UN to vote on Kosovo organ trafficking draft

Do it, but it wont make a difference. If the investigation shows up with nothing, Serbs will just call the UN a Western puppet institution. Propaganda only works when its beneficial for them

Do it, but it wont make a difference. If the investigation shows up with nothing, Serbs will just call the UN a Western puppet institution. Propaganda only works when its beneficial for them
(Zena, 21 December 2011, 12:53)
Then they would be doing exactly what Albanians do. Every time someone accuses an Albanian of anything they immediately say it's Serbian propaganda or that Serbs paid someone off. Seems like there's a lot of that going around these days, you know, blaming others.

blah blah show me the fects its on ough with russian propagenda how long this fake story is been on news on ehere we are one year letter no thing new same old fake news

Let us see where the UK, US & Fr fall on this. If they block it or undermine it then they are openly siding with organized crime. There will be no way to hide this. Belgrade can then argue that the EU 'rule of law' only seems to apply to serbs whilst albanian criminals have effective immunity and protection from the top.

Then they would be doing exactly what Albanians do. Every time someone accuses an Albanian of anything they immediately say it's Serbian propaganda or that Serbs paid someone off. Seems like there's a lot of that going around these days, you know, blaming others.
(Daniel, 21 December 2011 13:14)

No it's not the same. Albanians accept a lot of their wrong doings. There were churches and monasteries burned in 2004 by angry K-Albanian mobs and these are facts and documented which no one denies. There is an explanation on why this happened but 99% of Albanians feel bad about it including everyone that post in here. There is plenty of criminality among Albanians just like among any other nationality. 99% of Albanians acknowledge it and feel bad about it.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there. You still claim that the expulsion of almost 1 million civilians from Kosova was because of NATO bombs.

All Albanians are asking is, that Dick Marty provide the facts that he so dearly cherish. As long as there are not facts, as long as not a single victim has been identified, then there is no crime. If you persist, than it is a propaganda and nothing else.

I wonder whether miri and all the other Albanian apologists here have ever considered why the names of witnesses and those involved in cases such as these are not made public. Could it be because people who are exposed in criminal trials either end up hanging from a tree in a German park, or mysteriously disappear. And of course EULEX is completely unbiased and has a cast iron witness protection programme in Kosovo right? The facts and the evidence that you keep banging on about would undoubtedly be presented in an impartial and intimidation free courtroom as far away from the culprits as possible, ie not in Thaci's Pristina surrounded by his US and German sponsors. Get real miri. Don't insult our intelligence. Lastly, I'm glad you and your compatriots 'feel bad' about burning priceless medieval buildings to the ground and then using them as toilets while filming the barbarism as a keepsake. Now go one step further and punish those responsible. It may be seven years too late, but at least it would make a start.

it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.
(stasi, 21 December 2011 18:05)
========================

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.

If you look at the UNSC website there is no mention of the resolution before the council in any of the open meetings. In the closed session all that is listed is Yemen and then other matters.
This all engrossing subject must be "other matters". I doubt it will make it to open session at least as writtenm, the west has stated several times that the matter should be investigated by Eulex and there was no need for a separate UNSC action. In most probability if something is passed will be for a special envoy to report back to the UNSC on the progress of the situation without any special rights to take control of the investigation.
For the west to vote otherwise would be a no confidence vote in EULEX.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there.
(miri, 21 December 2011 15:58)
--
Stop the crap miri. The Serbian police were cracking down on Albanian terrorists. Even the US considered them terrorists at the time. Albanians were killing and tormenting Serbs. I was in KiM in 1989 and witnessed it first hand.

As for crying about the war, you guys are the ones that no only provoked it but invited it. That was your game plan not ours.

what a waste of time which this fake story and cheap prpaganda without any evidence thi story is old no one belive this expect the serbs. it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.
(stasi, 21 December 2011 18:05)

Funilly enough, the only people who dont beleive the report are Albanian, the rest of the world either remaind oblivious to it (which they've done before), or were horrified by it. Regardless, whether or not the organs were stolen, the allegations must warrant at least an investigation. The only reason one of FUKUS (France, UK, US) would block such an investigation is if they know theres something to hide.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there. You still claim that the expulsion of almost 1 million civilians from Kosova was because of NATO bombs.

