Belgrade to take UEFA's Kosovo decision to arbitration court

Good luck loser. Gibraltar made a precedent already. You lost the political vote and now you will lose the legal vote. Ohh, i forgot, you already have lost both. Kosovo Albania.

hahahahahahahahaha, you got what you deserved. The world is not on your side, and your redicules claim on Kosovo is worth nothing. Serbia was put into it's place.

Not accepting Kosovo in UEFA would also be a political move, so what on earth is this guy on about?

Hahhahahahaha. Such a deluded loser this guy is. I CAN NOT BELIEVE !!! I am sorry for my serb neighbors. These ''people'' are brainwashing you with lies and creating an untrue world around you. GOD help this region get past its past ! Peace ! Regards from Republic of Kosovo.

I'm here to just post this link : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IEH95ZEUSw

FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE :) :) THANK YOU PUTIN!!

Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization."

You see so this is a win for Serbia. So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs.

Kosovo - Serbia 5:0.

bravo kosovo

@Bill

Is that a long winded version of telling me I was right? saying Kosovo is a part of Serbi is a political statement, hence keeping Kosovo out of Uefa because of say non UN membership, would have nothing to do with sport, only politics. In a way, letting them in, is apolitical, it means one does not have to be a universally recognised entity , to participate in sport. its Serbias position that is political. hope this helps.

Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization."

Unbelievable! Wait, there is no such thing in Serbia. Anything is believable. Serb politicians must think ordinary Serbs are 'stoka'.

UEFA is the first sequence but not the last. Serbs' last voting gave greenlights to ignore them when Brussels will need it. Good luck in your EU journey and give my regards to the Turks. Ask them SEN CELEBI MEN CHELEBI ATI KIM KASAR? Looks like the Serbs still do not undesrand what a horrible mistake they have done during the last voting! In a similar situation of 1938 after Munich treason when PM Chamberlain was waving his shit of paper (I brought you peace!) Winston Churchill was quoted as saying IF BETWEEN WAR AND DISGRACE YOU CHOSE DISGRACE YOU WILL HAVE BOTH WAR AND DISGRACE. Serbs have chosen disgrace so there’s nothing to be astonished with. It’s the beginning of the trend. You’ve turned from Russia so Russia may also step away. WE CANNOT BE BIGGER SERBS THAN THE SERBS THEMSELVES as Lavrov once said.

It's not over till the fat lady sings!

Extra time is now set in the courts and in the meantime complete schism of european football - politicising football is not the way to go though some seem to celebrate this poor decision that creates ever more political input into sports.

Oh what a tangled web we weave....

Kosova will most likely become FIFA member within two weeks, when this happens Kosova will be able to compete for Russia 2018 world cup.

So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs.

(mark, 3 May 2016 18:51)


Stop this Vatican BS please! In 1389 Slavs killed Slavs and none of the sides cared the territory because everything belonged to them on this planet. Royal Christians (pagans) and Apostolic Christians killed one another. It was a civil war of 1370-1415 inside the Great Mongolian Horde between the White and the Golden Hordes. The White Horde (Albanians, Albigonians) was the main and it took the upper hand. Most likely Slavs that later became Serbs fought on the Whites' side and no Obilic killed Murad I aka Dmitry Donskoy. Current Serbian history was written by the Oldenburgs who ruled Europe in 19 century. Real history of the Balkan peoples is much more glorious than the bones they've thrown to you.

Well done Kosovo...One way to get revenge on your (unwanted) enemies is to be successful. Why doesnt Serbia co concentrate on improving their own messed up country and leave Kosovo alone!

"Not accepting Kosovo in UEFA would also be a political move, so what on earth is this guy on about? (Nikolle, 3 May 2016 17:38)"

He is alluding to the fact that the decision to NOT allow Kosovo* into UEFA would have been consistent with the highest precedents -- being the UN charter, UN resolutions, UEFA statute, and the general principle of sporting organisations avoiding sensitive political issues before they have been settled in more appropriate international forums.

I think that answers your question of why he is terming the day's events as a "political move" that will "open Pandora's box".

You're welcome.

"So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs."

You are confused about the matter.

You seem to believe that Serbs celebrate the 1389 battle on Kosovo Polje against the Ottoman army as a military victory.

The Ottoman army, being one of the strongest military forces of the day in that part of the world, came out of the battle as victor in so far as its aggression and colonial expansion was insignificantly stalled by the battle itself. The large reserves of manpower that it could summon from its empire saw to it that it could continue its expansion westwards.

The Serbs do, indeed, commemorate the event as a significant one in their history for two reasons: (1) as a salute to the brave knights who, undeterred by a numerically superior enemy, marched out to the battlefield regardless, and (2) as the date of rememberance of the 500 years of oppression and occupation by the colonial Ottoman forces and their planting of a seed of evil and division in these parts of the world through their conversion of some Sloveni and non-Sloveni to Islam.

You are now officially more educated. Spread word in your village.

It's not over till the fat lady sings!

Extra time is now set in the courts and in the meantime complete schism of european football - politicising football is not the way to go though some seem to celebrate this poor decision that creates ever more political input into sports.

Oh what a tangled web we weave....
(Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 3 May 2016 19:18)

Sure. Whatever floats your boat dude. Just so you know "Kosovo The heart of Serbia" became an UEFA member today. You should celebrate.

"Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization.""

The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing...

UEFA will have to retract the vote that just took place.
It has embarrassed itself by meddling in politics instead of sticking with sport.
Once again these western powers are illegally passing laws to suit the briber.
Do not fear because Serbia will prevail.
Kosovo will only be playing football with its big brother Turkey in closed unrecognized matches.
Long live Serbia.

It is amazing how you Serbs make you a mockery to the rest of the world and especially yourselves. If you would be half-clever you would try to play it down (in vain of course), by pointing to Gibraltar or others. But ok, you want it, you get it.

My fellow Albanians, we must build more bunkers in our beloved homeland so that our kids can use them to play indoor soccer.

No-one will stop our Republic of Taqi from membership in FIFA or even the football association of Mars one day. The Martians are currently stopping our children from playing football.

(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)
Absolutely correct. In fact Kosovo, should I say the US, tried to change this to countries recognised by other nations or similar wording, but that failed because they could not get the 2/3 majority.
Opening Pandora's Box will come back to bite them hard.

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

[link]
(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)

Switzerland wasn't a UN member and as was a member of UEFA at the same time.

Speaking on Wednesday, Vulin said he expects the UN Security Council to say whether its Resolution 1244 on Kosovo is still valid."

Switzerland has been a member of UEFA since 1954, and it became a UN member October 10, 2002. Now, how is that possible!!!???

(Mother Theresa Catholic, 3 May 2016 21:14)

Theresa, there is something fundamentally wrong with a nation that commemorates mostly losses and tragic moments in its history. It makes people depressed, angry, and revengeful. All the countries in the world celebrate positive moments in their history as well, where the nation made a leap forward, things like independence days, human rights achievements, and so on. Optimistic things that bring hope. They commemorate tragic events as well, things like holocaust, atomic bombs being dropped, genocides, and that is fine, they should be commemorated.
Only in Serbia, there are no celebrations of positive moments, just pain and suffering and more pain. Does Serbia celebrate its independence day? Maybe it does, but all we see from Serbian media are commemorations of long forgotten battles "that started 500 years of oppression", Nikolic commemorating "Golgothas" of the Serbian army in WWI, the Serbian Orthodox Gore Church talking about pain and more pain. I am sure you have good moments in your history that you can celebrate and emphasize.

