Bosnian crisis to lead to Serbia isolation?

As a citizen of an EU country, I am utterly ashamed of this latest attempt by the "big guns" (Germany, France etc) to intimidate the government and people of Serbia. Don't let them walk all over you - they have their own agendas. International law is on the side of Serbia.

Bravo Tom - I agree wholeheartedly.

The impetus of the PR campaign used against Serbia has now been interrupted. If the memories are jogged among the public in EU countries, they are more likely to ask:

Why is it still a problem after the 'success' painted in 1999?
Why are our troops still there?
Why are we still spending taxes when we were told that it was a glorious victory?
Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?

Against this backdrop, the EU will hardly have support for taking military or other action against Serbia for merely protecting 15% of its own sovereign territory.

Serbia should be welcomed into the EU (if they want to join) and they should all work together towards the best compromise possible within the boundaries of international law.

Most people just want a peaceful life - the few who don't can soon be dealt with by the troops on the ground.

The sooner the message that independence cannot be handed over in the naive way envisaged by the Bush admin, the better.

The people who live in Kosovo are not going to be short-changed. It would go against everyone's interests. They will have full autonomy but national borders cannot be changed without consent.

“if "the Bosnian Serbs" - the name of an ethnic group, not of a geographic region - wanted to split from Bosnia and join Serbia, then they would be entitled to only about half of what is now "RS"(DimTuc, 31. October 2007 14:17)”

Serbs make up around 31% of the population and being primarily rural, of course they live on an area greater than 31%. Bosniaks were city dwellers living in high density conditions like Sarajevo. I have no idea where you are getting this 25%?

You all seem to imply RS is the result of ethnic cleansing, but maybe just maybe the current Bosnia is actually a result of genocide from WWII.

Also from “Wiki”.

“According to the 1931 census, there were 2,323,555 persons in Bosnia and Herzegovina: Orthodox 1,028,139 (44.25%); Muslims 718,079 (30.90%); Catholics 547,949 (23.58%); other: 29,388 (1.27%) of the total population”

“The war victims in Bosnia and Herzegovina, according to the above mentioned excerpt from the census, were 72.1% Serbs (129,114), 16.5% Muslims (29,539), 4.4% Croats (7850) and 7.0% of other nationalities.”

Now take into consideration that both Serbs and Croatians wanted to split Bosnia, and you have a clear majority that wanted to do so.

Might I remind our readers that RS has a 12% minority population and the Federation has only 2%. So ask yourselves which region of Bosnia is the most ethnically cleansed.

Keep in mind the number of victims in the 1990’s pretty much roughly reflected the population distribution, but that is clearly NOT the case with WWII. Why don’t you people make the same comments in support of Serbs regarding WWII? Hypocritical perhaps?

it is amazing how quickly serbia armed itself in 99 to go to war, and how slow they realise the loss. I dont think its only the international community but even its own neighbours can smell milosevices nappy's worn by someone else. To the serb camp, dont be the crazy driver in the highway going the wrong way and scream at others that they are all idiots and dangerous.

Like I said in a previous post, the 'civilized West' is trying to rape Serbia. When she makes noise and fights back, they get upset and make more threats. This is exactly what is now happening. This is immorality at its worst. These western countries have sunk to new lows. Not only are they in breach of international law, not only are they trying to impose ridiculous double standards (self determination for all ethnic minorities in ex-Yu except Serbs), but they smile and try to tell us that they are our 'friends' while doing it. Truly unbelievable. I don't know how these policy makers in the 'civilized West' can look themselves in the mirror. They are a disgrace to humanity.
Kostunica and Tadic will keep doing what they are doing, because they know that justice and truth are on their side, and Serbia will prevail.

Dear Tom O'Donoghue,
in my opinion the International Law cannot be on the side of Serbia in the Bosnian issue.
Maybe we can discuss about the Kosovo's issue but, definitely, we cannot talk about the Srpska situation accordingly.
Actually everyone knows quite well what happened from 1991 to 1995 in Bosnia-Herzegovina (and in the rest of former Yugoslavia)

Well go for it Kostunica! I really mean it. After all the crazier you get the better for Kosova! We always knew it: the Serbs themselves are the Serbs' worse enemies.
But if it is any consolation Kate and Ron still support you.

