Putin: If Kosovo could do it, so could Crimea

Well, B92, your citing was a little shaky and you modified some of Putins comments to not hurt some readers feelings too much but all in all, you got it.

Putin has declared that Kosovo independence is legit and in accordance with UN charta. Time walk the talk Putin. My Prediction for 2016, Russia will recognise Kosovo as part of deal to loosen sanctions. Quite a start 2016!!

Another Canadian Serb: Why would a referendum include 7 million Serbs? The Crimea referendum didn't include all of Ukraine, simply those living in the Crimea. Scotland is part of the UK but only Scots participated in their independence referendum, not all UK citizens. When Quebec held its plebiscite (in your backyard) only Quebecoise voted. If Dodik ever held a referendum I don't imagine that you would expect those living in the Federation to be asked for their opinion.

What I see in this interview is that Putin wants a deals with the West.
West has to recognize the annexation of Crimea and Putin and Russia will recognize Kosovo as independent,in return.
The pretext of referendum is funny because Albanians were the first in former YU to hold an referendum for independence back in 1992 where 99.96% of population voted for independence.
But if Mr. Putin wants another referendum, it is going to be very easy for Albanians.

"Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away"

who is stopping them? I have to say, I've always wondered about the Greek community in Southern Albania. Apparently, from what I read here, they make up a total figure of around 300K and are grotesquely discriminated against. Yet, I've always been surprised that they don't go out to protest against such an obvious injustice. Why on earth do they put up with it? Could it be that 1) they are not discriminated against and as such, have no reason to seek separation, 2) their numbers are so tiny so as to almost be negligible and any kind of attempt at separation is not worth anyone's time and would in fact be comical(not that this would make their grievances any less relevant, should they be suffering them) or 3) they enjoy being part of Albania? I am just curios as to which of these you think it is.

As for what Putin has said, this pretty much confirms what anyone with half a functioning brain cell has always known, if it comes to choosing between Crimea and defending holy Kosmet for the heavenly people, Russia will go for Crimea any time of the day. If the West was to suddenly go you recognise Kosovo and we'll recognise Crimea, all that apparent connection that Serbs think exists between mother Russia and Serbia will be count for nothing. You can still pay homage to the great Tsar however, that you can keep for amusement

We have not gone to war, we have not fired, not a single person was killed. Our soldiers have merely prevented the Ukrainian troops on Crimea from impeding the freedom of expression of the people. In the referendum - which was still decided to take place by the Crimea’s old parliament - the majority of citizens voted for belonging to Russia. This is democracy, the people’s will, he said.

When asked what about international law," Putin responded: "Of course one always has to follow international law. This was also the case in Crimea. According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination. Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. You can read that in all the records, also in the German ones.

Kosovo declared independence and the whole world accepted it, but what was the cause for that? It was a decision of (Kosovo's) parliament. They didn't even hold a referendum," Putin has been quoted as saying.

V. Putin, you have just basically recognized a Independent & sovereign Republic of Kosova!
And let me just remind u Mr Putin, that the people of Kosova did hold a legitimate referendum in 1991
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovan_independence_referendum,_1991
Now, Kosova and Albania should also organize another referendum, on the reunification of The republic of Kosova with Albania!!! Its time!

Putin responded: "Of course one always has to follow international law. This was also the case in Crimea. According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination. Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. You can read that in all the records, also in the German ones."

Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm so sorry for those naive people who believed that Russia would put Serbia's interests over Russia's!

I'm curious if Ivica will send a note of protest to Russia now to tell Russia that "UN bodies have not decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia".

Putin Recognizes Kosova's Independence!

But he is wrong to compare to Crimeia.

What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME.

Putin is comparing apples to oranges....

Typical illogical Slav Inat Backwards Trait.....getting them no where!

"Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. "

No, Mr.Putin, UN bodies/the UNSC didn't say that. Maybe you should read UNSCR 1244 (which is still in force, btw.) It says something different.

"Kosovo declared independence and the whole world accepted it, but what was the cause for that? It was a decision of (Kosovo's) parliament. They didn't even hold a referendum,"

No, not the whole world accepted it, 108 out of 192 UN member states did.
Yes, they didn't hold a referendum.

"The fact is that there was a long war in which Serbia and its capital Belgrade were bombarded and attacked with missiles. It was a military intervention of the West and NATO against the then rump Yugoslavia."

Yes, but this came AFTER all the crimes Serbian troops and paramilitaries committed in Kosovo, under the name of 'fighting terrorism'. But it's normal for Putin to understand that, having in min how he was 'fighting terrorism' in Chechniya, i.e. by erasing whole towns and totally bomb down bigger cities.

Another question is: Would Russia accept Kosovo's independence with a referendum? The outcome of that is obvious. Hmm, wait, no, not really, if the referendum would be similar to the one in Crimea, i.e. asking if Kosovo should either go back and restore the status of 1980 or join Albania, Kosovo citizens would 95% choose the latter.

Kosovo became independent. Crimea was annexed by Russia, so a better comparison would have been if Albania annexed Kosovo, but it didn't. Kosovo's independence took several years, while Crimea's annexation occurred in a few weeks. Kosovo's independence came after war in Kosovo, plus prior wars in neighboring states. There was no war in Ukraine before Crimea's annexation. Besides, Putin has already used the Kosovo excuse in Georgia with South Ossettia and Abkhazia. But I do believe he would sell out Serbia over Crimea in a heartbeat if the west agreed to recognize Crimea in exchange for Kosovo.

Then Mr. Putin u should support kosovo's independence... so you are exercising double standards not just the west..

(ned taylor, 11 January 2016 11:40)

Putin is only using Kosovo as an example of western duplicity, while it’s legal to break away Kosovo, but when the Russians do the same it somehow contravenes international law and the laws of God.
Putin is right. Crimea at least held a plebiscite whether to stay in Ukraine while Kosovo was declared independent by parliament and this was done under the auspices of that great lover of freedom and democracy, the US.

If the west does not follow norms, why should Russia?

Rote: If you read what I wrote, I made not a single criticism of Putin's policy in the Crimea. I simply stated that if he deems those actions to be acceptable he should change Russia's policy towards Kosovo. Would you accept Kosovo independence if that province held a referendum next weekend with the inevitable outcome? All your ranting about Sevastopol has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with my comment. As for Serbophilia, I have nothing against Serbs as a nation or as a people. I have a distinct problem with a number of individuals; Dodik, Seselj to name two. I am not a fan of Izetbegovic, Thaci, Dragan Covic, Lagumdzija and various others, all of whom have come in for criticism from me and none of whom is a Serb. You make the mistake that others make of thinking that if I criticise someone that you admire I must be doing so simply because I don't like them rather than because I disagree with their actions or words.

Slowly slowly - this guy is changing his mind....?
Before he always referers to the precedent. What's happening now?
If Kosovo has right why not Crimea. That's true actually- I fully support Crimea independent.

Putin's words about Kosovo would carry some weight if Russia had recognised the declaration of independence on which he bases the legitimacy of his actions in the Crimea. Russia regards the UDI as illegal so surely that applies to what they have done in the Crimea too, or am I missing something here?

icj1 supported what Putin said:

"According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination."

I believe Putin was using this as an example of "different rules for different folks"

If not, then according to you, you should have no problem with this happening:

- RS would like to break away
- N. Kosovo would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Croatia would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Montenegro would like to break away
- the Serb areas of Macedonia would like to break away
- Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away

"Comm. Parrisson

The referendum would also include 7 million Serbian citizens as Kosovo is a part of Serbia.

Nice try anyways!"
(Another Canadian Serb, 11 January 2016 14:53)


Oh, really? You mean like the famous Crimea 'referendum' which in Putin's eyes justifies the annexation included the 42 million Ukrainian citizens, as Crimea is part of Ukraine? Well, not such a good try. In football it would be called 'own goal'

P.S: Another little own goal: 7 million is not the number of citizens eligible for voting in Serbia (the 42 millions I mentioned isn't either)

I am an English man who has loved living in Serbia for the past twenty years. Should Catalonia claim independence from Spain, because of Spain's allegiance with Serbia over Kosovo, I presume the Belgrade government will not recognise an independent Catalonia.

Let's not lose sight of the big picture. This post has garnered over 70+ comments. Pro Kosovars shouldn't let Putin bother you. Who cares what Putin does? Who cares how much Putin supports Serbias position? Everyone has allies. None of this Crimea talk will change the facts on the ground which is that Kosova declared their independence after a bloody war and they run their own affairs whether it's called a state or whatever. What is also a fact is that no Chetnik soldiers will ever set foot on the territory that is called Kosova ever again. Another fact is that Serbia has deluded themselves into believing that Kosova is the cradle of their civilization. That's actually good. Why? Because they will never again control it and Albanians everywhere can ridicule and laugh in Serbians faces that they lost the cradle of their civilization:) Serbia was beat and lost their most precious land. Buahahaaaaa!

I knew it poor Russkys aliens have taken over their top leadership. Just look at the picture http://www.newanimal.org/alien_asgard_stargate.jpg and look at "Putin" do you see what I see. Just take that fake mask off the fake Putin wallah alien yap. Taking Russia nowhere good but war.

Azir : What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME. Putin is comparing apples to oranges.... Typical illogical Slav Inat Backwards Trait.....

If after such logical BS someone would clean you face then you would never open your bread slicer. As for the apples and the oranges it has always depended on how you look at them. Because the old name of orange was apelcin i.e. Chinese apple.


Amanaparts : Russia will recognise Kosovo as part of deal to loosen sanctions. Quite a start 2016!!

Russia is not trading it brothers so it cannot be a part of a deal. Find yourself other pills from panic.


Lenard : I knew it poor Russkys aliens have taken over their top leadership.

Lenard how d’you like the Nazareth ?

http://zaycev.net/pages/25373/2537371.shtml

here we are again
singing the same old songs
looking for someone
who will sing along …

"Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev. Ukraine has always been an integral part of Russia as well as Belarus whether economically or within it's borders.
(Jugoslavija, 11 January 2016 17:03)"

I'm not Albanian, but Crimea was recognized by Russia as part of Ukraine in 1991 when they recognized Ukraine's independence. They didn't object to it or protest it, they accepted it and recognized it.

Watcher : “NEGOTIATE A SOLUTION WITH BEOGRAD..this is the way forward towards lasting peace...even PUTIN would respect this.correct me if I'm wrong, Rote.”

I found not much to argue with here and I think that predicting Putin is a roulette game. But I believe that the people of the region can influence not much. All because of their pro-American elites. I believe that the solution will come from outside the Balkans when and if the US come to understand that they can do nothing about Russia and it’s time to settle things all over the world. Ony then many peoples will stop to be hostages of this US politics. Of course Serbs and Shqiptars play roles in the KIM conflict but the Shqiptars won’t move a finger before they are given a wink from the overseas. I think that best thing they both can do for the time being is not to further spoil the relations. Right now the key region of the world is the ME and in a great degree the fate of the planet is solved there. My personal opinion is that KIM have to be divided between Albania and Serbia and it cannot be a proportion of 1:20 or 1:10 if you mean to bring peace. 2016 will be the last year of agony of the late Ukraine while Moldova will join Russia as an ally state. So we’ll be neighbors again and it will refresh some hot heads in the Balkans. Russia is a better inermediator but I do not expect any drastic changes in Kosovo this year.

ned taylor : ... am I missing something here?

