<a href="http://www.b92.net/eng/news/politics-article.php?yyyy=2010&mm=12&dd=14&nav_id=71512" class="text-link" target= "_blank">The report by Council of Europe Special Rapporteur</a> Dick Marty is a great victory for Serbia in the fight for truth and justice, says Bruno Vekarić.
Albanians (citizens and politicians) rarely share the same opinion. The more you push us Albanians the more we stick together and the stronger we get. Please carry on...
The ''scandalous'' report issued by the European Parliamentary Council rapporteur Dick Marti ''is a text stuffed with slanders and falsehood, which are no more than a recycling of the continual propaganda coming from certain areas of ill-wishers to Kosovo and its citizens'' acting against their plans for freedom and independence through damaging their international image. The evidence contained in the report has been examined ''several times by now, by authoritative institutions of international justice, including the Hague Tribunal, UNMIK and lastly EULEX. In each of these cases it was demonstrated that the accusations in question were unfounded. In Kosovo, the communique' continues, ''horrendous crimes were committed over a period of years,'' climaxing with the war of 1998-1999. But ''the whole world knows who the aggressor was and who the victim''. Attempts to change history and ''put the aggressors and the victims on the same level are immoral, unjust, criminal and are bound to fail''-once again.
Am albanian and i always say, as long as hashim thaci runns Kosovo we are going to have problem! Albanians need to understand that sooner or later we going to face problem!
As an albanian i say SEND THACI TO HAGUE TRIBUNAL
''Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".''
Yeah right, it took 5 years for internationals to intervene in bosna, and when they finally put pressure on beograd, the damage was already done, more than half of country was totally cleansed...by serb's own experience it is quite possible to ethnically cleanse 100 000 serbs in a short time, you know how it happens...espcially now that Rep o Albania has a NATO standart army...only a single Albanian armored battalion is able to take control of Kosovo in less than 3 hours...
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
Lets start a new without all these criminals.
(robby, 15 December 2010 23:48)
Who is we? How many people are writing this post? If you are the one writing then shouldn't it be honest you speak for yourself rather than authorize yourself to speak in the name of others.
@Une
‘Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense’..(Une)
- You truly made me laugh out loud :)))!!!What you failed to realise as a ‘doctor’, oh pardon me a ‘surgeon,’ is how limited your scope is.
If you know anything about the Nursing in Western World then you should be aware that there are so many degrees and levels of education in Nursing which certainly can never be described as limited. Surely, it is not as wide as for doctors because the plan and programs differ at some point which is undertandable.
Also, what you failed to understand while trying to underestimate a role of Nurse is the fact that specialised Nurses are not much under doctors with their knowledge, especially when you add experience on it.
But, let me be the one with limited scope as you put it, and tell you that you still have no clues abut the surger-ies.
Maybe you know or heard something about the appendectomy, but surely you know nothing about really complicated surger-ies nor you ever seen it, I can bet on it.
You may want to keep your privacy and that is all right with me,
Perhaps I should keep my privacy as well.
Honestly speaking, I would like to check are you really registered as a doctor, pardon surgeon :) anywhere in US since the registration should be available publicly. At least so is in Finland.
Vicryl 3-0??? Is that best you know about the surgery? Congratulations, you know types of sutures and should prove you are a surgeon???
Anyway, since you wanted to know, I specialized anaesthesia nursing and work independently in OR.
I can tell you more about the intubation and medication, types of anaesthesia, etc, but we should agree that this is not place for it. Perhaps we could go to another forum and discuss medical issues, different illness and surgeries.
And if you are liar it doesn't mean that everyone else is a liar too. I remember in some of your posts you called Mr.Mrty a Liar. Unlike you, he is honest and decent man. At least, you as a 'doctor' should have some decency and respect for human beings. I am afraid you are ready to deny your help (if you are some doctor really) someone you don't like, most probably you would deny help to any Serb.
Well, personally, I don't think some dude accusing Thaçi, truly or falsely, is a victory for anyone! but from another point of view, I guess why some call it a victory for Serbia. Finally, someone NOT SERB gets accused for war crimes. If that's a victory, serb authorities are very easy to please. If Thaçi is guilty and justice proves that, he should be hanged not jailed. But before getting so high when someone else is accused, serb authorities should catch their own criminals, (i dont think there's need to mention names) who just live comfortably on honest serb citizens taxes. I think that would be a victory for Serbia!
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
Hey listen to my you are just a nurse I got my Diploma in the US at X university. I did my general Surgery Residency here in Us at X and my trauma fellowship in Maryland at shock trauma center( I amommiting the names for you could easily see my biography at the page of my residency for privacy issues). Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense..
OO I need my 3 0 vicryl now nurse. So please dont insult my learning instead focus on giving me what I need
What do you mean when you say anasthesia scrub nurse?? You give anasthesia or are you a scrub nurse?
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
You can bet on that.
(KOSO, 16 December 2010 02:51)
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Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".
Let's for pretend examine the following scenario:
1. Organ harvesting occured
2. Thaci is found guilty and jailed
What do you think will happen in Kosovo? PM Thaci is a hero, and a founding father The Kosovars would quickly become bitter and extreme and Kurti would be elected PM. You guys remember that study that said 80% of Kosovar support unification of the ethnic Albania...well that would shoot up to 100%.
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
Good luck Serbia in fight for truth!! Albanian terrorist shoul go to prison. My country should withdraw support for this terrorist, mafia pseudostate. Kosovo is province of Republic of Serbia - and all thinking peoples on the world know it.
The council of europe represent 47 States and is not relatet to EU. After this report, it should be impossible that Kosovo gets so much support if Thaci remain as prime minister.
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
If i were in the position of Thaci, I'd stop any kind of dialogue with Serbia till the truth comes out. The accusators of Thaci MUST PROVE their allegations or they'll have serious trouble in the future. At the end well see that all these fabrications will returned as a BOOMERANG to Serbia. Before the battle have started the Serbs are claiming victory. You've done the same thing in the past, an example was in the case of the ICTY. We saw who the real winners were. And remember one thing: "He who laughs last, laughs best."
Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. (Une)
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy (Marine)
@Une
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
And, if it is true that you are some kind of doctor as @Marine claims, then I must question your degree.
Where did you obtain your Diploma?
If you really are a doctor, then all I can say is that you are either naïve (pretending to be one) or you are just pure medical dilettante.
I fear for you patients.
But something tells me that you are as doctor as I am Angelina Jolie, thus I completely agree with @Marine.
As for Mr. Vekaric, I would like to say that this is not any win for Serbia but hopefully stimulation to push more forward in the direction of Yellow house. Do not allow anyone to stop us in further investigation, even if further nosing and sneaking cost you a life.
And when finally, if ever happen that the truth of Yellow house find its way out and all criminals involved in these monstrous deeds end up behind bars for very long time, then and only then we can say that the Justice and victims have won. Not you, not state of Serbia, not us ordinary people, but Justice and victims.
This is not any competition remember that. Your job is to deal with the war crimes and tit is your duty towards the victims and towards the state you represent. And we, ordinary people will be there to support and appreciate every effort you make in that direction and rejoice all your success.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible.
====================
Why don't you go and help Thaci or don't you consider yourself to be one of the best surgeons?
Hey, the organs were HARVESTED not transplanted there. I think you will agree there is a difference.
This is Miloshevic lie! No Albanian want Serbs organ! Only organ from friendly state like US of A, Great Britain, now Tuvalu too, soon many more.
(Arsim, 15 December 2010 14:31)
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You would cut out organs from your friends?
K-Albanians were not the recipients of these organs. They were sold to people with money.
Anyway, you would take an organ from a chimp if it mean you could live. Don't be so ridiculous.
Thanks for the link bganon. It made a very interesting reading. I tried to go to the references, but a login window came up. Apparently, the references are available only to COE staff. Hope an investigation will be carried out as soon as possible into this. The report mentions sources, which must now be involved in investigations into these crimes. He claims the sources are insiders of KLA and truck drivers. The report mentions foreign intelligence agencies. That material must be investigated too. I want the link between the claims of the organ removed from Serbs and those houses in Albania proved or disproved beyond any doubt in a court.
To some of the insecure Albanians here, the propaganda and PR benefit Serbia will get out of this is not important as it will change nothing on the ground as regards the status of Kosovo. If such horrible crimes were committed, then they must be investigated and the perpetrators condemned. Will see what comes out of this.
You are wrong, Nikshala, if the KLA murdered civilians, not only Serbs but their own Albanians too, and removed their vital organs for profit, this out does anything that any Serbian soldier or paramilitary did anywhere in the Balkans. These accusations by Dick Marti against Thaci and his KLA group is fiendish, sub-human behavior, and not the actions of soldiers fighting for independence. In starts to fall into Hannibal Lechter territory.
One more thing, Eagle, it was the KLA that started the wrs in KiM, not the Serbs. I guess you forgot the part when Adem Jashari and his band of cowards was murdering policemen and innocent people in cafes, then running away, to provoke the Serbian authorities? He (Jashari) came to a justified end, it looks like Thaci will too.
Eagle, you should ask Thaci where missing bodies of Albanian civilians are. Maybe they were some of the unfortunates that wound up in Fushe Kruje? The KLA murdered their own too, not just Serbs.
B.Vekaric, how much did you pay him, 1 million euro.
A great Serbian PROPAGANDA, Rocky
I heard that Thaci only offered Marti 2 kilos of Hash, so Dick took the better bribe. In any case, looks like the Snake's days are numbered, maybe even Pristina's.
Miles, I have stated before that PRN's head is buried somewhere for sure, but it's not sand. In fact, he may be able to see his own kidneys. In any case, the blind denial of the Albanians here is quite amusing. When Marti's proof comes to light, Albanians will not only be known as the world's drug dealers, but also organ-harvesters. More proud moments in Albanian history.
