Putin to meet with Ukraine counterpart in Poland

I expect a lot of interesting things to be announced in Poland. There are a lot of questions we in Russia would like to be explained. They are :

1.Why should we consider 1 September 1939 as the start of WW2 ? Why not June 22 of 1941 ? Why not when Chechoslovakia , Austria or France were occupied ?

2.What was wrong with Molotov –Ribbentrop Pact while almost all the European states had similar pacts with Hitler ? Was it anything worse than Munchen Treaty ?

3.What do the Poles want from Russia ? Do they mean that we should take some lands from Belorussia and Ukraine and return them to Poland ? Why not talk to them directly ?

4.Why don’t the Poles attack the Slovaks who entered Poland together with the Germans ?

5.Why don’t the Poles talk about their biting away a part of Chechoslovakia in 1938 ?

6.Why 20-30 years ago during the cold war nobody even tried to compare Stalin’s regime with fascism ?

7.Do the Poles have any right to compare the two regimes while Poland only formally was a part of the Coalition tributing much more to Wermacht ?

8.Why should every Russian leader be obliged to beg pardon for Katyn ? Wasn’t it enough that Eltsyn and Gorby has done this ? Maybe we must include the text to the Constitution and repeat this manthra on every innaguration ? What about 100 000 Russian prisoners of war tortured to death after 1920 ? Has somebody begged our pardon ?

9.How does it comes that they did not invite Russian President when they celebrate the Overlord Operation ? Who do they think has won the war ? Us or them while 3 out of 4 Germans ( plus their dogs ) fought against us and the Overlord has been designed not to fight Hitler but to stop Stalin ?

10.Why Serbia is so patient about the revision of the history ?

To be continued …

Rote,

Had you not attended комсомолский кружок истории(full of brainwashing and stalinist type history falsification) and instead played soccer or ice hockey(or go to judo sessions) after school drinking some KBAC afterwards similarly to your great president Putin (who by the way does not share 90 percent of your views)and most russian folks you would not suffer of a disease called polacophobia and ask stupid question and falsify polish history the same way some baltic guys who do the same to yours.Otherwise all my respect to those 85-90 percent of russians who have not lost their common sense and do not consider Stalin as the greatest person of russian history.According to my experiance the same layer has not been fortunatelly infected by western brainwashing either so if russia is not taken back by some narrow-minded stalinists she has a bright future.As to Katyn despite having lost some family members there I am also angry with polish" elite "poining finger at russians all time since native russians can neither be found among those who gave the orders and those NKVD officers who did the executions.

Rote Kapelle

Stop it with the Stalinist lies, nobody believes you, most Russians would be sickened by it as well. I shouldn't waste my time even replying, but I can't let such lies sit unanswered, as they offend the Poles and teach the Serbs complete lies about us and the war:

"1.Why should we consider 1 September 1939 as the start of WW2 ? Why not June 22 of 1941 ? Why not when Chechoslovakia , Austria or France were occupied ?"

Because that's when armed conflict started, Czechoslovakia and Austria fell without combat.

"2.What was wrong with Molotov –Ribbentrop Pact while almost all the European states had similar pacts with Hitler ? Was it anything worse than Munchen Treaty ? "

Because it advocated the conquering of several sovereign states (Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Finland and Romania) and dividing it between themselves, where one side liked to send jews and roma to death camps, while the other side like to deport whole populations to gu³ags and massacre inteligencja, that's what was wrong. Munich was not done by force, that's why it was better, the other one implied occupation by force.

"3.What do the Poles want from Russia ? Do they mean that we should take some lands from Belorussia and Ukraine and return them to Poland ? Why not talk to them directly ?"

Because borders and land caused World War II, where 50 million people died, including 20 million Russians. The borders are there to say and not to be talked about, which doesn't mean that we don't consider the theft of our Eastern territories as justified, but we don't moan about it. Let bygones by bygones.