Of course you are ! As usual you imitate an independent view being a hidden Russophobe and Serbophobe that in fact is the same thing. Russia has absorbed not only Crimea but Sevastopol city as well. Those are two different subjects because Sevastopol has always been a separate from Crimea subject. This is why not one but two referendums were held. The results were 96% in Crimea and 98% in Sevastopol. Concerning Crimea Ukraine at least had part of the documents required while they had not a single one saying the city of Sevastopol had ever been part of this fake state. Putin as a jurist step by step followed all the formalities. Fox/BBC/CNN must have forgotten to let you know that Crimea was the only region of the former Ukraine with the right to abandon this artificial formation. It was written in the Constitution of the region while Crimea was the only region which enjoyed it own Constitution. So formally Russia has violated nothing during saving our compatriots from the Donbass type massacre. You must also be unaware that Ukraine leads a policy of blockade in Crimea cutting off the water and electricity supplies and stopping any trade. Yet the Russians on the peninsula are happy to be home again and nobody is complaining. Does it mean anything for you or your Russophobia is UBER ALLES ? Ned you need to change your nickname before you’ll be able to mislead someone here again.

Putin's words about Kosovo would carry some weight if Russia had recognised the declaration of independence on which he bases the legitimacy of his actions in the Crimea.

===

well in Kosovo there was no referendum - he says even that was considered to be legitimate by the west so why results of Crimean referendum then are not taken into account - that is what he is saying - he says Crimean decigion was MORE LEGITIMATE then that in Kosovo - so he is not obliged to recognise Kosovo independance (though one day even Serbia will be forced to recognise it and then Russia will do it too)

Speechless!
Interesting!
@ rote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xx-VvX4FtU
"I always remember the main"

The reason a "referendum" will not happen is because the "powers to be" in Pristina are wondering how many ordinary Albanians are fed up with the situation in Kosovo....how many are really thinking to themselves "hell, what are we doing? Things were much more organized under Serbia"! I understand the first reaction will be "NEVER in a million years" or " Not ONE Albanian thinks this"....but I think we all know and can actually see (Exodus from Kosovo) what reality is...The west has pretty much dropped Kosovo as the "flavor of the week" and it has become an nusiance to them..their actions on Kosovo has opened a can of worms for international order and only their pride keeps Kosovo in the news...I work with Albanians here in the US and hear first hand...these are people who want a normal life in normal circumstances...the same as Serbs or any other peoples who desire a normal life and are fed up with politicians who benefit themselves & their families...As for what happened in Kosovo in the late 90's, I also hear first hand as to what transpired before Serbia was bombed...their was an agenda planned and it worked...BOTH sides did things that borne what happened in Kosovo..Albanian extremists poked and the Serbs reacted how they did...You need "2" for a fight to happen...All this from BOTH Serbs AND Albanians..NEGOTIATE A SOLUTION WITH BEOGRAD..this is the way forward towards lasting peace...even PUTIN would respect this.correct me if I'm wrong, Rote.

@Stretan:

Kosova and Crimea Comparison?

Serbia committed Genocide,War Crimes, Crimes against Humanity in KOSOVA after a pattern of aggression in Slovenia,Croatia and Bosnia.
Go to The Hague to see the transcripts of this Criminal Enterprise AKA Greater Serbia.

Crimea might have a majority Russian enclave population but so does Brighton Beach, Brooklyn .

Can Putin Annex part of New York too?
The ethnic Russians in Crimea were abused and have half of its civilian population chased out of their homes in the dead of winter at gun point just because they weren't Ukrainians.

Crimea simply was Putin's excuse to try to show the world Russia still had some global significance by being able to antagonize world powers.

Putin's comparison to Kosova is similar to comparing an apple to an orange.....
Two different situations .....

Kosova has 110 recognitions where as Crimea has only Russia.....

Universal Democracy favors Kosova and no one supports evil Putin criminal actions ....

International Law was Not violated in Kosova's Independence Declaration BUT Russia violated it in Crimea....

BIG DIFFERANCE!

Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev.
(Jugoslavija, 11 January 2016 17:03

Maybe you illiterate Serb should also learn that you got Kosovo in 1912 in a treaty that did not consider wishes of the population. But hey go back then to 1389 and give me bla bla bla as Kosovo was Serbian bla bla bla.

So will you give back Vojvodina as well as this was never yours until Hungary lost WW1? So what that Russia gave away part of territory this is something Russians should have thought of before doing, also this is why Medvedge and Bujanovce !!!!

Even though its nut true Serbs believe that makes it yours something was taken from them 500years ie Turks again if you agree with this then just feel free to give Vojvodina back!!! If Serbs live there so what Give it back same way you ask for Kosovo - But you like double standards here.

Hungary thinks its heart of Hungary ..... sounds very similar to you asking for something that is not yours as population there does not want to be part of Serbia as population in Vojvodina does not want to be Hungary. 500years ago lets see who it belonged and many things are in hands of others now. Ie Alzas in France, Macedonia, parts of Serbia Hungary Austria etc etc catch my drift.

Putin is correct in claiming that the RF respected international law in Crimea, but he drifts from his moral bearings when he goes on to pose self determination as being the source of legitimacy in Kosovo. It was not. It was the self determination of the Serbian people in Kosovo that was carefully corrupted and subverted by shifting demographics through illegal immigration and pathological birth rate from the Albanians. Albanians claims for self determination as the legitimacy for Albanian nationalism for Kosovo is a fraud.

Yes, the unification of Crimea with the RF was just, but the claims of Albanians to Kosovo are a huge injustice.

Could the Muslims of the no-go areas of Europe legitimately claim self determination, national autonomy?

Quick dacic, a protest note

@azir
You are full of it, just google "bbc Serbia did not commit genocide in Kosovo"...also The Hague prosecution dropped the "greater Serbia" accusation against Milosevic while he was still alive...Albanians have to stop these lies...

icJ1 wrote :"Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm so sorry for those naive people who believed that Russia would put Serbia's interests over Russia's!

====

why should Russia put Serbian interests ahead of Russia's interests even if Russia is friendly towards Serbia?...I doubt it Serbia would put Russian interests ahead of its own Serbian interests, so why should Russia?...Russians sacrificed a lot during 3 wars of 1878, 1914 and 1945 for serbian cource so your doubts about brotherhood are strange...

@Stretan:

Kosova and Crimea Comparison?

Serbia committed Genocide,War Crimes, Crimes against Humanity in KOSOVA after a pattern of aggression in Slovenia,Croatia and Bosnia.
Go to The Hague to see the transcripts of this Criminal Enterprise AKA Greater Serbia.

Crimea might have a majority Russian enclave population but so does Brighton Beach, Brooklyn .

Can Putin Annex part of New York too?
The ethnic Russians in Crimea were abused and have half of its civilian population chased out of their homes in the dead of winter at gun point just because they weren't Ukraknes...

Crimea simply was Putin's excuse to try to show the world Russia still had some global significance by being able to antagonize world powers.

Putin's comparison to Kosova is similar to comparing an apple to an orange.....
Two different situations .....

Kosova has 110 recognitions where as Crimea has only Russia.....

Universal Democracy favors Kosova and no one supports evil Putin criminal actions ....

International Law was Not violated in Kosova's Independence Declaration BUT Russia violated it in Crimea....

BIG DIFFERANCE!

Putin is waking up. By the way; If Crimea could do it, so could Chechnya.

The reason a "referendum" will not happen is because the "powers to be" in Pristina are wondering how many ordinary Albanians are fed up with the situation in Kosovo....how many are really thinking to themselves "hell, what are we doing? Things were much more organized under Serbia"! I understand the first reaction will be "NEVER in a million years" or " Not ONE Albanian thinks this"....but I think we all know and can actually see (Exodus from Kosovo) what reality is...The west has pretty much dropped Kosovo as the "flavor of the week" and it has become an nusiance to them..their actions on Kosovo has opened a can of worms for international order and only their pride keeps Kosovo in the news...I work with Albanians here in the US and hear first hand...these are people who want a normal life in normal circumstances...the same as Serbs or any other peoples who desire a normal life and are fed up with politicians who benefit themselves & their families...
(Watcher, 11 January 2016 15:30)

Got it... so the referendum is not going to be held because it's possible that the majority of Kosovo's population would vote to stay under a failed state like Serbia where the best way for politicians to get votes or support from the most patriotic of Serbs in these forums is to bash the Albanians!!!

As for the so-called exodus, it is with the EU as destination, not Serbia.

Also to all the Albaniacs saying something about Vojvodina being Serb after ww1 just look up the lands Stefan Dragutin ruled independently in the 1200's...this was the century even before the word "Albanian" was first ever recorded....

Bravo Putin!
Let's recognize the will of the Crimea and it's desire to join with Russia.
And in turn Kosovo's right to independence.
Russia and Serbia = brothers.

@mystery name caller

Your language is straight from kindergarten, illiterate was put in the English dictionary to be used. The majority of those Vojvodina Serbs are Kosovo Serbs who were displaced after the battle of Kosovo In 1389 by both the Ottoman Turks and Albanians . Austro Hungary attacked Serbia I914 and lost the war, 1/3 of Serbia's population was wiped out. The treaty of Versailles tried to solve the Slav problem with partition including the Bosnian Slavs . Kosovo is the founding nation of Serbia, Rasca and Zeta and that is why it is called the land of the churches. Albania remained and grew in Kosovo as an Islamic nation in consort with the Turks and continued to force Serbs out which again accelerated in the 1980's. Croatia and Albania would not exist without the Balkan wars and World war 1 where the Serbs lost millions of lives and the Albanians did nothing, in fact, fought on the Ottoman side. Some Croats fought with the Austro-Hungarian army but a small number joined the Serbian army.

"1.5M Kosovars will be very happy about that.
40M Ukranians will not be very happy about that."

What is the point here? Some sort of, better to make fewer unhappy than more unhappy kind of nonsense?

I made my conclusion not after this one comment of yours. Serbia and Russia you would like to see again are gone into the history and the sooner you forget it the better. Be realistic to see that too much has changed. We were told that we are different form the “civilized world” that finally we saw it by ourselves. So we no longer want to be like you. We want to be like ourselves. So your round about talks that this Serbs are good and those are worse will not be accepted any longer. It’s just a cover but under your skin you are a Serbophobe and as a matter of fact a Russophobe as well. Also those poor excuses that you are not happy about the people whom you mention and if I were to decide would be hanged on the closest tree. You like everything that leads to the domination of the West while I would prefer the opposite. Everything else are just words. Despite the distance Serbs managed to save their Russian spirit that makes us invincible. If we succeed in Montenegro we’ll have a corridor to Serbia and it will change the region for better. I believe that we’ll sooner find compromise with the shqiptars than with the West. Because mentally and culturally we are closer to the shqiptars than to the brits or the dutch. You are surprised why the Arabs do not assimilate but look at yourselves and try to imagine how disgusting you must be looking for normal peoples of any civilization. And you dare to come here and teach us what is good and what is not.

Azir,

"Putin Recognizes Kosova's Independence!
But he is wrong to compare to Crimeia.
What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME. "
Can you explain why is one a crime while other one isn't?

Ned Taylor
West recognizes Kosovo's UDI as legal, so surely that applies to Crimea too, or am I missing something here?

sj,
"If the west does not follow norms, why should Russia?"
Why should anyone?
In early 90's USSR went bust, and West didn't think that International laws matter any more. They violated every rule in the book. West went wild, and today globe is Wild West. Surprise?

Comm. Parrisson,

"Yes, but this came AFTER all the crimes Serbian troops and paramilitaries committed in Kosovo, under the name of 'fighting terrorism'."

It turned out that there were several mass graves made before the bombing - with Serbs in them!
Total death toll of the conflict in Kosovo before the bombing was around 2000 - 800 Serbs, 1200 Albanians.

icj1 supported what Putin said:

"According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination."

I believe Putin was using this as an example of "different rules for different folks"

If not, then according to you, you should have no problem with this happening:

- RS would like to break away
- N. Kosovo would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Croatia would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Montenegro would like to break away
- the Serb areas of Macedonia would like to break away
- Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away
(factman, 11 January 2016 16:45)

Sure, I couldn't care less what, say, Serbs in Croatia do. I have nothing against Serbs doing whatever is best for them.

