Party leader: Serbia denying Montenegrin identity

DjukanoviC added that Montenegro “should not be fooled with make-believe brotherly recommendations such as - fine, you are independent but give up on your national identity, culture, church and language”.

I didn't know that Montenegro has an own orthodox church and an own language that is totally different from the language formerly known as 'Serbo-Croatian' :-)

Djukanovic is nothing more then a quisling! He is a criminal and a lier!

Like Milovan Djilas, a Yugoslav Partisan leader and close associate to Tito, said: "All Montenegrins are Serbs, but not all Serbs are Montenegrins"

God Bless Serbs, Serbia and Serbdom!

Montenegrins are Serbs, period. That's a fact, no matter what revisionists and bootlickers like Milo invent. He's a traitor, a criminal, and an embarrassment, and will go down in history as such.

Đukanović added that Montenegro “should not be fooled with make-believe brotherly recommendations such as - fine, you are independent but give up on your national identity, culture, church and language”.

-- So in other words, Milo is upset not that Serbia is denying Montenegro its identity, but *his* understanding of Montenegrin identity which flies in the face of all previous Montenegrin conceptions of being a part of a larger Serbian community in language, religion, and history.

The census results must have really pissed him off.

How about if Tzar Milo instead focused on something creative and positive for the citizens of Montenegro instead of whining and complaining about Serbia?
Like bringing new investements, jobs and opportunities to the republic? Oh, I forgot the marina in Tivat, but how many jobs is that creating outside the political circle loyal to Tzar Milo?
how about once and for all solving the problem with water, pollution (and no Tzar Milo, your socalled "eco" tax on cars isn't part of the solution) and electricity? How about finally build that bridge over Verige strait instead of waiting for EU funds to do it? It would improve infrastructure a lot, but that will never happen because the criminals that are running the ferry company between Lepetane-Kamenari are friends of, guess who? Tzar Milo!!

As a matter of fact, the differences between Serbs, Croats, Bosnians, Montenegrians are minimal, mostly based on a different religious belief.

That why smart people once said about themselves 'I'm a Yugoslav' instead of saying 'I'm a Serb' or 'I'm a Croat'. A pity that Milosevic and other nationalist pulled the 'being different' card.

What kind of an Ignorant Selfdeceiver is this.

A Name of People usually points to its Ancestry.

Black Mountainers are no Ancestry.

By the Way -
are not the People in CrnaGora Serbian reffugees to some extent,
reffugees from Kosovo a long time ago ?

Arn.Sweden.

dukanovic is a total fool he keeps crying and crying he sounds albanian already with his cries all he is a criminal and a fool that nobody cares for what he says and he will be in jail soon . he is so mad that montengro speaks serbian and that montengrins are serbs. and guess what dokanovic i am a montenegrin/ SERBIAN. your falling and not getting up. lol long live the serb people of serbia and montengro and republica srpska, and sooner or later all the serbs in krajina and all the serbs world wide unity we stand. end of story.

The man says it as it is. Good bye to the 'velika srbia' lie , hello to a new future in Europe.

Readers should check out previous statistics for census in Montenegro.

Back under Tito there were more self avowed Montenegrins than there are today, over 60%. Today as Djukanovic commissions census after census the main headline that any foreigner would note is that Montenegrins make up a minority of their own country.

Well done Djukanovic in entrenching ethnic politics in daily Montenegrin life and well done in reducing the numbers of those who believe they are Montenegrin.

bganon,

Check of this link about the demographic history of Montenegro:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Montenegro

Basically prior to 1948 when Tito started differentiating between Serbs of Serbia and Serbs of Montenegro, Montenegro comprised over 90% Serbs, or to be more exact, Serbian Orthodox.

As late as 1931, Montenegro was 80% Serb. Suddenly in 1948, "Montenegrins" make up 90% of the population and Serbs all of a sudden made up less than 2%. Even as late as 1991 when Milo was already in power, Montenegrins were over 60% of the population.

And then suddenly, people start becoming Serbs again in 2003, where the population changed from 9.34% Serb to nearly 32%. You can imagine the shock for a 1974-era communist apparatchik like Milo. Apparently despite his best efforts to ram a state-controlled church, a state-controlled language, and a state-controlled identity down the throats of his people to remind them what they are, those calling themselves Montenegrins, as well as those claiming to speak Montenegrin, remained the same.

I'd be curious to see how many people say they belong to the CPC.

Hence, Milo is pissed.

Milo, Milo ....

I am told that when you look in a mirror and see yourself, you try to convince your reflection that you are an honorable person.

You'll make a fool of yourself if you continue to do this.