Une, if you are a surgeon in the USA, then I am the Pope. Transplants were not conducted in the mountains of Albania. Vital organs were removed from unfortunate kidnapped civilians, placed immediately in coolers, and flown to rich customers. Thanks for the chuckle, though. In any case, the Snake is going down. This puts him in the same class as Mengele and Vlad the Impaler. Not even Dr. Frankenstein would do what the Snake is accused of.
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
dear PRN, i like you! you make the funnies! you write about the disneyland serbia! yes yes you write more. you no pay attention to bad milosheviq media in world that say bad things about mr. thaci. he nice man. what nice hair he have! he smile good with american freinds. these all LIES against him from smely serbs and dick marti. he serb mup you know? bad marti! he not friend of us. we take him to court and win the big moneys!
"USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'. "
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
Exactly. They know him well, for many years. Simply try to find the good old CIA investigations and reports about Thaci. And hasn't there been a nice file with interesting findings about him, created by the German Intelligence service, too? ;-)
This is indeed a great Victory for Serbia,
No crime will go unpunished!
Serbia caught their own criminals,(Mladic is from Bosnia, and Hadzic is from Croatia remain uncaught) but I dont see Serbia's neighbours catching their own criminals.
Also Milosevic was on Trial but there was NO evidence for his crimes!!!.
Now is the turn for non caught criminals like Thaci to get a trial!!!
I wonder when victims of Srebrenica will be able to say they same.
(ivan, 15 December 2010 17:00)
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I wonder when the Dasht-i-Leili massacre will even start being investigated. 8000 Afghan POWs involved in this massacre involving the West and NATO. Check http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/sep/14/afghanistan.lukeharding
Hopefully, with the current momentum we will make some progress to just get an investigation started (10 years after the event).
PRN says..."They supported him (Thaci) because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country."
I think you should see a doctor, PRN, so you can get a medication called Aricept. The pill will help you to remember better, think clearly and improve your communication.
The real "Snake Thaci"
http://dalje.com/en-world/who-is-hashim-snake-thaci/125467
Illegal harvesting of organs is a well known problem throughout the world and brings in BIG profits.
What is really disgusting is that it often takes advantage of the most vulnerable the poorest of the poor, illiterate, prisoners and refugees.
Heck, illegal harvesting of human organs can even help fund wars!
'We take the allegations seriously but we invite Mr Marty to put forward the evidence,' Maja Kocijancic, spokeswoman for EU foreign policy...
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Nuf said, where's the beef Mr. Dick Marti?
Read this about Marty:
"But we are told: "Kosovo is different, he was the victim of abuse on the part of Serbia." I realize that Kosovo is administered by ten years the international community and that after ten years, Kosovo's economy is nonexistent, it became a center of organized crime, drug trafficking, arms trafficking , trafficking in human beings. I note that there is no genuine civil society that is able to run a truly democratic institution, and there are various minorities who live protected by international soldiers.
During those years when Kosovo was under international protectorate, monasteries and Orthodox churches were burned in the total indifference of the international media. Since 1999, 250,000 Serbs have fled Kosovo."
http://www.voltairenet.org/article155903.html
Sounds like Kostunica, doesn't he? He said that a year before he started 'investihgating'
Remains to be seen what impact this will have on totalitarian western media. In the mean time, from one monster to another, Hash owed many thanks to one of his benefactors, described here:
http://www.counterpunch.org/johnstone12152010.html
Nikshala this is not a court of law and in the report Marty stresses that that isn't the aim of the report.
I don't agree with you that the report is pro Serbian either. It clearly condemns actions from Serbian security forces and Slobodan Milosevic's control of them.
There is one part of the report that I'd like to address to show how acts of helpfulness can go a long way. I will concede that perhaps Marty gave more credence to information coming from Vukicevic's Special Prosecutor's Office in Serbia (alongside other sources). However, this is due to the fact that the Albanian equivallents whether in Albania itself or Kosovo NGO's, institutions and government did not attempt to help or to be open in any way towards the Council of Europe. In such a situation one must show greater credence to those that do help and show a more open attitude. It obviously didn't do Vukicevic any harm to show Marty that the prosection are processing war crimes committed against Serbs, Albanians, Croats etc. He would likely have told Marty that any light sentences are down to the Serbian judiciary, just as Vukicevic cannot be held responsible for Mladic and Hadzic.
That might have prodded Marty into a more pro Serbian position, but this could have easily prevented if the Kosovo authorities had been open and shared their information with Marty. The fact they didn't do this shows they are either stupid and inexperienced in international diplomacy or that they have something to hide. Marty likely believes the latter.
In the end Serb or Albanian can quote sections 'proving' bias against them.
That doesn't change the fact that we all know that most of what is written there is true, court or not.
http://assembly.coe.int/ASP/APFeaturesManager/defaultArtSiteView.asp?ID=964
The full report, absolutely no evidence (just 'we heard',) just rehashes old lines. So in a week it will be forgotten.
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
(Bob, 15 December 2010 13:15)
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Bob, please do some research. Lots of wicked things happened between the people but it was the West that opened the gates to hell.
Without going into too much detail, it started in Croatia with Germany and the Vatican prematurely recognising Croatia. No negotiations, no compromises just recognition, which well... obviously ended up in war.
In BiH, the idea was to avoid war so they came up with the Cutileiro plan (or Lisbon agreement) which everyone signed and war was avoided until Izetbegovic reneged after advice from the US - who said he can have it all. In the end and after more than 100,000 deaths Dayton gave the Muslims less.
And what about Kosovo? Well, all ethnic Albanians were firmly in the province while Serbia was dealing with terrorists. Then came the ultimatum of the Rambouillet Agreement, which basically said accept Kosovo independence and allow NATO to occupy all of Yugoslavia (Serbia + Montenegro) or we'll bomb! I mean, who in their right mind would accept that?
Sorry to say, it was undoubtedly the West that opened the gates to hell.
drowntheday no, I don't believe there is a Serbian / Albanian translation of the draft report yet.
But there probably will be. God know the EU have enough translators on their books...
I have now read the report in its entirety. Very interesting, even though much of it we suspected already. And I include Kos Albanians in this too. Despite some denials here, I believe in their hearts Albanians know that many, if not all the allegations in the report are true. Its a sad state of affairs but one that needs to be faced, if it is to change. If you don't read anything else then read the last few lines of the report:
'Everyone in Kosovo is aware of what happened and of the current situation, but people do not talk about it, except in private; they have for years been waiting for the truth - the whole truth, rather than the official version - to be laid bare. Our sole aim today is to serve as spokespersons for those men and women from Kosovo, as well as those from Serbia and Albania, who, regardless of their ethnic or religious backgrounds, simply aspire to the truth and to an end to scandalous impunity, with no greater wish than to be able to live in peace.'
On another note I was trying to put myself in the position of EU decision makers. I think the least harmful way to react to this report initially is to put pressure on Albania to do something on this. It will be much more difficult and risky for the internationals to orchestrate change in Kosovo in the short term. We know that Albania wants to join the EU and that it needs EU support in many areas. How this Albanian influence will manifest itself on the Kosovo politic is another question.
I'm not saying this potential approach by the EU is the right or just one, but a likely one alongside others...
The draft of the report is out now - I would ask everyone to read it themselves.
Then imagine yourself as a jury in a court of law - and them imaginge the accused being the same nationaily as you to avoid hatred / prejudice getting in the way of your judgement - do you think this report presents enough evidence to convict someone of this crime??
I certainly do not - I am not denying that this might have happened, and many times where there is smoke there is fire - but currently this reports does not present any concrete evidence apart from what we have already heard before based on some statements from 'anonymous' sources. I have not doubt that Thaci has or had some involvement in criminality, but as currently presented the charges for 'organ removal' are vague at best and the evidence in this report is almost non-existant.
This case should be investigated by unbiased investigators - I am afraid that Dick Marty has previsouly shown himself to be pro-serb and there are definetely anti-albanian connotations in the report.
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
Hashim Thaci was scanned 1000s of times by the Western powers the before the West was VERY CONFIDENT of him as a serious person to deal with. They supported him because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country.
Serbia, a country that committed genocides last decade, with a number of countries in region accusing it (at ICJ) for the said deed, trying to reverse (with money) the course and direction of war/s, BUT is not going to be sold easily.
There must be several hundreds Dick Marties to come along with PURE FACTS for alleged crimes, not one silly individual paid by Serbian government to do a research with the intention of disturbing the truth. Dick Marty failed.
USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'.
Serbia 'could' have come with even more shocking 'research' about THACI, but they know that anyhow such 'finding' would be useless especially since it would come from a state that did awful crimes cannot accuse others before cleaning itself.
So they chose Dick Marty from a respectable Switzerland do the dirty job. BUT, rest assure that he will fail too.
Nevertheless this is good time for Serbs to smile a bit, while it lasts. You guys forget that there isn't not even a place anymore in the Hague for any new potential criminal BECAUSE the Hague prison is FULLY BOOKED with Serbian Criminals, starting from Serbian top government officials (the entire former Serbian leadership in Serbia, Bosnia and Croatia) to low level Serbian guards (who committed war crimes).
I am really wondering about how long, how stubbornly and how helplessly our dear k-albanian friends are trying to deny what is already common knowledge, it seems.
do they not feel ashamed at all? do they not feel the need to condemn these atrocities against both, Serbs and Albanians together?
some Albanians are so deeply stuck in their ugly,tiny little world of anti-serb hatred that they do not even realize when they are making complete fools of themselves...
"He expressed expectation that the “exceptionally positive” report will launch many investigations into human organs trafficking in Kosovo, and also in Albania, where courts have been "ignoring calls for solving the problem for years"."
I don't have the expectation that investigations in Kosovo will be launched. The persons who were even mentioned in this reports will try to deny everything and to stop the case being solved. Of course there's hope: EULEX is present in Kosovo, and now that the (manipulated) elections are over, they have no reason to further delay all kind of investigations, even against high state officials or presidents of political parties.