As for RS and North Kosovo breaking away, I agree that it makes total sense. The only thing is that it would be against international law: the first for violating the Dayton Agreement and the second for violating UNSCR 1244. But again, if the rest of Bosnia and Kosovo were smart, they would support the RS and North Kosovo breaking away.

if the rest of Bosnia and Kosovo were smart, they would support the RS and North Kosovo breaking away.
(icj1, 12 January 2016 01:45)
I agree with you 100% most Serbs in this forum do not see that actually their goals and Albanians can be aligned, Serbia does not know what to do with Kosovo any way. if they took RS and North ( saying adios to the churches and majoraty of Serb population south of Kosovo) Albanians get to merge in a one state and seek same in Macedonia what 1913 treaty did not do can be done.

EU does not like it so we have to deal with it.

Serbia has only solution with Kosovo as territory but nothing with population same one it failed to expel in 1999, returning Kosovo under Serbia is like giving an abused child back to abusing parent ( this is from ICJ proceedings).

As much as Serbian friends here say that they have changed they are still to this day ruled by same people ( Vucic, Dacic, Nikolic) - how can they trust them?

To not nice to name call,
I will give you the answer about Vojvodina!
1st ,Serbia has won 2 major wars from 1914 ,and Kosovo ,with Vojvodina where the spoils and rewards of war.In both League of Nations (1918),and United Nations(1945) was agreed ,with all the major countries,Twice .
The agreement of solution 1244 ,with United Nations in 1999,is why Shiptars cannot get a extra country.
When you win a War, you have to make sure what agree too,and you sign your name too.That ,you need to ask Thaci and his mates that represented Shiptars, to what did they agree too!

To the dude below who questions about Vojvodina and Kosovo.

Territory is gained in war and in treaty.

If you don't negotiate the treaty right your battlefield gains are useless.

Serbia was attacked in WW1. Austro-Hungary lost that war. The international treaties that followed legally gave Vojvodina to Serbia as Austo-Hungary was dismantled.

The Kosovo situation is different. And your leaders negotiated the treaty you got which is called 1244.

To the same dude below who wrote this:

Maybe you illiterate Serb should also learn that you got Kosovo in 1912 in a treaty that did not consider wishes of the population. But hey go back then to 1389 and give me bla bla bla as Kosovo was Serbian bla bla bla.

####

At that time, you had no country or representatives to even negotiate with.

You had no organization.

No republic.

No territory.

No autonomy.

No country.

No government.

No parliament.

No local councils.

No backing from powerful friends.

So why would anyone even consider your opinions let alone give you territory? Why would you have a seat at the table?

Serbia was an internationally recognized country running an independent international foreign policy.

You can't compare these two different situations.

don't you all see the writing on the wall? Part of the reconciliation between the East and the West will be that the West somehow accepts Russias claims on the Crimia pininsula and Russia will stop supporting Serbia's claim on Kosovo.

#####

1.5M Kosovars will be very happy about that.

40M Ukranians will not be very happy about that.

If the Serbs had done their killing in Croatia, Bosnia, and Kosovo quietly with no pompous attitude they would have gotten away with it. But they had to be vocal and advertise to the world and made a military response the only option. As Teddy Roosevelt once said. Speak softly and carry a big stick.
(Steve Powell, 12 January 2016 15:55)

Actually, the complete opposite happened, the Bosnian Muslims broke every agreement from the Cutilero to the Vance Owen/Vance Stoltenberg plans because the US stoked the fans of war by instructing Izetbegovic not to sign agreements. Part of that blame is squarely on the Bosnian Serb and RSK leadership which also failed to approve peace plans during the civil war.

The only reasonable negotiator was Milosevic which led to the Dayton accord with essentially allowing RSK to fall into Croatian hands. What many historians forget is the Milosevic is more of a Communist than a nationalist who's only concern was to seize and maintain power like his mentors Stambolic and Tito.

icj1 : Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm curious if Ivica will send a note of protest to Russia ...

No they were waiting for a shqiptar to come and open their eyes ! So now your “dear Serbian friends” will grant you whatever you ask and forget about their blood their belief and their history ! And of course Ivica will beat Lavrov at their first meeting. Now that you’ve opened his eyes on those Russians …

Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev. Ukraine has always been an integral part of Russia as well as Belarus whether economically or within it's borders.

Russian hypocrisy at its best. Let's revisit the facts.
Before Kosovo declared independence Russia claimed that the will of Kosovo Albanians for independence didn't matter.Russia at that time was part of a troika of three envoys that held talks on Kosovo's future status(the envoys were Frank Wisner from the United States, Alexandar Botsan-Kharchenko from Russia and German Wolfgang Ischinger for the EU).The talks started after the UN envoy the Norwegian diplomat Kai Eide recommended in his report to Kofi Annan that it was time for Kosovo's status to be settled. During the whole process Russia was involved and had a saying. In 2008 Kosovo declared independence, Russia to this day still does not recognize Kosovo. In 2008 Russia recognized S. Ossetia as independent by bypassing UN and all the international mechanisms and processes that Kosovo had gone through by simply stating that S. Ossetia had more rights to be independent then Kosovo. Then after the annexation of Crimea, Russia recognized the will of the Russian Crimeans for independence yet again without allowing any of the international factors to get involved.

Like a fine chess game, Czar Vlade you are the King!!! Every body just relax and sit back, nothing less than God alone can change what has been placed into motion by Satan on March 24, 1999!!! Russia and God a combination that will carry the world into the next era!!! Any Serbian people out there any where who wish to betray Russia then better you never been born!!! God Bless Czar Vlade and God Bless Russia!!!

What are you mumbling about, learn how to speak English if you want a response. Albanians with a English as a second language speak better than you, your parents must be really proud of you.
(Jugoslavija, 12 January 2016 01:10)
Not sure what you did not like about my writing but hey please answer why is Vojvodina Serbian but Kosovo can not be Albanian.
As for my Parents they are very very proud and I work in Fortune 100 seems to work just fine for me :) Maybe your parents are the ones dropped the ball in not teaching you a kindergarten principle of no name calling.

You as a Serb please answer a simple question demographics of Vojvodina have changed since you took over Serbs from all over moved there, removing Germans, Hungarians, Croats ... becoming majority today its Serbian.

Now again for you even if ( not true by world historians) your Serb theory that Albanians moved to Kosovo is true by the same analysis of Vojvodina belonging to Serbia is equates to Kosovo Belonging to Albanians.

Now relax this is a blog not a scientific paper!!! And if you have a true answer please feel fee to debate away if not got to local kindergarten and learn a simple principle.

Comm. Parrisson

The referendum would also include 7 million Serbian citizens as Kosovo is a part of Serbia.

Nice try anyways!

Comm : Another question is: Would Russia accept Kosovo's independence with a referendum? The outcome of that is obvious.

One cannot enter the same water twice and referendum today would be different from a referendum in 1999. No one thinks that the Serbs dream of a nightmare when the 2 million shqiptars be back. They care their own lands only so in the circumstances one can talk about the division of the lands only. Shqptars are chain dogs of the Yankees and we saw it in Macedonia few months ago. So before any progress is to be expected the Russians should have a general deal with the USA. Only then Serbs and shqiptars can go to the details. Without Serbian approval Russia won’t move a finger.

@ watcher
Dream on sasa.p.... - watcher!
��

P.S: Another little own goal: 7 million is not the number of citizens eligible for voting in Serbia (the 42 millions I mentioned isn't either)
(Comm. Parrisson, 11 January 2016 17:26)
==================================
The point is that the rest of the country wasn't asked so if they didn't ask the whole of Serbia (with Kosovo included) to vote, why should they ask the whole of Ukraine? Same as RS. why ask the rest of BIH?
Kosovo started all this you know. Once only Albanians had a say in Kosovo, it paved the way for all the rest. What, only the US can apply double standards?

Paul

There are no Muslim No-Go Areas in Europe. What are you even talking about?!

Also to all the Albaniacs saying something about Vojvodina being Serb after ww1 just look up the lands Stefan Dragutin ruled independently in the 1200's...this was the century even before the word "Albanian" was first ever recorded
(Bishop, 12 January 2016 04:01)
Not sure what that means 1200 so makes it yours? How about 450 Atila the Hun was ruling all the way down to Nis are you preparing to give this to Hungarians?

This is the double standard of Serbia it has different rules for everyone and some very special for themselves. Just because you ruled a land in 1200, 1300 etc does not make it yours if you lost it in a battle or treaty. When you won with alies WWI you got Vojvodina and Kosovo. When you lost war in Croatia you lost Krahinja and then in 1999 you lost the war to NATO so you lost Kosovo.

No need for Kuku majko for something you lost, but cherish the things you won; Germany has lost territory but you dont see them saying about parts of Poland are theirs, or Parts of France they keep progressing along. But you know Patriotism and historical myths are favourite antidote for poverty and lagging in the same region you once were shining.

Serbs had it the best during Yugoslavia, and even today Dacic says how Tito is best ambasador for Serbia where they go to Africa and present themselves as Yugoslav just changed the name and try to follow in his shadow.

Greetings. People forget the context of the NATO intervention. Europe wanted nothing to do with the Serbian response of the breakup of the former Yugoslavia. The Serbian Nationalist like tyrants do interpreted a lack of response as weakness and continued their aggression. Enter Bill Clinton. He had been accused of not intervening in Rwanda. I'm sure the Croats committed their share of atrocities. But winning gives you so much more opportunity and a number of notorious events occurred where Serbian Nationalist made NATO peace keepers appear incompetent. And then they laughed and sang their Nationalist folk songs. NATO still might not have done anything but Clinton was being humiliated by his naysayers. He pretty much dragged NATO kicking and screaming justifying that a war in central Europe was against their strategic interests. The event became a political issue and Clinton had to intervene to keep the military hawks at bay.

If the Serbs had done their killing in Croatia, Bosnia, and Kosovo quietly with no pompous attitude they would have gotten away with it. But they had to be vocal and advertise to the world and made a military response the only option. As Teddy Roosevelt once said. Speak softly and carry a big stick.

1st ,Serbia has won 2 major wars from 1914 ,and Kosovo ,with Vojvodina where the spoils and rewards of war.In both League of Nations (1918),and United Nations(1945) was agreed ,with all the major countries,Twice .
The agreement of solution 1244 ,with United Nations in 1999,is why Shiptars cannot get a extra country.
When you win a War, you have to make sure what agree too,and you sign your name too.That ,you need to ask Thaci and his mates that represented Shiptars, to what did they agree too!
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 15:02)

Sasa we also won the war in 1999 with help of NATO hence no Serbian military or police capitulation Kumanovo agreement. Not sure what else you do when you loose a war you withdraw I have been many times to Kosovo i never see Serbian MUP.

So hence, you won WWI and WWII mainly being part of right alliance not due to your might just like Albanians. So now hence u lost 1999 war and you lost Kosovo which is accepted by 111 countries which majority of countries this is why Serbs now talk about majority population.

No police no Government agreement just like 2 Germanies but Albanians never want to come back. Best case is you one day get north best case but might loose some other part for now u lost.

Either WW war u would never have won without help so think about it.

Posi Mo -

If I was sasa p, I would tell you I was sasa p. But I am not sasa p, I am Watcher. Sasa p has his own thoughts and he doesn't need mine & I don't need his.
Please rest assured, I never will try to confuse you or anyone...I will tell you EXACTLY how & what I think..."let your yay be yay and your nay, nay"...thus sayeth our Lord!
that much we should be able to agree on...Serb or Albanian!
Anyways, why do you say Dream on? Your own people are saying this! It's not a Pro Serb or antiAlbanian opinion...it's people who live life day to day in the real world...

don't you all see the writing on the wall? Part of the reconciliation between the East and the West will be that the West somehow accepts Russias claims on the Crimia pininsula and Russia will stop supporting Serbia's claim on Kosovo.