All this because a 200 years old aggressor empire without any history of itself but genocide on it´s 50 mill, natives,wars and slavery decided to split up the Balkans as a favour to the Germans and their own oil company's.

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.

All this because a 200 years old aggressor empire without any history of itself but genocide on it´s 50 mill, natives,wars and slavery decided to split up the Balkans as a favour to the vengeful Germans and their own oil company's.

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.

USA (the settler state) in the evolution of man is a retarded one year old psychopath who started to rip the legs of insects and then left to go on to larger preys, your chances to get out of this mess intact is that you have a history, a memory that hasn´t been lost. You know who you are...

Cigarete smuggling milo has been partaking of the albo weed too much methinks. Montenegrins are Serbs, end of story. Their history, culture and religion are permanently intertwined. Except for atheist milo - he is the world's first monteblack. If Serbia got into the eu first, milo's citizens would demand annexation by Serbia and milo knows it.

Its an interesting topic for sure Mike. Am not sure how many unbiased accounts of how numbers changed so wildly from period to period.

I'm assuing that in back in the early days of Tito, it was made clear to people in Montenegro which way to vote. And that later on helping to massage the figures are benefits bestowed by the government of the time.

In short it makes you wonder exactly at the motives of people that change nationality from one year to the next and its an v interesting subject in my opinion.

As I've said before on this issue:

Welcome to the 21st century, where you can't define for someone else what their identity is.

Balkans people LOVE to explain-away the existence of other people. "Bosniaks are really Serbs", "Bosniaks are really Croats".

This is the polite and well-mannered roots of violence in the Balkans. First explain away their existence. Then end their actual existence.

You can twist and turn anyway you want. However, you can't change what you are.

From the lead-up to the 1992 Montenegrin referendum on independence from Yugoslavia:

"We are proud of our Serb origin and Montenegrin statehood, the proud history of the Serbian people. That's why we believe in a common future and prosperity." - Milo Đukanović

"Because of eternal brotherhood links; common blood spilled in wars, because of the eternal dream of the best Montenegrins and Serbians, for a brightly common better future, Montenegro willingly chose to live in a common state with Serbia with open heart." - Milo Đukanović

A leopard can never change its spots. ;)

Đukanović is an insecure communist relic who's only motive in antagonising Serbia is to stay in power in his own little private kingdom.

It’s obvious that when he says that not only "Pro-Serbian" parties receive "support" from Serbia, he’s trying to scare the population and marginalize any opposition to himself, classic power hungry dictator.

Oh and about the two-Serb states next to one another thing, the Austrians don't seem to be insecure in speaking German now do they? Hell, the Swiss speak three different languages and yet they don't seem to care, they are still Swiss. It's only you Đukanović...

-Balkans people LOVE to explain-away the existence of other people. "Bosniaks are really Serbs", "Bosniaks are really Croats".
This is the polite and well-mannered roots of violence in the Balkans. First explain away their existence. Then end their actual existence.
(Danilo, 14 July 2011 14:32)--

well said, as usual.

Listen "Arn", the ancestors of the amerindians are to be found in the area round Tibet. long before the time i mentioned, some of them started to cross the Bering. That is a fact.

Excuse my profanity but I don´t give a damn why you aren´t proud of who you really are, using fictive Swedish nick´s here, but you sure are not Swedish. Your mother tongue should be of Turkish origin. So i conclude you are Albanian, presumably from kosovo, am i wrong? ;)

To Wakan Tanka

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.
(Wakan Tanka, 14 July 2011 16:26)

Comment -

If you mean the Indians North America they are of Turkish origin,
and the Turkish ansestor and Forefather of the Turkish People are only from some 3500 B.C.

Your other comments i can go with.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvYIjFtPQ

Arn.Sweden.

Montenegro - a census like no other?

http://www.transconflict.com/2011/07/montenegro-a-census-like-no-other-147/

mike/bganon,

The issue of national identity in Montenegro is both far older and far more complex than you seem to appreciate. For more recent academic studies, check Robert's 'Realm of the Black Mountain' and Morrison's 'Montenegro: A Modern History'. Neither of the two could be blamed for having any bias toward or against Serbs, but both arrive at more or less the same conclusion that most Montenegrins have historically perceived themselves, as they also have been perceived by foreigners, as being different from Serbs in Serbia proper, while at the same time having a dual identity of Montenegrin/Serb, in which the relative weight between the two would shift over time and circumstances.

Those who think this is about a historically recent attempt to split Serbian unity, engineered by Djukanovic and Tito before him, are simply ignorant about the history of Montenegro.

balkanico

The man says it as it is. Good bye to the 'velika srbia' lie , hello to a new future in Europe.

