26

Wednesday, 22.07.2015.

12:08

"Serbia pressured Croatia's allies," claims party leader

Leader of Croatia's HDZ party says his country's allies <a href="http://www.b92.net/eng/news/region.php?yyyy=2015&mm=07&dd=17&nav_id=94794" class="text-link" target= "_blank">gave up on participating in the Operation Storm parade</a> on August 4 "due to pressure from Serbia."

Izvor: Tanjug

"Serbia pressured Croatia's allies," claims party leader IMAGE SOURCE
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26 Komentari

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Mira

pre 8 godina

To all our dear neighbors in Serbia, the war didn't start in 1995. It started in 1991. In 1995 Croatia freed their homeland. Serbs should be celebrating this, because Croatia let all those people alive and in peace to leave, as was organized by your dear leader Milosevic. If Milosevic wouldn't have started the war, everyone would have lived in peace. Stop whining already and face reality.

rogersKab

pre 8 godina

sunman, you seem to be missing the overall point. from what you're suggesting it is not wrong because the people got out of the way and weren't willing to die in order for people like yourself to feel pity for them. they, ran from the war. the reasons they ran are less relevant than their running, and far less relevant than why they haven't returned.
weren't the likes of alan turing and his code breaker heros for giving civilians a chance to run. same thing. many people were smart enough to run, and you are suggesting that it was nothing. perhaps if and when you're ever faced with a flight or die situation you may reconsider your stance, or become a martyr and we can make a statue to commemorate bravery and idiocy all at once.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership.
(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14)

With all due respect, because I'm under the impression you actually believe what you write, but Storm was not an organized evacuation and if it was, it was the most chaotically organized evacuation in history.

Moreover, "evacuation" implies those who left are somehow able to return. This is another myth propagated by HDZ since most of those Serb houses were either demolished or repopulated with Croats. Serbs travelling throughout Storm were repeatedly assaulted and harassed by Croats, and many who took a wrong turn and wound up in a dead end blocked by Croats never got out. Even if Milosevic had planned this, as you claim, it was in cooperation with Tudjman who was more than happy to rid his beloved Domovina of an ethnic minority he made no effort to work with, choosing instead to side with ethnonationalsts. Plus, if Croats had nothing to do with what is now regarded as a Joint-Criminal Enterprise (you forgot to mention that, didn't you), then explain the endemic racism in Croatia twenty years after the ethnic cleansing against Serbs.

And if Storm is used as a case study in military strategy, I dread to know when attacking fleeing civilians and killing old pensioners is considered in taking over a territory the home state did absolutely nothing to integrate.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14) # Comment link

Ustasha denial: the same people who deny Jasenovac happened, or try to minimize the number also deny the extent of war crimes in Oluja. They claim that Milosevic "gave orders" to hundreds of thousands of people to pick up and leave their homes.

These were civilians, Milosevic was no one to give orders for anything. As if he had enough power to tell 250, 000 people just pick up and leave their ancestral homes in a matter of days. No, Croat terrorists broke down doors and threw out civilians by force.

Oluja taught at military academies? I doubt it. What's there to teach? "Make sure you have resources from NATO to help you carry out your aggression on your enemy"? Because that's all that happened. Croatia wouldn't have been able to carry any ethnic cleansing out without the guidance of NATO.

This is NOT 'new'

pre 8 godina

Feral Tribune, Split, Croatia, February 10, 2001

https://web.archive.org/web/20090108034605/http://www.ex-yupress.com/feral/feral156.html

Darkness From Above
In the flier that appeared in Krajina two days before the start of the operation Storm and which ordered Serb civilians to leave their homes, in the Cyrillic stamp of the Krajina Defense Ministry the first three letters are in the Latin script. Feral's source in the Croatian Defense Ministry claims that the flier was produced by the Croatian Defense Ministry Department for Special Warfare

by Frenki LAUSIC


...Instead of causing panic and confusion in the Serb units by propaganda-psychological tricks, which is allowed by the Geneva Conventions under the category of "wartime trickery", panic and confusion were provoked among the civilians in order to prompt them to run en masse. And that mode of special warfare could clearly be named special ethnic cleansing.

John Smith

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm. Ethnic cleansing at it's worst. What did the UN / NATO & World Powers do to prevent Croatia doing this? Nothing. NATO bombed the Serbs for driving out the terrorists Albanian's from Kosovo, but didnothing against the Croats. Why ?

Suman

pre 8 godina

Been reading the responses to my post and am surprised at the level of denial, diversion, spin and level of cynicism. Folks whether you like Croats or whether Croats like you is not the point, the truth is point. Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership. Storm was the a brilliant military campaign with minimal civilian casualties and minimal collateral damage to reclaim Croatian legal and historical lands. Military colleges and strategists are using Storm as a case study in military effectiveness and leadership. Whether you want to accept the truth is a whole different story.

Peggy

pre 8 godina

I wish our enemies would make up their mind about Serbia. On one hand they say that the whole world hates Serbia and Serbia is weak and now they are saying how Serbia has intimidated everyone into not celebrating this farce. Which is it?

