Priština "declared independence legally" - U.S. embassy

As usual the U.S. government speaks with a forked tongue and loses more credibility.

The time is long overdue to throw out the US ambassador and declare him 'persona non grata'. He's just a CIA stooge who funds anti-Serbian fifth columnists through NGO's, just like Victoria 'F*#% the EU' Nuland - and we can see what mess these NATO war criminals created there - supporting a neo-nazi led putsch government and calling it 'democracy'. Hypocrites and clowns full of hubris is what they are. They must be really upset that their main anti-Serbian hate monger, Ceda Jovanovic, is out of the government :).
Cheers!!

The fact that Western governments have to even start repeating this shows that recognition of Kosovo i Metohija as an independent state did open a Pandora's box because it went against international norms.

Now Crimea is only the beginning. Actually, South Ossetia and Abkhazia was. Next Venice, Catalonia, Wallonia, Scotland, Basque, Republika Srpska and probably more will want the same (albeit partial) recognition that was given to the Albanians in Kosovo i Metohija.

No matter if their specific reasons for independence is all different, in 10, 20, 50 years, history will judge the first unilateral separation as the root cause for all these regions seeking independence and actually declaring it.

The U.S. embassy statement is a weak effort to try and repair Obama's poor attempt at altering history. Because the west says it, it is true, and when someone else disagrees - it is propaganda.

Putin says, "They (western allies)have come to believe in their exceptionalism and their sense of being the chosen ones. That they can decide the destiny of the world, that it is only them who can be right."

The US embassy statement helps to support what Putin said.

The US can argue whatever it likes but we can all see the double standards and cynicism.

It created a precedent by violating the territorial integrity of a sovereign and UN recognised state. It went against the constitution of the said state (something it is arguing in favour of the Ukraine) and it did not receive UNSC approval. The action was unilateral and there was no referrendum. It has motivated separatism around the world, especially in Europe such as Italy, Spain and Belgium.

There was no humanitarian catastrophy in KiM prior to NATO bombing. Serbia was legitimately cracking down on KLA terrorism. In fact, what we had was decades worth of ethnic cleansing and intimidation against Serbs.

That is the problem when powerful countries have big egos. They make things up and act like schoolyard bullies but it ends up backfiring in their face.

Thank you Comm. Parrisson. I was hoping I wasn't the only sane one in the room after reading about the information put out by the US Ministry of Truth. The only referendum that took place under UN administration in Kosovo was the one organized in 2011 in northern Kosovo where Serbs voted overwhelmingly to reject Kosovo's institutions as their own. Other than that, I don't recall any referendum in Kosovo, or any UN administration that organized such a thing. Maybe there's another Kosovo the United States is speaking of that we haven't heard of because as far as anyone with a passing interest on Kosovo's recent history is concerned, thoughts of independence only because part of US foreign strategy as of 2007. Certainly not part of the original bargain with UNSC 1244 in 1999. Americans may be more subtle in their foreign policy than Russians, but they're horrible liars.

Milosevic had plenty of chances to solve things, but chose to use nationalism as a way of keeping power.

Serbia was the loser because of the political ineptitude of nationalism.

Nationalists don't realise that if you make enemies, you may lose against them.

The west was given cause to intervene in Kosovo. That was the mistake Serbia made.

The problem with allowing UDI after a 'humanitarian' intervention however, is that it confuses intervention because of a problem, with straight forward invasion.

Kosovo now looks like an invasion - despite any humanitarian justification.

Crimea is an invasion - with just a vague humanitarian excuse.

Kosovo UDI is (internationally speaking) a mistake, and not a good precedent.

Yes, NATO only intervened after the atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsion through Serbian troops and paramilitaries.
(Comm. Parrisson, 31 March 2014 15:45)
--
Are you able to show some evidence that atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsions occured prior to NATOs intervention? Seems like your memory is as good as Obama's.

Kosovo independence is not legal in any way and the US statement is deplorable.

The declaration of independence by the KLA bandits is illegal, the occupation of Kosovo by foreign forces is illegal, the theft of Serbian resources in Kosovo by US Senators is illegal.

"There was no humanitarian catastrophy in KiM prior to NATO bombing. Serbia was legitimately cracking down on KLA terrorism. "
(Zoran, 31 March 2014 15:16)

With legitimate paramilitaries who raided, looted, raped and killed, you mean? Maybe watch some recent court rulings in Belgrade against Kosovo war criminals, i.e. those people who thought it was 'legitimate' to destroy a whole village or family if they suspected one 'terrorist' amongst them. What about the truck found in Belgrade with bodies of Albanians? Surely all 'terrorists', right?

