rooted bigotry and decades of communist indoctrination. I will just leave you with your view of the world, I am pretty sure you will not change any opinions but you may make the other Serbian ultranationalists feel warm and fuzzy.

very nice.

"pss" cannot contribute anything else than his quite wrong and of course rather subjective view of allegedly "established facts"! or in other words: he cannot answer confirmable arguments. what also let´s him appear like he´s just another Albanian, hiding cowardly behind a "western" smoke-screen...

leprachaun has, I must admit it, quite nicely unveiled how wrong those k-albanian propaganda-claims are, but all "pss" is coming up with are stories of old men he "met" and told him stories... and his claims about alleged "facts".

I must say I am quite impressed by his "objectivity", but given that all he says or to be precise, all he writes, sounds like cheap albanian propaganda, it´s hardly surprising.

my dear "pss", instead of writing nonsense here, you should rather educate yourself a little bit more thoroughly on the sociopolitical circumstances in southern Serbia before the NATO-aggression.

that would be better than bleating albanian propaganda-phrases like " the Serbs want the land without the Albanians", which only shows the low level of your argumentation.

and, last but not least, have you ever just thought for a second about the possibility of the Albanians lying? ...of course, only in case you are not an Albanian yourself.

anyway, you just proved, you have no arguments. and as previously said, that´s no surprise.

Serbia will prevail. just a question of time.

Jovan, 25 June 2012 21:40)
You know Jovan, it matters not to me whether you think I am Albanian or not, I don't take it as an insult. One of the differences in you and me I don't see that heritage or ethniticity is a more than an interesting conversation topic.
So if it makes you believe that I am Albanian go for it. The thing you do not like is my message, and that is Serbs want Kosovo without the Albanians on it and have done nothing, nada, zip to show the world otherwise.
One thing about America is that it is a relatively new country built by immigrants from all over so there are very few "pure" blood lines so if you hate an ethnic group you may find out someday you really hate yourself. I may have Albanian in my blood, I may have Serbian in my blood, I really do not know but none of that would change my stance.

sj, 26 June 2012 13:12),
Wasn't going to respond but I must.
I never disputed the energy claim, US has always had cheaper energy forms and still does. Right now Gasoline runs about 3.50 a gallon which would translate somewhere around 90cents a liter.
My dispute where you were claiming US made it economically due to cheap labor, not true, when US labor was cheap by global standards there was not a huge global commerce. It was on technology to include energy that made mass production cheaper but that argument really does not matter.
No in the US we do not teach in Albanian but then there is not a high percentage of Albanians, or Serbians or Romanians, or Greeks etc, etc, there. But you will find our biggest non English constituent Spanish speaking with the ability to learn in Spanish plus most signage in the US has Spanish on it and translators in most every segment of society.
This in contrast to Kosovo part of pre1999 Serbia which was almost exclusively Albanian. I once visited a man who was beaten by Milosevics kind hearted Serbian police, what was his crime? He taught Albanian children in his home after the schools were closed. His home and farm were later burned to the ground as he and his family fled from Serbian police, so don't tell me what a great humanitarian Milosevic was, your own people are the ones who overthrew him.

(pss, 26 June 2012 10:19)

Au contraire my dear friend, it is thee who has been misled, you will find that Milosevic re-opened for example the University of Pristina even sending in police to beat up and evict the Serbian protesters in 1998. You will also find he had a very good working relationship with Ibrahim Rugova an Albanian who was largely seen by Albanian ultra-nationalists and violent radicals such as Thaci (a former student) to be getting in the way of a Greater Albania project.

The reason why such an institution was closed is very reasonable, I cannot imagine or place myself in such a gullible position to think a host country should be paying for ultra-nationalist and Maoist teachings of Enver Hoxha by foreign professors. These guys went two steps further than MEChA.

About development and funding below,

http://books.google.com.au/books?id=Po03enYpbqsC&pg=PA179&lpg=PA179&dq=total+investment+in+kosovo&source=bl&ots=pC2Jw175l2&sig=L_3dcY9dAfHGW1ZgPurhEex-WbA&hl=en&ei=NUTXTsbyFImfiAe8kLj8DQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEMQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=total%20investment%20in%20kosovo&f=false

Somehow it is never enough, nor recognised. Albanians you would have found also being employed heavily in State mining, forestry and in many other segments during your “travels” until offcourse many were accused and some killed after being labelled collaborators by their own.

All they wanted was work not nationalism, provocations and reprisals.

To catch a Leprechaun, 27 June 2012 12:34)
I think we have established 2 facts.
1. To you Milosevic was a great humanitarian that treated the Albanians like his own children.
2. To the rest of the world he was a ruthless dictator determined to erase the Albanian people from Kosovo, by whatever force and means necessary.

To catch a Leprechaun, 27 June 2012 12:34)
I think we have established 2 facts.
1. To you Milosevic was a great humanitarian that treated the Albanians like his own children.
2. To the rest of the world he was a ruthless dictator determined to erase the Albanian people from Kosovo, by whatever force and means necessary.
(pss, 27 June 2012 14:36)


(pss, 27 June 2012 14:36)

Again you are to presumptuous, I am no supporter of Milosevic but am objective enough to correct a few of your mistakes. Again you seem to state a mistaken generalisation “the rest of the world” you do understand he had supporters from other parts of the world too.