To posi mo,
I don't even leave any message,and still get under your skin!

As for what Putin has said, this pretty much confirms what anyone with half a functioning brain cell has always known, if it comes to choosing between Crimea and defending holy Kosmet for the heavenly people, Russia will go for Crimea any time of the day. If the West was to suddenly go you recognise Kosovo and we'll recognise Crimea, all that apparent connection that Serbs think exists between mother Russia and Serbia will be count for nothing. You can still pay homage to the great Tsar however, that you can keep for amusement
(Nikolle, 11 January 2016 17:44
====================================
What makes you think they will have to choose?
This world is changing rapidly and maybe borders will be drawn everywhere, this time to stay for a very long time. Now just how they will be drawn may not be the way you or I think. There might even be a third solution. I doubt Russia will leave Serbs dangling.

Tsar Vladimir double standards in regards to Crimea and Kosovo are despicable. Russia refuses to recognize Kosovo supposedly because the independence came thru an act of parliament and not via a referendum, though Russia itself became independent state from Soviet Union without a referendum, but thru an act of Russian parliament. In fact Kosovo had a referendum for independence way before Russia became an independent state.
He compares Crimea to Kosovo, yet he rejects the idea that kosovars are separate people, but somehow crimeans are separate people deserving the right of self determination.
Mr.Putin you are a self righteous thug and nothing else. I feel sorry for Russian people that have to endure your disastrous autocratic rule. Once a KGB man, always a thug!

Just as expected, Putin's support of Serbia against Kosova is just a bargaining chip for what he really wants: Western acknowledgment of Crimea's occupation. What Putin doesn't realize is that Kosovo was created to save the population from genocide, which is not what happened in Crimea.

@sumar
what are you rambling on about? again i am still waiting - name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? you can not as they don't exist!

as mentioned during stefan dragutin's time serbs were majority in vojvodina (1200s), years before the word "Albanian" was ever even used for the first time.

you also mention some invented "genocide" the serbs committed against Albanian Nazi German allies from ww2 (we all know who the "SS Skenderbeg" Albanian Muslim unit was, ISIS was inspired by them)...

more albanian lies just like the "genocide" in kosovo from 1999...you claimed 500,000 were killed and all one has to do is google the BBC article from Sept 7th 2001 which said the UN stated "no genocide occurred in Kosovo"; http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1530781.stm

the only genocide that has taken place in kosovo is the killings and ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands of serbs since the late 1800s when the Albaniacs kicked out over 400k Serbs...just google "demographic history of kosovo"...you can not debate me as the genocide against the serbs continues to this day...

the only genocide that has taken place in kosovo is the killings and ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands of serbs since the late 1800s when the Albaniacs kicked out over 400k Serbs...just google "demographic history of kosovo"...you can not debate me as the genocide against the serbs continues to this day...
(bishop, 15 January 2016 05:35)

Who is(are) the individual(s) that committed genocide in Kosovo?! Please provide the court and the date in which said court made such a determination. "Google" is not a court and a certain "bishop" is not a court either!

You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 22:36)

Indeed, they never signed Serbia's version of UNSCR 1244 which says "that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory" so there is no point asking them about something they did not sign, but if you want to waste your time, feel free to ask them!

Ie Alzas in France, Macedonia, parts of Serbia Hungary Austria etc etc catch my drift.
(Not nice to name call, 11 January 2016 20:21) # Comment link

What are you mumbling about, learn how to speak English if you want a response. Albanians with a English as a second language speak better than you, your parents must be really proud of you.

To
Serbia lost 1999 war,
Why are you asking me?
You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
Again ask your Shiptar leader,why,WHY sign that paper to UN.
Now they need Russia and China ,to agree to your Pristina demands,or Belgrade.
Again ask your leader's, their still hanging around in Pristinas Office.Not your office ,since you are not living in the Balkans!
P's, I visit Pristina, Pec, Tirana, and Durres, alot more than your holiday's.

So hence, you won WWI and WWII mainly being part of right alliance not due to your might just like Albanians.
(Serbia Lost 1999 WAR, 12 January 2016 20:56)


Not even close, little Serbia repelled Austro-Hungary 3 times over the Sava River during WWI at the end of 1914 in the Battle of Cer and Kolobura. It took the Germans, Austro-Hungarians and the Bulgarians to subdue the Serbian army in 1915. The Albanians did one favor to the Serbian army, they allowed access through Albania where the Serb army was subject to countless attacks by the Albanian hordes. However, the Serbian army regrouped in the Salonika front and rolled over the Bulgarians who capitulated followed by the Austro-Hungarians and Germany who capitulated as Serbia marched back to Belgrade which was relieved. http://spartacus-educational.com/FWWserbiaA.htm

Albania has never fought or won a war! Where was Albania during the Balkan wars and World War I? Where was Albania in WWII? Declaring war on the US and then trying to invade Greece with Italy where again they took heavy losses and the Germans had to send troops to both Yugoslavia and Greece!!

The Albanians have shown countless times to be worthless soldiers.

@sumar
You are a a fool to mention a conquering ruler like Attila who came to a land to occupy it...the 1200s were just an example That shows a long presence of Serbs in Vojvodina (were a majority) long befor Albanians were brought to the Balkans and before the word Albanian existed....as for the typical Albanian response to this about being "Illyrian" I wish to ask you one question; can you name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? Name just one...you can't
(Bishop, 13 January 2016 05:27)

When you speak like this shows exatlly what you are ignorant, If you want to look about Albanian people look at their language and that will show you the truth if you open your yes how long they bee there, much longer than you in 7 century. My point is that no one cares who owned something in Balkans in 1200 or 450 as land here has changed hands many many times. Albanians have been in Balkans longer than you but all the books that show you that you dispute as Western propaganda.

Again no one cares who been there before you took Vojvodina in 1918 today you have ethnically cleansed it moving Germand, Croats etc out, but do not want to return.

to Sasa:

Serbs moved to Vojvodina as its better land and it was given free after Germans were displaced its easy and simple to research.

You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 22:36)

How is that working for you, where is Serbian Police returning to Kosovo as in 1244 and why are your leaders quiet and never talk about it.1244 was there not to put boots on the ground with fighting face-saving for Milosevic, Serbia will sign a two Germany type agreement before entering EU.

Do you realistically believe that Kosovo will ever be a part of Serbia, in my opinion that will be a day of mourning for Serbia. Serbia's only plan is Kosovo without Albanians.

We shall see what future brings, but Kosovo is entering 17th year away from Serbian dominance, and population that spoke Serbian (K-Albanians) is slowly disappearing making the link much more harder.

Road to EU is paved with letting Kosovo go with dignity signing agreement of 2 Germanies this is already in process with liaison office.

Just as expected, Putin's support of Serbia against Kosova is just a bargaining chip for what he really wants: Western acknowledgment of Crimea's occupation.

#####

So I guess that means you need to convince Washington to accept the Crimean situation as it currently is.

Good luck.

@icj
typical albanian logic - google and wikipedia are only "good" when you read pro albanian garbage and everything else is a "lie" right? albanian genocidal ss division maniacs never existed; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21st_Waffen_Mountain_Division_of_the_SS_Skanderbeg

During the Second World War, Kosovo was annexed into a Greater Albania under fascist rule. There ensued an exodus of 100,000 Serbs while over 10,000 were killed by Albanians. Carlo Umiltà, an aide to the leader of the Italian military forces in Kosovo, recounted that Albanians were out to exterminate all Serbs and told of several events where horrified Italian troops were forced to fire on their Albanian allies to halt massacres of Serbs. Tito did not allow these Serbs to return to Kosovo.

Here are just a few names of genocidal Nazi Albanians to look up (there is not enough space in a book to list the murdering Ottoman Albanian Muslim foot soldiers that fought for Istanbul and cleansed 400,000 serbs in the 1800s);
-Nazir Hodic SS leader
-Xhafer Deva, Kosovo Albanian Muslim interior minister of the Nazi-created Greater Albania
-Gjon Marka Gjoni, the fascist leader of the Albanian Roman Catholics etc

all one needs to do is look up "demographic history of kosovo" to get an idea of the long term genocide. serbs were forced out or killed from the land there were a dominant majority until the late 1800s...

None of them Nikolle, as long as the non-Greek behave in the proper way they always did. I would stop wondering in foreign pages and would mind my own business, if I were you. Otherwise, you know the saying, figures don't mean anything when it comes to Orthos. It wouldn't be the first time Orthos would end up kicking the majority's asses in the Balkans. For the esteemed colleagues, instead, here is what I just told to a German magazine re Putin's interview: Well, I think what Mr. Vladimir Vladimirovic exactly meant to say is that actually Krim returned to where it always belonged, that is - mainland Russia. In addition, given Kosovo's precedent and the corresponding ICJ advisory opinion, Ukraine will never dare to bring Krim's case before the ICJ itself... of course, he went on saying, we have nothing against the Albanians as such, as long as they are being fair with the Greeks and their neighbors in general, and with each other....and who knows, never say never, one day we can be best friends and recognize their legitimate claims :)

Sasa we also won the war in 1999 with help of NATO hence no Serbian military or police capitulation Kumanovo agreement. Not sure what else you do when you loose a war you withdraw I have been many times to Kosovo i never see Serbian MUP.
(Serbia Lost 1999 WAR, 12 January 2016 20:56)

Albania has never fought or won any war, you can't even field a proper army.
No UCK or ALbanian army remained in Kosovo-Metohia , the insurgency was crushed by the Serbian army. The UCK and KLA was allowed back in by KFOR in direct contradiction of UN resolution 1244 resulting in more Serbs being ethically cleansed without protection of it's citizens as KFOR blindly did not offer any security.

@sumar
You are a a fool to mention a conquering ruler like Attila who came to a land to occupy it...the 1200s were just an example That shows a long presence of Serbs in Vojvodina (were a majority) long befor Albanians were brought to the Balkans and before the word Albanian existed....as for the typical Albanian response to this about being "Illyrian" I wish to ask you one question; can you name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? Name just one...you can't

To wake up,
It's not 2 Germany's, like you write,but I will give you a country called Cyprus, that would be very similar to the problem's ,that Serbia has,with same history and similar situation at present.
I give you Albanian's an realistic opportunity to came to a solution, that will meet both parties (Belgrade, Pristina) happy!.
Please don't give me bull stories, like "you can't be a half pregnant" and we where under Serb rule ( You where under Yugoslav rule and Communist's TITO,and Milosevic rule) Leave that peasants say's, else where.
At present situation, Serbia is moving forward, and even in Novi Pazar is moving forward ,with hositals and school just completed. Serbia investor's in the last 6 month's are arriving ,with countries alist,Cuba,Argentina, Brazil, Japan,China,Vietnam, South Korea, UAE,Iran,Kazakhstan, Belarus, Russia, ,EU countries, and even USA.
If a solution can't be found,than that suits Serbia fine at present situation.Serbia is progressing economic fast,( That I am shock).While Albania and Pristina are at snail pace.
Again I say,please don't give peasantry and village explaining 's, Give me a realistic solution that will work ,like I gave everyone (Cyprus).
P's Don't forget ,Cyprus ( Russian owned) has a vote.

Putin Recognizes Kosova's Independence!

But he is wrong to compare to Crimeia.

What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME.

Putin is comparing apples to oranges....

Typical illogical Slav Inat Backwards Trait.....getting them no where!

Comm. Parrisson

The referendum would also include 7 million Serbian citizens as Kosovo is a part of Serbia.

Nice try anyways!

