Nobody in Romania cares if Serbia joins NATO or not. EU - you could benefit and also we could. But that`s your own problem. Not you are our enemy, our enemy is Russia.
Unfortunately, my compatriote Mircea is living in fantasy land, being as brainwashed as the people who say communism is a good thing. The biggest mistake you could make is to believe blindly in what eu is promissing. Eu has no interest for Romania to develop or become a rich country. What Mircea is not telling you, or he doesnt know, is that with the accesion to the EU, almost all Romanian Small Enterprises are DEAD, all romanian cheaper products were replaced with western more expensive products. Almost all romanians are in debt to western banks.They wanted us in EU just to a have a new market for the products. This is why they want Serbia in. What Mr Mircea is "forgettng" is that Romania is guverned from Bruxelles, they dictate and we do. It has the same rulles as the USSR. Dear Mircea, if you don't wake up, you're grandchildren will stay pay for the debt that Romania made to IMF in your life time. By the way, Romania is 43 bld debts to IMF, a record debt. Every time ROmania has a problem, our "administration" goes to IMF. You tell me Mircea, who runs the IMF? If Serbia wants to go with the russians, it's your problem, i consider them Romania's enemy. But the solution for Romania is not EU or Russia, it's Romania.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Adrian,
The BRIC nations had a meeting on June 16 2009.
The ramifications of this meeting were felt almost immediately with international investors dropping their reserves of US dollars and diversifying it into gold bullion, IMF bonds and the more stable Euro etc.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=adlcCx_aGFBU
The BRIC has huge reserves of the USD so it is in their immediate interest to stabilize the Dollar until they can shed their reserves China Russia India have been on a spending spree buying every thing from Australian metal resources to US law firms at ridiculously high prices to shed it's US cash reserves. Geopolitically all the powers are scrambling to secure their energy needs, Kosovo for the US is all about the AMBO pipeline and corridor 8 not about Trepca mines, sovereignty, human rights and all those democratic jargons thrown at us and the EU is now in the way. In November 1998 Bill Richardson the then US energy secretary spelt out his policy on the extraction and transport of Caspian oil. "This is about America's energy security" and "It's also about preventing strategic inroads by those who don't share our values", March 1999 Serbia was bombed under the auspices of a humanitarian mission. The US based AMBO pipeline consortium is directly linked to the seat of political and military power in the United States and Vice President Dick Cheney's firm Halliburton Energy. The East-West rivalry is only one segment of politics in competing energy interests it goes deeper to even EU-US rivalry. Michel Chossudovsky Professor of Economics, University of Ottawa has a fine essay on the EU-US divide written back in 2001 and playing out even today,
http://www.ippnw.de/commonFiles/pdfs/Frieden/chossudovsky.pdf
German intelligence services were also expelled from Kosovo.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122877290688889167.html
Afghanistan still dogs the US plan, on April 30th 1999 Afghanistan Pakistan and Turkmenistan reignited the central Asian pipeline project excluding US interests, July the 4th 1999 Clinton then ordered a freeze of Taliban assets and the love affair was over Bush tried once again to co-operate with the Taliban in Feb 2001 but that yielded no concrete results, Dec 22 after the WTC attack the Us backed interim Afghan Govt of Hamid Kharzi took office previously he functioned as Unocol Corp consultant Bush also appointed Zalmay Khalizad as special envoy to Afghanistan he too had a consultancy position in Unocol. There are no freinds in buisness just associates which can change at a whim. Hope I have clarified some things, personally it is best not to have all your eggs in one basket.
Zoran,
Your correct about the debt,
http://usdebtclock.org/
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
(Ataman, 21 January 2010 22:42)
--
Yes Ataman, but it doesn't mean the West is economically fit. Banks also want their customers to be financially well but it doesn't quite work out that way. No one seems interested in buying US debt anymore. Why should they? Every worker has an average debt of US$110,000. Every child born inherits US$40,000 of debt. It is not sustainable.
Something is going to give sooner or later and the West knowns it. Why do you think the expansion of NATO is so crucial here? When the debt collector comes to visit, it's always handy to have a vicious dog in your front garden right?
You obviously have your reasons for being anti Russian and I have no problems with that, but I am seriously interested to know how much has Romania benefitted from joining the EU. I posted earlier that I was in Romania several times in recent years and I could not see any great change. In fact, while travelling in Europe I saw greater rural poverty in a vast majority of Eastern European countries that belong to the EU than in Serbia.
