actually croatia was enslaved in yugoslavia, serbia had full dictatorship over the whole country. thats why croatia wanted independece. what good is unity and brotherhood, when every serb is offered a job as docoter or lawyer in croatia. and every croat is forced to dig raods or work in a field. thats not freedom or unity at all.
personally i think serbia. shoudl be happy and not hate albania, bosina , croatia and the rest of the countrys. insteas look to investing all its energy and money into schools and universitys and forge a utopia. well thats what i would do.
first of all croatian ustas where from the northern reagins. the southern dalmatians and caost were all partizan. against germany and nazi ustas.after ww2 all ustas were executed or they fled to south americara. because they used to torture our poeple and partizan resisantce. only half of croatia was possibly usas. and no there are neo-nazis or ustas in croatia lving now. as they were executing for gouging the eyes and torturing their partizan and own ppl. thats why no ones knows about them. they were exterminated. and if they exist ,then their may be in south america now.which of some were extradited back to europe, to be face trial to be executed.
im a dalmation croat. and my whole familal tree was partizan as was 99% of all other dalmatians from the massive coast and islands.We dont hate serbia trust me.But!! i think the village folk and inbreds that were in the ustas. probably had a reason for being the way they. why must every country near croatia want to conquer and wipe croatia off the map own it and everyhting in it. yes ustas were scum and an disgrace to croatia.
But invading croatia and attempting to forge a greater country is proabably waht made the ustas the scum they were.
any child is born neutral, atack. rape. kill its parents. and viola.
its full of hate and not as human anymore. so before all u say. how serbia is innccent. why have you been trying to turn croatia into greater serbia for how long?? 500 800 YEARs??
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history.
============================
Fine, don't reconcile. I really don't care but maybe you should stop believing in your own fairy tales before you accuse me of it.
Maybe I should not believe my own lying eyes when I see old footage from archives actually showing Croatians welcoming Serbs with flowers, song and dance.
Don't worry. Serbia will never again do anything for you. Deal with your own occupiers yourself.
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you."
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 22:49)
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history. For the record, the Croatian Sabor and people never "willingly joined" the "Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes" which was just established by the Allied victors at the Treaty of Versailles. Croatian leader Stjepan Radic (do you even know who he was ?) was actually arrested and imprisoned for protesting it for Christ’s sake !
Furthermore, dear, it was renamed "Yugoslavia" ten years later when your king Alexander I abolished the Constitution, and imposed his royal dictatorship in his coup d'état of 1929, you know that "January 6th Dictatorship" which you guys either don't know about, or still pretend never happened.
The Croatian people never had a say about being merged with the Serbs. The latter was simply done by the Allies to allow Serbians outside Serbia to all live in the same state while completely dismantling the former Hapsburg Empire.
...your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
So the double headed eagle is a Serb property now? And here I thought the double headed eagle has been used by various peoples throughout history, you know like the Babylonians and Hittites since 1250 b.c , and borrowed by almost everyone since then. Everyone except Serbs that is. Their double headed eagle is a brand new original symbol which Albanians copied because there have never been any civilizations greater than the Serbs we could get the double headed eagle from, ever.
Yes that’s right wake up and smell the coffee…....smell anything, just wake up.
I know plenty about history, and this article is about recent modern day history i.e. Gotovina.
Anyways…tell me, how many times in “history” has Croatia attacked Serbia proper?
Every country has its propaganda, Croatia is no exception, but Serbia are the Kings of propaganda, propaganda seems to be the basis of the Serbian identity, it is what keeps them going. The sooner that stops the better it is for Serbia.
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
(you think?, 27 November 2012 10:33)
=====================================
I never said there was no need to reconcile. I said that with attitudes like that it was not probable that reconciliation was going to happen.
Now what do you suggest Serbia does?
Turn the other cheek for the third time?
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you.
We then turned the other cheek, forgave and it was majority Serbs who wanted to stay in the brotherhood and unity with all, only to be stabbed in the back AGAIN with 1990s ethnic cleansing and mass murder (OLUJA).
How many times do you think we should just turn the other cheek and trust again?
Don't you think that now it's their turn to acknowledge their part in establishing bad relations and bad blood and this time it's their turn to want to reconcile?
Or, do you think it's all Serbia's fault and therefore Serbia should be the bigger man all the time and keep asking for reconciliation?
reading "Veotoni"´s contribution, I wonder why Albanians are always big mouths when they are in a chat-room or internet-forum...but when it comes to trouble in the real world, they prove to be cowards.
I have witnessed that a few times and it was always the same with them.
simple wannabees. actually, they should be waving a white flag on their "flag day" - it would match much better to their not so heroic mentality.
oh, and by the way, don´t you Albanians ask yourself where that bicephalic eagle on "your" flag derives from?
it is your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
so whenever you look at your flag, my dear k-albanian boys...remember where the symbol comes from!
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
(ZZ, 26 November 2012 20:12)
So, that must be Russia and China, because, according to the CE of the B92 forums sj, Russia and China have the cash, whereas the West has collapsed and is starving.
“When indictment was issued against Ratko Mladić in the Srebrenica case, we did not even wait for the guilty verdict, the (Serbian) parliament immediately passed a resolution condemning the Srebrenica crime."
Well, that Srebrenica was genocide had already been established beyond reasonable doubt by a court set up by Russia, China & Co. long before Serbia's parliament resolution in 2010. We don't need the conclusion of Mladic's trial to establish that Srebrenica was genocide.
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
(icj1, 27 November 2012 03:01)
--
My friend, your ignorance shines. Not even your poor attempt at spin can hide it.
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 02:20)
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
Don't forget to read this book also. Check -> [link]
Travesty: The Trial of Slobodan Milosevic and the Corruption of International Justice by John Laughland
(Zoran, 26 November 2012 22:19)
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
(croatia-eu, 26 November 2012 21:39)
===========================
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
(Mirel from Albania)
They should have offered independence
(aaayyy)
--------------------------------
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country
(Mirel from Albania, 26 November 2012 22:13)
Just like Serbia could be stable and prosperus country now if it had expelled all Albanians from Kosovo. No people - no problem.
Tom, wake up and smell what? do guys like you really come on here to post empty rhetoric without knowing anything about history? Really? I mean, look at Jasenovac, that was a massacre. And expelling 250,000 is the 2nd biggest. How many times do you hear about the Nazi croats and albanians during WWII? Hardly ever...you hear a lot about Hitler, and the bad Germans though all the time, those hardline Nazi's..etc.
Its almost as ppl forget about the gruesome crimes albanians and croats did . You people need to educate yourself a bit more. Serbia has not been on the wrong side of these wars. The propaganda machine made them look that way. And you blame Nikolic for saying what he said? He should have said it before. You cant step all over a nation like a door mat forever. We have done more right than the nazi croats ever have..and nothing is good enough. Time to realize, it never may be. And you delirious posters on here..time to read a book. And maybe, just maybe, you will go post about flowers or arts and crafts, becuase you are wasting your time here, unless you know something about history, and what the nation of Serbia has endured.
This guys said two months ago thet he never want to be President of Prishtina and gave several reasons such as he was never welcome there etc.
Now he wants to be President of Prishtina?
While Dacic wants a Dayton for Kosovo and Serbia.
What is going on in Serbia?Are those guys clawns or politicans?
Hasan, I believe it was the DS and tadic that kept Mladic out of the hague for many years, they were the ones in power, not Nikolic. The DS handed him over when the time was right, and he no longer served as a bargaining chip for them. Why you jumping ugly so much on Toma?
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
Serbs themselves clean up Krajina from croats and other minorities and refused to deal with Zagreb who at the time was UN member and with internationally knows borders.
Based on this cicurmstances there were two ways to deal with serbs:
1.Leave them like in Noth Kosovo where Republic of Knin would have been paradise for durgs and money laundring
or
2.show them that this is Croatia and they are citizens of Croatia and they supposed to obey the Constitution of Croatia.
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country and EU member after 1 month.And please spare me with the statements that Serbia standard living is better tha Croatia coz are not.
exKFOR, 26 November 2012 19:16)
In 2004 the ICTY ruled that the crimes in Srebrenica was Genocide, and the UNSG stated it was the worst crimes on European soil since WW2.
One has to wonder why a Serb calls himself exKfor, whose mandate was to force all Serb forces and police out of Kosovo and make sure they did not return?
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
--
LOL!! One has to limit the scope to "European soil" and "after WWII" to make a point. Well my friend, Croatia, Germany and your partners in crime (Bosnian Muslims, Turks, Albanians, etc...) committed the most horrific crimes the world has known in recent history. Srebrenica wouldn't even be mentioned in comparison.
Now if we remove the "Europe" limitation, we know that the USA and NATO have committed the most horrific crimes post WWII. They are responsible for millions up millions of deaths in their push for US hegemony.
No one buys your rubbish Nikolle so remember that all of this will come to an end soon enough. Your side is losing ground day by day while we are getting stronger. We know the score and we now know what needs to be done to bring lasting peace to the Balkans.
