"Absurd to expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo"

I get it Christer. It is ok to alter the borders of Serbia, but not Kosovo. Hmmm. Do you realize how stupid that sounds. Stop being an American lackey and have some principles.

Kosovo is not independent and never will be so.

There is nothing to recognise.

Actually, its absurd for Serbia to not do everything it could (at least on a diplomatic/legal level) to counter the occupation of Serbia's southern province. The fact that our political class is not doing that today is nothing short of treason. They necessarily plan their every move in 'accordance with European values' and have several times buckled under Western pressure when it didn't have too.

Serbs in Kosovo and the state alike should not have any cooperation with EULEX (as long as they break the original agreements of staying neutral), no negotiations with organ extractors (definitely not shaking one's hand) and increased aid for the Serbs in Kosovo who managed to avoid ethnic cleansing/rape/murder.

I am pretty sure increasing aid/investment into Serb communities in Kosovo is more important than tax dollars funding foreign NGO's and having over 130 gov't agencies when most countries have...8.

Anyway ambassador Asp, asking Serbia "to recognize Kosovo" (idk what that means Serbia already recognizes the existence of a Kosovo..weird) is absurd but..handshakes with war criminals at summits in genocidal Croatia is absurd as is having sit-downs with Edita the warthog.

You know what, enough with this rotten EU membership carrot the EU has been waving in front of Serbia, and our dumb ass politicians are chasing. The EU has no intent in bringing Serbia into the EU, none. Have readers here driven through Serbia lately? Have you seen what the small towns and cities look like? Even the large cities are a decaying wasteland, but the rest of Serbia is dead. Why in the world would the EU want Serbia in its club - they don't. They just wave that EU carrot, and our dumb politicians play the EU accession game, so they can get the loans. Everyone knows it's a farce, yet they keep, from both sides, selling the same old crap. Serbia is a basket case, and is decades away from EU standards, so why are we playing this EU membership game? Better to say, and more honest from the EU, we will help rebuild your country, the one we were very instrumental in ruining, and one day in the future, if we are even still a Union, we will consider asking you to join our club. Wouldn't it be nice if politicians were honest?

Peace can only be founded on Justice and Rightousness.

As is Written -

" With what measurie You measuries to others,
will be measuried to You again,
and with what Judgement You Judge others,
will be Judged to You again " !.

The Albanians has Judged that the Albanians must be Free and Independent,
but They dont Judge this Freedom and Independence to the Serbians.

The Albanians have Measuried that The Albanians shall be Free and Independen where They are in Majority,
But They dont Meeasurie this Measurie to the Serbians.

What is this ?

Judgement and Meausurment according to the Albanians Themselves,
will come back to the Albanians Themselves.

It is called Equality.

Arn.Sweden.

Seems like almost every day, there is another EU talking head spewing the same identical rhetoric as the previous one. It would be such a welcomed relief if just one of them said something new and different. I have been listening to the same line, Serbia is not expected to recognize an independent KiM, but they should act like it is. What the F? If you don't recognize something, then it does not exist. PLEASE, EU talkers, change your words a bit, and think about what you are saying. You are reading official policy from Brussels, nothing else. And with that behavior, you are not helping the situation in the Balkans one bit. You (EU) have dug your heels in, and so has Serbia and Pristina: who will be the most pragmatic, and move the solution along? Or, will everyone be bogged down by their myopic interests, throw their weight, or stubbornness around, and extend the frozen conflict in KiM for a few more decades? Sometimes, I get the feeling that the West is OK with the status quo in KiM, they can spend military dollars on KFOR, yet they can play both sides (Serbs and Albanians) politically forever.

Do you know what's absurd?? That Albanians think Kosovo is independent.

"If serbian would treated albanians like albanians treating serbs today in kosovo, look the serbs south of ibar river, nobody wuold have right to demand independance."

De niro

Did albanians during Serbian control need KFOR to protect their graveyards and mosques from vandals? Did ordinary albanians need KFOR protection to go to the market? Did elderly albanians get beaten to death in their homes or terrorized so that they would sell their property for half of what it is worth? Serbs can not remain in Kosovo without KFOR protection, 2 million albanians stayed in Kosovo when it was under Serbian control. How do you explain that?