Hungary was technically bankrupt last year and was asking the Russians for money after the EU initially refused a loan. Greece has been a long time member of the EU but it’s suffering economic problems of huge proportions and this is not just due to a “corrupt” government. Now just how is Serbia going to prosper by joining the EU? Is she going to “jump” the queue ahead of Poland, Hungary etc and be made prosperous?
My sources tell me that in order to improve living standards a “Marshall Plan” should have been implemented in 1989 straight after the fall of communism, but the west required cheap labor so no plan was prepared and in fact the strategy was to give loans until countries were under control of the EU. However, it does not stop there; with full EU integration these same western countries will be able to use cheap labor from Eastern Europe to lower wages in their countries. Unfortunately, by the time most see this happening it will be too late.
As far as NATO and Serbia are concerned, I totally agree with Zoran’s postings.
"The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe."
Mircea
What a load of bull! The EU are short term thinkers. They think they have solved an issue without thinking of the consequenses it will bring in the future. Kosovo is a great example! Where is the stability? Where is peace? Where is justice? The Americans with its sidekick the EU are the biggest maffia in the world. They hide behind their "democracy" to do horrible things to other countries of the world. Bombing Serbia, Irak, Afganistan, not to mention the past, Vietnam, South America etc.
Im not sure if Russia wants the west to do 'too' well. Not as well as themselves anyway.
And yes it is symbolic how the sun sets on the west and rises in the east, kind of like whats happening with the worlds powerhouses.
A realignment or shift is occuring, a natural force is at the core, globalisation and the world economic crisis just causing this shift to move even faster. It will continue to change and this will benefit Serbia.
On a lighter note,why is everybody picking on Mircea :P
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
Mircea, the Eastern alliance doesn't just consist of Russia but 80% of the world's population, 90% of the world's resources and most of the emerging economies. I found an interesting article on the BBC today. Check http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8471613.stm
I have already asked you three times Mircea, how much debt does Romania have? Twenty years ago it had zero.
The wealth of capitalism was built on debt and although you may be saying "long live capitalism", debt will kill it. The best time to join an alliance is when it is emerging, not when it has peaked.
I suspect your Euro-Atlantic alliance will attempt to draw an iron curtain around itself and that is the reason NATO has expanded so quickly within our region. Serbia however, is the thorn in its side.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
--
Adrian, of course there is an East/West divide. The West is attempting to expand NATO Eastwards and the East is finally stopping it. The Ukraine and Georgia are unlikely to join now while there is a push to get Serbia in by using Romania, Greece and Spain. However, the resistance is too strong. Serbians are strongly opposed to NATO membership.
I think you're giving too much importance to the statement. The subject of this article was a line in many lines Basescu put forward during that meeting. Don't take kindness and francness for stupidity.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
(Zoran, 21 January 2010 15:04)
Well said.Our romanian poster with his dogmatic narrow-minded caucescuist statments is typical by-product of communism .Those who once laudly repeated the broken record "long live Lenin socialist revolution will preveil Caucescu is our great leader " are the greatest supporters today of this monster €USSR.As to romanian prosperity well as I see droid manufacturing industy has not developed enough.The software update has been due for long time.
It is absurd to compare the EU with the USSR. The EU is not heading in the direction of the USSR.
The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe. The EU has a bright future.
The USSR destroyed Romania's economy during the 50 years of communism.
Those people who 40 years ago were saying "Long live the Soviet Union" were brainwashed by the Russians who brought the curse of communism to Romania.
The EU is helping Romania to rebuild its economy after those 50 years of communism.
If you Serbs want to join the Russia-Belarus union you are free to do so, but this union will not help Serbia to achieve economic prosperity.
By joining the Russia-Belarus union Serbia will be isolated.
Serbia is surrounded by EU and NATO Member States or candidate states.
Serbia would make a big mistake by going against the current. Your president Tadic understands this. Hopefully, you will also understand this one day Zoran.
Mircea, it's a shame B92 find it appropriate to censor my posts.
You do frequently say "Long live the European Union". Let me just say that 40 years ago, people from your country were saying "Long live the Soviet Union".
How quickly things can change when economic promises do not live up to expectations. The Eastern economies continues to grow rapidly, the Western economies continue to shrink. Sooner or later Romania again will realise where it's best interests lie. You wouldn't want to stay on board a sinking ship for too long.
Fortunately for countries like Serbia and Romania, we are right next to the life rafts. The Lisbon treaty describes membership as voluntary so leaving the EU is far simpler than leaving the USSR.