Don’t be to quick to establish “facts” without necessarily gathering all the facts, ooh jeez but offcourse, there always was a different agenda, silly me…

Milosevic was the cleverest politician in the world who was more than capable of not only running a country but huge corporations. There was no westerner that even came close to his capabilities.
(sj, 26 June 2012 11:44)

I fully agree... what a great loss for the mankind. You should have convinced you merchant bank in malaysia to hire him as manager so that the bank could have had followed the same glorious path as Serbia in the 1990s LOL

anyway, you just proved, you have no arguments. and as previously said, that´s no surprise.

Serbia will prevail. just a question of time.
(Jovan, 28 June 2012 09:45)
The gentleman I spoke of seemed genuine, well educated and I found no reason for him to lie and most of his story was verifyable. My comments about Serbs wanting the land without the Albanians does not come from Albanians but from people here on this forum and the actions of your politicians. Name one thing that the govt of Serb has done to encourage the Albanian people they have a place in Serbia should Kosovo return.
If this were a goal that would have been built into your constitution form the beginning.

As I said before, the only way that is possible is if you get Serbia to agree which is not even the hard part. With scum in Belgrade leading the country then nothing is impossible.

The hard part would be moving 40,000 dead bodies out of Mitrovica. Because that is exactly what would have to happen in order for that area to be under this hypothetical state that cannot exist unless Belgrade is submitted.

The point is the Serbs of Northern Mitrovica are along with Republika Srpska, bastions of Serbdom. You will get rid of Serbian institutions there over their dead bodies. I personally talk to people mainly from Zvecan who have confirmed this.

Now why would the "international community" (really only USA and the crumbling EU) would help such known criminals, I don't even think I would like to know the answer to that question.

But we have gotten to this point because of SERBIA. It was our govt who took the venue of these talks to the EU it was our govt who submitted a watered down version of the draft that was voted on in the UN and our govt that purposely asked a misleading question at the ICJ. It is sabotage and all those should be held in contempt of treason.

Fortunately not the Serb govt, organ trafficking rapists nor KFOR imperialist neo Nazis will pressure the Serbs of Mitrovica. That is remaining out of reach from criminal institutions until a responsible people take control of Belgrade, and the entire occupation is lifted.

And I thought Kosovo is already independent after the famous UDI from some years ago? What shall this 'full' independence be like?

- Kosovo won't become a UN member and recognized state any time soon.
- EULEX will leave, transfer things to the 'competent' Kosovo authorities, and this black hole on European soil will sink even deeper into corruption, impunity, patronage and crime than it is now?

i though all the albanians on here said kosovo was independant already since 99 lol i guess not is it now andthe north with over 60,000 serbs will still laugh just like everyone else just laughing at albanians.

Independent Kosovo is the only way for peace in Balkans. Serbs lose a lot of energy with Kosovo. It must be better to concentrate that energy in economy of Serbia.

The problem with Albanians is that they believe anything that is said in the media.
Answer this riddle and if it’s an honest yes to all the questions then Kosovo will be independent as the US.
Does it have enough water or mineral resources? Does it have sufficient energy to meet local as well as any industrial demands? Have the internationalists established taxation model and a means to recover such monies? Have the so called Pristina authorities established what our little Albanians like to call rule of law or perhaps an independent judicial system? How are the police, schools, hospitals, doctors, government workers and so on and so forth to be funded??????
The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. The EU is in crises, the US is in a Great Recession and worst is yet to come with signs of unemployment on the rise again – some are already predicting up to 27% opps no it should be only 8.7%.
And the Albanians think this is real. When pigs start flying, that’s when. Another Belgrade tabloid with an over reactive imagination.

But I thought according to so many on here that the west was starting the reintegration of Kosovo into Serbia??? Certainly we have not been misled!
(doodah, 24 June 2012 13:52)

So why were Albanians pelting Cooper with tomatoes?

This Janjic guy should move to Tirana and write his drivels there...
We Serbs do have a problem:
There are too many fifth columnists within our ranks who would sell their mother like this guy to write "realistic" articles (of course only if they are antiSerb) and get paid by our enemies(NATO & Albanians)!

Kosovo is still part of Serbia according to UN1244,Russia and China,Spain will block every attempt of Kosovo to go into UN,NATO,EU!
In their support I am very much sure since they are mature and serious countries unlike Serbia,the only thing I have doubt is in the Serbs from Serbia,the Serbian government!
They are capable of every treachery,of every move which could haunt Serbias national interests!

I can very well remember Russian Ambassador Konuzin,who in July last year,when Albanian ROSU with the support of NATO tried to ethnically cleanse Serbs from Mitrovica,went to a Belgrade based NATO conference(this is only possible in Serbia,NATO troops are cleansing Serbs while a NATO conference is held in Serbia) and famously said:

"Are there any Serbs in this room?"

Of course the liberal scum was foaming since they have been exposed brutally by Konuzin for what they were...

I must say I really enjoyed for the first time a foreigner washing Tadics head in public...