Ambassador, thanks fr recognising the independence of Kosova. 22 of EU countries, USA, Canada, Japan, New Zealand, Australia and more than 60 other memebr countrie of UN has recognised the indepence of Kosovo. Soon we will have more recognisions.

Commentators, Israel is not recognised by more than 40 UN countries and is member of UN.
Membership of Kosovo is going slowly but surely. Do you remember where we was before 12 years. Look at us now ;)

@ Gjergj Kastrioti

Yes I look and I can see where you are. Over 50% of population living in poverty and unnemployed. Living on EU and US taxpayer money. Zero economy. No investments. Terrorists as 'government officials' (puppets). Lawless fanatic society. Wow you really achieved a lot. Oh ya wait...you did actually progress in one sector - you managed to build a mosque on every corner with islamic jihad saudi money.

If you commentators start to demand a indepandance for a handfull serbs in northkosovo what about the albanians in a Preseva valley, albanians in montenegro, macedonia and greece? Do they also have the right of selfdetermination?
Serbia should and will never gain control over kosovo and its population again, the only thing it remains, when i read some opinions, is to run into kosovo again with military and paramilitary and punish that people again, killing thousands of innocent civilians.
If serbian would treated albanians like albanians treating serbs today in kosovo, look the serbs south of ibar river, nobody wuold have right to demand independance.

Rocky- stupid but i will respond. Borders stay the same as in Yugoslavia. Simples.

Keep on massaging Serbia's ego....that will be allowed to join EU without recognising Kosovo independence first....!

Border changes should be made possible with conditions. First, they the (E.U & U.S) should require Serbia to relinquish, presevo, bujonovac & medvedja as a starting point, the Albanians there are the majority! If Serbia agree's to take this first step then & only then should the government of Kosova sit down and negotiate the relinquishment of northern mitrovica!!! After all, we are looking to be fair here arn't we? Oh and one more thing, don't forget about the Albanians of macedonia? What can one expect that response to be? I have a pretty good feeling on the answer to that one..

The diplomat stated that Sweden was "against any changes to the existing borders, and is completely in agreement with the U.S. on this issue". In line with his country's decision to recognize Kosovo,
========================================

What a contradictory statement. Against changes to existing borders and in agreement about independent Kosovo.
If you are against changes to existing borders then you would not consider Kosovo a country since it is part of Serbia (according to majority of the world and the UN).

To - De Niro !.

If you commentators start to demand a indepandance for a handfull serbs in northkosovo what about the albanians in a Preseva valley, albanians in montenegro, macedonia and greece? Do they also have the right of selfdetermination?

Comment - They will also demand Selfdetermination, just you wait and se.

It is written -

" The Good things You wants others to do to You,
You should also do to them " !.

The demand beginns with Yourself.
To accuse the Serbians will only lead to what you stated about them.

So blame only Youself when it happens,
because if you dont end it,
when you are in power and have the opportunity to do so,
it will be ended in a way you cant prevent.

All by what you called wrongdoings,
will not Justifie Your own wrongdoings.

To demand Justice from others,
but dont acting in the same way Yourself,
is called Hypocrisy.

Arn.Sweden.

MikeC, 16 July 2012 17:40)
what a ridiculous post. When Yugoslavia was under the control of Tito no, one Milosevic took over we all know the answer. You have 4 UN resolutions calling for the end to the violence perpetrated on Albanians by Serbs. Not only did the police turn their head to any violence from Serbs, they instigated most of violence.
How many left Kosovo for protection from the violence how many are buried in mass graves and you have the gall to pretend like it was a utopia for Albanians under Serbian control.

Kosovo's recognition by Serbia isn't a big deal. We all know deep down, Serbia wants to join EU, at the same time one major condition for Serbia is to implement all of the agreements that took place already. Now, we already know Serbia is still hiding the agreements reached by Stefanovic, which he signed them himself, and not at a gun point either, but by his own will. You wonder why EU has asked Serbia to strengthen relations with Kosovo? Some where among those agreements, one of them is for Serbia and Kosovo to open official offices on opposite sides. Not any different from opening embassies, it's safe to say that Serbia has already recognized Kosovo to a certain extent. The problem is, Serbian government officials are trying to think of a way, how to tell the Serbian public, without hurting their feelings.