Sorry, Zoran, fighting terrorism might be legitimate, but only with legal means of police and justice, and not with soldiers and paramilitaries, looting and raping.

Anvi, no the US is not right and neither are you. The declaration of independence in Kosovo is not legal and the US state department saying it is does not make it so.

Mirel, not in a million years can you ask a people to forget their own land and cut their losses. People wait for the right climate and then take back what is theirs and so it will be with Kosovo. The Americans will one day be in no position to uphold this illegality, that day will come then we shall see how the land lies.

Sorry, Zoran, fighting terrorism might be legitimate, but only with legal means of police and justice, and not with soldiers and paramilitaries, looting and raping.
(Comm. Parrisson, 31 March 2014 18:01)
--
You don't even know what you are writing. You claim that NATO intervened to stop what you are claiming. So you are saying all that happened before NATO's aggression even started.

There was an OSCE mission in Kosovo (KVM) observing and documenting the situation on the ground prior to NATO's aggression so I challenge you to show us what you claim is true.

Why didn't the OSCE report it? William Walker was head and he was looking for any excuse to start the aggression. If it happened (or even if it didn't) then he would have reported it. He was known for making things up (i.e. Racak) so why didn't he report what you claim happened prior to NATO's aggression?

The fact is NATO started a humanitarian disaster, it didn't intervene to stop one. Show me proof!

Had the federal republic of Yugoslavia not continued to disintegrate as it did with
Montenegro's Declaration of Independence in 2006, I could see how Res 1244 could have remained a viable document!
However, with Montenegro a part of frm Yugo with a larger Serbian population then that one of Kosova splitting away from federal republic of Yugoslavia, it was only made clear to the world & to the citizens of Kosova that this once federal Yugoslav republic was at that point dead, and officially ceased to exist any longer!! From that point on, it was only a matter of time & the preparing of some remaining technicalities that the 95% majority Albanian population would also declare her independence! Why would Kosova remain a part of something that didn't exist any longer? The 95% majority had no relation to the Serbs, a completely different race, a race which adopted policies of genocide & ethnic cleansing against the 95% Albanian majority! For some 100+ years the Albanian majority lived under a apartheid system, which Serbia brutally enforced upon the majority citizens of kosova! The citizens of kosova & their democratically elected officials new that Serbia would never change her brutal policies of discrimination against the majority population of kosova! Now since Kosova's independence it is much better, Kosovar's mind their own business, and Serbia can mind her own business, and thank you Jesus for that, as it was a horrific experience for the citizens of kosova!

The fact is NATO started a humanitarian disaster, it didn't intervene to stop one. Show me proof!
(Zoran, 31 March 2014 22:11)

Unfortunately, the UN disagrees with you when it found "that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes, conducted by forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities, during which there were incidents of killing, sexual assault, and the intentional destruction of mosques. It was the deliberate actions of these forces during this campaign that caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999. Efforts by the MUP to conceal the killing of Kosovo Albanians, by transporting the bodies to other areas of Serbia also suggest that such killings were criminal in nature."

Again some misinformation:

"UN Security Council Resolution 1244 established a special legal regime for Kosovo under UN administration and provided for a political process for determining Kosovo’s future status, which included the possibility of independence."

This is true. But he forgot to mention that UN1244 talks about an 'agreed solution' for the final status of Kosovo, and not an UDI.

"Unlike Crimea, in Kosovo there was a legitimate democratic process, under UN Administration, that included a free and fair vote to constitute a representative Kosovo parliament, which legally declared independence..."

The 'representative Kosovo parliament' was voted under UN adminstration, that's true. The rest is wrong: The UDI was done by self-proclaimed 'representatives of the people of Kosovo'. The ICJ ruled that the UDI was not violating UN1244 exactly because of that.


"NATO only intervened after the people of Kosovo were systematically brutalized and killed for years. Kosovo only left Serbia after a referendum was organized – not outside the boundaries of international law but in careful cooperation with the United Nations, and with Kosovo’s neighbors"

Yes, NATO only intervened after the atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsion through Serbian troops and paramilitaries. But there was no referendum, and especially not 'in cooperation with the United Nations', because the UNMIK mission in Kosovo was explicitly status neutral.

USA is right. By the way Serbs can keep Russians, we'll keep Americans. Keep in mind since Kosovo declared independence it has been recognized by 106 countries. On the other hand South Ossetia and Abkhazia backed by Russia have been recognized by only 4 countries each. We can see who's more powerful. Having USA on your side is better.