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
(Mircea, 21 January 2010 14:38)
thank goodness for Dacian Ciolos, now Romania will be safe from any sort of crisis and become the richest country in eastern Europe!
Mircea you always blame Russia for making Romania poor and say how they should never turn to Russia again. Well the EU made Serbia poor and bombed it and is trying to steal part of its land just to rid themselves of albanians. So why should Serbia want to be part of EU?
Sorry Mircea, it is all changing. I could understand joining the Western sphere two or three decades ago but it is now exhausted and it's time for the Eastern sphere to prosper. They have dedicated workers, practically all energy reserves, 80% of the population and the West cannot compete. Our countries lies on the fault lines of the East and West so will be pulled both ways.
So tell me, if the Euro-Atlantic alliance ends up like the USSR, will you still support it Mircea? That is the direction it is heading. Things will not change overnight but they will change. It's all coming together now.
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
Mircea,
how prosperous would Romania be if NATO bombed it and then cut off all the economic routes.
Serbia was once a viable and prosperous nation, much more than Romania and without the help of the EU. On the contrary Mircea, the EU is why Serbia is currently broke.
You sound like a broken record Mircea and never support your statements with actual facts.
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
Hehehe, with friends like Romania, who needs enemys ;)
As Serbia enjoyed a good run against the weak states of the former Yugo, the huge Romania will play a little bit too.
BUCHAREST -- Serbia's accession “to EU and NATO” represents a national interest for Romania, Romanian President Traian Basescu said.
--
I can understand why this is in Romania's national interest or should I say, NATO's and US's interest?
Firstly, Serbia is not going to join NATO so forget about that and secondly, the East is getting stronger by the day. The Ukraine is likely to fall back within Russia's influence next week and the only country separating Serbia from this sphere is Romanian.
Now tell me, why would Romania stick with the West if it gets into severe economic problems while the East prospers? The Lisbon treaty describes EU membership as voluntary so if this project ever turns sour (like the USSR) then I would expect many to jump ship - as it is easy to exit the EU with the Lisbon treaty in place.
This is the way it's turning out my friends, you cannot dig yourself out of a hole, especially by printing more money or obtaining further debt. The clock is ticking so lets see what happens.
If I was to predict anything, I would say the coloured revolutions are at their end. Ukraine is just about back, Georgia will fall, so will Serbia and Montenegro so with Romania on board the Eastern sphere will stretch to the Adriatic through Romania, Serbia and Montenegro.
That is why there is so much effort to get Serbia into the Euro-Atlantic structures so quickly and also the reason Romania and Bulgaria were rushed into it. The problem is the West messed up big time with Serbia and that means the loss of the Balkans. The free world will be the East, not the West. Wait and see.
BUCHAREST -- Serbia's accession “to EU and NATO” represents a national interest for Romania, Romanian President Traian Basescu said.
--
I can understand why this is in Romania's national interest or should I say, NATO's and US's interest?
Firstly, Serbia is not going to join NATO so forget about that and secondly, the East is getting stronger by the day. The Ukraine is likely to fall back within Russia's influence next week and the only country separating Serbia from this sphere is Romanian.
Now tell me, why would Romania stick with the West if it gets into severe economic problems while the East prospers? The Lisbon treaty describes EU membership as voluntary so if this project ever turns sour (like the USSR) then I would expect many to jump ship - as it is easy to exit the EU with the Lisbon treaty in place.
This is the way it's turning out my friends, you cannot dig yourself out of a hole, especially by printing more money or obtaining further debt. The clock is ticking so lets see what happens.
If I was to predict anything, I would say the coloured revolutions are at their end. Ukraine is just about back, Georgia will fall, so will Serbia and Montenegro so with Romania on board the Eastern sphere will stretch to the Adriatic through Romania, Serbia and Montenegro.
That is why there is so much effort to get Serbia into the Euro-Atlantic structures so quickly and also the reason Romania and Bulgaria were rushed into it. The problem is the West messed up big time with Serbia and that means the loss of the Balkans. The free world will be the East, not the West. Wait and see.
Sorry Mircea, it is all changing. I could understand joining the Western sphere two or three decades ago but it is now exhausted and it's time for the Eastern sphere to prosper. They have dedicated workers, practically all energy reserves, 80% of the population and the West cannot compete. Our countries lies on the fault lines of the East and West so will be pulled both ways.