Gotovina was not released due to “politics” it is more the case of he was originally thrown in jail due to “politics”
Serbs, wake up and smell the coffee, join reality and the rest of the world, the longer you live and thrive in your own propaganda machine (which the rest of the world pays no attention to) the better it is for your country and people.
Mario, what ever books are written we know the score, Former Krajina ~(as mentioned in 1750 austrian maps) is not so beautiful its basically rolling hills and arable land worked hard by generations of Serbian families since the 1600s. Nice is when you get a living for a reasonable effort like germany, uk etc I cannot see too many croatians from zagreb or dubrovnik running to inhabit these areas, instead they send refugee janjevci & bosnian croatians who take a look and run for the nearest town cafes. These areas are empty of serbs and unproductive just what Tudjman and his cronies planned. Unfortunately this is not communist jugoslavija in 1947, crimes will be investigated sooner or later, each and every murder. I believe law abiding peoples would want that.
Face it, the international community passed the judgment in its highest UN sponsored court. The ruling goes against your twisted reality and no lies will ever be able to change that. If only a fraction of your day to day energy would be used for reconciliation with an honest heart then the whole region would be better off. I believe that most of hard-code serbian commentators are most likely living abroad and it is shameful that such people are propagating hatred and non reconciliation, spiced by complete ignorance of the evidence and responsibility as a nation.
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
"Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 16:05)
I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general.
@milan
"I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general."
(Milan, 26 November 2012 21:13)
And how exactly do you know that "these guys should not have been acquitted". I guess you must have evidence that only yourself has access to, in which case you should be tried for treason by Serbia... LOL
What a joke. You people are incredible. Lies and more lies and then lying to yourselves and others and your children and god knows who else...
Here you go my friends, a book to read. Check -> http://tangibleinfo.blogspot.be/2009/06/how-america-gets-away-with-murder.html
MICHAEL MANDEL ON HOW AMERICA GETS AWAY WITH MURDER
Mandel is a Professor at the Osgoode Hall Law School at York University in Toronto, Canada, with a specialty in international law and with some enlightening experience as the individual who, in May 1999, in the midst of NATO's 78-day bombing war against Yugoslavia, presented a petition for the indictment of 68 NATO leaders for their war crimes to Louise Arbour, then prosecutor of the Tribunal. His account of this experience and his analysis of Arbour.s and her successor Carla Del Ponte's handling of this petition is crushing, and even funny, as he contrasts their finely-tuned adjustments to NATO's needs for public relations service to its military plans with their crude and often laughable modes of evading even an official investigation of the documented evidence of NATO crimes.
There is no finer account of the structured bias of the Tribunal, its de facto control by the United States, the integration of its work to the needs of U.S. political objectives in the area, and its judicial failings, which characterize it at every level of its operations. Mandel is no fan of Milosevic, but makes it very clear that he is on trial strictly because he was the political target of the NATO war, and the supreme criminals needed his demonization, arrest and show-trial guilt to prove the justice of their cause.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia i
==============================
What about before WW2? Why don't you want to mention WW2?
How about we compare what happened in Srebrenica to what happened in Jasenovac and see who comes out dirty?
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
When has any court ruled that Serbia committed any kind of crimes in Srebrenica? nit even the kangaroo ICTY. Nor did it Serbs from Bosnia - most of jihadists got killed in fighting - but again - when have Albanians ever read anything but Koran? assuming that Serbs did executed cold-bloodedly POWs then they did not commit genocide or attempted to to carry it out - tey only would have killed adult male (wouldbe) Mulsim soldiers - as Muslims had plenty of male teens under that age one cannot speak about possible elimination of the particvular group - teens would have grown bigger and continue breeding as Muslims do all over the world. So, calm down Nikolle and read some unbiased materials and use critical thinking - otherwise you sound like Soviets at Nurenburg (Katyn massacre)
I believe a criminal act was committed. 2000+ bosnian muslim fighters killed in combat trying to escape + innocent men/boys murdered in retribution. Dont forget the shame on the bosnian muslim forces who left after starting their military folly against serbian forces. Srebrenica was a 'demilitarized safe area' not a military spring board for bosnian muslims forces to kill serbians. Don't forget the slaughtered Serbian women, children and old in villages around srebrenica within your "genocide" calculation.
I think it means the plan for total liquidation of all, women, men children as a national group/identity, i.e. 1916 liquidation of christian armenian population in ottoman empire.
What crimes? Doris Pack (member of European Parliament) told European Parliament: 'Storm is a legitimate action, Croats were returning abducted territory!' A good book to read up on Croatian history is: "Croatia: A Nation forged in War" by Marcus Tanner. I almost don't blame you Serbs want Croatia for your self. Croatia is so beautiful!
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
"Listen" to this petty little soul of the yellow pro organ harvesters trying to hide their bloody tracks. Lol
“However, it is obvious that we cannot cooperate in a sincere and open manner with a country that celebrates its crimes. It cannot be done! It doesn't go that way! In whose name? On behalf of the victims, on behalf of their children?"
-- You have perfectly described Serbia. When you ask for forgiveness and recognize your crimes in Kosova you can hope to be treated better. Since you still celebrate those crime you will continue to remain a pariah.
They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with).
(think again, 26 November 2012 17:15)
The US promised to the USSR not to make attempts to invade Cuba in return to our withdrowal of missles and kept its promise. So there was help.
I was a little sceptic when Nikolic gained power in Serbia. Now, I'm sold and happy we have a honest president who tells it how it is. My wish has been to have a Dodik in Serbia. We may just have found one. Me happy!
Like you bombed us? Really?? It was NATO who bombed us, we both know if NATO had no involvement then the war would have been over in weeks and a Serbian flag would be flying in Pristina right now.
"If there is a country in Europe with a more revolting history than Croatia (Germany excluded) please suggest."
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
They probably arrested Hotovina and told him "don't worry, we just want to make it possible for Croatia to join EU and to convince Serbia to arrest Mladic. After that we will make you free"
This modified comment says that Genocide was perpetrated on the Serbs of Krajina who were there for centuries, and Krajina is located in Croatia.
Police have found bodies of People who were obviously murdered, but in a few cases they could not find the culprit, or they could not convict or extradite the culprit because of various reasons.
The Fact that the culprit could not be found or a suspect found guilty, does not diminish the Fact that a murder had taken place, or that there was a Criminal and a Victim involved.
It is exactly the same with Croatia, and with the Genocide that they perpetrated against the Serbian minority in Krajina, for the only reason that they were of a different race.
President Bush said Iraq has weapons of Mass Destruction as his reason for invading Iraq, and we need to know the Criminals will always blame the Victims, and so ignore the Lies of Croatian and Western Politicians.
Franjo Tudman and Alija Izetbegovic, cannot be put on Trial and found Guilty of Genocide, because they are dead, and Adolf Hitler cannot be put on trial for Genocide that he is Definitely Guilty of; just like Franjo Tudman, Alija Izetbegovic, and Presidents Bill and Hillary Clinton are Guilty of Genocide against Serbs.
A realistic understanding of how the Genocide that was committed by Croatia against its Serbian Minority has been Documented.
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
(Niall O'Doherty, 26 November 2012 16:29)
Shows that you can try to twist anything to prove a point, maybe you should actually ask the people in Cuba instead. Even Castro himself has said many times that the US has crippled his country. They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with). Probably a very similar situation to what Serbia can expect should all the balkans join the EU with the exception of Serbia.
Commentators-if you choose to post-use this as it has the link to the song. Thank you.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
(Bam Bam, 26 November 2012 13:39)
The self-righteous proper goody two shoe happy concentration campers that never did anything wrong should listen to this song very carefully without crying. It's the sign of the times!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Uqb2vts8m1g
Nikolle, Croatia has moved on to better things? You mean, Croatia has been cleansed, and not held accountable for any of its war crimes by its EU handlers, so as to enter the rotten Union unblemished? You daily anti-Serb rants are getting quite old, why don't you just come out and say, "I hate Serbs, and wish them everything bad"? You would then be more credible, instead of trying to sound oh so clever and wise. You are not. You are just a simple hate filled person.
this man is like a baby SERBS lissen to me u do what u have to do and we do what we think is good for us STOP talking if u wont o war strart on but this time not only we gona bomb u like in 99 but we going to push the army up to molla e kuqee near nis long live ethnice albaniaaa
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
(Milan, 26 November 2012 12:51)
The objective of a court is to deal with the accused and to find him guilty and not guilty based on facts and proofs relating to that person.
Concerning the Genocide Case we have the confirmation that Srebrenica was an act of genocide, with the RS and their leaders as perpetrators. Aside from a range of Serbian politicians, among them Nikolic, nobody challenged that, while Tomo denounced Vukovar as a Serbian city. Only the missing proofs that Serbia was directly involved to it, made it impossible to sentence Serbia for it. From a judicial point of view, I have nothing against it, but we all know the truth. Sounds familiar to you?
Simply, reconciliation cannot be achieved by courts. It is a political and socio-cultural progress. The Serbian side just proves that it was never about reconciliation but about downplaying and white washing the own guilt. "Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
These are fair words from Nikolic, but these are just words and I fail to see any genuine action. The fact that he is still chasing EU membership (which will never happen) despite the fact that the Serbian people are growing against it makes him to be an absolute fool, because the most powerful states in the EU aided Croatia in its crimes in the 90s. If Nikolic wants Serbs to take him seriously then there needs to be action, such as abandonment of the EU and a serious stance taken with Croatia, the issuing of arrest warrants for various ustasa war criminals and so on.
