Croatian PM’s statement scandalous, SNS official says

“We are glad Croatia is approaching the EU but we have to remind it that three percent of Serb villages that remained after their ‘magnificent’ operations have neither electricity nor water and it would be good to provide that before they lecture Serbia on European values,” he explained.

Vučić said that the fact that the Serbian authorities did not react to Kosor’s latest statement was scandalous and added that the SNS hoped that Serbia would respond to Croatia.'

Tadic and the yellows did not react because he's a little quisling who takes his orders from Washington and Brussels, and needs approval from them before he makes any public statements. They probably even write his speeches for him. His days are numbered.

Croatia definitely has 'German values', in the way they treat the Serbs is the same. I guess this is why they are deemd 'ready' for the EU. Another reason to stay out of that immoral, bankrupt, wanker club.

I'm usualy not a big fan of Aleksandar Vučić but on this issue he is absolutely right. Serbs are treated as second class citizens by their dear neighbours. At the same time minorities in Serbia enjoy red carpet treatment. Look at Serbs in Croatia. Those that are not expelled live in constant fear. They are refused employement and, like in the case Vučić mentioned, some don't even have electricity. The same goes for Albanians in Presevo and Serbs in Kosovo. Do we hear about Albanians being robbed, beaten, threatened and harrassed in Presevo?
Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region and still we get all the crap.

Can somebody explain to me ,did 400,000 Croats wanted to create any "Croatska Republickaja" in Serbian territory?!
Because I know that Srps wanted to create only ONE "Republic"in Croatian territory.

Thanks!

Appears that Kosor and Tudjman did not have that little chit chat before the press statement. Or does Kosor plead ignorance to history in the Balkans namely Kraina.

delon:

As a foreigner, it's hard for me to see why it is "right" for the Albanians to be allowed to carve out their own chunk of Serbia as an independent nation but "wrong" for the Serbians to be allowed to do the same in Croatia or Bosnia.

The Serbians may be socially inept jerks, but it certainly does appear that they have reasonable grounds to feel that they are unfairly persecuted.

Mark

You are looking at a particular event in the balkan war and making a judgement based on only that. You should look at the current, as well as the pre war situation. Ask yourself why there are no, or very few, minorities in Croatia and the croat/muslim federation in Bosnia. Why do minorities in Kosovo need protection 12 years after the war ended? The Serbian minority in Albania were not allowed to be Serb but had to convert to "Albanianism". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kz8uHGN6nUE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rmMyHgkfnU.
Minorities in Serbia include muslims, albanians, hungarians, croats, roma etc. Muslims are returning to Reupblika Srpska even. More so then there are Serbs returning to the federation, Croatia or Kosovo. You are nothing but a hypocrite. Perhaps Serbs should treat Presevo Albanians the same way Serbs are treated in Kosovo. Serbs have always been the most tollerant people in the balkans. Croats and Albanians are the fascists of the Balkans. Joining Hitler is proof of that.

Well if you sit down and think a little with it is the Serbian regime that deported those poor Srbs from Croatia .You all know Croatias borders but you thoght everything was yours.

"Vučić said that the fact that the Serbian authorities did not react to Kosor’s latest statement was scandalous and added that the SNS hoped that Serbia would respond to Croatia."

-- Serbs have a tendency of ignoring statements coming from Croatian officials because unless it's an outright glorification of war criminals, they are either unimportant or emotionally hyperbolic. This usually seems to stupify Croats because they can't imagine anyone - Serbs most of all - thinking Croats and Croatia aren't important. Croats on the other hand seem to be always more interested in what's happening in Serbia than Croatia. Kosor's need to interject - yet again - this highly sanitized narrative of Storm on her trip to Pristina is par for the course, knowing the friendly company she's in will receive her statements with a smile. It's like a paranoid child always trying to find something wrong with a perceived rival. Sure it's a cheap shot, but Kosor's not the most innovative official and I suspect she needed the sound byte for home consumption since she's still smarting from Gotovina's conviction and needs to convince herself otherwise.

@Delon And Blero

So it is the Croatian border and that cannot be changed??

Tito and his buddies have drawn the Croatian Border in 1945/1946 as well for the other Ex YU republics.
So before that, Istra, was Italian, and dalmatie was it's own province.
and they gave these parts to Croatia.Why?
Croatia in Austor-Hungary was named "kingdom of Croatia-Slavonia"
and before that Croatia and Slavonia where split (and at the 1910 census croats and serbs where about 50/50 in Slavonia(but in the Croatian number where also Serbs of catholic faith).
So why do the Croats deserve their present day borders , the borders where changed many times in the past why can't it be changed in the future?

Let me remind you according to the 1910 census, in Croatia, without dalmatia and Istra lived 650000 Serbs and 1.6 mil Croats, (in the Croatian number are also Serbs of Catholic faith.

At least do the people in Croatia who still identify themselves as Serbs have the right to split from that country?
I say yes if Kosovo Albanians can.

Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region and still we get all the crap.
(MikeC, 25 August 2011 16:57)

Hahahaha.Denial to the core.

The Court concludes that the acts committed at Srebrenica falling within Article II (a) and (b) of the Convention were committed with the specific intent to destroy in part the group of the Muslims of Bosnia and Herzegovina as such; and accordingly that THESE WERE ACTS OF GENOCIDE, committed by members of the VRS in and around Srebrenica from about 13 July 1995

Foreigner,

Albanians did not carve any part of Serbia.

