Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
even if it´s not worth it, I will answer your questions in order not to give you the opportunity to call me a "racist", of course not knowing what that term really means...
they did not want to leave Serbia, they wanted to leave Yugoslavia in order to creat own nationstates. if you do not see the difference, perhaps it´s the sign for your own hatred towards the Serbs? of course, it´s always easy to point fingers on the Serbs, Albanians have never done anything wrong, right?
as to your second question:
ruling yourself in an autonomous province is not enoough for you??? you really wanna tell us you would feel like in prison???
maybe you don´t know what prison means?
if you don´t believe a Serb, you can ask an Albanian, 30 % of all prison-inmates in Switzerland is of albanian origin/ ethnicity!
please, don´t bore me to death with those remarks about racial prejudices.
Fatos, Serbs are not affraid of Serbian Albaniens being president in near future as long as they look what is in best interest for Serbia. That is what is all about. Get rid of your terrorists and let peaceful people live their life and prosper. Stop trying to intimidate Serbs. Serbs know that there are lots of terrorists in Kosovo but they also know there are lots of good people there who are scared of those terrorist that you are talking about.
You have yet to understand what the West plans with you. They are trying to figure out how much it will cost to make this problem go away without Albanians threatning violence.
The other thing that is utterly laughable is "we could have gone to Belgrade if it was about land." You guys are trying to rewrite history. UCK fighters tried to boast to American soldiers in Albania that "if we had tanks we could take Belgrade and Athens." If violence is the only card you guys have then good for you. When you get your precious Kosovo, how long before the infighting between each other begins?
Mike,i agree with you,but there is just one "little" problem:its totaly absurd to compare system in Serbia with US,France,Germany,Russia etc.Those countries are BIG/HUGE and of course they need some sort of federal structure.Serbia is small country,from every part of Serbia you can arrive to Belgrade by car in 4-5 hours maximum.Novi Sad is just 45 mins drive from Belgrade,so the whole "federalization" theory is pointless in country of this size,got it?Plus,why Croatia,Slovenia,Hungary,Romania,Bulgaria are not federal states?All our neighbours are centralized states!
Rade thank you for the information but some there are some things that don't click. but first Krajina, Republika Srpska is a thought to rejoin their masters not independence. Albanians in Macedonia have enough Seats in the parliament to take the government but they are spread between 22 party's. There is no need for Independence either.
Second i seriously feel that most of the Serbs are still fooled with the passport of Yugoslavia witch expires in 2016, and as so still have an unjustified claim to most of that republics claims. And as for Croatian and Albanians expelling the most people. It was only the Serbs that went against the former republics of Yugo. Even though there is clear evidence of who pressed who from earlier History. I admit Albanians are sometimes Revengful but it is not with out a reason, and for that matter whe haven't learned a lot better From serbia that somehow made it down to the Balkans through history, and im convinced it wasn't with diplomacy, or INT LAW for that matter!
Third yes it was a concession, but many of the serb camp in here thinks that we are in a competition on who will build the Great whatever, It has been said as an argument against independence somehow.
Fourth don't blame the feeding hand that gave serbia those great powers in the communist days. and Just because TITO was not in-line with usual blood thirsty expanding lead
er he was not bad!
Slovenians going back??? Please man common, it was good up until that, they don't even want to be linked with the Balkans let alone Slavic culture.
And how many mortgages, rental agreements have tried to kill you mate? How many Paperworks tried to repress and change the language you read those papers too?
I bet you can change mortgages, rental agreements for the appropriate time. Change address owner number everything! Just so you know.
Let me get this right because i really lost you here. In case Kosovo will not be Independent you are suggesting that NATO Will protect Serbia to regain control of Kosovo???
Started good Rade but it went bad and turned ugly. Its not the avarege serbian that we dont like but the choices they have for leader that have a direct effect in our lifes, And our lifes far outweigh any views what you and the rest of the Serb supporters might hold dear to your hearts. A lot of empires and republics have fallen. Just live and let live! You are north we are south. Kosovo wont be serbian again Rade! As much as you want, This is our necessity to live peacefully, to most Serbians who want Kosovo back, it is about an unjustified pride that it was the Albanians who took it.
Somehow a number of people here think that "federalization" means "independence". For those who are giddy at the possible further fragmentation of Serbia, keep your pants on.
