Church: EU has alternative, Serbs should persevere

Well said! This is a huge rebuke to Tadic and the sellout regime, as well as to the the German temporary occupiers of Serbian land. It is also a huge boost to the Serbs at the barricades. The church has called out the traitors.
Cheers!!

Fantastic statement, great display of Christian and human dignity from the Serbian Ortodox Church!

We chose the right religion! Meanwhile catholics, protestants and anglicans welcome islamization. Watch and Learn how a great proud nation defends its interests!

It is pathetic to see/read Serbian church to deal with politics.
(EA, 2 December 2011 15:55)

They are not even the most politically active religious institution in Serbia. That Mufti running his mouth in Novi Pazar has a party that runs directly in elections.

Thank you Church. I will start my Christmas fast early this year and go a little longer for our brothers and sisters in the occupied province. You are the strongest voice of opposition to this neo liberal mess of a country. We need to build a new, strong Serbia that is economically fit for the modern world but still holds on to traditional Christian values. Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.

Very nicely balanced and one that reflects reality. It will come as a moral boost to those protecting their homes and land.

It is pathetic to see/read Serbian church to deal with politics.

"For a responsible political authority and political elite of Serbia, Serbia and the Serb people as a whole have no alternative. Everything else, including the idealized and mythologized European Union, does."

B92

It's refreshing to see the Church taking a leading role on Serbia's potential EU membership by pointing out the interests of the Serbian nation and people are above anything else including the EU.Well done Church.

Yes the church is right we have an alternative. Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way church members do. If we all lived as these people do I am sure we would show the EU and the rest of the world an amazing alternative lifestyle to the way people in the modern world live. Let's pay our bills with donations we receive from our friends and protect ourselves from disease by repeating "Kosovo is Serbia". Our education should only consist of reading the Bible and the surrounding national mythology that has been built up over the centuries. Since we won't have jobs and will live off of donations we will have lots of time to think about all the important philosophical issues of Christianity and Serbian mythology while sleeping on the road or derelict factory buildings. This sounds like a great alternative.

@ metrod
could you please get your facts straight about your tens of thousands of people slaughtered by Serbian forces?
Even those who are the most favorable to your cause are talking about aprox. 13 000 people of all ethnics who died during this conflict.
Most during NATO bombing and several due to natural causes.
We're far from the massacre or "genocide" you're depicting !

I'm afraid the only hate speech I can see here comes from Albanian 'contributors.' There is nothing hateful about this statement from the SPC. In fact it sounds quite conciliatory. Something Albanian nationalist fanatics are unable to grasp; you know the concept of re-conciliation. As far as the statement 'tens of thousands of Albanian deaths in the 90's' is concerned, well eugene I really think you need to get your facts right before spouting off from the hip. There were far less than ten thousand casualties during the Kosovo conflict. And that includes Serbian victims. There have been a thousand Serb deaths since 1999 however, and this after the war ended and under the noses of supposedly neutral international forces occupying the province. Furthermore I don't hear any conciliatory pronouncements from either catholic or muslim albanian religious representatives. Let's hear what they think about the desecration of Orthodox churches and cemetaries. No, you're right. I haven't heard anything either.

I don't know where to begin with this statement to be honest... not only is it patronising to the Albanians (i.e. calling us Arbanasi a late mideaval term for Albanians!!) but it clearly shows their sad, nationalist, hateful and extremist ideology based on lies and myths.
(adrian kola, 2 December 2011 16:10)

Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?

I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's.
(Eugene, 2 December 2011 16:04)
--
LOL! I know where the Church was during the 90's. It was in the real world and not some NATO fantasy world where propaganda, lies and exaggeration ruled the waves.

Practically all religions around the world are involved in politics. Who ever said they weren't? The SPC is no different.

@ Lazar (or whatever)
..." why dont they go to kosovo..."
Probably you've never been to Kosovo and Metohija
Have a look at those beautiful churches and monasteries which are there for 100ds of years already. Have a look at those wonderful frescos and talk to the monks or even the simple people of this province.
No doubt, the church is there, has been there and will be there in despite of your ignorant comments !
Cheers

"Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?"
(???, 2 December 2011 17:13)
Strange people, not to admit that they came from Sicily in 11 century
per Greak books.

A wise man speaking for a worthy creed. Their vital spiritual independence is what makes Serbs the target of prejudice and discrimination. This kind of leadership is an example to us all. Why do we not even expect such voices out of Pristina?

"The Synod added that human deaths on either side, regardless of who provoked them, would be a sin, crime, tragedy and shame for everyone, and would result in defeat and collapse of the dialogue and peaceful efforts."