Let's see some facts here for you,as a "foreigner",not for Srps.

Kosovo was conquer from Srb "Empire" on 13-th century.At that time METOHIJA was DUKAGJINI,Serbs are familiar very well with this name.
You guess whom they conquered.
@ 14-th century ottomans came ....till 1912.
All these 5 centuries Kosova was ,I would say,sub-ruled from Albanians,until 1912 ,when Albania become independent state including Kosova.1912 was the year that Serbia ,with the help of Big Powers of that time,esp.Russia invaded Kosova (this time was WW1).
So ,as you can see ,Albanians just liberated Kosova and did not carved someones land.
One thing ,Foreigner, I don't understand.

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!
(delon, 25 August 2011 23:12)

Unfortunately for you there is not a single building left even in ruins, not a single document supporting Albanian existence in Kosovo before 16th century. And not a single document proving Albanian existence in the larger area before 13th century, the churches built by Muzaka family in Kastoria (Greece) area are among the first signs of Albanian existence as organized people with rulers wealthy and enlighted enough to build something substantial.

Before that the only reference is indirect. Greeks/Macedonians, Romans, Byzantines had to keeo a larger military detachment in the area to keep the unruly mountaineers ( = probably the ancestors of Albanians) at bay and prevent the plunder of the valleys.

What about Vukovar you mean when the croats started to murder and expel the serbian civilan population is that what you mean or the fact that serbian soldiers in response to that defended rersulting in croatian soldiers dying in combat against serb forces that is called casualities of war

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!
(delon, 25 August 2011 23:12)

Simple. Go there and start looking around and if you can find anything historical that's not Serbian or Turkish prior to the 19th century, you let me know :) If fact, everyone seems to know this except Albanians because Hoxha did such a great job rewriting history for a people without history. And when you teach stuff like he invented to people in a vacuum without any exposure to the outside world, it's amazing how long they'll stick to the story even when presented with factual information :)

"Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region"

Yes, they have shown that by committing war crimes and crimes against humanity against the Croatians; war crimes, crimes against humanity, and genocide against the Bosnians; and war crimes and crimes against humanity against the Albanians. They have also managed start wars with most of their neighbors, to have dissatisfied minorities, and to fight and lose a war with NATO - all in the name of tolerance and peace one presumes.

Wow Mick, you seriously need to go back to school.

Istria and Dalmatia have been croatian for over a thousand years...Period

If Tito didnt draw the borders properly it would have been war outright, a very bloody war.

Only reason that many serbs live in the so called krajina, is due to the serbian retreat from the ottomans 200 years ago when serbs and croats were allies, yes people we were major allies once a upon a time.

Bosnia up untill the Ottoman war was heavily croatian.

Montenegro was heavily croatian (ie the croatian chruches still there to this day) Also montenegrin sounds a hell of a lot like croatian.

There is a reason why serbs and croats are the most dominate people of former YU. We were hear first, before the bosniaks(turks 19thcentury), and before the slovenians(11th-14th century ). Id like to say the albanians too but we kicked them out 1400 years ago(7th century Illyrian retreat to present day albania)

The ottoman war has reshaped the balkans big time. But at least islam never won. West Bosnia is serbian and the East is croatian or at least it should be.

Finally I believe kosovo should be partitioned, fairly(impossible) between the serbs and albanians.

What about Vukovar.....? did you forget it ?

Vučić added that the SNS would not allow Croatia or any other country to “humiliate Serbia”.

No need for other countrires to humiliate Serbia and Serbs "You are doing a great job yourself!!!"

OK Marko,
Istria was first part of Illiria, and the Histri tribe lived there a Vento-illirian tribe (germans call slavs wends/vends/veneto)
Also I assume you are croatian,And Croats/Serbs/Bosnjaks/Montenegrins we all to gether descned from Illirians,(look op the dinaric race).

Then the Romans Controlled Istria, At the fall of the West Roman empire The Goths/Byzantines/avars/lobards and the Frankish Kingdom have controlled the region for some time. Then Istra was controlled by German dukes and in 1267 Istra became part of Republic of Venice, then the austrian empire (1797-1805), Napoleon (1806-1813) then Austrian empire again (1814-1918) Then Italy (1919-1947) and from 1947 in Yugoslavia and from 1991 Croatian. Here a quote from wikipedia: "After 1954, the border between the Slovenia and Croatia ran along the river Mirna. According to the Croatian historiographer Stjepan Srkulj,[11] this is the first time in Croatian history that Istria has been fully under Croatian jurisdiction"

Now lets go on with Dalmatia:
Also inhabited with Illirians (dinaric Race) and conquerd by the Romans.
At the fall of the West Roman empire the Goths controlled Dalmatia from (480 to 535 AD). Then Justianian 1 Retored it for the Byzantines.
Then The Middle Ages in Dalmatia were a period of intense rivalry between the involved factions: Byzantine empire/Croatian Kingdom/Union with Hungary/The Bosnian kingdom(which was A Serbian kingdom) and The Venetian Republic. in (1102) Croatia was absorbed by the Hungarian Empire, in 1241 The Hungarians lost controlled of Dalmatia when the Mongols invaded Hungary. The kingdom of Napels Conquered Dalamtia from The hungarian empire(Hungary and Croatia had a internal struggle). Ladislaus of Naples Sold Dalmatia by the year 1420 To the Venetian Republic and so it remaind for 377 Years.
Then you had napoleon from (1797-1814) then Illrian Kingdom controlled by the Habsburgs (1814-1822) then part of the austrian empire and was known as the Kingdom of Dalmatia.