Berisavljević was suggesting Serbia change structure from a unitary state like France, to a federated state like America. This means that local governments have greater say over local affairs, while Belgrade functions as the keystone that holds the interlocking components together. This is a call for decentralization, not fragmentation. Besides, Vojvodina has had a history of pursuing local government in the same way local government is pursued in the US. For those of you who want to chalk this up to people "not liking Serbs" anymore, you're way off the mark.
Anthony Shelmerdine
"Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word."
Dear sir, Albania was one of the most Xenophobic country's in the isolation of Enver Hoxhas. I sure can tell the same signs when people of your calibre talk about Albanians. I learned a new word???
Here is the meaning fo you sir to triple check:
A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.
Foreign peoples pretty much sumps it up from my view even in your case.
As for Brittany, well Kosovo was part of a so called Federation of Yugoslavia, its not and it wont be any more.
If you were as good in history about Kosovo as you seam about the UK maybe you would know that nobody gave Albania 2 seas and a strategic position in the Balkans for free. And on the north you can clearly see that all the country's that have divorced from Serbia are pushing the Serbian empire back to its colonialisation starting point of North East.
The sad point is that all the radical leaders of Serbia have been provoked with speeches of "our heartland" "our history" and what not. Claiming churches as the base of the claim that Kosovo is Serbian.
Trust me Anthony if Kosovo really wanted to destroy those Churches (witch in 99 have blessed death squads and acted as weapon holders, also have supplied the serbian colonists with weapons) we had the chance to do it many times over. We have enough respect not to do it. I admit there have been cases were Individuals or maybe a tiny group led by an individual has done some vandalising, i strongly condemn that and i would like justice to be practiced on these people. But on the other hand you have to look at the side that this people have suffered a lot from some of these churches that instead of condemning killings, it provokes more hate and blesses also minority's who have hate in their blood.
I feel sad that we in the west are forgetting what Europeean concept used to mean, the importance of people. And all you see in this forum is the Support for Russia with the dictatorship, and China with the manufactured Culture to come to the rescue of the Slavik branch of theirs to keep by force 2 million souls who want nothing less then Independence from an experiment to please the Egoistic leaders of the former past. I feel ashamed as a westerner to see Chechnya, Manchuria, and many more peoples not being heard because of secure oil and cheap goods.
It is also sad that country's that the west heavily invested in like china and Russia are actually investing in smaller dictatorial regimes also. But its ok like that, In this forum as long as their not Albanian it is completely understandable. Xenophobia again!
Sir i am just addressing some issues, and would like to hears the answers to my questions.
Q. If Serbia had a real change since the Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening.
A. Each of the former Yugoslav republics has taken the same view. They all called on the Yugoslav constitution to redefine the internal boundaries of Yugoslavia as their new international their borders and succeeded. Serbia is doing the same. That is why there was no independence for Republika Srpska Krajina, Republika Srpska, and the Albanians in Macedonia.
Q. You wouldn't be a fabric of superior race propaganda.
A. That is not the position of Serbia or Serbs in general. There are base elements in every society that do this. Kosovo Albanians, along with the Croats have demonstrated their intolerance more than most by expelling huge numbers of people.
Q. When the English claimed Brittany and the majority was French, we know the rest.
A. I defer to Anthony.
Q. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania it will be Independent (considering how xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania).
A. What? Is that a concession?
Q. Why do you think that everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia?
A. Because of the failure of communism to deliver and when the economy goes bad, everyone blames everyone else? Because of international politics at the time? Because of petty politicians wanting to emulate the Croatian communist Tito, their hero? Because their leaders played on people’s fears to bring out racist and xenophobic feelings?
Q. And why do you think they never would look back?
A. Are you sure? Plenty of ordinary ex-Yugoslavs, including the Slovenians are looking back, nostalgically.
Q. And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
A. For the same reason everyone else respects all kinds of pieces of paper; mortgages, rental agreements. But not everyone considers themselves to be a prisoner of those same pieces of paper. The Californians only see the benefits of the piece of paper that makes them part of the US.
Q. Just once answer these simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from.
A. I think you’re wrong. There will be no war. NATO will see to that. Not all Kosovo Albanians are in love with violence.
Q. So toothpaste out of the tube.
A. Toothpaste is for brushing teeth. It has nothing to do with politics.
The English never claimed Brittany. They were in alliance with Brittany in the 14th and 15th century against France. The English were also in alliance with Burgundy and several other smaller kingdoms (Navarre, Castile etc). The English claim to France wasn't anything to do with the ethnicity of France but the notion of divine right to rule as the 'English' monarch was as much French as Norman. Edward III, Henry V, Henry VI all had very sound reasons to challenge for the French throne. Adriano is an Italian sounding name but how many Kings, Dukes, Princes of Naples, Savoy or Sicily were made from the stock of the native population?
