"They're using Seselj to punish us" - PM

"There is no right or justice, and unfortunately, no Vojislav Seselj there. There's just the wrong attempts to punish the Serbian government and its policy," said Vucic, commenting on Monday's announcement from The Hague that Seselj must return to the detention unit.

"Every decision we make - and it will not be immoral like all the political decisions of the Hague Tribunal - will have only one goal, to maintain stability in our Serbia and nothing more," Vucic said in the piece the daily ran under the headline, "They're using Seselj to punish us."

---------------------------

I don't see how Serbia is being 'punished' here. Seselj was temporarily released to receive medical treatment for cancer and now they require him back, what's the issue? Why is Vucic making this political? Anyway, I thought that Vucic and Nikolic fell out with Seselj years ago when they left the Radicals and formed the Progressives? What do they care about Seselj for? He certainly doesn't care for them, quite the opposite.

Blablabla... Why does Vucic make such a big deal out of it? You only punish yourself and Serbia. Why is he not simply doing his job as PM and doesn't care about such a minor irrelevant decision to send an alleged war criminal back to jail?

Seselj was upfront that he would accept no conditions before they released him, they still did and that was extremely stupid. But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release, knowing full well that eventually he would have to return even if it were just for the rendering of the verdict.

It looks like Vucic is really missing those days when he used to be a beer server for Seselj. It is important to keep the seniors drunk, so they can commit more crimes throughout the region. They say, old habits never die.

I'm afraid if you take a lots of pressure on premier Vucic,about this issue,he could pass like ex premier Zoran Djindjic,after he sent Milosevic to prison in Hague.From the other hand Seselj and anti-western parties could get a lots of popularity among the voters.Most of the agreements with EU,are the humiliation for most of the pride people in Serbia,cause EU was involved in bombing Serbia.Logic and sense must prevail from Hague and from Serbia governement,to maintain peace on Balkan now.

"Every decision we make - and it will not be immoral like all the political decisions of the Hague Tribunal - will have only one goal, to maintain stability in our Serbia and nothing more," Vucic said in the piece the daily ran under the headline

-- Here we go again. Serbia, the world's self-appointed moral police. I still don't get who this word (immoral) is directed to and for what effect? Who outside of Serbia is even feeling offended that Vucic and Serbia perceives them as immoral? Not sure there exists such a person. Its not as if Vucic or Serbia have the monopoly or even some authority on what moral means. So they vomit out these word salads that have no meaning. He also forgot to say the other word Provokacija. If I've learned anything from the Serb politics in the last 10 years are the following words: humiliation, immoral, illegal, provocation, punish us, attempt to bring down government, boycott, tycoons, Greater Albania. Look at the B92 news for the past 10 years. You will find that all the news are a variation of these words followed by some other empty words and the usual attempt from Serb government officials to win "The most patriotic Serb" contest. What a circus.

Just enacted Serbia's new National Anthem: Why is Everyone always pickin on me.
They are also changing the title from Prime Minister to Chief Conspiracy Theorist!

Dont Touch Sesselj He is stability ?.

Arn.Sweden.

Seselj was upfront that he would accept no conditions before they released him, they still did and that was extremely stupid. But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release, kno

wing full well that eventually he would have to return even if it were just for the rendering of the verdict.
(jdlsjflaj, 31 March 2015 13:16)

He was released unconiditionally or if you think otherwise show me proof where it says what the conditions were?

"Bezuslovno" oslobađanje uz unapred poznat stav optuženog da će poštovati pravila puštanje nije dosad zabeležana u praksi Tribunala.
Radio Free Europe reported, quoting the Hague Prosecution, that Šešelj was set free by the Chamber "with no conditions, on its own initiative, and without consulting with the prosecution."
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2014&mm=11&dd=19&nav_id=92302

Both the ICTY and Serbia know that Seselj left the UNDU without agreeing to any conditions. In plain written words that Serbia sent to the ICTY: it would guarantee the release, if and only if, Seselj agreed to the conditions. That the ICTY refused to present any conditions to Seselj is entirely ICTY's responsibility and incompetence.

According to many ICTY apologists, the tribunal is a towering and leading institute of international justice; would such an organization collectively target the entire population of a country for punishment because of errors and incompetence that are entirely ICTY's responsibility?

(jdlsjflaj, 31 March 2015 13:16) But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release.

----
Incorrect. In clear written text sent to the ICTY, Serbia would only guarantee the provisional release with the conditions that were accepted by accused. No conditions were presented to the accused: by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.

Incorrect. In clear written text sent to the ICTY, Serbia would only guarantee the provisional release with the conditions that were accepted by accused. No conditions were presented to the accused: by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.
(Amnesty Yugoslavia, 31 March 2015 15:34)
Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.