Comm : Another question is: Would Russia accept Kosovo's independence with a referendum? The outcome of that is obvious.

One cannot enter the same water twice and referendum today would be different from a referendum in 1999. No one thinks that the Serbs dream of a nightmare when the 2 million shqiptars be back. They care their own lands only so in the circumstances one can talk about the division of the lands only. Shqptars are chain dogs of the Yankees and we saw it in Macedonia few months ago. So before any progress is to be expected the Russians should have a general deal with the USA. Only then Serbs and shqiptars can go to the details. Without Serbian approval Russia won’t move a finger.

We have not gone to war, we have not fired, not a single person was killed. Our soldiers have merely prevented the Ukrainian troops on Crimea from impeding the freedom of expression of the people. In the referendum - which was still decided to take place by the Crimea’s old parliament - the majority of citizens voted for belonging to Russia. This is democracy, the people’s will, he said.

When asked what about international law," Putin responded: "Of course one always has to follow international law. This was also the case in Crimea. According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination. Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. You can read that in all the records, also in the German ones.

Kosovo declared independence and the whole world accepted it, but what was the cause for that? It was a decision of (Kosovo's) parliament. They didn't even hold a referendum," Putin has been quoted as saying.

V. Putin, you have just basically recognized a Independent & sovereign Republic of Kosova!
And let me just remind u Mr Putin, that the people of Kosova did hold a legitimate referendum in 1991
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovan_independence_referendum,_1991
Now, Kosova and Albania should also organize another referendum, on the reunification of The republic of Kosova with Albania!!! Its time!

icj1 supported what Putin said:

"According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination."

I believe Putin was using this as an example of "different rules for different folks"

If not, then according to you, you should have no problem with this happening:

- RS would like to break away
- N. Kosovo would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Croatia would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Montenegro would like to break away
- the Serb areas of Macedonia would like to break away
- Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away

Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev. Ukraine has always been an integral part of Russia as well as Belarus whether economically or within it's borders.

Well, B92, your citing was a little shaky and you modified some of Putins comments to not hurt some readers feelings too much but all in all, you got it.

Putin has declared that Kosovo independence is legit and in accordance with UN charta. Time walk the talk Putin. My Prediction for 2016, Russia will recognise Kosovo as part of deal to loosen sanctions. Quite a start 2016!!

(ned taylor, 11 January 2016 11:40)

Putin is only using Kosovo as an example of western duplicity, while it’s legal to break away Kosovo, but when the Russians do the same it somehow contravenes international law and the laws of God.
Putin is right. Crimea at least held a plebiscite whether to stay in Ukraine while Kosovo was declared independent by parliament and this was done under the auspices of that great lover of freedom and democracy, the US.

If the west does not follow norms, why should Russia?

Putin is correct in claiming that the RF respected international law in Crimea, but he drifts from his moral bearings when he goes on to pose self determination as being the source of legitimacy in Kosovo. It was not. It was the self determination of the Serbian people in Kosovo that was carefully corrupted and subverted by shifting demographics through illegal immigration and pathological birth rate from the Albanians. Albanians claims for self determination as the legitimacy for Albanian nationalism for Kosovo is a fraud.

Yes, the unification of Crimea with the RF was just, but the claims of Albanians to Kosovo are a huge injustice.

Could the Muslims of the no-go areas of Europe legitimately claim self determination, national autonomy?

@azir
You are full of it, just google "bbc Serbia did not commit genocide in Kosovo"...also The Hague prosecution dropped the "greater Serbia" accusation against Milosevic while he was still alive...Albanians have to stop these lies...

I knew it poor Russkys aliens have taken over their top leadership. Just look at the picture http://www.newanimal.org/alien_asgard_stargate.jpg and look at "Putin" do you see what I see. Just take that fake mask off the fake Putin wallah alien yap. Taking Russia nowhere good but war.

Azir : What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME. Putin is comparing apples to oranges.... Typical illogical Slav Inat Backwards Trait.....

If after such logical BS someone would clean you face then you would never open your bread slicer. As for the apples and the oranges it has always depended on how you look at them. Because the old name of orange was apelcin i.e. Chinese apple.


Amanaparts : Russia will recognise Kosovo as part of deal to loosen sanctions. Quite a start 2016!!

Russia is not trading it brothers so it cannot be a part of a deal. Find yourself other pills from panic.


Lenard : I knew it poor Russkys aliens have taken over their top leadership.

Lenard how d’you like the Nazareth ?

http://zaycev.net/pages/25373/2537371.shtml

here we are again
singing the same old songs
looking for someone
who will sing along …

Azir,

"Putin Recognizes Kosova's Independence!
But he is wrong to compare to Crimeia.
What Russia did in Crimeiais a CRIME. "
Can you explain why is one a crime while other one isn't?

Ned Taylor
West recognizes Kosovo's UDI as legal, so surely that applies to Crimea too, or am I missing something here?

sj,
"If the west does not follow norms, why should Russia?"
Why should anyone?
In early 90's USSR went bust, and West didn't think that International laws matter any more. They violated every rule in the book. West went wild, and today globe is Wild West. Surprise?

Comm. Parrisson,

"Yes, but this came AFTER all the crimes Serbian troops and paramilitaries committed in Kosovo, under the name of 'fighting terrorism'."

It turned out that there were several mass graves made before the bombing - with Serbs in them!
Total death toll of the conflict in Kosovo before the bombing was around 2000 - 800 Serbs, 1200 Albanians.

Then Mr. Putin u should support kosovo's independence... so you are exercising double standards not just the west..

ned taylor : ... am I missing something here?

Of course you are ! As usual you imitate an independent view being a hidden Russophobe and Serbophobe that in fact is the same thing. Russia has absorbed not only Crimea but Sevastopol city as well. Those are two different subjects because Sevastopol has always been a separate from Crimea subject. This is why not one but two referendums were held. The results were 96% in Crimea and 98% in Sevastopol. Concerning Crimea Ukraine at least had part of the documents required while they had not a single one saying the city of Sevastopol had ever been part of this fake state. Putin as a jurist step by step followed all the formalities. Fox/BBC/CNN must have forgotten to let you know that Crimea was the only region of the former Ukraine with the right to abandon this artificial formation. It was written in the Constitution of the region while Crimea was the only region which enjoyed it own Constitution. So formally Russia has violated nothing during saving our compatriots from the Donbass type massacre. You must also be unaware that Ukraine leads a policy of blockade in Crimea cutting off the water and electricity supplies and stopping any trade. Yet the Russians on the peninsula are happy to be home again and nobody is complaining. Does it mean anything for you or your Russophobia is UBER ALLES ? Ned you need to change your nickname before you’ll be able to mislead someone here again.

To the same dude below who wrote this:

Maybe you illiterate Serb should also learn that you got Kosovo in 1912 in a treaty that did not consider wishes of the population. But hey go back then to 1389 and give me bla bla bla as Kosovo was Serbian bla bla bla.

####

At that time, you had no country or representatives to even negotiate with.

You had no organization.

No republic.

No territory.

No autonomy.

No country.

No government.

No parliament.

No local councils.

No backing from powerful friends.

So why would anyone even consider your opinions let alone give you territory? Why would you have a seat at the table?

Serbia was an internationally recognized country running an independent international foreign policy.

You can't compare these two different situations.

Putin's words about Kosovo would carry some weight if Russia had recognised the declaration of independence on which he bases the legitimacy of his actions in the Crimea. Russia regards the UDI as illegal so surely that applies to what they have done in the Crimea too, or am I missing something here?

@Stretan:

Kosova and Crimea Comparison?

Serbia committed Genocide,War Crimes, Crimes against Humanity in KOSOVA after a pattern of aggression in Slovenia,Croatia and Bosnia.
Go to The Hague to see the transcripts of this Criminal Enterprise AKA Greater Serbia.

Crimea might have a majority Russian enclave population but so does Brighton Beach, Brooklyn .

Can Putin Annex part of New York too?
The ethnic Russians in Crimea were abused and have half of its civilian population chased out of their homes in the dead of winter at gun point just because they weren't Ukrainians.

Crimea simply was Putin's excuse to try to show the world Russia still had some global significance by being able to antagonize world powers.

Putin's comparison to Kosova is similar to comparing an apple to an orange.....
Two different situations .....

Kosova has 110 recognitions where as Crimea has only Russia.....

Universal Democracy favors Kosova and no one supports evil Putin criminal actions ....

International Law was Not violated in Kosova's Independence Declaration BUT Russia violated it in Crimea....

BIG DIFFERANCE!

As for what Putin has said, this pretty much confirms what anyone with half a functioning brain cell has always known, if it comes to choosing between Crimea and defending holy Kosmet for the heavenly people, Russia will go for Crimea any time of the day. If the West was to suddenly go you recognise Kosovo and we'll recognise Crimea, all that apparent connection that Serbs think exists between mother Russia and Serbia will be count for nothing. You can still pay homage to the great Tsar however, that you can keep for amusement
(Nikolle, 11 January 2016 17:44
====================================
What makes you think they will have to choose?
This world is changing rapidly and maybe borders will be drawn everywhere, this time to stay for a very long time. Now just how they will be drawn may not be the way you or I think. There might even be a third solution. I doubt Russia will leave Serbs dangling.

I made my conclusion not after this one comment of yours. Serbia and Russia you would like to see again are gone into the history and the sooner you forget it the better. Be realistic to see that too much has changed. We were told that we are different form the “civilized world” that finally we saw it by ourselves. So we no longer want to be like you. We want to be like ourselves. So your round about talks that this Serbs are good and those are worse will not be accepted any longer. It’s just a cover but under your skin you are a Serbophobe and as a matter of fact a Russophobe as well. Also those poor excuses that you are not happy about the people whom you mention and if I were to decide would be hanged on the closest tree. You like everything that leads to the domination of the West while I would prefer the opposite. Everything else are just words. Despite the distance Serbs managed to save their Russian spirit that makes us invincible. If we succeed in Montenegro we’ll have a corridor to Serbia and it will change the region for better. I believe that we’ll sooner find compromise with the shqiptars than with the West. Because mentally and culturally we are closer to the shqiptars than to the brits or the dutch. You are surprised why the Arabs do not assimilate but look at yourselves and try to imagine how disgusting you must be looking for normal peoples of any civilization. And you dare to come here and teach us what is good and what is not.

icj1 : Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm curious if Ivica will send a note of protest to Russia ...

No they were waiting for a shqiptar to come and open their eyes ! So now your “dear Serbian friends” will grant you whatever you ask and forget about their blood their belief and their history ! And of course Ivica will beat Lavrov at their first meeting. Now that you’ve opened his eyes on those Russians …

P.S: Another little own goal: 7 million is not the number of citizens eligible for voting in Serbia (the 42 millions I mentioned isn't either)
(Comm. Parrisson, 11 January 2016 17:26)
==================================
The point is that the rest of the country wasn't asked so if they didn't ask the whole of Serbia (with Kosovo included) to vote, why should they ask the whole of Ukraine? Same as RS. why ask the rest of BIH?
Kosovo started all this you know. Once only Albanians had a say in Kosovo, it paved the way for all the rest. What, only the US can apply double standards?

Also to all the Albaniacs saying something about Vojvodina being Serb after ww1 just look up the lands Stefan Dragutin ruled independently in the 1200's...this was the century even before the word "Albanian" was first ever recorded....

Putin's words about Kosovo would carry some weight if Russia had recognised the declaration of independence on which he bases the legitimacy of his actions in the Crimea.