Of course...a totally political statement, just like the report...actually somethin good might come out of this, Thaci has been serving for to long and has become pretty soft and consumed lately...with all this political pressure he has from other political parties he probably will not be able to deal with the negotions properly...maybe Kurti should become a premier ... i wonder what would Serbia fabricate against Kurti...? If Serbia is worried about Kosovo having a noble premier, who could be more appropiate than Kurti? A young idealist former political prisoner of Serbia ... I doubt Kurti would even care to negotiate with Serbia, though...on anything.
I am sure that you would agree that these are serious allegations and you can not reject them lightly. I agree with sentiment of your post that this crime is so horrible that it looks impossible, but this is exactly the reason why we should see this matter all the way through. If anybody would accuse me that I was involved in this kind of thing, I would welcome as thorough investigation as possible. I am sure that you are honest and decent human being and that you accept that anybody who is involved in criminal activities deserves to face the low.
I think a throughouh investigation by unbiased investigators is required to put this issue to rest. If true, as an albanian, I hope that all responsible will be brought to justice.
The irony, is that most serbs are cheering here hoping that this will lead to the toppling of Thaci & Co goverment - and you know what - so do I because I have no doubt he is corrupt and has criminal connections. Then once this serb 'wish' is realised, hopefully we will have a clean & independent from foreign influence goverment that cannot be blackmailed or threatend with corruption cases. This goverement will stand up to Serbia and weak EU politicians only interested in relative stability and will revise the laws based on the wish of the majority and democracy.
The irony is that in my opinion, Thaci is the best Kosovan primeminister that Serbia could currently hope for because he is one who will compromise further and sell north of Kosovo just so that he can remain in power / avoid prosecutions. And he is incompetent.
A note to hypocrits: even if true, this does not undermine or match up to the crimes commited by Serbia which everyone is aware of.
Une ...
Why do you raise the idea that organ harvesting can only be performed in some ivory tower institution and not some third world region?
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy. Less probably. At least they get paid to pretend. What's in it for you?
and when the report, contains nothing at all whatsoever other than the same identical fiction pieces previously reported and investigated and found lacking, with nothing more than vague hints at "sources" wich as usuall will remain mysteriously unknown. When nothing whatsover will result legally from such a report because fiction is not admissable.
@ miles - Sadly I think you are right, but hope through quickly fading rose-tinted lenses that at last some media coverage will be given which is fair.
But it does strike me that this story has got more coverage than I would have expected, and I think that for some devious reason its exposure may actually suit 'those that be' at the moment.
Actually, thinking about it a little more, if the wetern media do start front paging this news, then it will be a clear indication that the western elites have switched sides and are now mobilising their media against Thaci, just as they did against Milosevic. Whether the tide has shifted or not what remains constant is that the truth does not matter. Serbs and Albanians like many other small nations are just pawns in a bigger game. Today the Albanians begin their walk on the long road of awareness. Come on PRN start learning.
Brotherhood and unity is the only way forward. Now who said that?
This is an international scandal of epic proportions. I agree with the posters here who say that comments like a great victory for Serbia are wholly inappropriate. It will be a great victory for HUMANITY when the perpetrators of this trade be brought to justice and anyone who knowingly ignored it must also be held to account including those in the Western powers, no matter how high in the hierarchy they are.
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
You are right to be glad that organ trafficking is being investigated. It is very likely to have occurred and deserves to be treated extremely seriously. This is true in Kosovo, just as it is true in many other parts of the world. The KLA had a particularly strong opportunity - and quite likely used it.
Even where the west did what you think to be wrong, that does not make what happened in the Balkans right. The west was given strong reason to intervene in Bosnia, and unsurprisingly extended that into Kosovo. The Hague was set up to deal with a lot of wrongs - and it is still the best way currently available of getting some element of justice for some of the significant war crimes that occurred.
In the case of organ trafficking this does need to find its way to a court, so I hope there are finally moves on this. This report should lead to that opportunity.
With respect to Kos Albanian posters but you look as if you are clutching at straws.
To any internationals hearing that Marty was bribed, alongside the BBC, Guardian, the Times, Reuters, the Independent, well nobody will take it seriously.
On the other hand Serbs always spoke about William Walker and look at him today...
Anyway take a look at the first draft of the report:
Hey PRN, I'm looking forward to Thursday when they start pulling your head out of the sand. It must be so far down by now that you could probably have a chat with some Chilean miners.
It will be interesting to see how the western media ignore this story and others that threaten to disrupt the machine- like voting fraud... the machine which is still working perfectly, chewing up human life for profit in Iraq and Afganistan, and telling fairytales to their people. Go back to sleep everyone next stop Iran.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. It is achallenging operation here in the US where we do it under sterile conditions with all the support such as FFR, PRBC, cryoprecipitate and all other conjugated factors. ROFL if kidney transplant it is done that easy we surgreons should not be needed anymore
This in fact is nothing new to Serbians. The practices here is something we have known about for a long time, including:
1. The ethnic Albanian leadership are terrorists and criminals.
2. The US, EU and Western governments have been covering up these crimes for a very long time. This is also shown in the CIA reports.
3. Ethnic Albanians are in denial regarding crimes they committed. In general they will deny this ever happening even though organ trading is common in Albania.
4. The NATO court in the Hague is biased against Serbians. Del Ponte was blocked from further investigations into organ harvesting as she was from investigating NATO crimes. This has also been revealed.
Guys, it's all coming out now. Wikileaks and further investigations will expose the nakedness of the emperor. The empire is falling and much of the evilness will be exposed. The nature of the NATO court will be revealed, here is a preview -> http://jurist.org/paperchase/2010/08/icty-orders-independent-investigation-of-witness-intimidation-at-seselj-trial.php
This is great news, not only for Serbians but the whole region. It will help us reconcile and understand who were the real aggressors and criminals in this orgy of violence brought upon us. Let the truth be known.
My goodness. Paying someone to report a LIE is considered a great victory for Serbia.
Some seem to forget that the EC/EU knows pretty well that Serbia is the huge factory of crimes and lies, and this why all the Serbian government apparatus (and other criminals from other parts of ex-YU) has hugely increased the density of population in the Hague Tribunal.
As per Dick Marty, he only knows how much he obtained in his Swiss accounts to produce a fiction story.
REST ASSURE that this will be ignored due to substantial containment of lies and thus overlooked.
This in fact is nothing new to Serbians. The practices here is something we have known about for a long time, including:
1. The ethnic Albanian leadership are terrorists and criminals.
2. The US, EU and Western governments have been covering up these crimes for a very long time. This is also shown in the CIA reports.
3. Ethnic Albanians are in denial regarding crimes they committed. In general they will deny this ever happening even though organ trading is common in Albania.
4. The NATO court in the Hague is biased against Serbians. Del Ponte was blocked from further investigations into organ harvesting as she was from investigating NATO crimes. This has also been revealed.
Guys, it's all coming out now. Wikileaks and further investigations will expose the nakedness of the emperor. The empire is falling and much of the evilness will be exposed. The nature of the NATO court will be revealed, here is a preview -> http://jurist.org/paperchase/2010/08/icty-orders-independent-investigation-of-witness-intimidation-at-seselj-trial.php
This is great news, not only for Serbians but the whole region. It will help us reconcile and understand who were the real aggressors and criminals in this orgy of violence brought upon us. Let the truth be known.
Hey PRN, I'm looking forward to Thursday when they start pulling your head out of the sand. It must be so far down by now that you could probably have a chat with some Chilean miners.
It will be interesting to see how the western media ignore this story and others that threaten to disrupt the machine- like voting fraud... the machine which is still working perfectly, chewing up human life for profit in Iraq and Afganistan, and telling fairytales to their people. Go back to sleep everyone next stop Iran.
This is an international scandal of epic proportions. I agree with the posters here who say that comments like a great victory for Serbia are wholly inappropriate. It will be a great victory for HUMANITY when the perpetrators of this trade be brought to justice and anyone who knowingly ignored it must also be held to account including those in the Western powers, no matter how high in the hierarchy they are.
With respect to Kos Albanian posters but you look as if you are clutching at straws.
To any internationals hearing that Marty was bribed, alongside the BBC, Guardian, the Times, Reuters, the Independent, well nobody will take it seriously.
On the other hand Serbs always spoke about William Walker and look at him today...
Anyway take a look at the first draft of the report:
My goodness. Paying someone to report a LIE is considered a great victory for Serbia.
Some seem to forget that the EC/EU knows pretty well that Serbia is the huge factory of crimes and lies, and this why all the Serbian government apparatus (and other criminals from other parts of ex-YU) has hugely increased the density of population in the Hague Tribunal.
As per Dick Marty, he only knows how much he obtained in his Swiss accounts to produce a fiction story.
REST ASSURE that this will be ignored due to substantial containment of lies and thus overlooked.
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
Hashim Thaci was scanned 1000s of times by the Western powers the before the West was VERY CONFIDENT of him as a serious person to deal with. They supported him because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country.
Serbia, a country that committed genocides last decade, with a number of countries in region accusing it (at ICJ) for the said deed, trying to reverse (with money) the course and direction of war/s, BUT is not going to be sold easily.
There must be several hundreds Dick Marties to come along with PURE FACTS for alleged crimes, not one silly individual paid by Serbian government to do a research with the intention of disturbing the truth. Dick Marty failed.
USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'.
Serbia 'could' have come with even more shocking 'research' about THACI, but they know that anyhow such 'finding' would be useless especially since it would come from a state that did awful crimes cannot accuse others before cleaning itself.
So they chose Dick Marty from a respectable Switzerland do the dirty job. BUT, rest assure that he will fail too.
Nevertheless this is good time for Serbs to smile a bit, while it lasts. You guys forget that there isn't not even a place anymore in the Hague for any new potential criminal BECAUSE the Hague prison is FULLY BOOKED with Serbian Criminals, starting from Serbian top government officials (the entire former Serbian leadership in Serbia, Bosnia and Croatia) to low level Serbian guards (who committed war crimes).
I think a throughouh investigation by unbiased investigators is required to put this issue to rest. If true, as an albanian, I hope that all responsible will be brought to justice.