As for 'Xenophobic'? May i suggest that when learning a new word you discover the meaning. A definition of your 'new long word' is 'petty minded fear of foreigners' and not fear of a 'large, unstable, never achieved Albanian state'. To call Serbs Xenophobic is to ignore the multi ethnic cauldren that is Vojvodina and to ignore the almost ethnically pure Albanian Kosovo and Metohija. Who is Xenophobic Adriano? Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word.
Vojvodina should get a broad autonomy INTERNATIONALLY SUPERVISED.
I have said all along that Serbia will not sustain its territory an neither will Russia.
Russia has about 20 areas where people want nothing to do with Slavic regime of Putin.
Lets wait and see.
My prediction, in Russia we'll have several conflicts going on in the near future.
KOSOVO INDEPENDENT. That is the SOLUTION.
MULTIETHNIC, CIVIL, PROGRESSIVE.
Who the hell is this guy anyway?Former communist official who leads now some obscure little party that nobody heard off...this is pathetic.Serbs make 70% of population in Vojvodina,end of story!
Jovane, If Serbia had a real change since th Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening. You wouldn't be a fabric of a superior race propaganda. When the English claimed Brittany and the mojority was French, we know the rest. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania in will be Independent (considering how Xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania). Just one Question for you Jovan.
Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
Just once answer this simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life's of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from. So toothpaste out of the tube.
All solutions must be considered but with all respect to this former communist official havent we tried a federal state already?
No this seems like a sneaky way to further autonomise Vojvodina so that Vojvodina politicians get a larger share of the cake both in terms of money and power.
Just look at whether any of our close neighbours have a federal structure. They don't. There was talk of federalising Croatia a few years back.
Even though there were much stronger arguments than in Serbia's case, the Dalmatians are a separate ethno-cultural group after all, the attempt failed.
Serbia has no need for artificial federal units or self-promoting, second-rate political hacks.
interesting, once again someone wants to create an artificial link to another integral part of Serbia...
there is no need for a federalization, a broad autonomy for the K-albanians under international supervision is the solution.
nothing else, it´s that simple.
One thing is for sure, Independence for Kosovo, Another thing is uncertain Vojvodina.
Is this possible? The people closest to Serbia cant stand them? But far away Russia is ready to fight for Serbia's interests?? Start being nice people. If K-Albanians wanted land we could have gone to Belgrade and taken it, we just want what was, is, and will be ours Kosovo. No harsh feelings Serbia, we tried to work it out, but there was nothing that held us together, nothing.
Go Vjvodina and Banat. Go Janos Huniadi's sons. After Kosovo, it's your turn, and after you, Sandjak. Serbia should remain what it is really serb territory: Belgrade and Sumadija.
The English never claimed Brittany. They were in alliance with Brittany in the 14th and 15th century against France. The English were also in alliance with Burgundy and several other smaller kingdoms (Navarre, Castile etc). The English claim to France wasn't anything to do with the ethnicity of France but the notion of divine right to rule as the 'English' monarch was as much French as Norman. Edward III, Henry V, Henry VI all had very sound reasons to challenge for the French throne. Adriano is an Italian sounding name but how many Kings, Dukes, Princes of Naples, Savoy or Sicily were made from the stock of the native population?
As for 'Xenophobic'? May i suggest that when learning a new word you discover the meaning. A definition of your 'new long word' is 'petty minded fear of foreigners' and not fear of a 'large, unstable, never achieved Albanian state'. To call Serbs Xenophobic is to ignore the multi ethnic cauldren that is Vojvodina and to ignore the almost ethnically pure Albanian Kosovo and Metohija. Who is Xenophobic Adriano? Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word.
Who the hell is this guy anyway?Former communist official who leads now some obscure little party that nobody heard off...this is pathetic.Serbs make 70% of population in Vojvodina,end of story!
interesting, once again someone wants to create an artificial link to another integral part of Serbia...
there is no need for a federalization, a broad autonomy for the K-albanians under international supervision is the solution.
nothing else, it´s that simple.
Jovane, If Serbia had a real change since th Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening. You wouldn't be a fabric of a superior race propaganda. When the English claimed Brittany and the mojority was French, we know the rest. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania in will be Independent (considering how Xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania). Just one Question for you Jovan.
Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
Just once answer this simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life's of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from. So toothpaste out of the tube.