Bam Bam, funny you call Nikolic a "right wing maniac" because you come on here often echoing opinions of an ustasa nature, your people remain to be fixated with the fascist ustasa ideology. Any comment for the ustasa crimes of WWII? Without answering with a question about supposed Serbian war crimes.
I see a brave man who is willing to say what every non-croatian thinks, even if this gets people (like we can see here on b92 website) to post double standarded remarks and accuse him of extremism or even slobodism.
I think it is unbelievable though that he has to be the first person saying these things. No one in international community on a public level said "wait, hold on a second, Croatia is doing some things here that are not okay, after the tribunal made a ruling that was also not okay". The problem this carries with it is that when people say nonsense like "Ohh ignore him he's just a serb being serbian" im affraid the people who dont want him to be heard will seem more credible (though we all know they are likely people who dream of a time where everyone dressed in Ustase uniforms can do their bidding to anyone they consider ethnically inferior for whatever reason).
Speaking of which, did anyone else notice that Serbian nationalism is all about "Look at my beautiful culture country and people and come enjoy it with us!" (well you see how the albanians went about this offer of hospitality :-/) and Croatian Nationalism is all about marching in columns waving the same flag that flew over Jasenovac and denying of ethnic cleansing and massacres.
What thing? Oh, the 23 years of invasion, occupation, liberation, ethnic cleansing, refugee suffering, law suits, violence at sports matches, conflicting history books? You mean that "thing"?
Finally some smart words and backbone shown by President Nikolic. I hope he keeps it up. Show the Fourth Reich (the EU) the middle finger, call out our enemies, quit pretending they are friends, and demand truth and justice - nothing less. This is the path to victory.
Cheers!!
Make sure that it is quite some time before Serbia rules a Line under this.
The Serbia President is being Far Too Polite, but it good, if this is just Practice.
The EU should be referred to as Naziland, and Croatia should the land of the Ustacha.
If it were up to me, I would give it to them without using bad Language, but it would be accurate Language.
I would make those Bastards go insane with my speech, and TRUST ME, I would make them beg me to stop, because those Nazis know that they would go insane from my Truthful Judgemental Speech.
There is nothing wrong with choosing this course of Action, but it needs to be Fierce, Fast, and Unrelenting until it has accomplished its task.
Serbia’s Enemies call the Serbs Chetniks, yet we know what is the status of Draza Mihajlovic, and Serbia cannot Rehabilitate the Chetnik Leader from Lies, then Serbia had better make up for it some other way, that would make Draza Mihajlovic proud to be a Serb.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
Serbs and Serbian officials have not been honest to begin with. They only arrested Mladic when they smelled an EU membership opportunity. That was done after almost couple of decades so you will not fool anyone else but yourself on that matter. Secondly, only if you could have thought about the outcome of the 90's wars and genocides that you Serbs so much loved and are proud of today this would not have happened. You have created nothing but enemies around yourselves. You're certainly in no position to point fingers at others when you're one of the dirtiest man yourself and most of your nationalistic partners in your administration. These Croats may not be the brightest, but I am sure their reasons are far more legitimate than the reasons what Serbs have done to Croatians Bosnians and Albanians. I hope Nikolic does realize that no one I mean no one in this world cares about what he has to say and his future intentions with neighboring countries around are. The world simply has had enough of this Serbian (We are the victims) game already. You can dream about being a president of Prishtina, you said it yourself a few months back that it is impossible for you to be president of Prishtina. While you're the president of Serbia try to improve Serbia itself, don't worry so much about others who simply don't worry about you and anything you have to say.
Oh, Ante...you want me to come back do you? After what happened to immediate family in two separate generations at two separate times in history? I'm not about to convert to Catholicism so what's your plan for me exactly? On second thought I might return termporarily (sp?) just to give you a good smack about...
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
In the paragraph regarding the indictment against Mladic (1995), Nikolic fails to mention that it was another 16 years before he was arrested, giving the impression that it happened almost simultaneously. Anyway, on the subject of Croatia I agree with Toma that they are now adopting a holier than thou attitude towards regional war crimes. I attended various conferences in BiH at which Croatian delegates were present. Because they were well down the road towards EU membership they treated the Bosnian delegates in a terribly condescending way and I am reminded of this now in the whole discussion about Operation Storm and the fall out from the appeal verdict. Being a good 'winner' is harder than being a good 'loser' and Croatia is proving this adage to be true on a daily basis.
When people and nations hurt us over and over again, lets think of them as sandpaper. We may get scratched, but end up polished and they end up useless.
As you sow, so shall you reap. We have powerful nations on our side my fellow Serbs. Nations that are gaining global power and momentum.
On the other hand, our fake partners (i.e. opponents) are losing momentum. Time is on our side but our opponents know this so beware of trickery and keep our guard strong.
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
Finally some smart words and backbone shown by President Nikolic. I hope he keeps it up. Show the Fourth Reich (the EU) the middle finger, call out our enemies, quit pretending they are friends, and demand truth and justice - nothing less. This is the path to victory.
Cheers!!
When people and nations hurt us over and over again, lets think of them as sandpaper. We may get scratched, but end up polished and they end up useless.
As you sow, so shall you reap. We have powerful nations on our side my fellow Serbs. Nations that are gaining global power and momentum.
On the other hand, our fake partners (i.e. opponents) are losing momentum. Time is on our side but our opponents know this so beware of trickery and keep our guard strong.
Oh, Ante...you want me to come back do you? After what happened to immediate family in two separate generations at two separate times in history? I'm not about to convert to Catholicism so what's your plan for me exactly? On second thought I might return termporarily (sp?) just to give you a good smack about...
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
Serbs and Serbian officials have not been honest to begin with. They only arrested Mladic when they smelled an EU membership opportunity. That was done after almost couple of decades so you will not fool anyone else but yourself on that matter. Secondly, only if you could have thought about the outcome of the 90's wars and genocides that you Serbs so much loved and are proud of today this would not have happened. You have created nothing but enemies around yourselves. You're certainly in no position to point fingers at others when you're one of the dirtiest man yourself and most of your nationalistic partners in your administration. These Croats may not be the brightest, but I am sure their reasons are far more legitimate than the reasons what Serbs have done to Croatians Bosnians and Albanians. I hope Nikolic does realize that no one I mean no one in this world cares about what he has to say and his future intentions with neighboring countries around are. The world simply has had enough of this Serbian (We are the victims) game already. You can dream about being a president of Prishtina, you said it yourself a few months back that it is impossible for you to be president of Prishtina. While you're the president of Serbia try to improve Serbia itself, don't worry so much about others who simply don't worry about you and anything you have to say.
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
In the paragraph regarding the indictment against Mladic (1995), Nikolic fails to mention that it was another 16 years before he was arrested, giving the impression that it happened almost simultaneously. Anyway, on the subject of Croatia I agree with Toma that they are now adopting a holier than thou attitude towards regional war crimes. I attended various conferences in BiH at which Croatian delegates were present. Because they were well down the road towards EU membership they treated the Bosnian delegates in a terribly condescending way and I am reminded of this now in the whole discussion about Operation Storm and the fall out from the appeal verdict. Being a good 'winner' is harder than being a good 'loser' and Croatia is proving this adage to be true on a daily basis.
I was a little sceptic when Nikolic gained power in Serbia. Now, I'm sold and happy we have a honest president who tells it how it is. My wish has been to have a Dodik in Serbia. We may just have found one. Me happy!
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia i
==============================
What about before WW2? Why don't you want to mention WW2?
How about we compare what happened in Srebrenica to what happened in Jasenovac and see who comes out dirty?
I see a brave man who is willing to say what every non-croatian thinks, even if this gets people (like we can see here on b92 website) to post double standarded remarks and accuse him of extremism or even slobodism.
I think it is unbelievable though that he has to be the first person saying these things. No one in international community on a public level said "wait, hold on a second, Croatia is doing some things here that are not okay, after the tribunal made a ruling that was also not okay". The problem this carries with it is that when people say nonsense like "Ohh ignore him he's just a serb being serbian" im affraid the people who dont want him to be heard will seem more credible (though we all know they are likely people who dream of a time where everyone dressed in Ustase uniforms can do their bidding to anyone they consider ethnically inferior for whatever reason).
Speaking of which, did anyone else notice that Serbian nationalism is all about "Look at my beautiful culture country and people and come enjoy it with us!" (well you see how the albanians went about this offer of hospitality :-/) and Croatian Nationalism is all about marching in columns waving the same flag that flew over Jasenovac and denying of ethnic cleansing and massacres.
Nikolle, Croatia has moved on to better things? You mean, Croatia has been cleansed, and not held accountable for any of its war crimes by its EU handlers, so as to enter the rotten Union unblemished? You daily anti-Serb rants are getting quite old, why don't you just come out and say, "I hate Serbs, and wish them everything bad"? You would then be more credible, instead of trying to sound oh so clever and wise. You are not. You are just a simple hate filled person.