The irony, is that most serbs are cheering here hoping that this will lead to the toppling of Thaci & Co goverment - and you know what - so do I because I have no doubt he is corrupt and has criminal connections. Then once this serb 'wish' is realised, hopefully we will have a clean & independent from foreign influence goverment that cannot be blackmailed or threatend with corruption cases. This goverement will stand up to Serbia and weak EU politicians only interested in relative stability and will revise the laws based on the wish of the majority and democracy.
The irony is that in my opinion, Thaci is the best Kosovan primeminister that Serbia could currently hope for because he is one who will compromise further and sell north of Kosovo just so that he can remain in power / avoid prosecutions. And he is incompetent.
A note to hypocrits: even if true, this does not undermine or match up to the crimes commited by Serbia which everyone is aware of.
Actually, thinking about it a little more, if the wetern media do start front paging this news, then it will be a clear indication that the western elites have switched sides and are now mobilising their media against Thaci, just as they did against Milosevic. Whether the tide has shifted or not what remains constant is that the truth does not matter. Serbs and Albanians like many other small nations are just pawns in a bigger game. Today the Albanians begin their walk on the long road of awareness. Come on PRN start learning.
Brotherhood and unity is the only way forward. Now who said that?
@ miles - Sadly I think you are right, but hope through quickly fading rose-tinted lenses that at last some media coverage will be given which is fair.
But it does strike me that this story has got more coverage than I would have expected, and I think that for some devious reason its exposure may actually suit 'those that be' at the moment.
PRN says..."They supported him (Thaci) because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country."
I think you should see a doctor, PRN, so you can get a medication called Aricept. The pill will help you to remember better, think clearly and improve your communication.
The real "Snake Thaci"
http://dalje.com/en-world/who-is-hashim-snake-thaci/125467
Illegal harvesting of organs is a well known problem throughout the world and brings in BIG profits.
What is really disgusting is that it often takes advantage of the most vulnerable the poorest of the poor, illiterate, prisoners and refugees.
Heck, illegal harvesting of human organs can even help fund wars!
Une ...
Why do you raise the idea that organ harvesting can only be performed in some ivory tower institution and not some third world region?
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy. Less probably. At least they get paid to pretend. What's in it for you?
If i were in the position of Thaci, I'd stop any kind of dialogue with Serbia till the truth comes out. The accusators of Thaci MUST PROVE their allegations or they'll have serious trouble in the future. At the end well see that all these fabrications will returned as a BOOMERANG to Serbia. Before the battle have started the Serbs are claiming victory. You've done the same thing in the past, an example was in the case of the ICTY. We saw who the real winners were. And remember one thing: "He who laughs last, laughs best."
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
(Bob, 15 December 2010 13:15)
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Bob, please do some research. Lots of wicked things happened between the people but it was the West that opened the gates to hell.
Without going into too much detail, it started in Croatia with Germany and the Vatican prematurely recognising Croatia. No negotiations, no compromises just recognition, which well... obviously ended up in war.
In BiH, the idea was to avoid war so they came up with the Cutileiro plan (or Lisbon agreement) which everyone signed and war was avoided until Izetbegovic reneged after advice from the US - who said he can have it all. In the end and after more than 100,000 deaths Dayton gave the Muslims less.
And what about Kosovo? Well, all ethnic Albanians were firmly in the province while Serbia was dealing with terrorists. Then came the ultimatum of the Rambouillet Agreement, which basically said accept Kosovo independence and allow NATO to occupy all of Yugoslavia (Serbia + Montenegro) or we'll bomb! I mean, who in their right mind would accept that?
Sorry to say, it was undoubtedly the West that opened the gates to hell.
Remains to be seen what impact this will have on totalitarian western media. In the mean time, from one monster to another, Hash owed many thanks to one of his benefactors, described here:
http://www.counterpunch.org/johnstone12152010.html
One more thing, Eagle, it was the KLA that started the wrs in KiM, not the Serbs. I guess you forgot the part when Adem Jashari and his band of cowards was murdering policemen and innocent people in cafes, then running away, to provoke the Serbian authorities? He (Jashari) came to a justified end, it looks like Thaci will too.
I am really wondering about how long, how stubbornly and how helplessly our dear k-albanian friends are trying to deny what is already common knowledge, it seems.
do they not feel ashamed at all? do they not feel the need to condemn these atrocities against both, Serbs and Albanians together?
some Albanians are so deeply stuck in their ugly,tiny little world of anti-serb hatred that they do not even realize when they are making complete fools of themselves...
You are wrong, Nikshala, if the KLA murdered civilians, not only Serbs but their own Albanians too, and removed their vital organs for profit, this out does anything that any Serbian soldier or paramilitary did anywhere in the Balkans. These accusations by Dick Marti against Thaci and his KLA group is fiendish, sub-human behavior, and not the actions of soldiers fighting for independence. In starts to fall into Hannibal Lechter territory.
I am sure that you would agree that these are serious allegations and you can not reject them lightly. I agree with sentiment of your post that this crime is so horrible that it looks impossible, but this is exactly the reason why we should see this matter all the way through. If anybody would accuse me that I was involved in this kind of thing, I would welcome as thorough investigation as possible. I am sure that you are honest and decent human being and that you accept that anybody who is involved in criminal activities deserves to face the low.
Of course...a totally political statement, just like the report...actually somethin good might come out of this, Thaci has been serving for to long and has become pretty soft and consumed lately...with all this political pressure he has from other political parties he probably will not be able to deal with the negotions properly...maybe Kurti should become a premier ... i wonder what would Serbia fabricate against Kurti...? If Serbia is worried about Kosovo having a noble premier, who could be more appropiate than Kurti? A young idealist former political prisoner of Serbia ... I doubt Kurti would even care to negotiate with Serbia, though...on anything.
The draft of the report is out now - I would ask everyone to read it themselves.
Then imagine yourself as a jury in a court of law - and them imaginge the accused being the same nationaily as you to avoid hatred / prejudice getting in the way of your judgement - do you think this report presents enough evidence to convict someone of this crime??
I certainly do not - I am not denying that this might have happened, and many times where there is smoke there is fire - but currently this reports does not present any concrete evidence apart from what we have already heard before based on some statements from 'anonymous' sources. I have not doubt that Thaci has or had some involvement in criminality, but as currently presented the charges for 'organ removal' are vague at best and the evidence in this report is almost non-existant.
This case should be investigated by unbiased investigators - I am afraid that Dick Marty has previsouly shown himself to be pro-serb and there are definetely anti-albanian connotations in the report.
Eagle, you should ask Thaci where missing bodies of Albanian civilians are. Maybe they were some of the unfortunates that wound up in Fushe Kruje? The KLA murdered their own too, not just Serbs.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible.
====================
Why don't you go and help Thaci or don't you consider yourself to be one of the best surgeons?
Hey, the organs were HARVESTED not transplanted there. I think you will agree there is a difference.
This is Miloshevic lie! No Albanian want Serbs organ! Only organ from friendly state like US of A, Great Britain, now Tuvalu too, soon many more.
(Arsim, 15 December 2010 14:31)
=========================
You would cut out organs from your friends?
K-Albanians were not the recipients of these organs. They were sold to people with money.
Anyway, you would take an organ from a chimp if it mean you could live. Don't be so ridiculous.
drowntheday no, I don't believe there is a Serbian / Albanian translation of the draft report yet.
But there probably will be. God know the EU have enough translators on their books...
I have now read the report in its entirety. Very interesting, even though much of it we suspected already. And I include Kos Albanians in this too. Despite some denials here, I believe in their hearts Albanians know that many, if not all the allegations in the report are true. Its a sad state of affairs but one that needs to be faced, if it is to change. If you don't read anything else then read the last few lines of the report:
'Everyone in Kosovo is aware of what happened and of the current situation, but people do not talk about it, except in private; they have for years been waiting for the truth - the whole truth, rather than the official version - to be laid bare. Our sole aim today is to serve as spokespersons for those men and women from Kosovo, as well as those from Serbia and Albania, who, regardless of their ethnic or religious backgrounds, simply aspire to the truth and to an end to scandalous impunity, with no greater wish than to be able to live in peace.'
On another note I was trying to put myself in the position of EU decision makers. I think the least harmful way to react to this report initially is to put pressure on Albania to do something on this. It will be much more difficult and risky for the internationals to orchestrate change in Kosovo in the short term. We know that Albania wants to join the EU and that it needs EU support in many areas. How this Albanian influence will manifest itself on the Kosovo politic is another question.
I'm not saying this potential approach by the EU is the right or just one, but a likely one alongside others...
Miles, I have stated before that PRN's head is buried somewhere for sure, but it's not sand. In fact, he may be able to see his own kidneys. In any case, the blind denial of the Albanians here is quite amusing. When Marti's proof comes to light, Albanians will not only be known as the world's drug dealers, but also organ-harvesters. More proud moments in Albanian history.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. It is achallenging operation here in the US where we do it under sterile conditions with all the support such as FFR, PRBC, cryoprecipitate and all other conjugated factors. ROFL if kidney transplant it is done that easy we surgreons should not be needed anymore
Une, if you are a surgeon in the USA, then I am the Pope. Transplants were not conducted in the mountains of Albania. Vital organs were removed from unfortunate kidnapped civilians, placed immediately in coolers, and flown to rich customers. Thanks for the chuckle, though. In any case, the Snake is going down. This puts him in the same class as Mengele and Vlad the Impaler. Not even Dr. Frankenstein would do what the Snake is accused of.
and when the report, contains nothing at all whatsoever other than the same identical fiction pieces previously reported and investigated and found lacking, with nothing more than vague hints at "sources" wich as usuall will remain mysteriously unknown. When nothing whatsover will result legally from such a report because fiction is not admissable.
Nikshala this is not a court of law and in the report Marty stresses that that isn't the aim of the report.
I don't agree with you that the report is pro Serbian either. It clearly condemns actions from Serbian security forces and Slobodan Milosevic's control of them.