In 1848 a quote from Greater Croatian nationalists: "In 1848, the Croatian Assembly (Sabor) published the People's Requests, in which they requested among other things the abolition of serfdom and the unification of Dalmatia and Croatia"
The Austrian emperor Franz Joseph Didn't agree!
But dalmatia remaind it's own Kingdom inside the Austrian empire until 1918 when it was Divided between The kingdom of Italy and Kingdom of Serbs/Croats and Slovens (Yugoslavia).
and since 1945 part of Croatian Republic in Yugoslavia)
But according to the 1857 Austrian Census dalmatia had 88.51 % Serbs and 10.97% Italians Living in the Kingdom of Dalmatia!!!

AS you can see Istra and Dalmatia where NOT croatian for over 1000 years!!

Ok we move on,
"Only reason that many serbs live in the so called krajina, is due to the serbian retreat from the ottomans 200 years ago when serbs and croats were allies, yes people we were major allies once a upon a time."
Listen:
1. Serbs lived far more longer on these terretories, beside Croats including in present day Hungary and Austria!
2. Serbs where leaving the ottoman empire since the 14th Century so 600 years ago
3.
Serbs ARE NOT Enemies of Croats, even to this day, BUT indoctrinated Serbs Catholics and Others who became Croats in the middle and end of the 19th C. and Beginning of 20th C. are the ones who hate! there Orthodox Brothers.
Croatian Writer "IVANA BRLIĆ MAŽURANIĆ" was wittnesing that hate, and she couldn't understand why!!
There where anti Serbian protests on 1,2 and 3 September 1902 in Zagreb and other cities.
Here a quote in Croatian from Ivana Brlic of the protests in Slavonski Brod:
"I u Brodu je bilo lupanja prozora, špricanja na table i kuće itd., a noćas su se Stefanović, Popović etc.osigurali policijom i avizirali vojničtvo po magistratu da se sprema veća pobuna. Nu valjda nije ništa bilo pošto sada (11sati) još ništa čuli nismo. Ti znas kako ja inače u 'gungulah' uživam nu mene je jako stid što se kod nas ovako velike stvari događaju proti našoj, ma i vrlo nepravičnoj braći, A NA TOLIKE UPRAVO BEZOBRAZNE UVREDE I POVREDE SA STRANE MAĐARA NITKO SE NE MIČE. Ovdje doduše nitko nedieli moje mnienje, ponajpače stara Tomićka ne, koja je biesna na Srbe ne znam zašto." (Arhiv porodice Brlić u Sl.Brodu)"

(sorry I am not good to translate it sorry for that but the big picture is:
That Croatian nationalists (or Serbs Catholics) where protesting and where vandalizing cities like now was Happening in London and where insulting non Croats!)

That was that now just a little more:
"Bosnia up untill the Ottoman war was heavily croatian"

Ok Petar Kreshmir controlled Bosnia from (1018-1074) afther that Hungarians then they lost it to the Byzantine empire and they send a Vasal Ban kulin, but north east Bosnia was controlled by croatia while west bsonia was part of Kingdom of Rashka.

And before the 10th C little is know about Bosnia and who controlled it, it is assumed that local (slav) (croat/serb)leaders controlled the territory.

My friend this is BS:
"Montenegro was heavily croatian (ie the croatian chruches still there to this day) Also montenegrin sounds a hell of a lot like croatian."

Here 2 quotes from wikipedia on Njegos:
"Follow me Montenegrins - on to Bar, on to our Serb Bar, on to Serb sea!."

"Under Murad I the Serbian Tsardom was destroyed, under Murad V it has to rise again. This is my wish and wish of all of us as well as the wish of almighty God."

and the Croatian churches (IN podgorica albanian Catholics live there)
and in Kotor Serbs of Catholic faith lived there who became Croatian because they are Catholic).
(BTW Petrovic-Njegos family orginate From Zenica Bosnia, Zenica is now a Bosnjak-croat Town).

Ok it is maybe not what you want to hear but, The forefathers of the Bonsjak people where Serbs orthodox who adopted Islam and kept their language, (they did not became turks) the people who moved to Anatolia became Turks, For the Ottomans was if you are Muslim you are a Turk, your mother language didnt matter.
Then Serbs are orthodox so the poeple in these region where serb, then they became under austrian and Vatikan influence Catholic and these catholics became Croats(in bosnia/Slavonia/dalmatia).
THat are all facst Real croats lived around Zagreb and in some parts of present day hungary and Slavonia.
You can see it in the kajkavski Dialect which was NEVER regarded Serbian By Vuk Karadzic!

Slovens means Slavs From Venice
Some of them became German others Italian and some kept their language and they always lived there!! even before the 11th Century...

And about albanians,
They settled first in present day albania, in the 13th Century from Sicily by the byzantines then more came with the Turks, albanians are mixed not all of them are of Dinaric race (ILIRIAN)
I saw a vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9xbKmXAJaE&feature=channel_video_title

And there I saw the writting of Illirians the alphabet they where using:
If you are not BLIND you can see That the ILlirian writing was IDENTICAL TO THE Glagolitic alphabet SCRIPT!!!!