Honestly, I don't know what Tanjug expected the US ambassador to say? Of course he would say what he did about Kosovo's independence, they believe it's legal. Regardless of all of the international laws they violated, they're not going to admit wrong doing. I obviously feel different, but that can be debated on here for eternity.

Crimea voted for independence in the same way that Kosovo did. The only difference is Russia didn't bomb Ukraine for 79 days to force them out , and take away a historically Ukrainian land away. Russians also were not forcing 95% of the population to vote the way they did. Crimea is unique in that it's actually Russian land that was given to Ukraine during the USSR 60 years ago.

I don't agree with the way either Crimea or Kosovo was done and handled, but let's face it, the situations are very similar...more similar than different. For the US ambassador to say one was a special case while the other isn't is pure smoke up your rear end. As usual, it's the 'humanitarian' aspect of Kosovo (ignoring Albanian crimes of course) while in Crimea it wasn't an issue that they use as the difference. Ummm, with Kosovo it was 'the will of the people' argument in 2008, so why do they change their thoughts now?

It would be funny to see what would happen if Mexicans took up arms in southern parts of California, Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico to declare independence. I wonder how the US would respond...I bet it would be a 'humanitarian'.

And then they failed to provide any proof. Anyone can write a memo, that's easy. All this proof they were going to show the world....never materialized.
(Aleks, 2 April 2014 22:33)

Please direct your inquiry to the UN... But between and anonym person like you saying something and the UN saying something, let me see whom most people would choose to believe.... :)

As for you getting convinced, that is an exercise in futility - no amount of proof would change that if that proof does not match what you have in the virtual reality in your head.

Also, let's not forget, that according to Serbs, what the UN says is the word of God.

there no referendum on independence, that is true, but does anyone here actually think that had there been one, those who live in Kosova would have voted to stay inside Serbia? if you believe that, then you may as well believe in unicorns. if all it takes is a referendum, we'll have one tomorrow. the heavenly people are not as sophisticated as the Brits when it comes to self-determination.

The real events happened like this: Serbia did not accept the Rambouillet Dictact; then she was bombed for almost 3 months; followed by foreign military occupation; then the illegal vote and illegal secession. That is what happened. It distorted all the international norms, and has brought the world to the boomerang effect it is causing now.

"that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes..."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)
--
Thank you for proving my point. As you can read, the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.

the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.
(Zoran, 2 April 2014 23:55)

False.This is taught in primary schools worldwide and is known as a logical fallacy. Correlation does not imply causation. I drank coffee this morning and then the sun started to shine, therefore my drinking coffee caused the sun to shine

...Kosovo independence is not legal in any way and the US statement is deplorable.

The declaration of independence by the KLA bandits is illegal, the occupation of Kosovo by foreign forces is illegal, the theft of Serbian resources in Kosovo by US Senators is illegal.
(Legal Eagle, 31 March 2014 21:10)....

The same thing England said about Founding Fathers of USA.They called them bandits,thieves etc.After several years they recignised USA as independent.

The same thing said Turkey for Greeks,Serbs,Albanians etc when they declared their independence and in the end they accepted that.

Do I have to go on more?
Serbia,like all empires before, has to face the reality on the ground.
Is Kosovo the real Jerusalem of Serbia and is it worthied to keep it?I doubt it,because if it was their Jerusalem,they didnt have to abandon it and move to Belgrade,while Kosovo was under their rule.

So make a math.
Cut the losses and make a deal with K-Alb,while officially recognize Kosovo.
Or keep Kosovo under your rule with 1.8 milion albanians who,unlike 1999, already have weapons in their hand and are being recognized by more that half of UN members.You may conquest Kosovo,but it will trigger a guerrilla war where serbs will die every day.None of Albanians will colaborate with you,so managing a hostile territorry will be terrible for serbs.

So like all emipres,if you are smart, you have to choose cutting the losses,so make a deal with K-Alb and move on.

There's nothing funnier then when people think themselves so important so as to believe their blessing matters. @Legal Eagle, no one is asking for your permission are they? i mean, if you could, you'd have stopped Albanians declaring independence and you'd have stopped 100+ UN states recognising them. truth is, you couldn't and you can't do either of those things, so you come on B92 and protest. face it, neither Serbs nor Albanians are going to decide, nor is anyone going to ask for Serbia's acceptance, because ultimately, you're not important enough

The declaration of independence in Kosovo is not legal and the US state department saying it is does not make it so.
(Legal Eagle, 1 April 2014 11:25)

But the International Court of Justice saying so, does make it, unless, of course, what you are saying is that Kosovo's declaration of independence is not legal under Serbia's law - that's obviously correct.
----------

Mirel, not in a million years can you ask a people to forget their own land and cut their losses. People wait for the right climate and then take back what is theirs and so it will be with Kosovo. The Americans will one day be in no position to uphold this illegality, that day will come then we shall see how the land lies.
(Legal Eagle, 1 April 2014 11:25)

Ok, let us know when that days comes, if we are still around to celebrate it!