"it's safe to say that Serbia has already recognized Kosovo to a certain extent. "
(EU, 16 July 2012 18:46)

Yes, there's no denial that there's an entity called Kosovo, Serbia recognized that, but it doesn't make this entity a state.

Serbia has recognized kosovo independence in every way . The conferences with kosovo. The education deal, tadic thaci handshake everything . How does serbia even oppose kosovo independence now?

MikeC, 16 July 2012 17:40)
what a ridiculous post. (pss, 17 July 2012 07:47)

The only ridiculous post is your's; the KLA instigated every piece of violence, in those four year's over 150 Yugoslav policemen were killed and many Serbian civilians were harrased, expulsed from their homes and place of business. The Yugoslav authorities had not other choice but to send the army to root out the KLA. The KLA is not only responsible for the murder of Serbian police and civilains but also many Albanian civilians and political opponents against the KLA terrorist organization. Need it be reminded even the USA listed the KLA as a terrorist organization, nothing more, nothing less. The fact of the matter is that Kosovo is still run by terrorists other than Northern Kosovo.

There was no utopia in Kosovo, but it was much better before than it is now which is nothing more than a illegal drug state collecting charitable funds from the US and EU brandishing a 50% unemployment rate and no hope for the normal Albanian or Serbian citizen. Kosovo is a joke, a country run by terrorists and bandits.

As for TITO's rule, he allowed the mass expulsion of thousands of Serbian civilians from Kosovo by the Yugoslav Communist Authorities which escalated between the periods of 1980-1989. Milosovic government was a reaction to those Albanian Communist policies.

Ask thos who went to Vidovdan and think again, that makes you wonder does Kosovo recognises serbia As a country not allway round. Give few more years and you will see how Kosovo will behave towards serbia. Enough is enough, time for preshevo valley to join Kosovo and get rid of dictatorial regime of Milosovic puppets. Those who have doubt on Kosovo not a state than i suggest you read basic stuff and you will find out. I travelled through serbia and i can tell you Kosovo 13 years after war is 100 times better than serbia, this is simply because shepherd people in Serbian parlament has dreamt EU and Kosovo but lost all by the look of it.

It's nice the EU continues to support and have no problem supporting parallel realities in Kosovo* :)

Been following B92 for some time now ...what's amazing and disappointing, is how some of the looser career diplomats go around the world talking a lot of nonsense(don't know if you heard the report about Karl Bilt, almost going to war against russia because he thought Herring(the fish)Farts were the seismic trails of russian subs) ...bottom line is, in america the african american community got a Voice in the 70 and 80s by boycotting products that didn't promote equality...a simple solution and something my family and I do is not buy certain products...we will not buy products from countries or companies that are and historically have been "Anti-Serbian" ...its my hard earned money and its my choice what i spend it on...

And without the recognition of Kosovo can live peacefully!

MikeC, 17 July 2012 17:40)
Oh, I did not know that we were not suppose to talk about atrocities committed against the Albanians at such a level to elicit condemnation from the entire UNSC. Murders, tortures, rapes, and the theft of property, and desecretion of holy places at such a level that NATO banned together to launch a bombing campaign to stop it.
forgive me!
But in answer to your question yes they needed them but no one was there and they dared not to report it to the police for fear getting worse treatment.
And they did leave as they could most with only what they could carry, and returned to nothing.

pss

You are not sticking to the subject. My argument was simple. If you can't answer, then don't.

Albanians! when will you stop to pretend that any non-albanians here support you???

there are not brian´s, luigi´s, joachim´s... there are coward-albanians who are eager to create the impression as if there is some united support for the albanian cause, but that is ridiculous.

from my very own experience I do know, those foreigners who are familiar with the balkans, support Serbia. I know that, and that is no simple phrase.

those comments of these alleged non-albanians are mostly very simple comments, showing the usual lack of knowledge that is so typical for the average K-albanian...

so, your efforts are senseless, my dear k-albanian friends.

pss- good question. How many are buried in mass graves? Keep looking.