It became long text It took me an hour to write and read :) but I hope I have explained your comment well.
I got my information mostly from wikipedia so you can look up the facts.
The Truth is not always what you want!
Cheers!!!

Foreigner,

Albanians did not carve any part of Serbia.

Let's see some facts here for you,as a "foreigner",not for Srps.

Kosovo was conquer from Srb "Empire" on 13-th century.At that time METOHIJA was DUKAGJINI,Serbs are familiar very well with this name.
You guess whom they conquered.
@ 14-th century ottomans came ....till 1912.
All these 5 centuries Kosova was ,I would say,sub-ruled from Albanians,until 1912 ,when Albania become independent state including Kosova.1912 was the year that Serbia ,with the help of Big Powers of that time,esp.Russia invaded Kosova (this time was WW1).
So ,as you can see ,Albanians just liberated Kosova and did not carved someones land.
One thing ,Foreigner, I don't understand.

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!

it seems that serbs need reminding for the millionth time.

Serbia and its "misunderstood" citizens sat in safety as it gleefully exported and supported violence against its neighbors using serbs outside of serbia as fodder. for decades.

yes, throughout the decades of violence, where the only common denominator in all of the violence across ALL ethnic, religious and political lines were serbs...

serbia proper remained UNTOUCHED throughout it all until nato bombings where they tasted a tiny shred of what they inflicted and they promptly "discovered" that maybe all this wasnt a good idea after all.

@mikec
the serb idea of "tolerance" is that co-existence is unacceptable unless they are treated special, with undo and disproportionate power.

no mikeC, im afraid serbs are the last to spittle out the word tolerance, please dont embarrass yourself by using the word hypocrite..

Everywhere serbs are a majority they give nothing near to its minorities that they Demand... under the threat of violence and barbarity... for serb minorities elsewhere.

the churches build by Muzaka family in Kastoria (Greece) area ,

Ataman,26 August 2011,

So ,Ataman if we follow the Serbian pattern,"where are Serbian churches is Serbia" then we should claim Kastoria Albanian , right?!

Istria and Dalmatia were in ancient times countries in which language is spoken Illyrian-old descendant of Illyrian language is today Albanian. Croatian people is Illyrian tribe which is assimilated in Slavic...Montenegrins are the people of Illyrian origin but have been assimilated in Slavic and are returned Ortodox. Bosnians are Serbs assimilated in the Islamic religion, both peoples Serbs and Bosnians are of one blood. (Dardanian - Kosovars today are Illyrian tribe). Albania consist also of the Illyrian tribes. These are provided by Albanolog from aroud the world.....see Illyrians, Dardans and their tribes......but do not forget all these peoples can live in peace together in one EU and have respectfully of each culture.

See I think this is a big problem for the region, people like to make up their own history. Marko is right. It is true the Illyrians controlled most of the territory of former yugoslavia before the romans, but the Romans suffered big loses from different northern tribes and lost it all with the decline of the roman empire. The first slavs to settle the territory were the Croatian tribes in the 6th century who came from the area between Krakow, Poland down to Ukraine at the invitation of Byzantine Emperor Heraclius to protect the area from the different tribes like the Avars. serbs also come from same region of what is today Ukraine and settled to the east of the sava and drina rivers over the next 100-200 years so they were not that far behind. In the meantime the vatican cristianized the Croats and the byzantines did the same for the Serbs. The IIlyrians were long gone by then, but obviously most them with roots converted to croatian or Serbian depending on where they lived. In Bosnia, it was mostly Croatians who settled, but there were also Bogomils who were influenced by the Bulgarians and wanted a return to early christianity, they did not want to align with either vatican or the byzantines, and as you can imagine both wanted to convert the Bogomils for that reason. Anyway, Croatia had it's own kingdom in the 8th century which included Istria, Bosnia, Kotor, Banat. With the end of the Trpimirović dynasty with no male heirs, Croatia joined in a union with Hungary which later became Austro Hungarian empire. Over the years Croatia was invaded by venetians in Istria and Dalmatia and ottoman turks, it's Bosnian and Banat territory by serbs and ottoman turks. Croatia continued to defend itself from just about everybody since the 6th century and all it's territory was most civilized when under it's own rule because no one take care better care of it's own, regardless if some of their own are from Illyrian, Serbian, bogomil, roman, greek, venetian, ottoman decent. So no one else deserves it more and is better able to take care of all it's historic territory Banat in today's vojvodina , Bosnia, Kotor in today's montenegro. Istria isn't even arguable. I am not forgetting Trieste also which was given to Croatia by the Austrians for pushing back the ottomans at Vienna, southern Austria, Croatia, and Bosnia. That is why tito took it back after WW2, it was not to invade it but to keep what is ours. These are the borders I recognize. Any Croatian who is happy with it's current borders is happy being a victim. For the Serbs, don't forget it was the Croatians who came to help defeat the Bulgarians and the ottomans. There would be no Serbia today without Croatia. Now I ask you, when did Serbia ever come to Croatia's aid? Answer is never, you just took and stole from a friend and never gave back. You do not deserve the territories you have stolen from Croatia and Bosnia, and you don't deserve Kosovo. Maybe if you fix your own house first and you build the greatest economy and society in the area, everyone would want to join you, but I don't see that happening when you continue to lie about your history.

it seems that serbs need reminding for the millionth time.