Hank the Tank

pre 8 godina

Marko K

Yes Marko, Serbia is last in its group. It might end up last and even loose to Albani but so what? You can't win them all. Lately we are winners of Wimbledon, world champions in soccer (U20), waterpolo champs etc. Not to mention Serbian acheivements in the past. No matter what Balkan country you are from you know you'll never be better then Serbia.

DefendingOnesCountryIsOk

pre 8 godina

Did you guys forget about. The Republic of Serbian Krajina? Did it exist? That region that serbs annexed out of 1/3 of a internationally recognized country and called it there own? Illegally? So now you mean to say that the defence of a country to stop another people from carving out 1/3rd of it...is a crime? And yes ppl lost lives..on both sides..even when the Serbs of krajina were creating there own state by killing and kicking out any Croatians living in the region. Which happened! Can't deny that..makes serbs guilty of genocide. And yes lots of Serbs moved out after they lost the region..which they initally stole threw ethnic cleansing..some because of fear and some because they were told to by there own. There is a famous picture with Serbs on the highway fleeing Croatia it's sad to see but they should be happy!..they are alive! Proof that they weren't harmed! And can return to there homes in Croatia today! Unlike the ppl of vukovar or skabrnje or Srebrenica, half of Bosna. Where innocent civilian people were butchered like animals. Bad stuff was done on all sides. I'm not arguing that. But if some other peoples tried to annex 1/3rd of serbia how would you react? You would do the exact same thing! There's nothing else you could call it! Self defence! If you want Kosovo back so much go have your own oluja! Stop trying to take other peoples land! You "technically" stole half of Bosna which was made legal! so stop crying! Everyone else lost way more than the serbs!

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes we all suck but it’s our life ! Serbia is a bone in the Balkan throat with it stubborn mentality and never dying last for Russia. Please leave us alone and let us suck. Or you Serbs really think that we are so dumb that we do not understand our real status quo ? We do but please stop your independence game and join us. We don’t need white crows here so be one of us and let the region relax. Serbs are the biggest problem. They do not live themselves and do not let to live for the rest. Stop it please and do not spit against the wind. Be one of us and suck with us to help the region ! Be sure you'll like it as they always tell you what to do and you have nothing to worry about.

laudy

pre 8 godina

sunman, international courts... really... hmm,
gwbush, and dickyChenney have also be found guilty and convicted of war crimes by an international court (KLWCT), yet they walk free, flaunt the international law with their version of the propaganda. if the western allies will not accept an international courts decisions, why should anybody else who is trying to emulate the democracy and freedoms of the west.
its all propaganda. truth is an abstraction these days.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Marko K., 22 July 2015 19:00

Completely agree. The senior team is atrocious. I've lost faith in humanity every time I've seen them play in the last year. So we are going to finish very poorly.

But at least we will be punished for our terrible play, and not punished because we are a bunch of Nazis. But don't worry too much about Serbia. Our U-20 team just won the World Cup which means our immediate future is looking very bright ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1nvVk5pIXg

ida

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm was the largest ethnic cleansing of the entire Balkan Wars. Up to 300,000 in a few days.
Even today much of that area is practically uninhabited.
The Croats continued to kill the Serbs that stayed for many months.
UN reports say they kept finding freshly decapitated bodies - mainly elderly Serbian men.
The fact that the Croats kept killing civilians - and in primitive, sadistic and mutilated manner - who stayed shows a genocide.
The number of Serbs who died has been very downplayed and under-counted by the official media.

Those areas of Croatia were Serbs lived had a charming culture which has now been erased or de-placed. Croats made a desert out of it and called it "peace". And the last of Nikola Tesla's relatives were ethnically cleansed too.

Marko K.

pre 8 godina

Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.
(Ari Gold, 22 July 2015 12:39)

Hey Ari,
How is Serbia going to be able to finish the qualifiers without being humiliated. So far serbia is dead last in a group that includes such heavyweights as Armenia. Serbia thus far has accumulated negative two points (-2) and will be the first team ever to finish in the red. I think it's time to send in the under 21 team (many of whom were 23 years old) in order to attempt to bail you out so as to avoid a major humiliation.

Roger7

pre 8 godina

sunman said, "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

Your views are colored by your self-interested sources and your obvious bias.

Don't believe your propaganda.

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes, the international community and NATO are so scared and intimidated by Serbia and her long tongue. Serbia is such an important and big military and economic power in the world. It ranks up there with Bahamas, Tonga, the Gambia and the Seychelles. Yes, who says Serbia is small???

Stan

pre 8 godina

Croatia is an affront to humanity. A disgusting creation built on the bones of millions of innocents, slaughtered in the most cruel ways.
nazism has been trying to make a comeback, but it appears to have taken a blow here. Good news all around.

Moonshine

pre 8 godina

Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.
(sunman, 22 July 2015 14:48)

The butthurt is strong with this one. Don't worry sunman, no one's going to take away your day. Just that no one wants to celebrate it with you.

njegos

pre 8 godina

Sunman, I see you're still trolling Serbian sites trying to rewrite history.