Cheer up people, not everybody deserves your revenge.

Read closely - "...a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state..."

Switzerland was a full observer state of the UN prior to its full membership in 2002. That is, it was a fully recognised sovereign state (by the UN and also the entire world community) before it opted for full UN membership (therefore agreeing to be fully bound by UN rules/regulations).

Kosovo is not in the same position. It is not recognised by the UN as an independent and sovereign state. It doesn't have observer status, nevermind membership.


-- UN doesn't recognize States. States recognize other states. UN is an organization like the EU is an organization. Not being in the EU is not the same as not being a country. Same goes for the UN. Serbia didn't stop being a country when it was thrown out of the UN in the 90's. Go in front of a mirror and yell your lungs out :" I hate Albanians ". This is the real reason you are against this. Anything else is nonsense you tell yourself to avoid seeing the real image in front of your mirror; that of a xenophobe.

These ''people'' are brainwashing you with lies
==============================
We think the same of you but the difference is that we are right.

Makes you wonder why they make rules when they have no intention of abiding by them.
Rote, I completely agree. It does look like Serbs have turned against Russia but don't forget that half of them didn't bother to turn up. If voting was made compulsory like here in Australia they would give their vote and then we could determine just how many want Russia.
These deluded fools who thought that not turning up is some sort of a protest or left it to someone else to decide are now having to accept EU and al their kicks in the gut.
They are either that lost and demoralised or extremely stupid.
I really believe that they didn't think what their abstention was going to result in.

After seeing off Lyin' Ted in the primaries and becoming the presumptive GOP nominee, I would like to announce a new policy exclusively here on B92.net:

The Balkans will be the focus of my foreign policy. Given the high regard in which the Albanian community in New York is held, I will see to it that every Albanian child, whether in Albania or Serbia, is given a free American football and the right to enter into a prize draw to be my guest at the next Wimbledon tennis final where we will be cheering on my favourite sportsman Novak Djokovic.

Before 19 century Serbs were not oppressed because they were one of the plots of the Sultans. Many Serbs reached Wazir or even Pasha positions.They saved the Sultanate after it was defeated by Tamerlane in 1402."

Agree, but try finding a Serb to admit to this.

"Ottoman Empire was the best place to live for the Orthodox peoples after 1613. No religion or nation was discriminated there."

Partly true. Albanians were destroyed by the Ottomans and didn't enjoy the same rights as the Serbs.

At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives."

Yes. Turks and many Serbs share the same blood.

(rote

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country. (Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)"

"Switzerland wasn't a UN member and as was a member of UEFA at the same time. (j, 4 May 2016 17:13)"


English isn't your strong suit is it?

Read closely - "...a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state..."

Switzerland was a full observer state of the UN prior to its full membership in 2002. That is, it was a fully recognised sovereign state (by the UN and also the entire world community) before it opted for full UN membership (therefore agreeing to be fully bound by UN rules/regulations).

Kosovo is not in the same position. It is not recognised by the UN as an independent and sovereign state. It doesn't have observer status, nevermind membership.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Switzerland#United_Nations

"The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing... (icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)"

Get used to losing (not loosing) a lot of soccer games, but you can continue to be loose with your comments.

At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives."

Yes. Turks and many Serbs share the same blood.

(rote
(cry me a river, 4 May 2016 15:29)

The more accurate description is a few which were Janissaries and in many cases much crueler than the Ottoman Pasha's themselves. However, the Ottomans in exchange allowed the Serbian Orthodox Church to function or it would not even exist today. In B&H, the Ottoman Turks were far more successful in converting Serbs and Croatians to the Muslim faith.

Albanians on the other hand are essentially Turks, nothing more which explains over 5 Mil Albanians who live in Turkey which is where they came from.

It the Ottoman Turks were some sort of Slavic Horde, then the Serbs would be eating Caviar not Pork. What nonsense!

"Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization.""

The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing...
(icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)

What utter nonsense. If you can read English then you will translate this to Shqip for your village:

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

[link]
(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)

Hey mate, did you even read Article 5 that you quoted?! Where do you see "that only UN members" can join UEFA?!!! It looks like you have the same reading and comprehension challenges as poor Djuric lol

"The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing... (icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)"

What utter nonsense. If you can read English then you will translate this to Shqip for your village:

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/Download/OfficialDocument/uefaorg/WhatUEFAis/02/33/81/40/2338140_DOWNLOAD.pdf

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).

-- The procedure is for becoming a UN member. A territory will still have to go through mutual recognitions with other countries. The UN doesn't say you're a country and all of a sudden you are. That critical mass of mutual recognitions between countries still apply. Otherwise we can simply state that there were no countries on the face of this earth prior to the formation of the UN. If the opposite was true Switzerland would not be a country because it wasn't a UN member.

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

Read it. You read it once again. This is Serbia's own doing. Serbia claims Kosova is part of its territory, a UN member. Under the definition above even through the Serb lens Kosova doesn't violate the rule. It has a football association that implements football related matters. This is how Gibraltar got in UEFA, depsite Spanish opposition. The loophole in that article is the size of the Atlantic Ocean. Close the loophole and you may have a point.

"Read it. You read it once again. This is Serbia's own doing. Serbia claims Kosova is part of its territory, a UN member. Under the definition above even through the Serb lens Kosova doesn't violate the rule. It has a football association that implements football related matters. This is how Gibraltar got in UEFA, depsite Spanish opposition. The loophole in that article is the size of the Atlantic Ocean. Close the loophole and you may have a point. (j, 5 May 2016 17:03)"

Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, a country recognised by the UN as an independent state and furthermore a full UN member.

The difference is that the Kosovo football association does not claim to be part of Serbia, a country recognised as a sovereign and independent state by the UN and furthermore a full UN member.

That is the difference.

If the Kosovo Football Association were to seek membership in UEFA under the flag and the sovereignty of Serbia, and Serbia consents to such a thing, then the Kosovo FA could attempt to seek UEFA membership under those terms (which of course in practice would mean that it would still answer to the Serbian Football Association).

As it stands, there is no legal basis under the UEFA statute for Kosovo to seek membership.

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).
(Your English legal interpreter, 5 May 2016 16:34)

Well, according to the UN itself, the UN does not possess any authority to recognise either a state or a government.

So, unless the UN has authorised you to write on UN's behalf, your opinion that the "UN certainly does recognise states" is certainly an ignorant opinion :)

"Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this: ( mark, 06 May 2016, 6:19 )"

The most fundamental legal principle in existence is that you deal with the law/rules/regulations as you find them, not as they once may have been or as someone may like them to be.

The UEFA Statute today, which is when the Kosovo football association is trying to join, is that only football associations of countries recognised by the UN (as in the UN as an organisation) as independent states (as reflected in either UN observer status or UN full membership) can be accepted as member organisations.