"that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes..."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)
--
Thank you for proving my point. As you can read, the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.
(Zoran, 2 April 2014 23:55)

Well, I was not disputing WHEN the broad campaign of violence happened - we agree there, so I'm happy to prove your point about that from reliable sources like the UN. Btw, there is also a little known fact that I'm so glad to reveal that the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** my dinner on 23 March, 1999, and not prior to it.

So, now that we established the time, I hope that you also agree that as far as who was RESPONSIBLE for it... "it was the deliberate actions of forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999" says the UN.

Obama misspoke. The last time Kosovo held a referendum for independence was in 1991. At the time 89%+ of the people voted. After the vote, it was proven that 99%+ of the people in that election voted to leave Serbia.

That was in 1991. Nearly 20 years before declaring independence. All other options were exhausted.

Crimea voted for independence in the same way that Kosovo did. The only difference is Russia didn't bomb Ukraine for 79 days to force them out , and take away a historically Ukrainian land away. Russians also were not forcing 95% of the population to vote the way they did.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

I guess you are saying that an armed robber pointing a gun on your head is OK, as long as he does not fire :)
----------


Crimea is unique in that it's actually Russian land that was given to Ukraine during the USSR 60 years ago.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

There are many territories that were given to a country or another in the past decades or centuries; which are the ones that should be undone :)
----------


It would be funny to see what would happen if Mexicans took up arms in southern parts of California, Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico to declare independence. I wonder how the US would respond...I bet it would be a 'humanitarian'.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

But they have no intention of doing that! It's quite the opposite; Mexicans do whatever they can to go into the US, not to leave the US :)

Unfortunately, the UN disagrees with you when it found "that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes, conducted by forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities, during which there were incidents of killing, sexual assault, and the intentional destruction of mosques. It was the deliberate actions of these forces during this campaign that caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999. Efforts by the MUP to conceal the killing of Kosovo Albanians, by transporting the bodies to other areas of Serbia also suggest that such killings were criminal in nature."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)

And then they failed to provide any proof. Anyone can write a memo, that's easy. All this proof they were going to show the world....never materialized.

Please direct your inquiry to the UN...But between and anonym person like you saying something and the UN saying something, let me see whom most people would choose to believe..:)

As for you getting convinced, that is an exercise in futility -no amount

Also, let's not forget, that according to Serbs, what the UN says is the word of God.
(icj1, 3 April 2014 21:29)

ICJ, proof is an excercise in futility for people like you. People who are in denial as to what happened in Kosovo, what Albanians did, & the responsibility they bear. Regardless, there's no proof to match my 'virtual reality'. Simple proof of the massacre of 100's of thousands of Albanians, or even just 100 thousand Albanians was assured by NATO, the EU, & US. Where is it?

I'm not denying crimes, & I never have. I fully believe Albanians suffered at the hands of Serbs. There was a war, it would be stupid to suggest it didn't happen. However, the actions Albanians and the KLA in particular, left little choice but to get a response. If anyone is in virtual reality, it's people like you ICJ who fail to comprehend any reality & read books and history based on some Albanian 'myth figure'...history that only Albanians learn & believe.

It doesn't matter anyway. You believe what you believe (Albanians are innocent and did nothing wrong..LOL), I know what I know. Nothing we say here changes anything anyway.

O course it was legal. America says so and it must be he case- get real, why would you even put s$;t here that the American embassy says so.

Grow up you clowns at B92, the funds must still be coming from ms Nuland and the national endowment for democracy

Aleks, Zoran,
Do you also want proof that earth moves around sun?

Comm. Parrisson,
You assume they were fighting terrorism. In reality they were applying the Cubrillovic Doctrine. This is not the first time ethnic cleaning took place in Albanian lands. Just look up both topics, and you will find tens of unbised sources describing them.