"4.Why don’t the Poles attack the Slovaks who entered Poland together with the Germans ?"

Because they were no threat to us ideologically and did nothing wrong to the civilian population, unlike the Germans and Soviets were doing to us in the war.

"5.Why don’t the Poles talk about their biting away a part of Chechoslovakia in 1938 ? "

Who says we don't? At least we don't lie about that territory being ours, like our Eastern territories were stolen after the war. Œl¹sk Cieszyñski was simply taken out of nationalistic chauvinism, but it's a fraction of the size of our Eastern territories, and we didn't deport people to gu³ags or massacre them, like the Soviets did.

"6.Why 20-30 years ago during the cold war nobody even tried to compare Stalin’s regime with fascism ?"

Capitalist and Communist lies taught that generation to be suspiscious of each other, but thankfully people are doing it now, since numbers even show that Stalin killed more Ukrainians than Hitler did jews, by 1 000 000 people. Thankfully the truth can no longer be hidden by the liers in Moscow, times have changed, you lost Cold War.

"7.Do the Poles have any right to compare the two regimes while Poland only formally was a part of the Coalition tributing much more to Wermacht ? "

You have never been able to prove this lie, so why keep spurting it out here? Do you think anyone actually believes this nonsense?

"8.Why should every Russian leader be obliged to beg pardon for Katyn ? Wasn’t it enough that Eltsyn and Gorby has done this ? Maybe we must include the text to the Constitution and repeat this manthra on every innaguration ? What about 100 000 Russian prisoners of war tortured to death after 1920 ? Has somebody begged our pardon ?"

Hahahaha, 100 000? Are you sure it wasn't 1 000 000 000 000 000? Actually, it was around 20 000, and they weren't tortured to death, they died of malnutrition and disease, Poland had just suffered a Soviet Invasion, and while we annihilated your army, we were weakned and could not afford to rebuild properly, let alone feed your prisoners, while Katyn was genocide of the Polish officer class and inteligencja, because they were a threat to your precious communism.

"9.How does it comes that they did not invite Russian President when they celebrate the Overlord Operation ? Who do they think has won the war ? Us or them while 3 out of 4 Germans ( plus their dogs ) fought against us and the Overlord has been designed not to fight Hitler but to stop Stalin ?"

Because Stalin was equally as bad as Hitler was, only difference was he won the war and could write history as he liked it. Communism actually killed more people than Fascism did, in terms of numbers. Count how much the Red Plague killed in China, the USSR and Cambodia, and then compare that to the regimes of Hitler, Franco and Mussolini, then come tell me which one is worse.

"10.Why Serbia is so patient about the revision of the history ?"

Because they are not stupid, they will not believe your lies just because you are Russian and because Russia and Serbia have a bond. They can read for themselves.

Rote/ORTHODOX/Hand of Moscow, I really will not answer anymore of your posts, but know that your propaganda might have worked in the 30's, but it won't work now. Russia cannot influence other countries with their lies anymore, we have moved on. Get over it.

szemi

Ignore him, I think he is really sore that the USSR broke up and he can't seem to be able to get over it.

1/ Concerning Katyn I think the same. But I would like the Poles to consider all the facts that brought this tragedy. I had a discussion over the matter with Peter Sudyka and we had little difference.
2/ Concerning Putin’s views I have little difference. Sure as a guest he will not raise all those questions but the whole idea of his speech will be the same.
3/ Concerning polacophobia it has nothing to do with me but when 76% of Poles want new apologizings for 22 000 officers while 600 000 Russians remained there forever and while Poland is one of the sponsors of revision of the history I cannot remain political correct.
4/ As for Comsomol it was a good organization and I really was a member.
5/ As for Stalin you have wrong information. The reality is that most of the Russians think him to be the greatest man in our history. Also he tribute to Poland more that any Pole within last 1000 years.