Hypocrisy in its lowest level. I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's. The role of religion should be to bring people together so they can live in peace next to each other. I'm not sure that's been the case with the SPC as far as Kosovo is concerned.

That's what I call a slap in Tadic's face :)

I don't know where to begin with this statement to be honest... not only is it patronising to the Albanians (i.e. calling us Arbanasi a late mideaval term for Albanians!!) but it clearly shows their sad, nationalist, hateful and extremist ideology based on lies and myths.

As i wrote many times one of the reasons why Serbia can't be part of Eu is the Church aka Holy Sinod...every one was aware of this in Brussels but hope for some changes... but after 10 years the clergy is the same it was in the Milosevic era..never and i repeat never in a country approching Eu the church had been negative in the European Integration ...Serbia is different but we all know this don't we ?

@Frank
EU won't hand out billions of dollars for free, specially not at the moment.
The actual government already indebted Serbia more than enough.
That's not the right way to go forward !
Remember that our children will have to pay off the debt your contracting today!
Remember that Yugoslav war started when US voted a law which closed the credit tap !
Don't put yourself the handcuffs on!
Stay away from IMF and WB or any EU credit promises, since they're NEVER without counterparts which you wouldn't like to endorse!
Serbia has resources, value them, spare them where's no need to spend.
During Kostunica government I saw nice Ladas outside the assembly hall.
Today, only Audis, BMWs etc.
Throwing money out of the window is not the solution !
EU won't plant no money trees in Serbia since they just don't exist !!!
Get real people, defend what you have instead of dreaming of a better future with your neighbors resources !!!

Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way church members do.
(Phill, 2 December 2011 16:46)

That statement can easily be re-written:

"Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way Kosovo Albanians do."

Priceless!

Stick that that and to your "religion"! You will win like you won Yugoslavia/Velika Srbija
(EA, 2 December 2011 17:43)

We didn't lose any war. We won against Bosnians, Croats and Bosniaks. We only lost wars against the strongest military alliance in the world and a 30,000 feet bombardment is not a war.

We beat all of you separately and even if it was Serbs vs. everyone else in ex-YU we would still come out on top and will in the future. Thanks.

This is a different type of church.
(metrod, 2 December 2011 17:15)
Metrod now I know what you mean, Zoran explain it to me.
Practically all religions around the world are involved in politics. Who ever said they weren't? The SPC is no different.
(Zoran, 2 December 2011 17:25)
This is Political Church says Zoran. Now I have a question for this kind of Serb Church. They complain for some Churches destroyed from Albanians after 1999. They are right, I disagree with this act of Kalbanians, but my question is: Why the forefather of this Kalbanians doesn’t destroy these Churches during 5 centuries of Ottoman rule? Maybe this kind of declaration and political and nationalist profile of this Church frustrate the Kalbanians. I hope that this Church first heal Itself from the Nationalist illness and then help Serbian nation to recover from this illness.

Is the church going to step in and give the government the billion of dollars that they get from the EU development funds? How about road building and infrastructure development? How about restructuring the economy? The church has not development strategy for the country their advice seems to revolve around wanting people to live off 13th century fantasies and religious myths. I'm afraid that most Serbian people will not like that as an alternative to hands-on reforms and development.

Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.
(Ari Gold, 2 December 2011 16:26)

Stick that that and to your "religion"! You will win like you won Yugoslavia/Velika Srbija

Church and other religious institutions should stay out of politics, if they claim to work for unity and all other bs. By being involved, they show to take sides, which in return alienates the other side. No wonder, orthodox churches got burned and what not. I didn't see any catholic church being vandalized. You cannot have the cake and eat it too. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

"Hypocrisy in its lowest level. I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's. The role of religion should be to bring people together so they can live in peace next to each other. I'm not sure that's been the case with the SPC as far as Kosovo is concerned.
(Eugene"

- This is a different type of church.

Is the church going to step in and give the government the billion of dollars that they get from the EU development funds? How about road building and infrastructure development? How about restructuring the economy? The church has not development strategy for the country their advice seems to revolve around wanting people to live off 13th century fantasies and religious myths. I'm afraid that most Serbian people will not like that as an alternative to hands-on reforms and development.
(Frank, 2 December 2011 17:16)

The point of the church is that KSerbs shouldn't be betrayed in the sake of virtual EU money.

Well -

Humanly to speak,
this is as best Humans can come,
However,
It is to late because God has another solution on this matter.

That solution is already determined by God,
and the solution is War.

Note here what I write,
in a wery short time you will see.

Arn.Sweden.