Some are more equal then others and I am talking of Srpska. Which of the other have there own entity but Srpska in Bosnia. Which is based on the expulsion of 92% of Bosniaks ,96% of Croatians and 99% of other ethnic groups for the grand total of 690,000 still ethnically cleansed from Srpska 12 years after the Serbians aggressions on Bosnia. Also the murder of 10s of thousands of those ethnic groups of defenseless people children ,women ,men and the thousands still missing and showing up in mass graves in Srpska. The figures are in Wikipedia.org other international references and in the public record. Now Serbia is making trouble again like Dushan inveterately said continuing in the steps of Slobodan. The world is getting tired of Serbia's nonsense ,interference and trouble making in Bosnia a independent country. Which Serbia would love nothing else but to steal half of Bosnia and add it to its territorial control. Finish the work of the Serbian President Slobodan and his murdereres Serbian henchman had started in Bosnia. It was the international community that saved Srpska and its army in 95 from a rout and final military defeat from the Croatian and Bosnian army.The western international community is regretting that it didn't let it happen. With all this nonsense coming from Serbia and Srpska year after year. Never mind of Serbia and Srpska ever wanting to rectify the cruel unjust horrendous treatment of the other ethnicities and there closest neighbors.

This is a disgrace what these western powers are trying to do. Basically they just blackmail you. They say you do it our way or we are going to isolate you. Is this democracy?

I am so sick of these western powers interfering in Serb national intersts. Does anyone come to their countries and just give them orders day in and day out. After a while you really just get sick of it!

Oh, no!
Things are not going as smoothly for the US as they had thought so they have begun to make noise like a howling dog.
How badly the US will look if the Kosovo status issue proves to ignite international turmoil starting with BH. The US has begun and will continue to do its best to deflect their responsibilities in the matter and blame everyone else but themselves.
Russia will smile and say, “I told you so” but the big question is...What is the EU going to do?

Kate: I try to understand your frustration at seeing that Kosova is lost. For some strange reason this fact really bothers you and Ron. I understand and even sympathize with the Serbs being bothered by it, but for the life of me I do not understand why a Brit would be so passionate about something happening somewhere you know next to nothing about.
In any case however strongly you feel about it, it does not give you the right to insult anyone in the pro-independence camp here. I don't know on what basis you reached the conclusion that the pro-Serb camp here is too educated, as opposed to the implicit message in your comment that the Albanian camp lacks manners - if that is not discrimination I don't know what is - and had it been anyone else I would have been insulted by it. After all your camp continually refers to the Albanians here in offensive and derogatory term, with, I must say, the blessing of the B92 editors who are always quick to delete any hint of an insult and at times even criticism aimed at the Serbs or Serbia, but see no problem in the Albanians being assigned all sorts of racist and discriminatory epithets.
Will B92 post this I wonder?

Serbia has all the right in the world to defend the Dayton agreement because Serbia signed it and therefore garantuees for its implemetation. If some High representative then tries to change the constitution and the Dayton accords then of course Serbia has the right to express its dissatisfaction and complaints.

What is so wrong about that? What are these western countries so unhappy about now I don't understand.

And for how much longer will Bosnia be ruled by some High representative? Let the people in Bosnia rule themselves!

Who cares about the isolation from the west, the money is in the east now. Once again, look at the Chinese, Russian,
Indian and Brazilian markets,
who needs to be dominated by the US.

Blah,blah...these so called "experts" are just scaring people with empty gun and intentionaly creating defetistic atmosphere.Of course there will be no any sanctions or "isolation" cause western companies invested billions in Serbia in the last 7 years ,so who will be under sanctions?There own companies,banks etc. that work here?Give me a break...

I don't quite understand what this article is getting at. It appears to be that Serbia will be blamed if the Rep. Srpska does not agree to Miroslav Lajčak's attempts to change to the B-H constitution. Surely RS has the right to oppose something that it doesn't agree with and Serbia has the right to voice its concern.

"It was the international community that saved Srpska and its army in 95 from a rout and final military defeat from the Croatian and Bosnian army."

Actually the opposite is true. The "west" hoped that the Croatian and Bosnian armies would over run Bosnian Serbs, but once their progress towards Banja Luka stalled Dayton was the obvious outcome.