Border changes should be made possible with conditions. First, they the (E.U & U.S) should require Serbia to relinquish, presevo, bujonovac & medvedja as a starting point, the Albanians there are the majority! If Serbia agree's to take this first step then & only then should the government of Kosova sit down and negotiate the relinquishment of northern mitrovica!!! After all, we are looking to be fair here arn't we? Oh and one more thing, don't forget about the Albanians of macedonia? What can one expect that response to be? I have a pretty good feeling on the answer to that one..

If you commentators start to demand a indepandance for a handfull serbs in northkosovo what about the albanians in a Preseva valley, albanians in montenegro, macedonia and greece? Do they also have the right of selfdetermination?
Serbia should and will never gain control over kosovo and its population again, the only thing it remains, when i read some opinions, is to run into kosovo again with military and paramilitary and punish that people again, killing thousands of innocent civilians.
If serbian would treated albanians like albanians treating serbs today in kosovo, look the serbs south of ibar river, nobody wuold have right to demand independance.

Keep on massaging Serbia's ego....that will be allowed to join EU without recognising Kosovo independence first....!

I get it Christer. It is ok to alter the borders of Serbia, but not Kosovo. Hmmm. Do you realize how stupid that sounds. Stop being an American lackey and have some principles.

Peace can only be founded on Justice and Rightousness.

As is Written -

" With what measurie You measuries to others,
will be measuried to You again,
and with what Judgement You Judge others,
will be Judged to You again " !.

The Albanians has Judged that the Albanians must be Free and Independent,
but They dont Judge this Freedom and Independence to the Serbians.

The Albanians have Measuried that The Albanians shall be Free and Independen where They are in Majority,
But They dont Meeasurie this Measurie to the Serbians.

What is this ?

Judgement and Meausurment according to the Albanians Themselves,
will come back to the Albanians Themselves.

It is called Equality.

Arn.Sweden.

Kosovo is not independent and never will be so.

There is nothing to recognise.

@ Gjergj Kastrioti

Yes I look and I can see where you are. Over 50% of population living in poverty and unnemployed. Living on EU and US taxpayer money. Zero economy. No investments. Terrorists as 'government officials' (puppets). Lawless fanatic society. Wow you really achieved a lot. Oh ya wait...you did actually progress in one sector - you managed to build a mosque on every corner with islamic jihad saudi money.

Ambassador, thanks fr recognising the independence of Kosova. 22 of EU countries, USA, Canada, Japan, New Zealand, Australia and more than 60 other memebr countrie of UN has recognised the indepence of Kosovo. Soon we will have more recognisions.

Commentators, Israel is not recognised by more than 40 UN countries and is member of UN.
Membership of Kosovo is going slowly but surely. Do you remember where we was before 12 years. Look at us now ;)

Do you know what's absurd?? That Albanians think Kosovo is independent.

Actually, its absurd for Serbia to not do everything it could (at least on a diplomatic/legal level) to counter the occupation of Serbia's southern province. The fact that our political class is not doing that today is nothing short of treason. They necessarily plan their every move in 'accordance with European values' and have several times buckled under Western pressure when it didn't have too.

Serbs in Kosovo and the state alike should not have any cooperation with EULEX (as long as they break the original agreements of staying neutral), no negotiations with organ extractors (definitely not shaking one's hand) and increased aid for the Serbs in Kosovo who managed to avoid ethnic cleansing/rape/murder.

I am pretty sure increasing aid/investment into Serb communities in Kosovo is more important than tax dollars funding foreign NGO's and having over 130 gov't agencies when most countries have...8.

Anyway ambassador Asp, asking Serbia "to recognize Kosovo" (idk what that means Serbia already recognizes the existence of a Kosovo..weird) is absurd but..handshakes with war criminals at summits in genocidal Croatia is absurd as is having sit-downs with Edita the warthog.

"If serbian would treated albanians like albanians treating serbs today in kosovo, look the serbs south of ibar river, nobody wuold have right to demand independance."