"They are using Seselj to punish us"PM
The real question here for Serbs to understand is this:Why did the court released Mr.Seselj in the first place?For medical reasons?That's deceptive smoke screen.They release him in the hope that he would die soon and spare them from perception that he may have died from lack of medical care in their prison.(As the case was with Milosevic)Mr.Seselj is alive (and I hope he stay alive for long time to come)that's what they did not expect so they want him back to die in their prison anyway .From their perspective its less damaging.Mr Seselj over period of his incarceration just about totally destroyed credibility of that institution.Therefore,court wants him dead as soon as possible and anyway possible.This court is dispensing justice based on political expediency not on the forensic and material evidence.Its critical for Serbian Government not to play lackey to this institution.

(Put up or shut up, 31 March 2015 19:43) Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.

----

The order granting Seselj's release is accompanied by Liang's dissenting opinion; Serbia's letter forms an important component of the dissent.

Liang writes: "It is also regrettable that the decision by the majority places the Serbian authorities in an uncomfortable and awkward position. The Chamber sought the opinion of Serbia. It provided one, specifying that its cooperation was conditional on the Accused confirming that he will adhere to the Chamber's conditions."

Here is the link: http://www.icty.org/x/cases/seselj/tord/en/141111.pdf

B92 also reported on Serbia`s reply and conditions in November 2014: http://www.b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2014&mm=11&dd=05&nav_id=92145


There are earlier reports during the first hearings on provisional release in June-July 2014. Please feel free to peruse the B92 web site. If you have trouble, I'll be glad to respond to your cordial requests.

Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.
(Put up or shut up, 31 March 2015 19:43)
# Comment link

It would also be easy for you too google it but here you go,
http://inserbia.info/today/2014/11/icty-publishes-serbian-letter-of-guarantees-for-seselj/

by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.
(Amnesty Yugoslavia, 31 March 2015 15:34)

Well, assuming Serbia is a State and a UN member, THERE ARE conditions that Serbia agreed to when it joined the UN in 2000, namely to accept and carry out the decisions of the UNSC. The UNSC decision is that:

"All states shall cooperate fully with the International Tribunal [and] shall take any measures necessary [...] to comply with [...] orders issued by a Trial Chamber under Article 29 of the Statute"

Article 29 of the ICTY Statute says:

"States shall comply without undue delay with any request for assistance or an order issued by a Trial Chamber, including, but not limited to [...] the arrest or detention of persons; the surrender or the transfer of the accused to the International Tribunal."

If the Trial Chamber orders for Seselj to be back at the ICTY detention unit, the logic and the law is simple: as long as Seselj is in Serbia's territory, Serbia must arrest Seselj and transfer it to the ICTY. End of the story!

Blablabla... Why does Vucic make such a big deal out of it? You only punish yourself and Serbia. Why is he not simply doing his job as PM and doesn't care about such a minor irrelevant decision to send an alleged war criminal back to jail?

I'm afraid if you take a lots of pressure on premier Vucic,about this issue,he could pass like ex premier Zoran Djindjic,after he sent Milosevic to prison in Hague.From the other hand Seselj and anti-western parties could get a lots of popularity among the voters.Most of the agreements with EU,are the humiliation for most of the pride people in Serbia,cause EU was involved in bombing Serbia.Logic and sense must prevail from Hague and from Serbia governement,to maintain peace on Balkan now.

Dont Touch Sesselj He is stability ?.

Arn.Sweden.

It looks like Vucic is really missing those days when he used to be a beer server for Seselj. It is important to keep the seniors drunk, so they can commit more crimes throughout the region. They say, old habits never die.

"There is no right or justice, and unfortunately, no Vojislav Seselj there. There's just the wrong attempts to punish the Serbian government and its policy," said Vucic, commenting on Monday's announcement from The Hague that Seselj must return to the detention unit.

"Every decision we make - and it will not be immoral like all the political decisions of the Hague Tribunal - will have only one goal, to maintain stability in our Serbia and nothing more," Vucic said in the piece the daily ran under the headline, "They're using Seselj to punish us."

---------------------------

I don't see how Serbia is being 'punished' here. Seselj was temporarily released to receive medical treatment for cancer and now they require him back, what's the issue? Why is Vucic making this political? Anyway, I thought that Vucic and Nikolic fell out with Seselj years ago when they left the Radicals and formed the Progressives? What do they care about Seselj for? He certainly doesn't care for them, quite the opposite.

Seselj was upfront that he would accept no conditions before they released him, they still did and that was extremely stupid. But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release, kno

wing full well that eventually he would have to return even if it were just for the rendering of the verdict.
(jdlsjflaj, 31 March 2015 13:16)

He was released unconiditionally or if you think otherwise show me proof where it says what the conditions were?

"Bezuslovno" oslobađanje uz unapred poznat stav optuženog da će poštovati pravila puštanje nije dosad zabeležana u praksi Tribunala.
Radio Free Europe reported, quoting the Hague Prosecution, that Šešelj was set free by the Chamber "with no conditions, on its own initiative, and without consulting with the prosecution."
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2014&mm=11&dd=19&nav_id=92302

Both the ICTY and Serbia know that Seselj left the UNDU without agreeing to any conditions. In plain written words that Serbia sent to the ICTY: it would guarantee the release, if and only if, Seselj agreed to the conditions. That the ICTY refused to present any conditions to Seselj is entirely ICTY's responsibility and incompetence.