This is why i support secularism-If they are so morally upright why dont they go to kosovo?
Sorry but you cant be modern and at the same time be backward.Most countries which are succesfull are secular even if they have a highly religious population-USA,Britian,China etc.I think Serbia should strive to be a citizen State and not influenced by religion,the same goes for all Yugoslav countries.

Church must shut the ...up. Stay out of politics and stop inciting hatred and violence. Advising people to abandon EU integration for a lost myth (Kosovo, cradle of Serbs blablabla...) is sick and insane. The call to KFOR to get shot in a status neutral manner is ridiculous.
(Hruz, 3 December 2011 10:01)

In the whole universe there is only one more slave minded creture than the original so called geci magyar namely the magyarized slovak or totek.
Your comment just reflect this attitude.You hungarians have a long tradition of being extremly short-sighted and having a good time on the sinking ship.Not an accident the you wer Hitler's last bootéickers.Could you explain me what adventages did EU accesion bring to your county ?Among 27 member states you are by far the biggest losers.I meet many hungarians who seem to be very dissatisfied with what happened in your country in the last 7 years.Meaning that quite a lot anyway shortshited huns are oppening their eyes.Seems you are the blindest among blind preching to others about EU Integration.Are you some kind of overpaid bent-backed EU chinovnik siting in Brussels that you still belive in this overdue new sovietunion. Otherwise As opposed to hungarians there are still people who have principles and spine and do not give up what is sacred for them.They insist on their traditions and therefor as opposed to rootless hungarians do not have to steal other peoples' culture .

bla bla bla al blaaak bla bla..... Parrots made blank in the head.

Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.
(Ari Gold, 2 December 2011 16:26)

Poor kids, only to be taught to live and die in hatred. Another generation wasted before final extinction...

"Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?"
(???, 2 December 2011 17:13)
Strange people, not to admit that they came from Sicily in 11 century
per Greak books.
(Bugar Skoplje, 2 December 2011 19:41)
Bulgar we can benefit from Leonidas a Greek that we have in this forum. Let ask him what tell this Greek books:)

I'm glad that the Orthodox church is being real with this. The EU is leading Europe towards a brick wall. Over the past few weeks many thousands of people have been protesting the Austerity measures put forth by the governments in EU countries. Portugal, Greece, U.K., Bulgaria, Spain, Belgium have all seen massive strikes and protests. Then someone like Herman Van Rompoy has the nerve to say the Eu has brought prosperity and stability.

Great words from the Church, showing it cares about its people and wont bow down to traitors and those who want to destroy Serbia.

Regarding comments about the SPC being political - Most of these comments are coming from islamic albos, are you all honestly telling me that islam isn't political? and all the things is has to say about political issues? I don't care to hear from a religion that openly preaches the killing of all those who insult islam. I have an awful lot of bad things to say about islam, I dare anyone to try and kill me for it.

Regarding general condemnation of this statement - There is nothing bad about this statement, it is nothing more than telling these brave Serbs to stay defiant, there is no preaching of violence here. The statement proves also that government and politics does not control the Church, which is undoubtbly a good thing. I mean for crying out loud I would love to see islam's reaction if Mecca for example and the land surrounding it was conquered by Christians, there would most likely be calls by imams and muftis to slaughter these Christians. Considering the suffering and the terrorism that the Serbian Orthodox Church and its believers have gone through in Kosovo has been met with very moderate reaction, considering what has been done to them. While I fully respect the Church's statement, for what the albanians have done they deserve nothing better than equal pain and suffering for what they have done.

Such a fair and peaceful statement. I strongly support everything they said and I am certainly NOT brainwashed but rather 'rational'.

I encourage all Serbs to read this article (follow link) keeping in mind EU 'alternative' :)

I also encourage all Albanians to read it too for a reality check :)

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/west-looks-east-for-a-lifeline-20111202-1obc3.html

Church must shut the ...up. Stay out of politics and stop inciting hatred and violence. Advising people to abandon EU integration for a lost myth (Kosovo, cradle of Serbs blablabla...) is sick and insane. The call to KFOR to get shot in a status neutral manner is ridiculous.

"Yeah, but the problem is that the Church is legitimized by God not by the people :)
(icj1, 3 December 2011 16:26)"

I have always thought that on this globe of ours, things are legitimized by PEOPLE egs. human beings running governments and/or judges presciding over issues such as some province's UDI or legitimizing gay marriages in some countries where it was previously illegal, etc, rather than by some supernatural being that nobody seemed to have had legal encounters with before (except perhaps you?)