What the UEFA Stuatute may or may not have said some 30 years ago is of no consequence for the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

Kosovo's Albanian political representatives must return to the negotiating table and work out a deal where their political interests are taken into account while abiding by international legal norms and customs. Kosovo's legal Albanian inhabitants are welcome in Serbia as its citizens and have and must have all the same rights.
(Milos Obilic, 6 May 2016 14:34)

You have no case here. CAS already settled this issue. Spain was making the same arguments you make here. Gibraltar is now a UEFA member precisely because it had applied under the older rules. The icing on the cake? Jugoslavia got ousted from the UN in 1992.

"Go read the case of Gibraltar. I know you serbs don't like it but they already won that UN membership argument and they won it because THEY APPLIED BEFORE UEFA CHANGED ITS RULES. Gibraltar applied 8 years after Kosovo. (mark, 6 May 2016 16:51)"

You are making numerous errors and they will now be clearly pointed out for your benefit and the benefit of readers:

1. The Gibraltar Football Association is not a suitable legal analogy for the Kosovo Football Association, as previously pointed out in this thread. Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, which is a country recognised by the UN as being an independent state. According to the UEFA Statute, a football association must be -- "based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and
... responsible for the organisation and implementation offootball-related matters in the territory of their country." As already pointed out numerous times in this thread, the Kosovo FA does not meet this definition by its failiure to enter UEFA under the aegis of Serbia.

2. Even putting aside the above point which is definitive in itself, you say that the Gibraltar FA applied 8 years after the Kosovo FA. What nonsense. Gibraltar applied in 1999, whereas Kosovo applied in 2015/16. It therefore applied well after Gibraltar, and well after the current UEFA Statute. What you are incorrectly referring to may be some non-existent non-state doing stuff which no-one recognises in the early 1990s.

Mother Theresa Catholic : The Ottoman army, being one of the strongest military forces of the day in that part of the world …

*** There were no Ottomans before 17 century as they obeyed mainland Russia. Only after the Lutheran Romanovs seized power in Moscow we can talk about the Osman/Ataman empire. Before that it was south-west wing of the Great Horde. Please remember this.

Mother Theresa Catholic : 500 years of oppression and occupation by the colonial Ottoman forces and their planting of a seed of evil

*** The empire existed since 1453 and since 1613 it became independent. Because like the other Hordes in China, India, Indochina, Africa and America the Chelebi Sultans refused to obey the Romanovs. Before 19 century Serbs were not oppressed because they were one of the plots of the Sultans. Many Serbs reached Wazir or even Pasha positions.They saved the Sultanate after it was defeated by Tamerlane in 1402. It was a civil war where Voevoda Tamerlane backed the Golden Horde while Serbs were on the side of the White Horde's Great Kniaz Vasili I aka Bayased I. Ottoman Empire was the best place to live for the Orthodox peoples after 1613. No religion or nation was discriminated there. At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives. Finally Catholic/Capholic are all Orthodox churches s well because they are autonomous in most issues.

"These deluded fools who thought that not turning up is some sort of a protest or left it to someone else to decide are now having to accept EU and al their kicks in the gut."

When the entire system is illegitimate the best thing is to turn your back on it, if you vote you are legitimizing the system. Serbia was to be dragged into the EU regardless of the average Serbs desires. Voting is irrelevant; it is a method of control to legitimize the installed ruling clique. It will take much more than voting to change Serbia’s path toward the EU, just like it took more to break the pact with Nazi Germany in 1941.

Jugoslavija

Janissaries meant NEW ARMY and was composed of Slavs. Later non-Slavs were also accepted to this elite troops. There are a lot of pictures where you can see that Janissaries had Slavic appearance and dress. It was infantry troop but each one had a horse to reach the battlefield. Ottomans had problems with horses because there were no enough grass fields. So they asked reinforcement from the Great Horde. Cossacks were nomads because a horse needs 3-4 times more of grass than a bull. Every village in Atamania and the mainland Horde had to pay Tagma – every tenth boy that was sent to the Horde for 25 years. Monasteries were built for the retired Cossacks as they could not return to their homes where their old friends were Grandfathers already. It was the main reason why monasteries were built worldwide. Second reason was to defend local people who could find shelter there. Finally Cossacks also prayed there so in every monastery a church was built too. Retired Cossacks payed no taxes and were granted with vast lands so many of them became rich. Including the Janissaries who before 1613 had the same rights as other Cossacks. It was elite troop that could change the Sultans. Until in 1826 bastard Mahmud-VI backed by the Brits massacred 30 000 of them. Since that date the Ottomans changed for worse. Serbs, Macedonians, Bulgars and Russians were one Ottoman people. Albanians were a minority never discriminated before 19 century when they supported the Greeks.

Get used to losing (not loosing) a lot of soccer games
(jugoslavija, 4 May 2016 20:53)

I don't play soccer very often, but a couple of weeks ago when I played, my team actually won... Sorry for ignoring your advice lol

"Theresa, there is something fundamentally wrong with a nation that commemorates mostly losses and tragic moments in its history. It makes people depressed, angry, and revengeful."

We celebreate nearly every other week. Have you heard of Novak Djokovic, or Tesla car company?

The Serb name is synonymous with success and trailblazing. Even the most advanced American companies name themselves after Serbs.

Go Novak!!!

What do Albanians celebrate apart from a new train timetable to Germany?

"-- UN doesn't recognize States. States recognize other states. UN is an organization like the EU is an organization. Not being in the EU is not the same as not being a country. Same goes for the UN. Serbia didn't stop being a country when it was thrown out of the UN in the 90's."

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).

What also isn't in dispute is what the UEFA statute says. It says that only national associations in countries that are recognised by the UN as independent states can become member associations. As we all know, Kosovo* is not a country recognised by the UN as an independent state. Ipso facto, it does not meet the definition of an eligible national association for the purposes of membership under the UEFA statute.

In case you would like the extract again, here it is --

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

Link ------> http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/Download/OfficialDocument/uefaorg/WhatUEFAis/02/33/81/40/2338140_DOWNLOAD.pdf

You're most welcome.

Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, a country recognised by the UN as an independent state and furthermore a full UN member.

The difference is that the Kosovo football association does not claim to be part of Serbia, a country recognised as a sovereign and independent state by the UN and furthermore a full UN member.

That is the difference.

-- This is a difference that doesn't matter. Nowhere in that rule it is stated that the FA being part of a UN recognized state should seek the membership only through that state. That is where the loophole is. It is not specifically prohibited. It doesn't also specifically prohibit said FA seeking membership on its own either.Serbia is making the claim that Kosova is part of a UN recognized state. This is why Kosova didn't have to make the claim. Instead you apply quietly without making such claims. So you have all conditions fulfilled. A UN recognized country. An FA that is in charge of football matters in the territory and no specific prohibitions on how to apply for it or prohibitions on any specific guides that would require the approval of the other FA. The loophole is a giant one. Serbia went about this the wrong way. Thinking that the intent of the rule as Serbia understood was enough. It is never enough; that's why good lawyers get payed good money. To find the loophole on that one special case.Then you're golden.

"Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this: ( mark, 06 May 2016, 6:19 )"

The most fundamental legal principle in existence is that you deal with the law/rules/regulations as you find them, not as they once may have been or as someone may like them to be.