(Bilbao, 24 June 2012 14:45)

I am not frustrated at all but I thank you for showing concern. I do agree with you though, nobody forced Serbia to go to the ICJ and nobody forced Serbia to ask such a gray question that can be spinned in a number of different ways.

This is a regime that has for the most part lost all credibility among the people. Due to shady backdoor deals of parties completely abandoning their original ideology and just complete apathy by the Serbian electorate, they are constantly being voted into gov't by sham elections.

You bring up 200k Serbs in Krajina. But here is where there is a major difference. Krajina was never legally apart of Serbia. Kosovo* is LEGALLY apart of Serbia. You can spin it anyway you like it, you can say de-facto this and that but the reality is under international law, Kosovo is apart of Serbia.

Its just goes back to what I have been saying all along. If Kosovo was not apart of Serbia then why send Angela Merkel and Hilary Clinton to Belgrade to convince us of otherwise.

A. the Albanians in Kosovo do not have the physical strength to impose their wills over the Serbs of Mitro. That was attempted in July of last year and they failed miserably resulting in one terrorist being murdered by the local population and the Albs retreated in defeat back to Pristina doing NOTHING about that terrorists' murder.

B. You will never agree to KFOR massacring 40k people to suit your unrealistic wet dreams.

Can't happen. Not in this lifetime.

(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 13:01)

I understand your frustration but you need ot be realistic.

#1 ICJ no one forced Serbia to ask wrong question they asked the right question to leave room as they knew they could loos.
#2 Going to UN without a blessing of EU/US it would go no where and Serbias interest was to talk.

40K Serbs in the north can do as much trouble as 200K Serbs in Croatia for now they have had free rain to do as they please now they will be the sacrificial lamb, Beograd will not be able to Finance them and as a result not automaticly but step by Step this will be filled with kosovo institutions.

I hope no one dies as this is not in best interest of Serbia ( and trust me no one is going to kill any woman and children which should bring the number to 10K) there are no more than 10K Serbs able to fight it KFOR that is protecting them there.

Cheers

KOSOVO BELONGS TO USA

But I thought according to so many on here that the west was starting the reintegration of Kosovo into Serbia??? Certainly we have not been misled!

"That was attempted in July of last year and they failed miserably resulting in one terrorist being murdered by the local population and the Albs retreated in defeat back to Pristina doing NOTHING about that terrorists' murder."

At least you admit it was murder. And for the "terrorist": we have been called that by the ones like you since the 80s. But keep on calling us "terrorists", make us even more willing never to return to the ones like you.

But keep on talking the Milosevic talk as long as you admit that there are murderers in the north protected by Belgrade.

The point is the Serbs of Northern Mitrovica are along with Republika Srpska, bastions of Serbdom.
(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 13:01)

That's nice... The bastions of Serbdom in Kosovo are the best evidence that Kosovo is a multhi-ethnic society as Albanians say.

Kosovo won't become a UN member and recognized state any time soon.
(Comm. Parrisson, 24 June 2012 14:22)

Sure, Kosovo won't become a recognized state by Serbia any time soon; but it will continue to be a recognized state by many other countries.

And yes Kosovo will not be a UN member any time soon, first because it has not applied for it and second because it does not need it to be independent or recognized; UN membership has no relevance on either of the two.

I like how the West and NATO have hijacked the word "International community". They are not the international community as the majority of the world in fact support Serbia's territorial integrity. While the West and NATO have been attempting to gain independence for "Kosova"* for well over a decade, there is nothing new here. The north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide.

Can't happen. Not in this lifetime.
(Ari Gold, 24 June 2012 15:14)

NEither was Vojvodina part of Serbia but it was given as a present in WWI. World is funny like this it takes and gives away.

I said that KFOR is protecting the SERBS nit that is going to kill them and I said I hope no one dies. I have no such wet dreams of people dying to the contrary you are here praising people killing with sniper a police officer and saying that they did nothing after. You kow how hard it was to swallow for people that but they were forced by KFOR to go back.

We can stay here fighting with words but reality is that Serbia lost Kosovo and for that Kumanovo agreement is signed by Serbia.

Changing constitution in a step does not make it part of your territory but no point to argue, Alzas in France was Germany and now its France. Regardles of History big portions of Ukrain used to be part of Poland but they are not any longer and the bigest is Vojvodina historically it was never Serbian.

You win some you loos some as you see now the batle for Kosovo is for a small portion of territory and 40K people and that its how they will be controlling their fate, we know what Sertba wants a small RS in Kosovo but west learned and they will get something like Athasari with no mention of his name.

But again we can just guess as we wont be asked solution will be forced down our throughts.

Full independence for Kosovo and full independence for Sandzak.
Serbs must be less noisy and stop blocking solution of international problems.
After, Serbia can be some little Oblast of Russia if they want.