Please show us your source(s) for the relevant legal documentation containing a judgement or decision from this God to legitimize a church. Thanks in advance.

Joachim,
I think you confused my post with someone else's. But, 13,000 qualifies as 'tens of thousands' doesn't it?
Since we're on the topic, claiming that most of the '13,0000' died due to NATO airstrikes is like saying the Serb patriarch is a holy man. No one with an ounce of common sense and objectivity will believe it.

Look, I'm Christian. And, I look at what the SPC is doing and it is similar to some radical Muslim clerics preach...

Maby you need to spill some holy water over your head to cool down friend.

Yes i know those Fresco's and churches, and i study the architexture and i can tell you they are beautifull.I have never been there no,i dont claim to be morally upright now do i?And when i refer to them i mean the leadership,ie the partriarch,but i think that those baricades wont be able to sustain his throne.

Seriously what is wrong with you?are these people not to be touched or something?Whats wrong with secularism,it works.I say this because i believe that the citizen state is better becasue it does not centralise on a specific group and it is free and open,not filled with any doctrines or dogma's.I think that constantly looking to god for help is self destructive.I believe it would be better to think "Hey i can do something productive and i dont have to bound by strict rules for thinking outside the box".

Yes the church does partly have such a mindset in helping the community and all that.But when you look through history from the inquisition to any perseqution ,high tendencies towards religion can stifle development.One might say ohh but what about what happend in the French revolution with the terror?.Yes but isnt the worship of a god not the same with the worship of another deity (Stalin,Robespierre etc)?

As for the monks or most of them, in Kosovo sure i have respect for them (at least the ones who dont get into fights or are involved in scandals),I dont believe in god but i admire the basic ideals they have,but as for those untouchables id sooner say something good about Tadic than them.I think they hold far too much power.Many if not most of them want things like religion to be part the official school programe.Religion has absolutly no place in this sphere what so ever.It is a private matter which people share out socailly,keep it away from the state.Writing it on paper is not good enough,it has to like this in practice.So Sorry to actually confront your rant with a credible argument but i suppose that gives you all the more reason to hate.

You seem to like lecturing people on "ignorance',exept that of your own,maby you should be a patriarch

Wowww! What a discovery - of course the EU has many alternatives! Nothing new!! Mr Kostunica has said it many times already! However, why did the church wait so long to make such an obvious statement? Lazy episops, prists, monks or?

Well said! This is a huge rebuke to Tadic and the sellout regime, as well as to the the German temporary occupiers of Serbian land. It is also a huge boost to the Serbs at the barricades. The church has called out the traitors.
(Dragan, 2 December 2011 15:47)

Yeah, but the problem is that the Church is legitimized by God not by the people :)

"but after 10 years the clergy is the same it was in the Milosevic era.."
(Luigi, 2 December 2011 17:47)

That is to be expected, I think. They were 85 years old back then, now they are 95 years old. Not much change can be expected by people that age. You must also consider that, in general, churches and religious institutions are among the most conservative institutions in every country. So, you have Serb Orthodox Church speaking like this, Catholic Church saying it is a sin to use contraceptives, Muslim clerics against women rights in many countries, etc etc. Change is not good for these self-appointed men of God because they say they hold the keys to the truth. They are stuck with that, cannot say "we changed our mind".

When will thiey stop cowardly hiding behind the veneer of religion when they are obviously nothing more than a political organization.

""The government should not be making decisions or changing its political tactics 'on the fly' without taking into account the vital needs and the positionheld by the Serbs in northern Kosovo, for whom this issue is not one of partisan and political calculations, but literally, an issue of 'to be or not to be'," the Holy Synod of the SPC said in its statement."


Well, as the Holy Synod is aware the Govermnment in Serbia is elected to take into account the interest and position of the majority of the 7M+ Serbs. If the position of the northern Kosovo Serbs matches with that, than it's good, otherwise they are out of luck :). Unfortunately the Sun does not revolve around the 0.07M+ Serbs in northern Kosovo.

Radek. I am surprised your hate speech came through, shame on B92 moderators first of all. It can be the weather or global waming, you just spew hatred on Hungarians. The topic was the church and making political comments. I have no idea how "scumbag Hungarians" and "Hitler's boot lickers" are concerened here, but it shows well your level of intelligence, If you have nothing to say, lets attack Hungarians. I don't know which sewer you crawled out from but it does not matter, whatever is your nationality, you are a disgrace of your people.

It is pathetic to see/read Serbian church to deal with politics.

"The Synod added that human deaths on either side, regardless of who provoked them, would be a sin, crime, tragedy and shame for everyone, and would result in defeat and collapse of the dialogue and peaceful efforts."