So tell me, if the Euro-Atlantic alliance ends up like the USSR, will you still support it Mircea? That is the direction it is heading. Things will not change overnight but they will change. It's all coming together now.
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
Mircea,
how prosperous would Romania be if NATO bombed it and then cut off all the economic routes.
Serbia was once a viable and prosperous nation, much more than Romania and without the help of the EU. On the contrary Mircea, the EU is why Serbia is currently broke.
You sound like a broken record Mircea and never support your statements with actual facts.
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
(Mircea, 21 January 2010 14:38)
thank goodness for Dacian Ciolos, now Romania will be safe from any sort of crisis and become the richest country in eastern Europe!
Mircea you always blame Russia for making Romania poor and say how they should never turn to Russia again. Well the EU made Serbia poor and bombed it and is trying to steal part of its land just to rid themselves of albanians. So why should Serbia want to be part of EU?
Mircea, it's a shame B92 find it appropriate to censor my posts.
You do frequently say "Long live the European Union". Let me just say that 40 years ago, people from your country were saying "Long live the Soviet Union".
How quickly things can change when economic promises do not live up to expectations. The Eastern economies continues to grow rapidly, the Western economies continue to shrink. Sooner or later Romania again will realise where it's best interests lie. You wouldn't want to stay on board a sinking ship for too long.
Fortunately for countries like Serbia and Romania, we are right next to the life rafts. The Lisbon treaty describes membership as voluntary so leaving the EU is far simpler than leaving the USSR.
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
(Zoran, 21 January 2010 15:04)
Well said.Our romanian poster with his dogmatic narrow-minded caucescuist statments is typical by-product of communism .Those who once laudly repeated the broken record "long live Lenin socialist revolution will preveil Caucescu is our great leader " are the greatest supporters today of this monster €USSR.As to romanian prosperity well as I see droid manufacturing industy has not developed enough.The software update has been due for long time.
Mircea, the Eastern alliance doesn't just consist of Russia but 80% of the world's population, 90% of the world's resources and most of the emerging economies. I found an interesting article on the BBC today. Check http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8471613.stm
I have already asked you three times Mircea, how much debt does Romania have? Twenty years ago it had zero.
The wealth of capitalism was built on debt and although you may be saying "long live capitalism", debt will kill it. The best time to join an alliance is when it is emerging, not when it has peaked.
I suspect your Euro-Atlantic alliance will attempt to draw an iron curtain around itself and that is the reason NATO has expanded so quickly within our region. Serbia however, is the thorn in its side.
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
(Ataman, 21 January 2010 22:42)
--
Yes Ataman, but it doesn't mean the West is economically fit. Banks also want their customers to be financially well but it doesn't quite work out that way. No one seems interested in buying US debt anymore. Why should they? Every worker has an average debt of US$110,000. Every child born inherits US$40,000 of debt. It is not sustainable.
Something is going to give sooner or later and the West knowns it. Why do you think the expansion of NATO is so crucial here? When the debt collector comes to visit, it's always handy to have a vicious dog in your front garden right?
Hehehe, with friends like Romania, who needs enemys ;)
As Serbia enjoyed a good run against the weak states of the former Yugo, the huge Romania will play a little bit too.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
--
Adrian, of course there is an East/West divide. The West is attempting to expand NATO Eastwards and the East is finally stopping it. The Ukraine and Georgia are unlikely to join now while there is a push to get Serbia in by using Romania, Greece and Spain. However, the resistance is too strong. Serbians are strongly opposed to NATO membership.
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
"The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe."
Mircea
What a load of bull! The EU are short term thinkers. They think they have solved an issue without thinking of the consequenses it will bring in the future. Kosovo is a great example! Where is the stability? Where is peace? Where is justice? The Americans with its sidekick the EU are the biggest maffia in the world. They hide behind their "democracy" to do horrible things to other countries of the world. Bombing Serbia, Irak, Afganistan, not to mention the past, Vietnam, South America etc.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Adrian,
The BRIC nations had a meeting on June 16 2009.