Because that's when armed conflict started, Czechoslovakia and Austria fell without combat.
- --- Do you think 2 weeks of resistance was enough ( while the next 4 years Poles fought only within Wermacht ) to declare WW2 started ?

Stop it with the Stalinist lies
-----It is just what you would like to be forgotten. You want to talk of Stalin’s crimes but you never mentioned Polish crimes and treasons.

Because it advocated the conquering of several sovereign states
---- What about the similar Polish-German Pact signed a year before ?

Munich was not done by force, that's why it was better,
---- It showed him where to move so when Chamberlain said “I brought you peace” meant only that he believed he had canalized Hitler Eastward where Poland was the first victim

. the theft of our Eastern territories
----- Even if you call it a theft it was a theft of the stolen Russian territories where absolute majority were Russians. Besides in 1945 you received a good compensation…

unlike the Germans and Soviets were doing to us
--- if you mean 1939 there was no resistance to us so nobody touched the civilians. But if you mean Katyn you have to compare what Stalin did to the Russian officers to understand that he made no difference. So in no case Katyn was a result of nationalism. I can see two reasons which forced Stalin. One is ideological and this is why they did not kill soldiers and the other is the revenge for the 100 000 Soviet prisoners of war tortured to death 19 years before.

Cieszyñski was simply taken out of nationalistic chauvinism
--- As simple as that ! How easy you justify Poles while you never hinted that 600 000 lie in their graves in Poland ! Should you mention them I would thank you for keeping up the memorials in good conditions …

Stalin killed more Ukrainians than Hitler did jews,
----- Then why do Ukrainians prefer us to the rest of the world ?

Thankfully the truth can no longer be hidden by the liers in Moscow, times have changed
--- No we shall not allow you to write a history of your own cause we have too much evidence. When you read the new book of the Polish politics before WW2 made public these days you will not be so desisive.

you lost Cold War
---- It was a knock out only ! Otherwise why should “the winners” be so anxious about the loosers ? Where’s the Nuernberg ? How can a looser be able to destroy the whole world ? Why united Europe is so incapable to impose us anything ?

You have never been able to prove this lie
--- Official combat losses of Poland were 123 000 with half of them between September 1 and 17 in 1939. During the next 5,5 years you have lost another half … ( Compare this with the 300 000 killed Serbian partisans ! ) Much more losses were within Wermacht where 500 000 Poles fought us. To tell the truth they were reluctant to fight and Hitler never trusted them. This is why in 1943 we had 62 000 Polish prisoners of war in Kursk battle. Some of them were set free to join Berings Army where they fought much better and this is the fact I have never denied. But those Poles were a minority.

Actually, it was around 20 000, and they weren't tortured to death, they died of malnutrition and disease
--- I don’t know how many of them were tortured to death. I’ve heard figures from 63 000 to 100 000. But in any case none of the Polish leaders had never apologized … They are interested only in Katyn.

we were weakned and could not afford to rebuild properly, let alone feed your prisoners
--- Shame on you ! Why not set them free if you cannot keep them up ?

Because Stalin was equally as bad as Hitler was
--- If you say this on our soil you will be imprisoned cause we have a new special law for fascists. I am not advocating neither Stalin nor Communism but what is told today in the West is totally amoral.

Because they are not stupid, they will not believe your lies just because you are Russian
--- Thus every Serb which will check and find out that my “lies” are well documented is stupid ? But if they says that Poland was not only a victim but also the biggest provoker of WW2 will mean that they are stupid ? One of the reasons that I sometimes come here is not to let folks like you to mislead customers.

Hand of Moscow
--- It’s not me. Please note that only Ataman will have opinions you like to hear from the Russians. Most of us are consolidated enough in the matters of foreign policy. Check it in an any Russian forum !

I think he is really sore that the USSR broke up
--- Here you are right !

You stop pouring mud on us and I forget that you exist . As soon as you start to wash brains of the customers be sure they will have the facts Poles always want to forget or manipulate. Even D.Tusk understood that going to the discussions means a confuse for Poland.