Hypocrisy in its lowest level. I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's. The role of religion should be to bring people together so they can live in peace next to each other. I'm not sure that's been the case with the SPC as far as Kosovo is concerned.

I don't know where to begin with this statement to be honest... not only is it patronising to the Albanians (i.e. calling us Arbanasi a late mideaval term for Albanians!!) but it clearly shows their sad, nationalist, hateful and extremist ideology based on lies and myths.

Yes the church is right we have an alternative. Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way church members do. If we all lived as these people do I am sure we would show the EU and the rest of the world an amazing alternative lifestyle to the way people in the modern world live. Let's pay our bills with donations we receive from our friends and protect ourselves from disease by repeating "Kosovo is Serbia". Our education should only consist of reading the Bible and the surrounding national mythology that has been built up over the centuries. Since we won't have jobs and will live off of donations we will have lots of time to think about all the important philosophical issues of Christianity and Serbian mythology while sleeping on the road or derelict factory buildings. This sounds like a great alternative.

Well -

Humanly to speak,
this is as best Humans can come,
However,
It is to late because God has another solution on this matter.

That solution is already determined by God,
and the solution is War.

Note here what I write,
in a wery short time you will see.

Arn.Sweden.

This is why i support secularism-If they are so morally upright why dont they go to kosovo?
Sorry but you cant be modern and at the same time be backward.Most countries which are succesfull are secular even if they have a highly religious population-USA,Britian,China etc.I think Serbia should strive to be a citizen State and not influenced by religion,the same goes for all Yugoslav countries.

Is the church going to step in and give the government the billion of dollars that they get from the EU development funds? How about road building and infrastructure development? How about restructuring the economy? The church has not development strategy for the country their advice seems to revolve around wanting people to live off 13th century fantasies and religious myths. I'm afraid that most Serbian people will not like that as an alternative to hands-on reforms and development.

I'm afraid the only hate speech I can see here comes from Albanian 'contributors.' There is nothing hateful about this statement from the SPC. In fact it sounds quite conciliatory. Something Albanian nationalist fanatics are unable to grasp; you know the concept of re-conciliation. As far as the statement 'tens of thousands of Albanian deaths in the 90's' is concerned, well eugene I really think you need to get your facts right before spouting off from the hip. There were far less than ten thousand casualties during the Kosovo conflict. And that includes Serbian victims. There have been a thousand Serb deaths since 1999 however, and this after the war ended and under the noses of supposedly neutral international forces occupying the province. Furthermore I don't hear any conciliatory pronouncements from either catholic or muslim albanian religious representatives. Let's hear what they think about the desecration of Orthodox churches and cemetaries. No, you're right. I haven't heard anything either.

Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.
(Ari Gold, 2 December 2011 16:26)

Stick that that and to your "religion"! You will win like you won Yugoslavia/Velika Srbija

This is a different type of church.
(metrod, 2 December 2011 17:15)
Metrod now I know what you mean, Zoran explain it to me.
Practically all religions around the world are involved in politics. Who ever said they weren't? The SPC is no different.
(Zoran, 2 December 2011 17:25)
This is Political Church says Zoran. Now I have a question for this kind of Serb Church. They complain for some Churches destroyed from Albanians after 1999. They are right, I disagree with this act of Kalbanians, but my question is: Why the forefather of this Kalbanians doesn’t destroy these Churches during 5 centuries of Ottoman rule? Maybe this kind of declaration and political and nationalist profile of this Church frustrate the Kalbanians. I hope that this Church first heal Itself from the Nationalist illness and then help Serbian nation to recover from this illness.

We chose the right religion! Meanwhile catholics, protestants and anglicans welcome islamization. Watch and Learn how a great proud nation defends its interests!

I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's.
(Eugene, 2 December 2011 16:04)
--
LOL! I know where the Church was during the 90's. It was in the real world and not some NATO fantasy world where propaganda, lies and exaggeration ruled the waves.

Practically all religions around the world are involved in politics. Who ever said they weren't? The SPC is no different.

Well said! This is a huge rebuke to Tadic and the sellout regime, as well as to the the German temporary occupiers of Serbian land. It is also a huge boost to the Serbs at the barricades. The church has called out the traitors.
Cheers!!

I don't know where to begin with this statement to be honest... not only is it patronising to the Albanians (i.e. calling us Arbanasi a late mideaval term for Albanians!!) but it clearly shows their sad, nationalist, hateful and extremist ideology based on lies and myths.
(adrian kola, 2 December 2011 16:10)

Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?