Kate: Don't you think that the fact that so many countries in the world, let alone the countries and peoples of the former Yugoslavia, have a problem with the Serbs for exactly the same reasons, i.e. aggression, oppression, discrimination, ethnic cleansing, war crimes and so forth, makes it hard to argue that the Serbs are really a bunch of unfortunate souls who are being criticized and attacked simply as the result of some Western plot? It's not just the Albanians after all that are levelling these accusations. Anyhow I guess you won't understand this - or you don't care - because this is just a thread for you where one choses sides the same way one supports one football team against another.
Furthermore you seem to have a scary lack of concern about the consequences of any conflict or war - "will be dealt soon by troops on the ground". Who will these troops deal with and how? For your information that usually involves a lot of loss of life, and in the case of Kosova any such move would just make the situation a lot worse. Because Kate differently from what you think all K-Albanians support independence. Those who don't live in Belgrade, not in Kosova.

Serbia wake up! For once stand up for the next generation and protect your tradition, culture and language. If you cave in , the internationalists and your enemies have conqured you and their is no turning back. Soon you'll be under the new international law and you'll have nothing to say about it. Divided and you'll be conquered! The dark side is powerfull! Have unity with you brothers and you will win. They are the ones who created the Dayton accords, now they want to break it and control you. Learn from history and realize they are their to serve their own interest and enslave you. this is you country and much blood was spilled over it. Don't forget it.

The reaction of the big 4 may well be over the top, but what on earth are Kostunica and co up to in the first place?

“Serbia’s determination to respect the Dayton Accords and all its elements, which are a guarantee of the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina.“

OK, and I'll ask again. What in the world do the changes in rules of chorum at meetings - which affect all mps equally - have to do with undermining "the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina"?

A nationalistic beat-up if you ask me, with approaching election time in mind.

Teni - Please don't make assumptions about what other people would support.

For me, the fun part is when nationalistic countries like Serbia, throw out hilarious and extreme comments and statements...

They compare everything that happens with the most extreme comparison out there, it's hilarious.

Drama only works in theatres though, in real life things happen a little bit differently.

Teni - My implication was not that the pro-independence camp are not educated. Some clearly are - such as yourself. What I said was that [most of] the anti-independence camp were too educated to fall for 'Simply's' mock post from me to Ron.

But now you mention it, I have found many people on here both rude and clearly uneducated. We are not talking academia (which certainly doesn't equate to brightness) or standards of English but just plain courtesy and levels of behaviour.

I do equate certain posts such as taunts to Serbian males for not producing 9 children both backward and ignorant. Especially as in the next breath the same posters speak of joining the EU and how MY taxes will support them for the foreseeable future.

I find blindly low level bigoted comments from either side unacceptable. But I do wish that you would stop making assumptions about what other posters think and support.

We are isolated already. I can't go anywhere without visa. If they try to block our goods or something illegal, we should respond by ignoring that Danube is International Waterway, and stop the shipping on it.

Lenard:
Same goes for the Federation. Serbs were expelled and murdered there too. Stop acting as if this was good guy vs bad guy. I know many serbs that were expelled from various parts of the Federation: Sarajevo, Gacko, Tuzla, Zenica, among others. Dont act like ur tracks are clean.

The international community didnt save RS from losing the war, they actually bombed us into submission. You should really do your research.

P.S. Anyone can write a wikipedia article. Theres plenty of propaganda from all sides that can be referenced in. Stop being so naive.

First, Lenard's description of the reality of what is "Republika Srpska" is absolutely to the point, spot-on, and should pondered by the serb nationalists here before making ridiculous comparisons of independence for Kosova and "RS."

If all the Serb refugees returned to Kosova - something I would like to see both sides expiditing better than at present - then the Serb proportion of the population would return toabout 10% from about 5% now. That's good for them, but hardly puts a veto n the will of the 90%, except perhaps north of the Ibar. By contrast, if the non-Serb population that was brutally expelled with 10's of 1000's of murders from what later became the atrocity called "RS" were to return, there would be no such thing as "RS". That is, if "the Bosnian Serbs" - the name of an ethnic group, not of a geographic region - wanted to split from Bosnia and join Serbia, then they would be entitled to only about half of what is now "RS", and that half would exclude almost the entire east Bosnia along the Serbia border which was overwhelmingly Muslim before the bloody cleansing of 1992.