I expect a lot of interesting things to be announced in Poland. There are a lot of questions we in Russia would like to be explained. They are :

1.Why should we consider 1 September 1939 as the start of WW2 ? Why not June 22 of 1941 ? Why not when Chechoslovakia , Austria or France were occupied ?

2.What was wrong with Molotov –Ribbentrop Pact while almost all the European states had similar pacts with Hitler ? Was it anything worse than Munchen Treaty ?

3.What do the Poles want from Russia ? Do they mean that we should take some lands from Belorussia and Ukraine and return them to Poland ? Why not talk to them directly ?

4.Why don’t the Poles attack the Slovaks who entered Poland together with the Germans ?

5.Why don’t the Poles talk about their biting away a part of Chechoslovakia in 1938 ?

6.Why 20-30 years ago during the cold war nobody even tried to compare Stalin’s regime with fascism ?

7.Do the Poles have any right to compare the two regimes while Poland only formally was a part of the Coalition tributing much more to Wermacht ?

8.Why should every Russian leader be obliged to beg pardon for Katyn ? Wasn’t it enough that Eltsyn and Gorby has done this ? Maybe we must include the text to the Constitution and repeat this manthra on every innaguration ? What about 100 000 Russian prisoners of war tortured to death after 1920 ? Has somebody begged our pardon ?

9.How does it comes that they did not invite Russian President when they celebrate the Overlord Operation ? Who do they think has won the war ? Us or them while 3 out of 4 Germans ( plus their dogs ) fought against us and the Overlord has been designed not to fight Hitler but to stop Stalin ?

10.Why Serbia is so patient about the revision of the history ?

To be continued …

1/ Concerning Katyn I think the same. But I would like the Poles to consider all the facts that brought this tragedy. I had a discussion over the matter with Peter Sudyka and we had little difference.
2/ Concerning Putin’s views I have little difference. Sure as a guest he will not raise all those questions but the whole idea of his speech will be the same.
3/ Concerning polacophobia it has nothing to do with me but when 76% of Poles want new apologizings for 22 000 officers while 600 000 Russians remained there forever and while Poland is one of the sponsors of revision of the history I cannot remain political correct.
4/ As for Comsomol it was a good organization and I really was a member.
5/ As for Stalin you have wrong information. The reality is that most of the Russians think him to be the greatest man in our history. Also he tribute to Poland more that any Pole within last 1000 years.

Rote Kapelle

Stop it with the Stalinist lies, nobody believes you, most Russians would be sickened by it as well. I shouldn't waste my time even replying, but I can't let such lies sit unanswered, as they offend the Poles and teach the Serbs complete lies about us and the war:

"1.Why should we consider 1 September 1939 as the start of WW2 ? Why not June 22 of 1941 ? Why not when Chechoslovakia , Austria or France were occupied ?"

Because that's when armed conflict started, Czechoslovakia and Austria fell without combat.

"2.What was wrong with Molotov –Ribbentrop Pact while almost all the European states had similar pacts with Hitler ? Was it anything worse than Munchen Treaty ? "

Because it advocated the conquering of several sovereign states (Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Finland and Romania) and dividing it between themselves, where one side liked to send jews and roma to death camps, while the other side like to deport whole populations to gu³ags and massacre inteligencja, that's what was wrong. Munich was not done by force, that's why it was better, the other one implied occupation by force.

"3.What do the Poles want from Russia ? Do they mean that we should take some lands from Belorussia and Ukraine and return them to Poland ? Why not talk to them directly ?"

Because borders and land caused World War II, where 50 million people died, including 20 million Russians. The borders are there to say and not to be talked about, which doesn't mean that we don't consider the theft of our Eastern territories as justified, but we don't moan about it. Let bygones by bygones.

"4.Why don’t the Poles attack the Slovaks who entered Poland together with the Germans ?"