Church must shut the ...up. Stay out of politics and stop inciting hatred and violence. Advising people to abandon EU integration for a lost myth (Kosovo, cradle of Serbs blablabla...) is sick and insane. The call to KFOR to get shot in a status neutral manner is ridiculous.

Fantastic statement, great display of Christian and human dignity from the Serbian Ortodox Church!

It is pathetic to see/read Serbian church to deal with politics.
(EA, 2 December 2011 15:55)

They are not even the most politically active religious institution in Serbia. That Mufti running his mouth in Novi Pazar has a party that runs directly in elections.

Thank you Church. I will start my Christmas fast early this year and go a little longer for our brothers and sisters in the occupied province. You are the strongest voice of opposition to this neo liberal mess of a country. We need to build a new, strong Serbia that is economically fit for the modern world but still holds on to traditional Christian values. Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.

Our revenge will be the laughter of our children.
(Ari Gold, 2 December 2011 16:26)

Poor kids, only to be taught to live and die in hatred. Another generation wasted before final extinction...

@ metrod
could you please get your facts straight about your tens of thousands of people slaughtered by Serbian forces?
Even those who are the most favorable to your cause are talking about aprox. 13 000 people of all ethnics who died during this conflict.
Most during NATO bombing and several due to natural causes.
We're far from the massacre or "genocide" you're depicting !

bla bla bla al blaaak bla bla..... Parrots made blank in the head.

"Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?"
(???, 2 December 2011 17:13)
Strange people, not to admit that they came from Sicily in 11 century
per Greak books.
(Bugar Skoplje, 2 December 2011 19:41)
Bulgar we can benefit from Leonidas a Greek that we have in this forum. Let ask him what tell this Greek books:)

Is the church going to step in and give the government the billion of dollars that they get from the EU development funds? How about road building and infrastructure development? How about restructuring the economy? The church has not development strategy for the country their advice seems to revolve around wanting people to live off 13th century fantasies and religious myths. I'm afraid that most Serbian people will not like that as an alternative to hands-on reforms and development.
(Frank, 2 December 2011 17:16)

The point of the church is that KSerbs shouldn't be betrayed in the sake of virtual EU money.

Church and other religious institutions should stay out of politics, if they claim to work for unity and all other bs. By being involved, they show to take sides, which in return alienates the other side. No wonder, orthodox churches got burned and what not. I didn't see any catholic church being vandalized. You cannot have the cake and eat it too. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

Very nicely balanced and one that reflects reality. It will come as a moral boost to those protecting their homes and land.

"For a responsible political authority and political elite of Serbia, Serbia and the Serb people as a whole have no alternative. Everything else, including the idealized and mythologized European Union, does."

B92

It's refreshing to see the Church taking a leading role on Serbia's potential EU membership by pointing out the interests of the Serbian nation and people are above anything else including the EU.Well done Church.

Stick that that and to your "religion"! You will win like you won Yugoslavia/Velika Srbija
(EA, 2 December 2011 17:43)

We didn't lose any war. We won against Bosnians, Croats and Bosniaks. We only lost wars against the strongest military alliance in the world and a 30,000 feet bombardment is not a war.

We beat all of you separately and even if it was Serbs vs. everyone else in ex-YU we would still come out on top and will in the future. Thanks.

As i wrote many times one of the reasons why Serbia can't be part of Eu is the Church aka Holy Sinod...every one was aware of this in Brussels but hope for some changes... but after 10 years the clergy is the same it was in the Milosevic era..never and i repeat never in a country approching Eu the church had been negative in the European Integration ...Serbia is different but we all know this don't we ?

Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way church members do.
(Phill, 2 December 2011 16:46)

That statement can easily be re-written:

"Let's all dress funny, wear funny hats, live in caves, make grandiose pointless statements every day, and survive off of donations and state funds the way Kosovo Albanians do."

Priceless!

"Hypocrisy in its lowest level. I wonder where was the Serbian Orthodox Church (SPC) when tens of thousands of Arbanasi were slaughtered by Serbian forces in the 1990's. The role of religion should be to bring people together so they can live in peace next to each other. I'm not sure that's been the case with the SPC as far as Kosovo is concerned.
(Eugene"

- This is a different type of church.

That's what I call a slap in Tadic's face :)

A wise man speaking for a worthy creed. Their vital spiritual independence is what makes Serbs the target of prejudice and discrimination. This kind of leadership is an example to us all. Why do we not even expect such voices out of Pristina?