The UEFA Statute today, which is when the Kosovo football association is trying to join, is that only football associations of countries recognised by the UN (as in the UN as an organisation) as independent states (as reflected in either UN observer status or UN full membership) can be accepted as member organisations.

What the UEFA Stuatute may or may not have said some 30 years ago is of no consequence for the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

Kosovo's Albanian political representatives must return to the negotiating table and work out a deal where their political interests are taken into account while abiding by international legal norms and customs. Kosovo's legal Albanian inhabitants are welcome in Serbia as its citizens and have and must have all the same rights.

(Milos Obilic, 6 May 2016 14:34)

Go read the case of Gibraltar. I know you serbs don't like it but they already won that UN membership argument and they won it because THEY APPLIED BEFORE UEFA CHANGED ITS RULES. Gibraltar applied 8 years after Kosovo.

2. Even putting aside the above point which is definitive in itself, you say that the Gibraltar FA applied 8 years after the Kosovo FA. What nonsense. Gibraltar applied in 1999, whereas Kosovo applied in 2015/16. It therefore applied well after Gibraltar, and well after the current UEFA Statute. What you are incorrectly referring to may be some non-existent non-state doing stuff which no-one recognises in the early 1990s.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 6 May 2016 21:01)

Kosova applied in 1992. Here's the catch. Serbia was a non-existent non-state which no-one recognized in 1992 as Jugoslavia was kicked out of the UN in 1992.

"Kosova applied in 1992. Here's the catch. Serbia was a non-existent non-state which no-one recognized in 1992 as Jugoslavia was kicked out of the UN in 1992. (j, 6 May 2016 23:23)"

There is no such thing as "Kosova" in 1992. There was no such entity recognised by anyone in the international community (except perhaps Albania, which no-one in the world even today knows is an actual country in Europe).

In exactly the same vein, I could declare my house to be the entity of "Bigdickovia" and apply to UEFA today but it means nothing, and I would be stupid to claim to people in 30 years time that I applied on 7th May 2016 to join UEFA. They will say "What the hell was Bigdickovia? Was that like a non-recognised state or the name of an adult movie?"

"Gibraltar is now a UEFA member precisely because it had applied under the older rules. The icing on the cake? Jugoslavia got ousted from the UN in 1992. (j, 6 May 2016 19:20)"

What part don't you understand? The Gibraltar Football Association can be a member, today, yesterday, 10 years ago, because it CLAIMS TO BE PART OF A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.

Kosovo does not, so it is missing the FUNDAMENTAL element in the Gibraltar FA's application to UEFA.

What don't you understand? YOU NEED TO BE AN FA IN A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE. If the Kosovo* FA comes to UEFA and says "We are the Kosovo FA, we run football-related matters in the UN-recognised independent state of Serbia, and we want to be admitted to UEFA as the Serbian FA" then it would at least have a prima facie case to be admitted under the Statute. (Of course, the Serbian FA would then say that it is the legitimate and pre-existing football representative of Serbia, but that is beside our immediate purposes here.)

@(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

You can be in denial all you want. The fact the Gibraltar got accepted in UEFA because is part of UK is something that you serbs invented,it is nowhere in the CAS case which is public and is online.Go read it. Go ahead and sue UEFA in CAS. Both FFK and UEFA have the documentation of Kosovo's 1992 application. Gerhard Aigner was the general secretary of UEFA at the time and the person that signed all the correspondence with the FFK.

@ (Republic of Taqi's family, 5 May 2016 18:56)

Gibraltar did not win the CAS case because is part of UK.This is how they won it:
Gibraltar countered that several FIFA members — including Palestine, the Faroe Islands and even England — are not recognized nation states, either, and that it had applied for membership before the rules were changed.

Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this:

According to the old version of Article 5 of the UEFA Statutes “Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in their particular territory”. GFA indisputably exercises sole responsibility for the organisation and structure of football in its territory. The concept of “nation” or “country” in the sports environment must not necessarily be “understood within its common political meaning. More importantly, UEFA already has – and had at the time when the application was made – a number of member associations from countries which do not enjoy independent statehood, such as Scotland, Wales or the Faroe Islands.

On 11 October 2001, the UEFA Congress approved the change of the UEFA Statutes, whereby UEFA membership would from then on be open only to associations in a country “recognised by the United Nations as an independent State ”.

Kosova has also applied for membership before the rules were changed and the article mentioning the UN was added. First time it applied was in 1992. You know who else applied before the rules were changed and now is a member? Gibraltar.

Second. The UEFA legal team answered the question on the UN during voting day. Paraphrasing the answer: Since the UN doesn't recognize countries, the rule means a majority of UN members have recognized the country. This is the case for Kosova.

What don't you understand? YOU NEED TO BE AN FA IN A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

Few people, if any, are understanding what you are writing, mate. You are not making any sense because there is not such a thing as "A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE". No country has ever been or will ever be recognised by the UN because, according to the UN itself, the UN does NOT possess any authority to recognise either a state or a government.

What part don't you understand? The Gibraltar Football Association can be a member, today, yesterday, 10 years ago, because it CLAIMS TO BE PART OF A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.

Kosovo does not, so it is missing the FUNDAMENTAL element in the Gibraltar FA's application to UEFA.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

So, are you saying that Kosovo's claim that Kosovo is independent from Serbia is correct?!

The UEFA Statute is clear.

Some members of UEFA decided to violate the UEFA Statute because of political pressure behind closed doors funded by dirty money.

It is up to the Court of Arbitration for Sport to decide on which interpretation of the Statute they want to enforce now. And to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.

There is nothing more that can be usefully said here.

The UEFA Statute is clear.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Of course, and based on that Statute Kosovo was admitted to UEFA's membership.
----------

Some members of UEFA decided to violate the UEFA Statute because of political pressure behind closed doors funded by dirty money.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Who did violate the UEFA statute? According to whom? And what part of the statute did they violate?! Who paid the money? Where is the evidence? Or was the above just according to you and because you say so?!
----------

It is up to the Court of Arbitration for Sport to decide on which interpretation of the Statute they want to enforce now. And to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

CAS has no authority to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.
----------

There is nothing more that can be usefully said here.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Of course, there is nothing of value that you added other then stating your opinion without providing any reasoning and/or evidence why your opinion is correct!

@icj1 who wrote:
"Who did violate the UEFA statute? According to whom? And what part of the statute did they violate?! Who paid the money? Where is the evidence? Or was the above just according to you and because you say so?!"

UEFA Statutes, Edition 2014, Article 5: Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognized by the United Nations as an independent state...

So, what part of this hard evidence needs to be clarified for you?

Good luck loser. Gibraltar made a precedent already. You lost the political vote and now you will lose the legal vote. Ohh, i forgot, you already have lost both. Kosovo Albania.

Not accepting Kosovo in UEFA would also be a political move, so what on earth is this guy on about?

It's not over till the fat lady sings!

Extra time is now set in the courts and in the meantime complete schism of european football - politicising football is not the way to go though some seem to celebrate this poor decision that creates ever more political input into sports.

Oh what a tangled web we weave....