According to many ICTY apologists, the tribunal is a towering and leading institute of international justice; would such an organization collectively target the entire population of a country for punishment because of errors and incompetence that are entirely ICTY's responsibility?

(jdlsjflaj, 31 March 2015 13:16) But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release.

----
Incorrect. In clear written text sent to the ICTY, Serbia would only guarantee the provisional release with the conditions that were accepted by accused. No conditions were presented to the accused: by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.

Seselj was upfront that he would accept no conditions before they released him, they still did and that was extremely stupid. But Serbia agreed to all conditions of his release, knowing full well that eventually he would have to return even if it were just for the rendering of the verdict.

"They are using Seselj to punish us"PM
The real question here for Serbs to understand is this:Why did the court released Mr.Seselj in the first place?For medical reasons?That's deceptive smoke screen.They release him in the hope that he would die soon and spare them from perception that he may have died from lack of medical care in their prison.(As the case was with Milosevic)Mr.Seselj is alive (and I hope he stay alive for long time to come)that's what they did not expect so they want him back to die in their prison anyway .From their perspective its less damaging.Mr Seselj over period of his incarceration just about totally destroyed credibility of that institution.Therefore,court wants him dead as soon as possible and anyway possible.This court is dispensing justice based on political expediency not on the forensic and material evidence.Its critical for Serbian Government not to play lackey to this institution.

Incorrect. In clear written text sent to the ICTY, Serbia would only guarantee the provisional release with the conditions that were accepted by accused. No conditions were presented to the accused: by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.
(Amnesty Yugoslavia, 31 March 2015 15:34)
Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.

(Put up or shut up, 31 March 2015 19:43) Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.

----

The order granting Seselj's release is accompanied by Liang's dissenting opinion; Serbia's letter forms an important component of the dissent.

Liang writes: "It is also regrettable that the decision by the majority places the Serbian authorities in an uncomfortable and awkward position. The Chamber sought the opinion of Serbia. It provided one, specifying that its cooperation was conditional on the Accused confirming that he will adhere to the Chamber's conditions."

Here is the link: http://www.icty.org/x/cases/seselj/tord/en/141111.pdf

B92 also reported on Serbia`s reply and conditions in November 2014: http://www.b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2014&mm=11&dd=05&nav_id=92145


There are earlier reports during the first hearings on provisional release in June-July 2014. Please feel free to peruse the B92 web site. If you have trouble, I'll be glad to respond to your cordial requests.

"Every decision we make - and it will not be immoral like all the political decisions of the Hague Tribunal - will have only one goal, to maintain stability in our Serbia and nothing more," Vucic said in the piece the daily ran under the headline

-- Here we go again. Serbia, the world's self-appointed moral police. I still don't get who this word (immoral) is directed to and for what effect? Who outside of Serbia is even feeling offended that Vucic and Serbia perceives them as immoral? Not sure there exists such a person. Its not as if Vucic or Serbia have the monopoly or even some authority on what moral means. So they vomit out these word salads that have no meaning. He also forgot to say the other word Provokacija. If I've learned anything from the Serb politics in the last 10 years are the following words: humiliation, immoral, illegal, provocation, punish us, attempt to bring down government, boycott, tycoons, Greater Albania. Look at the B92 news for the past 10 years. You will find that all the news are a variation of these words followed by some other empty words and the usual attempt from Serb government officials to win "The most patriotic Serb" contest. What a circus.

Just enacted Serbia's new National Anthem: Why is Everyone always pickin on me.
They are also changing the title from Prime Minister to Chief Conspiracy Theorist!

Would love to see a copy of this so called letter no one has heard of until your revelation. It should be easy for you to produce a link to it.
(Put up or shut up, 31 March 2015 19:43)
# Comment link

It would also be easy for you too google it but here you go,
http://inserbia.info/today/2014/11/icty-publishes-serbian-letter-of-guarantees-for-seselj/

by logic and law there are no conditions for Serbia.
(Amnesty Yugoslavia, 31 March 2015 15:34)

Well, assuming Serbia is a State and a UN member, THERE ARE conditions that Serbia agreed to when it joined the UN in 2000, namely to accept and carry out the decisions of the UNSC. The UNSC decision is that:

"All states shall cooperate fully with the International Tribunal [and] shall take any measures necessary [...] to comply with [...] orders issued by a Trial Chamber under Article 29 of the Statute"

Article 29 of the ICTY Statute says:

"States shall comply without undue delay with any request for assistance or an order issued by a Trial Chamber, including, but not limited to [...] the arrest or detention of persons; the surrender or the transfer of the accused to the International Tribunal."

If the Trial Chamber orders for Seselj to be back at the ICTY detention unit, the logic and the law is simple: as long as Seselj is in Serbia's territory, Serbia must arrest Seselj and transfer it to the ICTY. End of the story!