The ramifications of this meeting were felt almost immediately with international investors dropping their reserves of US dollars and diversifying it into gold bullion, IMF bonds and the more stable Euro etc.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=adlcCx_aGFBU
The BRIC has huge reserves of the USD so it is in their immediate interest to stabilize the Dollar until they can shed their reserves China Russia India have been on a spending spree buying every thing from Australian metal resources to US law firms at ridiculously high prices to shed it's US cash reserves. Geopolitically all the powers are scrambling to secure their energy needs, Kosovo for the US is all about the AMBO pipeline and corridor 8 not about Trepca mines, sovereignty, human rights and all those democratic jargons thrown at us and the EU is now in the way. In November 1998 Bill Richardson the then US energy secretary spelt out his policy on the extraction and transport of Caspian oil. "This is about America's energy security" and "It's also about preventing strategic inroads by those who don't share our values", March 1999 Serbia was bombed under the auspices of a humanitarian mission. The US based AMBO pipeline consortium is directly linked to the seat of political and military power in the United States and Vice President Dick Cheney's firm Halliburton Energy. The East-West rivalry is only one segment of politics in competing energy interests it goes deeper to even EU-US rivalry. Michel Chossudovsky Professor of Economics, University of Ottawa has a fine essay on the EU-US divide written back in 2001 and playing out even today,
http://www.ippnw.de/commonFiles/pdfs/Frieden/chossudovsky.pdf
German intelligence services were also expelled from Kosovo.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122877290688889167.html
Afghanistan still dogs the US plan, on April 30th 1999 Afghanistan Pakistan and Turkmenistan reignited the central Asian pipeline project excluding US interests, July the 4th 1999 Clinton then ordered a freeze of Taliban assets and the love affair was over Bush tried once again to co-operate with the Taliban in Feb 2001 but that yielded no concrete results, Dec 22 after the WTC attack the Us backed interim Afghan Govt of Hamid Kharzi took office previously he functioned as Unocol Corp consultant Bush also appointed Zalmay Khalizad as special envoy to Afghanistan he too had a consultancy position in Unocol. There are no freinds in buisness just associates which can change at a whim. Hope I have clarified some things, personally it is best not to have all your eggs in one basket.
Zoran,
Your correct about the debt,
http://usdebtclock.org/
Im not sure if Russia wants the west to do 'too' well. Not as well as themselves anyway.
And yes it is symbolic how the sun sets on the west and rises in the east, kind of like whats happening with the worlds powerhouses.
A realignment or shift is occuring, a natural force is at the core, globalisation and the world economic crisis just causing this shift to move even faster. It will continue to change and this will benefit Serbia.
On a lighter note,why is everybody picking on Mircea :P
Unfortunately, my compatriote Mircea is living in fantasy land, being as brainwashed as the people who say communism is a good thing. The biggest mistake you could make is to believe blindly in what eu is promissing. Eu has no interest for Romania to develop or become a rich country. What Mircea is not telling you, or he doesnt know, is that with the accesion to the EU, almost all Romanian Small Enterprises are DEAD, all romanian cheaper products were replaced with western more expensive products. Almost all romanians are in debt to western banks.They wanted us in EU just to a have a new market for the products. This is why they want Serbia in. What Mr Mircea is "forgettng" is that Romania is guverned from Bruxelles, they dictate and we do. It has the same rulles as the USSR. Dear Mircea, if you don't wake up, you're grandchildren will stay pay for the debt that Romania made to IMF in your life time. By the way, Romania is 43 bld debts to IMF, a record debt. Every time ROmania has a problem, our "administration" goes to IMF. You tell me Mircea, who runs the IMF? If Serbia wants to go with the russians, it's your problem, i consider them Romania's enemy. But the solution for Romania is not EU or Russia, it's Romania.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
You obviously have your reasons for being anti Russian and I have no problems with that, but I am seriously interested to know how much has Romania benefitted from joining the EU. I posted earlier that I was in Romania several times in recent years and I could not see any great change. In fact, while travelling in Europe I saw greater rural poverty in a vast majority of Eastern European countries that belong to the EU than in Serbia.
Hungary was technically bankrupt last year and was asking the Russians for money after the EU initially refused a loan. Greece has been a long time member of the EU but it’s suffering economic problems of huge proportions and this is not just due to a “corrupt” government. Now just how is Serbia going to prosper by joining the EU? Is she going to “jump” the queue ahead of Poland, Hungary etc and be made prosperous?
My sources tell me that in order to improve living standards a “Marshall Plan” should have been implemented in 1989 straight after the fall of communism, but the west required cheap labor so no plan was prepared and in fact the strategy was to give loans until countries were under control of the EU. However, it does not stop there; with full EU integration these same western countries will be able to use cheap labor from Eastern Europe to lower wages in their countries. Unfortunately, by the time most see this happening it will be too late.
As far as NATO and Serbia are concerned, I totally agree with Zoran’s postings.