The other thing is, back to Bosnia, can I yet again ask (3rd time) from any of the Serb nationalists here:

What in the world do the changes in rules of chorum at parliament meetings - which affect all members of paliament equally - have to do with undermining "the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina"? Is not this just a nationalistic beat-up over *nothing* (I say this, btw, as someone who believes both Bosnia and Kosova can do just well without colonial "high representatives" s they can without colonail Serb overlords.

Kosovo is not a nation, 'M'. Maybe it will be, but it isn't at the moment.

You have it completely wrong that I am in favour of any sort of war. Not at all. But the entire region can't be held hostage by threats of violence.

M: “Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?” Have you got any evidence that Kosova has higher level of criminals then any other state in the region or for that matter any other country in the world."

There is plenty of evidence that Kosovo is a hub for smuggling and other criminal activities. Google the various Interpol and European security service reports.

I predicted this several days ago when the initial incident started:
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=44884#hrono

"You can always count on Serbs to shoot themselves on the foot. At a time when the status of Kosovo is about to be decided, the Serbian government sticks its nose in other countries affairs. "

Not to worry, Serbs, about these demarches. This is government procedure as opposed to western leaders going straight to the media.

Not to worry, Serbs, about these speculations of isolationism. There are not hundreds of thousands of refugees fleeing; no bombings; no shootings; no threats; no war rhetoric. This is diplomacy by the book.

Kate,

"Serbia should be welcomed into the EU (if they want to join)"

I think Serbia should be shunned by the EU until it clearly distances itself from its war-crime-ridden past, takes steps towards reconcilation and becomes politically more mature. As it is, Serbia can (and does) seek union with the likes of Russia, China etc., but should stay clear of EU.

Every such article contains a hidden backwards message:

People, take buying positions in Serbia.
'Nuf said.

It is only a demarche, so why to worry,I don't see any reason for it. It is just diplomatic manner and demonstration of the power. The superficial analysis made by certain experts just lack the sense of depth. Besides, Serbian diplomacy should act in same manners when its interests are jeopardized. It is just a policy and game in which everyone of us should preserve own dignity

Not Gacko, Glamoc

Kate

You have made very clear as to what you stand for! That needs no further comments. However, i don't think one has the right to accuse one side of making assumption when clearly you make accusations about a nation.
“Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?”
Have you got any evidence that Kosova has higher level of criminals then any other state in the region or for that matter any other country in the world. And also let me tell you smth ells too, if the application of the law is at the same level as its in Kosova it would be a civil war in an established country in the world.
Spear me the hypocrite approach and stop hiding behind the eloquent writing, you have made yourself clear that you support the war for the sake of preserving so called 'international laws'.
It doesn't take a genius to distinguish you views and your lack of understanding on the region.
In addition to this you assume that people in this forum are uneducated and rude, yet again you portray yourself as well educated (which is not clear what constitutes 'educated' for you) but at the same time you make incomprehensible accusations about a nation. Knowing something and applying it on practice are two different things, as a philosopher said ' i know what is the mountain but that doesn't mean that i can explain it'

good day/evening to you all.

Yeah, its confirmed, there is more than one person posting on B92 with the name Slavko.

I am the Slavko that speaks and types Canadian English, the real one.

The educated will be able to observe that the typeset differentiates us.

dear teni --- thank you, 100 times over, for your comments today, and on many other days as well. i am usually in agreement with you, in content and tone, but today's really hit the spot. i have commented several times about something of a double standard by moderators here in their, shall we say, editorial policy regarding comments towards the other side (dare i categorize them and lose my spot?) whereas i stopped counting all of the "CCCCCCC" postings which for me was a rally cry for war crimes in bosnia and beyond. also many of my carefully-constructed posts have "disappeared." i suppose it is typical that opposing sides of a debate each feel unfairly dealt with, but in this case i believe that we have a point.

keep on writing in, you and many others are showing the best side of kosovo/a and of the balkans, and we need to hear more such feedback.

It is not the "Bosnian Crisis", but Serbian Social Crisis that's bringing to the isolation of Serbia once again.

How can you go forward when the same people that want to go towards EU, want to go as far away from NATO? The same people that want to build democratic institutions, want to ignore the democratic right of seldetermination of a Nation (Albanians in Kosova). The same people that want to "be" European, vote in elections for people with dark backgrounds, or who hold AK-s on their preferred photo shots? It is a time of great confusion for the Serbian nation, a time that has always been used brutally by business-minded people covered with the political power to make money more than ever.