There is one part of the report that I'd like to address to show how acts of helpfulness can go a long way. I will concede that perhaps Marty gave more credence to information coming from Vukicevic's Special Prosecutor's Office in Serbia (alongside other sources). However, this is due to the fact that the Albanian equivallents whether in Albania itself or Kosovo NGO's, institutions and government did not attempt to help or to be open in any way towards the Council of Europe. In such a situation one must show greater credence to those that do help and show a more open attitude. It obviously didn't do Vukicevic any harm to show Marty that the prosection are processing war crimes committed against Serbs, Albanians, Croats etc. He would likely have told Marty that any light sentences are down to the Serbian judiciary, just as Vukicevic cannot be held responsible for Mladic and Hadzic.
That might have prodded Marty into a more pro Serbian position, but this could have easily prevented if the Kosovo authorities had been open and shared their information with Marty. The fact they didn't do this shows they are either stupid and inexperienced in international diplomacy or that they have something to hide. Marty likely believes the latter.
In the end Serb or Albanian can quote sections 'proving' bias against them.
That doesn't change the fact that we all know that most of what is written there is true, court or not.
Thanks for the link bganon. It made a very interesting reading. I tried to go to the references, but a login window came up. Apparently, the references are available only to COE staff. Hope an investigation will be carried out as soon as possible into this. The report mentions sources, which must now be involved in investigations into these crimes. He claims the sources are insiders of KLA and truck drivers. The report mentions foreign intelligence agencies. That material must be investigated too. I want the link between the claims of the organ removed from Serbs and those houses in Albania proved or disproved beyond any doubt in a court.
To some of the insecure Albanians here, the propaganda and PR benefit Serbia will get out of this is not important as it will change nothing on the ground as regards the status of Kosovo. If such horrible crimes were committed, then they must be investigated and the perpetrators condemned. Will see what comes out of this.
Good luck Serbia in fight for truth!! Albanian terrorist shoul go to prison. My country should withdraw support for this terrorist, mafia pseudostate. Kosovo is province of Republic of Serbia - and all thinking peoples on the world know it.
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
You are right to be glad that organ trafficking is being investigated. It is very likely to have occurred and deserves to be treated extremely seriously. This is true in Kosovo, just as it is true in many other parts of the world. The KLA had a particularly strong opportunity - and quite likely used it.
Even where the west did what you think to be wrong, that does not make what happened in the Balkans right. The west was given strong reason to intervene in Bosnia, and unsurprisingly extended that into Kosovo. The Hague was set up to deal with a lot of wrongs - and it is still the best way currently available of getting some element of justice for some of the significant war crimes that occurred.
In the case of organ trafficking this does need to find its way to a court, so I hope there are finally moves on this. This report should lead to that opportunity.
I wonder when victims of Srebrenica will be able to say they same.
(ivan, 15 December 2010 17:00)
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I wonder when the Dasht-i-Leili massacre will even start being investigated. 8000 Afghan POWs involved in this massacre involving the West and NATO. Check http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/sep/14/afghanistan.lukeharding
Hopefully, with the current momentum we will make some progress to just get an investigation started (10 years after the event).
'We take the allegations seriously but we invite Mr Marty to put forward the evidence,' Maja Kocijancic, spokeswoman for EU foreign policy...
-----
Nuf said, where's the beef Mr. Dick Marti?
Read this about Marty:
"But we are told: "Kosovo is different, he was the victim of abuse on the part of Serbia." I realize that Kosovo is administered by ten years the international community and that after ten years, Kosovo's economy is nonexistent, it became a center of organized crime, drug trafficking, arms trafficking , trafficking in human beings. I note that there is no genuine civil society that is able to run a truly democratic institution, and there are various minorities who live protected by international soldiers.
During those years when Kosovo was under international protectorate, monasteries and Orthodox churches were burned in the total indifference of the international media. Since 1999, 250,000 Serbs have fled Kosovo."
http://www.voltairenet.org/article155903.html
Sounds like Kostunica, doesn't he? He said that a year before he started 'investihgating'
This is indeed a great Victory for Serbia,
No crime will go unpunished!
Serbia caught their own criminals,(Mladic is from Bosnia, and Hadzic is from Croatia remain uncaught) but I dont see Serbia's neighbours catching their own criminals.
Also Milosevic was on Trial but there was NO evidence for his crimes!!!.
Now is the turn for non caught criminals like Thaci to get a trial!!!
Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. (Une)
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy (Marine)
@Une
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
And, if it is true that you are some kind of doctor as @Marine claims, then I must question your degree.
Where did you obtain your Diploma?
If you really are a doctor, then all I can say is that you are either naïve (pretending to be one) or you are just pure medical dilettante.
I fear for you patients.
But something tells me that you are as doctor as I am Angelina Jolie, thus I completely agree with @Marine.
As for Mr. Vekaric, I would like to say that this is not any win for Serbia but hopefully stimulation to push more forward in the direction of Yellow house. Do not allow anyone to stop us in further investigation, even if further nosing and sneaking cost you a life.
And when finally, if ever happen that the truth of Yellow house find its way out and all criminals involved in these monstrous deeds end up behind bars for very long time, then and only then we can say that the Justice and victims have won. Not you, not state of Serbia, not us ordinary people, but Justice and victims.
This is not any competition remember that. Your job is to deal with the war crimes and tit is your duty towards the victims and towards the state you represent. And we, ordinary people will be there to support and appreciate every effort you make in that direction and rejoice all your success.
"USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'. "
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
Exactly. They know him well, for many years. Simply try to find the good old CIA investigations and reports about Thaci. And hasn't there been a nice file with interesting findings about him, created by the German Intelligence service, too? ;-)
"He expressed expectation that the “exceptionally positive” report will launch many investigations into human organs trafficking in Kosovo, and also in Albania, where courts have been "ignoring calls for solving the problem for years"."
I don't have the expectation that investigations in Kosovo will be launched. The persons who were even mentioned in this reports will try to deny everything and to stop the case being solved. Of course there's hope: EULEX is present in Kosovo, and now that the (manipulated) elections are over, they have no reason to further delay all kind of investigations, even against high state officials or presidents of political parties.
B.Vekaric, how much did you pay him, 1 million euro.
A great Serbian PROPAGANDA, Rocky
I heard that Thaci only offered Marti 2 kilos of Hash, so Dick took the better bribe. In any case, looks like the Snake's days are numbered, maybe even Pristina's.
''Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".''
Yeah right, it took 5 years for internationals to intervene in bosna, and when they finally put pressure on beograd, the damage was already done, more than half of country was totally cleansed...by serb's own experience it is quite possible to ethnically cleanse 100 000 serbs in a short time, you know how it happens...espcially now that Rep o Albania has a NATO standart army...only a single Albanian armored battalion is able to take control of Kosovo in less than 3 hours...
Am albanian and i always say, as long as hashim thaci runns Kosovo we are going to have problem! Albanians need to understand that sooner or later we going to face problem!
As an albanian i say SEND THACI TO HAGUE TRIBUNAL
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
dear PRN, i like you! you make the funnies! you write about the disneyland serbia! yes yes you write more. you no pay attention to bad milosheviq media in world that say bad things about mr. thaci. he nice man. what nice hair he have! he smile good with american freinds. these all LIES against him from smely serbs and dick marti. he serb mup you know? bad marti! he not friend of us. we take him to court and win the big moneys!
@Une
‘Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense’..(Une)
- You truly made me laugh out loud :)))!!!What you failed to realise as a ‘doctor’, oh pardon me a ‘surgeon,’ is how limited your scope is.
If you know anything about the Nursing in Western World then you should be aware that there are so many degrees and levels of education in Nursing which certainly can never be described as limited. Surely, it is not as wide as for doctors because the plan and programs differ at some point which is undertandable.
Also, what you failed to understand while trying to underestimate a role of Nurse is the fact that specialised Nurses are not much under doctors with their knowledge, especially when you add experience on it.
But, let me be the one with limited scope as you put it, and tell you that you still have no clues abut the surger-ies.
Maybe you know or heard something about the appendectomy, but surely you know nothing about really complicated surger-ies nor you ever seen it, I can bet on it.
You may want to keep your privacy and that is all right with me,
Perhaps I should keep my privacy as well.
Honestly speaking, I would like to check are you really registered as a doctor, pardon surgeon :) anywhere in US since the registration should be available publicly. At least so is in Finland.
Vicryl 3-0??? Is that best you know about the surgery? Congratulations, you know types of sutures and should prove you are a surgeon???
Anyway, since you wanted to know, I specialized anaesthesia nursing and work independently in OR.
I can tell you more about the intubation and medication, types of anaesthesia, etc, but we should agree that this is not place for it. Perhaps we could go to another forum and discuss medical issues, different illness and surgeries.
And if you are liar it doesn't mean that everyone else is a liar too. I remember in some of your posts you called Mr.Mrty a Liar. Unlike you, he is honest and decent man. At least, you as a 'doctor' should have some decency and respect for human beings. I am afraid you are ready to deny your help (if you are some doctor really) someone you don't like, most probably you would deny help to any Serb.
http://assembly.coe.int/ASP/APFeaturesManager/defaultArtSiteView.asp?ID=964
The full report, absolutely no evidence (just 'we heard',) just rehashes old lines. So in a week it will be forgotten.
Let's for pretend examine the following scenario:
1. Organ harvesting occured
2. Thaci is found guilty and jailed
What do you think will happen in Kosovo? PM Thaci is a hero, and a founding father The Kosovars would quickly become bitter and extreme and Kurti would be elected PM. You guys remember that study that said 80% of Kosovar support unification of the ethnic Albania...well that would shoot up to 100%.
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
You can bet on that.
(KOSO, 16 December 2010 02:51)
=====================
Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
Lets start a new without all these criminals.
(robby, 15 December 2010 23:48)
Who is we? How many people are writing this post? If you are the one writing then shouldn't it be honest you speak for yourself rather than authorize yourself to speak in the name of others.