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
This modified comment says that Genocide was perpetrated on the Serbs of Krajina who were there for centuries, and Krajina is located in Croatia.
Police have found bodies of People who were obviously murdered, but in a few cases they could not find the culprit, or they could not convict or extradite the culprit because of various reasons.
The Fact that the culprit could not be found or a suspect found guilty, does not diminish the Fact that a murder had taken place, or that there was a Criminal and a Victim involved.
It is exactly the same with Croatia, and with the Genocide that they perpetrated against the Serbian minority in Krajina, for the only reason that they were of a different race.
President Bush said Iraq has weapons of Mass Destruction as his reason for invading Iraq, and we need to know the Criminals will always blame the Victims, and so ignore the Lies of Croatian and Western Politicians.
Franjo Tudman and Alija Izetbegovic, cannot be put on Trial and found Guilty of Genocide, because they are dead, and Adolf Hitler cannot be put on trial for Genocide that he is Definitely Guilty of; just like Franjo Tudman, Alija Izetbegovic, and Presidents Bill and Hillary Clinton are Guilty of Genocide against Serbs.
A realistic understanding of how the Genocide that was committed by Croatia against its Serbian Minority has been Documented.
Like you bombed us? Really?? It was NATO who bombed us, we both know if NATO had no involvement then the war would have been over in weeks and a Serbian flag would be flying in Pristina right now.
Make sure that it is quite some time before Serbia rules a Line under this.
The Serbia President is being Far Too Polite, but it good, if this is just Practice.
The EU should be referred to as Naziland, and Croatia should the land of the Ustacha.
If it were up to me, I would give it to them without using bad Language, but it would be accurate Language.
I would make those Bastards go insane with my speech, and TRUST ME, I would make them beg me to stop, because those Nazis know that they would go insane from my Truthful Judgemental Speech.
There is nothing wrong with choosing this course of Action, but it needs to be Fierce, Fast, and Unrelenting until it has accomplished its task.
Serbia’s Enemies call the Serbs Chetniks, yet we know what is the status of Draza Mihajlovic, and Serbia cannot Rehabilitate the Chetnik Leader from Lies, then Serbia had better make up for it some other way, that would make Draza Mihajlovic proud to be a Serb.
What thing? Oh, the 23 years of invasion, occupation, liberation, ethnic cleansing, refugee suffering, law suits, violence at sports matches, conflicting history books? You mean that "thing"?
I believe a criminal act was committed. 2000+ bosnian muslim fighters killed in combat trying to escape + innocent men/boys murdered in retribution. Dont forget the shame on the bosnian muslim forces who left after starting their military folly against serbian forces. Srebrenica was a 'demilitarized safe area' not a military spring board for bosnian muslims forces to kill serbians. Don't forget the slaughtered Serbian women, children and old in villages around srebrenica within your "genocide" calculation.
I think it means the plan for total liquidation of all, women, men children as a national group/identity, i.e. 1916 liquidation of christian armenian population in ottoman empire.
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
"Listen" to this petty little soul of the yellow pro organ harvesters trying to hide their bloody tracks. Lol
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
--
LOL!! One has to limit the scope to "European soil" and "after WWII" to make a point. Well my friend, Croatia, Germany and your partners in crime (Bosnian Muslims, Turks, Albanians, etc...) committed the most horrific crimes the world has known in recent history. Srebrenica wouldn't even be mentioned in comparison.
Now if we remove the "Europe" limitation, we know that the USA and NATO have committed the most horrific crimes post WWII. They are responsible for millions up millions of deaths in their push for US hegemony.
No one buys your rubbish Nikolle so remember that all of this will come to an end soon enough. Your side is losing ground day by day while we are getting stronger. We know the score and we now know what needs to be done to bring lasting peace to the Balkans.
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
(Milan, 26 November 2012 12:51)
The objective of a court is to deal with the accused and to find him guilty and not guilty based on facts and proofs relating to that person.
Concerning the Genocide Case we have the confirmation that Srebrenica was an act of genocide, with the RS and their leaders as perpetrators. Aside from a range of Serbian politicians, among them Nikolic, nobody challenged that, while Tomo denounced Vukovar as a Serbian city. Only the missing proofs that Serbia was directly involved to it, made it impossible to sentence Serbia for it. From a judicial point of view, I have nothing against it, but we all know the truth. Sounds familiar to you?
Simply, reconciliation cannot be achieved by courts. It is a political and socio-cultural progress. The Serbian side just proves that it was never about reconciliation but about downplaying and white washing the own guilt. "Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
"If there is a country in Europe with a more revolting history than Croatia (Germany excluded) please suggest."
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
They probably arrested Hotovina and told him "don't worry, we just want to make it possible for Croatia to join EU and to convince Serbia to arrest Mladic. After that we will make you free"
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
When has any court ruled that Serbia committed any kind of crimes in Srebrenica? nit even the kangaroo ICTY. Nor did it Serbs from Bosnia - most of jihadists got killed in fighting - but again - when have Albanians ever read anything but Koran? assuming that Serbs did executed cold-bloodedly POWs then they did not commit genocide or attempted to to carry it out - tey only would have killed adult male (wouldbe) Mulsim soldiers - as Muslims had plenty of male teens under that age one cannot speak about possible elimination of the particvular group - teens would have grown bigger and continue breeding as Muslims do all over the world. So, calm down Nikolle and read some unbiased materials and use critical thinking - otherwise you sound like Soviets at Nurenburg (Katyn massacre)
These are fair words from Nikolic, but these are just words and I fail to see any genuine action. The fact that he is still chasing EU membership (which will never happen) despite the fact that the Serbian people are growing against it makes him to be an absolute fool, because the most powerful states in the EU aided Croatia in its crimes in the 90s. If Nikolic wants Serbs to take him seriously then there needs to be action, such as abandonment of the EU and a serious stance taken with Croatia, the issuing of arrest warrants for various ustasa war criminals and so on.
Bam Bam, funny you call Nikolic a "right wing maniac" because you come on here often echoing opinions of an ustasa nature, your people remain to be fixated with the fascist ustasa ideology. Any comment for the ustasa crimes of WWII? Without answering with a question about supposed Serbian war crimes.
"Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 16:05)
I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general.
“However, it is obvious that we cannot cooperate in a sincere and open manner with a country that celebrates its crimes. It cannot be done! It doesn't go that way! In whose name? On behalf of the victims, on behalf of their children?"
-- You have perfectly described Serbia. When you ask for forgiveness and recognize your crimes in Kosova you can hope to be treated better. Since you still celebrate those crime you will continue to remain a pariah.
Here you go my friends, a book to read. Check -> http://tangibleinfo.blogspot.be/2009/06/how-america-gets-away-with-murder.html
MICHAEL MANDEL ON HOW AMERICA GETS AWAY WITH MURDER
Mandel is a Professor at the Osgoode Hall Law School at York University in Toronto, Canada, with a specialty in international law and with some enlightening experience as the individual who, in May 1999, in the midst of NATO's 78-day bombing war against Yugoslavia, presented a petition for the indictment of 68 NATO leaders for their war crimes to Louise Arbour, then prosecutor of the Tribunal. His account of this experience and his analysis of Arbour.s and her successor Carla Del Ponte's handling of this petition is crushing, and even funny, as he contrasts their finely-tuned adjustments to NATO's needs for public relations service to its military plans with their crude and often laughable modes of evading even an official investigation of the documented evidence of NATO crimes.
There is no finer account of the structured bias of the Tribunal, its de facto control by the United States, the integration of its work to the needs of U.S. political objectives in the area, and its judicial failings, which characterize it at every level of its operations. Mandel is no fan of Milosevic, but makes it very clear that he is on trial strictly because he was the political target of the NATO war, and the supreme criminals needed his demonization, arrest and show-trial guilt to prove the justice of their cause.
What crimes? Doris Pack (member of European Parliament) told European Parliament: 'Storm is a legitimate action, Croats were returning abducted territory!' A good book to read up on Croatian history is: "Croatia: A Nation forged in War" by Marcus Tanner. I almost don't blame you Serbs want Croatia for your self. Croatia is so beautiful!
Mario, what ever books are written we know the score, Former Krajina ~(as mentioned in 1750 austrian maps) is not so beautiful its basically rolling hills and arable land worked hard by generations of Serbian families since the 1600s. Nice is when you get a living for a reasonable effort like germany, uk etc I cannot see too many croatians from zagreb or dubrovnik running to inhabit these areas, instead they send refugee janjevci & bosnian croatians who take a look and run for the nearest town cafes. These areas are empty of serbs and unproductive just what Tudjman and his cronies planned. Unfortunately this is not communist jugoslavija in 1947, crimes will be investigated sooner or later, each and every murder. I believe law abiding peoples would want that.
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
Serbs themselves clean up Krajina from croats and other minorities and refused to deal with Zagreb who at the time was UN member and with internationally knows borders.