Had the federal republic of Yugoslavia not continued to disintegrate as it did with
Montenegro's Declaration of Independence in 2006, I could see how Res 1244 could have remained a viable document!
However, with Montenegro a part of frm Yugo with a larger Serbian population then that one of Kosova splitting away from federal republic of Yugoslavia, it was only made clear to the world & to the citizens of Kosova that this once federal Yugoslav republic was at that point dead, and officially ceased to exist any longer!! From that point on, it was only a matter of time & the preparing of some remaining technicalities that the 95% majority Albanian population would also declare her independence! Why would Kosova remain a part of something that didn't exist any longer? The 95% majority had no relation to the Serbs, a completely different race, a race which adopted policies of genocide & ethnic cleansing against the 95% Albanian majority! For some 100+ years the Albanian majority lived under a apartheid system, which Serbia brutally enforced upon the majority citizens of kosova! The citizens of kosova & their democratically elected officials new that Serbia would never change her brutal policies of discrimination against the majority population of kosova! Now since Kosova's independence it is much better, Kosovar's mind their own business, and Serbia can mind her own business, and thank you Jesus for that, as it was a horrific experience for the citizens of kosova!

Milosevic had plenty of chances to solve things, but chose to use nationalism as a way of keeping power.

Serbia was the loser because of the political ineptitude of nationalism.

Nationalists don't realise that if you make enemies, you may lose against them.

The west was given cause to intervene in Kosovo. That was the mistake Serbia made.

The problem with allowing UDI after a 'humanitarian' intervention however, is that it confuses intervention because of a problem, with straight forward invasion.

Kosovo now looks like an invasion - despite any humanitarian justification.

Crimea is an invasion - with just a vague humanitarian excuse.

Kosovo UDI is (internationally speaking) a mistake, and not a good precedent.

As usual the U.S. government speaks with a forked tongue and loses more credibility.

The fact that Western governments have to even start repeating this shows that recognition of Kosovo i Metohija as an independent state did open a Pandora's box because it went against international norms.

Now Crimea is only the beginning. Actually, South Ossetia and Abkhazia was. Next Venice, Catalonia, Wallonia, Scotland, Basque, Republika Srpska and probably more will want the same (albeit partial) recognition that was given to the Albanians in Kosovo i Metohija.

No matter if their specific reasons for independence is all different, in 10, 20, 50 years, history will judge the first unilateral separation as the root cause for all these regions seeking independence and actually declaring it.

there no referendum on independence, that is true, but does anyone here actually think that had there been one, those who live in Kosova would have voted to stay inside Serbia? if you believe that, then you may as well believe in unicorns. if all it takes is a referendum, we'll have one tomorrow. the heavenly people are not as sophisticated as the Brits when it comes to self-determination.

The U.S. embassy statement is a weak effort to try and repair Obama's poor attempt at altering history. Because the west says it, it is true, and when someone else disagrees - it is propaganda.

Putin says, "They (western allies)have come to believe in their exceptionalism and their sense of being the chosen ones. That they can decide the destiny of the world, that it is only them who can be right."

The US embassy statement helps to support what Putin said.

Kosovo independence is not legal in any way and the US statement is deplorable.

The declaration of independence by the KLA bandits is illegal, the occupation of Kosovo by foreign forces is illegal, the theft of Serbian resources in Kosovo by US Senators is illegal.

Sorry, Zoran, fighting terrorism might be legitimate, but only with legal means of police and justice, and not with soldiers and paramilitaries, looting and raping.
(Comm. Parrisson, 31 March 2014 18:01)
--
You don't even know what you are writing. You claim that NATO intervened to stop what you are claiming. So you are saying all that happened before NATO's aggression even started.

There was an OSCE mission in Kosovo (KVM) observing and documenting the situation on the ground prior to NATO's aggression so I challenge you to show us what you claim is true.

Why didn't the OSCE report it? William Walker was head and he was looking for any excuse to start the aggression. If it happened (or even if it didn't) then he would have reported it. He was known for making things up (i.e. Racak) so why didn't he report what you claim happened prior to NATO's aggression?

The fact is NATO started a humanitarian disaster, it didn't intervene to stop one. Show me proof!

USA is right. By the way Serbs can keep Russians, we'll keep Americans. Keep in mind since Kosovo declared independence it has been recognized by 106 countries. On the other hand South Ossetia and Abkhazia backed by Russia have been recognized by only 4 countries each. We can see who's more powerful. Having USA on your side is better.