Serbia and its "misunderstood" citizens sat in safety as it gleefully exported and supported violence against its neighbors using serbs outside of serbia as fodder. for decades.

yes, throughout the decades of violence, where the only common denominator in all of the violence across ALL ethnic, religious and political lines were serbs...

serbia proper remained UNTOUCHED throughout it all until nato bombings where they tasted a tiny shred of what they inflicted and they promptly "discovered" that maybe all this wasnt a good idea after all.

@mikec
the serb idea of "tolerance" is that co-existence is unacceptable unless they are treated special, with undo and disproportionate power.

no mikeC, im afraid serbs are the last to spittle out the word tolerance, please dont embarrass yourself by using the word hypocrite..

Everywhere serbs are a majority they give nothing near to its minorities that they Demand... under the threat of violence and barbarity... for serb minorities elsewhere.

Can somebody explain to me ,did 400,000 Croats wanted to create any "Croatska Republickaja" in Serbian territory?!
Because I know that Srps wanted to create only ONE "Republic"in Croatian territory.

Thanks!

Well if you sit down and think a little with it is the Serbian regime that deported those poor Srbs from Croatia .You all know Croatias borders but you thoght everything was yours.

“We are glad Croatia is approaching the EU but we have to remind it that three percent of Serb villages that remained after their ‘magnificent’ operations have neither electricity nor water and it would be good to provide that before they lecture Serbia on European values,” he explained.

Vučić said that the fact that the Serbian authorities did not react to Kosor’s latest statement was scandalous and added that the SNS hoped that Serbia would respond to Croatia.'

Tadic and the yellows did not react because he's a little quisling who takes his orders from Washington and Brussels, and needs approval from them before he makes any public statements. They probably even write his speeches for him. His days are numbered.

Croatia definitely has 'German values', in the way they treat the Serbs is the same. I guess this is why they are deemd 'ready' for the EU. Another reason to stay out of that immoral, bankrupt, wanker club.

Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region and still we get all the crap.
(MikeC, 25 August 2011 16:57)

Hahahaha.Denial to the core.

The Court concludes that the acts committed at Srebrenica falling within Article II (a) and (b) of the Convention were committed with the specific intent to destroy in part the group of the Muslims of Bosnia and Herzegovina as such; and accordingly that THESE WERE ACTS OF GENOCIDE, committed by members of the VRS in and around Srebrenica from about 13 July 1995

"Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region"

Yes, they have shown that by committing war crimes and crimes against humanity against the Croatians; war crimes, crimes against humanity, and genocide against the Bosnians; and war crimes and crimes against humanity against the Albanians. They have also managed start wars with most of their neighbors, to have dissatisfied minorities, and to fight and lose a war with NATO - all in the name of tolerance and peace one presumes.

What about Vukovar.....? did you forget it ?

I'm usualy not a big fan of Aleksandar Vučić but on this issue he is absolutely right. Serbs are treated as second class citizens by their dear neighbours. At the same time minorities in Serbia enjoy red carpet treatment. Look at Serbs in Croatia. Those that are not expelled live in constant fear. They are refused employement and, like in the case Vučić mentioned, some don't even have electricity. The same goes for Albanians in Presevo and Serbs in Kosovo. Do we hear about Albanians being robbed, beaten, threatened and harrassed in Presevo?
Serbs are the most tollerant people in the region and still we get all the crap.

Appears that Kosor and Tudjman did not have that little chit chat before the press statement. Or does Kosor plead ignorance to history in the Balkans namely Kraina.

Foreigner,

Albanians did not carve any part of Serbia.

Let's see some facts here for you,as a "foreigner",not for Srps.

Kosovo was conquer from Srb "Empire" on 13-th century.At that time METOHIJA was DUKAGJINI,Serbs are familiar very well with this name.
You guess whom they conquered.
@ 14-th century ottomans came ....till 1912.
All these 5 centuries Kosova was ,I would say,sub-ruled from Albanians,until 1912 ,when Albania become independent state including Kosova.1912 was the year that Serbia ,with the help of Big Powers of that time,esp.Russia invaded Kosova (this time was WW1).
So ,as you can see ,Albanians just liberated Kosova and did not carved someones land.
One thing ,Foreigner, I don't understand.

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!

Wow Mick, you seriously need to go back to school.

Istria and Dalmatia have been croatian for over a thousand years...Period

If Tito didnt draw the borders properly it would have been war outright, a very bloody war.

Only reason that many serbs live in the so called krajina, is due to the serbian retreat from the ottomans 200 years ago when serbs and croats were allies, yes people we were major allies once a upon a time.

Bosnia up untill the Ottoman war was heavily croatian.

Montenegro was heavily croatian (ie the croatian chruches still there to this day) Also montenegrin sounds a hell of a lot like croatian.

There is a reason why serbs and croats are the most dominate people of former YU. We were hear first, before the bosniaks(turks 19thcentury), and before the slovenians(11th-14th century ). Id like to say the albanians too but we kicked them out 1400 years ago(7th century Illyrian retreat to present day albania)

The ottoman war has reshaped the balkans big time. But at least islam never won. West Bosnia is serbian and the East is croatian or at least it should be.

Finally I believe kosovo should be partitioned, fairly(impossible) between the serbs and albanians.

Vučić added that the SNS would not allow Croatia or any other country to “humiliate Serbia”.