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
Hey listen to my you are just a nurse I got my Diploma in the US at X university. I did my general Surgery Residency here in Us at X and my trauma fellowship in Maryland at shock trauma center( I amommiting the names for you could easily see my biography at the page of my residency for privacy issues). Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense..
OO I need my 3 0 vicryl now nurse. So please dont insult my learning instead focus on giving me what I need
What do you mean when you say anasthesia scrub nurse?? You give anasthesia or are you a scrub nurse?
Well, personally, I don't think some dude accusing Thaçi, truly or falsely, is a victory for anyone! but from another point of view, I guess why some call it a victory for Serbia. Finally, someone NOT SERB gets accused for war crimes. If that's a victory, serb authorities are very easy to please. If Thaçi is guilty and justice proves that, he should be hanged not jailed. But before getting so high when someone else is accused, serb authorities should catch their own criminals, (i dont think there's need to mention names) who just live comfortably on honest serb citizens taxes. I think that would be a victory for Serbia!
The council of europe represent 47 States and is not relatet to EU. After this report, it should be impossible that Kosovo gets so much support if Thaci remain as prime minister.
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
Albanians (citizens and politicians) rarely share the same opinion. The more you push us Albanians the more we stick together and the stronger we get. Please carry on...
The ''scandalous'' report issued by the European Parliamentary Council rapporteur Dick Marti ''is a text stuffed with slanders and falsehood, which are no more than a recycling of the continual propaganda coming from certain areas of ill-wishers to Kosovo and its citizens'' acting against their plans for freedom and independence through damaging their international image. The evidence contained in the report has been examined ''several times by now, by authoritative institutions of international justice, including the Hague Tribunal, UNMIK and lastly EULEX. In each of these cases it was demonstrated that the accusations in question were unfounded. In Kosovo, the communique' continues, ''horrendous crimes were committed over a period of years,'' climaxing with the war of 1998-1999. But ''the whole world knows who the aggressor was and who the victim''. Attempts to change history and ''put the aggressors and the victims on the same level are immoral, unjust, criminal and are bound to fail''-once again.
My goodness. Paying someone to report a LIE is considered a great victory for Serbia.
Some seem to forget that the EC/EU knows pretty well that Serbia is the huge factory of crimes and lies, and this why all the Serbian government apparatus (and other criminals from other parts of ex-YU) has hugely increased the density of population in the Hague Tribunal.
As per Dick Marty, he only knows how much he obtained in his Swiss accounts to produce a fiction story.
REST ASSURE that this will be ignored due to substantial containment of lies and thus overlooked.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. It is achallenging operation here in the US where we do it under sterile conditions with all the support such as FFR, PRBC, cryoprecipitate and all other conjugated factors. ROFL if kidney transplant it is done that easy we surgreons should not be needed anymore
and when the report, contains nothing at all whatsoever other than the same identical fiction pieces previously reported and investigated and found lacking, with nothing more than vague hints at "sources" wich as usuall will remain mysteriously unknown. When nothing whatsover will result legally from such a report because fiction is not admissable.
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
Hashim Thaci was scanned 1000s of times by the Western powers the before the West was VERY CONFIDENT of him as a serious person to deal with. They supported him because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country.
Serbia, a country that committed genocides last decade, with a number of countries in region accusing it (at ICJ) for the said deed, trying to reverse (with money) the course and direction of war/s, BUT is not going to be sold easily.
There must be several hundreds Dick Marties to come along with PURE FACTS for alleged crimes, not one silly individual paid by Serbian government to do a research with the intention of disturbing the truth. Dick Marty failed.
USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'.
Serbia 'could' have come with even more shocking 'research' about THACI, but they know that anyhow such 'finding' would be useless especially since it would come from a state that did awful crimes cannot accuse others before cleaning itself.
So they chose Dick Marty from a respectable Switzerland do the dirty job. BUT, rest assure that he will fail too.
Nevertheless this is good time for Serbs to smile a bit, while it lasts. You guys forget that there isn't not even a place anymore in the Hague for any new potential criminal BECAUSE the Hague prison is FULLY BOOKED with Serbian Criminals, starting from Serbian top government officials (the entire former Serbian leadership in Serbia, Bosnia and Croatia) to low level Serbian guards (who committed war crimes).
This in fact is nothing new to Serbians. The practices here is something we have known about for a long time, including:
1. The ethnic Albanian leadership are terrorists and criminals.
2. The US, EU and Western governments have been covering up these crimes for a very long time. This is also shown in the CIA reports.
3. Ethnic Albanians are in denial regarding crimes they committed. In general they will deny this ever happening even though organ trading is common in Albania.
4. The NATO court in the Hague is biased against Serbians. Del Ponte was blocked from further investigations into organ harvesting as she was from investigating NATO crimes. This has also been revealed.
Guys, it's all coming out now. Wikileaks and further investigations will expose the nakedness of the emperor. The empire is falling and much of the evilness will be exposed. The nature of the NATO court will be revealed, here is a preview -> http://jurist.org/paperchase/2010/08/icty-orders-independent-investigation-of-witness-intimidation-at-seselj-trial.php
This is great news, not only for Serbians but the whole region. It will help us reconcile and understand who were the real aggressors and criminals in this orgy of violence brought upon us. Let the truth be known.
One more thing, Eagle, it was the KLA that started the wrs in KiM, not the Serbs. I guess you forgot the part when Adem Jashari and his band of cowards was murdering policemen and innocent people in cafes, then running away, to provoke the Serbian authorities? He (Jashari) came to a justified end, it looks like Thaci will too.
Nikshala this is not a court of law and in the report Marty stresses that that isn't the aim of the report.
I don't agree with you that the report is pro Serbian either. It clearly condemns actions from Serbian security forces and Slobodan Milosevic's control of them.
There is one part of the report that I'd like to address to show how acts of helpfulness can go a long way. I will concede that perhaps Marty gave more credence to information coming from Vukicevic's Special Prosecutor's Office in Serbia (alongside other sources). However, this is due to the fact that the Albanian equivallents whether in Albania itself or Kosovo NGO's, institutions and government did not attempt to help or to be open in any way towards the Council of Europe. In such a situation one must show greater credence to those that do help and show a more open attitude. It obviously didn't do Vukicevic any harm to show Marty that the prosection are processing war crimes committed against Serbs, Albanians, Croats etc. He would likely have told Marty that any light sentences are down to the Serbian judiciary, just as Vukicevic cannot be held responsible for Mladic and Hadzic.
That might have prodded Marty into a more pro Serbian position, but this could have easily prevented if the Kosovo authorities had been open and shared their information with Marty. The fact they didn't do this shows they are either stupid and inexperienced in international diplomacy or that they have something to hide. Marty likely believes the latter.
In the end Serb or Albanian can quote sections 'proving' bias against them.
That doesn't change the fact that we all know that most of what is written there is true, court or not.
http://assembly.coe.int/ASP/APFeaturesManager/defaultArtSiteView.asp?ID=964
The full report, absolutely no evidence (just 'we heard',) just rehashes old lines. So in a week it will be forgotten.
I think a throughouh investigation by unbiased investigators is required to put this issue to rest. If true, as an albanian, I hope that all responsible will be brought to justice.
The irony, is that most serbs are cheering here hoping that this will lead to the toppling of Thaci & Co goverment - and you know what - so do I because I have no doubt he is corrupt and has criminal connections. Then once this serb 'wish' is realised, hopefully we will have a clean & independent from foreign influence goverment that cannot be blackmailed or threatend with corruption cases. This goverement will stand up to Serbia and weak EU politicians only interested in relative stability and will revise the laws based on the wish of the majority and democracy.
The irony is that in my opinion, Thaci is the best Kosovan primeminister that Serbia could currently hope for because he is one who will compromise further and sell north of Kosovo just so that he can remain in power / avoid prosecutions. And he is incompetent.
A note to hypocrits: even if true, this does not undermine or match up to the crimes commited by Serbia which everyone is aware of.
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
You are right to be glad that organ trafficking is being investigated. It is very likely to have occurred and deserves to be treated extremely seriously. This is true in Kosovo, just as it is true in many other parts of the world. The KLA had a particularly strong opportunity - and quite likely used it.
Even where the west did what you think to be wrong, that does not make what happened in the Balkans right. The west was given strong reason to intervene in Bosnia, and unsurprisingly extended that into Kosovo. The Hague was set up to deal with a lot of wrongs - and it is still the best way currently available of getting some element of justice for some of the significant war crimes that occurred.
In the case of organ trafficking this does need to find its way to a court, so I hope there are finally moves on this. This report should lead to that opportunity.
Your attempts at self justification are not very convincing. There were a lot of wicked things that were the responsibility of people and governments within the Balkans. Blaming everyone else may make you feel a bit better, but it is actually a lack of acknowledgement of the locally originated wrongs.
(Bob, 15 December 2010 13:15)
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Bob, please do some research. Lots of wicked things happened between the people but it was the West that opened the gates to hell.
Without going into too much detail, it started in Croatia with Germany and the Vatican prematurely recognising Croatia. No negotiations, no compromises just recognition, which well... obviously ended up in war.
In BiH, the idea was to avoid war so they came up with the Cutileiro plan (or Lisbon agreement) which everyone signed and war was avoided until Izetbegovic reneged after advice from the US - who said he can have it all. In the end and after more than 100,000 deaths Dayton gave the Muslims less.
And what about Kosovo? Well, all ethnic Albanians were firmly in the province while Serbia was dealing with terrorists. Then came the ultimatum of the Rambouillet Agreement, which basically said accept Kosovo independence and allow NATO to occupy all of Yugoslavia (Serbia + Montenegro) or we'll bomb! I mean, who in their right mind would accept that?
Sorry to say, it was undoubtedly the West that opened the gates to hell.
Eagle, you should ask Thaci where missing bodies of Albanian civilians are. Maybe they were some of the unfortunates that wound up in Fushe Kruje? The KLA murdered their own too, not just Serbs.