There's nothing funnier then when people think themselves so important so as to believe their blessing matters. @Legal Eagle, no one is asking for your permission are they? i mean, if you could, you'd have stopped Albanians declaring independence and you'd have stopped 100+ UN states recognising them. truth is, you couldn't and you can't do either of those things, so you come on B92 and protest. face it, neither Serbs nor Albanians are going to decide, nor is anyone going to ask for Serbia's acceptance, because ultimately, you're not important enough

The time is long overdue to throw out the US ambassador and declare him 'persona non grata'. He's just a CIA stooge who funds anti-Serbian fifth columnists through NGO's, just like Victoria 'F*#% the EU' Nuland - and we can see what mess these NATO war criminals created there - supporting a neo-nazi led putsch government and calling it 'democracy'. Hypocrites and clowns full of hubris is what they are. They must be really upset that their main anti-Serbian hate monger, Ceda Jovanovic, is out of the government :).
Cheers!!

The US can argue whatever it likes but we can all see the double standards and cynicism.

It created a precedent by violating the territorial integrity of a sovereign and UN recognised state. It went against the constitution of the said state (something it is arguing in favour of the Ukraine) and it did not receive UNSC approval. The action was unilateral and there was no referrendum. It has motivated separatism around the world, especially in Europe such as Italy, Spain and Belgium.

There was no humanitarian catastrophy in KiM prior to NATO bombing. Serbia was legitimately cracking down on KLA terrorism. In fact, what we had was decades worth of ethnic cleansing and intimidation against Serbs.

That is the problem when powerful countries have big egos. They make things up and act like schoolyard bullies but it ends up backfiring in their face.

Again some misinformation:

"UN Security Council Resolution 1244 established a special legal regime for Kosovo under UN administration and provided for a political process for determining Kosovo’s future status, which included the possibility of independence."

This is true. But he forgot to mention that UN1244 talks about an 'agreed solution' for the final status of Kosovo, and not an UDI.

"Unlike Crimea, in Kosovo there was a legitimate democratic process, under UN Administration, that included a free and fair vote to constitute a representative Kosovo parliament, which legally declared independence..."

The 'representative Kosovo parliament' was voted under UN adminstration, that's true. The rest is wrong: The UDI was done by self-proclaimed 'representatives of the people of Kosovo'. The ICJ ruled that the UDI was not violating UN1244 exactly because of that.


"NATO only intervened after the people of Kosovo were systematically brutalized and killed for years. Kosovo only left Serbia after a referendum was organized – not outside the boundaries of international law but in careful cooperation with the United Nations, and with Kosovo’s neighbors"

Yes, NATO only intervened after the atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsion through Serbian troops and paramilitaries. But there was no referendum, and especially not 'in cooperation with the United Nations', because the UNMIK mission in Kosovo was explicitly status neutral.

"There was no humanitarian catastrophy in KiM prior to NATO bombing. Serbia was legitimately cracking down on KLA terrorism. "
(Zoran, 31 March 2014 15:16)

With legitimate paramilitaries who raided, looted, raped and killed, you mean? Maybe watch some recent court rulings in Belgrade against Kosovo war criminals, i.e. those people who thought it was 'legitimate' to destroy a whole village or family if they suspected one 'terrorist' amongst them. What about the truck found in Belgrade with bodies of Albanians? Surely all 'terrorists', right?

Sorry, Zoran, fighting terrorism might be legitimate, but only with legal means of police and justice, and not with soldiers and paramilitaries, looting and raping.

...Kosovo independence is not legal in any way and the US statement is deplorable.

The declaration of independence by the KLA bandits is illegal, the occupation of Kosovo by foreign forces is illegal, the theft of Serbian resources in Kosovo by US Senators is illegal.
(Legal Eagle, 31 March 2014 21:10)....

The same thing England said about Founding Fathers of USA.They called them bandits,thieves etc.After several years they recignised USA as independent.

The same thing said Turkey for Greeks,Serbs,Albanians etc when they declared their independence and in the end they accepted that.

Do I have to go on more?
Serbia,like all empires before, has to face the reality on the ground.
Is Kosovo the real Jerusalem of Serbia and is it worthied to keep it?I doubt it,because if it was their Jerusalem,they didnt have to abandon it and move to Belgrade,while Kosovo was under their rule.

So make a math.
Cut the losses and make a deal with K-Alb,while officially recognize Kosovo.
Or keep Kosovo under your rule with 1.8 milion albanians who,unlike 1999, already have weapons in their hand and are being recognized by more that half of UN members.You may conquest Kosovo,but it will trigger a guerrilla war where serbs will die every day.None of Albanians will colaborate with you,so managing a hostile territorry will be terrible for serbs.

So like all emipres,if you are smart, you have to choose cutting the losses,so make a deal with K-Alb and move on.