===

well in Kosovo there was no referendum - he says even that was considered to be legitimate by the west so why results of Crimean referendum then are not taken into account - that is what he is saying - he says Crimean decigion was MORE LEGITIMATE then that in Kosovo - so he is not obliged to recognise Kosovo independance (though one day even Serbia will be forced to recognise it and then Russia will do it too)

The reason a "referendum" will not happen is because the "powers to be" in Pristina are wondering how many ordinary Albanians are fed up with the situation in Kosovo....how many are really thinking to themselves "hell, what are we doing? Things were much more organized under Serbia"! I understand the first reaction will be "NEVER in a million years" or " Not ONE Albanian thinks this"....but I think we all know and can actually see (Exodus from Kosovo) what reality is...The west has pretty much dropped Kosovo as the "flavor of the week" and it has become an nusiance to them..their actions on Kosovo has opened a can of worms for international order and only their pride keeps Kosovo in the news...I work with Albanians here in the US and hear first hand...these are people who want a normal life in normal circumstances...the same as Serbs or any other peoples who desire a normal life and are fed up with politicians who benefit themselves & their families...As for what happened in Kosovo in the late 90's, I also hear first hand as to what transpired before Serbia was bombed...their was an agenda planned and it worked...BOTH sides did things that borne what happened in Kosovo..Albanian extremists poked and the Serbs reacted how they did...You need "2" for a fight to happen...All this from BOTH Serbs AND Albanians..NEGOTIATE A SOLUTION WITH BEOGRAD..this is the way forward towards lasting peace...even PUTIN would respect this.correct me if I'm wrong, Rote.

Watcher : “NEGOTIATE A SOLUTION WITH BEOGRAD..this is the way forward towards lasting peace...even PUTIN would respect this.correct me if I'm wrong, Rote.”

I found not much to argue with here and I think that predicting Putin is a roulette game. But I believe that the people of the region can influence not much. All because of their pro-American elites. I believe that the solution will come from outside the Balkans when and if the US come to understand that they can do nothing about Russia and it’s time to settle things all over the world. Ony then many peoples will stop to be hostages of this US politics. Of course Serbs and Shqiptars play roles in the KIM conflict but the Shqiptars won’t move a finger before they are given a wink from the overseas. I think that best thing they both can do for the time being is not to further spoil the relations. Right now the key region of the world is the ME and in a great degree the fate of the planet is solved there. My personal opinion is that KIM have to be divided between Albania and Serbia and it cannot be a proportion of 1:20 or 1:10 if you mean to bring peace. 2016 will be the last year of agony of the late Ukraine while Moldova will join Russia as an ally state. So we’ll be neighbors again and it will refresh some hot heads in the Balkans. Russia is a better inermediator but I do not expect any drastic changes in Kosovo this year.

To the dude below who questions about Vojvodina and Kosovo.

Territory is gained in war and in treaty.

If you don't negotiate the treaty right your battlefield gains are useless.

Serbia was attacked in WW1. Austro-Hungary lost that war. The international treaties that followed legally gave Vojvodina to Serbia as Austo-Hungary was dismantled.

The Kosovo situation is different. And your leaders negotiated the treaty you got which is called 1244.

Putin responded: "Of course one always has to follow international law. This was also the case in Crimea. According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination. Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. You can read that in all the records, also in the German ones."

Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm so sorry for those naive people who believed that Russia would put Serbia's interests over Russia's!

I'm curious if Ivica will send a note of protest to Russia now to tell Russia that "UN bodies have not decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia".

"Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away"

who is stopping them? I have to say, I've always wondered about the Greek community in Southern Albania. Apparently, from what I read here, they make up a total figure of around 300K and are grotesquely discriminated against. Yet, I've always been surprised that they don't go out to protest against such an obvious injustice. Why on earth do they put up with it? Could it be that 1) they are not discriminated against and as such, have no reason to seek separation, 2) their numbers are so tiny so as to almost be negligible and any kind of attempt at separation is not worth anyone's time and would in fact be comical(not that this would make their grievances any less relevant, should they be suffering them) or 3) they enjoy being part of Albania? I am just curios as to which of these you think it is.

As for what Putin has said, this pretty much confirms what anyone with half a functioning brain cell has always known, if it comes to choosing between Crimea and defending holy Kosmet for the heavenly people, Russia will go for Crimea any time of the day. If the West was to suddenly go you recognise Kosovo and we'll recognise Crimea, all that apparent connection that Serbs think exists between mother Russia and Serbia will be count for nothing. You can still pay homage to the great Tsar however, that you can keep for amusement

Ie Alzas in France, Macedonia, parts of Serbia Hungary Austria etc etc catch my drift.
(Not nice to name call, 11 January 2016 20:21) # Comment link

What are you mumbling about, learn how to speak English if you want a response. Albanians with a English as a second language speak better than you, your parents must be really proud of you.

To not nice to name call,
I will give you the answer about Vojvodina!
1st ,Serbia has won 2 major wars from 1914 ,and Kosovo ,with Vojvodina where the spoils and rewards of war.In both League of Nations (1918),and United Nations(1945) was agreed ,with all the major countries,Twice .
The agreement of solution 1244 ,with United Nations in 1999,is why Shiptars cannot get a extra country.
When you win a War, you have to make sure what agree too,and you sign your name too.That ,you need to ask Thaci and his mates that represented Shiptars, to what did they agree too!

"Just take Kosovo: back then, UN bodies decided that Kosovo should become independent of Serbia and that the interests of Serbia’s central government had to be subordinated. "

No, Mr.Putin, UN bodies/the UNSC didn't say that. Maybe you should read UNSCR 1244 (which is still in force, btw.) It says something different.

"Kosovo declared independence and the whole world accepted it, but what was the cause for that? It was a decision of (Kosovo's) parliament. They didn't even hold a referendum,"

No, not the whole world accepted it, 108 out of 192 UN member states did.
Yes, they didn't hold a referendum.

"The fact is that there was a long war in which Serbia and its capital Belgrade were bombarded and attacked with missiles. It was a military intervention of the West and NATO against the then rump Yugoslavia."

Yes, but this came AFTER all the crimes Serbian troops and paramilitaries committed in Kosovo, under the name of 'fighting terrorism'. But it's normal for Putin to understand that, having in min how he was 'fighting terrorism' in Chechniya, i.e. by erasing whole towns and totally bomb down bigger cities.

Another question is: Would Russia accept Kosovo's independence with a referendum? The outcome of that is obvious. Hmm, wait, no, not really, if the referendum would be similar to the one in Crimea, i.e. asking if Kosovo should either go back and restore the status of 1980 or join Albania, Kosovo citizens would 95% choose the latter.

@Stretan:

Kosova and Crimea Comparison?

Serbia committed Genocide,War Crimes, Crimes against Humanity in KOSOVA after a pattern of aggression in Slovenia,Croatia and Bosnia.
Go to The Hague to see the transcripts of this Criminal Enterprise AKA Greater Serbia.

Crimea might have a majority Russian enclave population but so does Brighton Beach, Brooklyn .

Can Putin Annex part of New York too?
The ethnic Russians in Crimea were abused and have half of its civilian population chased out of their homes in the dead of winter at gun point just because they weren't Ukraknes...

Crimea simply was Putin's excuse to try to show the world Russia still had some global significance by being able to antagonize world powers.

Putin's comparison to Kosova is similar to comparing an apple to an orange.....
Two different situations .....

Kosova has 110 recognitions where as Crimea has only Russia.....

Universal Democracy favors Kosova and no one supports evil Putin criminal actions ....

International Law was Not violated in Kosova's Independence Declaration BUT Russia violated it in Crimea....

BIG DIFFERANCE!

Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev.
(Jugoslavija, 11 January 2016 17:03

Maybe you illiterate Serb should also learn that you got Kosovo in 1912 in a treaty that did not consider wishes of the population. But hey go back then to 1389 and give me bla bla bla as Kosovo was Serbian bla bla bla.

So will you give back Vojvodina as well as this was never yours until Hungary lost WW1? So what that Russia gave away part of territory this is something Russians should have thought of before doing, also this is why Medvedge and Bujanovce !!!!

Even though its nut true Serbs believe that makes it yours something was taken from them 500years ie Turks again if you agree with this then just feel free to give Vojvodina back!!! If Serbs live there so what Give it back same way you ask for Kosovo - But you like double standards here.

Hungary thinks its heart of Hungary ..... sounds very similar to you asking for something that is not yours as population there does not want to be part of Serbia as population in Vojvodina does not want to be Hungary. 500years ago lets see who it belonged and many things are in hands of others now. Ie Alzas in France, Macedonia, parts of Serbia Hungary Austria etc etc catch my drift.

@mystery name caller

Your language is straight from kindergarten, illiterate was put in the English dictionary to be used. The majority of those Vojvodina Serbs are Kosovo Serbs who were displaced after the battle of Kosovo In 1389 by both the Ottoman Turks and Albanians . Austro Hungary attacked Serbia I914 and lost the war, 1/3 of Serbia's population was wiped out. The treaty of Versailles tried to solve the Slav problem with partition including the Bosnian Slavs . Kosovo is the founding nation of Serbia, Rasca and Zeta and that is why it is called the land of the churches. Albania remained and grew in Kosovo as an Islamic nation in consort with the Turks and continued to force Serbs out which again accelerated in the 1980's. Croatia and Albania would not exist without the Balkan wars and World war 1 where the Serbs lost millions of lives and the Albanians did nothing, in fact, fought on the Ottoman side. Some Croats fought with the Austro-Hungarian army but a small number joined the Serbian army.

If the Serbs had done their killing in Croatia, Bosnia, and Kosovo quietly with no pompous attitude they would have gotten away with it. But they had to be vocal and advertise to the world and made a military response the only option. As Teddy Roosevelt once said. Speak softly and carry a big stick.
(Steve Powell, 12 January 2016 15:55)

Actually, the complete opposite happened, the Bosnian Muslims broke every agreement from the Cutilero to the Vance Owen/Vance Stoltenberg plans because the US stoked the fans of war by instructing Izetbegovic not to sign agreements. Part of that blame is squarely on the Bosnian Serb and RSK leadership which also failed to approve peace plans during the civil war.

The only reasonable negotiator was Milosevic which led to the Dayton accord with essentially allowing RSK to fall into Croatian hands. What many historians forget is the Milosevic is more of a Communist than a nationalist who's only concern was to seize and maintain power like his mentors Stambolic and Tito.

To
Serbia lost 1999 war,
Why are you asking me?
You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
Again ask your Shiptar leader,why,WHY sign that paper to UN.
Now they need Russia and China ,to agree to your Pristina demands,or Belgrade.
Again ask your leader's, their still hanging around in Pristinas Office.Not your office ,since you are not living in the Balkans!
P's, I visit Pristina, Pec, Tirana, and Durres, alot more than your holiday's.

don't you all see the writing on the wall? Part of the reconciliation between the East and the West will be that the West somehow accepts Russias claims on the Crimia pininsula and Russia will stop supporting Serbia's claim on Kosovo.

#####

1.5M Kosovars will be very happy about that.

40M Ukranians will not be very happy about that.

Slowly slowly - this guy is changing his mind....?
Before he always referers to the precedent. What's happening now?
If Kosovo has right why not Crimea. That's true actually- I fully support Crimea independent.

Like a fine chess game, Czar Vlade you are the King!!! Every body just relax and sit back, nothing less than God alone can change what has been placed into motion by Satan on March 24, 1999!!! Russia and God a combination that will carry the world into the next era!!! Any Serbian people out there any where who wish to betray Russia then better you never been born!!! God Bless Czar Vlade and God Bless Russia!!!

Greetings. People forget the context of the NATO intervention. Europe wanted nothing to do with the Serbian response of the breakup of the former Yugoslavia. The Serbian Nationalist like tyrants do interpreted a lack of response as weakness and continued their aggression. Enter Bill Clinton. He had been accused of not intervening in Rwanda. I'm sure the Croats committed their share of atrocities. But winning gives you so much more opportunity and a number of notorious events occurred where Serbian Nationalist made NATO peace keepers appear incompetent. And then they laughed and sang their Nationalist folk songs. NATO still might not have done anything but Clinton was being humiliated by his naysayers. He pretty much dragged NATO kicking and screaming justifying that a war in central Europe was against their strategic interests. The event became a political issue and Clinton had to intervene to keep the military hawks at bay.