All Albanians are asking is, that Dick Marty provide the facts that he so dearly cherish. As long as there are not facts, as long as not a single victim has been identified, then there is no crime. If you persist, than it is a propaganda and nothing else.
(miri, 21 December 2011 15:58)
First, I am not in position to wage an entire war; I am but one person. So, you are obviously wrong there. Second, Albanians on this fora rarely accept responsibility for any act. I've been reading and responding to B92 for years now and rarely do I ever read anything accepting responsibility for any crime. Serbs on the other hand have accepted responsibility and sent people to the Hague, and willingly. That shows responsibility. Even if they did so under pressure, they did so. I would love to see Albanians accept that some of theirs are criminals.

Regarding your point about evidence. From what I've been reading over time is that Marty refuses to provide witnesses until there is adequate protection or an impartial investigation. Thus far, some powers are not allowing an impartial investigation. That is horrible. Why would Serbs be suspicious? Well, ask your self this. If you want an investigation that could possibly show that you were wrong, as the Serbs are asking, why not have one? Why is the US government representative in the UN blocking such a move? If there is nothing to hide, shouldn't they allow it? And if you are right, I'll be the first to acknowledge it. All that is being asked for is a fair and impartial investigation, nothing more. The EU doesn't even have jurisdiction in Albania, where some of the crimes are alleged to have taken place. So, that's why Serbs and I (only half Serb) are upset. Do you finally get it? I hope so.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.

It is pretty useless that Russia and the UNSC vote and send envoys whose conclusions and reports will be ignored. We all know what happened to the last envoy, Ahtisaari. They sent him down to the mortals and when he came back with the verdict they said: "We don't like it".

This sentence written in the article is false: "In his report published in late 2010, Council of Europe (CoE) rapporteur Dick Marty named the ethnic Albanian KLA as perpetrators of the atrocities....".
Dick Marty named members of the KLA as possible perpetrators of the atrocities.

what a waste of time which this fake story and cheap prpaganda without any evidence thi story is old no one belive this expect the serbs. it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.
(Steve B., 21 December 2011 20:08)

And I thought the Serbian response to the shootings in north Kosovo was that since KFOR had not released any eveidence then there was not any evidence??? How we continually manipulate to suit ourselves.
(Hmmm, 22 December 2011 00:39)

Incorrect. If you are talking about the ROSU officer, my response was that the Serbs were fired on by an automatic weapon. This resulted in return fire hitting the officer.

Speaking of manipulating to suit yourselves how about illegally declaring independence because you dont want to be rules by Serbs, then deny Serbs their right not to be ruled by Albanians.

Don't worry though. The land grabbers will get what's coming to them. Only a matter of time.

Again with the same old propaganda, Serbia is hoping to dirty Kosovo's name by tying its inception with myth history. To this day no evidence has been found, recovered, or been produce to prove such a crime might have existed. Contrary video footage and witnesses have come forward stating what non-serbs have been saying from the get-go: Serbia and its agents have been paying people off to say their organs are missing.

Kosovars are sick and tired of hearing this age old propaganda and it's this same old beating of the horse with no proof is the reason that such waste isn't mass produced outside the Balkans. Such information continuous to spin primarily through B92 alone.

@pen

marty made no legal investigation of any kind... he had no capacity to nor did he attempt to. his own words.

Dick Marty has NO FACTS at all. No evidence AT ALL. The words of his magical mystery witnessess have not been investigated in the slightest.. and he emphatically absolves himself of any responsibility ... it is up to others to prove the allegations that he alone deems plausible despite making no investigation.

Do not insult our intelligence... this is propaganda pure and simple.

And talking about it, putting it in the media is the GOAL. its all serbs have... propaganda that has not accomplished single thing for serbs in these last few decades.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.
(Steve B., 21 December 2011 20:08)

And I thought the Serbian response to the shootings in north Kosovo was that since KFOR had not released any eveidence then there was not any evidence??? How we continually manipulate to suit ourselves.

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.
(Peggy, 21 December 2011 20:49)
The investigation is not being blocked the politicization of the matter by Serbia/Russia is what is being blocked. Eulex has undertaken the task of investigation, It has the full support of the EU. It is the EP that recommended the investigation. Why should the matter suddenly jump to the UN when the EU/EP/Eulex has not even had the opportunity to complete its investigation. Only for political purposes and has nothing to do with justice. The UN has had 2 opportunities in the matter through the ICTY, and again by UNMIK. There is no justification that the rightful place for any investigation is based in the UN "again".
You have had an endorsement by most if not all UNSC members that an investigation should take place, it is only whose jusridiction that is in question.
The UNSC has already selected to transfer all police and justice authorities concerning Kosovo to EULEX and the reconfiguration of UNMIK.