I know I frighten you people
(sj, 25 June 2012 00:30

You really think you frighten anyone, anyone at all? You spout rhetoric some based in reality that is common knowledge and try to interlace it with ultranationalist twists to create a picture of doom for Kosovo.
Serbia has been effective in blocking a lot of free standing industries from entering Kosovo in that people are not looking at a black hole as you and others say. Corruption has never been the block to enterprise look at russia, Serbia, China etc. What worries industry is the indeterminate status of Kosovo, will the north go back to Serbia? Will there be another war?, will Serbia succeed in overtaking Kosovo. Most doubt these things but when thinking of investing millions or billions the choice will be in a more stable area. As in Venezuela, some of the oil companies and banks have learned while their investments paid off very profitably all it takes is one overzealous leader to come in and confiscate all their assets for the state. This is exactly what would happen to all that would be present in Kosovo should Serbia ever take the helm again. This was Milosevic's plan he shut down all state factories and destroyed the economy in order to drive the Albanians out.
As far as standing on its own. Kosovo has the capability of over 1/3 of the independent members of the UN. Joining the EU, It is a ways down the road but if it meets the political goals the economics will soon come

With a little help from you exKfor eh?

Does it have enough water or mineral resources? Does it have sufficient energy to meet local as well as any industrial demands? Have the internationalists established taxation model and a means to recover such monies? Have the so called Pristina authorities established what our little Albanians like to call rule of law or perhaps an independent judicial system? How are the police, schools, hospitals, doctors, government workers and so on and so forth to be funded??????
The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. The EU is in crises, the US is in a Great Recession and worst is yet to come with signs of unemployment on the rise again – some are already predicting up to 27% opps no it should be only 8.7%.
(sj, 24 June 2012 14:44)

Woow, that's a great description of Serbia dear as we see it everyday on the section on the right of this page labeled "Economic Crisis in Serbia". I'd suggest to the B92 staff to use the excellent analysis of the CE of B92 forums sj to further enrich that section.

P.S. CE = Chief Economist

Oh great, another brilliant piece of economic analysis from sj! OK, read this with care, if Kosova is this perpetually piss poor, eternally impoverished place, why on Io does Serbia want it? Seriously, it makes no sense

as Ari said: Its just goes back to what I have been saying all along. If Kosovo was not apart of Serbia then why send Angela Merkel and Hilary Clinton to Belgrade to convince us of otherwise.

That what I have underlined all the time and jihadist can only gnaw their lips or give thumbs down (what else can one xpect from thieves), cause truth hurts: If Kosovo is not ours, why are they asking us to give it up? If it is theirs, why are they taking it by force? And if they can take it by force, why they are so circumspect about it?" Jihadists and their delusional Western supporters steal others peoples land, ethnically cleanse the owners and then try to convince victim of a crime that they must to accept utter injustice? Only fools or suicidal entities would do that...

"And yes Kosovo will not be a UN member any time soon, first because it has not applied for it and second because it does not need it to be independent or recognized; UN membership has no relevance on either of the two."
(icj1, 24 June 2012 17:13)

Yes, 'representatives of the people of Kosovo' said 'Kosovo is independent', and Kosovo became independent. Kosovo is recognized by the 99 or whatever countries that recognized it. Life is easy. What needs the 'international community' to prepare then, I wonder?

"That's nice... The bastions of Serbdom in Kosovo are the best evidence that Kosovo is a multhi-ethnic society as Albanians say."
(icj1, 24 June 2012 17:09)

If Albanians would say that, it would be great. And even greater would be, if they act like that. Not the scumbags that throw stones or attack people only because of their ethnicity, I mean, but the official state organs like KPS which surely don't behave unbiased and tolerate ethnically motivated crimes.

So far, I only heard the international community which sponsored the Kosovo project (and 'suggested' the words of the Kosovo constitution) talking about a 'multi-ethnic society'.

"Kosovo project"...duh! Some people never tire of writing crap. Yes Kosovo was a beacon of tolerance before those nasty Westerness decided to sponsor Kosovo. We should give it to Serbia again, after all they were doing such a good job of it

(pss, 25 June 2012 10:16)

I know just how viable a place like Kosovo is. Corruption is everywhere including the US. When they sell military equipment to Middle Eastern countries US companies give out bribes to officials.
Jadranka Kosor summed up the issue of foreign investment about 6 or 7 months ago. While visiting a local factory which had expanded its production she officiated in opening the new wing and afterwards mingled with the workers. One man asked her in front of the HTV camera why wasn’t her government putting more effort into attracting foreign industry to Croatia. Kosor said past and her administration have worked hard in doing just that but foreign industry is not interested in Croatia because it is a small country and it’s not viable. Croatia has 4.2 million while Kosovo has 1.2.
Investment is not coming into Kosovo because it’s not viable and not because corporations are afraid of war. You do not have the population to sustain such investment. The EU wants industry opening up in Serbia like Fiat in Kragujevac to then make components elsewhere like in the old Yugoslavia, but it’s all up to Belgrade where they locate production. You see components will be made for Fiat but in Republika Srpska.
Actually Milosevic spent about $150 million on a biscuit factory in Pristina before the war but when Belgrade saw hostilities would take place they removed the machinery and only the shell was left and now in ruins.

"Intl.community preparing ground for full independence"
The headline is incorrect.Some Western countries led by Washington and Brussels are engaged, from the day one, to give Kosovo full independence.
Howevr,most populous countries of the World do not support full independence for Kosovo.To date,no one including Washington and Brussels
made public, written request to Serbia to give province of Kosovo full independence.Kosovo,at present time is semi independent state(with out sovreignty)and should remain in that state for forseeable future.Kosovo do not need to be fully independent state to prosper economically.West has been more then 12 years in the province and appears to be still in first gear.Its very expensive to build the Nation.