UEFA will have to retract the vote that just took place.
It has embarrassed itself by meddling in politics instead of sticking with sport.
Once again these western powers are illegally passing laws to suit the briber.
Do not fear because Serbia will prevail.
Kosovo will only be playing football with its big brother Turkey in closed unrecognized matches.
Long live Serbia.

hahahahahahahahaha, you got what you deserved. The world is not on your side, and your redicules claim on Kosovo is worth nothing. Serbia was put into it's place.

Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization."

You see so this is a win for Serbia. So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs.

"Not accepting Kosovo in UEFA would also be a political move, so what on earth is this guy on about? (Nikolle, 3 May 2016 17:38)"

He is alluding to the fact that the decision to NOT allow Kosovo* into UEFA would have been consistent with the highest precedents -- being the UN charter, UN resolutions, UEFA statute, and the general principle of sporting organisations avoiding sensitive political issues before they have been settled in more appropriate international forums.

I think that answers your question of why he is terming the day's events as a "political move" that will "open Pandora's box".

You're welcome.

These ''people'' are brainwashing you with lies
==============================
We think the same of you but the difference is that we are right.

UEFA is the first sequence but not the last. Serbs' last voting gave greenlights to ignore them when Brussels will need it. Good luck in your EU journey and give my regards to the Turks. Ask them SEN CELEBI MEN CHELEBI ATI KIM KASAR? Looks like the Serbs still do not undesrand what a horrible mistake they have done during the last voting! In a similar situation of 1938 after Munich treason when PM Chamberlain was waving his shit of paper (I brought you peace!) Winston Churchill was quoted as saying IF BETWEEN WAR AND DISGRACE YOU CHOSE DISGRACE YOU WILL HAVE BOTH WAR AND DISGRACE. Serbs have chosen disgrace so there’s nothing to be astonished with. It’s the beginning of the trend. You’ve turned from Russia so Russia may also step away. WE CANNOT BE BIGGER SERBS THAN THE SERBS THEMSELVES as Lavrov once said.

Hahhahahahaha. Such a deluded loser this guy is. I CAN NOT BELIEVE !!! I am sorry for my serb neighbors. These ''people'' are brainwashing you with lies and creating an untrue world around you. GOD help this region get past its past ! Peace ! Regards from Republic of Kosovo.

My fellow Albanians, we must build more bunkers in our beloved homeland so that our kids can use them to play indoor soccer.

No-one will stop our Republic of Taqi from membership in FIFA or even the football association of Mars one day. The Martians are currently stopping our children from playing football.

Makes you wonder why they make rules when they have no intention of abiding by them.
Rote, I completely agree. It does look like Serbs have turned against Russia but don't forget that half of them didn't bother to turn up. If voting was made compulsory like here in Australia they would give their vote and then we could determine just how many want Russia.
These deluded fools who thought that not turning up is some sort of a protest or left it to someone else to decide are now having to accept EU and al their kicks in the gut.
They are either that lost and demoralised or extremely stupid.
I really believe that they didn't think what their abstention was going to result in.

"So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs."

You are confused about the matter.

You seem to believe that Serbs celebrate the 1389 battle on Kosovo Polje against the Ottoman army as a military victory.

The Ottoman army, being one of the strongest military forces of the day in that part of the world, came out of the battle as victor in so far as its aggression and colonial expansion was insignificantly stalled by the battle itself. The large reserves of manpower that it could summon from its empire saw to it that it could continue its expansion westwards.

The Serbs do, indeed, commemorate the event as a significant one in their history for two reasons: (1) as a salute to the brave knights who, undeterred by a numerically superior enemy, marched out to the battlefield regardless, and (2) as the date of rememberance of the 500 years of oppression and occupation by the colonial Ottoman forces and their planting of a seed of evil and division in these parts of the world through their conversion of some Sloveni and non-Sloveni to Islam.

You are now officially more educated. Spread word in your village.

So Serbia won again like it did in 1389. Start celebrating serbs.

(mark, 3 May 2016 18:51)


Stop this Vatican BS please! In 1389 Slavs killed Slavs and none of the sides cared the territory because everything belonged to them on this planet. Royal Christians (pagans) and Apostolic Christians killed one another. It was a civil war of 1370-1415 inside the Great Mongolian Horde between the White and the Golden Hordes. The White Horde (Albanians, Albigonians) was the main and it took the upper hand. Most likely Slavs that later became Serbs fought on the Whites' side and no Obilic killed Murad I aka Dmitry Donskoy. Current Serbian history was written by the Oldenburgs who ruled Europe in 19 century. Real history of the Balkan peoples is much more glorious than the bones they've thrown to you.

After seeing off Lyin' Ted in the primaries and becoming the presumptive GOP nominee, I would like to announce a new policy exclusively here on B92.net:

The Balkans will be the focus of my foreign policy. Given the high regard in which the Albanian community in New York is held, I will see to it that every Albanian child, whether in Albania or Serbia, is given a free American football and the right to enter into a prize draw to be my guest at the next Wimbledon tennis final where we will be cheering on my favourite sportsman Novak Djokovic.

(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)
Absolutely correct. In fact Kosovo, should I say the US, tried to change this to countries recognised by other nations or similar wording, but that failed because they could not get the 2/3 majority.
Opening Pandora's Box will come back to bite them hard.

At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives."

Yes. Turks and many Serbs share the same blood.

(rote
(cry me a river, 4 May 2016 15:29)

The more accurate description is a few which were Janissaries and in many cases much crueler than the Ottoman Pasha's themselves. However, the Ottomans in exchange allowed the Serbian Orthodox Church to function or it would not even exist today. In B&H, the Ottoman Turks were far more successful in converting Serbs and Croatians to the Muslim faith.

Albanians on the other hand are essentially Turks, nothing more which explains over 5 Mil Albanians who live in Turkey which is where they came from.

It the Ottoman Turks were some sort of Slavic Horde, then the Serbs would be eating Caviar not Pork. What nonsense!

bravo kosovo

Kosovo - Serbia 5:0.

@Bill

Is that a long winded version of telling me I was right? saying Kosovo is a part of Serbi is a political statement, hence keeping Kosovo out of Uefa because of say non UN membership, would have nothing to do with sport, only politics. In a way, letting them in, is apolitical, it means one does not have to be a universally recognised entity , to participate in sport. its Serbias position that is political. hope this helps.

Mother Theresa Catholic : The Ottoman army, being one of the strongest military forces of the day in that part of the world …

*** There were no Ottomans before 17 century as they obeyed mainland Russia. Only after the Lutheran Romanovs seized power in Moscow we can talk about the Osman/Ataman empire. Before that it was south-west wing of the Great Horde. Please remember this.

Mother Theresa Catholic : 500 years of oppression and occupation by the colonial Ottoman forces and their planting of a seed of evil

*** The empire existed since 1453 and since 1613 it became independent. Because like the other Hordes in China, India, Indochina, Africa and America the Chelebi Sultans refused to obey the Romanovs. Before 19 century Serbs were not oppressed because they were one of the plots of the Sultans. Many Serbs reached Wazir or even Pasha positions.They saved the Sultanate after it was defeated by Tamerlane in 1402. It was a civil war where Voevoda Tamerlane backed the Golden Horde while Serbs were on the side of the White Horde's Great Kniaz Vasili I aka Bayased I. Ottoman Empire was the best place to live for the Orthodox peoples after 1613. No religion or nation was discriminated there. At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives. Finally Catholic/Capholic are all Orthodox churches s well because they are autonomous in most issues.

