7,000 police deployed in Athens for Merkel visit

(Danilo
Get your facts right before you post.It is the Greek banks that are the recipients of economic assistance.If a Greek private bank lost $billions in Eastern Europe they should've been allowed to go bust and their shareholders bear their losses.Your statement would only apply to a situation where the Greek banks were nationalised under democratic workers control and management.

I've got no personal qualms against Merkel but against the EU and the single currency.Under the Euro Greece has suffered massive de-industrialisaion, massive importation of cheap illegal labour,a collapse of agricultural production(import tomatoes from Holland) and an arms budget that has skyrocket beyond all proportion.

I have said in my previous postings that as things stand there is no cure either for Greece or the single currency which creates winners and losers within the euroland.

In order for the single currency to survive sovereign debts of EU countries must be taken over by the ECB and there must also be an effective mechanism in place to redistribute surpluses from the winners to the losers as its the case in US or UK.Since voters in Surpluses countries are unwilling to go along with the above the single currency in its present form has no future.

As for Greece, they should default,restructure their economy and start all over again.The initial period will be difficult but at some point,unlike the present austerity measures,there will be a light at the end of the tunnel.

what misdirected anger.

Greek borrows too much money. It's time to pay the piper. It's the piper's fault.

a child's mentality.

Unfortunately, we, the people in Germany, have not much saying in this. Otherwise that bottomless pit would not see a single Euro. It is only a question of time until Greece will default. It is simply not capable to bolster that huge amount of debts. Angie, however, still wants to beat that dead horse, for the sake of our banksters. Sometimes I can't believe that I voted for her, but the alternatives are not really better. The SPD and the Greens want to go even farer, suggesting Eurobonds. So the CDU is the lesser evil, but they will fail on the long run. Inflation will increase and eat up the savings. I recommend all to invest the money in something, no matter what. Properties are currently cheap.

Greece, Spain, Cyprus... all economically broken countries. There is no shield which can handle that. We just burn more money.

" Angela you're not welcome " why not? it's not germany's fault that greece is in crisis. You Greks retired from job when you were 40 years old, not paying tax, living a good life. But when the economy collapse 2008, you were not prepared. So blame yourselfs becaue Angela Merkel can make your lifes even harder, so respect the boss lady.

It's reminisant of the 2 world wars when the German leaders visit their new conquered lands. Besides, how much is this costing Greece, I thought its was in heavily on debt. Hey Merkel have you ever heard of a video conference?

You need 7,000 to protect ONE person? In the first place, why must she come to Greece? Isn't it cheaper, and safer, for Greek officials to fly to Germany to see her instead?

It seems that some have lost sight of who is really at fault for the economic crisis around the globe.

It is not the public who are at fault but they are the ones who are taking the bloody flak and the ones being made to pay for the corrupt bankers mess.

Why are they not paying the price instead of Joe Public one might ask, while the corrupt bankers are carrying on the same old way and continue to escape justice while everyone else has to suffer. It is time for people to rise up and do that which is long overdue, vote out the bloody corrupt politicians who are protecting their buddies in the banking sector, maybe take up arms and cut the cancer out for once and for all.

People can't carry on allowing these corrupt bastards who are ruining lives while they break the law with no fear of prosecution because they are being protected by bent politicians who have been ripping the people off for bloody years for pete's sake.

The people must pay my arse. Execute those crooks and be done with it.

@ Bridge "You Greks retired from job when you were 40 years old, not paying tax, living a good life."
You are totally manipulated by the german media.Try to have your own independent judgement.It is not difficult.

(luciano, 9 October 2012 18:13)

You seem not to have taken aboard my denial that I am not an expert in economics nor a Marxist(although I hold the highest regard for Marx as a social scientist)but you as an economist should've known that GDP is a poor measure of living standards.GDP is an output measure, whereas living standards are in part a function of the goods and services we consume and of the income generated by those we produce.Can GDP measure hapiness or well-being?Think about it.

Now you seem to be confused as in my posting below I don't accuse anybody for Greece's troubles.As I have said before Greece's disease is not its debts but the prevailing corruptive culture leading to those debts.Unless this culture is changed we will never manage to get out of our troubles.

With regard to your nonsensical point that" Greek per capita and standard of living should be no higher than Bulgaria's if it wasn't for the borrowed 300 billion euros" my answer is that a comparison between Greek and Bulgarian GDP in 1980,before Greece joined the EU, you'll see that Bulgarian standards of living were only 40% of the Greek ones.

A major mistake that Marxist economists such as Leonidas make are to confuse cause and effect.A country's GDP and overall productivity should determine the per capita and standard of living NOT borrowed money that you dont invest in productive activities which will give you a future return higher than your borrowing costs.It is amusing to blame your neighbor across the street because he should have said no when you asked him to lend you money that you then took to the pub and bought drinks for all the ladies in order for one to come back to your place and give you temporary ecstasy. The Greek per capita and standard of living should be no higher than Bulgaria's if it wasn't for the borrowed 300 billion euros.