Kosovo* was never designed to have "full independence". It was designed to have a weak central authority with enormous powers of decentralization at the municipal level, with "enhanced competencies" for Serb-majority municipalities. Even under the best circumstances, these municipalities would maintain closer ties to Belgrade than Pristina, and with limited international recognition and a staunch refusal of northern Kosovo Serbs to cooperate with a bunch of inept and corrupt Washington-trained puppets, any talk of "full independence" for a supposed country with a footnote describing its sovereignty is laughable.

Just a short comment on the used language: It is not the "international community" which is in favour of independence/secessionism of Kosovo. It is the West. This should be clear mentioned. China, Russia, India, Brasil and more than 100 countries are against the "independence" of this terrorist construction. I do not understand, why serbian Politicians or Media are telling the people the "international community" wants this or is against that. Make it clear: The EU and NATO-States many - serbian politicians want to see Serbia as a member - wants Serbias complete subjugation. So please name it as it is: The West, in particular USA, Germany, France, Netherlands and Great Britain!

exKfor, kind of blew your cover there dude. I think most everyone knew you were a Serb trying to pretend to be an exKfor soldier that "saw the light"
But when you write "If Kosovo is not ours, why are they asking us to give"
Kind of makes it hard to deny.

sj, I don't know about the biscuit factory, the only person I have ever heard that story from is you. I have my doubts during his heyday of trying to rid Kosovo of Albanians but if he did build one I am sure it had a Serb only sign over the employment line. But as far as stripping it and leaving a shell that was true of ever factory in Kosovo the main reason that the infrastructure in Kosovo is non existent. It is hard to build factories from nothing but empty delapidated buildings.
There is one huge reason the Fiat plant is being built in Serbia, it is because the labor force will cost 30cents on the dollar. There are not a lot of places in Europe you can get that deal.

To catch a Leprechaun, 25 June 2012 15:07)
I need to say more about my reason for supporting the people of Kosovo.
I was born in the 1950's one of my first memories is standing on the sofa in our living room looking out the window and seeing men in white sheets burning a cross in a neighbors yard and my mother grabbing me and taking me to the bedroom. It was years later that I learned that incident was because the man in that house had dated a black girl.
I remember the day the national guard came to our town to stand guard while the black children were brought to our all white school. I remember my wife and I watching a close friends baby (who was black) and going to town and the looks of disgust we received. I never understood the prejudice against a people for being different. Why hate someone you do not know, simply because they are different. There are too many evil individuals out there that deserve it.
So if I root for a team it will probably be the oppressed. In 2012 do I think Kosovo has the right leaders no but it is traditional that those who fight to achieve a rebellion is usually the initial leaders. (1st US President General George Washington) Hopefully after 1-2 elections a true leader will surface.

Alzas in France was Germany and now its France.

(Bilbao, 24 June 2012 17:39)

But remember Sudets were given to Czechoslovakia after WWI and see just in 20 years Germans got it back. Turkey occupied Northern Cyprus and got away with that so everything is possible.

As you can see when you use logic with the Albanians they respond with off goes the head and on goes the pumpkin.

I ask a series of simple questions and what do I get? Some very banal and stupid answers. How is Kosovo going to become a self sustaining country? You do recall that the EU wants every part to stand on its own two little legs; ask the Croats or Slovenes or Latvians or Estonians.

The crises in the EU is slowly spreading throughout Europe like a disease and there is no answer to it this time as the Germans are being engulfed in it too. You see the German banks lent the money to places like Greece, Italy etc so they can buy their goods and now with no more loans being taken up guess what happens to German productions????

I know I frighten you people, but let’s try for the fiftieth time, please answer the questions honestly.

To those that think that the US Government has not been hiding the true economic status get a hold of Treasury papers on your budget and see if you can work out what you owe or even where your money is being spent then come back to me and tell its all on the internet.

They are not the international community as the majority of the world in fact support Serbia's territorial integrity. While the West and NATO have been attempting to gain independence for "Kosova"* for well over a decade, there is nothing new here. The north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide.
(Zoran, 24 June 2012 20:44)

Yes, the majority of the world supports the territorial integrity of Serbia, as it supports the one of Kosovo, Russia, US, etc... Thanks for reminding us of that.

And yes, the north simply will not submit regardless of what the sellouts in Belgrade may decide because the north is independent from Belgrade as the rest of Kosovo.

As far as standing on its own. Kosovo has the capability of over 1/3 of the independent members of the UN. Joining the EU, It is a ways down the road but if it meets the political goals the economics will soon come
(pss, 25 June 2012 10:16)

I always wondered why such an articulate and possibly intelligent poster would undermine themselves, in fighting for a cause opposite to anything noble.

We will wait with suspense for Kosovo* to apply any semblance or notion of EU values.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/22/us-kosovo-resignation-idUSBRE85L14420120622

http://www.eurasiareview.com/24062012-kosovo-critics-target-size-of-government/

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-14/kosovo-privatization-agency-director-asanaj-killed-in-pristina.html

A plethora of evidence hinting Kosovo* can stand on it's own in the past few days.