Yes, NATO only intervened after the atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsion through Serbian troops and paramilitaries.
(Comm. Parrisson, 31 March 2014 15:45)
--
Are you able to show some evidence that atrocities, killings, rapes, looting and expulsions occured prior to NATOs intervention? Seems like your memory is as good as Obama's.

Obama misspoke. The last time Kosovo held a referendum for independence was in 1991. At the time 89%+ of the people voted. After the vote, it was proven that 99%+ of the people in that election voted to leave Serbia.

That was in 1991. Nearly 20 years before declaring independence. All other options were exhausted.

Thank you Comm. Parrisson. I was hoping I wasn't the only sane one in the room after reading about the information put out by the US Ministry of Truth. The only referendum that took place under UN administration in Kosovo was the one organized in 2011 in northern Kosovo where Serbs voted overwhelmingly to reject Kosovo's institutions as their own. Other than that, I don't recall any referendum in Kosovo, or any UN administration that organized such a thing. Maybe there's another Kosovo the United States is speaking of that we haven't heard of because as far as anyone with a passing interest on Kosovo's recent history is concerned, thoughts of independence only because part of US foreign strategy as of 2007. Certainly not part of the original bargain with UNSC 1244 in 1999. Americans may be more subtle in their foreign policy than Russians, but they're horrible liars.

The declaration of independence in Kosovo is not legal and the US state department saying it is does not make it so.
(Legal Eagle, 1 April 2014 11:25)

But the International Court of Justice saying so, does make it, unless, of course, what you are saying is that Kosovo's declaration of independence is not legal under Serbia's law - that's obviously correct.
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Mirel, not in a million years can you ask a people to forget their own land and cut their losses. People wait for the right climate and then take back what is theirs and so it will be with Kosovo. The Americans will one day be in no position to uphold this illegality, that day will come then we shall see how the land lies.
(Legal Eagle, 1 April 2014 11:25)

Ok, let us know when that days comes, if we are still around to celebrate it!

The fact is NATO started a humanitarian disaster, it didn't intervene to stop one. Show me proof!
(Zoran, 31 March 2014 22:11)

Unfortunately, the UN disagrees with you when it found "that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes, conducted by forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities, during which there were incidents of killing, sexual assault, and the intentional destruction of mosques. It was the deliberate actions of these forces during this campaign that caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999. Efforts by the MUP to conceal the killing of Kosovo Albanians, by transporting the bodies to other areas of Serbia also suggest that such killings were criminal in nature."

Anvi, no the US is not right and neither are you. The declaration of independence in Kosovo is not legal and the US state department saying it is does not make it so.

Mirel, not in a million years can you ask a people to forget their own land and cut their losses. People wait for the right climate and then take back what is theirs and so it will be with Kosovo. The Americans will one day be in no position to uphold this illegality, that day will come then we shall see how the land lies.

Crimea voted for independence in the same way that Kosovo did. The only difference is Russia didn't bomb Ukraine for 79 days to force them out , and take away a historically Ukrainian land away. Russians also were not forcing 95% of the population to vote the way they did.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

I guess you are saying that an armed robber pointing a gun on your head is OK, as long as he does not fire :)
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Crimea is unique in that it's actually Russian land that was given to Ukraine during the USSR 60 years ago.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

There are many territories that were given to a country or another in the past decades or centuries; which are the ones that should be undone :)
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It would be funny to see what would happen if Mexicans took up arms in southern parts of California, Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico to declare independence. I wonder how the US would respond...I bet it would be a 'humanitarian'.
(Aleks, 1 April 2014 19:33)

But they have no intention of doing that! It's quite the opposite; Mexicans do whatever they can to go into the US, not to leave the US :)

Please direct your inquiry to the UN...But between and anonym person like you saying something and the UN saying something, let me see whom most people would choose to believe..:)

As for you getting convinced, that is an exercise in futility -no amount

Also, let's not forget, that according to Serbs, what the UN says is the word of God.
(icj1, 3 April 2014 21:29)

ICJ, proof is an excercise in futility for people like you. People who are in denial as to what happened in Kosovo, what Albanians did, & the responsibility they bear. Regardless, there's no proof to match my 'virtual reality'. Simple proof of the massacre of 100's of thousands of Albanians, or even just 100 thousand Albanians was assured by NATO, the EU, & US. Where is it?

I'm not denying crimes, & I never have. I fully believe Albanians suffered at the hands of Serbs. There was a war, it would be stupid to suggest it didn't happen. However, the actions Albanians and the KLA in particular, left little choice but to get a response. If anyone is in virtual reality, it's people like you ICJ who fail to comprehend any reality & read books and history based on some Albanian 'myth figure'...history that only Albanians learn & believe.