Why shouldn't Merkel come to see what happened to the already transfered 200 000 000 000 Euro (200 Billion) and what will happen to the further 31 000 000 000 Euro (31 Billion) from the EU, which are supposed be to transfered next?
Seriously, of course you can blame western banks for lending Greece so much money and for allowing Greece to make so much debt. But people should rather protest against corruption and bad governance than against those who help them.
Apart from that, it is not only Germany that sets conditions. The Netherlands, Finland or Austria are quite happy with Germany taking the blame, but they would be even stricter. Greece is the corruptest country in the EU with the biggest and most inefficient bureaucracy. This needs to be changed, otherwise Greece will fall back to the point where other countries stand with so much corruption and bad governance. And this will not be at 90% of the average GDP per capita (PPP) of the EU.
Explain to the citizens of West Germany, why they need to transfer so much money to a country more than 1000 km away from its borders, if they already have to transfer 80 000 000 000 Euro annually to the former GDR (until at least 2019). Explain to the citizens of the Netherlands, Finland, Austria, Belgium, and others, why they have to shrink their governmental sector and fire people to be more efficient, pay their taxes and keep corruption as low as possible, work twice as efficient, when nothing is done in Greece.

Chancellor Angela dose that not sound heavenly. Chancellor Angela will be saying too the Greeks cut more and repay back more. Greeks we have nothing more to cut back on Oberlin Fuhrer. Angela that is a lie EU/Germany had a very incitefull study of incredulous waste. You waste good feta cheese and olive oil on your Greek salad not goood dummkopfe when you are suppose to be suffering excruciating hunger pans. Sale the oil and cheese millions will be put back in the EU empire treasury. Greeks woest us how did we get in to this mess http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&v=xkzm4O6u9UQ&NR=1 .

I would rather be living on a beautiful Greek island with plenty of sunshine all year round earning $100 a month than in cold London or Berlin making $10,000 a month but I have the best of both worlds living in sunny Florida where by the way I love my Greek friends especially when they brag about how much money they have and how not to pay taxes.Greece should have never been allowed to join the eurozone and should have never been lent all that money.As far as living standards the per capita we economists use is a pretty good reflection of living standards but of course there are big differences in cost of living between different localities.What does a rich Jewish financier living in Manhattan have in common with a black man living in the Delta in southern Mississippi who survives on a per capita of %8,000 a year? The guy in Manhattan may make more money but the guy in Mississippi has much better climate.Leonidas your English is superb but your anti US commentaries are amusing not only to me but to the Greek Americans who I think are the second most prosperous ethnic group to Jews in this amazing country.

what misdirected anger.

Greek borrows too much money. It's time to pay the piper. It's the piper's fault.

a child's mentality.

" Angela you're not welcome " why not? it's not germany's fault that greece is in crisis. You Greks retired from job when you were 40 years old, not paying tax, living a good life. But when the economy collapse 2008, you were not prepared. So blame yourselfs becaue Angela Merkel can make your lifes even harder, so respect the boss lady.

Unfortunately, we, the people in Germany, have not much saying in this. Otherwise that bottomless pit would not see a single Euro. It is only a question of time until Greece will default. It is simply not capable to bolster that huge amount of debts. Angie, however, still wants to beat that dead horse, for the sake of our banksters. Sometimes I can't believe that I voted for her, but the alternatives are not really better. The SPD and the Greens want to go even farer, suggesting Eurobonds. So the CDU is the lesser evil, but they will fail on the long run. Inflation will increase and eat up the savings. I recommend all to invest the money in something, no matter what. Properties are currently cheap.

Greece, Spain, Cyprus... all economically broken countries. There is no shield which can handle that. We just burn more money.

@ Bridge "You Greks retired from job when you were 40 years old, not paying tax, living a good life."
You are totally manipulated by the german media.Try to have your own independent judgement.It is not difficult.

It seems that some have lost sight of who is really at fault for the economic crisis around the globe.

It is not the public who are at fault but they are the ones who are taking the bloody flak and the ones being made to pay for the corrupt bankers mess.

Why are they not paying the price instead of Joe Public one might ask, while the corrupt bankers are carrying on the same old way and continue to escape justice while everyone else has to suffer. It is time for people to rise up and do that which is long overdue, vote out the bloody corrupt politicians who are protecting their buddies in the banking sector, maybe take up arms and cut the cancer out for once and for all.

People can't carry on allowing these corrupt bastards who are ruining lives while they break the law with no fear of prosecution because they are being protected by bent politicians who have been ripping the people off for bloody years for pete's sake.

The people must pay my arse. Execute those crooks and be done with it.

You need 7,000 to protect ONE person? In the first place, why must she come to Greece? Isn't it cheaper, and safer, for Greek officials to fly to Germany to see her instead?

Chancellor Angela dose that not sound heavenly. Chancellor Angela will be saying too the Greeks cut more and repay back more. Greeks we have nothing more to cut back on Oberlin Fuhrer. Angela that is a lie EU/Germany had a very incitefull study of incredulous waste. You waste good feta cheese and olive oil on your Greek salad not goood dummkopfe when you are suppose to be suffering excruciating hunger pans. Sale the oil and cheese millions will be put back in the EU empire treasury. Greeks woest us how did we get in to this mess http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&v=xkzm4O6u9UQ&NR=1 .