No need for other countrires to humiliate Serbia and Serbs "You are doing a great job yourself!!!"

delon:

As a foreigner, it's hard for me to see why it is "right" for the Albanians to be allowed to carve out their own chunk of Serbia as an independent nation but "wrong" for the Serbians to be allowed to do the same in Croatia or Bosnia.

The Serbians may be socially inept jerks, but it certainly does appear that they have reasonable grounds to feel that they are unfairly persecuted.

Mark

You are looking at a particular event in the balkan war and making a judgement based on only that. You should look at the current, as well as the pre war situation. Ask yourself why there are no, or very few, minorities in Croatia and the croat/muslim federation in Bosnia. Why do minorities in Kosovo need protection 12 years after the war ended? The Serbian minority in Albania were not allowed to be Serb but had to convert to "Albanianism". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kz8uHGN6nUE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rmMyHgkfnU.
Minorities in Serbia include muslims, albanians, hungarians, croats, roma etc. Muslims are returning to Reupblika Srpska even. More so then there are Serbs returning to the federation, Croatia or Kosovo. You are nothing but a hypocrite. Perhaps Serbs should treat Presevo Albanians the same way Serbs are treated in Kosovo. Serbs have always been the most tollerant people in the balkans. Croats and Albanians are the fascists of the Balkans. Joining Hitler is proof of that.

Istria and Dalmatia were in ancient times countries in which language is spoken Illyrian-old descendant of Illyrian language is today Albanian. Croatian people is Illyrian tribe which is assimilated in Slavic...Montenegrins are the people of Illyrian origin but have been assimilated in Slavic and are returned Ortodox. Bosnians are Serbs assimilated in the Islamic religion, both peoples Serbs and Bosnians are of one blood. (Dardanian - Kosovars today are Illyrian tribe). Albania consist also of the Illyrian tribes. These are provided by Albanolog from aroud the world.....see Illyrians, Dardans and their tribes......but do not forget all these peoples can live in peace together in one EU and have respectfully of each culture.

@Delon And Blero

So it is the Croatian border and that cannot be changed??

Tito and his buddies have drawn the Croatian Border in 1945/1946 as well for the other Ex YU republics.
So before that, Istra, was Italian, and dalmatie was it's own province.
and they gave these parts to Croatia.Why?
Croatia in Austor-Hungary was named "kingdom of Croatia-Slavonia"
and before that Croatia and Slavonia where split (and at the 1910 census croats and serbs where about 50/50 in Slavonia(but in the Croatian number where also Serbs of catholic faith).
So why do the Croats deserve their present day borders , the borders where changed many times in the past why can't it be changed in the future?

Let me remind you according to the 1910 census, in Croatia, without dalmatia and Istra lived 650000 Serbs and 1.6 mil Croats, (in the Croatian number are also Serbs of Catholic faith.

At least do the people in Croatia who still identify themselves as Serbs have the right to split from that country?
I say yes if Kosovo Albanians can.

See I think this is a big problem for the region, people like to make up their own history. Marko is right. It is true the Illyrians controlled most of the territory of former yugoslavia before the romans, but the Romans suffered big loses from different northern tribes and lost it all with the decline of the roman empire. The first slavs to settle the territory were the Croatian tribes in the 6th century who came from the area between Krakow, Poland down to Ukraine at the invitation of Byzantine Emperor Heraclius to protect the area from the different tribes like the Avars. serbs also come from same region of what is today Ukraine and settled to the east of the sava and drina rivers over the next 100-200 years so they were not that far behind. In the meantime the vatican cristianized the Croats and the byzantines did the same for the Serbs. The IIlyrians were long gone by then, but obviously most them with roots converted to croatian or Serbian depending on where they lived. In Bosnia, it was mostly Croatians who settled, but there were also Bogomils who were influenced by the Bulgarians and wanted a return to early christianity, they did not want to align with either vatican or the byzantines, and as you can imagine both wanted to convert the Bogomils for that reason. Anyway, Croatia had it's own kingdom in the 8th century which included Istria, Bosnia, Kotor, Banat. With the end of the Trpimirović dynasty with no male heirs, Croatia joined in a union with Hungary which later became Austro Hungarian empire. Over the years Croatia was invaded by venetians in Istria and Dalmatia and ottoman turks, it's Bosnian and Banat territory by serbs and ottoman turks. Croatia continued to defend itself from just about everybody since the 6th century and all it's territory was most civilized when under it's own rule because no one take care better care of it's own, regardless if some of their own are from Illyrian, Serbian, bogomil, roman, greek, venetian, ottoman decent. So no one else deserves it more and is better able to take care of all it's historic territory Banat in today's vojvodina , Bosnia, Kotor in today's montenegro. Istria isn't even arguable. I am not forgetting Trieste also which was given to Croatia by the Austrians for pushing back the ottomans at Vienna, southern Austria, Croatia, and Bosnia. That is why tito took it back after WW2, it was not to invade it but to keep what is ours. These are the borders I recognize. Any Croatian who is happy with it's current borders is happy being a victim. For the Serbs, don't forget it was the Croatians who came to help defeat the Bulgarians and the ottomans. There would be no Serbia today without Croatia. Now I ask you, when did Serbia ever come to Croatia's aid? Answer is never, you just took and stole from a friend and never gave back. You do not deserve the territories you have stolen from Croatia and Bosnia, and you don't deserve Kosovo. Maybe if you fix your own house first and you build the greatest economy and society in the area, everyone would want to join you, but I don't see that happening when you continue to lie about your history.