It is absurd to compare the EU with the USSR. The EU is not heading in the direction of the USSR.
The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe. The EU has a bright future.
The USSR destroyed Romania's economy during the 50 years of communism.
Those people who 40 years ago were saying "Long live the Soviet Union" were brainwashed by the Russians who brought the curse of communism to Romania.
The EU is helping Romania to rebuild its economy after those 50 years of communism.
If you Serbs want to join the Russia-Belarus union you are free to do so, but this union will not help Serbia to achieve economic prosperity.
By joining the Russia-Belarus union Serbia will be isolated.
Serbia is surrounded by EU and NATO Member States or candidate states.
Serbia would make a big mistake by going against the current. Your president Tadic understands this. Hopefully, you will also understand this one day Zoran.
Nobody in Romania cares if Serbia joins NATO or not. EU - you could benefit and also we could. But that`s your own problem. Not you are our enemy, our enemy is Russia.
I think you're giving too much importance to the statement. The subject of this article was a line in many lines Basescu put forward during that meeting. Don't take kindness and francness for stupidity.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
Hehehe, with friends like Romania, who needs enemys ;)
As Serbia enjoyed a good run against the weak states of the former Yugo, the huge Romania will play a little bit too.
BUCHAREST -- Serbia's accession “to EU and NATO” represents a national interest for Romania, Romanian President Traian Basescu said.
--
I can understand why this is in Romania's national interest or should I say, NATO's and US's interest?
Firstly, Serbia is not going to join NATO so forget about that and secondly, the East is getting stronger by the day. The Ukraine is likely to fall back within Russia's influence next week and the only country separating Serbia from this sphere is Romanian.
Now tell me, why would Romania stick with the West if it gets into severe economic problems while the East prospers? The Lisbon treaty describes EU membership as voluntary so if this project ever turns sour (like the USSR) then I would expect many to jump ship - as it is easy to exit the EU with the Lisbon treaty in place.
This is the way it's turning out my friends, you cannot dig yourself out of a hole, especially by printing more money or obtaining further debt. The clock is ticking so lets see what happens.
If I was to predict anything, I would say the coloured revolutions are at their end. Ukraine is just about back, Georgia will fall, so will Serbia and Montenegro so with Romania on board the Eastern sphere will stretch to the Adriatic through Romania, Serbia and Montenegro.
That is why there is so much effort to get Serbia into the Euro-Atlantic structures so quickly and also the reason Romania and Bulgaria were rushed into it. The problem is the West messed up big time with Serbia and that means the loss of the Balkans. The free world will be the East, not the West. Wait and see.
It is absurd to compare the EU with the USSR. The EU is not heading in the direction of the USSR.
The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe. The EU has a bright future.
The USSR destroyed Romania's economy during the 50 years of communism.
Those people who 40 years ago were saying "Long live the Soviet Union" were brainwashed by the Russians who brought the curse of communism to Romania.
The EU is helping Romania to rebuild its economy after those 50 years of communism.
If you Serbs want to join the Russia-Belarus union you are free to do so, but this union will not help Serbia to achieve economic prosperity.
By joining the Russia-Belarus union Serbia will be isolated.
Serbia is surrounded by EU and NATO Member States or candidate states.
Serbia would make a big mistake by going against the current. Your president Tadic understands this. Hopefully, you will also understand this one day Zoran.
Mircea,
how prosperous would Romania be if NATO bombed it and then cut off all the economic routes.
Serbia was once a viable and prosperous nation, much more than Romania and without the help of the EU. On the contrary Mircea, the EU is why Serbia is currently broke.
You sound like a broken record Mircea and never support your statements with actual facts.
Dacian Ciolos from Romania will be the European Commissioner for Agriculture and Rural Development starting on 9 February.
I am proud that a Romanian will have such an important job within the European Commission.
Also, Romania has access to the Structural Funds of the EU which are helping to reduce the economic disparities between my country and other EU Member States.
(Mircea, 21 January 2010 14:38)
thank goodness for Dacian Ciolos, now Romania will be safe from any sort of crisis and become the richest country in eastern Europe!
Mircea you always blame Russia for making Romania poor and say how they should never turn to Russia again. Well the EU made Serbia poor and bombed it and is trying to steal part of its land just to rid themselves of albanians. So why should Serbia want to be part of EU?
Sorry Mircea, it is all changing. I could understand joining the Western sphere two or three decades ago but it is now exhausted and it's time for the Eastern sphere to prosper. They have dedicated workers, practically all energy reserves, 80% of the population and the West cannot compete. Our countries lies on the fault lines of the East and West so will be pulled both ways.