You said: "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

This is funny coming from you. Please explain why the Croat gov't. spent millions of dollars on US PR forms like Ruder & Finn to slant the western press during the war of 90s?

Croatians are the masters of propaganda. Ever since WWII and your alliance with Nazi Germany you guys have been trying to rewrite history and cleanse your image. Even after the millions you've spent for propaganda purposes, the truth eventually comes out. The world is now seeing the true Croatia. Keep trying sunman. LOL

sunman

pre 8 godina

Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda. In the article you mention that Serbs were expelled from Croatia and thousands killed. This is factually wrong and historically incorrect. International courts have confirm that Croatia and it military campaign were legitimate and just, and that Croatia did Not expel Serbs. Serbs were ordered to evacuate in an order and pre planned strategy by its own leadership. Moreover courts have confirmed that Storm did not kill thousand in fact it has very few casualties and destruction (just look at the picture of Knin and vukovar after the respective military campaigns) especially compared with serbian forces destruction and killings. Journalism must also acknowledge that Serbia was occupying Croatia's territory and had either killed or forcibly expelled croatian and other non Serbs from the area liberated - when Croats were expelled they were forced to sign over their property to serbian forces or face death. Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.

butteredup

pre 8 godina

Only reason why Germans did not go there is because they want Serbia to EU so they can pretend that they once more have an empire with Habsburgs land included. Why would serbs join EU, if Germans openly would celebrate the defeat of Velika Srbija.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

LOL while a part of me wishes Hrvatska do Zero would finally be resigned to the dustbin of history where it belonged a decade ago, I can't help but laugh at people like Karamarko and Gospodjo Kolinda for making a spectacle out of the Domovina. I love how he somehow believes Serbia has this diplomatic leverage throughout Europe to somehow succeed in pressuring every EU member state to withdraw from attending Croatia's annual Family Fascist Freak Fest this August. I also love the conspiracies among Croatia's Tudjmanistas that every little thing that goes wrong in Lijepa Nasa is somehow part of this omnipresent Serbian lobby, who along with communists and homosexuals are determined to destroy this allegedly powerful country no one seems to notice outside Western Hercegovina. If Serbia were as powerful as its critics claim it to be, they'd have retained Kosovo and took most of Bosnia with them while already enjoying EU membership for years.

No no, Black Mark, the decision by the First World not to attend your little dose of historical revisionism has less to do with Serbs ruining the fun and more to do with the First World having better things to do than listen to Thompson songs and watch a collection of old pensioners and twenty-something goons from Split march throughout Knin on a hot day shouting racist statements in honor of a fabricated victory.

njegos

pre 8 godina

HA! The Croat posters on this site would have us believe that Serbia is on life support and totally irrelevant from a political and every other perspective. And now the leader of the far right, neo Nazi HDZ is crying about Serbia's influence over Croatia's allies/neighbors. How embarrassing for Mighty Croatia! Or maybe it's Midget Croatia. LOL

Perhaps a better explanation is that Croatia's 'allies and partners in crime' see Croatia for what they really are: a far right leaning, intolerant nation with racist tendencies. This is an example of the real world distancing themselves from an country that will only smear their respective country's image on the world stage. Keep up the good work Croatia. Yet another step toward isolation. Have fun celebrating alone.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

I doubt it, but maybe the NATO reps felt deep down that there was something really wrong about marking the ethnic cleansing of 250, 000 people & the murder of 2000 in a matter of days in such a positive way. Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.

So the glorification of Oluja isn't even the half of what's a very disturbed segment of Croatia's society.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

LOL while a part of me wishes Hrvatska do Zero would finally be resigned to the dustbin of history where it belonged a decade ago, I can't help but laugh at people like Karamarko and Gospodjo Kolinda for making a spectacle out of the Domovina. I love how he somehow believes Serbia has this diplomatic leverage throughout Europe to somehow succeed in pressuring every EU member state to withdraw from attending Croatia's annual Family Fascist Freak Fest this August. I also love the conspiracies among Croatia's Tudjmanistas that every little thing that goes wrong in Lijepa Nasa is somehow part of this omnipresent Serbian lobby, who along with communists and homosexuals are determined to destroy this allegedly powerful country no one seems to notice outside Western Hercegovina. If Serbia were as powerful as its critics claim it to be, they'd have retained Kosovo and took most of Bosnia with them while already enjoying EU membership for years.

No no, Black Mark, the decision by the First World not to attend your little dose of historical revisionism has less to do with Serbs ruining the fun and more to do with the First World having better things to do than listen to Thompson songs and watch a collection of old pensioners and twenty-something goons from Split march throughout Knin on a hot day shouting racist statements in honor of a fabricated victory.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

I doubt it, but maybe the NATO reps felt deep down that there was something really wrong about marking the ethnic cleansing of 250, 000 people & the murder of 2000 in a matter of days in such a positive way. Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.

So the glorification of Oluja isn't even the half of what's a very disturbed segment of Croatia's society.