Uber optimism seems to be the opium of some people, but, isn't that how the West and it's financial institutions got in trouble in the first place? Soon that pot of gold will be found if I only follow Pss's rainbow map, here Mr Leprechaun where are you.....

(To catch a Leprechaun, 25 June 2012 15:07)
You know I went to Kosovo in 2006, with the thoughts that its only chance for survival was to somehow reintegrate it with Serbia and guarantee the security of its people. However, over the next few months I talked to many of the people, survivors of the war and Milosevic, I traveled the country and saw the destruction and tasks that these people had ahead of them. And then I followed the Serbian political scene and I never once even today have seen an effort on the Serbian govt to want to include the people of Kosovo in Serbia. They all want the same thing Milosevic wanted the land without the people. Then I started reading Serbian papers such as this at at first Serbianna (that did not last long) and I realized that there was zero chance for survival of these people if they ever came under the thumb of Serbia again.
Now do I ever believe that Kosovo will ever be a robust thriving economy, not in my life time. My statement on 1/3 of the UN members was just that. More than that are in as bad if not worse shape than Kosovo.
On the other hand do I think Serbia has a bright future, a mediocre one at best, it has potential but no one interested in developing it, it only comes second to insuring that the Albanians fail.

The one big thing I did learn is that most people Albanian or Serbian just want a decent life for their family. That is my interest in the cause.

to pss, 25 June 2012 14:04)

No I am NOT Serb. Just one Serb poet has said those words and I found them a while ago, and he is darn right, otherwise you would not be tweeting on Serbian site, right?

to the one who claims to be non-albanian, pss:

it´s a typical albanian propaganda-phrase ( "the Serbs want the land but not the people" ) that doesn´t really fit into that so carefully described story of a foreigner who is just interested in the well-being of "the people"... what poeple do you mean? those who were illegally bombed in ´99 , based on fabricated lies by the "allies" , of course led by the USofA... or those who are waving american flags wherever they can, just to show their anklegrabbing-attitude, those whe desperately wish to make others believe that they are the descendants of the socalled illyrians, just to somehow, even if totally silly, create some justification for their greater albanian project?

you know, the Serbs are not that stupid. even if you should not be a k-albanian, it doesn´t matter actually. because the Serbs will not let them go. not with OUR land. because, just in case you did not get it by now - KiM is serbian soil.

and we will do everything to liberate it.

that´s something you can count on. just one hint for you, my "non-albanian" friend: the ottoman turks stayed for several centuries until they were driven out.

the US and their bootlickers will not stay that long. and we will take care of that. Serbia will prevail.

and you are free to contribute to the poeple´s well-being then. in case you should still be there.

The so called internationals are lurching from one crises to another but it’s all democratically being hidden form their populace. sj.
thank you sj, I had never ever read that anywhere in a western paper. No one I know has a clue that there is a financial crisis going on. How bad is it really?
Of course if it were printed in the media like this article we would have automatically known it was not true because sj tells us not to believe anything in the media.

Of course if I hit European Economic crisis in google news I get 143,000 hits,
and if I hit US Economic crisis I get 1,200,000
It is amazing that no one but sj is talking about it!!!

sj, 26 June 2012 11:44)
I yield, there is no competing with deep rooted bigotry and decades of communist indoctrination. I will just leave you with your view of the world, I am pretty sure you will not change any opinions but you may make the other Serbian ultranationalists feel warm and fuzzy.

I know I frighten you people
(sj, 25 June 2012 00:30)

Why would people be frightened ?!... Your posts are a great opportunity for making big profits by short-selling stocks. People must be ignorant to not understand that you and your Malaysian friend get insider information ahead of the rest of the market offering opportunities for big profits. Keep up your good work mate :)

sj, 26 June 2012 13:12),
Wasn't going to respond but I must.
I never disputed the energy claim, US has always had cheaper energy forms and still does. Right now Gasoline runs about 3.50 a gallon which would translate somewhere around 90cents a liter.
My dispute where you were claiming US made it economically due to cheap labor, not true, when US labor was cheap by global standards there was not a huge global commerce. It was on technology to include energy that made mass production cheaper but that argument really does not matter.
No in the US we do not teach in Albanian but then there is not a high percentage of Albanians, or Serbians or Romanians, or Greeks etc, etc, there. But you will find our biggest non English constituent Spanish speaking with the ability to learn in Spanish plus most signage in the US has Spanish on it and translators in most every segment of society.
This in contrast to Kosovo part of pre1999 Serbia which was almost exclusively Albanian. I once visited a man who was beaten by Milosevics kind hearted Serbian police, what was his crime? He taught Albanian children in his home after the schools were closed. His home and farm were later burned to the ground as he and his family fled from Serbian police, so don't tell me what a great humanitarian Milosevic was, your own people are the ones who overthrew him.