Here is a quote from a B92 article one year ago today on the official Belgrade stance.
"We believe this issue must be free of any politics, that it is in the interest of Serbia for the entire case to be processed as soon as possible, that EULEX should assume responsibility, because this is an exclusive issue that is a precondition for the establishing of the process of reconciliation in the entire region," Ljajić said in a telephone statement to Beta news agency from Strasbourg.
Notice 2 things it should be free of politics, and now that the west is supporting Eulex to handle the investigation, they are trying to block the investigation.

Don't worry though. The land grabbers will get what's coming to them. Only a matter of time.
(Steve B., 22 December 2011 04:44)
Could not have summed it up better, the whole reason that independence is the only possible solution. The Albanians would never be safe under Serbian authority again, the international community knows it, Kosovo knows it, Serbs know it. You just proved the point.

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.
(Peggy, 21 December 2011 20:49)

Peggy, I guess they are not really that sure then, or they are afraid of what else an impartial investigation would uncover. I have never seen such nonsense in the history of humanity.

... then you are going nowhere my dear Serbian friends. No matter how much you believe in it, you better hire yourselves a private investigator and get down to it. I'm sure Russia, China your "allies" will be ready to foot the bill.

Daniel, 21 December 2011 20:35)
Have happen crimes by both sides? Yes. Serbian crimes are not committed only by paramilitary but from all state structures of Serbia. What do you expect after all that? No reaction from other part. I don’t want to justify any single crime that any single Albanian has done versus Serbs. But please do we have a little reason when we compare things.

blah blah show me the fects its on ough with russian propagenda how long this fake story is been on news on ehere we are one year letter no thing new same old fake news

Do it, but it wont make a difference. If the investigation shows up with nothing, Serbs will just call the UN a Western puppet institution. Propaganda only works when its beneficial for them

Then they would be doing exactly what Albanians do. Every time someone accuses an Albanian of anything they immediately say it's Serbian propaganda or that Serbs paid someone off. Seems like there's a lot of that going around these days, you know, blaming others.
(Daniel, 21 December 2011 13:14)

No it's not the same. Albanians accept a lot of their wrong doings. There were churches and monasteries burned in 2004 by angry K-Albanian mobs and these are facts and documented which no one denies. There is an explanation on why this happened but 99% of Albanians feel bad about it including everyone that post in here. There is plenty of criminality among Albanians just like among any other nationality. 99% of Albanians acknowledge it and feel bad about it.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there. You still claim that the expulsion of almost 1 million civilians from Kosova was because of NATO bombs.

All Albanians are asking is, that Dick Marty provide the facts that he so dearly cherish. As long as there are not facts, as long as not a single victim has been identified, then there is no crime. If you persist, than it is a propaganda and nothing else.

Do it, but it wont make a difference. If the investigation shows up with nothing, Serbs will just call the UN a Western puppet institution. Propaganda only works when its beneficial for them
(Zena, 21 December 2011, 12:53)
Then they would be doing exactly what Albanians do. Every time someone accuses an Albanian of anything they immediately say it's Serbian propaganda or that Serbs paid someone off. Seems like there's a lot of that going around these days, you know, blaming others.

Let us see where the UK, US & Fr fall on this. If they block it or undermine it then they are openly siding with organized crime. There will be no way to hide this. Belgrade can then argue that the EU 'rule of law' only seems to apply to serbs whilst albanian criminals have effective immunity and protection from the top.

It is pretty useless that Russia and the UNSC vote and send envoys whose conclusions and reports will be ignored. We all know what happened to the last envoy, Ahtisaari. They sent him down to the mortals and when he came back with the verdict they said: "We don't like it".

This sentence written in the article is false: "In his report published in late 2010, Council of Europe (CoE) rapporteur Dick Marty named the ethnic Albanian KLA as perpetrators of the atrocities....".
Dick Marty named members of the KLA as possible perpetrators of the atrocities.

Again with the same old propaganda, Serbia is hoping to dirty Kosovo's name by tying its inception with myth history. To this day no evidence has been found, recovered, or been produce to prove such a crime might have existed. Contrary video footage and witnesses have come forward stating what non-serbs have been saying from the get-go: Serbia and its agents have been paying people off to say their organs are missing.