If the Serbs had done their killing in Croatia, Bosnia, and Kosovo quietly with no pompous attitude they would have gotten away with it. But they had to be vocal and advertise to the world and made a military response the only option. As Teddy Roosevelt once said. Speak softly and carry a big stick.

So hence, you won WWI and WWII mainly being part of right alliance not due to your might just like Albanians.
(Serbia Lost 1999 WAR, 12 January 2016 20:56)


Not even close, little Serbia repelled Austro-Hungary 3 times over the Sava River during WWI at the end of 1914 in the Battle of Cer and Kolobura. It took the Germans, Austro-Hungarians and the Bulgarians to subdue the Serbian army in 1915. The Albanians did one favor to the Serbian army, they allowed access through Albania where the Serb army was subject to countless attacks by the Albanian hordes. However, the Serbian army regrouped in the Salonika front and rolled over the Bulgarians who capitulated followed by the Austro-Hungarians and Germany who capitulated as Serbia marched back to Belgrade which was relieved. http://spartacus-educational.com/FWWserbiaA.htm

Albania has never fought or won a war! Where was Albania during the Balkan wars and World War I? Where was Albania in WWII? Declaring war on the US and then trying to invade Greece with Italy where again they took heavy losses and the Germans had to send troops to both Yugoslavia and Greece!!

The Albanians have shown countless times to be worthless soldiers.

@sumar
You are a a fool to mention a conquering ruler like Attila who came to a land to occupy it...the 1200s were just an example That shows a long presence of Serbs in Vojvodina (were a majority) long befor Albanians were brought to the Balkans and before the word Albanian existed....as for the typical Albanian response to this about being "Illyrian" I wish to ask you one question; can you name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? Name just one...you can't

Rote: If you read what I wrote, I made not a single criticism of Putin's policy in the Crimea. I simply stated that if he deems those actions to be acceptable he should change Russia's policy towards Kosovo. Would you accept Kosovo independence if that province held a referendum next weekend with the inevitable outcome? All your ranting about Sevastopol has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with my comment. As for Serbophilia, I have nothing against Serbs as a nation or as a people. I have a distinct problem with a number of individuals; Dodik, Seselj to name two. I am not a fan of Izetbegovic, Thaci, Dragan Covic, Lagumdzija and various others, all of whom have come in for criticism from me and none of whom is a Serb. You make the mistake that others make of thinking that if I criticise someone that you admire I must be doing so simply because I don't like them rather than because I disagree with their actions or words.

The reason a "referendum" will not happen is because the "powers to be" in Pristina are wondering how many ordinary Albanians are fed up with the situation in Kosovo....how many are really thinking to themselves "hell, what are we doing? Things were much more organized under Serbia"! I understand the first reaction will be "NEVER in a million years" or " Not ONE Albanian thinks this"....but I think we all know and can actually see (Exodus from Kosovo) what reality is...The west has pretty much dropped Kosovo as the "flavor of the week" and it has become an nusiance to them..their actions on Kosovo has opened a can of worms for international order and only their pride keeps Kosovo in the news...I work with Albanians here in the US and hear first hand...these are people who want a normal life in normal circumstances...the same as Serbs or any other peoples who desire a normal life and are fed up with politicians who benefit themselves & their families...
(Watcher, 11 January 2016 15:30)

Got it... so the referendum is not going to be held because it's possible that the majority of Kosovo's population would vote to stay under a failed state like Serbia where the best way for politicians to get votes or support from the most patriotic of Serbs in these forums is to bash the Albanians!!!

As for the so-called exodus, it is with the EU as destination, not Serbia.

if the rest of Bosnia and Kosovo were smart, they would support the RS and North Kosovo breaking away.
(icj1, 12 January 2016 01:45)
I agree with you 100% most Serbs in this forum do not see that actually their goals and Albanians can be aligned, Serbia does not know what to do with Kosovo any way. if they took RS and North ( saying adios to the churches and majoraty of Serb population south of Kosovo) Albanians get to merge in a one state and seek same in Macedonia what 1913 treaty did not do can be done.

EU does not like it so we have to deal with it.

Serbia has only solution with Kosovo as territory but nothing with population same one it failed to expel in 1999, returning Kosovo under Serbia is like giving an abused child back to abusing parent ( this is from ICJ proceedings).

As much as Serbian friends here say that they have changed they are still to this day ruled by same people ( Vucic, Dacic, Nikolic) - how can they trust them?

Also to all the Albaniacs saying something about Vojvodina being Serb after ww1 just look up the lands Stefan Dragutin ruled independently in the 1200's...this was the century even before the word "Albanian" was first ever recorded
(Bishop, 12 January 2016 04:01)
Not sure what that means 1200 so makes it yours? How about 450 Atila the Hun was ruling all the way down to Nis are you preparing to give this to Hungarians?

This is the double standard of Serbia it has different rules for everyone and some very special for themselves. Just because you ruled a land in 1200, 1300 etc does not make it yours if you lost it in a battle or treaty. When you won with alies WWI you got Vojvodina and Kosovo. When you lost war in Croatia you lost Krahinja and then in 1999 you lost the war to NATO so you lost Kosovo.

No need for Kuku majko for something you lost, but cherish the things you won; Germany has lost territory but you dont see them saying about parts of Poland are theirs, or Parts of France they keep progressing along. But you know Patriotism and historical myths are favourite antidote for poverty and lagging in the same region you once were shining.

Serbs had it the best during Yugoslavia, and even today Dacic says how Tito is best ambasador for Serbia where they go to Africa and present themselves as Yugoslav just changed the name and try to follow in his shadow.

@icj
typical albanian logic - google and wikipedia are only "good" when you read pro albanian garbage and everything else is a "lie" right? albanian genocidal ss division maniacs never existed; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21st_Waffen_Mountain_Division_of_the_SS_Skanderbeg

During the Second World War, Kosovo was annexed into a Greater Albania under fascist rule. There ensued an exodus of 100,000 Serbs while over 10,000 were killed by Albanians. Carlo Umiltà, an aide to the leader of the Italian military forces in Kosovo, recounted that Albanians were out to exterminate all Serbs and told of several events where horrified Italian troops were forced to fire on their Albanian allies to halt massacres of Serbs. Tito did not allow these Serbs to return to Kosovo.

Here are just a few names of genocidal Nazi Albanians to look up (there is not enough space in a book to list the murdering Ottoman Albanian Muslim foot soldiers that fought for Istanbul and cleansed 400,000 serbs in the 1800s);
-Nazir Hodic SS leader
-Xhafer Deva, Kosovo Albanian Muslim interior minister of the Nazi-created Greater Albania
-Gjon Marka Gjoni, the fascist leader of the Albanian Roman Catholics etc

all one needs to do is look up "demographic history of kosovo" to get an idea of the long term genocide. serbs were forced out or killed from the land there were a dominant majority until the late 1800s...

Another Canadian Serb: Why would a referendum include 7 million Serbs? The Crimea referendum didn't include all of Ukraine, simply those living in the Crimea. Scotland is part of the UK but only Scots participated in their independence referendum, not all UK citizens. When Quebec held its plebiscite (in your backyard) only Quebecoise voted. If Dodik ever held a referendum I don't imagine that you would expect those living in the Federation to be asked for their opinion.

"Comm. Parrisson

The referendum would also include 7 million Serbian citizens as Kosovo is a part of Serbia.

Nice try anyways!"
(Another Canadian Serb, 11 January 2016 14:53)


Oh, really? You mean like the famous Crimea 'referendum' which in Putin's eyes justifies the annexation included the 42 million Ukrainian citizens, as Crimea is part of Ukraine? Well, not such a good try. In football it would be called 'own goal'

P.S: Another little own goal: 7 million is not the number of citizens eligible for voting in Serbia (the 42 millions I mentioned isn't either)

Putin is waking up. By the way; If Crimea could do it, so could Chechnya.

Bravo Putin!
Let's recognize the will of the Crimea and it's desire to join with Russia.
And in turn Kosovo's right to independence.
Russia and Serbia = brothers.

Sasa we also won the war in 1999 with help of NATO hence no Serbian military or police capitulation Kumanovo agreement. Not sure what else you do when you loose a war you withdraw I have been many times to Kosovo i never see Serbian MUP.
(Serbia Lost 1999 WAR, 12 January 2016 20:56)

Albania has never fought or won any war, you can't even field a proper army.
No UCK or ALbanian army remained in Kosovo-Metohia , the insurgency was crushed by the Serbian army. The UCK and KLA was allowed back in by KFOR in direct contradiction of UN resolution 1244 resulting in more Serbs being ethically cleansed without protection of it's citizens as KFOR blindly did not offer any security.

To wake up,
It's not 2 Germany's, like you write,but I will give you a country called Cyprus, that would be very similar to the problem's ,that Serbia has,with same history and similar situation at present.
I give you Albanian's an realistic opportunity to came to a solution, that will meet both parties (Belgrade, Pristina) happy!.
Please don't give me bull stories, like "you can't be a half pregnant" and we where under Serb rule ( You where under Yugoslav rule and Communist's TITO,and Milosevic rule) Leave that peasants say's, else where.
At present situation, Serbia is moving forward, and even in Novi Pazar is moving forward ,with hositals and school just completed. Serbia investor's in the last 6 month's are arriving ,with countries alist,Cuba,Argentina, Brazil, Japan,China,Vietnam, South Korea, UAE,Iran,Kazakhstan, Belarus, Russia, ,EU countries, and even USA.
If a solution can't be found,than that suits Serbia fine at present situation.Serbia is progressing economic fast,( That I am shock).While Albania and Pristina are at snail pace.
Again I say,please don't give peasantry and village explaining 's, Give me a realistic solution that will work ,like I gave everyone (Cyprus).
P's Don't forget ,Cyprus ( Russian owned) has a vote.

Just as expected, Putin's support of Serbia against Kosova is just a bargaining chip for what he really wants: Western acknowledgment of Crimea's occupation.

#####

So I guess that means you need to convince Washington to accept the Crimean situation as it currently is.

Good luck.

Speechless!
Interesting!
@ rote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xx-VvX4FtU
"I always remember the main"

icJ1 wrote :"Hahaha, if our dear Serbian friends wanted anymore proof of Russia's "brotherhood", there you go... I'm so sorry for those naive people who believed that Russia would put Serbia's interests over Russia's!

====

why should Russia put Serbian interests ahead of Russia's interests even if Russia is friendly towards Serbia?...I doubt it Serbia would put Russian interests ahead of its own Serbian interests, so why should Russia?...Russians sacrificed a lot during 3 wars of 1878, 1914 and 1945 for serbian cource so your doubts about brotherhood are strange...

To posi mo,
I don't even leave any message,and still get under your skin!

I am an English man who has loved living in Serbia for the past twenty years. Should Catalonia claim independence from Spain, because of Spain's allegiance with Serbia over Kosovo, I presume the Belgrade government will not recognise an independent Catalonia.

don't you all see the writing on the wall? Part of the reconciliation between the East and the West will be that the West somehow accepts Russias claims on the Crimia pininsula and Russia will stop supporting Serbia's claim on Kosovo.

"1.5M Kosovars will be very happy about that.
40M Ukranians will not be very happy about that."

What is the point here? Some sort of, better to make fewer unhappy than more unhappy kind of nonsense?