Q. If Serbia had a real change since the Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening.
A. Each of the former Yugoslav republics has taken the same view. They all called on the Yugoslav constitution to redefine the internal boundaries of Yugoslavia as their new international their borders and succeeded. Serbia is doing the same. That is why there was no independence for Republika Srpska Krajina, Republika Srpska, and the Albanians in Macedonia.
Q. You wouldn't be a fabric of superior race propaganda.
A. That is not the position of Serbia or Serbs in general. There are base elements in every society that do this. Kosovo Albanians, along with the Croats have demonstrated their intolerance more than most by expelling huge numbers of people.
Q. When the English claimed Brittany and the majority was French, we know the rest.
A. I defer to Anthony.
Q. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania it will be Independent (considering how xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania).
A. What? Is that a concession?
Q. Why do you think that everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia?
A. Because of the failure of communism to deliver and when the economy goes bad, everyone blames everyone else? Because of international politics at the time? Because of petty politicians wanting to emulate the Croatian communist Tito, their hero? Because their leaders played on people’s fears to bring out racist and xenophobic feelings?
Q. And why do you think they never would look back?
A. Are you sure? Plenty of ordinary ex-Yugoslavs, including the Slovenians are looking back, nostalgically.
Q. And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
A. For the same reason everyone else respects all kinds of pieces of paper; mortgages, rental agreements. But not everyone considers themselves to be a prisoner of those same pieces of paper. The Californians only see the benefits of the piece of paper that makes them part of the US.
Q. Just once answer these simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from.
A. I think you’re wrong. There will be no war. NATO will see to that. Not all Kosovo Albanians are in love with violence.
Q. So toothpaste out of the tube.
A. Toothpaste is for brushing teeth. It has nothing to do with politics.
One thing is for sure, Independence for Kosovo, Another thing is uncertain Vojvodina.
Is this possible? The people closest to Serbia cant stand them? But far away Russia is ready to fight for Serbia's interests?? Start being nice people. If K-Albanians wanted land we could have gone to Belgrade and taken it, we just want what was, is, and will be ours Kosovo. No harsh feelings Serbia, we tried to work it out, but there was nothing that held us together, nothing.
Go Vjvodina and Banat. Go Janos Huniadi's sons. After Kosovo, it's your turn, and after you, Sandjak. Serbia should remain what it is really serb territory: Belgrade and Sumadija.
Just look at whether any of our close neighbours have a federal structure. They don't. There was talk of federalising Croatia a few years back.
Even though there were much stronger arguments than in Serbia's case, the Dalmatians are a separate ethno-cultural group after all, the attempt failed.
Serbia has no need for artificial federal units or self-promoting, second-rate political hacks.
Vojvodina should get a broad autonomy INTERNATIONALLY SUPERVISED.
I have said all along that Serbia will not sustain its territory an neither will Russia.
Russia has about 20 areas where people want nothing to do with Slavic regime of Putin.
Lets wait and see.
My prediction, in Russia we'll have several conflicts going on in the near future.
KOSOVO INDEPENDENT. That is the SOLUTION.
MULTIETHNIC, CIVIL, PROGRESSIVE.
Anthony Shelmerdine
"Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word."
Dear sir, Albania was one of the most Xenophobic country's in the isolation of Enver Hoxhas. I sure can tell the same signs when people of your calibre talk about Albanians. I learned a new word???
Here is the meaning fo you sir to triple check:
A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.
Foreign peoples pretty much sumps it up from my view even in your case.
As for Brittany, well Kosovo was part of a so called Federation of Yugoslavia, its not and it wont be any more.
If you were as good in history about Kosovo as you seam about the UK maybe you would know that nobody gave Albania 2 seas and a strategic position in the Balkans for free. And on the north you can clearly see that all the country's that have divorced from Serbia are pushing the Serbian empire back to its colonialisation starting point of North East.
The sad point is that all the radical leaders of Serbia have been provoked with speeches of "our heartland" "our history" and what not. Claiming churches as the base of the claim that Kosovo is Serbian.
Trust me Anthony if Kosovo really wanted to destroy those Churches (witch in 99 have blessed death squads and acted as weapon holders, also have supplied the serbian colonists with weapons) we had the chance to do it many times over. We have enough respect not to do it. I admit there have been cases were Individuals or maybe a tiny group led by an individual has done some vandalising, i strongly condemn that and i would like justice to be practiced on these people. But on the other hand you have to look at the side that this people have suffered a lot from some of these churches that instead of condemning killings, it provokes more hate and blesses also minority's who have hate in their blood.