Well done Kosovo...One way to get revenge on your (unwanted) enemies is to be successful. Why doesnt Serbia co concentrate on improving their own messed up country and leave Kosovo alone!

"Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization.""

The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing...

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country. (Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)"

"Switzerland wasn't a UN member and as was a member of UEFA at the same time. (j, 4 May 2016 17:13)"


English isn't your strong suit is it?

Read closely - "...a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state..."

Switzerland was a full observer state of the UN prior to its full membership in 2002. That is, it was a fully recognised sovereign state (by the UN and also the entire world community) before it opted for full UN membership (therefore agreeing to be fully bound by UN rules/regulations).

Kosovo is not in the same position. It is not recognised by the UN as an independent and sovereign state. It doesn't have observer status, nevermind membership.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Switzerland#United_Nations

"Theresa, there is something fundamentally wrong with a nation that commemorates mostly losses and tragic moments in its history. It makes people depressed, angry, and revengeful."

We celebreate nearly every other week. Have you heard of Novak Djokovic, or Tesla car company?

The Serb name is synonymous with success and trailblazing. Even the most advanced American companies name themselves after Serbs.

Go Novak!!!

What do Albanians celebrate apart from a new train timetable to Germany?

"Read it. You read it once again. This is Serbia's own doing. Serbia claims Kosova is part of its territory, a UN member. Under the definition above even through the Serb lens Kosova doesn't violate the rule. It has a football association that implements football related matters. This is how Gibraltar got in UEFA, depsite Spanish opposition. The loophole in that article is the size of the Atlantic Ocean. Close the loophole and you may have a point. (j, 5 May 2016 17:03)"

Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, a country recognised by the UN as an independent state and furthermore a full UN member.

The difference is that the Kosovo football association does not claim to be part of Serbia, a country recognised as a sovereign and independent state by the UN and furthermore a full UN member.

That is the difference.

If the Kosovo Football Association were to seek membership in UEFA under the flag and the sovereignty of Serbia, and Serbia consents to such a thing, then the Kosovo FA could attempt to seek UEFA membership under those terms (which of course in practice would mean that it would still answer to the Serbian Football Association).

As it stands, there is no legal basis under the UEFA statute for Kosovo to seek membership.

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).
(Your English legal interpreter, 5 May 2016 16:34)

Well, according to the UN itself, the UN does not possess any authority to recognise either a state or a government.

So, unless the UN has authorised you to write on UN's behalf, your opinion that the "UN certainly does recognise states" is certainly an ignorant opinion :)

"Go read the case of Gibraltar. I know you serbs don't like it but they already won that UN membership argument and they won it because THEY APPLIED BEFORE UEFA CHANGED ITS RULES. Gibraltar applied 8 years after Kosovo. (mark, 6 May 2016 16:51)"

You are making numerous errors and they will now be clearly pointed out for your benefit and the benefit of readers:

1. The Gibraltar Football Association is not a suitable legal analogy for the Kosovo Football Association, as previously pointed out in this thread. Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, which is a country recognised by the UN as being an independent state. According to the UEFA Statute, a football association must be -- "based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and
... responsible for the organisation and implementation offootball-related matters in the territory of their country." As already pointed out numerous times in this thread, the Kosovo FA does not meet this definition by its failiure to enter UEFA under the aegis of Serbia.

2. Even putting aside the above point which is definitive in itself, you say that the Gibraltar FA applied 8 years after the Kosovo FA. What nonsense. Gibraltar applied in 1999, whereas Kosovo applied in 2015/16. It therefore applied well after Gibraltar, and well after the current UEFA Statute. What you are incorrectly referring to may be some non-existent non-state doing stuff which no-one recognises in the early 1990s.

Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization."

Unbelievable! Wait, there is no such thing in Serbia. Anything is believable. Serb politicians must think ordinary Serbs are 'stoka'.

I'm here to just post this link : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IEH95ZEUSw

FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE :) :) THANK YOU PUTIN!!

It's not over till the fat lady sings!

Extra time is now set in the courts and in the meantime complete schism of european football - politicising football is not the way to go though some seem to celebrate this poor decision that creates ever more political input into sports.

Oh what a tangled web we weave....
(Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 3 May 2016 19:18)

Sure. Whatever floats your boat dude. Just so you know "Kosovo The heart of Serbia" became an UEFA member today. You should celebrate.

Kosova will most likely become FIFA member within two weeks, when this happens Kosova will be able to compete for Russia 2018 world cup.

"The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing... (icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)"

What utter nonsense. If you can read English then you will translate this to Shqip for your village:

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/Download/OfficialDocument/uefaorg/WhatUEFAis/02/33/81/40/2338140_DOWNLOAD.pdf

(Mother Theresa Catholic, 3 May 2016 21:14)

Theresa, there is something fundamentally wrong with a nation that commemorates mostly losses and tragic moments in its history. It makes people depressed, angry, and revengeful. All the countries in the world celebrate positive moments in their history as well, where the nation made a leap forward, things like independence days, human rights achievements, and so on. Optimistic things that bring hope. They commemorate tragic events as well, things like holocaust, atomic bombs being dropped, genocides, and that is fine, they should be commemorated.
Only in Serbia, there are no celebrations of positive moments, just pain and suffering and more pain. Does Serbia celebrate its independence day? Maybe it does, but all we see from Serbian media are commemorations of long forgotten battles "that started 500 years of oppression", Nikolic commemorating "Golgothas" of the Serbian army in WWI, the Serbian Orthodox Gore Church talking about pain and more pain. I am sure you have good moments in your history that you can celebrate and emphasize.

Cheer up people, not everybody deserves your revenge.

"The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing... (icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)"

Get used to losing (not loosing) a lot of soccer games, but you can continue to be loose with your comments.

Get used to losing (not loosing) a lot of soccer games
(jugoslavija, 4 May 2016 20:53)

I don't play soccer very often, but a couple of weeks ago when I played, my team actually won... Sorry for ignoring your advice lol

"Djuric also said that "the opponent side has lost because it failed in its attempts to change the UEFA statute, which still stipulates that only UN members can join the organization.""

The UEFA statute does not stipulate "that only UN members" can join the organization. No wonder this guy is clueless what's going on and keeps loosing...
(icj1, 4 May 2016 01:36)

What utter nonsense. If you can read English then you will translate this to Shqip for your village:

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

[link]
(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)

Hey mate, did you even read Article 5 that you quoted?! Where do you see "that only UN members" can join UEFA?!!! It looks like you have the same reading and comprehension challenges as poor Djuric lol

"Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this: ( mark, 06 May 2016, 6:19 )"

The most fundamental legal principle in existence is that you deal with the law/rules/regulations as you find them, not as they once may have been or as someone may like them to be.

The UEFA Statute today, which is when the Kosovo football association is trying to join, is that only football associations of countries recognised by the UN (as in the UN as an organisation) as independent states (as reflected in either UN observer status or UN full membership) can be accepted as member organisations.