Some are more equal then others and I am talking of Srpska. Which of the other have there own entity but Srpska in Bosnia. Which is based on the expulsion of 92% of Bosniaks ,96% of Croatians and 99% of other ethnic groups for the grand total of 690,000 still ethnically cleansed from Srpska 12 years after the Serbians aggressions on Bosnia. Also the murder of 10s of thousands of those ethnic groups of defenseless people children ,women ,men and the thousands still missing and showing up in mass graves in Srpska. The figures are in Wikipedia.org other international references and in the public record. Now Serbia is making trouble again like Dushan inveterately said continuing in the steps of Slobodan. The world is getting tired of Serbia's nonsense ,interference and trouble making in Bosnia a independent country. Which Serbia would love nothing else but to steal half of Bosnia and add it to its territorial control. Finish the work of the Serbian President Slobodan and his murdereres Serbian henchman had started in Bosnia. It was the international community that saved Srpska and its army in 95 from a rout and final military defeat from the Croatian and Bosnian army.The western international community is regretting that it didn't let it happen. With all this nonsense coming from Serbia and Srpska year after year. Never mind of Serbia and Srpska ever wanting to rectify the cruel unjust horrendous treatment of the other ethnicities and there closest neighbors.

it is amazing how quickly serbia armed itself in 99 to go to war, and how slow they realise the loss. I dont think its only the international community but even its own neighbours can smell milosevices nappy's worn by someone else. To the serb camp, dont be the crazy driver in the highway going the wrong way and scream at others that they are all idiots and dangerous.

Dear Tom O'Donoghue,
in my opinion the International Law cannot be on the side of Serbia in the Bosnian issue.
Maybe we can discuss about the Kosovo's issue but, definitely, we cannot talk about the Srpska situation accordingly.
Actually everyone knows quite well what happened from 1991 to 1995 in Bosnia-Herzegovina (and in the rest of former Yugoslavia)

As a citizen of an EU country, I am utterly ashamed of this latest attempt by the "big guns" (Germany, France etc) to intimidate the government and people of Serbia. Don't let them walk all over you - they have their own agendas. International law is on the side of Serbia.

Bravo Tom - I agree wholeheartedly.

The impetus of the PR campaign used against Serbia has now been interrupted. If the memories are jogged among the public in EU countries, they are more likely to ask:

Why is it still a problem after the 'success' painted in 1999?
Why are our troops still there?
Why are we still spending taxes when we were told that it was a glorious victory?
Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?

Against this backdrop, the EU will hardly have support for taking military or other action against Serbia for merely protecting 15% of its own sovereign territory.

Serbia should be welcomed into the EU (if they want to join) and they should all work together towards the best compromise possible within the boundaries of international law.

Most people just want a peaceful life - the few who don't can soon be dealt with by the troops on the ground.

The sooner the message that independence cannot be handed over in the naive way envisaged by the Bush admin, the better.

The people who live in Kosovo are not going to be short-changed. It would go against everyone's interests. They will have full autonomy but national borders cannot be changed without consent.

Well go for it Kostunica! I really mean it. After all the crazier you get the better for Kosova! We always knew it: the Serbs themselves are the Serbs' worse enemies.
But if it is any consolation Kate and Ron still support you.

First, Lenard's description of the reality of what is "Republika Srpska" is absolutely to the point, spot-on, and should pondered by the serb nationalists here before making ridiculous comparisons of independence for Kosova and "RS."

If all the Serb refugees returned to Kosova - something I would like to see both sides expiditing better than at present - then the Serb proportion of the population would return toabout 10% from about 5% now. That's good for them, but hardly puts a veto n the will of the 90%, except perhaps north of the Ibar. By contrast, if the non-Serb population that was brutally expelled with 10's of 1000's of murders from what later became the atrocity called "RS" were to return, there would be no such thing as "RS". That is, if "the Bosnian Serbs" - the name of an ethnic group, not of a geographic region - wanted to split from Bosnia and join Serbia, then they would be entitled to only about half of what is now "RS", and that half would exclude almost the entire east Bosnia along the Serbia border which was overwhelmingly Muslim before the bloody cleansing of 1992.

The other thing is, back to Bosnia, can I yet again ask (3rd time) from any of the Serb nationalists here:

What in the world do the changes in rules of chorum at parliament meetings - which affect all members of paliament equally - have to do with undermining "the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina"? Is not this just a nationalistic beat-up over *nothing* (I say this, btw, as someone who believes both Bosnia and Kosova can do just well without colonial "high representatives" s they can without colonail Serb overlords.