As I've said before on this issue:

Welcome to the 21st century, where you can't define for someone else what their identity is.

Balkans people LOVE to explain-away the existence of other people. "Bosniaks are really Serbs", "Bosniaks are really Croats".

This is the polite and well-mannered roots of violence in the Balkans. First explain away their existence. Then end their actual existence.

Montenegrins are Serbs, period. That's a fact, no matter what revisionists and bootlickers like Milo invent. He's a traitor, a criminal, and an embarrassment, and will go down in history as such.

Djukanovic is nothing more then a quisling! He is a criminal and a lier!

Like Milovan Djilas, a Yugoslav Partisan leader and close associate to Tito, said: "All Montenegrins are Serbs, but not all Serbs are Montenegrins"

God Bless Serbs, Serbia and Serbdom!

dukanovic is a total fool he keeps crying and crying he sounds albanian already with his cries all he is a criminal and a fool that nobody cares for what he says and he will be in jail soon . he is so mad that montengro speaks serbian and that montengrins are serbs. and guess what dokanovic i am a montenegrin/ SERBIAN. your falling and not getting up. lol long live the serb people of serbia and montengro and republica srpska, and sooner or later all the serbs in krajina and all the serbs world wide unity we stand. end of story.

To Wakan Tanka

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.
(Wakan Tanka, 14 July 2011 16:26)

Comment -

If you mean the Indians North America they are of Turkish origin,
and the Turkish ansestor and Forefather of the Turkish People are only from some 3500 B.C.

Your other comments i can go with.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvYIjFtPQ

Arn.Sweden.

-Balkans people LOVE to explain-away the existence of other people. "Bosniaks are really Serbs", "Bosniaks are really Croats".
This is the polite and well-mannered roots of violence in the Balkans. First explain away their existence. Then end their actual existence.
(Danilo, 14 July 2011 14:32)--

well said, as usual.

What kind of an Ignorant Selfdeceiver is this.

A Name of People usually points to its Ancestry.

Black Mountainers are no Ancestry.

By the Way -
are not the People in CrnaGora Serbian reffugees to some extent,
reffugees from Kosovo a long time ago ?

Arn.Sweden.

Đukanović added that Montenegro “should not be fooled with make-believe brotherly recommendations such as - fine, you are independent but give up on your national identity, culture, church and language”.

-- So in other words, Milo is upset not that Serbia is denying Montenegro its identity, but *his* understanding of Montenegrin identity which flies in the face of all previous Montenegrin conceptions of being a part of a larger Serbian community in language, religion, and history.

The census results must have really pissed him off.

All this because a 200 years old aggressor empire without any history of itself but genocide on it´s 50 mill, natives,wars and slavery decided to split up the Balkans as a favour to the Germans and their own oil company's.

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.

Listen "Arn", the ancestors of the amerindians are to be found in the area round Tibet. long before the time i mentioned, some of them started to cross the Bering. That is a fact.

Excuse my profanity but I don´t give a damn why you aren´t proud of who you really are, using fictive Swedish nick´s here, but you sure are not Swedish. Your mother tongue should be of Turkish origin. So i conclude you are Albanian, presumably from kosovo, am i wrong? ;)

How about if Tzar Milo instead focused on something creative and positive for the citizens of Montenegro instead of whining and complaining about Serbia?
Like bringing new investements, jobs and opportunities to the republic? Oh, I forgot the marina in Tivat, but how many jobs is that creating outside the political circle loyal to Tzar Milo?
how about once and for all solving the problem with water, pollution (and no Tzar Milo, your socalled "eco" tax on cars isn't part of the solution) and electricity? How about finally build that bridge over Verige strait instead of waiting for EU funds to do it? It would improve infrastructure a lot, but that will never happen because the criminals that are running the ferry company between Lepetane-Kamenari are friends of, guess who? Tzar Milo!!

All this because a 200 years old aggressor empire without any history of itself but genocide on it´s 50 mill, natives,wars and slavery decided to split up the Balkans as a favour to the vengeful Germans and their own oil company's.

As sure as the "Americans" don´t know a sh*t about their natives,of which remaining 1 mil. badly treated still lives in poverty in their reservations, 30,000 years of history or any other history anywhere at all for that matter, they couldn´t care less about yours. You should.

USA (the settler state) in the evolution of man is a retarded one year old psychopath who started to rip the legs of insects and then left to go on to larger preys, your chances to get out of this mess intact is that you have a history, a memory that hasn´t been lost. You know who you are...

Readers should check out previous statistics for census in Montenegro.