De niro

Did albanians during Serbian control need KFOR to protect their graveyards and mosques from vandals? Did ordinary albanians need KFOR protection to go to the market? Did elderly albanians get beaten to death in their homes or terrorized so that they would sell their property for half of what it is worth? Serbs can not remain in Kosovo without KFOR protection, 2 million albanians stayed in Kosovo when it was under Serbian control. How do you explain that?

Kosovo's recognition by Serbia isn't a big deal. We all know deep down, Serbia wants to join EU, at the same time one major condition for Serbia is to implement all of the agreements that took place already. Now, we already know Serbia is still hiding the agreements reached by Stefanovic, which he signed them himself, and not at a gun point either, but by his own will. You wonder why EU has asked Serbia to strengthen relations with Kosovo? Some where among those agreements, one of them is for Serbia and Kosovo to open official offices on opposite sides. Not any different from opening embassies, it's safe to say that Serbia has already recognized Kosovo to a certain extent. The problem is, Serbian government officials are trying to think of a way, how to tell the Serbian public, without hurting their feelings.

You know what, enough with this rotten EU membership carrot the EU has been waving in front of Serbia, and our dumb ass politicians are chasing. The EU has no intent in bringing Serbia into the EU, none. Have readers here driven through Serbia lately? Have you seen what the small towns and cities look like? Even the large cities are a decaying wasteland, but the rest of Serbia is dead. Why in the world would the EU want Serbia in its club - they don't. They just wave that EU carrot, and our dumb politicians play the EU accession game, so they can get the loans. Everyone knows it's a farce, yet they keep, from both sides, selling the same old crap. Serbia is a basket case, and is decades away from EU standards, so why are we playing this EU membership game? Better to say, and more honest from the EU, we will help rebuild your country, the one we were very instrumental in ruining, and one day in the future, if we are even still a Union, we will consider asking you to join our club. Wouldn't it be nice if politicians were honest?

Seems like almost every day, there is another EU talking head spewing the same identical rhetoric as the previous one. It would be such a welcomed relief if just one of them said something new and different. I have been listening to the same line, Serbia is not expected to recognize an independent KiM, but they should act like it is. What the F? If you don't recognize something, then it does not exist. PLEASE, EU talkers, change your words a bit, and think about what you are saying. You are reading official policy from Brussels, nothing else. And with that behavior, you are not helping the situation in the Balkans one bit. You (EU) have dug your heels in, and so has Serbia and Pristina: who will be the most pragmatic, and move the solution along? Or, will everyone be bogged down by their myopic interests, throw their weight, or stubbornness around, and extend the frozen conflict in KiM for a few more decades? Sometimes, I get the feeling that the West is OK with the status quo in KiM, they can spend military dollars on KFOR, yet they can play both sides (Serbs and Albanians) politically forever.

The diplomat stated that Sweden was "against any changes to the existing borders, and is completely in agreement with the U.S. on this issue". In line with his country's decision to recognize Kosovo,
========================================

What a contradictory statement. Against changes to existing borders and in agreement about independent Kosovo.
If you are against changes to existing borders then you would not consider Kosovo a country since it is part of Serbia (according to majority of the world and the UN).

"it's safe to say that Serbia has already recognized Kosovo to a certain extent. "
(EU, 16 July 2012 18:46)

Yes, there's no denial that there's an entity called Kosovo, Serbia recognized that, but it doesn't make this entity a state.

Rocky- stupid but i will respond. Borders stay the same as in Yugoslavia. Simples.

Ask thos who went to Vidovdan and think again, that makes you wonder does Kosovo recognises serbia As a country not allway round. Give few more years and you will see how Kosovo will behave towards serbia. Enough is enough, time for preshevo valley to join Kosovo and get rid of dictatorial regime of Milosovic puppets. Those who have doubt on Kosovo not a state than i suggest you read basic stuff and you will find out. I travelled through serbia and i can tell you Kosovo 13 years after war is 100 times better than serbia, this is simply because shepherd people in Serbian parlament has dreamt EU and Kosovo but lost all by the look of it.

To - De Niro !.

If you commentators start to demand a indepandance for a handfull serbs in northkosovo what about the albanians in a Preseva valley, albanians in montenegro, macedonia and greece? Do they also have the right of selfdetermination?

Comment - They will also demand Selfdetermination, just you wait and se.