I feel sad that we in the west are forgetting what Europeean concept used to mean, the importance of people. And all you see in this forum is the Support for Russia with the dictatorship, and China with the manufactured Culture to come to the rescue of the Slavik branch of theirs to keep by force 2 million souls who want nothing less then Independence from an experiment to please the Egoistic leaders of the former past. I feel ashamed as a westerner to see Chechnya, Manchuria, and many more peoples not being heard because of secure oil and cheap goods.
It is also sad that country's that the west heavily invested in like china and Russia are actually investing in smaller dictatorial regimes also. But its ok like that, In this forum as long as their not Albanian it is completely understandable. Xenophobia again!
Sir i am just addressing some issues, and would like to hears the answers to my questions.
Mike,i agree with you,but there is just one "little" problem:its totaly absurd to compare system in Serbia with US,France,Germany,Russia etc.Those countries are BIG/HUGE and of course they need some sort of federal structure.Serbia is small country,from every part of Serbia you can arrive to Belgrade by car in 4-5 hours maximum.Novi Sad is just 45 mins drive from Belgrade,so the whole "federalization" theory is pointless in country of this size,got it?Plus,why Croatia,Slovenia,Hungary,Romania,Bulgaria are not federal states?All our neighbours are centralized states!
Fatos, Serbs are not affraid of Serbian Albaniens being president in near future as long as they look what is in best interest for Serbia. That is what is all about. Get rid of your terrorists and let peaceful people live their life and prosper. Stop trying to intimidate Serbs. Serbs know that there are lots of terrorists in Kosovo but they also know there are lots of good people there who are scared of those terrorist that you are talking about.
Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
even if it´s not worth it, I will answer your questions in order not to give you the opportunity to call me a "racist", of course not knowing what that term really means...
they did not want to leave Serbia, they wanted to leave Yugoslavia in order to creat own nationstates. if you do not see the difference, perhaps it´s the sign for your own hatred towards the Serbs? of course, it´s always easy to point fingers on the Serbs, Albanians have never done anything wrong, right?
as to your second question:
ruling yourself in an autonomous province is not enoough for you??? you really wanna tell us you would feel like in prison???
maybe you don´t know what prison means?
if you don´t believe a Serb, you can ask an Albanian, 30 % of all prison-inmates in Switzerland is of albanian origin/ ethnicity!
please, don´t bore me to death with those remarks about racial prejudices.
Rade thank you for the information but some there are some things that don't click. but first Krajina, Republika Srpska is a thought to rejoin their masters not independence. Albanians in Macedonia have enough Seats in the parliament to take the government but they are spread between 22 party's. There is no need for Independence either.
Second i seriously feel that most of the Serbs are still fooled with the passport of Yugoslavia witch expires in 2016, and as so still have an unjustified claim to most of that republics claims. And as for Croatian and Albanians expelling the most people. It was only the Serbs that went against the former republics of Yugo. Even though there is clear evidence of who pressed who from earlier History. I admit Albanians are sometimes Revengful but it is not with out a reason, and for that matter whe haven't learned a lot better From serbia that somehow made it down to the Balkans through history, and im convinced it wasn't with diplomacy, or INT LAW for that matter!
Third yes it was a concession, but many of the serb camp in here thinks that we are in a competition on who will build the Great whatever, It has been said as an argument against independence somehow.
Fourth don't blame the feeding hand that gave serbia those great powers in the communist days. and Just because TITO was not in-line with usual blood thirsty expanding lead
er he was not bad!
Slovenians going back??? Please man common, it was good up until that, they don't even want to be linked with the Balkans let alone Slavic culture.
And how many mortgages, rental agreements have tried to kill you mate? How many Paperworks tried to repress and change the language you read those papers too?
I bet you can change mortgages, rental agreements for the appropriate time. Change address owner number everything! Just so you know.
Let me get this right because i really lost you here. In case Kosovo will not be Independent you are suggesting that NATO Will protect Serbia to regain control of Kosovo???
Started good Rade but it went bad and turned ugly. Its not the avarege serbian that we dont like but the choices they have for leader that have a direct effect in our lifes, And our lifes far outweigh any views what you and the rest of the Serb supporters might hold dear to your hearts. A lot of empires and republics have fallen. Just live and let live! You are north we are south. Kosovo wont be serbian again Rade! As much as you want, This is our necessity to live peacefully, to most Serbians who want Kosovo back, it is about an unjustified pride that it was the Albanians who took it.