So tell me, if the Euro-Atlantic alliance ends up like the USSR, will you still support it Mircea? That is the direction it is heading. Things will not change overnight but they will change. It's all coming together now.
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
Mircea, it's a shame B92 find it appropriate to censor my posts.
You do frequently say "Long live the European Union". Let me just say that 40 years ago, people from your country were saying "Long live the Soviet Union".
How quickly things can change when economic promises do not live up to expectations. The Eastern economies continues to grow rapidly, the Western economies continue to shrink. Sooner or later Romania again will realise where it's best interests lie. You wouldn't want to stay on board a sinking ship for too long.
Fortunately for countries like Serbia and Romania, we are right next to the life rafts. The Lisbon treaty describes membership as voluntary so leaving the EU is far simpler than leaving the USSR.
Mircea, the Eastern alliance doesn't just consist of Russia but 80% of the world's population, 90% of the world's resources and most of the emerging economies. I found an interesting article on the BBC today. Check http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8471613.stm
I have already asked you three times Mircea, how much debt does Romania have? Twenty years ago it had zero.
The wealth of capitalism was built on debt and although you may be saying "long live capitalism", debt will kill it. The best time to join an alliance is when it is emerging, not when it has peaked.
I suspect your Euro-Atlantic alliance will attempt to draw an iron curtain around itself and that is the reason NATO has expanded so quickly within our region. Serbia however, is the thorn in its side.
"The EU is a successful organization which has brought economic and political stability to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe."
Mircea
What a load of bull! The EU are short term thinkers. They think they have solved an issue without thinking of the consequenses it will bring in the future. Kosovo is a great example! Where is the stability? Where is peace? Where is justice? The Americans with its sidekick the EU are the biggest maffia in the world. They hide behind their "democracy" to do horrible things to other countries of the world. Bombing Serbia, Irak, Afganistan, not to mention the past, Vietnam, South America etc.
You obviously have your reasons for being anti Russian and I have no problems with that, but I am seriously interested to know how much has Romania benefitted from joining the EU. I posted earlier that I was in Romania several times in recent years and I could not see any great change. In fact, while travelling in Europe I saw greater rural poverty in a vast majority of Eastern European countries that belong to the EU than in Serbia.
Hungary was technically bankrupt last year and was asking the Russians for money after the EU initially refused a loan. Greece has been a long time member of the EU but it’s suffering economic problems of huge proportions and this is not just due to a “corrupt” government. Now just how is Serbia going to prosper by joining the EU? Is she going to “jump” the queue ahead of Poland, Hungary etc and be made prosperous?
My sources tell me that in order to improve living standards a “Marshall Plan” should have been implemented in 1989 straight after the fall of communism, but the west required cheap labor so no plan was prepared and in fact the strategy was to give loans until countries were under control of the EU. However, it does not stop there; with full EU integration these same western countries will be able to use cheap labor from Eastern Europe to lower wages in their countries. Unfortunately, by the time most see this happening it will be too late.
As far as NATO and Serbia are concerned, I totally agree with Zoran’s postings.
Unfortunately, my compatriote Mircea is living in fantasy land, being as brainwashed as the people who say communism is a good thing. The biggest mistake you could make is to believe blindly in what eu is promissing. Eu has no interest for Romania to develop or become a rich country. What Mircea is not telling you, or he doesnt know, is that with the accesion to the EU, almost all Romanian Small Enterprises are DEAD, all romanian cheaper products were replaced with western more expensive products. Almost all romanians are in debt to western banks.They wanted us in EU just to a have a new market for the products. This is why they want Serbia in. What Mr Mircea is "forgettng" is that Romania is guverned from Bruxelles, they dictate and we do. It has the same rulles as the USSR. Dear Mircea, if you don't wake up, you're grandchildren will stay pay for the debt that Romania made to IMF in your life time. By the way, Romania is 43 bld debts to IMF, a record debt. Every time ROmania has a problem, our "administration" goes to IMF. You tell me Mircea, who runs the IMF? If Serbia wants to go with the russians, it's your problem, i consider them Romania's enemy. But the solution for Romania is not EU or Russia, it's Romania.
People like you were saying long live the USSR and we will never join the capitalists 40 years ago.