(pss, 25 June 2012 14:04)

Actually Milosevic was to try to keep the locals in employment and most of those were Albanian. The problem with the Albanians is they thought they were going to see the streets of Pristina paved in gold once the west arrived, but it did not happen. It would be nice for moment to admit that during the early ears there was some industry brought by Belgrade to Kosovo and as far as the biscuit factory is concerned why the Albanians would mention this fact as they have shot themselves in the foot and now have nothing.
On the issue of “as stripping it and leaving a shell that was true of ever factory in Kosovo”, when the Us left Clarke Air force base and Subic Bay Naval installation in the Philippines in the 1990s, the US stripped every building and even pulled out the electrical wiring and burnt everything they would not take, even new computers. So what did you except Belgrade to do? But even if everything was left in tacit those factories would still be idle as they were only a small component.
Cheap labor is how the US started and its how China, India and Brazil have risen in wealth. What is most important to have people working and the rest follows.
Another nail in the EU coffin – Cyprus has asked for loans now to stave off collpase.

Jovan, 25 June 2012 21:40)
You know Jovan, it matters not to me whether you think I am Albanian or not, I don't take it as an insult. One of the differences in you and me I don't see that heritage or ethniticity is a more than an interesting conversation topic.
So if it makes you believe that I am Albanian go for it. The thing you do not like is my message, and that is Serbs want Kosovo without the Albanians on it and have done nothing, nada, zip to show the world otherwise.
One thing about America is that it is a relatively new country built by immigrants from all over so there are very few "pure" blood lines so if you hate an ethnic group you may find out someday you really hate yourself. I may have Albanian in my blood, I may have Serbian in my blood, I really do not know but none of that would change my stance.

Cheap labor is how the US started and its how China, India and Brazil have risen in wealth. What is most important to have people working and the rest follows.
Another nail in the EU coffin – Cyprus has asked for loans now to stave off collpase.
(sj, 26 June 2012 01:43)
When someone coined the phrase "Ignorance is Bliss" it wasn't really taken as a true statement. The US did not achieve their success in cheap labor as you suggest. They achieved it in advances in technology that allowed things to be made cheaper, ie the assembly line concept, etc. The US labor market has not been considered cheap for at least 75 years if ever. Japan made its comeback after rebuilding from the war on cheap labor in manufacturing. Of course with that success comes higher wages and prices. It is their concept that you first saw South Korea, now China, India, Brazil following suit. The question is will they also fall into the same problems as Japan and the workforce no longer be kept satisfied with low wages. Only time will tell.
As far as Milosevic, you are dead wrong history proves it and I have heard no one but you claim to the contrary. Milosevic's goal was never to keep the Albanians working, he is the one who closed the schools, the factories, and instituted most of the programs to try and drive the Albanians out of Kosovo.

(pss, 26 June 2012 10:19)
Every country rode on the back of cheap labor to success it’s just that the US schools don’t teach their history very well.
Milosevic was the cleverest politician in the world who was more than capable of not only running a country but huge corporations. There was no westerner that even came close to his capabilities. Milosevic saw Albanians as a threat. Even Tito at times of crises such as the one between Yugoslavia and Italy in the late 1950s the first place he sent reinforcement was to Kosovo then the Italian/Yugoslav border – there were other incidents like this one. It sad to say that Albanians have a history in that department.
As far as industry being closed by Milosevic it was mainly due to sanctions at the time. As far as schools being closed, why should Serbs pay for schools that taught the Albanian language in Serbia? Did Albania pay for Serbian or Greek schools? No. In the past Albanians finished even at university level in Albanian but they could not get employment and not in just Serbia but the rest of Europe.
However, the question is what has the west done so far for the Albanians? Where is the industry? No matter how you like to say it in the end Kosovo is economically unsustainable. It has nothing to entice industry. Look, one of the elements of why the US rose to power was industry that rode on the back of lots of cheap electricity for production. Kosovo runs on generators.

(pss, 26 June 2012 12:12)

I was not born nor raised in a communist country. I have lived all my life in what you call a western country – Australia with the exception of when working overseas like now. My mother is an Australian whose family goes back to the first settlers of 1788; she married a Serb who studied engineering in Australia in the early 1950s.
On the issue of schools, does the US government pay for Albanian schools there? Or is the official language English and what you want to learn on your own time and expense is your business? What? that Albanian universities produce graduates that can find jobs elsewhere? Not even doctors are recognized outside Albania.

On Milosevic, I have met people who have dealt with him on the business side before the wars and all say the same thing, he was highly intelligent and extremely capable who could have got any post he wished for. Bill Clinton is not much more than a charming but entertaining buffoon who arrived in Australia about 12 years ago and told an assembly of returned Vietnam veterans how the US won the war. He was told to go you know where. Bill is just an amusing clow.
On cheap energy, it’s a historical fact that the US rose to great heights because of that fact. This is simple business. My statements to you on Kosovo are purely based on business principles and not because there are Albanians living there. I do understand that when cut Albanians bleed just like Serbs and it’s also a red colour.

my dear pss, actually it doesn´t matter where you come from since you are wrong. it is your stance that is not only "not liked" by me as you try to put it - no, it is simply and completely wrong. a stupid and rather simple propaganda-phrase of the greater-albanian liars.

the Albanians in southern Serbia have had their own schools, their own radio-stations and -programs, they had it all, but they wanted something else...they wanted something that is not theirs - our land. and interestingly, it is the Albanians who are forcing out other ethnicities.. they want southern Serbia without the Serbs

and with poeple like you, be it albanian or not, easily reiterating these false claims, they managed to drag foreign power into southern Serbia, to do the dirty work for them.

finally, whatever you may think doesn´t matter because they will be defeated sooner or later and that is something you can be sure of.


by the way, it is not important for me or "the Serbs" what ethnicity one has - the Serbs have always lived in harmony with others who were peaceful and righteous. so, trying to present me as someone who is thinking about ethnicity or race... while it is the Albanians who are constantly coming up with these categories shows me that you either have not understood what the problem is about, OR you deliberately do not want to see what is so obvious.

but don´t worry. Serbia will prevail. it is our spirit that makes us strong. we never give up. and our revenge will be rigorous.