Of course...a totally political statement, just like the report...actually somethin good might come out of this, Thaci has been serving for to long and has become pretty soft and consumed lately...with all this political pressure he has from other political parties he probably will not be able to deal with the negotions properly...maybe Kurti should become a premier ... i wonder what would Serbia fabricate against Kurti...? If Serbia is worried about Kosovo having a noble premier, who could be more appropiate than Kurti? A young idealist former political prisoner of Serbia ... I doubt Kurti would even care to negotiate with Serbia, though...on anything.
I am really wondering about how long, how stubbornly and how helplessly our dear k-albanian friends are trying to deny what is already common knowledge, it seems.
do they not feel ashamed at all? do they not feel the need to condemn these atrocities against both, Serbs and Albanians together?
some Albanians are so deeply stuck in their ugly,tiny little world of anti-serb hatred that they do not even realize when they are making complete fools of themselves...
The draft of the report is out now - I would ask everyone to read it themselves.
Then imagine yourself as a jury in a court of law - and them imaginge the accused being the same nationaily as you to avoid hatred / prejudice getting in the way of your judgement - do you think this report presents enough evidence to convict someone of this crime??
I certainly do not - I am not denying that this might have happened, and many times where there is smoke there is fire - but currently this reports does not present any concrete evidence apart from what we have already heard before based on some statements from 'anonymous' sources. I have not doubt that Thaci has or had some involvement in criminality, but as currently presented the charges for 'organ removal' are vague at best and the evidence in this report is almost non-existant.
This case should be investigated by unbiased investigators - I am afraid that Dick Marty has previsouly shown himself to be pro-serb and there are definetely anti-albanian connotations in the report.
With respect to Kos Albanian posters but you look as if you are clutching at straws.
To any internationals hearing that Marty was bribed, alongside the BBC, Guardian, the Times, Reuters, the Independent, well nobody will take it seriously.
On the other hand Serbs always spoke about William Walker and look at him today...
Anyway take a look at the first draft of the report:
Actually, thinking about it a little more, if the wetern media do start front paging this news, then it will be a clear indication that the western elites have switched sides and are now mobilising their media against Thaci, just as they did against Milosevic. Whether the tide has shifted or not what remains constant is that the truth does not matter. Serbs and Albanians like many other small nations are just pawns in a bigger game. Today the Albanians begin their walk on the long road of awareness. Come on PRN start learning.
Brotherhood and unity is the only way forward. Now who said that?
This is indeed a great Victory for Serbia,
No crime will go unpunished!
Serbia caught their own criminals,(Mladic is from Bosnia, and Hadzic is from Croatia remain uncaught) but I dont see Serbia's neighbours catching their own criminals.
Also Milosevic was on Trial but there was NO evidence for his crimes!!!.
Now is the turn for non caught criminals like Thaci to get a trial!!!
Hey PRN, I'm looking forward to Thursday when they start pulling your head out of the sand. It must be so far down by now that you could probably have a chat with some Chilean miners.
It will be interesting to see how the western media ignore this story and others that threaten to disrupt the machine- like voting fraud... the machine which is still working perfectly, chewing up human life for profit in Iraq and Afganistan, and telling fairytales to their people. Go back to sleep everyone next stop Iran.
This is Miloshevic lie! No Albanian want Serbs organ! Only organ from friendly state like US of A, Great Britain, now Tuvalu too, soon many more.
(Arsim, 15 December 2010 14:31)
=========================
You would cut out organs from your friends?
K-Albanians were not the recipients of these organs. They were sold to people with money.
Anyway, you would take an organ from a chimp if it mean you could live. Don't be so ridiculous.
This is an international scandal of epic proportions. I agree with the posters here who say that comments like a great victory for Serbia are wholly inappropriate. It will be a great victory for HUMANITY when the perpetrators of this trade be brought to justice and anyone who knowingly ignored it must also be held to account including those in the Western powers, no matter how high in the hierarchy they are.
If i were in the position of Thaci, I'd stop any kind of dialogue with Serbia till the truth comes out. The accusators of Thaci MUST PROVE their allegations or they'll have serious trouble in the future. At the end well see that all these fabrications will returned as a BOOMERANG to Serbia. Before the battle have started the Serbs are claiming victory. You've done the same thing in the past, an example was in the case of the ICTY. We saw who the real winners were. And remember one thing: "He who laughs last, laughs best."
You are wrong, Nikshala, if the KLA murdered civilians, not only Serbs but their own Albanians too, and removed their vital organs for profit, this out does anything that any Serbian soldier or paramilitary did anywhere in the Balkans. These accusations by Dick Marti against Thaci and his KLA group is fiendish, sub-human behavior, and not the actions of soldiers fighting for independence. In starts to fall into Hannibal Lechter territory.
@ miles - Sadly I think you are right, but hope through quickly fading rose-tinted lenses that at last some media coverage will be given which is fair.
But it does strike me that this story has got more coverage than I would have expected, and I think that for some devious reason its exposure may actually suit 'those that be' at the moment.
'We take the allegations seriously but we invite Mr Marty to put forward the evidence,' Maja Kocijancic, spokeswoman for EU foreign policy...
-----
Nuf said, where's the beef Mr. Dick Marti?
Read this about Marty:
"But we are told: "Kosovo is different, he was the victim of abuse on the part of Serbia." I realize that Kosovo is administered by ten years the international community and that after ten years, Kosovo's economy is nonexistent, it became a center of organized crime, drug trafficking, arms trafficking , trafficking in human beings. I note that there is no genuine civil society that is able to run a truly democratic institution, and there are various minorities who live protected by international soldiers.
During those years when Kosovo was under international protectorate, monasteries and Orthodox churches were burned in the total indifference of the international media. Since 1999, 250,000 Serbs have fled Kosovo."
http://www.voltairenet.org/article155903.html
Sounds like Kostunica, doesn't he? He said that a year before he started 'investihgating'
Remains to be seen what impact this will have on totalitarian western media. In the mean time, from one monster to another, Hash owed many thanks to one of his benefactors, described here:
http://www.counterpunch.org/johnstone12152010.html
Une, if you are a surgeon in the USA, then I am the Pope. Transplants were not conducted in the mountains of Albania. Vital organs were removed from unfortunate kidnapped civilians, placed immediately in coolers, and flown to rich customers. Thanks for the chuckle, though. In any case, the Snake is going down. This puts him in the same class as Mengele and Vlad the Impaler. Not even Dr. Frankenstein would do what the Snake is accused of.
Miles, I have stated before that PRN's head is buried somewhere for sure, but it's not sand. In fact, he may be able to see his own kidneys. In any case, the blind denial of the Albanians here is quite amusing. When Marti's proof comes to light, Albanians will not only be known as the world's drug dealers, but also organ-harvesters. More proud moments in Albanian history.
"He expressed expectation that the “exceptionally positive” report will launch many investigations into human organs trafficking in Kosovo, and also in Albania, where courts have been "ignoring calls for solving the problem for years"."
I don't have the expectation that investigations in Kosovo will be launched. The persons who were even mentioned in this reports will try to deny everything and to stop the case being solved. Of course there's hope: EULEX is present in Kosovo, and now that the (manipulated) elections are over, they have no reason to further delay all kind of investigations, even against high state officials or presidents of political parties.
B.Vekaric, how much did you pay him, 1 million euro.
A great Serbian PROPAGANDA, Rocky
I heard that Thaci only offered Marti 2 kilos of Hash, so Dick took the better bribe. In any case, looks like the Snake's days are numbered, maybe even Pristina's.
If I was Thaci I would just hire the best transplant surgeons to come and visit the are. Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible.
====================
Why don't you go and help Thaci or don't you consider yourself to be one of the best surgeons?
Hey, the organs were HARVESTED not transplanted there. I think you will agree there is a difference.
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
Hey listen to my you are just a nurse I got my Diploma in the US at X university. I did my general Surgery Residency here in Us at X and my trauma fellowship in Maryland at shock trauma center( I amommiting the names for you could easily see my biography at the page of my residency for privacy issues). Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense..
OO I need my 3 0 vicryl now nurse. So please dont insult my learning instead focus on giving me what I need
What do you mean when you say anasthesia scrub nurse?? You give anasthesia or are you a scrub nurse?
PRN says..."They supported him (Thaci) because they knew he was clean fighter who fought for liberation of his country."
I think you should see a doctor, PRN, so you can get a medication called Aricept. The pill will help you to remember better, think clearly and improve your communication.
The real "Snake Thaci"
http://dalje.com/en-world/who-is-hashim-snake-thaci/125467
Illegal harvesting of organs is a well known problem throughout the world and brings in BIG profits.
What is really disgusting is that it often takes advantage of the most vulnerable the poorest of the poor, illiterate, prisoners and refugees.
Heck, illegal harvesting of human organs can even help fund wars!
I wonder when victims of Srebrenica will be able to say they same.
(ivan, 15 December 2010 17:00)
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I wonder when the Dasht-i-Leili massacre will even start being investigated. 8000 Afghan POWs involved in this massacre involving the West and NATO. Check http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/sep/14/afghanistan.lukeharding
Hopefully, with the current momentum we will make some progress to just get an investigation started (10 years after the event).
Good luck Serbia in fight for truth!! Albanian terrorist shoul go to prison. My country should withdraw support for this terrorist, mafia pseudostate. Kosovo is province of Republic of Serbia - and all thinking peoples on the world know it.
Let's for pretend examine the following scenario:
1. Organ harvesting occured
2. Thaci is found guilty and jailed
What do you think will happen in Kosovo? PM Thaci is a hero, and a founding father The Kosovars would quickly become bitter and extreme and Kurti would be elected PM. You guys remember that study that said 80% of Kosovar support unification of the ethnic Albania...well that would shoot up to 100%.
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
Une ...
Why do you raise the idea that organ harvesting can only be performed in some ivory tower institution and not some third world region?
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy. Less probably. At least they get paid to pretend. What's in it for you?