(Zoran, 21 January 2010 15:04)
Well said.Our romanian poster with his dogmatic narrow-minded caucescuist statments is typical by-product of communism .Those who once laudly repeated the broken record "long live Lenin socialist revolution will preveil Caucescu is our great leader " are the greatest supporters today of this monster €USSR.As to romanian prosperity well as I see droid manufacturing industy has not developed enough.The software update has been due for long time.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
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Adrian, of course there is an East/West divide. The West is attempting to expand NATO Eastwards and the East is finally stopping it. The Ukraine and Georgia are unlikely to join now while there is a push to get Serbia in by using Romania, Greece and Spain. However, the resistance is too strong. Serbians are strongly opposed to NATO membership.
Im not sure if Russia wants the west to do 'too' well. Not as well as themselves anyway.
And yes it is symbolic how the sun sets on the west and rises in the east, kind of like whats happening with the worlds powerhouses.
A realignment or shift is occuring, a natural force is at the core, globalisation and the world economic crisis just causing this shift to move even faster. It will continue to change and this will benefit Serbia.
On a lighter note,why is everybody picking on Mircea :P
I think you're giving too much importance to the statement. The subject of this article was a line in many lines Basescu put forward during that meeting. Don't take kindness and francness for stupidity.
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
Yep. Besides, "West" doing economically well is in best interest of Russia and China.
(Ataman, 21 January 2010 22:42)
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Yes Ataman, but it doesn't mean the West is economically fit. Banks also want their customers to be financially well but it doesn't quite work out that way. No one seems interested in buying US debt anymore. Why should they? Every worker has an average debt of US$110,000. Every child born inherits US$40,000 of debt. It is not sustainable.
Something is going to give sooner or later and the West knowns it. Why do you think the expansion of NATO is so crucial here? When the debt collector comes to visit, it's always handy to have a vicious dog in your front garden right?
As for the East vs West arguments here, I can only say that not even Russia or the "West" are actually seeing things so divided. So why are some, mostly irrelevant for Russia and the West, East Europeans doing so?
(adrian/bucharest, 21 January 2010 20:54)
Adrian,
The BRIC nations had a meeting on June 16 2009.
The ramifications of this meeting were felt almost immediately with international investors dropping their reserves of US dollars and diversifying it into gold bullion, IMF bonds and the more stable Euro etc.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=adlcCx_aGFBU
The BRIC has huge reserves of the USD so it is in their immediate interest to stabilize the Dollar until they can shed their reserves China Russia India have been on a spending spree buying every thing from Australian metal resources to US law firms at ridiculously high prices to shed it's US cash reserves. Geopolitically all the powers are scrambling to secure their energy needs, Kosovo for the US is all about the AMBO pipeline and corridor 8 not about Trepca mines, sovereignty, human rights and all those democratic jargons thrown at us and the EU is now in the way. In November 1998 Bill Richardson the then US energy secretary spelt out his policy on the extraction and transport of Caspian oil. "This is about America's energy security" and "It's also about preventing strategic inroads by those who don't share our values", March 1999 Serbia was bombed under the auspices of a humanitarian mission. The US based AMBO pipeline consortium is directly linked to the seat of political and military power in the United States and Vice President Dick Cheney's firm Halliburton Energy. The East-West rivalry is only one segment of politics in competing energy interests it goes deeper to even EU-US rivalry. Michel Chossudovsky Professor of Economics, University of Ottawa has a fine essay on the EU-US divide written back in 2001 and playing out even today,
http://www.ippnw.de/commonFiles/pdfs/Frieden/chossudovsky.pdf
German intelligence services were also expelled from Kosovo.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122877290688889167.html
Afghanistan still dogs the US plan, on April 30th 1999 Afghanistan Pakistan and Turkmenistan reignited the central Asian pipeline project excluding US interests, July the 4th 1999 Clinton then ordered a freeze of Taliban assets and the love affair was over Bush tried once again to co-operate with the Taliban in Feb 2001 but that yielded no concrete results, Dec 22 after the WTC attack the Us backed interim Afghan Govt of Hamid Kharzi took office previously he functioned as Unocol Corp consultant Bush also appointed Zalmay Khalizad as special envoy to Afghanistan he too had a consultancy position in Unocol. There are no freinds in buisness just associates which can change at a whim. Hope I have clarified some things, personally it is best not to have all your eggs in one basket.
Zoran,
Your correct about the debt,
http://usdebtclock.org/
Nobody in Romania cares if Serbia joins NATO or not. EU - you could benefit and also we could. But that`s your own problem. Not you are our enemy, our enemy is Russia.
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