Every such article contains a hidden backwards message:

People, take buying positions in Serbia.
'Nuf said.

The reaction of the big 4 may well be over the top, but what on earth are Kostunica and co up to in the first place?

“Serbia’s determination to respect the Dayton Accords and all its elements, which are a guarantee of the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina.“

OK, and I'll ask again. What in the world do the changes in rules of chorum at meetings - which affect all mps equally - have to do with undermining "the equality of the two entities, and all three peoples within Bosnia-Hercegovina"?

A nationalistic beat-up if you ask me, with approaching election time in mind.

Kate: I try to understand your frustration at seeing that Kosova is lost. For some strange reason this fact really bothers you and Ron. I understand and even sympathize with the Serbs being bothered by it, but for the life of me I do not understand why a Brit would be so passionate about something happening somewhere you know next to nothing about.
In any case however strongly you feel about it, it does not give you the right to insult anyone in the pro-independence camp here. I don't know on what basis you reached the conclusion that the pro-Serb camp here is too educated, as opposed to the implicit message in your comment that the Albanian camp lacks manners - if that is not discrimination I don't know what is - and had it been anyone else I would have been insulted by it. After all your camp continually refers to the Albanians here in offensive and derogatory term, with, I must say, the blessing of the B92 editors who are always quick to delete any hint of an insult and at times even criticism aimed at the Serbs or Serbia, but see no problem in the Albanians being assigned all sorts of racist and discriminatory epithets.
Will B92 post this I wonder?

For me, the fun part is when nationalistic countries like Serbia, throw out hilarious and extreme comments and statements...

They compare everything that happens with the most extreme comparison out there, it's hilarious.

Drama only works in theatres though, in real life things happen a little bit differently.

Blah,blah...these so called "experts" are just scaring people with empty gun and intentionaly creating defetistic atmosphere.Of course there will be no any sanctions or "isolation" cause western companies invested billions in Serbia in the last 7 years ,so who will be under sanctions?There own companies,banks etc. that work here?Give me a break...

Teni - Please don't make assumptions about what other people would support.

Kate: Don't you think that the fact that so many countries in the world, let alone the countries and peoples of the former Yugoslavia, have a problem with the Serbs for exactly the same reasons, i.e. aggression, oppression, discrimination, ethnic cleansing, war crimes and so forth, makes it hard to argue that the Serbs are really a bunch of unfortunate souls who are being criticized and attacked simply as the result of some Western plot? It's not just the Albanians after all that are levelling these accusations. Anyhow I guess you won't understand this - or you don't care - because this is just a thread for you where one choses sides the same way one supports one football team against another.
Furthermore you seem to have a scary lack of concern about the consequences of any conflict or war - "will be dealt soon by troops on the ground". Who will these troops deal with and how? For your information that usually involves a lot of loss of life, and in the case of Kosova any such move would just make the situation a lot worse. Because Kate differently from what you think all K-Albanians support independence. Those who don't live in Belgrade, not in Kosova.

I predicted this several days ago when the initial incident started:
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=44884#hrono

"You can always count on Serbs to shoot themselves on the foot. At a time when the status of Kosovo is about to be decided, the Serbian government sticks its nose in other countries affairs. "

Like I said in a previous post, the 'civilized West' is trying to rape Serbia. When she makes noise and fights back, they get upset and make more threats. This is exactly what is now happening. This is immorality at its worst. These western countries have sunk to new lows. Not only are they in breach of international law, not only are they trying to impose ridiculous double standards (self determination for all ethnic minorities in ex-Yu except Serbs), but they smile and try to tell us that they are our 'friends' while doing it. Truly unbelievable. I don't know how these policy makers in the 'civilized West' can look themselves in the mirror. They are a disgrace to humanity.
Kostunica and Tadic will keep doing what they are doing, because they know that justice and truth are on their side, and Serbia will prevail.

This is a disgrace what these western powers are trying to do. Basically they just blackmail you. They say you do it our way or we are going to isolate you. Is this democracy?

I am so sick of these western powers interfering in Serb national intersts. Does anyone come to their countries and just give them orders day in and day out. After a while you really just get sick of it!