It is written -

" The Good things You wants others to do to You,
You should also do to them " !.

The demand beginns with Yourself.
To accuse the Serbians will only lead to what you stated about them.

So blame only Youself when it happens,
because if you dont end it,
when you are in power and have the opportunity to do so,
it will be ended in a way you cant prevent.

All by what you called wrongdoings,
will not Justifie Your own wrongdoings.

To demand Justice from others,
but dont acting in the same way Yourself,
is called Hypocrisy.

Arn.Sweden.

Been following B92 for some time now ...what's amazing and disappointing, is how some of the looser career diplomats go around the world talking a lot of nonsense(don't know if you heard the report about Karl Bilt, almost going to war against russia because he thought Herring(the fish)Farts were the seismic trails of russian subs) ...bottom line is, in america the african american community got a Voice in the 70 and 80s by boycotting products that didn't promote equality...a simple solution and something my family and I do is not buy certain products...we will not buy products from countries or companies that are and historically have been "Anti-Serbian" ...its my hard earned money and its my choice what i spend it on...

MikeC, 16 July 2012 17:40)
what a ridiculous post. When Yugoslavia was under the control of Tito no, one Milosevic took over we all know the answer. You have 4 UN resolutions calling for the end to the violence perpetrated on Albanians by Serbs. Not only did the police turn their head to any violence from Serbs, they instigated most of violence.
How many left Kosovo for protection from the violence how many are buried in mass graves and you have the gall to pretend like it was a utopia for Albanians under Serbian control.

pss

You are not sticking to the subject. My argument was simple. If you can't answer, then don't.

It's nice the EU continues to support and have no problem supporting parallel realities in Kosovo* :)

And without the recognition of Kosovo can live peacefully!

Serbia has recognized kosovo independence in every way . The conferences with kosovo. The education deal, tadic thaci handshake everything . How does serbia even oppose kosovo independence now?

MikeC, 16 July 2012 17:40)
what a ridiculous post. (pss, 17 July 2012 07:47)

The only ridiculous post is your's; the KLA instigated every piece of violence, in those four year's over 150 Yugoslav policemen were killed and many Serbian civilians were harrased, expulsed from their homes and place of business. The Yugoslav authorities had not other choice but to send the army to root out the KLA. The KLA is not only responsible for the murder of Serbian police and civilains but also many Albanian civilians and political opponents against the KLA terrorist organization. Need it be reminded even the USA listed the KLA as a terrorist organization, nothing more, nothing less. The fact of the matter is that Kosovo is still run by terrorists other than Northern Kosovo.

There was no utopia in Kosovo, but it was much better before than it is now which is nothing more than a illegal drug state collecting charitable funds from the US and EU brandishing a 50% unemployment rate and no hope for the normal Albanian or Serbian citizen. Kosovo is a joke, a country run by terrorists and bandits.

As for TITO's rule, he allowed the mass expulsion of thousands of Serbian civilians from Kosovo by the Yugoslav Communist Authorities which escalated between the periods of 1980-1989. Milosovic government was a reaction to those Albanian Communist policies.

pss- good question. How many are buried in mass graves? Keep looking.

MikeC, 17 July 2012 17:40)
Oh, I did not know that we were not suppose to talk about atrocities committed against the Albanians at such a level to elicit condemnation from the entire UNSC. Murders, tortures, rapes, and the theft of property, and desecretion of holy places at such a level that NATO banned together to launch a bombing campaign to stop it.
forgive me!
But in answer to your question yes they needed them but no one was there and they dared not to report it to the police for fear getting worse treatment.
And they did leave as they could most with only what they could carry, and returned to nothing.

Albanians! when will you stop to pretend that any non-albanians here support you???

there are not brian´s, luigi´s, joachim´s... there are coward-albanians who are eager to create the impression as if there is some united support for the albanian cause, but that is ridiculous.

from my very own experience I do know, those foreigners who are familiar with the balkans, support Serbia. I know that, and that is no simple phrase.

those comments of these alleged non-albanians are mostly very simple comments, showing the usual lack of knowledge that is so typical for the average K-albanian...

so, your efforts are senseless, my dear k-albanian friends.