What the UEFA Stuatute may or may not have said some 30 years ago is of no consequence for the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

Kosovo's Albanian political representatives must return to the negotiating table and work out a deal where their political interests are taken into account while abiding by international legal norms and customs. Kosovo's legal Albanian inhabitants are welcome in Serbia as its citizens and have and must have all the same rights.
(Milos Obilic, 6 May 2016 14:34)

You have no case here. CAS already settled this issue. Spain was making the same arguments you make here. Gibraltar is now a UEFA member precisely because it had applied under the older rules. The icing on the cake? Jugoslavia got ousted from the UN in 1992.

2. Even putting aside the above point which is definitive in itself, you say that the Gibraltar FA applied 8 years after the Kosovo FA. What nonsense. Gibraltar applied in 1999, whereas Kosovo applied in 2015/16. It therefore applied well after Gibraltar, and well after the current UEFA Statute. What you are incorrectly referring to may be some non-existent non-state doing stuff which no-one recognises in the early 1990s.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 6 May 2016 21:01)

Kosova applied in 1992. Here's the catch. Serbia was a non-existent non-state which no-one recognized in 1992 as Jugoslavia was kicked out of the UN in 1992.

It is amazing how you Serbs make you a mockery to the rest of the world and especially yourselves. If you would be half-clever you would try to play it down (in vain of course), by pointing to Gibraltar or others. But ok, you want it, you get it.

Before 19 century Serbs were not oppressed because they were one of the plots of the Sultans. Many Serbs reached Wazir or even Pasha positions.They saved the Sultanate after it was defeated by Tamerlane in 1402."

Agree, but try finding a Serb to admit to this.

"Ottoman Empire was the best place to live for the Orthodox peoples after 1613. No religion or nation was discriminated there."

Partly true. Albanians were destroyed by the Ottomans and didn't enjoy the same rights as the Serbs.

At least Mehmet II aka Prophet Mohammad killed during Belgrade operation and Suleiman the Magnificent both spoke Slovenski language and had Serbian mothers and wives."

Yes. Turks and many Serbs share the same blood.

(rote

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

[link]
(Arbanas Baljezgaj, 4 May 2016 12:31)

Switzerland wasn't a UN member and as was a member of UEFA at the same time.

Speaking on Wednesday, Vulin said he expects the UN Security Council to say whether its Resolution 1244 on Kosovo is still valid."

Switzerland has been a member of UEFA since 1954, and it became a UN member October 10, 2002. Now, how is that possible!!!???

Read closely - "...a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state..."

Switzerland was a full observer state of the UN prior to its full membership in 2002. That is, it was a fully recognised sovereign state (by the UN and also the entire world community) before it opted for full UN membership (therefore agreeing to be fully bound by UN rules/regulations).

Kosovo is not in the same position. It is not recognised by the UN as an independent and sovereign state. It doesn't have observer status, nevermind membership.


-- UN doesn't recognize States. States recognize other states. UN is an organization like the EU is an organization. Not being in the EU is not the same as not being a country. Same goes for the UN. Serbia didn't stop being a country when it was thrown out of the UN in the 90's. Go in front of a mirror and yell your lungs out :" I hate Albanians ". This is the real reason you are against this. Anything else is nonsense you tell yourself to avoid seeing the real image in front of your mirror; that of a xenophobe.

"-- UN doesn't recognize States. States recognize other states. UN is an organization like the EU is an organization. Not being in the EU is not the same as not being a country. Same goes for the UN. Serbia didn't stop being a country when it was thrown out of the UN in the 90's."

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).

What also isn't in dispute is what the UEFA statute says. It says that only national associations in countries that are recognised by the UN as independent states can become member associations. As we all know, Kosovo* is not a country recognised by the UN as an independent state. Ipso facto, it does not meet the definition of an eligible national association for the purposes of membership under the UEFA statute.

In case you would like the extract again, here it is --

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

Link ------> http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/Download/OfficialDocument/uefaorg/WhatUEFAis/02/33/81/40/2338140_DOWNLOAD.pdf

You're most welcome.

The UN certainly does recognise States. It even has a formal procedure for it. Now whether you personally agree with that or not is a different matter (and one which frankly is of no concern to anyone on Earth).

-- The procedure is for becoming a UN member. A territory will still have to go through mutual recognitions with other countries. The UN doesn't say you're a country and all of a sudden you are. That critical mass of mutual recognitions between countries still apply. Otherwise we can simply state that there were no countries on the face of this earth prior to the formation of the UN. If the opposite was true Switzerland would not be a country because it wasn't a UN member.

"Article 5 Members
1 Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognised by the United Nations as an independent state, and which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in the territory of their country."

Read it. You read it once again. This is Serbia's own doing. Serbia claims Kosova is part of its territory, a UN member. Under the definition above even through the Serb lens Kosova doesn't violate the rule. It has a football association that implements football related matters. This is how Gibraltar got in UEFA, depsite Spanish opposition. The loophole in that article is the size of the Atlantic Ocean. Close the loophole and you may have a point.

Kosova has also applied for membership before the rules were changed and the article mentioning the UN was added. First time it applied was in 1992. You know who else applied before the rules were changed and now is a member? Gibraltar.

Second. The UEFA legal team answered the question on the UN during voting day. Paraphrasing the answer: Since the UN doesn't recognize countries, the rule means a majority of UN members have recognized the country. This is the case for Kosova.

"Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this: ( mark, 06 May 2016, 6:19 )"

The most fundamental legal principle in existence is that you deal with the law/rules/regulations as you find them, not as they once may have been or as someone may like them to be.

The UEFA Statute today, which is when the Kosovo football association is trying to join, is that only football associations of countries recognised by the UN (as in the UN as an organisation) as independent states (as reflected in either UN observer status or UN full membership) can be accepted as member organisations.

What the UEFA Stuatute may or may not have said some 30 years ago is of no consequence for the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

Kosovo's Albanian political representatives must return to the negotiating table and work out a deal where their political interests are taken into account while abiding by international legal norms and customs. Kosovo's legal Albanian inhabitants are welcome in Serbia as its citizens and have and must have all the same rights.

(Milos Obilic, 6 May 2016 14:34)

Go read the case of Gibraltar. I know you serbs don't like it but they already won that UN membership argument and they won it because THEY APPLIED BEFORE UEFA CHANGED ITS RULES. Gibraltar applied 8 years after Kosovo.

"Kosova applied in 1992. Here's the catch. Serbia was a non-existent non-state which no-one recognized in 1992 as Jugoslavia was kicked out of the UN in 1992. (j, 6 May 2016 23:23)"

There is no such thing as "Kosova" in 1992. There was no such entity recognised by anyone in the international community (except perhaps Albania, which no-one in the world even today knows is an actual country in Europe).

In exactly the same vein, I could declare my house to be the entity of "Bigdickovia" and apply to UEFA today but it means nothing, and I would be stupid to claim to people in 30 years time that I applied on 7th May 2016 to join UEFA. They will say "What the hell was Bigdickovia? Was that like a non-recognised state or the name of an adult movie?"

"Gibraltar is now a UEFA member precisely because it had applied under the older rules. The icing on the cake? Jugoslavia got ousted from the UN in 1992. (j, 6 May 2016 19:20)"

What part don't you understand? The Gibraltar Football Association can be a member, today, yesterday, 10 years ago, because it CLAIMS TO BE PART OF A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.