I am sure that you would agree that these are serious allegations and you can not reject them lightly. I agree with sentiment of your post that this crime is so horrible that it looks impossible, but this is exactly the reason why we should see this matter all the way through. If anybody would accuse me that I was involved in this kind of thing, I would welcome as thorough investigation as possible. I am sure that you are honest and decent human being and that you accept that anybody who is involved in criminal activities deserves to face the low.
drowntheday no, I don't believe there is a Serbian / Albanian translation of the draft report yet.
But there probably will be. God know the EU have enough translators on their books...
I have now read the report in its entirety. Very interesting, even though much of it we suspected already. And I include Kos Albanians in this too. Despite some denials here, I believe in their hearts Albanians know that many, if not all the allegations in the report are true. Its a sad state of affairs but one that needs to be faced, if it is to change. If you don't read anything else then read the last few lines of the report:
'Everyone in Kosovo is aware of what happened and of the current situation, but people do not talk about it, except in private; they have for years been waiting for the truth - the whole truth, rather than the official version - to be laid bare. Our sole aim today is to serve as spokespersons for those men and women from Kosovo, as well as those from Serbia and Albania, who, regardless of their ethnic or religious backgrounds, simply aspire to the truth and to an end to scandalous impunity, with no greater wish than to be able to live in peace.'
On another note I was trying to put myself in the position of EU decision makers. I think the least harmful way to react to this report initially is to put pressure on Albania to do something on this. It will be much more difficult and risky for the internationals to orchestrate change in Kosovo in the short term. We know that Albania wants to join the EU and that it needs EU support in many areas. How this Albanian influence will manifest itself on the Kosovo politic is another question.
I'm not saying this potential approach by the EU is the right or just one, but a likely one alongside others...
"USA, UK, Germnay, France, Italy know FAR BETTER Thaci's biography than small Dick's 'findings'. "
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
Exactly. They know him well, for many years. Simply try to find the good old CIA investigations and reports about Thaci. And hasn't there been a nice file with interesting findings about him, created by the German Intelligence service, too? ;-)
@Une
‘Anywyas what you as a nurse with your limited scope fail to realise is this..
I . In you limited nursing education you only see what is given to you not the planining and the smarts that go along with it. WHile I will admint that the procurment of the organs could potentially be done I still think it is a tale and it does not make sense’..(Une)
- You truly made me laugh out loud :)))!!!What you failed to realise as a ‘doctor’, oh pardon me a ‘surgeon,’ is how limited your scope is.
If you know anything about the Nursing in Western World then you should be aware that there are so many degrees and levels of education in Nursing which certainly can never be described as limited. Surely, it is not as wide as for doctors because the plan and programs differ at some point which is undertandable.
Also, what you failed to understand while trying to underestimate a role of Nurse is the fact that specialised Nurses are not much under doctors with their knowledge, especially when you add experience on it.
But, let me be the one with limited scope as you put it, and tell you that you still have no clues abut the surger-ies.
Maybe you know or heard something about the appendectomy, but surely you know nothing about really complicated surger-ies nor you ever seen it, I can bet on it.
You may want to keep your privacy and that is all right with me,
Perhaps I should keep my privacy as well.
Honestly speaking, I would like to check are you really registered as a doctor, pardon surgeon :) anywhere in US since the registration should be available publicly. At least so is in Finland.
Vicryl 3-0??? Is that best you know about the surgery? Congratulations, you know types of sutures and should prove you are a surgeon???
Anyway, since you wanted to know, I specialized anaesthesia nursing and work independently in OR.
I can tell you more about the intubation and medication, types of anaesthesia, etc, but we should agree that this is not place for it. Perhaps we could go to another forum and discuss medical issues, different illness and surgeries.
And if you are liar it doesn't mean that everyone else is a liar too. I remember in some of your posts you called Mr.Mrty a Liar. Unlike you, he is honest and decent man. At least, you as a 'doctor' should have some decency and respect for human beings. I am afraid you are ready to deny your help (if you are some doctor really) someone you don't like, most probably you would deny help to any Serb.
The council of europe represent 47 States and is not relatet to EU. After this report, it should be impossible that Kosovo gets so much support if Thaci remain as prime minister.
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
I again notice some funny comments that are to comic that are entertain us.
(PRN, 15 December 2010 15:37)
dear PRN, i like you! you make the funnies! you write about the disneyland serbia! yes yes you write more. you no pay attention to bad milosheviq media in world that say bad things about mr. thaci. he nice man. what nice hair he have! he smile good with american freinds. these all LIES against him from smely serbs and dick marti. he serb mup you know? bad marti! he not friend of us. we take him to court and win the big moneys!
''Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".''
Yeah right, it took 5 years for internationals to intervene in bosna, and when they finally put pressure on beograd, the damage was already done, more than half of country was totally cleansed...by serb's own experience it is quite possible to ethnically cleanse 100 000 serbs in a short time, you know how it happens...espcially now that Rep o Albania has a NATO standart army...only a single Albanian armored battalion is able to take control of Kosovo in less than 3 hours...
We all believe these accusations are possibly and if we are honest to ourself, we know its true.
Lets start a new without all these criminals.
(robby, 15 December 2010 23:48)
Who is we? How many people are writing this post? If you are the one writing then shouldn't it be honest you speak for yourself rather than authorize yourself to speak in the name of others.
Than you will understand that transplanting an organ in the middle of mountainus Albania is immposible. (Une)
You implied you are a surgeon but I doubt you have any more medical experience than the actors from er or gray's anatomy (Marine)
@Une
As an anaesthesia and scrub Registered Nurse I assure you that the organ extraction can be done in any conditions and in any place as long as the surgical field is sterile. If you know anything about the surgery then you should know that is pretty much easy to provide and ensure sterile filed nowadays. Perhaps you did not read the report or did not understand that the organs were transported to those destinations where the organ was needed for rich clients. Now, shall we agree that the transport is not big deal as long as the organs are kept under strict conditions. I am sure that was easiest part!
This only means that the actual transplant surgeries did not take place in Albanian mountains but organ removal. Hope that you know the difference.
Now, since you obviously have no clues about the surgery I will tell you that the most complicated surgeries can be done anywhere, even under the tent. All you need is skilled medical staff, especially anaesthesiologist and surgeon. Does surgery in war times and in war fields mean anything to you?
I doubt, otherwise you wouldn’t make such comment.
And, if it is true that you are some kind of doctor as @Marine claims, then I must question your degree.
Where did you obtain your Diploma?
If you really are a doctor, then all I can say is that you are either naïve (pretending to be one) or you are just pure medical dilettante.
I fear for you patients.
But something tells me that you are as doctor as I am Angelina Jolie, thus I completely agree with @Marine.
As for Mr. Vekaric, I would like to say that this is not any win for Serbia but hopefully stimulation to push more forward in the direction of Yellow house. Do not allow anyone to stop us in further investigation, even if further nosing and sneaking cost you a life.
And when finally, if ever happen that the truth of Yellow house find its way out and all criminals involved in these monstrous deeds end up behind bars for very long time, then and only then we can say that the Justice and victims have won. Not you, not state of Serbia, not us ordinary people, but Justice and victims.
This is not any competition remember that. Your job is to deal with the war crimes and tit is your duty towards the victims and towards the state you represent. And we, ordinary people will be there to support and appreciate every effort you make in that direction and rejoice all your success.
With Kurti in power, I can assure you that he will cleanse Kosovo of serbs.
You can bet on that.
(KOSO, 16 December 2010 02:51)
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Let's hope he attempt it. That would mean a slap in the face of all western countries who declared how multi ethnic and tolerant "Kosova" is. Do you honestly think they would ever allow you to show publicly that it is not?
They would turn on you before you had a chance to chant "Kosova, Kosova".
Thanks for the link bganon. It made a very interesting reading. I tried to go to the references, but a login window came up. Apparently, the references are available only to COE staff. Hope an investigation will be carried out as soon as possible into this. The report mentions sources, which must now be involved in investigations into these crimes. He claims the sources are insiders of KLA and truck drivers. The report mentions foreign intelligence agencies. That material must be investigated too. I want the link between the claims of the organ removed from Serbs and those houses in Albania proved or disproved beyond any doubt in a court.
To some of the insecure Albanians here, the propaganda and PR benefit Serbia will get out of this is not important as it will change nothing on the ground as regards the status of Kosovo. If such horrible crimes were committed, then they must be investigated and the perpetrators condemned. Will see what comes out of this.
Well, personally, I don't think some dude accusing Thaçi, truly or falsely, is a victory for anyone! but from another point of view, I guess why some call it a victory for Serbia. Finally, someone NOT SERB gets accused for war crimes. If that's a victory, serb authorities are very easy to please. If Thaçi is guilty and justice proves that, he should be hanged not jailed. But before getting so high when someone else is accused, serb authorities should catch their own criminals, (i dont think there's need to mention names) who just live comfortably on honest serb citizens taxes. I think that would be a victory for Serbia!
Am albanian and i always say, as long as hashim thaci runns Kosovo we are going to have problem! Albanians need to understand that sooner or later we going to face problem!
As an albanian i say SEND THACI TO HAGUE TRIBUNAL
The ''scandalous'' report issued by the European Parliamentary Council rapporteur Dick Marti ''is a text stuffed with slanders and falsehood, which are no more than a recycling of the continual propaganda coming from certain areas of ill-wishers to Kosovo and its citizens'' acting against their plans for freedom and independence through damaging their international image. The evidence contained in the report has been examined ''several times by now, by authoritative institutions of international justice, including the Hague Tribunal, UNMIK and lastly EULEX. In each of these cases it was demonstrated that the accusations in question were unfounded. In Kosovo, the communique' continues, ''horrendous crimes were committed over a period of years,'' climaxing with the war of 1998-1999. But ''the whole world knows who the aggressor was and who the victim''. Attempts to change history and ''put the aggressors and the victims on the same level are immoral, unjust, criminal and are bound to fail''-once again.
Albanians (citizens and politicians) rarely share the same opinion. The more you push us Albanians the more we stick together and the stronger we get. Please carry on...
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