"Vučić said that the fact that the Serbian authorities did not react to Kosor’s latest statement was scandalous and added that the SNS hoped that Serbia would respond to Croatia."

-- Serbs have a tendency of ignoring statements coming from Croatian officials because unless it's an outright glorification of war criminals, they are either unimportant or emotionally hyperbolic. This usually seems to stupify Croats because they can't imagine anyone - Serbs most of all - thinking Croats and Croatia aren't important. Croats on the other hand seem to be always more interested in what's happening in Serbia than Croatia. Kosor's need to interject - yet again - this highly sanitized narrative of Storm on her trip to Pristina is par for the course, knowing the friendly company she's in will receive her statements with a smile. It's like a paranoid child always trying to find something wrong with a perceived rival. Sure it's a cheap shot, but Kosor's not the most innovative official and I suspect she needed the sound byte for home consumption since she's still smarting from Gotovina's conviction and needs to convince herself otherwise.

the churches build by Muzaka family in Kastoria (Greece) area ,

Ataman,26 August 2011,

So ,Ataman if we follow the Serbian pattern,"where are Serbian churches is Serbia" then we should claim Kastoria Albanian , right?!

What about Vukovar you mean when the croats started to murder and expel the serbian civilan population is that what you mean or the fact that serbian soldiers in response to that defended rersulting in croatian soldiers dying in combat against serb forces that is called casualities of war

Foreigner,

Albanians did not carve any part of Serbia.

Let's see some facts here for you,as a "foreigner",not for Srps.

Kosovo was conquer from Srb "Empire" on 13-th century.At that time METOHIJA was DUKAGJINI,Serbs are familiar very well with this name.
You guess whom they conquered.
@ 14-th century ottomans came ....till 1912.
All these 5 centuries Kosova was ,I would say,sub-ruled from Albanians,until 1912 ,when Albania become independent state including Kosova.1912 was the year that Serbia ,with the help of Big Powers of that time,esp.Russia invaded Kosova (this time was WW1).
So ,as you can see ,Albanians just liberated Kosova and did not carved someones land.
One thing ,Foreigner, I don't understand.

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!
(delon, 25 August 2011 23:12)

Unfortunately for you there is not a single building left even in ruins, not a single document supporting Albanian existence in Kosovo before 16th century. And not a single document proving Albanian existence in the larger area before 13th century, the churches built by Muzaka family in Kastoria (Greece) area are among the first signs of Albanian existence as organized people with rulers wealthy and enlighted enough to build something substantial.

Before that the only reference is indirect. Greeks/Macedonians, Romans, Byzantines had to keeo a larger military detachment in the area to keep the unruly mountaineers ( = probably the ancestors of Albanians) at bay and prevent the plunder of the valleys.

OK Marko,
Istria was first part of Illiria, and the Histri tribe lived there a Vento-illirian tribe (germans call slavs wends/vends/veneto)
Also I assume you are croatian,And Croats/Serbs/Bosnjaks/Montenegrins we all to gether descned from Illirians,(look op the dinaric race).

Then the Romans Controlled Istria, At the fall of the West Roman empire The Goths/Byzantines/avars/lobards and the Frankish Kingdom have controlled the region for some time. Then Istra was controlled by German dukes and in 1267 Istra became part of Republic of Venice, then the austrian empire (1797-1805), Napoleon (1806-1813) then Austrian empire again (1814-1918) Then Italy (1919-1947) and from 1947 in Yugoslavia and from 1991 Croatian. Here a quote from wikipedia: "After 1954, the border between the Slovenia and Croatia ran along the river Mirna. According to the Croatian historiographer Stjepan Srkulj,[11] this is the first time in Croatian history that Istria has been fully under Croatian jurisdiction"

Now lets go on with Dalmatia:
Also inhabited with Illirians (dinaric Race) and conquerd by the Romans.
At the fall of the West Roman empire the Goths controlled Dalmatia from (480 to 535 AD). Then Justianian 1 Retored it for the Byzantines.
Then The Middle Ages in Dalmatia were a period of intense rivalry between the involved factions: Byzantine empire/Croatian Kingdom/Union with Hungary/The Bosnian kingdom(which was A Serbian kingdom) and The Venetian Republic. in (1102) Croatia was absorbed by the Hungarian Empire, in 1241 The Hungarians lost controlled of Dalmatia when the Mongols invaded Hungary. The kingdom of Napels Conquered Dalamtia from The hungarian empire(Hungary and Croatia had a internal struggle). Ladislaus of Naples Sold Dalmatia by the year 1420 To the Venetian Republic and so it remaind for 377 Years.
Then you had napoleon from (1797-1814) then Illrian Kingdom controlled by the Habsburgs (1814-1822) then part of the austrian empire and was known as the Kingdom of Dalmatia.

In 1848 a quote from Greater Croatian nationalists: "In 1848, the Croatian Assembly (Sabor) published the People's Requests, in which they requested among other things the abolition of serfdom and the unification of Dalmatia and Croatia"
The Austrian emperor Franz Joseph Didn't agree!
But dalmatia remaind it's own Kingdom inside the Austrian empire until 1918 when it was Divided between The kingdom of Italy and Kingdom of Serbs/Croats and Slovens (Yugoslavia).
and since 1945 part of Croatian Republic in Yugoslavia)
But according to the 1857 Austrian Census dalmatia had 88.51 % Serbs and 10.97% Italians Living in the Kingdom of Dalmatia!!!