Because they were no threat to us ideologically and did nothing wrong to the civilian population, unlike the Germans and Soviets were doing to us in the war.

"5.Why don’t the Poles talk about their biting away a part of Chechoslovakia in 1938 ? "

Who says we don't? At least we don't lie about that territory being ours, like our Eastern territories were stolen after the war. Œl¹sk Cieszyñski was simply taken out of nationalistic chauvinism, but it's a fraction of the size of our Eastern territories, and we didn't deport people to gu³ags or massacre them, like the Soviets did.

"6.Why 20-30 years ago during the cold war nobody even tried to compare Stalin’s regime with fascism ?"

Capitalist and Communist lies taught that generation to be suspiscious of each other, but thankfully people are doing it now, since numbers even show that Stalin killed more Ukrainians than Hitler did jews, by 1 000 000 people. Thankfully the truth can no longer be hidden by the liers in Moscow, times have changed, you lost Cold War.

"7.Do the Poles have any right to compare the two regimes while Poland only formally was a part of the Coalition tributing much more to Wermacht ? "

You have never been able to prove this lie, so why keep spurting it out here? Do you think anyone actually believes this nonsense?

"8.Why should every Russian leader be obliged to beg pardon for Katyn ? Wasn’t it enough that Eltsyn and Gorby has done this ? Maybe we must include the text to the Constitution and repeat this manthra on every innaguration ? What about 100 000 Russian prisoners of war tortured to death after 1920 ? Has somebody begged our pardon ?"

Hahahaha, 100 000? Are you sure it wasn't 1 000 000 000 000 000? Actually, it was around 20 000, and they weren't tortured to death, they died of malnutrition and disease, Poland had just suffered a Soviet Invasion, and while we annihilated your army, we were weakned and could not afford to rebuild properly, let alone feed your prisoners, while Katyn was genocide of the Polish officer class and inteligencja, because they were a threat to your precious communism.

"9.How does it comes that they did not invite Russian President when they celebrate the Overlord Operation ? Who do they think has won the war ? Us or them while 3 out of 4 Germans ( plus their dogs ) fought against us and the Overlord has been designed not to fight Hitler but to stop Stalin ?"

Because Stalin was equally as bad as Hitler was, only difference was he won the war and could write history as he liked it. Communism actually killed more people than Fascism did, in terms of numbers. Count how much the Red Plague killed in China, the USSR and Cambodia, and then compare that to the regimes of Hitler, Franco and Mussolini, then come tell me which one is worse.

"10.Why Serbia is so patient about the revision of the history ?"

Because they are not stupid, they will not believe your lies just because you are Russian and because Russia and Serbia have a bond. They can read for themselves.

Rote/ORTHODOX/Hand of Moscow, I really will not answer anymore of your posts, but know that your propaganda might have worked in the 30's, but it won't work now. Russia cannot influence other countries with their lies anymore, we have moved on. Get over it.

szemi

Ignore him, I think he is really sore that the USSR broke up and he can't seem to be able to get over it.

Rote,

Had you not attended комсомолский кружок истории(full of brainwashing and stalinist type history falsification) and instead played soccer or ice hockey(or go to judo sessions) after school drinking some KBAC afterwards similarly to your great president Putin (who by the way does not share 90 percent of your views)and most russian folks you would not suffer of a disease called polacophobia and ask stupid question and falsify polish history the same way some baltic guys who do the same to yours.Otherwise all my respect to those 85-90 percent of russians who have not lost their common sense and do not consider Stalin as the greatest person of russian history.According to my experiance the same layer has not been fortunatelly infected by western brainwashing either so if russia is not taken back by some narrow-minded stalinists she has a bright future.As to Katyn despite having lost some family members there I am also angry with polish" elite "poining finger at russians all time since native russians can neither be found among those who gave the orders and those NKVD officers who did the executions.

Because that's when armed conflict started, Czechoslovakia and Austria fell without combat.
- --- Do you think 2 weeks of resistance was enough ( while the next 4 years Poles fought only within Wermacht ) to declare WW2 started ?