Stan

pre 8 godina

Croatia is an affront to humanity. A disgusting creation built on the bones of millions of innocents, slaughtered in the most cruel ways.
nazism has been trying to make a comeback, but it appears to have taken a blow here. Good news all around.

njegos

pre 8 godina

HA! The Croat posters on this site would have us believe that Serbia is on life support and totally irrelevant from a political and every other perspective. And now the leader of the far right, neo Nazi HDZ is crying about Serbia's influence over Croatia's allies/neighbors. How embarrassing for Mighty Croatia! Or maybe it's Midget Croatia. LOL

Perhaps a better explanation is that Croatia's 'allies and partners in crime' see Croatia for what they really are: a far right leaning, intolerant nation with racist tendencies. This is an example of the real world distancing themselves from an country that will only smear their respective country's image on the world stage. Keep up the good work Croatia. Yet another step toward isolation. Have fun celebrating alone.

Hank the Tank

pre 8 godina

Marko K

Yes Marko, Serbia is last in its group. It might end up last and even loose to Albani but so what? You can't win them all. Lately we are winners of Wimbledon, world champions in soccer (U20), waterpolo champs etc. Not to mention Serbian acheivements in the past. No matter what Balkan country you are from you know you'll never be better then Serbia.

njegos

pre 8 godina

Sunman, I see you're still trolling Serbian sites trying to rewrite history.

You said: "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

This is funny coming from you. Please explain why the Croat gov't. spent millions of dollars on US PR forms like Ruder & Finn to slant the western press during the war of 90s?

Croatians are the masters of propaganda. Ever since WWII and your alliance with Nazi Germany you guys have been trying to rewrite history and cleanse your image. Even after the millions you've spent for propaganda purposes, the truth eventually comes out. The world is now seeing the true Croatia. Keep trying sunman. LOL

ida

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm was the largest ethnic cleansing of the entire Balkan Wars. Up to 300,000 in a few days.
Even today much of that area is practically uninhabited.
The Croats continued to kill the Serbs that stayed for many months.
UN reports say they kept finding freshly decapitated bodies - mainly elderly Serbian men.
The fact that the Croats kept killing civilians - and in primitive, sadistic and mutilated manner - who stayed shows a genocide.
The number of Serbs who died has been very downplayed and under-counted by the official media.

Those areas of Croatia were Serbs lived had a charming culture which has now been erased or de-placed. Croats made a desert out of it and called it "peace". And the last of Nikola Tesla's relatives were ethnically cleansed too.

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes, the international community and NATO are so scared and intimidated by Serbia and her long tongue. Serbia is such an important and big military and economic power in the world. It ranks up there with Bahamas, Tonga, the Gambia and the Seychelles. Yes, who says Serbia is small???

DefendingOnesCountryIsOk

pre 8 godina

Did you guys forget about. The Republic of Serbian Krajina? Did it exist? That region that serbs annexed out of 1/3 of a internationally recognized country and called it there own? Illegally? So now you mean to say that the defence of a country to stop another people from carving out 1/3rd of it...is a crime? And yes ppl lost lives..on both sides..even when the Serbs of krajina were creating there own state by killing and kicking out any Croatians living in the region. Which happened! Can't deny that..makes serbs guilty of genocide. And yes lots of Serbs moved out after they lost the region..which they initally stole threw ethnic cleansing..some because of fear and some because they were told to by there own. There is a famous picture with Serbs on the highway fleeing Croatia it's sad to see but they should be happy!..they are alive! Proof that they weren't harmed! And can return to there homes in Croatia today! Unlike the ppl of vukovar or skabrnje or Srebrenica, half of Bosna. Where innocent civilian people were butchered like animals. Bad stuff was done on all sides. I'm not arguing that. But if some other peoples tried to annex 1/3rd of serbia how would you react? You would do the exact same thing! There's nothing else you could call it! Self defence! If you want Kosovo back so much go have your own oluja! Stop trying to take other peoples land! You "technically" stole half of Bosna which was made legal! so stop crying! Everyone else lost way more than the serbs!

Moonshine

pre 8 godina

Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.
(sunman, 22 July 2015 14:48)

The butthurt is strong with this one. Don't worry sunman, no one's going to take away your day. Just that no one wants to celebrate it with you.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership.
(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14)

With all due respect, because I'm under the impression you actually believe what you write, but Storm was not an organized evacuation and if it was, it was the most chaotically organized evacuation in history.

Moreover, "evacuation" implies those who left are somehow able to return. This is another myth propagated by HDZ since most of those Serb houses were either demolished or repopulated with Croats. Serbs travelling throughout Storm were repeatedly assaulted and harassed by Croats, and many who took a wrong turn and wound up in a dead end blocked by Croats never got out. Even if Milosevic had planned this, as you claim, it was in cooperation with Tudjman who was more than happy to rid his beloved Domovina of an ethnic minority he made no effort to work with, choosing instead to side with ethnonationalsts. Plus, if Croats had nothing to do with what is now regarded as a Joint-Criminal Enterprise (you forgot to mention that, didn't you), then explain the endemic racism in Croatia twenty years after the ethnic cleansing against Serbs.