Kosovars are sick and tired of hearing this age old propaganda and it's this same old beating of the horse with no proof is the reason that such waste isn't mass produced outside the Balkans. Such information continuous to spin primarily through B92 alone.

@pen

marty made no legal investigation of any kind... he had no capacity to nor did he attempt to. his own words.

Dick Marty has NO FACTS at all. No evidence AT ALL. The words of his magical mystery witnessess have not been investigated in the slightest.. and he emphatically absolves himself of any responsibility ... it is up to others to prove the allegations that he alone deems plausible despite making no investigation.

Do not insult our intelligence... this is propaganda pure and simple.

And talking about it, putting it in the media is the GOAL. its all serbs have... propaganda that has not accomplished single thing for serbs in these last few decades.

what a waste of time which this fake story and cheap prpaganda without any evidence thi story is old no one belive this expect the serbs. it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.
(Steve B., 21 December 2011 20:08)

And I thought the Serbian response to the shootings in north Kosovo was that since KFOR had not released any eveidence then there was not any evidence??? How we continually manipulate to suit ourselves.

I wonder whether miri and all the other Albanian apologists here have ever considered why the names of witnesses and those involved in cases such as these are not made public. Could it be because people who are exposed in criminal trials either end up hanging from a tree in a German park, or mysteriously disappear. And of course EULEX is completely unbiased and has a cast iron witness protection programme in Kosovo right? The facts and the evidence that you keep banging on about would undoubtedly be presented in an impartial and intimidation free courtroom as far away from the culprits as possible, ie not in Thaci's Pristina surrounded by his US and German sponsors. Get real miri. Don't insult our intelligence. Lastly, I'm glad you and your compatriots 'feel bad' about burning priceless medieval buildings to the ground and then using them as toilets while filming the barbarism as a keepsake. Now go one step further and punish those responsible. It may be seven years too late, but at least it would make a start.

what a waste of time which this fake story and cheap prpaganda without any evidence thi story is old no one belive this expect the serbs. it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.
(stasi, 21 December 2011 18:05)

Funilly enough, the only people who dont beleive the report are Albanian, the rest of the world either remaind oblivious to it (which they've done before), or were horrified by it. Regardless, whether or not the organs were stolen, the allegations must warrant at least an investigation. The only reason one of FUKUS (France, UK, US) would block such an investigation is if they know theres something to hide.

If you look at the UNSC website there is no mention of the resolution before the council in any of the open meetings. In the closed session all that is listed is Yemen and then other matters.
This all engrossing subject must be "other matters". I doubt it will make it to open session at least as writtenm, the west has stated several times that the matter should be investigated by Eulex and there was no need for a separate UNSC action. In most probability if something is passed will be for a special envoy to report back to the UNSC on the progress of the situation without any special rights to take control of the investigation.
For the west to vote otherwise would be a no confidence vote in EULEX.

Here is a quote from a B92 article one year ago today on the official Belgrade stance.
"We believe this issue must be free of any politics, that it is in the interest of Serbia for the entire case to be processed as soon as possible, that EULEX should assume responsibility, because this is an exclusive issue that is a precondition for the establishing of the process of reconciliation in the entire region," Ljajić said in a telephone statement to Beta news agency from Strasbourg.
Notice 2 things it should be free of politics, and now that the west is supporting Eulex to handle the investigation, they are trying to block the investigation.

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.
(Peggy, 21 December 2011 20:49)

Peggy, I guess they are not really that sure then, or they are afraid of what else an impartial investigation would uncover. I have never seen such nonsense in the history of humanity.

... then you are going nowhere my dear Serbian friends. No matter how much you believe in it, you better hire yourselves a private investigator and get down to it. I'm sure Russia, China your "allies" will be ready to foot the bill.

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.
(Peggy, 21 December 2011 20:49)
The investigation is not being blocked the politicization of the matter by Serbia/Russia is what is being blocked. Eulex has undertaken the task of investigation, It has the full support of the EU. It is the EP that recommended the investigation. Why should the matter suddenly jump to the UN when the EU/EP/Eulex has not even had the opportunity to complete its investigation. Only for political purposes and has nothing to do with justice. The UN has had 2 opportunities in the matter through the ICTY, and again by UNMIK. There is no justification that the rightful place for any investigation is based in the UN "again".
You have had an endorsement by most if not all UNSC members that an investigation should take place, it is only whose jusridiction that is in question.
The UNSC has already selected to transfer all police and justice authorities concerning Kosovo to EULEX and the reconfiguration of UNMIK.