Kosovo does not, so it is missing the FUNDAMENTAL element in the Gibraltar FA's application to UEFA.

What don't you understand? YOU NEED TO BE AN FA IN A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE. If the Kosovo* FA comes to UEFA and says "We are the Kosovo FA, we run football-related matters in the UN-recognised independent state of Serbia, and we want to be admitted to UEFA as the Serbian FA" then it would at least have a prima facie case to be admitted under the Statute. (Of course, the Serbian FA would then say that it is the legitimate and pre-existing football representative of Serbia, but that is beside our immediate purposes here.)

What part don't you understand? The Gibraltar Football Association can be a member, today, yesterday, 10 years ago, because it CLAIMS TO BE PART OF A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.

Kosovo does not, so it is missing the FUNDAMENTAL element in the Gibraltar FA's application to UEFA.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

So, are you saying that Kosovo's claim that Kosovo is independent from Serbia is correct?!

@(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

You can be in denial all you want. The fact the Gibraltar got accepted in UEFA because is part of UK is something that you serbs invented,it is nowhere in the CAS case which is public and is online.Go read it. Go ahead and sue UEFA in CAS. Both FFK and UEFA have the documentation of Kosovo's 1992 application. Gerhard Aigner was the general secretary of UEFA at the time and the person that signed all the correspondence with the FFK.

The UEFA Statute is clear.

Some members of UEFA decided to violate the UEFA Statute because of political pressure behind closed doors funded by dirty money.

It is up to the Court of Arbitration for Sport to decide on which interpretation of the Statute they want to enforce now. And to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.

There is nothing more that can be usefully said here.

"These deluded fools who thought that not turning up is some sort of a protest or left it to someone else to decide are now having to accept EU and al their kicks in the gut."

When the entire system is illegitimate the best thing is to turn your back on it, if you vote you are legitimizing the system. Serbia was to be dragged into the EU regardless of the average Serbs desires. Voting is irrelevant; it is a method of control to legitimize the installed ruling clique. It will take much more than voting to change Serbia’s path toward the EU, just like it took more to break the pact with Nazi Germany in 1941.

Jugoslavija

Janissaries meant NEW ARMY and was composed of Slavs. Later non-Slavs were also accepted to this elite troops. There are a lot of pictures where you can see that Janissaries had Slavic appearance and dress. It was infantry troop but each one had a horse to reach the battlefield. Ottomans had problems with horses because there were no enough grass fields. So they asked reinforcement from the Great Horde. Cossacks were nomads because a horse needs 3-4 times more of grass than a bull. Every village in Atamania and the mainland Horde had to pay Tagma – every tenth boy that was sent to the Horde for 25 years. Monasteries were built for the retired Cossacks as they could not return to their homes where their old friends were Grandfathers already. It was the main reason why monasteries were built worldwide. Second reason was to defend local people who could find shelter there. Finally Cossacks also prayed there so in every monastery a church was built too. Retired Cossacks payed no taxes and were granted with vast lands so many of them became rich. Including the Janissaries who before 1613 had the same rights as other Cossacks. It was elite troop that could change the Sultans. Until in 1826 bastard Mahmud-VI backed by the Brits massacred 30 000 of them. Since that date the Ottomans changed for worse. Serbs, Macedonians, Bulgars and Russians were one Ottoman people. Albanians were a minority never discriminated before 19 century when they supported the Greeks.

Gibraltar claims to be part of the United Kingdom, a country recognised by the UN as an independent state and furthermore a full UN member.

The difference is that the Kosovo football association does not claim to be part of Serbia, a country recognised as a sovereign and independent state by the UN and furthermore a full UN member.

That is the difference.

-- This is a difference that doesn't matter. Nowhere in that rule it is stated that the FA being part of a UN recognized state should seek the membership only through that state. That is where the loophole is. It is not specifically prohibited. It doesn't also specifically prohibit said FA seeking membership on its own either.Serbia is making the claim that Kosova is part of a UN recognized state. This is why Kosova didn't have to make the claim. Instead you apply quietly without making such claims. So you have all conditions fulfilled. A UN recognized country. An FA that is in charge of football matters in the territory and no specific prohibitions on how to apply for it or prohibitions on any specific guides that would require the approval of the other FA. The loophole is a giant one. Serbia went about this the wrong way. Thinking that the intent of the rule as Serbia understood was enough. It is never enough; that's why good lawyers get payed good money. To find the loophole on that one special case.Then you're golden.

@ (Republic of Taqi's family, 5 May 2016 18:56)

Gibraltar did not win the CAS case because is part of UK.This is how they won it:
Gibraltar countered that several FIFA members — including Palestine, the Faroe Islands and even England — are not recognized nation states, either, and that it had applied for membership before the rules were changed.

Kosovo used the same arguments. Kosovo applied for UEFA membership in 1992. UEFA statute about membership at the time said this:

According to the old version of Article 5 of the UEFA Statutes “Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe which are responsible for the organisation and implementation of football-related matters in their particular territory”. GFA indisputably exercises sole responsibility for the organisation and structure of football in its territory. The concept of “nation” or “country” in the sports environment must not necessarily be “understood within its common political meaning. More importantly, UEFA already has – and had at the time when the application was made – a number of member associations from countries which do not enjoy independent statehood, such as Scotland, Wales or the Faroe Islands.

On 11 October 2001, the UEFA Congress approved the change of the UEFA Statutes, whereby UEFA membership would from then on be open only to associations in a country “recognised by the United Nations as an independent State ”.

What don't you understand? YOU NEED TO BE AN FA IN A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 7 May 2016 00:51)

Few people, if any, are understanding what you are writing, mate. You are not making any sense because there is not such a thing as "A COUNTRY THAT IS RECOGNISED BY THE UN AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE". No country has ever been or will ever be recognised by the UN because, according to the UN itself, the UN does NOT possess any authority to recognise either a state or a government.

The UEFA Statute is clear.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Of course, and based on that Statute Kosovo was admitted to UEFA's membership.
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Some members of UEFA decided to violate the UEFA Statute because of political pressure behind closed doors funded by dirty money.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Who did violate the UEFA statute? According to whom? And what part of the statute did they violate?! Who paid the money? Where is the evidence? Or was the above just according to you and because you say so?!
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It is up to the Court of Arbitration for Sport to decide on which interpretation of the Statute they want to enforce now. And to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

CAS has no authority to decide whether the international community should function according to Albanian values, or the values of rule of law.
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There is nothing more that can be usefully said here.
(David Cayman Islands Cameron, 8 May 2016 16:00)

Of course, there is nothing of value that you added other then stating your opinion without providing any reasoning and/or evidence why your opinion is correct!

@icj1 who wrote:
"Who did violate the UEFA statute? According to whom? And what part of the statute did they violate?! Who paid the money? Where is the evidence? Or was the above just according to you and because you say so?!"

UEFA Statutes, Edition 2014, Article 5: Membership of UEFA is open to national football associations situated in the continent of Europe, based in a country which is recognized by the United Nations as an independent state...

So, what part of this hard evidence needs to be clarified for you?