(Danilo
Get your facts right before you post.It is the Greek banks that are the recipients of economic assistance.If a Greek private bank lost $billions in Eastern Europe they should've been allowed to go bust and their shareholders bear their losses.Your statement would only apply to a situation where the Greek banks were nationalised under democratic workers control and management.

I've got no personal qualms against Merkel but against the EU and the single currency.Under the Euro Greece has suffered massive de-industrialisaion, massive importation of cheap illegal labour,a collapse of agricultural production(import tomatoes from Holland) and an arms budget that has skyrocket beyond all proportion.

I have said in my previous postings that as things stand there is no cure either for Greece or the single currency which creates winners and losers within the euroland.

In order for the single currency to survive sovereign debts of EU countries must be taken over by the ECB and there must also be an effective mechanism in place to redistribute surpluses from the winners to the losers as its the case in US or UK.Since voters in Surpluses countries are unwilling to go along with the above the single currency in its present form has no future.

As for Greece, they should default,restructure their economy and start all over again.The initial period will be difficult but at some point,unlike the present austerity measures,there will be a light at the end of the tunnel.

It's reminisant of the 2 world wars when the German leaders visit their new conquered lands. Besides, how much is this costing Greece, I thought its was in heavily on debt. Hey Merkel have you ever heard of a video conference?

Why shouldn't Merkel come to see what happened to the already transfered 200 000 000 000 Euro (200 Billion) and what will happen to the further 31 000 000 000 Euro (31 Billion) from the EU, which are supposed be to transfered next?
Seriously, of course you can blame western banks for lending Greece so much money and for allowing Greece to make so much debt. But people should rather protest against corruption and bad governance than against those who help them.
Apart from that, it is not only Germany that sets conditions. The Netherlands, Finland or Austria are quite happy with Germany taking the blame, but they would be even stricter. Greece is the corruptest country in the EU with the biggest and most inefficient bureaucracy. This needs to be changed, otherwise Greece will fall back to the point where other countries stand with so much corruption and bad governance. And this will not be at 90% of the average GDP per capita (PPP) of the EU.
Explain to the citizens of West Germany, why they need to transfer so much money to a country more than 1000 km away from its borders, if they already have to transfer 80 000 000 000 Euro annually to the former GDR (until at least 2019). Explain to the citizens of the Netherlands, Finland, Austria, Belgium, and others, why they have to shrink their governmental sector and fire people to be more efficient, pay their taxes and keep corruption as low as possible, work twice as efficient, when nothing is done in Greece.

A major mistake that Marxist economists such as Leonidas make are to confuse cause and effect.A country's GDP and overall productivity should determine the per capita and standard of living NOT borrowed money that you dont invest in productive activities which will give you a future return higher than your borrowing costs.It is amusing to blame your neighbor across the street because he should have said no when you asked him to lend you money that you then took to the pub and bought drinks for all the ladies in order for one to come back to your place and give you temporary ecstasy. The Greek per capita and standard of living should be no higher than Bulgaria's if it wasn't for the borrowed 300 billion euros.

(luciano, 9 October 2012 18:13)

You seem not to have taken aboard my denial that I am not an expert in economics nor a Marxist(although I hold the highest regard for Marx as a social scientist)but you as an economist should've known that GDP is a poor measure of living standards.GDP is an output measure, whereas living standards are in part a function of the goods and services we consume and of the income generated by those we produce.Can GDP measure hapiness or well-being?Think about it.

Now you seem to be confused as in my posting below I don't accuse anybody for Greece's troubles.As I have said before Greece's disease is not its debts but the prevailing corruptive culture leading to those debts.Unless this culture is changed we will never manage to get out of our troubles.

With regard to your nonsensical point that" Greek per capita and standard of living should be no higher than Bulgaria's if it wasn't for the borrowed 300 billion euros" my answer is that a comparison between Greek and Bulgarian GDP in 1980,before Greece joined the EU, you'll see that Bulgarian standards of living were only 40% of the Greek ones.

I would rather be living on a beautiful Greek island with plenty of sunshine all year round earning $100 a month than in cold London or Berlin making $10,000 a month but I have the best of both worlds living in sunny Florida where by the way I love my Greek friends especially when they brag about how much money they have and how not to pay taxes.Greece should have never been allowed to join the eurozone and should have never been lent all that money.As far as living standards the per capita we economists use is a pretty good reflection of living standards but of course there are big differences in cost of living between different localities.What does a rich Jewish financier living in Manhattan have in common with a black man living in the Delta in southern Mississippi who survives on a per capita of %8,000 a year? The guy in Manhattan may make more money but the guy in Mississippi has much better climate.Leonidas your English is superb but your anti US commentaries are amusing not only to me but to the Greek Americans who I think are the second most prosperous ethnic group to Jews in this amazing country.