AS you can see Istra and Dalmatia where NOT croatian for over 1000 years!!

Ok we move on,
"Only reason that many serbs live in the so called krajina, is due to the serbian retreat from the ottomans 200 years ago when serbs and croats were allies, yes people we were major allies once a upon a time."
Listen:
1. Serbs lived far more longer on these terretories, beside Croats including in present day Hungary and Austria!
2. Serbs where leaving the ottoman empire since the 14th Century so 600 years ago
3.
Serbs ARE NOT Enemies of Croats, even to this day, BUT indoctrinated Serbs Catholics and Others who became Croats in the middle and end of the 19th C. and Beginning of 20th C. are the ones who hate! there Orthodox Brothers.
Croatian Writer "IVANA BRLIĆ MAŽURANIĆ" was wittnesing that hate, and she couldn't understand why!!
There where anti Serbian protests on 1,2 and 3 September 1902 in Zagreb and other cities.
Here a quote in Croatian from Ivana Brlic of the protests in Slavonski Brod:
"I u Brodu je bilo lupanja prozora, špricanja na table i kuće itd., a noćas su se Stefanović, Popović etc.osigurali policijom i avizirali vojničtvo po magistratu da se sprema veća pobuna. Nu valjda nije ništa bilo pošto sada (11sati) još ništa čuli nismo. Ti znas kako ja inače u 'gungulah' uživam nu mene je jako stid što se kod nas ovako velike stvari događaju proti našoj, ma i vrlo nepravičnoj braći, A NA TOLIKE UPRAVO BEZOBRAZNE UVREDE I POVREDE SA STRANE MAĐARA NITKO SE NE MIČE. Ovdje doduše nitko nedieli moje mnienje, ponajpače stara Tomićka ne, koja je biesna na Srbe ne znam zašto." (Arhiv porodice Brlić u Sl.Brodu)"

(sorry I am not good to translate it sorry for that but the big picture is:
That Croatian nationalists (or Serbs Catholics) where protesting and where vandalizing cities like now was Happening in London and where insulting non Croats!)

That was that now just a little more:
"Bosnia up untill the Ottoman war was heavily croatian"

Ok Petar Kreshmir controlled Bosnia from (1018-1074) afther that Hungarians then they lost it to the Byzantine empire and they send a Vasal Ban kulin, but north east Bosnia was controlled by croatia while west bsonia was part of Kingdom of Rashka.

And before the 10th C little is know about Bosnia and who controlled it, it is assumed that local (slav) (croat/serb)leaders controlled the territory.

My friend this is BS:
"Montenegro was heavily croatian (ie the croatian chruches still there to this day) Also montenegrin sounds a hell of a lot like croatian."

Here 2 quotes from wikipedia on Njegos:
"Follow me Montenegrins - on to Bar, on to our Serb Bar, on to Serb sea!."

"Under Murad I the Serbian Tsardom was destroyed, under Murad V it has to rise again. This is my wish and wish of all of us as well as the wish of almighty God."

and the Croatian churches (IN podgorica albanian Catholics live there)
and in Kotor Serbs of Catholic faith lived there who became Croatian because they are Catholic).
(BTW Petrovic-Njegos family orginate From Zenica Bosnia, Zenica is now a Bosnjak-croat Town).

Ok it is maybe not what you want to hear but, The forefathers of the Bonsjak people where Serbs orthodox who adopted Islam and kept their language, (they did not became turks) the people who moved to Anatolia became Turks, For the Ottomans was if you are Muslim you are a Turk, your mother language didnt matter.
Then Serbs are orthodox so the poeple in these region where serb, then they became under austrian and Vatikan influence Catholic and these catholics became Croats(in bosnia/Slavonia/dalmatia).
THat are all facst Real croats lived around Zagreb and in some parts of present day hungary and Slavonia.
You can see it in the kajkavski Dialect which was NEVER regarded Serbian By Vuk Karadzic!

Slovens means Slavs From Venice
Some of them became German others Italian and some kept their language and they always lived there!! even before the 11th Century...

And about albanians,
They settled first in present day albania, in the 13th Century from Sicily by the byzantines then more came with the Turks, albanians are mixed not all of them are of Dinaric race (ILIRIAN)
I saw a vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9xbKmXAJaE&feature=channel_video_title

And there I saw the writting of Illirians the alphabet they where using:
If you are not BLIND you can see That the ILlirian writing was IDENTICAL TO THE Glagolitic alphabet SCRIPT!!!!

It became long text It took me an hour to write and read :) but I hope I have explained your comment well.
I got my information mostly from wikipedia so you can look up the facts.
The Truth is not always what you want!
Cheers!!!

WHEN AND HOW Kosova is the CRADLE OF SERBIA OR SERBDOM or wherever they say it, and how the transition from DUKAGJINI to METOHIJA evolved,I like to hear from a Serb,so both of us can learn.

Thx!
(delon, 25 August 2011 23:12)

Simple. Go there and start looking around and if you can find anything historical that's not Serbian or Turkish prior to the 19th century, you let me know :) If fact, everyone seems to know this except Albanians because Hoxha did such a great job rewriting history for a people without history. And when you teach stuff like he invented to people in a vacuum without any exposure to the outside world, it's amazing how long they'll stick to the story even when presented with factual information :)