Somehow a number of people here think that "federalization" means "independence". For those who are giddy at the possible further fragmentation of Serbia, keep your pants on.
Berisavljević was suggesting Serbia change structure from a unitary state like France, to a federated state like America. This means that local governments have greater say over local affairs, while Belgrade functions as the keystone that holds the interlocking components together. This is a call for decentralization, not fragmentation. Besides, Vojvodina has had a history of pursuing local government in the same way local government is pursued in the US. For those of you who want to chalk this up to people "not liking Serbs" anymore, you're way off the mark.
You have yet to understand what the West plans with you. They are trying to figure out how much it will cost to make this problem go away without Albanians threatning violence.
The other thing that is utterly laughable is "we could have gone to Belgrade if it was about land." You guys are trying to rewrite history. UCK fighters tried to boast to American soldiers in Albania that "if we had tanks we could take Belgrade and Athens." If violence is the only card you guys have then good for you. When you get your precious Kosovo, how long before the infighting between each other begins?
All solutions must be considered but with all respect to this former communist official havent we tried a federal state already?
No this seems like a sneaky way to further autonomise Vojvodina so that Vojvodina politicians get a larger share of the cake both in terms of money and power.
One thing is for sure, Independence for Kosovo, Another thing is uncertain Vojvodina.
Is this possible? The people closest to Serbia cant stand them? But far away Russia is ready to fight for Serbia's interests?? Start being nice people. If K-Albanians wanted land we could have gone to Belgrade and taken it, we just want what was, is, and will be ours Kosovo. No harsh feelings Serbia, we tried to work it out, but there was nothing that held us together, nothing.
Go Vjvodina and Banat. Go Janos Huniadi's sons. After Kosovo, it's your turn, and after you, Sandjak. Serbia should remain what it is really serb territory: Belgrade and Sumadija.
Jovane, If Serbia had a real change since th Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening. You wouldn't be a fabric of a superior race propaganda. When the English claimed Brittany and the mojority was French, we know the rest. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania in will be Independent (considering how Xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania). Just one Question for you Jovan.
Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
Just once answer this simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life's of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from. So toothpaste out of the tube.
Vojvodina should get a broad autonomy INTERNATIONALLY SUPERVISED.
I have said all along that Serbia will not sustain its territory an neither will Russia.
Russia has about 20 areas where people want nothing to do with Slavic regime of Putin.
Lets wait and see.
My prediction, in Russia we'll have several conflicts going on in the near future.
KOSOVO INDEPENDENT. That is the SOLUTION.
MULTIETHNIC, CIVIL, PROGRESSIVE.
Q. If Serbia had a real change since the Milosevic days (and not just by names) in mentality all this would not be happening.
A. Each of the former Yugoslav republics has taken the same view. They all called on the Yugoslav constitution to redefine the internal boundaries of Yugoslavia as their new international their borders and succeeded. Serbia is doing the same. That is why there was no independence for Republika Srpska Krajina, Republika Srpska, and the Albanians in Macedonia.
Q. You wouldn't be a fabric of superior race propaganda.
A. That is not the position of Serbia or Serbs in general. There are base elements in every society that do this. Kosovo Albanians, along with the Croats have demonstrated their intolerance more than most by expelling huge numbers of people.
Q. When the English claimed Brittany and the majority was French, we know the rest.
A. I defer to Anthony.
Q. But instead of Kosovo joining with Albania it will be Independent (considering how xenophobic you sound of a Greater Albania).
A. What? Is that a concession?
Q. Why do you think that everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia?
A. Because of the failure of communism to deliver and when the economy goes bad, everyone blames everyone else? Because of international politics at the time? Because of petty politicians wanting to emulate the Croatian communist Tito, their hero? Because their leaders played on people’s fears to bring out racist and xenophobic feelings?
Q. And why do you think they never would look back?
A. Are you sure? Plenty of ordinary ex-Yugoslavs, including the Slovenians are looking back, nostalgically.
Q. And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
A. For the same reason everyone else respects all kinds of pieces of paper; mortgages, rental agreements. But not everyone considers themselves to be a prisoner of those same pieces of paper. The Californians only see the benefits of the piece of paper that makes them part of the US.
Q. Just once answer these simple questions, as you don't seem to understand the analogy that Serb influence has already left the life of Kosovo and only by force will it ever get back in, and it was the force for what they got kicked out from.
A. I think you’re wrong. There will be no war. NATO will see to that. Not all Kosovo Albanians are in love with violence.