Based on this cicurmstances there were two ways to deal with serbs:
1.Leave them like in Noth Kosovo where Republic of Knin would have been paradise for durgs and money laundring
or
2.show them that this is Croatia and they are citizens of Croatia and they supposed to obey the Constitution of Croatia.
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country and EU member after 1 month.And please spare me with the statements that Serbia standard living is better tha Croatia coz are not.
Commentators-if you choose to post-use this as it has the link to the song. Thank you.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
(Bam Bam, 26 November 2012 13:39)
The self-righteous proper goody two shoe happy concentration campers that never did anything wrong should listen to this song very carefully without crying. It's the sign of the times!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Uqb2vts8m1g
Gotovina was not released due to “politics” it is more the case of he was originally thrown in jail due to “politics”
Serbs, wake up and smell the coffee, join reality and the rest of the world, the longer you live and thrive in your own propaganda machine (which the rest of the world pays no attention to) the better it is for your country and people.
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
(Niall O'Doherty, 26 November 2012 16:29)
Shows that you can try to twist anything to prove a point, maybe you should actually ask the people in Cuba instead. Even Castro himself has said many times that the US has crippled his country. They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with). Probably a very similar situation to what Serbia can expect should all the balkans join the EU with the exception of Serbia.
They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with).
(think again, 26 November 2012 17:15)
The US promised to the USSR not to make attempts to invade Cuba in return to our withdrowal of missles and kept its promise. So there was help.
Face it, the international community passed the judgment in its highest UN sponsored court. The ruling goes against your twisted reality and no lies will ever be able to change that. If only a fraction of your day to day energy would be used for reconciliation with an honest heart then the whole region would be better off. I believe that most of hard-code serbian commentators are most likely living abroad and it is shameful that such people are propagating hatred and non reconciliation, spiced by complete ignorance of the evidence and responsibility as a nation.
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
@milan
"I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general."
(Milan, 26 November 2012 21:13)
And how exactly do you know that "these guys should not have been acquitted". I guess you must have evidence that only yourself has access to, in which case you should be tried for treason by Serbia... LOL
What a joke. You people are incredible. Lies and more lies and then lying to yourselves and others and your children and god knows who else...
Hasan, I believe it was the DS and tadic that kept Mladic out of the hague for many years, they were the ones in power, not Nikolic. The DS handed him over when the time was right, and he no longer served as a bargaining chip for them. Why you jumping ugly so much on Toma?
exKFOR, 26 November 2012 19:16)
In 2004 the ICTY ruled that the crimes in Srebrenica was Genocide, and the UNSG stated it was the worst crimes on European soil since WW2.
One has to wonder why a Serb calls himself exKfor, whose mandate was to force all Serb forces and police out of Kosovo and make sure they did not return?
Tom, wake up and smell what? do guys like you really come on here to post empty rhetoric without knowing anything about history? Really? I mean, look at Jasenovac, that was a massacre. And expelling 250,000 is the 2nd biggest. How many times do you hear about the Nazi croats and albanians during WWII? Hardly ever...you hear a lot about Hitler, and the bad Germans though all the time, those hardline Nazi's..etc.
Its almost as ppl forget about the gruesome crimes albanians and croats did . You people need to educate yourself a bit more. Serbia has not been on the wrong side of these wars. The propaganda machine made them look that way. And you blame Nikolic for saying what he said? He should have said it before. You cant step all over a nation like a door mat forever. We have done more right than the nazi croats ever have..and nothing is good enough. Time to realize, it never may be. And you delirious posters on here..time to read a book. And maybe, just maybe, you will go post about flowers or arts and crafts, becuase you are wasting your time here, unless you know something about history, and what the nation of Serbia has endured.
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
(croatia-eu, 26 November 2012 21:39)
===========================
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
Yes that’s right wake up and smell the coffee…....smell anything, just wake up.
I know plenty about history, and this article is about recent modern day history i.e. Gotovina.
Anyways…tell me, how many times in “history” has Croatia attacked Serbia proper?
Every country has its propaganda, Croatia is no exception, but Serbia are the Kings of propaganda, propaganda seems to be the basis of the Serbian identity, it is what keeps them going. The sooner that stops the better it is for Serbia.
this man is like a baby SERBS lissen to me u do what u have to do and we do what we think is good for us STOP talking if u wont o war strart on but this time not only we gona bomb u like in 99 but we going to push the army up to molla e kuqee near nis long live ethnice albaniaaa
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
(icj1, 27 November 2012 03:01)
--
My friend, your ignorance shines. Not even your poor attempt at spin can hide it.
This guys said two months ago thet he never want to be President of Prishtina and gave several reasons such as he was never welcome there etc.
Now he wants to be President of Prishtina?
While Dacic wants a Dayton for Kosovo and Serbia.
What is going on in Serbia?Are those guys clawns or politicans?
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
(Mirel from Albania)
They should have offered independence
(aaayyy)
--------------------------------
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country
(Mirel from Albania, 26 November 2012 22:13)
Just like Serbia could be stable and prosperus country now if it had expelled all Albanians from Kosovo. No people - no problem.
“When indictment was issued against Ratko Mladić in the Srebrenica case, we did not even wait for the guilty verdict, the (Serbian) parliament immediately passed a resolution condemning the Srebrenica crime."
Well, that Srebrenica was genocide had already been established beyond reasonable doubt by a court set up by Russia, China & Co. long before Serbia's parliament resolution in 2010. We don't need the conclusion of Mladic's trial to establish that Srebrenica was genocide.
...your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
So the double headed eagle is a Serb property now? And here I thought the double headed eagle has been used by various peoples throughout history, you know like the Babylonians and Hittites since 1250 b.c , and borrowed by almost everyone since then. Everyone except Serbs that is. Their double headed eagle is a brand new original symbol which Albanians copied because there have never been any civilizations greater than the Serbs we could get the double headed eagle from, ever.
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 02:20)
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
(you think?, 27 November 2012 10:33)
=====================================
I never said there was no need to reconcile. I said that with attitudes like that it was not probable that reconciliation was going to happen.
Now what do you suggest Serbia does?
Turn the other cheek for the third time?
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you.
We then turned the other cheek, forgave and it was majority Serbs who wanted to stay in the brotherhood and unity with all, only to be stabbed in the back AGAIN with 1990s ethnic cleansing and mass murder (OLUJA).
How many times do you think we should just turn the other cheek and trust again?
Don't you think that now it's their turn to acknowledge their part in establishing bad relations and bad blood and this time it's their turn to want to reconcile?
Or, do you think it's all Serbia's fault and therefore Serbia should be the bigger man all the time and keep asking for reconciliation?
Don't forget to read this book also. Check -> [link]
Travesty: The Trial of Slobodan Milosevic and the Corruption of International Justice by John Laughland
(Zoran, 26 November 2012 22:19)
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
(ZZ, 26 November 2012 20:12)
So, that must be Russia and China, because, according to the CE of the B92 forums sj, Russia and China have the cash, whereas the West has collapsed and is starving.
reading "Veotoni"´s contribution, I wonder why Albanians are always big mouths when they are in a chat-room or internet-forum...but when it comes to trouble in the real world, they prove to be cowards.
I have witnessed that a few times and it was always the same with them.
simple wannabees. actually, they should be waving a white flag on their "flag day" - it would match much better to their not so heroic mentality.
oh, and by the way, don´t you Albanians ask yourself where that bicephalic eagle on "your" flag derives from?
it is your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
so whenever you look at your flag, my dear k-albanian boys...remember where the symbol comes from!
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you."
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 22:49)
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history. For the record, the Croatian Sabor and people never "willingly joined" the "Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes" which was just established by the Allied victors at the Treaty of Versailles. Croatian leader Stjepan Radic (do you even know who he was ?) was actually arrested and imprisoned for protesting it for Christ’s sake !
Furthermore, dear, it was renamed "Yugoslavia" ten years later when your king Alexander I abolished the Constitution, and imposed his royal dictatorship in his coup d'état of 1929, you know that "January 6th Dictatorship" which you guys either don't know about, or still pretend never happened.
The Croatian people never had a say about being merged with the Serbs. The latter was simply done by the Allies to allow Serbians outside Serbia to all live in the same state while completely dismantling the former Hapsburg Empire.
actually croatia was enslaved in yugoslavia, serbia had full dictatorship over the whole country. thats why croatia wanted independece. what good is unity and brotherhood, when every serb is offered a job as docoter or lawyer in croatia. and every croat is forced to dig raods or work in a field. thats not freedom or unity at all.
personally i think serbia. shoudl be happy and not hate albania, bosina , croatia and the rest of the countrys. insteas look to investing all its energy and money into schools and universitys and forge a utopia. well thats what i would do.
first of all croatian ustas where from the northern reagins. the southern dalmatians and caost were all partizan. against germany and nazi ustas.after ww2 all ustas were executed or they fled to south americara. because they used to torture our poeple and partizan resisantce. only half of croatia was possibly usas. and no there are neo-nazis or ustas in croatia lving now. as they were executing for gouging the eyes and torturing their partizan and own ppl. thats why no ones knows about them. they were exterminated. and if they exist ,then their may be in south america now.which of some were extradited back to europe, to be face trial to be executed.
im a dalmation croat. and my whole familal tree was partizan as was 99% of all other dalmatians from the massive coast and islands.We dont hate serbia trust me.But!! i think the village folk and inbreds that were in the ustas. probably had a reason for being the way they. why must every country near croatia want to conquer and wipe croatia off the map own it and everyhting in it. yes ustas were scum and an disgrace to croatia.