And if Storm is used as a case study in military strategy, I dread to know when attacking fleeing civilians and killing old pensioners is considered in taking over a territory the home state did absolutely nothing to integrate.

sunman

pre 8 godina

Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda. In the article you mention that Serbs were expelled from Croatia and thousands killed. This is factually wrong and historically incorrect. International courts have confirm that Croatia and it military campaign were legitimate and just, and that Croatia did Not expel Serbs. Serbs were ordered to evacuate in an order and pre planned strategy by its own leadership. Moreover courts have confirmed that Storm did not kill thousand in fact it has very few casualties and destruction (just look at the picture of Knin and vukovar after the respective military campaigns) especially compared with serbian forces destruction and killings. Journalism must also acknowledge that Serbia was occupying Croatia's territory and had either killed or forcibly expelled croatian and other non Serbs from the area liberated - when Croats were expelled they were forced to sign over their property to serbian forces or face death. Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Marko K., 22 July 2015 19:00

Completely agree. The senior team is atrocious. I've lost faith in humanity every time I've seen them play in the last year. So we are going to finish very poorly.

But at least we will be punished for our terrible play, and not punished because we are a bunch of Nazis. But don't worry too much about Serbia. Our U-20 team just won the World Cup which means our immediate future is looking very bright ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1nvVk5pIXg

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14) # Comment link

Ustasha denial: the same people who deny Jasenovac happened, or try to minimize the number also deny the extent of war crimes in Oluja. They claim that Milosevic "gave orders" to hundreds of thousands of people to pick up and leave their homes.

These were civilians, Milosevic was no one to give orders for anything. As if he had enough power to tell 250, 000 people just pick up and leave their ancestral homes in a matter of days. No, Croat terrorists broke down doors and threw out civilians by force.

Oluja taught at military academies? I doubt it. What's there to teach? "Make sure you have resources from NATO to help you carry out your aggression on your enemy"? Because that's all that happened. Croatia wouldn't have been able to carry any ethnic cleansing out without the guidance of NATO.

John Smith

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm. Ethnic cleansing at it's worst. What did the UN / NATO & World Powers do to prevent Croatia doing this? Nothing. NATO bombed the Serbs for driving out the terrorists Albanian's from Kosovo, but didnothing against the Croats. Why ?

Peggy

pre 8 godina

I wish our enemies would make up their mind about Serbia. On one hand they say that the whole world hates Serbia and Serbia is weak and now they are saying how Serbia has intimidated everyone into not celebrating this farce. Which is it?

laudy

pre 8 godina

sunman, international courts... really... hmm,
gwbush, and dickyChenney have also be found guilty and convicted of war crimes by an international court (KLWCT), yet they walk free, flaunt the international law with their version of the propaganda. if the western allies will not accept an international courts decisions, why should anybody else who is trying to emulate the democracy and freedoms of the west.
its all propaganda. truth is an abstraction these days.

Marko K.

pre 8 godina

Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.
(Ari Gold, 22 July 2015 12:39)

Hey Ari,
How is Serbia going to be able to finish the qualifiers without being humiliated. So far serbia is dead last in a group that includes such heavyweights as Armenia. Serbia thus far has accumulated negative two points (-2) and will be the first team ever to finish in the red. I think it's time to send in the under 21 team (many of whom were 23 years old) in order to attempt to bail you out so as to avoid a major humiliation.

butteredup

pre 8 godina

Only reason why Germans did not go there is because they want Serbia to EU so they can pretend that they once more have an empire with Habsburgs land included. Why would serbs join EU, if Germans openly would celebrate the defeat of Velika Srbija.

Roger7

pre 8 godina

sunman said, "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

Your views are colored by your self-interested sources and your obvious bias.

Don't believe your propaganda.

Suman

pre 8 godina

Been reading the responses to my post and am surprised at the level of denial, diversion, spin and level of cynicism. Folks whether you like Croats or whether Croats like you is not the point, the truth is point. Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership. Storm was the a brilliant military campaign with minimal civilian casualties and minimal collateral damage to reclaim Croatian legal and historical lands. Military colleges and strategists are using Storm as a case study in military effectiveness and leadership. Whether you want to accept the truth is a whole different story.

This is NOT 'new'

pre 8 godina

Feral Tribune, Split, Croatia, February 10, 2001

https://web.archive.org/web/20090108034605/http://www.ex-yupress.com/feral/feral156.html

Darkness From Above
In the flier that appeared in Krajina two days before the start of the operation Storm and which ordered Serb civilians to leave their homes, in the Cyrillic stamp of the Krajina Defense Ministry the first three letters are in the Latin script. Feral's source in the Croatian Defense Ministry claims that the flier was produced by the Croatian Defense Ministry Department for Special Warfare

by Frenki LAUSIC


...Instead of causing panic and confusion in the Serb units by propaganda-psychological tricks, which is allowed by the Geneva Conventions under the category of "wartime trickery", panic and confusion were provoked among the civilians in order to prompt them to run en masse. And that mode of special warfare could clearly be named special ethnic cleansing.