Q. So toothpaste out of the tube.
A. Toothpaste is for brushing teeth. It has nothing to do with politics.
Anthony Shelmerdine
"Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word."
Dear sir, Albania was one of the most Xenophobic country's in the isolation of Enver Hoxhas. I sure can tell the same signs when people of your calibre talk about Albanians. I learned a new word???
Here is the meaning fo you sir to triple check:
A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.
Foreign peoples pretty much sumps it up from my view even in your case.
As for Brittany, well Kosovo was part of a so called Federation of Yugoslavia, its not and it wont be any more.
If you were as good in history about Kosovo as you seam about the UK maybe you would know that nobody gave Albania 2 seas and a strategic position in the Balkans for free. And on the north you can clearly see that all the country's that have divorced from Serbia are pushing the Serbian empire back to its colonialisation starting point of North East.
The sad point is that all the radical leaders of Serbia have been provoked with speeches of "our heartland" "our history" and what not. Claiming churches as the base of the claim that Kosovo is Serbian.
Trust me Anthony if Kosovo really wanted to destroy those Churches (witch in 99 have blessed death squads and acted as weapon holders, also have supplied the serbian colonists with weapons) we had the chance to do it many times over. We have enough respect not to do it. I admit there have been cases were Individuals or maybe a tiny group led by an individual has done some vandalising, i strongly condemn that and i would like justice to be practiced on these people. But on the other hand you have to look at the side that this people have suffered a lot from some of these churches that instead of condemning killings, it provokes more hate and blesses also minority's who have hate in their blood.
I feel sad that we in the west are forgetting what Europeean concept used to mean, the importance of people. And all you see in this forum is the Support for Russia with the dictatorship, and China with the manufactured Culture to come to the rescue of the Slavik branch of theirs to keep by force 2 million souls who want nothing less then Independence from an experiment to please the Egoistic leaders of the former past. I feel ashamed as a westerner to see Chechnya, Manchuria, and many more peoples not being heard because of secure oil and cheap goods.
It is also sad that country's that the west heavily invested in like china and Russia are actually investing in smaller dictatorial regimes also. But its ok like that, In this forum as long as their not Albanian it is completely understandable. Xenophobia again!
Sir i am just addressing some issues, and would like to hears the answers to my questions.
Rade thank you for the information but some there are some things that don't click. but first Krajina, Republika Srpska is a thought to rejoin their masters not independence. Albanians in Macedonia have enough Seats in the parliament to take the government but they are spread between 22 party's. There is no need for Independence either.
Second i seriously feel that most of the Serbs are still fooled with the passport of Yugoslavia witch expires in 2016, and as so still have an unjustified claim to most of that republics claims. And as for Croatian and Albanians expelling the most people. It was only the Serbs that went against the former republics of Yugo. Even though there is clear evidence of who pressed who from earlier History. I admit Albanians are sometimes Revengful but it is not with out a reason, and for that matter whe haven't learned a lot better From serbia that somehow made it down to the Balkans through history, and im convinced it wasn't with diplomacy, or INT LAW for that matter!
Third yes it was a concession, but many of the serb camp in here thinks that we are in a competition on who will build the Great whatever, It has been said as an argument against independence somehow.
Fourth don't blame the feeding hand that gave serbia those great powers in the communist days. and Just because TITO was not in-line with usual blood thirsty expanding lead
er he was not bad!
Slovenians going back??? Please man common, it was good up until that, they don't even want to be linked with the Balkans let alone Slavic culture.
And how many mortgages, rental agreements have tried to kill you mate? How many Paperworks tried to repress and change the language you read those papers too?
I bet you can change mortgages, rental agreements for the appropriate time. Change address owner number everything! Just so you know.
Let me get this right because i really lost you here. In case Kosovo will not be Independent you are suggesting that NATO Will protect Serbia to regain control of Kosovo???
Started good Rade but it went bad and turned ugly. Its not the avarege serbian that we dont like but the choices they have for leader that have a direct effect in our lifes, And our lifes far outweigh any views what you and the rest of the Serb supporters might hold dear to your hearts. A lot of empires and republics have fallen. Just live and let live! You are north we are south. Kosovo wont be serbian again Rade! As much as you want, This is our necessity to live peacefully, to most Serbians who want Kosovo back, it is about an unjustified pride that it was the Albanians who took it.
interesting, once again someone wants to create an artificial link to another integral part of Serbia...
there is no need for a federalization, a broad autonomy for the K-albanians under international supervision is the solution.
nothing else, it´s that simple.