But invading croatia and attempting to forge a greater country is proabably waht made the ustas the scum they were.
any child is born neutral, atack. rape. kill its parents. and viola.
its full of hate and not as human anymore. so before all u say. how serbia is innccent. why have you been trying to turn croatia into greater serbia for how long?? 500 800 YEARs??
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history.
============================
Fine, don't reconcile. I really don't care but maybe you should stop believing in your own fairy tales before you accuse me of it.
Maybe I should not believe my own lying eyes when I see old footage from archives actually showing Croatians welcoming Serbs with flowers, song and dance.
Don't worry. Serbia will never again do anything for you. Deal with your own occupiers yourself.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
Serbs and Serbian officials have not been honest to begin with. They only arrested Mladic when they smelled an EU membership opportunity. That was done after almost couple of decades so you will not fool anyone else but yourself on that matter. Secondly, only if you could have thought about the outcome of the 90's wars and genocides that you Serbs so much loved and are proud of today this would not have happened. You have created nothing but enemies around yourselves. You're certainly in no position to point fingers at others when you're one of the dirtiest man yourself and most of your nationalistic partners in your administration. These Croats may not be the brightest, but I am sure their reasons are far more legitimate than the reasons what Serbs have done to Croatians Bosnians and Albanians. I hope Nikolic does realize that no one I mean no one in this world cares about what he has to say and his future intentions with neighboring countries around are. The world simply has had enough of this Serbian (We are the victims) game already. You can dream about being a president of Prishtina, you said it yourself a few months back that it is impossible for you to be president of Prishtina. While you're the president of Serbia try to improve Serbia itself, don't worry so much about others who simply don't worry about you and anything you have to say.
When people and nations hurt us over and over again, lets think of them as sandpaper. We may get scratched, but end up polished and they end up useless.
As you sow, so shall you reap. We have powerful nations on our side my fellow Serbs. Nations that are gaining global power and momentum.
On the other hand, our fake partners (i.e. opponents) are losing momentum. Time is on our side but our opponents know this so beware of trickery and keep our guard strong.
"If there is a country in Europe with a more revolting history than Croatia (Germany excluded) please suggest."
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
Finally some smart words and backbone shown by President Nikolic. I hope he keeps it up. Show the Fourth Reich (the EU) the middle finger, call out our enemies, quit pretending they are friends, and demand truth and justice - nothing less. This is the path to victory.
Cheers!!
“However, it is obvious that we cannot cooperate in a sincere and open manner with a country that celebrates its crimes. It cannot be done! It doesn't go that way! In whose name? On behalf of the victims, on behalf of their children?"
-- You have perfectly described Serbia. When you ask for forgiveness and recognize your crimes in Kosova you can hope to be treated better. Since you still celebrate those crime you will continue to remain a pariah.
Make sure that it is quite some time before Serbia rules a Line under this.
The Serbia President is being Far Too Polite, but it good, if this is just Practice.
The EU should be referred to as Naziland, and Croatia should the land of the Ustacha.
If it were up to me, I would give it to them without using bad Language, but it would be accurate Language.
I would make those Bastards go insane with my speech, and TRUST ME, I would make them beg me to stop, because those Nazis know that they would go insane from my Truthful Judgemental Speech.
There is nothing wrong with choosing this course of Action, but it needs to be Fierce, Fast, and Unrelenting until it has accomplished its task.
Serbia’s Enemies call the Serbs Chetniks, yet we know what is the status of Draza Mihajlovic, and Serbia cannot Rehabilitate the Chetnik Leader from Lies, then Serbia had better make up for it some other way, that would make Draza Mihajlovic proud to be a Serb.
this man is like a baby SERBS lissen to me u do what u have to do and we do what we think is good for us STOP talking if u wont o war strart on but this time not only we gona bomb u like in 99 but we going to push the army up to molla e kuqee near nis long live ethnice albaniaaa
Gotovina was not released due to “politics” it is more the case of he was originally thrown in jail due to “politics”
Serbs, wake up and smell the coffee, join reality and the rest of the world, the longer you live and thrive in your own propaganda machine (which the rest of the world pays no attention to) the better it is for your country and people.
In the paragraph regarding the indictment against Mladic (1995), Nikolic fails to mention that it was another 16 years before he was arrested, giving the impression that it happened almost simultaneously. Anyway, on the subject of Croatia I agree with Toma that they are now adopting a holier than thou attitude towards regional war crimes. I attended various conferences in BiH at which Croatian delegates were present. Because they were well down the road towards EU membership they treated the Bosnian delegates in a terribly condescending way and I am reminded of this now in the whole discussion about Operation Storm and the fall out from the appeal verdict. Being a good 'winner' is harder than being a good 'loser' and Croatia is proving this adage to be true on a daily basis.
What crimes? Doris Pack (member of European Parliament) told European Parliament: 'Storm is a legitimate action, Croats were returning abducted territory!' A good book to read up on Croatian history is: "Croatia: A Nation forged in War" by Marcus Tanner. I almost don't blame you Serbs want Croatia for your self. Croatia is so beautiful!
Oh, Ante...you want me to come back do you? After what happened to immediate family in two separate generations at two separate times in history? I'm not about to convert to Catholicism so what's your plan for me exactly? On second thought I might return termporarily (sp?) just to give you a good smack about...
Face it, the international community passed the judgment in its highest UN sponsored court. The ruling goes against your twisted reality and no lies will ever be able to change that. If only a fraction of your day to day energy would be used for reconciliation with an honest heart then the whole region would be better off. I believe that most of hard-code serbian commentators are most likely living abroad and it is shameful that such people are propagating hatred and non reconciliation, spiced by complete ignorance of the evidence and responsibility as a nation.
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
Serbs themselves clean up Krajina from croats and other minorities and refused to deal with Zagreb who at the time was UN member and with internationally knows borders.
Based on this cicurmstances there were two ways to deal with serbs:
1.Leave them like in Noth Kosovo where Republic of Knin would have been paradise for durgs and money laundring
or
2.show them that this is Croatia and they are citizens of Croatia and they supposed to obey the Constitution of Croatia.
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country and EU member after 1 month.And please spare me with the statements that Serbia standard living is better tha Croatia coz are not.
This modified comment says that Genocide was perpetrated on the Serbs of Krajina who were there for centuries, and Krajina is located in Croatia.
Police have found bodies of People who were obviously murdered, but in a few cases they could not find the culprit, or they could not convict or extradite the culprit because of various reasons.
The Fact that the culprit could not be found or a suspect found guilty, does not diminish the Fact that a murder had taken place, or that there was a Criminal and a Victim involved.
It is exactly the same with Croatia, and with the Genocide that they perpetrated against the Serbian minority in Krajina, for the only reason that they were of a different race.
President Bush said Iraq has weapons of Mass Destruction as his reason for invading Iraq, and we need to know the Criminals will always blame the Victims, and so ignore the Lies of Croatian and Western Politicians.
Franjo Tudman and Alija Izetbegovic, cannot be put on Trial and found Guilty of Genocide, because they are dead, and Adolf Hitler cannot be put on trial for Genocide that he is Definitely Guilty of; just like Franjo Tudman, Alija Izetbegovic, and Presidents Bill and Hillary Clinton are Guilty of Genocide against Serbs.
A realistic understanding of how the Genocide that was committed by Croatia against its Serbian Minority has been Documented.
I see a brave man who is willing to say what every non-croatian thinks, even if this gets people (like we can see here on b92 website) to post double standarded remarks and accuse him of extremism or even slobodism.
I think it is unbelievable though that he has to be the first person saying these things. No one in international community on a public level said "wait, hold on a second, Croatia is doing some things here that are not okay, after the tribunal made a ruling that was also not okay". The problem this carries with it is that when people say nonsense like "Ohh ignore him he's just a serb being serbian" im affraid the people who dont want him to be heard will seem more credible (though we all know they are likely people who dream of a time where everyone dressed in Ustase uniforms can do their bidding to anyone they consider ethnically inferior for whatever reason).
Speaking of which, did anyone else notice that Serbian nationalism is all about "Look at my beautiful culture country and people and come enjoy it with us!" (well you see how the albanians went about this offer of hospitality :-/) and Croatian Nationalism is all about marching in columns waving the same flag that flew over Jasenovac and denying of ethnic cleansing and massacres.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
When has any court ruled that Serbia committed any kind of crimes in Srebrenica? nit even the kangaroo ICTY. Nor did it Serbs from Bosnia - most of jihadists got killed in fighting - but again - when have Albanians ever read anything but Koran? assuming that Serbs did executed cold-bloodedly POWs then they did not commit genocide or attempted to to carry it out - tey only would have killed adult male (wouldbe) Mulsim soldiers - as Muslims had plenty of male teens under that age one cannot speak about possible elimination of the particvular group - teens would have grown bigger and continue breeding as Muslims do all over the world. So, calm down Nikolle and read some unbiased materials and use critical thinking - otherwise you sound like Soviets at Nurenburg (Katyn massacre)
They probably arrested Hotovina and told him "don't worry, we just want to make it possible for Croatia to join EU and to convince Serbia to arrest Mladic. After that we will make you free"
These are fair words from Nikolic, but these are just words and I fail to see any genuine action. The fact that he is still chasing EU membership (which will never happen) despite the fact that the Serbian people are growing against it makes him to be an absolute fool, because the most powerful states in the EU aided Croatia in its crimes in the 90s. If Nikolic wants Serbs to take him seriously then there needs to be action, such as abandonment of the EU and a serious stance taken with Croatia, the issuing of arrest warrants for various ustasa war criminals and so on.