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes we all suck but it’s our life ! Serbia is a bone in the Balkan throat with it stubborn mentality and never dying last for Russia. Please leave us alone and let us suck. Or you Serbs really think that we are so dumb that we do not understand our real status quo ? We do but please stop your independence game and join us. We don’t need white crows here so be one of us and let the region relax. Serbs are the biggest problem. They do not live themselves and do not let to live for the rest. Stop it please and do not spit against the wind. Be one of us and suck with us to help the region ! Be sure you'll like it as they always tell you what to do and you have nothing to worry about.

rogersKab

pre 8 godina

sunman, you seem to be missing the overall point. from what you're suggesting it is not wrong because the people got out of the way and weren't willing to die in order for people like yourself to feel pity for them. they, ran from the war. the reasons they ran are less relevant than their running, and far less relevant than why they haven't returned.
weren't the likes of alan turing and his code breaker heros for giving civilians a chance to run. same thing. many people were smart enough to run, and you are suggesting that it was nothing. perhaps if and when you're ever faced with a flight or die situation you may reconsider your stance, or become a martyr and we can make a statue to commemorate bravery and idiocy all at once.

Mira

pre 8 godina

To all our dear neighbors in Serbia, the war didn't start in 1995. It started in 1991. In 1995 Croatia freed their homeland. Serbs should be celebrating this, because Croatia let all those people alive and in peace to leave, as was organized by your dear leader Milosevic. If Milosevic wouldn't have started the war, everyone would have lived in peace. Stop whining already and face reality.

sunman

pre 8 godina

Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda. In the article you mention that Serbs were expelled from Croatia and thousands killed. This is factually wrong and historically incorrect. International courts have confirm that Croatia and it military campaign were legitimate and just, and that Croatia did Not expel Serbs. Serbs were ordered to evacuate in an order and pre planned strategy by its own leadership. Moreover courts have confirmed that Storm did not kill thousand in fact it has very few casualties and destruction (just look at the picture of Knin and vukovar after the respective military campaigns) especially compared with serbian forces destruction and killings. Journalism must also acknowledge that Serbia was occupying Croatia's territory and had either killed or forcibly expelled croatian and other non Serbs from the area liberated - when Croats were expelled they were forced to sign over their property to serbian forces or face death. Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.

Stan

pre 8 godina

Croatia is an affront to humanity. A disgusting creation built on the bones of millions of innocents, slaughtered in the most cruel ways.
nazism has been trying to make a comeback, but it appears to have taken a blow here. Good news all around.

Suman

pre 8 godina

Been reading the responses to my post and am surprised at the level of denial, diversion, spin and level of cynicism. Folks whether you like Croats or whether Croats like you is not the point, the truth is point. Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership. Storm was the a brilliant military campaign with minimal civilian casualties and minimal collateral damage to reclaim Croatian legal and historical lands. Military colleges and strategists are using Storm as a case study in military effectiveness and leadership. Whether you want to accept the truth is a whole different story.

njegos

pre 8 godina

HA! The Croat posters on this site would have us believe that Serbia is on life support and totally irrelevant from a political and every other perspective. And now the leader of the far right, neo Nazi HDZ is crying about Serbia's influence over Croatia's allies/neighbors. How embarrassing for Mighty Croatia! Or maybe it's Midget Croatia. LOL

Perhaps a better explanation is that Croatia's 'allies and partners in crime' see Croatia for what they really are: a far right leaning, intolerant nation with racist tendencies. This is an example of the real world distancing themselves from an country that will only smear their respective country's image on the world stage. Keep up the good work Croatia. Yet another step toward isolation. Have fun celebrating alone.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

I doubt it, but maybe the NATO reps felt deep down that there was something really wrong about marking the ethnic cleansing of 250, 000 people & the murder of 2000 in a matter of days in such a positive way. Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.

So the glorification of Oluja isn't even the half of what's a very disturbed segment of Croatia's society.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

LOL while a part of me wishes Hrvatska do Zero would finally be resigned to the dustbin of history where it belonged a decade ago, I can't help but laugh at people like Karamarko and Gospodjo Kolinda for making a spectacle out of the Domovina. I love how he somehow believes Serbia has this diplomatic leverage throughout Europe to somehow succeed in pressuring every EU member state to withdraw from attending Croatia's annual Family Fascist Freak Fest this August. I also love the conspiracies among Croatia's Tudjmanistas that every little thing that goes wrong in Lijepa Nasa is somehow part of this omnipresent Serbian lobby, who along with communists and homosexuals are determined to destroy this allegedly powerful country no one seems to notice outside Western Hercegovina. If Serbia were as powerful as its critics claim it to be, they'd have retained Kosovo and took most of Bosnia with them while already enjoying EU membership for years.

No no, Black Mark, the decision by the First World not to attend your little dose of historical revisionism has less to do with Serbs ruining the fun and more to do with the First World having better things to do than listen to Thompson songs and watch a collection of old pensioners and twenty-something goons from Split march throughout Knin on a hot day shouting racist statements in honor of a fabricated victory.

njegos

pre 8 godina

Sunman, I see you're still trolling Serbian sites trying to rewrite history.