Just look at whether any of our close neighbours have a federal structure. They don't. There was talk of federalising Croatia a few years back.
Even though there were much stronger arguments than in Serbia's case, the Dalmatians are a separate ethno-cultural group after all, the attempt failed.
Serbia has no need for artificial federal units or self-promoting, second-rate political hacks.
Who the hell is this guy anyway?Former communist official who leads now some obscure little party that nobody heard off...this is pathetic.Serbs make 70% of population in Vojvodina,end of story!
Somehow a number of people here think that "federalization" means "independence". For those who are giddy at the possible further fragmentation of Serbia, keep your pants on.
Berisavljević was suggesting Serbia change structure from a unitary state like France, to a federated state like America. This means that local governments have greater say over local affairs, while Belgrade functions as the keystone that holds the interlocking components together. This is a call for decentralization, not fragmentation. Besides, Vojvodina has had a history of pursuing local government in the same way local government is pursued in the US. For those of you who want to chalk this up to people "not liking Serbs" anymore, you're way off the mark.
You have yet to understand what the West plans with you. They are trying to figure out how much it will cost to make this problem go away without Albanians threatning violence.
The other thing that is utterly laughable is "we could have gone to Belgrade if it was about land." You guys are trying to rewrite history. UCK fighters tried to boast to American soldiers in Albania that "if we had tanks we could take Belgrade and Athens." If violence is the only card you guys have then good for you. When you get your precious Kosovo, how long before the infighting between each other begins?
Fatos, Serbs are not affraid of Serbian Albaniens being president in near future as long as they look what is in best interest for Serbia. That is what is all about. Get rid of your terrorists and let peaceful people live their life and prosper. Stop trying to intimidate Serbs. Serbs know that there are lots of terrorists in Kosovo but they also know there are lots of good people there who are scared of those terrorist that you are talking about.
Why do you think thet everybody from the old Yugoslavia wanted to desert Serbia? And why do you think they never would look back?
And what makes you think K-Albanians need to be taken as prisoners of Serbia for a piece of paper?
even if it´s not worth it, I will answer your questions in order not to give you the opportunity to call me a "racist", of course not knowing what that term really means...
they did not want to leave Serbia, they wanted to leave Yugoslavia in order to creat own nationstates. if you do not see the difference, perhaps it´s the sign for your own hatred towards the Serbs? of course, it´s always easy to point fingers on the Serbs, Albanians have never done anything wrong, right?
as to your second question:
ruling yourself in an autonomous province is not enoough for you??? you really wanna tell us you would feel like in prison???
maybe you don´t know what prison means?
if you don´t believe a Serb, you can ask an Albanian, 30 % of all prison-inmates in Switzerland is of albanian origin/ ethnicity!
please, don´t bore me to death with those remarks about racial prejudices.
All solutions must be considered but with all respect to this former communist official havent we tried a federal state already?
No this seems like a sneaky way to further autonomise Vojvodina so that Vojvodina politicians get a larger share of the cake both in terms of money and power.
The English never claimed Brittany. They were in alliance with Brittany in the 14th and 15th century against France. The English were also in alliance with Burgundy and several other smaller kingdoms (Navarre, Castile etc). The English claim to France wasn't anything to do with the ethnicity of France but the notion of divine right to rule as the 'English' monarch was as much French as Norman. Edward III, Henry V, Henry VI all had very sound reasons to challenge for the French throne. Adriano is an Italian sounding name but how many Kings, Dukes, Princes of Naples, Savoy or Sicily were made from the stock of the native population?
As for 'Xenophobic'? May i suggest that when learning a new word you discover the meaning. A definition of your 'new long word' is 'petty minded fear of foreigners' and not fear of a 'large, unstable, never achieved Albanian state'. To call Serbs Xenophobic is to ignore the multi ethnic cauldren that is Vojvodina and to ignore the almost ethnically pure Albanian Kosovo and Metohija. Who is Xenophobic Adriano? Look at the ethnic demographics and you'll eat every single last word.
Mike,i agree with you,but there is just one "little" problem:its totaly absurd to compare system in Serbia with US,France,Germany,Russia etc.Those countries are BIG/HUGE and of course they need some sort of federal structure.Serbia is small country,from every part of Serbia you can arrive to Belgrade by car in 4-5 hours maximum.Novi Sad is just 45 mins drive from Belgrade,so the whole "federalization" theory is pointless in country of this size,got it?Plus,why Croatia,Slovenia,Hungary,Romania,Bulgaria are not federal states?All our neighbours are centralized states!
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