Bam Bam, funny you call Nikolic a "right wing maniac" because you come on here often echoing opinions of an ustasa nature, your people remain to be fixated with the fascist ustasa ideology. Any comment for the ustasa crimes of WWII? Without answering with a question about supposed Serbian war crimes.
@milan
"I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general."
(Milan, 26 November 2012 21:13)
And how exactly do you know that "these guys should not have been acquitted". I guess you must have evidence that only yourself has access to, in which case you should be tried for treason by Serbia... LOL
What a joke. You people are incredible. Lies and more lies and then lying to yourselves and others and your children and god knows who else...
I was a little sceptic when Nikolic gained power in Serbia. Now, I'm sold and happy we have a honest president who tells it how it is. My wish has been to have a Dodik in Serbia. We may just have found one. Me happy!
Like you bombed us? Really?? It was NATO who bombed us, we both know if NATO had no involvement then the war would have been over in weeks and a Serbian flag would be flying in Pristina right now.
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
(Niall O'Doherty, 26 November 2012 16:29)
Shows that you can try to twist anything to prove a point, maybe you should actually ask the people in Cuba instead. Even Castro himself has said many times that the US has crippled his country. They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with). Probably a very similar situation to what Serbia can expect should all the balkans join the EU with the exception of Serbia.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
"Listen" to this petty little soul of the yellow pro organ harvesters trying to hide their bloody tracks. Lol
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
(Milan, 26 November 2012 12:51)
The objective of a court is to deal with the accused and to find him guilty and not guilty based on facts and proofs relating to that person.
Concerning the Genocide Case we have the confirmation that Srebrenica was an act of genocide, with the RS and their leaders as perpetrators. Aside from a range of Serbian politicians, among them Nikolic, nobody challenged that, while Tomo denounced Vukovar as a Serbian city. Only the missing proofs that Serbia was directly involved to it, made it impossible to sentence Serbia for it. From a judicial point of view, I have nothing against it, but we all know the truth. Sounds familiar to you?
Simply, reconciliation cannot be achieved by courts. It is a political and socio-cultural progress. The Serbian side just proves that it was never about reconciliation but about downplaying and white washing the own guilt. "Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
What thing? Oh, the 23 years of invasion, occupation, liberation, ethnic cleansing, refugee suffering, law suits, violence at sports matches, conflicting history books? You mean that "thing"?
Nikolle, Croatia has moved on to better things? You mean, Croatia has been cleansed, and not held accountable for any of its war crimes by its EU handlers, so as to enter the rotten Union unblemished? You daily anti-Serb rants are getting quite old, why don't you just come out and say, "I hate Serbs, and wish them everything bad"? You would then be more credible, instead of trying to sound oh so clever and wise. You are not. You are just a simple hate filled person.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia i
==============================
What about before WW2? Why don't you want to mention WW2?
How about we compare what happened in Srebrenica to what happened in Jasenovac and see who comes out dirty?
Commentators-if you choose to post-use this as it has the link to the song. Thank you.
Here we go again...He's trying to hold back his Chetnik views but it's killing him he just can't help himself spewing hate like he and his forces did in Vukovar in 1991= when they blow the city to oblivion and had no regards for the civilian population. This right wing maniac is trying to de-stabalise the region. Serbia will never be a E.U member and by not recieving assistance from Europe what hope have they got. You keep preaching hate and publicly embarassing Serbia with your comments and we'll see how long you stay in power when Serbia's children have nothing to eat.
(Bam Bam, 26 November 2012 13:39)
The self-righteous proper goody two shoe happy concentration campers that never did anything wrong should listen to this song very carefully without crying. It's the sign of the times!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Uqb2vts8m1g
exKFOR, 26 November 2012 19:16)
In 2004 the ICTY ruled that the crimes in Srebrenica was Genocide, and the UNSG stated it was the worst crimes on European soil since WW2.
One has to wonder why a Serb calls himself exKfor, whose mandate was to force all Serb forces and police out of Kosovo and make sure they did not return?
Tom, wake up and smell what? do guys like you really come on here to post empty rhetoric without knowing anything about history? Really? I mean, look at Jasenovac, that was a massacre. And expelling 250,000 is the 2nd biggest. How many times do you hear about the Nazi croats and albanians during WWII? Hardly ever...you hear a lot about Hitler, and the bad Germans though all the time, those hardline Nazi's..etc.
Its almost as ppl forget about the gruesome crimes albanians and croats did . You people need to educate yourself a bit more. Serbia has not been on the wrong side of these wars. The propaganda machine made them look that way. And you blame Nikolic for saying what he said? He should have said it before. You cant step all over a nation like a door mat forever. We have done more right than the nazi croats ever have..and nothing is good enough. Time to realize, it never may be. And you delirious posters on here..time to read a book. And maybe, just maybe, you will go post about flowers or arts and crafts, becuase you are wasting your time here, unless you know something about history, and what the nation of Serbia has endured.
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
Cuba is far from isolated let me tell you. The annual vote taken at the UN General assembly in relation to the illegel sanctions being pleased against Havana by the US should tell you.
I believe a criminal act was committed. 2000+ bosnian muslim fighters killed in combat trying to escape + innocent men/boys murdered in retribution. Dont forget the shame on the bosnian muslim forces who left after starting their military folly against serbian forces. Srebrenica was a 'demilitarized safe area' not a military spring board for bosnian muslims forces to kill serbians. Don't forget the slaughtered Serbian women, children and old in villages around srebrenica within your "genocide" calculation.
I think it means the plan for total liquidation of all, women, men children as a national group/identity, i.e. 1916 liquidation of christian armenian population in ottoman empire.
croatia is not responsible for the worst massacre on European soil since WW2, Serbia is, so on that basis, Serbia has a more revolting history, just behind Germany
(Nikolle, 26 November 2012 17:02)
--
LOL!! One has to limit the scope to "European soil" and "after WWII" to make a point. Well my friend, Croatia, Germany and your partners in crime (Bosnian Muslims, Turks, Albanians, etc...) committed the most horrific crimes the world has known in recent history. Srebrenica wouldn't even be mentioned in comparison.
Now if we remove the "Europe" limitation, we know that the USA and NATO have committed the most horrific crimes post WWII. They are responsible for millions up millions of deaths in their push for US hegemony.
No one buys your rubbish Nikolle so remember that all of this will come to an end soon enough. Your side is losing ground day by day while we are getting stronger. We know the score and we now know what needs to be done to bring lasting peace to the Balkans.
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
(you think?, 27 November 2012 10:33)
=====================================
I never said there was no need to reconcile. I said that with attitudes like that it was not probable that reconciliation was going to happen.
Now what do you suggest Serbia does?
Turn the other cheek for the third time?
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you.
We then turned the other cheek, forgave and it was majority Serbs who wanted to stay in the brotherhood and unity with all, only to be stabbed in the back AGAIN with 1990s ethnic cleansing and mass murder (OLUJA).
How many times do you think we should just turn the other cheek and trust again?
Don't you think that now it's their turn to acknowledge their part in establishing bad relations and bad blood and this time it's their turn to want to reconcile?
Or, do you think it's all Serbia's fault and therefore Serbia should be the bigger man all the time and keep asking for reconciliation?
What is his desire? Being thrown out like Castro and his country isolated like Cuba? Who is Tome actually blaming? Not Croatia acquitted Gotovina, it was Den Haag. A similar court acquitted Serbia from committing genocide some years ago. This was just, right? What exactly has this to do the international relations between Croatia and Serbia?
Spare us with your rivers of tears. If you want to turn your back to Europe, so be it. But don't whine like a girl while simultaneously wishing to join the union. This is just pathetic.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 12:19)
I agree he's on a destructive path, but saying something doesn't fit the term of genocide is different than saying it didn't happen at all.
Here you go my friends, a book to read. Check -> http://tangibleinfo.blogspot.be/2009/06/how-america-gets-away-with-murder.html
MICHAEL MANDEL ON HOW AMERICA GETS AWAY WITH MURDER
Mandel is a Professor at the Osgoode Hall Law School at York University in Toronto, Canada, with a specialty in international law and with some enlightening experience as the individual who, in May 1999, in the midst of NATO's 78-day bombing war against Yugoslavia, presented a petition for the indictment of 68 NATO leaders for their war crimes to Louise Arbour, then prosecutor of the Tribunal. His account of this experience and his analysis of Arbour.s and her successor Carla Del Ponte's handling of this petition is crushing, and even funny, as he contrasts their finely-tuned adjustments to NATO's needs for public relations service to its military plans with their crude and often laughable modes of evading even an official investigation of the documented evidence of NATO crimes.