You said: "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

This is funny coming from you. Please explain why the Croat gov't. spent millions of dollars on US PR forms like Ruder & Finn to slant the western press during the war of 90s?

Croatians are the masters of propaganda. Ever since WWII and your alliance with Nazi Germany you guys have been trying to rewrite history and cleanse your image. Even after the millions you've spent for propaganda purposes, the truth eventually comes out. The world is now seeing the true Croatia. Keep trying sunman. LOL

DefendingOnesCountryIsOk

pre 8 godina

Did you guys forget about. The Republic of Serbian Krajina? Did it exist? That region that serbs annexed out of 1/3 of a internationally recognized country and called it there own? Illegally? So now you mean to say that the defence of a country to stop another people from carving out 1/3rd of it...is a crime? And yes ppl lost lives..on both sides..even when the Serbs of krajina were creating there own state by killing and kicking out any Croatians living in the region. Which happened! Can't deny that..makes serbs guilty of genocide. And yes lots of Serbs moved out after they lost the region..which they initally stole threw ethnic cleansing..some because of fear and some because they were told to by there own. There is a famous picture with Serbs on the highway fleeing Croatia it's sad to see but they should be happy!..they are alive! Proof that they weren't harmed! And can return to there homes in Croatia today! Unlike the ppl of vukovar or skabrnje or Srebrenica, half of Bosna. Where innocent civilian people were butchered like animals. Bad stuff was done on all sides. I'm not arguing that. But if some other peoples tried to annex 1/3rd of serbia how would you react? You would do the exact same thing! There's nothing else you could call it! Self defence! If you want Kosovo back so much go have your own oluja! Stop trying to take other peoples land! You "technically" stole half of Bosna which was made legal! so stop crying! Everyone else lost way more than the serbs!

ida

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm was the largest ethnic cleansing of the entire Balkan Wars. Up to 300,000 in a few days.
Even today much of that area is practically uninhabited.
The Croats continued to kill the Serbs that stayed for many months.
UN reports say they kept finding freshly decapitated bodies - mainly elderly Serbian men.
The fact that the Croats kept killing civilians - and in primitive, sadistic and mutilated manner - who stayed shows a genocide.
The number of Serbs who died has been very downplayed and under-counted by the official media.

Those areas of Croatia were Serbs lived had a charming culture which has now been erased or de-placed. Croats made a desert out of it and called it "peace". And the last of Nikola Tesla's relatives were ethnically cleansed too.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 8 godina

Serbs were NOT expelled, they were evacuated by YOUR leadership which was pre-planned - this is factual based on testimony and documents from YOUR leadership.
(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14)

With all due respect, because I'm under the impression you actually believe what you write, but Storm was not an organized evacuation and if it was, it was the most chaotically organized evacuation in history.

Moreover, "evacuation" implies those who left are somehow able to return. This is another myth propagated by HDZ since most of those Serb houses were either demolished or repopulated with Croats. Serbs travelling throughout Storm were repeatedly assaulted and harassed by Croats, and many who took a wrong turn and wound up in a dead end blocked by Croats never got out. Even if Milosevic had planned this, as you claim, it was in cooperation with Tudjman who was more than happy to rid his beloved Domovina of an ethnic minority he made no effort to work with, choosing instead to side with ethnonationalsts. Plus, if Croats had nothing to do with what is now regarded as a Joint-Criminal Enterprise (you forgot to mention that, didn't you), then explain the endemic racism in Croatia twenty years after the ethnic cleansing against Serbs.

And if Storm is used as a case study in military strategy, I dread to know when attacking fleeing civilians and killing old pensioners is considered in taking over a territory the home state did absolutely nothing to integrate.

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes, the international community and NATO are so scared and intimidated by Serbia and her long tongue. Serbia is such an important and big military and economic power in the world. It ranks up there with Bahamas, Tonga, the Gambia and the Seychelles. Yes, who says Serbia is small???

Marko K.

pre 8 godina

Btw, Croatia's football team faces disqualification from the rest of the Euro 2016 qualifiers for their giant swastika they imprinted into the field.
(Ari Gold, 22 July 2015 12:39)

Hey Ari,
How is Serbia going to be able to finish the qualifiers without being humiliated. So far serbia is dead last in a group that includes such heavyweights as Armenia. Serbia thus far has accumulated negative two points (-2) and will be the first team ever to finish in the red. I think it's time to send in the under 21 team (many of whom were 23 years old) in order to attempt to bail you out so as to avoid a major humiliation.

Moonshine

pre 8 godina

Only those mourning a criminal greater Serbia see things in a skewed and false view contorted to fit their narrative of victim and equalization of guilt.
(sunman, 22 July 2015 14:48)

The butthurt is strong with this one. Don't worry sunman, no one's going to take away your day. Just that no one wants to celebrate it with you.