To catch a Leprechaun, 27 June 2012 12:34)
I think we have established 2 facts.
1. To you Milosevic was a great humanitarian that treated the Albanians like his own children.
2. To the rest of the world he was a ruthless dictator determined to erase the Albanian people from Kosovo, by whatever force and means necessary.

(pss, 26 June 2012 10:19)

Au contraire my dear friend, it is thee who has been misled, you will find that Milosevic re-opened for example the University of Pristina even sending in police to beat up and evict the Serbian protesters in 1998. You will also find he had a very good working relationship with Ibrahim Rugova an Albanian who was largely seen by Albanian ultra-nationalists and violent radicals such as Thaci (a former student) to be getting in the way of a Greater Albania project.

The reason why such an institution was closed is very reasonable, I cannot imagine or place myself in such a gullible position to think a host country should be paying for ultra-nationalist and Maoist teachings of Enver Hoxha by foreign professors. These guys went two steps further than MEChA.

About development and funding below,

http://books.google.com.au/books?id=Po03enYpbqsC&pg=PA179&lpg=PA179&dq=total+investment+in+kosovo&source=bl&ots=pC2Jw175l2&sig=L_3dcY9dAfHGW1ZgPurhEex-WbA&hl=en&ei=NUTXTsbyFImfiAe8kLj8DQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEMQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=total%20investment%20in%20kosovo&f=false

Somehow it is never enough, nor recognised. Albanians you would have found also being employed heavily in State mining, forestry and in many other segments during your “travels” until offcourse many were accused and some killed after being labelled collaborators by their own.

All they wanted was work not nationalism, provocations and reprisals.

To catch a Leprechaun, 27 June 2012 12:34)
I think we have established 2 facts.
1. To you Milosevic was a great humanitarian that treated the Albanians like his own children.
2. To the rest of the world he was a ruthless dictator determined to erase the Albanian people from Kosovo, by whatever force and means necessary.
(pss, 27 June 2012 14:36)


(pss, 27 June 2012 14:36)

Again you are to presumptuous, I am no supporter of Milosevic but am objective enough to correct a few of your mistakes. Again you seem to state a mistaken generalisation “the rest of the world” you do understand he had supporters from other parts of the world too.

Don’t be to quick to establish “facts” without necessarily gathering all the facts, ooh jeez but offcourse, there always was a different agenda, silly me…

Milosevic was the cleverest politician in the world who was more than capable of not only running a country but huge corporations. There was no westerner that even came close to his capabilities.
(sj, 26 June 2012 11:44)

I fully agree... what a great loss for the mankind. You should have convinced you merchant bank in malaysia to hire him as manager so that the bank could have had followed the same glorious path as Serbia in the 1990s LOL

very nice.

"pss" cannot contribute anything else than his quite wrong and of course rather subjective view of allegedly "established facts"! or in other words: he cannot answer confirmable arguments. what also let´s him appear like he´s just another Albanian, hiding cowardly behind a "western" smoke-screen...

leprachaun has, I must admit it, quite nicely unveiled how wrong those k-albanian propaganda-claims are, but all "pss" is coming up with are stories of old men he "met" and told him stories... and his claims about alleged "facts".

I must say I am quite impressed by his "objectivity", but given that all he says or to be precise, all he writes, sounds like cheap albanian propaganda, it´s hardly surprising.

my dear "pss", instead of writing nonsense here, you should rather educate yourself a little bit more thoroughly on the sociopolitical circumstances in southern Serbia before the NATO-aggression.

that would be better than bleating albanian propaganda-phrases like " the Serbs want the land without the Albanians", which only shows the low level of your argumentation.

and, last but not least, have you ever just thought for a second about the possibility of the Albanians lying? ...of course, only in case you are not an Albanian yourself.

anyway, you just proved, you have no arguments. and as previously said, that´s no surprise.

Serbia will prevail. just a question of time.

anyway, you just proved, you have no arguments. and as previously said, that´s no surprise.

Serbia will prevail. just a question of time.
(Jovan, 28 June 2012 09:45)
The gentleman I spoke of seemed genuine, well educated and I found no reason for him to lie and most of his story was verifyable. My comments about Serbs wanting the land without the Albanians does not come from Albanians but from people here on this forum and the actions of your politicians. Name one thing that the govt of Serb has done to encourage the Albanian people they have a place in Serbia should Kosovo return.
If this were a goal that would have been built into your constitution form the beginning.