1st ,Serbia has won 2 major wars from 1914 ,and Kosovo ,with Vojvodina where the spoils and rewards of war.In both League of Nations (1918),and United Nations(1945) was agreed ,with all the major countries,Twice .
The agreement of solution 1244 ,with United Nations in 1999,is why Shiptars cannot get a extra country.
When you win a War, you have to make sure what agree too,and you sign your name too.That ,you need to ask Thaci and his mates that represented Shiptars, to what did they agree too!
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 15:02)

Sasa we also won the war in 1999 with help of NATO hence no Serbian military or police capitulation Kumanovo agreement. Not sure what else you do when you loose a war you withdraw I have been many times to Kosovo i never see Serbian MUP.

So hence, you won WWI and WWII mainly being part of right alliance not due to your might just like Albanians. So now hence u lost 1999 war and you lost Kosovo which is accepted by 111 countries which majority of countries this is why Serbs now talk about majority population.

No police no Government agreement just like 2 Germanies but Albanians never want to come back. Best case is you one day get north best case but might loose some other part for now u lost.

Either WW war u would never have won without help so think about it.

@ watcher
Dream on sasa.p.... - watcher!
��

What I see in this interview is that Putin wants a deals with the West.
West has to recognize the annexation of Crimea and Putin and Russia will recognize Kosovo as independent,in return.
The pretext of referendum is funny because Albanians were the first in former YU to hold an referendum for independence back in 1992 where 99.96% of population voted for independence.
But if Mr. Putin wants another referendum, it is going to be very easy for Albanians.

Kosovo became independent. Crimea was annexed by Russia, so a better comparison would have been if Albania annexed Kosovo, but it didn't. Kosovo's independence took several years, while Crimea's annexation occurred in a few weeks. Kosovo's independence came after war in Kosovo, plus prior wars in neighboring states. There was no war in Ukraine before Crimea's annexation. Besides, Putin has already used the Kosovo excuse in Georgia with South Ossettia and Abkhazia. But I do believe he would sell out Serbia over Crimea in a heartbeat if the west agreed to recognize Crimea in exchange for Kosovo.

"Maybe some of you illiterate Albanians should learn some history, Crimea or KRYM was given to Ukraine by Kruchev who didn't really care as it was part of the Soviet Union. The first capital of the Russian state was Kiev. Ukraine has always been an integral part of Russia as well as Belarus whether economically or within it's borders.
(Jugoslavija, 11 January 2016 17:03)"

I'm not Albanian, but Crimea was recognized by Russia as part of Ukraine in 1991 when they recognized Ukraine's independence. They didn't object to it or protest it, they accepted it and recognized it.

Russian hypocrisy at its best. Let's revisit the facts.
Before Kosovo declared independence Russia claimed that the will of Kosovo Albanians for independence didn't matter.Russia at that time was part of a troika of three envoys that held talks on Kosovo's future status(the envoys were Frank Wisner from the United States, Alexandar Botsan-Kharchenko from Russia and German Wolfgang Ischinger for the EU).The talks started after the UN envoy the Norwegian diplomat Kai Eide recommended in his report to Kofi Annan that it was time for Kosovo's status to be settled. During the whole process Russia was involved and had a saying. In 2008 Kosovo declared independence, Russia to this day still does not recognize Kosovo. In 2008 Russia recognized S. Ossetia as independent by bypassing UN and all the international mechanisms and processes that Kosovo had gone through by simply stating that S. Ossetia had more rights to be independent then Kosovo. Then after the annexation of Crimea, Russia recognized the will of the Russian Crimeans for independence yet again without allowing any of the international factors to get involved.

Paul

There are no Muslim No-Go Areas in Europe. What are you even talking about?!

What are you mumbling about, learn how to speak English if you want a response. Albanians with a English as a second language speak better than you, your parents must be really proud of you.
(Jugoslavija, 12 January 2016 01:10)
Not sure what you did not like about my writing but hey please answer why is Vojvodina Serbian but Kosovo can not be Albanian.
As for my Parents they are very very proud and I work in Fortune 100 seems to work just fine for me :) Maybe your parents are the ones dropped the ball in not teaching you a kindergarten principle of no name calling.

You as a Serb please answer a simple question demographics of Vojvodina have changed since you took over Serbs from all over moved there, removing Germans, Hungarians, Croats ... becoming majority today its Serbian.

Now again for you even if ( not true by world historians) your Serb theory that Albanians moved to Kosovo is true by the same analysis of Vojvodina belonging to Serbia is equates to Kosovo Belonging to Albanians.

Now relax this is a blog not a scientific paper!!! And if you have a true answer please feel fee to debate away if not got to local kindergarten and learn a simple principle.

@sumar
what are you rambling on about? again i am still waiting - name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? you can not as they don't exist!

as mentioned during stefan dragutin's time serbs were majority in vojvodina (1200s), years before the word "Albanian" was ever even used for the first time.

you also mention some invented "genocide" the serbs committed against Albanian Nazi German allies from ww2 (we all know who the "SS Skenderbeg" Albanian Muslim unit was, ISIS was inspired by them)...

more albanian lies just like the "genocide" in kosovo from 1999...you claimed 500,000 were killed and all one has to do is google the BBC article from Sept 7th 2001 which said the UN stated "no genocide occurred in Kosovo"; http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1530781.stm

the only genocide that has taken place in kosovo is the killings and ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands of serbs since the late 1800s when the Albaniacs kicked out over 400k Serbs...just google "demographic history of kosovo"...you can not debate me as the genocide against the serbs continues to this day...

None of them Nikolle, as long as the non-Greek behave in the proper way they always did. I would stop wondering in foreign pages and would mind my own business, if I were you. Otherwise, you know the saying, figures don't mean anything when it comes to Orthos. It wouldn't be the first time Orthos would end up kicking the majority's asses in the Balkans. For the esteemed colleagues, instead, here is what I just told to a German magazine re Putin's interview: Well, I think what Mr. Vladimir Vladimirovic exactly meant to say is that actually Krim returned to where it always belonged, that is - mainland Russia. In addition, given Kosovo's precedent and the corresponding ICJ advisory opinion, Ukraine will never dare to bring Krim's case before the ICJ itself... of course, he went on saying, we have nothing against the Albanians as such, as long as they are being fair with the Greeks and their neighbors in general, and with each other....and who knows, never say never, one day we can be best friends and recognize their legitimate claims :)

Posi Mo -

If I was sasa p, I would tell you I was sasa p. But I am not sasa p, I am Watcher. Sasa p has his own thoughts and he doesn't need mine & I don't need his.
Please rest assured, I never will try to confuse you or anyone...I will tell you EXACTLY how & what I think..."let your yay be yay and your nay, nay"...thus sayeth our Lord!
that much we should be able to agree on...Serb or Albanian!
Anyways, why do you say Dream on? Your own people are saying this! It's not a Pro Serb or antiAlbanian opinion...it's people who live life day to day in the real world...

icj1 supported what Putin said:

"According to the Charter of the United Nations, every people has the right to self-determination."

I believe Putin was using this as an example of "different rules for different folks"

If not, then according to you, you should have no problem with this happening:

- RS would like to break away
- N. Kosovo would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Croatia would like to break away
- The Serb areas of Montenegro would like to break away
- the Serb areas of Macedonia would like to break away
- Also the Greek areas of Albania would like to break away
(factman, 11 January 2016 16:45)

Sure, I couldn't care less what, say, Serbs in Croatia do. I have nothing against Serbs doing whatever is best for them.

As for RS and North Kosovo breaking away, I agree that it makes total sense. The only thing is that it would be against international law: the first for violating the Dayton Agreement and the second for violating UNSCR 1244. But again, if the rest of Bosnia and Kosovo were smart, they would support the RS and North Kosovo breaking away.

Let's not lose sight of the big picture. This post has garnered over 70+ comments. Pro Kosovars shouldn't let Putin bother you. Who cares what Putin does? Who cares how much Putin supports Serbias position? Everyone has allies. None of this Crimea talk will change the facts on the ground which is that Kosova declared their independence after a bloody war and they run their own affairs whether it's called a state or whatever. What is also a fact is that no Chetnik soldiers will ever set foot on the territory that is called Kosova ever again. Another fact is that Serbia has deluded themselves into believing that Kosova is the cradle of their civilization. That's actually good. Why? Because they will never again control it and Albanians everywhere can ridicule and laugh in Serbians faces that they lost the cradle of their civilization:) Serbia was beat and lost their most precious land. Buahahaaaaa!

the only genocide that has taken place in kosovo is the killings and ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands of serbs since the late 1800s when the Albaniacs kicked out over 400k Serbs...just google "demographic history of kosovo"...you can not debate me as the genocide against the serbs continues to this day...
(bishop, 15 January 2016 05:35)

Who is(are) the individual(s) that committed genocide in Kosovo?! Please provide the court and the date in which said court made such a determination. "Google" is not a court and a certain "bishop" is not a court either!

Quick dacic, a protest note

Tsar Vladimir double standards in regards to Crimea and Kosovo are despicable. Russia refuses to recognize Kosovo supposedly because the independence came thru an act of parliament and not via a referendum, though Russia itself became independent state from Soviet Union without a referendum, but thru an act of Russian parliament. In fact Kosovo had a referendum for independence way before Russia became an independent state.
He compares Crimea to Kosovo, yet he rejects the idea that kosovars are separate people, but somehow crimeans are separate people deserving the right of self determination.
Mr.Putin you are a self righteous thug and nothing else. I feel sorry for Russian people that have to endure your disastrous autocratic rule. Once a KGB man, always a thug!

@sumar
You are a a fool to mention a conquering ruler like Attila who came to a land to occupy it...the 1200s were just an example That shows a long presence of Serbs in Vojvodina (were a majority) long befor Albanians were brought to the Balkans and before the word Albanian existed....as for the typical Albanian response to this about being "Illyrian" I wish to ask you one question; can you name just one Albanian source from prior to the 19th century that claimed you were "Illyrian"? Name just one...you can't
(Bishop, 13 January 2016 05:27)

When you speak like this shows exatlly what you are ignorant, If you want to look about Albanian people look at their language and that will show you the truth if you open your yes how long they bee there, much longer than you in 7 century. My point is that no one cares who owned something in Balkans in 1200 or 450 as land here has changed hands many many times. Albanians have been in Balkans longer than you but all the books that show you that you dispute as Western propaganda.

Again no one cares who been there before you took Vojvodina in 1918 today you have ethnically cleansed it moving Germand, Croats etc out, but do not want to return.

to Sasa:

Serbs moved to Vojvodina as its better land and it was given free after Germans were displaced its easy and simple to research.

You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 22:36)

How is that working for you, where is Serbian Police returning to Kosovo as in 1244 and why are your leaders quiet and never talk about it.1244 was there not to put boots on the ground with fighting face-saving for Milosevic, Serbia will sign a two Germany type agreement before entering EU.

Do you realistically believe that Kosovo will ever be a part of Serbia, in my opinion that will be a day of mourning for Serbia. Serbia's only plan is Kosovo without Albanians.

We shall see what future brings, but Kosovo is entering 17th year away from Serbian dominance, and population that spoke Serbian (K-Albanians) is slowly disappearing making the link much more harder.

Road to EU is paved with letting Kosovo go with dignity signing agreement of 2 Germanies this is already in process with liaison office.

Just as expected, Putin's support of Serbia against Kosova is just a bargaining chip for what he really wants: Western acknowledgment of Crimea's occupation. What Putin doesn't realize is that Kosovo was created to save the population from genocide, which is not what happened in Crimea.

You should ask you leaders ,that agreed to UN resolution 1244.Why would they Thaci and his members sign,that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory.
(sasa.p, 12 January 2016 22:36)

Indeed, they never signed Serbia's version of UNSCR 1244 which says "that KiM,never leave Belgrade's territory" so there is no point asking them about something they did not sign, but if you want to waste your time, feel free to ask them!