Bob

pre 8 godina

Yes we all suck but it’s our life ! Serbia is a bone in the Balkan throat with it stubborn mentality and never dying last for Russia. Please leave us alone and let us suck. Or you Serbs really think that we are so dumb that we do not understand our real status quo ? We do but please stop your independence game and join us. We don’t need white crows here so be one of us and let the region relax. Serbs are the biggest problem. They do not live themselves and do not let to live for the rest. Stop it please and do not spit against the wind. Be one of us and suck with us to help the region ! Be sure you'll like it as they always tell you what to do and you have nothing to worry about.

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Suman, 23 July 2015 04:14) # Comment link

Ustasha denial: the same people who deny Jasenovac happened, or try to minimize the number also deny the extent of war crimes in Oluja. They claim that Milosevic "gave orders" to hundreds of thousands of people to pick up and leave their homes.

These were civilians, Milosevic was no one to give orders for anything. As if he had enough power to tell 250, 000 people just pick up and leave their ancestral homes in a matter of days. No, Croat terrorists broke down doors and threw out civilians by force.

Oluja taught at military academies? I doubt it. What's there to teach? "Make sure you have resources from NATO to help you carry out your aggression on your enemy"? Because that's all that happened. Croatia wouldn't have been able to carry any ethnic cleansing out without the guidance of NATO.

butteredup

pre 8 godina

Only reason why Germans did not go there is because they want Serbia to EU so they can pretend that they once more have an empire with Habsburgs land included. Why would serbs join EU, if Germans openly would celebrate the defeat of Velika Srbija.

John Smith

pre 8 godina

Operation Storm. Ethnic cleansing at it's worst. What did the UN / NATO & World Powers do to prevent Croatia doing this? Nothing. NATO bombed the Serbs for driving out the terrorists Albanian's from Kosovo, but didnothing against the Croats. Why ?

Hank the Tank

pre 8 godina

Marko K

Yes Marko, Serbia is last in its group. It might end up last and even loose to Albani but so what? You can't win them all. Lately we are winners of Wimbledon, world champions in soccer (U20), waterpolo champs etc. Not to mention Serbian acheivements in the past. No matter what Balkan country you are from you know you'll never be better then Serbia.

Peggy

pre 8 godina

I wish our enemies would make up their mind about Serbia. On one hand they say that the whole world hates Serbia and Serbia is weak and now they are saying how Serbia has intimidated everyone into not celebrating this farce. Which is it?

Ari Gold

pre 8 godina

(Marko K., 22 July 2015 19:00

Completely agree. The senior team is atrocious. I've lost faith in humanity every time I've seen them play in the last year. So we are going to finish very poorly.

But at least we will be punished for our terrible play, and not punished because we are a bunch of Nazis. But don't worry too much about Serbia. Our U-20 team just won the World Cup which means our immediate future is looking very bright ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1nvVk5pIXg

Mira

pre 8 godina

To all our dear neighbors in Serbia, the war didn't start in 1995. It started in 1991. In 1995 Croatia freed their homeland. Serbs should be celebrating this, because Croatia let all those people alive and in peace to leave, as was organized by your dear leader Milosevic. If Milosevic wouldn't have started the war, everyone would have lived in peace. Stop whining already and face reality.

laudy

pre 8 godina

sunman, international courts... really... hmm,
gwbush, and dickyChenney have also be found guilty and convicted of war crimes by an international court (KLWCT), yet they walk free, flaunt the international law with their version of the propaganda. if the western allies will not accept an international courts decisions, why should anybody else who is trying to emulate the democracy and freedoms of the west.
its all propaganda. truth is an abstraction these days.

This is NOT 'new'

pre 8 godina

Feral Tribune, Split, Croatia, February 10, 2001

https://web.archive.org/web/20090108034605/http://www.ex-yupress.com/feral/feral156.html

Darkness From Above
In the flier that appeared in Krajina two days before the start of the operation Storm and which ordered Serb civilians to leave their homes, in the Cyrillic stamp of the Krajina Defense Ministry the first three letters are in the Latin script. Feral's source in the Croatian Defense Ministry claims that the flier was produced by the Croatian Defense Ministry Department for Special Warfare

by Frenki LAUSIC


...Instead of causing panic and confusion in the Serb units by propaganda-psychological tricks, which is allowed by the Geneva Conventions under the category of "wartime trickery", panic and confusion were provoked among the civilians in order to prompt them to run en masse. And that mode of special warfare could clearly be named special ethnic cleansing.

Roger7

pre 8 godina

sunman said, "Journalism has a responsibility to uncovering and reporting on the truth. Otherwise it is propaganda."

Your views are colored by your self-interested sources and your obvious bias.

Don't believe your propaganda.

rogersKab

pre 8 godina

sunman, you seem to be missing the overall point. from what you're suggesting it is not wrong because the people got out of the way and weren't willing to die in order for people like yourself to feel pity for them. they, ran from the war. the reasons they ran are less relevant than their running, and far less relevant than why they haven't returned.
weren't the likes of alan turing and his code breaker heros for giving civilians a chance to run. same thing. many people were smart enough to run, and you are suggesting that it was nothing. perhaps if and when you're ever faced with a flight or die situation you may reconsider your stance, or become a martyr and we can make a statue to commemorate bravery and idiocy all at once.