Back under Tito there were more self avowed Montenegrins than there are today, over 60%. Today as Djukanovic commissions census after census the main headline that any foreigner would note is that Montenegrins make up a minority of their own country.

Well done Djukanovic in entrenching ethnic politics in daily Montenegrin life and well done in reducing the numbers of those who believe they are Montenegrin.

Its an interesting topic for sure Mike. Am not sure how many unbiased accounts of how numbers changed so wildly from period to period.

I'm assuing that in back in the early days of Tito, it was made clear to people in Montenegro which way to vote. And that later on helping to massage the figures are benefits bestowed by the government of the time.

In short it makes you wonder exactly at the motives of people that change nationality from one year to the next and its an v interesting subject in my opinion.

As a matter of fact, the differences between Serbs, Croats, Bosnians, Montenegrians are minimal, mostly based on a different religious belief.

That why smart people once said about themselves 'I'm a Yugoslav' instead of saying 'I'm a Serb' or 'I'm a Croat'. A pity that Milosevic and other nationalist pulled the 'being different' card.

bganon,

Check of this link about the demographic history of Montenegro:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Montenegro

Basically prior to 1948 when Tito started differentiating between Serbs of Serbia and Serbs of Montenegro, Montenegro comprised over 90% Serbs, or to be more exact, Serbian Orthodox.

As late as 1931, Montenegro was 80% Serb. Suddenly in 1948, "Montenegrins" make up 90% of the population and Serbs all of a sudden made up less than 2%. Even as late as 1991 when Milo was already in power, Montenegrins were over 60% of the population.

And then suddenly, people start becoming Serbs again in 2003, where the population changed from 9.34% Serb to nearly 32%. You can imagine the shock for a 1974-era communist apparatchik like Milo. Apparently despite his best efforts to ram a state-controlled church, a state-controlled language, and a state-controlled identity down the throats of his people to remind them what they are, those calling themselves Montenegrins, as well as those claiming to speak Montenegrin, remained the same.

I'd be curious to see how many people say they belong to the CPC.

Hence, Milo is pissed.

DjukanoviC added that Montenegro “should not be fooled with make-believe brotherly recommendations such as - fine, you are independent but give up on your national identity, culture, church and language”.

I didn't know that Montenegro has an own orthodox church and an own language that is totally different from the language formerly known as 'Serbo-Croatian' :-)

Cigarete smuggling milo has been partaking of the albo weed too much methinks. Montenegrins are Serbs, end of story. Their history, culture and religion are permanently intertwined. Except for atheist milo - he is the world's first monteblack. If Serbia got into the eu first, milo's citizens would demand annexation by Serbia and milo knows it.

You can twist and turn anyway you want. However, you can't change what you are.

From the lead-up to the 1992 Montenegrin referendum on independence from Yugoslavia:

"We are proud of our Serb origin and Montenegrin statehood, the proud history of the Serbian people. That's why we believe in a common future and prosperity." - Milo Đukanović

"Because of eternal brotherhood links; common blood spilled in wars, because of the eternal dream of the best Montenegrins and Serbians, for a brightly common better future, Montenegro willingly chose to live in a common state with Serbia with open heart." - Milo Đukanović

A leopard can never change its spots. ;)

mike/bganon,

The issue of national identity in Montenegro is both far older and far more complex than you seem to appreciate. For more recent academic studies, check Robert's 'Realm of the Black Mountain' and Morrison's 'Montenegro: A Modern History'. Neither of the two could be blamed for having any bias toward or against Serbs, but both arrive at more or less the same conclusion that most Montenegrins have historically perceived themselves, as they also have been perceived by foreigners, as being different from Serbs in Serbia proper, while at the same time having a dual identity of Montenegrin/Serb, in which the relative weight between the two would shift over time and circumstances.

Those who think this is about a historically recent attempt to split Serbian unity, engineered by Djukanovic and Tito before him, are simply ignorant about the history of Montenegro.

balkanico

Milo, Milo ....

I am told that when you look in a mirror and see yourself, you try to convince your reflection that you are an honorable person.

You'll make a fool of yourself if you continue to do this.

Đukanović is an insecure communist relic who's only motive in antagonising Serbia is to stay in power in his own little private kingdom.

It’s obvious that when he says that not only "Pro-Serbian" parties receive "support" from Serbia, he’s trying to scare the population and marginalize any opposition to himself, classic power hungry dictator.

Oh and about the two-Serb states next to one another thing, the Austrians don't seem to be insecure in speaking German now do they? Hell, the Swiss speak three different languages and yet they don't seem to care, they are still Swiss. It's only you Đukanović...

Montenegro - a census like no other?

http://www.transconflict.com/2011/07/montenegro-a-census-like-no-other-147/