Kate

You have made very clear as to what you stand for! That needs no further comments. However, i don't think one has the right to accuse one side of making assumption when clearly you make accusations about a nation.
“Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?”
Have you got any evidence that Kosova has higher level of criminals then any other state in the region or for that matter any other country in the world. And also let me tell you smth ells too, if the application of the law is at the same level as its in Kosova it would be a civil war in an established country in the world.
Spear me the hypocrite approach and stop hiding behind the eloquent writing, you have made yourself clear that you support the war for the sake of preserving so called 'international laws'.
It doesn't take a genius to distinguish you views and your lack of understanding on the region.
In addition to this you assume that people in this forum are uneducated and rude, yet again you portray yourself as well educated (which is not clear what constitutes 'educated' for you) but at the same time you make incomprehensible accusations about a nation. Knowing something and applying it on practice are two different things, as a philosopher said ' i know what is the mountain but that doesn't mean that i can explain it'

good day/evening to you all.

Kate,

"Serbia should be welcomed into the EU (if they want to join)"

I think Serbia should be shunned by the EU until it clearly distances itself from its war-crime-ridden past, takes steps towards reconcilation and becomes politically more mature. As it is, Serbia can (and does) seek union with the likes of Russia, China etc., but should stay clear of EU.

Oh, no!
Things are not going as smoothly for the US as they had thought so they have begun to make noise like a howling dog.
How badly the US will look if the Kosovo status issue proves to ignite international turmoil starting with BH. The US has begun and will continue to do its best to deflect their responsibilities in the matter and blame everyone else but themselves.
Russia will smile and say, “I told you so” but the big question is...What is the EU going to do?

I don't quite understand what this article is getting at. It appears to be that Serbia will be blamed if the Rep. Srpska does not agree to Miroslav Lajčak's attempts to change to the B-H constitution. Surely RS has the right to oppose something that it doesn't agree with and Serbia has the right to voice its concern.

"It was the international community that saved Srpska and its army in 95 from a rout and final military defeat from the Croatian and Bosnian army."

Actually the opposite is true. The "west" hoped that the Croatian and Bosnian armies would over run Bosnian Serbs, but once their progress towards Banja Luka stalled Dayton was the obvious outcome.

Teni - My implication was not that the pro-independence camp are not educated. Some clearly are - such as yourself. What I said was that [most of] the anti-independence camp were too educated to fall for 'Simply's' mock post from me to Ron.

But now you mention it, I have found many people on here both rude and clearly uneducated. We are not talking academia (which certainly doesn't equate to brightness) or standards of English but just plain courtesy and levels of behaviour.

I do equate certain posts such as taunts to Serbian males for not producing 9 children both backward and ignorant. Especially as in the next breath the same posters speak of joining the EU and how MY taxes will support them for the foreseeable future.

I find blindly low level bigoted comments from either side unacceptable. But I do wish that you would stop making assumptions about what other posters think and support.

Yeah, its confirmed, there is more than one person posting on B92 with the name Slavko.

I am the Slavko that speaks and types Canadian English, the real one.

The educated will be able to observe that the typeset differentiates us.

dear teni --- thank you, 100 times over, for your comments today, and on many other days as well. i am usually in agreement with you, in content and tone, but today's really hit the spot. i have commented several times about something of a double standard by moderators here in their, shall we say, editorial policy regarding comments towards the other side (dare i categorize them and lose my spot?) whereas i stopped counting all of the "CCCCCCC" postings which for me was a rally cry for war crimes in bosnia and beyond. also many of my carefully-constructed posts have "disappeared." i suppose it is typical that opposing sides of a debate each feel unfairly dealt with, but in this case i believe that we have a point.

keep on writing in, you and many others are showing the best side of kosovo/a and of the balkans, and we need to hear more such feedback.

It is not the "Bosnian Crisis", but Serbian Social Crisis that's bringing to the isolation of Serbia once again.

How can you go forward when the same people that want to go towards EU, want to go as far away from NATO? The same people that want to build democratic institutions, want to ignore the democratic right of seldetermination of a Nation (Albanians in Kosova). The same people that want to "be" European, vote in elections for people with dark backgrounds, or who hold AK-s on their preferred photo shots? It is a time of great confusion for the Serbian nation, a time that has always been used brutally by business-minded people covered with the political power to make money more than ever.

We are isolated already. I can't go anywhere without visa. If they try to block our goods or something illegal, we should respond by ignoring that Danube is International Waterway, and stop the shipping on it.