Joachim,
I think you confused my post with someone else's. But, 13,000 qualifies as 'tens of thousands' doesn't it?
Since we're on the topic, claiming that most of the '13,0000' died due to NATO airstrikes is like saying the Serb patriarch is a holy man. No one with an ounce of common sense and objectivity will believe it.

Look, I'm Christian. And, I look at what the SPC is doing and it is similar to some radical Muslim clerics preach...

"Lol at albanians contradicting themselves. So being called arbanasi is bad but you keep calling yourselves dardinians and illyrians is good?"
(???, 2 December 2011 17:13)
Strange people, not to admit that they came from Sicily in 11 century
per Greak books.

When will thiey stop cowardly hiding behind the veneer of religion when they are obviously nothing more than a political organization.

@Frank
EU won't hand out billions of dollars for free, specially not at the moment.
The actual government already indebted Serbia more than enough.
That's not the right way to go forward !
Remember that our children will have to pay off the debt your contracting today!
Remember that Yugoslav war started when US voted a law which closed the credit tap !
Don't put yourself the handcuffs on!
Stay away from IMF and WB or any EU credit promises, since they're NEVER without counterparts which you wouldn't like to endorse!
Serbia has resources, value them, spare them where's no need to spend.
During Kostunica government I saw nice Ladas outside the assembly hall.
Today, only Audis, BMWs etc.
Throwing money out of the window is not the solution !
EU won't plant no money trees in Serbia since they just don't exist !!!
Get real people, defend what you have instead of dreaming of a better future with your neighbors resources !!!

Maby you need to spill some holy water over your head to cool down friend.

Yes i know those Fresco's and churches, and i study the architexture and i can tell you they are beautifull.I have never been there no,i dont claim to be morally upright now do i?And when i refer to them i mean the leadership,ie the partriarch,but i think that those baricades wont be able to sustain his throne.

Seriously what is wrong with you?are these people not to be touched or something?Whats wrong with secularism,it works.I say this because i believe that the citizen state is better becasue it does not centralise on a specific group and it is free and open,not filled with any doctrines or dogma's.I think that constantly looking to god for help is self destructive.I believe it would be better to think "Hey i can do something productive and i dont have to bound by strict rules for thinking outside the box".

Yes the church does partly have such a mindset in helping the community and all that.But when you look through history from the inquisition to any perseqution ,high tendencies towards religion can stifle development.One might say ohh but what about what happend in the French revolution with the terror?.Yes but isnt the worship of a god not the same with the worship of another deity (Stalin,Robespierre etc)?

As for the monks or most of them, in Kosovo sure i have respect for them (at least the ones who dont get into fights or are involved in scandals),I dont believe in god but i admire the basic ideals they have,but as for those untouchables id sooner say something good about Tadic than them.I think they hold far too much power.Many if not most of them want things like religion to be part the official school programe.Religion has absolutly no place in this sphere what so ever.It is a private matter which people share out socailly,keep it away from the state.Writing it on paper is not good enough,it has to like this in practice.So Sorry to actually confront your rant with a credible argument but i suppose that gives you all the more reason to hate.

You seem to like lecturing people on "ignorance',exept that of your own,maby you should be a patriarch

"but after 10 years the clergy is the same it was in the Milosevic era.."
(Luigi, 2 December 2011 17:47)

That is to be expected, I think. They were 85 years old back then, now they are 95 years old. Not much change can be expected by people that age. You must also consider that, in general, churches and religious institutions are among the most conservative institutions in every country. So, you have Serb Orthodox Church speaking like this, Catholic Church saying it is a sin to use contraceptives, Muslim clerics against women rights in many countries, etc etc. Change is not good for these self-appointed men of God because they say they hold the keys to the truth. They are stuck with that, cannot say "we changed our mind".

Well said! This is a huge rebuke to Tadic and the sellout regime, as well as to the the German temporary occupiers of Serbian land. It is also a huge boost to the Serbs at the barricades. The church has called out the traitors.
(Dragan, 2 December 2011 15:47)

Yeah, but the problem is that the Church is legitimized by God not by the people :)

@ Lazar (or whatever)
..." why dont they go to kosovo..."
Probably you've never been to Kosovo and Metohija
Have a look at those beautiful churches and monasteries which are there for 100ds of years already. Have a look at those wonderful frescos and talk to the monks or even the simple people of this province.
No doubt, the church is there, has been there and will be there in despite of your ignorant comments !
Cheers

Great words from the Church, showing it cares about its people and wont bow down to traitors and those who want to destroy Serbia.