Don't worry though. The land grabbers will get what's coming to them. Only a matter of time.
(Steve B., 22 December 2011 04:44)
Could not have summed it up better, the whole reason that independence is the only possible solution. The Albanians would never be safe under Serbian authority again, the international community knows it, Kosovo knows it, Serbs know it. You just proved the point.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there.
(miri, 21 December 2011 15:58)
--
Stop the crap miri. The Serbian police were cracking down on Albanian terrorists. Even the US considered them terrorists at the time. Albanians were killing and tormenting Serbs. I was in KiM in 1989 and witnessed it first hand.

As for crying about the war, you guys are the ones that no only provoked it but invited it. That was your game plan not ours.

it is also well known that this will be blocked from US,UK and France or at least one of them.
(stasi, 21 December 2011 18:05)
========================

That's why you Albanians are not worried. You know the investigation will be blocked by your pals.
If there is nothing to worry about, why block? Why not let Serbia have the investigation, return empty and then mock Serbia forever?
Simple, you are worried and will use your pals to block. Pathetic.

You on the other hand waged an entire war against an authentic population and 10 years later are still in denial. There were a massive number of Albanian civilians dead during the war and you claim you have no idea how they got there. You still claim that the expulsion of almost 1 million civilians from Kosova was because of NATO bombs.

All Albanians are asking is, that Dick Marty provide the facts that he so dearly cherish. As long as there are not facts, as long as not a single victim has been identified, then there is no crime. If you persist, than it is a propaganda and nothing else.
(miri, 21 December 2011 15:58)
First, I am not in position to wage an entire war; I am but one person. So, you are obviously wrong there. Second, Albanians on this fora rarely accept responsibility for any act. I've been reading and responding to B92 for years now and rarely do I ever read anything accepting responsibility for any crime. Serbs on the other hand have accepted responsibility and sent people to the Hague, and willingly. That shows responsibility. Even if they did so under pressure, they did so. I would love to see Albanians accept that some of theirs are criminals.

Regarding your point about evidence. From what I've been reading over time is that Marty refuses to provide witnesses until there is adequate protection or an impartial investigation. Thus far, some powers are not allowing an impartial investigation. That is horrible. Why would Serbs be suspicious? Well, ask your self this. If you want an investigation that could possibly show that you were wrong, as the Serbs are asking, why not have one? Why is the US government representative in the UN blocking such a move? If there is nothing to hide, shouldn't they allow it? And if you are right, I'll be the first to acknowledge it. All that is being asked for is a fair and impartial investigation, nothing more. The EU doesn't even have jurisdiction in Albania, where some of the crimes are alleged to have taken place. So, that's why Serbs and I (only half Serb) are upset. Do you finally get it? I hope so.

To all the Albanians posting here whining for evidence...

They would be crazy to reveal any evidence at this point for obvious reasons:
1. Witnesses are obviously not protected at the moment.
2. If they reveal evidence during the investigation there is a good chance that things might get "cleaned up" and evidence may get destroyed just like the last time.

But go ahead and keep whining. Your tone will change once the truth comes out.
(Steve B., 21 December 2011 20:08)

And I thought the Serbian response to the shootings in north Kosovo was that since KFOR had not released any eveidence then there was not any evidence??? How we continually manipulate to suit ourselves.
(Hmmm, 22 December 2011 00:39)

Incorrect. If you are talking about the ROSU officer, my response was that the Serbs were fired on by an automatic weapon. This resulted in return fire hitting the officer.

Speaking of manipulating to suit yourselves how about illegally declaring independence because you dont want to be rules by Serbs, then deny Serbs their right not to be ruled by Albanians.

Don't worry though. The land grabbers will get what's coming to them. Only a matter of time.

Daniel, 21 December 2011 20:35)
Have happen crimes by both sides? Yes. Serbian crimes are not committed only by paramilitary but from all state structures of Serbia. What do you expect after all that? No reaction from other part. I don’t want to justify any single crime that any single Albanian has done versus Serbs. But please do we have a little reason when we compare things.