It doesn't matter anyway. You believe what you believe (Albanians are innocent and did nothing wrong..LOL), I know what I know. Nothing we say here changes anything anyway.

"that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes..."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)
--
Thank you for proving my point. As you can read, the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.

And then they failed to provide any proof. Anyone can write a memo, that's easy. All this proof they were going to show the world....never materialized.
(Aleks, 2 April 2014 22:33)

Please direct your inquiry to the UN... But between and anonym person like you saying something and the UN saying something, let me see whom most people would choose to believe.... :)

As for you getting convinced, that is an exercise in futility - no amount of proof would change that if that proof does not match what you have in the virtual reality in your head.

Also, let's not forget, that according to Serbs, what the UN says is the word of God.

Honestly, I don't know what Tanjug expected the US ambassador to say? Of course he would say what he did about Kosovo's independence, they believe it's legal. Regardless of all of the international laws they violated, they're not going to admit wrong doing. I obviously feel different, but that can be debated on here for eternity.

Crimea voted for independence in the same way that Kosovo did. The only difference is Russia didn't bomb Ukraine for 79 days to force them out , and take away a historically Ukrainian land away. Russians also were not forcing 95% of the population to vote the way they did. Crimea is unique in that it's actually Russian land that was given to Ukraine during the USSR 60 years ago.

I don't agree with the way either Crimea or Kosovo was done and handled, but let's face it, the situations are very similar...more similar than different. For the US ambassador to say one was a special case while the other isn't is pure smoke up your rear end. As usual, it's the 'humanitarian' aspect of Kosovo (ignoring Albanian crimes of course) while in Crimea it wasn't an issue that they use as the difference. Ummm, with Kosovo it was 'the will of the people' argument in 2008, so why do they change their thoughts now?

It would be funny to see what would happen if Mexicans took up arms in southern parts of California, Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico to declare independence. I wonder how the US would respond...I bet it would be a 'humanitarian'.

Unfortunately, the UN disagrees with you when it found "that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes, conducted by forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities, during which there were incidents of killing, sexual assault, and the intentional destruction of mosques. It was the deliberate actions of these forces during this campaign that caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999. Efforts by the MUP to conceal the killing of Kosovo Albanians, by transporting the bodies to other areas of Serbia also suggest that such killings were criminal in nature."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)

And then they failed to provide any proof. Anyone can write a memo, that's easy. All this proof they were going to show the world....never materialized.

The real events happened like this: Serbia did not accept the Rambouillet Dictact; then she was bombed for almost 3 months; followed by foreign military occupation; then the illegal vote and illegal secession. That is what happened. It distorted all the international norms, and has brought the world to the boomerang effect it is causing now.

the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.
(Zoran, 2 April 2014 23:55)

False.This is taught in primary schools worldwide and is known as a logical fallacy. Correlation does not imply causation. I drank coffee this morning and then the sun started to shine, therefore my drinking coffee caused the sun to shine

"that there was a broad campaign of violence directed against the Kosovo Albanian civilian population during the course of the NATO airstrikes..."
(icj1, 2 April 2014 05:00)
--
Thank you for proving my point. As you can read, the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** NATO's aggression and not prior to it. Had NATO not bombed, it would not have occurred.
(Zoran, 2 April 2014 23:55)

Well, I was not disputing WHEN the broad campaign of violence happened - we agree there, so I'm happy to prove your point about that from reliable sources like the UN. Btw, there is also a little known fact that I'm so glad to reveal that the humanitarian catastrophe occurred **during** my dinner on 23 March, 1999, and not prior to it.

So, now that we established the time, I hope that you also agree that as far as who was RESPONSIBLE for it... "it was the deliberate actions of forces under the control of the FRY and Serbian authorities caused the departure of at least 700,000 Kosovo Albanians from Kosovo in the short period of time between the end of March and beginning of June 1999" says the UN.

O course it was legal. America says so and it must be he case- get real, why would you even put s$;t here that the American embassy says so.

Grow up you clowns at B92, the funds must still be coming from ms Nuland and the national endowment for democracy

Aleks, Zoran,
Do you also want proof that earth moves around sun?

Comm. Parrisson,
You assume they were fighting terrorism. In reality they were applying the Cubrillovic Doctrine. This is not the first time ethnic cleaning took place in Albanian lands. Just look up both topics, and you will find tens of unbised sources describing them.