It is only a demarche, so why to worry,I don't see any reason for it. It is just diplomatic manner and demonstration of the power. The superficial analysis made by certain experts just lack the sense of depth. Besides, Serbian diplomacy should act in same manners when its interests are jeopardized. It is just a policy and game in which everyone of us should preserve own dignity

Serbia has all the right in the world to defend the Dayton agreement because Serbia signed it and therefore garantuees for its implemetation. If some High representative then tries to change the constitution and the Dayton accords then of course Serbia has the right to express its dissatisfaction and complaints.

What is so wrong about that? What are these western countries so unhappy about now I don't understand.

And for how much longer will Bosnia be ruled by some High representative? Let the people in Bosnia rule themselves!

Who cares about the isolation from the west, the money is in the east now. Once again, look at the Chinese, Russian,
Indian and Brazilian markets,
who needs to be dominated by the US.

Serbia wake up! For once stand up for the next generation and protect your tradition, culture and language. If you cave in , the internationalists and your enemies have conqured you and their is no turning back. Soon you'll be under the new international law and you'll have nothing to say about it. Divided and you'll be conquered! The dark side is powerfull! Have unity with you brothers and you will win. They are the ones who created the Dayton accords, now they want to break it and control you. Learn from history and realize they are their to serve their own interest and enslave you. this is you country and much blood was spilled over it. Don't forget it.

“if "the Bosnian Serbs" - the name of an ethnic group, not of a geographic region - wanted to split from Bosnia and join Serbia, then they would be entitled to only about half of what is now "RS"(DimTuc, 31. October 2007 14:17)”

Serbs make up around 31% of the population and being primarily rural, of course they live on an area greater than 31%. Bosniaks were city dwellers living in high density conditions like Sarajevo. I have no idea where you are getting this 25%?

You all seem to imply RS is the result of ethnic cleansing, but maybe just maybe the current Bosnia is actually a result of genocide from WWII.

Also from “Wiki”.

“According to the 1931 census, there were 2,323,555 persons in Bosnia and Herzegovina: Orthodox 1,028,139 (44.25%); Muslims 718,079 (30.90%); Catholics 547,949 (23.58%); other: 29,388 (1.27%) of the total population”

“The war victims in Bosnia and Herzegovina, according to the above mentioned excerpt from the census, were 72.1% Serbs (129,114), 16.5% Muslims (29,539), 4.4% Croats (7850) and 7.0% of other nationalities.”

Now take into consideration that both Serbs and Croatians wanted to split Bosnia, and you have a clear majority that wanted to do so.

Might I remind our readers that RS has a 12% minority population and the Federation has only 2%. So ask yourselves which region of Bosnia is the most ethnically cleansed.

Keep in mind the number of victims in the 1990’s pretty much roughly reflected the population distribution, but that is clearly NOT the case with WWII. Why don’t you people make the same comments in support of Serbs regarding WWII? Hypocritical perhaps?

Lenard:
Same goes for the Federation. Serbs were expelled and murdered there too. Stop acting as if this was good guy vs bad guy. I know many serbs that were expelled from various parts of the Federation: Sarajevo, Gacko, Tuzla, Zenica, among others. Dont act like ur tracks are clean.

The international community didnt save RS from losing the war, they actually bombed us into submission. You should really do your research.

P.S. Anyone can write a wikipedia article. Theres plenty of propaganda from all sides that can be referenced in. Stop being so naive.

Not to worry, Serbs, about these demarches. This is government procedure as opposed to western leaders going straight to the media.

Not to worry, Serbs, about these speculations of isolationism. There are not hundreds of thousands of refugees fleeing; no bombings; no shootings; no threats; no war rhetoric. This is diplomacy by the book.

Not Gacko, Glamoc

Kosovo is not a nation, 'M'. Maybe it will be, but it isn't at the moment.

You have it completely wrong that I am in favour of any sort of war. Not at all. But the entire region can't be held hostage by threats of violence.

M: “Why is Kosovo monoethnic and exporting crime to other European nations, acting as a hub for smugglers and other criminals throughout the region?” Have you got any evidence that Kosova has higher level of criminals then any other state in the region or for that matter any other country in the world."

There is plenty of evidence that Kosovo is a hub for smuggling and other criminal activities. Google the various Interpol and European security service reports.