Stop it with the Stalinist lies
-----It is just what you would like to be forgotten. You want to talk of Stalin’s crimes but you never mentioned Polish crimes and treasons.

Because it advocated the conquering of several sovereign states
---- What about the similar Polish-German Pact signed a year before ?

Munich was not done by force, that's why it was better,
---- It showed him where to move so when Chamberlain said “I brought you peace” meant only that he believed he had canalized Hitler Eastward where Poland was the first victim

. the theft of our Eastern territories
----- Even if you call it a theft it was a theft of the stolen Russian territories where absolute majority were Russians. Besides in 1945 you received a good compensation…

unlike the Germans and Soviets were doing to us
--- if you mean 1939 there was no resistance to us so nobody touched the civilians. But if you mean Katyn you have to compare what Stalin did to the Russian officers to understand that he made no difference. So in no case Katyn was a result of nationalism. I can see two reasons which forced Stalin. One is ideological and this is why they did not kill soldiers and the other is the revenge for the 100 000 Soviet prisoners of war tortured to death 19 years before.

Cieszyñski was simply taken out of nationalistic chauvinism
--- As simple as that ! How easy you justify Poles while you never hinted that 600 000 lie in their graves in Poland ! Should you mention them I would thank you for keeping up the memorials in good conditions …

Stalin killed more Ukrainians than Hitler did jews,
----- Then why do Ukrainians prefer us to the rest of the world ?

Thankfully the truth can no longer be hidden by the liers in Moscow, times have changed
--- No we shall not allow you to write a history of your own cause we have too much evidence. When you read the new book of the Polish politics before WW2 made public these days you will not be so desisive.

you lost Cold War
---- It was a knock out only ! Otherwise why should “the winners” be so anxious about the loosers ? Where’s the Nuernberg ? How can a looser be able to destroy the whole world ? Why united Europe is so incapable to impose us anything ?

You have never been able to prove this lie
--- Official combat losses of Poland were 123 000 with half of them between September 1 and 17 in 1939. During the next 5,5 years you have lost another half … ( Compare this with the 300 000 killed Serbian partisans ! ) Much more losses were within Wermacht where 500 000 Poles fought us. To tell the truth they were reluctant to fight and Hitler never trusted them. This is why in 1943 we had 62 000 Polish prisoners of war in Kursk battle. Some of them were set free to join Berings Army where they fought much better and this is the fact I have never denied. But those Poles were a minority.

Actually, it was around 20 000, and they weren't tortured to death, they died of malnutrition and disease
--- I don’t know how many of them were tortured to death. I’ve heard figures from 63 000 to 100 000. But in any case none of the Polish leaders had never apologized … They are interested only in Katyn.

we were weakned and could not afford to rebuild properly, let alone feed your prisoners
--- Shame on you ! Why not set them free if you cannot keep them up ?

Because Stalin was equally as bad as Hitler was
--- If you say this on our soil you will be imprisoned cause we have a new special law for fascists. I am not advocating neither Stalin nor Communism but what is told today in the West is totally amoral.

Because they are not stupid, they will not believe your lies just because you are Russian
--- Thus every Serb which will check and find out that my “lies” are well documented is stupid ? But if they says that Poland was not only a victim but also the biggest provoker of WW2 will mean that they are stupid ? One of the reasons that I sometimes come here is not to let folks like you to mislead customers.

Hand of Moscow
--- It’s not me. Please note that only Ataman will have opinions you like to hear from the Russians. Most of us are consolidated enough in the matters of foreign policy. Check it in an any Russian forum !

I think he is really sore that the USSR broke up
--- Here you are right !

You stop pouring mud on us and I forget that you exist . As soon as you start to wash brains of the customers be sure they will have the facts Poles always want to forget or manipulate. Even D.Tusk understood that going to the discussions means a confuse for Poland.