Regarding comments about the SPC being political - Most of these comments are coming from islamic albos, are you all honestly telling me that islam isn't political? and all the things is has to say about political issues? I don't care to hear from a religion that openly preaches the killing of all those who insult islam. I have an awful lot of bad things to say about islam, I dare anyone to try and kill me for it.

Regarding general condemnation of this statement - There is nothing bad about this statement, it is nothing more than telling these brave Serbs to stay defiant, there is no preaching of violence here. The statement proves also that government and politics does not control the Church, which is undoubtbly a good thing. I mean for crying out loud I would love to see islam's reaction if Mecca for example and the land surrounding it was conquered by Christians, there would most likely be calls by imams and muftis to slaughter these Christians. Considering the suffering and the terrorism that the Serbian Orthodox Church and its believers have gone through in Kosovo has been met with very moderate reaction, considering what has been done to them. While I fully respect the Church's statement, for what the albanians have done they deserve nothing better than equal pain and suffering for what they have done.

I'm glad that the Orthodox church is being real with this. The EU is leading Europe towards a brick wall. Over the past few weeks many thousands of people have been protesting the Austerity measures put forth by the governments in EU countries. Portugal, Greece, U.K., Bulgaria, Spain, Belgium have all seen massive strikes and protests. Then someone like Herman Van Rompoy has the nerve to say the Eu has brought prosperity and stability.

"Yeah, but the problem is that the Church is legitimized by God not by the people :)
(icj1, 3 December 2011 16:26)"

I have always thought that on this globe of ours, things are legitimized by PEOPLE egs. human beings running governments and/or judges presciding over issues such as some province's UDI or legitimizing gay marriages in some countries where it was previously illegal, etc, rather than by some supernatural being that nobody seemed to have had legal encounters with before (except perhaps you?)

Please show us your source(s) for the relevant legal documentation containing a judgement or decision from this God to legitimize a church. Thanks in advance.

""The government should not be making decisions or changing its political tactics 'on the fly' without taking into account the vital needs and the positionheld by the Serbs in northern Kosovo, for whom this issue is not one of partisan and political calculations, but literally, an issue of 'to be or not to be'," the Holy Synod of the SPC said in its statement."


Well, as the Holy Synod is aware the Govermnment in Serbia is elected to take into account the interest and position of the majority of the 7M+ Serbs. If the position of the northern Kosovo Serbs matches with that, than it's good, otherwise they are out of luck :). Unfortunately the Sun does not revolve around the 0.07M+ Serbs in northern Kosovo.

Church must shut the ...up. Stay out of politics and stop inciting hatred and violence. Advising people to abandon EU integration for a lost myth (Kosovo, cradle of Serbs blablabla...) is sick and insane. The call to KFOR to get shot in a status neutral manner is ridiculous.
(Hruz, 3 December 2011 10:01)

In the whole universe there is only one more slave minded creture than the original so called geci magyar namely the magyarized slovak or totek.
Your comment just reflect this attitude.You hungarians have a long tradition of being extremly short-sighted and having a good time on the sinking ship.Not an accident the you wer Hitler's last bootéickers.Could you explain me what adventages did EU accesion bring to your county ?Among 27 member states you are by far the biggest losers.I meet many hungarians who seem to be very dissatisfied with what happened in your country in the last 7 years.Meaning that quite a lot anyway shortshited huns are oppening their eyes.Seems you are the blindest among blind preching to others about EU Integration.Are you some kind of overpaid bent-backed EU chinovnik siting in Brussels that you still belive in this overdue new sovietunion. Otherwise As opposed to hungarians there are still people who have principles and spine and do not give up what is sacred for them.They insist on their traditions and therefor as opposed to rootless hungarians do not have to steal other peoples' culture .

Wowww! What a discovery - of course the EU has many alternatives! Nothing new!! Mr Kostunica has said it many times already! However, why did the church wait so long to make such an obvious statement? Lazy episops, prists, monks or?

Such a fair and peaceful statement. I strongly support everything they said and I am certainly NOT brainwashed but rather 'rational'.

I encourage all Serbs to read this article (follow link) keeping in mind EU 'alternative' :)

I also encourage all Albanians to read it too for a reality check :)

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/west-looks-east-for-a-lifeline-20111202-1obc3.html

Radek. I am surprised your hate speech came through, shame on B92 moderators first of all. It can be the weather or global waming, you just spew hatred on Hungarians. The topic was the church and making political comments. I have no idea how "scumbag Hungarians" and "Hitler's boot lickers" are concerened here, but it shows well your level of intelligence, If you have nothing to say, lets attack Hungarians. I don't know which sewer you crawled out from but it does not matter, whatever is your nationality, you are a disgrace of your people.