There is no finer account of the structured bias of the Tribunal, its de facto control by the United States, the integration of its work to the needs of U.S. political objectives in the area, and its judicial failings, which characterize it at every level of its operations. Mandel is no fan of Milosevic, but makes it very clear that he is on trial strictly because he was the political target of the NATO war, and the supreme criminals needed his demonization, arrest and show-trial guilt to prove the justice of their cause.
Mario, what ever books are written we know the score, Former Krajina ~(as mentioned in 1750 austrian maps) is not so beautiful its basically rolling hills and arable land worked hard by generations of Serbian families since the 1600s. Nice is when you get a living for a reasonable effort like germany, uk etc I cannot see too many croatians from zagreb or dubrovnik running to inhabit these areas, instead they send refugee janjevci & bosnian croatians who take a look and run for the nearest town cafes. These areas are empty of serbs and unproductive just what Tudjman and his cronies planned. Unfortunately this is not communist jugoslavija in 1947, crimes will be investigated sooner or later, each and every murder. I believe law abiding peoples would want that.
Hasan, I believe it was the DS and tadic that kept Mladic out of the hague for many years, they were the ones in power, not Nikolic. The DS handed him over when the time was right, and he no longer served as a bargaining chip for them. Why you jumping ugly so much on Toma?
Nobody likes you and nobody gives a damn about your lies. Your president and PM are an insult to a humanity and are probably what you lot deserve.
(croatia-eu, 26 November 2012 21:39)
===========================
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
Don't forget to read this book also. Check -> [link]
Travesty: The Trial of Slobodan Milosevic and the Corruption of International Justice by John Laughland
(Zoran, 26 November 2012 22:19)
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
"Everyone is guilty", that was the credo since the Serbian crimes were exposed. That verdict screws that completely and that is the real reason why many Serbs are p**sed.
(Commentator, 26 November 2012 16:05)
I didn't say everyone is guilty or that all sides were equally guilty of crimes against humanity. However, I know these guys should not have been acquitted. You can say "Serbs think this or that" but since you responded to me specifically that is not really relevant unless you are trying to dehumanize me or Serbs in general.
Those two Croatian Generals escaped justice so that US Generals would not be declared war criminals and have to stand trial. He who pays the bills, decides the verdicts.
(ZZ, 26 November 2012 20:12)
So, that must be Russia and China, because, according to the CE of the B92 forums sj, Russia and China have the cash, whereas the West has collapsed and is starving.
One question for serb apologists.
How Croatia supposed to deal with Republic of Knin?
They offerend several peace plans and all of them were refused by serbs.
(Mirel from Albania)
They should have offered independence
(aaayyy)
--------------------------------
The second one proved to be right for Croatia which is a stable and prosperus country
(Mirel from Albania, 26 November 2012 22:13)
Just like Serbia could be stable and prosperus country now if it had expelled all Albanians from Kosovo. No people - no problem.
reading "Veotoni"´s contribution, I wonder why Albanians are always big mouths when they are in a chat-room or internet-forum...but when it comes to trouble in the real world, they prove to be cowards.
I have witnessed that a few times and it was always the same with them.
simple wannabees. actually, they should be waving a white flag on their "flag day" - it would match much better to their not so heroic mentality.
oh, and by the way, don´t you Albanians ask yourself where that bicephalic eagle on "your" flag derives from?
it is your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
so whenever you look at your flag, my dear k-albanian boys...remember where the symbol comes from!
Yes that’s right wake up and smell the coffee…....smell anything, just wake up.
I know plenty about history, and this article is about recent modern day history i.e. Gotovina.
Anyways…tell me, how many times in “history” has Croatia attacked Serbia proper?
Every country has its propaganda, Croatia is no exception, but Serbia are the Kings of propaganda, propaganda seems to be the basis of the Serbian identity, it is what keeps them going. The sooner that stops the better it is for Serbia.
This guys said two months ago thet he never want to be President of Prishtina and gave several reasons such as he was never welcome there etc.
Now he wants to be President of Prishtina?
While Dacic wants a Dayton for Kosovo and Serbia.
What is going on in Serbia?Are those guys clawns or politicans?
Kind of hard to want to reconcile with people who think this about us.
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 02:20)
DUH, If Croatians had lovey dovey thoughts about you then there probably would not be a "need" for reconciliation, you think? But trust me they will probably never have the same view that you have of yourself, so both sides need work.
Please make sure to recommend the same to Russia, China & Co since they established the court and elect its judges - Russia, China & Co. are the decision makers, not us.
(icj1, 27 November 2012 03:01)
--
My friend, your ignorance shines. Not even your poor attempt at spin can hide it.
They have had a close allegiance with Russia but alas that is no help as shown when Russia tried to place missles there in the early 60's(when they were definitely a force to deal with).
(think again, 26 November 2012 17:15)
The US promised to the USSR not to make attempts to invade Cuba in return to our withdrowal of missles and kept its promise. So there was help.
“When indictment was issued against Ratko Mladić in the Srebrenica case, we did not even wait for the guilty verdict, the (Serbian) parliament immediately passed a resolution condemning the Srebrenica crime."
Well, that Srebrenica was genocide had already been established beyond reasonable doubt by a court set up by Russia, China & Co. long before Serbia's parliament resolution in 2010. We don't need the conclusion of Mladic's trial to establish that Srebrenica was genocide.
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history.
============================
Fine, don't reconcile. I really don't care but maybe you should stop believing in your own fairy tales before you accuse me of it.
Maybe I should not believe my own lying eyes when I see old footage from archives actually showing Croatians welcoming Serbs with flowers, song and dance.
Don't worry. Serbia will never again do anything for you. Deal with your own occupiers yourself.
...your socalled national-hero Skenderbeg who married a serb woman and adopted the double-eagle in order to show loyalty to the father of that woman...
So the double headed eagle is a Serb property now? And here I thought the double headed eagle has been used by various peoples throughout history, you know like the Babylonians and Hittites since 1250 b.c , and borrowed by almost everyone since then. Everyone except Serbs that is. Their double headed eagle is a brand new original symbol which Albanians copied because there have never been any civilizations greater than the Serbs we could get the double headed eagle from, ever.
After WW1 when we liberated the Croatians from Austro-Hungary and were welcomed with flowers and dance by the Croatians and Croatians willingly joined us and we even renamed our country Yugoslavia, leaving the name Serbia in order to accommodate all they stabbed us in the back in WW2 as a thank you."
(Peggy, 27 November 2012 22:49)
No wonder we will never reconcile when Serbs like Peggy still have such fairy tale views of their own history. For the record, the Croatian Sabor and people never "willingly joined" the "Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes" which was just established by the Allied victors at the Treaty of Versailles. Croatian leader Stjepan Radic (do you even know who he was ?) was actually arrested and imprisoned for protesting it for Christ’s sake !
Furthermore, dear, it was renamed "Yugoslavia" ten years later when your king Alexander I abolished the Constitution, and imposed his royal dictatorship in his coup d'état of 1929, you know that "January 6th Dictatorship" which you guys either don't know about, or still pretend never happened.
The Croatian people never had a say about being merged with the Serbs. The latter was simply done by the Allies to allow Serbians outside Serbia to all live in the same state while completely dismantling the former Hapsburg Empire.
first of all croatian ustas where from the northern reagins. the southern dalmatians and caost were all partizan. against germany and nazi ustas.after ww2 all ustas were executed or they fled to south americara. because they used to torture our poeple and partizan resisantce. only half of croatia was possibly usas. and no there are neo-nazis or ustas in croatia lving now. as they were executing for gouging the eyes and torturing their partizan and own ppl. thats why no ones knows about them. they were exterminated. and if they exist ,then their may be in south america now.which of some were extradited back to europe, to be face trial to be executed.
im a dalmation croat. and my whole familal tree was partizan as was 99% of all other dalmatians from the massive coast and islands.We dont hate serbia trust me.But!! i think the village folk and inbreds that were in the ustas. probably had a reason for being the way they. why must every country near croatia want to conquer and wipe croatia off the map own it and everyhting in it. yes ustas were scum and an disgrace to croatia.
But invading croatia and attempting to forge a greater country is proabably waht made the ustas the scum they were.
any child is born neutral, atack. rape. kill its parents. and viola.
its full of hate and not as human anymore. so before all u say. how serbia is innccent. why have you been trying to turn croatia into greater serbia for how long?? 500 800 YEARs??
actually croatia was enslaved in yugoslavia, serbia had full dictatorship over the whole country. thats why croatia wanted independece. what good is unity and brotherhood, when every serb is offered a job as docoter or lawyer in croatia. and every croat is forced to dig raods or work in a field. thats not freedom or unity at all.
personally i think serbia. shoudl be happy and not hate albania, bosina , croatia and the rest of the countrys. insteas look to investing all its energy and money into schools and universitys and forge a utopia. well thats what i would do.
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