"Good climate for EU progress"

""1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process"" -- Poland had several parties opposed.

Luigi!

Yes, i totally agree with your post. However, Serbia is the only European country that fought against NATO and then walked away with 98% percent of it's military capabilities.

Globally, NATO has been a failure and ineffective. Had Milosevic not surrendered and waited a few more days, NATO would have capitulated to Serbia's terms.

Therefore, why would Serbia want to join NATO.

I believe that Serbia's EU aspirations are totally moot, in that Serbia will never be allowed to join.

For example let's look at european sports. Serbia is an adversary and totally dominates it's european neighbours. How can a small country like Serbia cause so much interest?

I believe the Serbian people are leaders and are a threat to the west...

Indeed, give them Sandžak & Vojvodina too, join NATO and let them transform Serbia to a military bunker and a torture-gulag and the "climate" will be tropical in terms of abandon our nation and sovereignity as we know it....

When i read about that self-humiltationg letter to Bush he wrote http://original.antiwar.com/malic/2005/09/29/laughable-sycophancy/, i knew what to expect from him and his regime.

Of course there is a very favorable climate in the EU for Serbia's candidacy!

All that sucking up is bound to get you some favours!

Tadic and his cronies have sold the soul of Serbia for a bag of gold!
They have given away Serbias holy land and have been deceiving the Serbian people!

Congratulations!

Just a few facts about the 'enormous funds' available from the EU, because this is utterly misleading in other words, a lie). In the case of Romania, as of August 2010:

- 2,18 bn Euro arrived in the country (less than 7% of the total amount 'available' to the country until 2013)

- 4,53 bn Euro were paid by the country to the budget of the EU (around 45% to be paid as contribution for the interval 2007 - 2013)

In short, the net contribution of the country to the EU budget to date is of 2,35 bn Euro (which is around one quarter of the total contraction of the economy in 2009). For those who don't understand: we pay more to the EU than we receive for 'development'.

Interestingly enough, the amount equivalent to the net contribution returned to the country over the last year and a half in the form of a loan 'granted' by the European Commission with an interest based on Euribor rate (which is continuously increasing).

For the remainder of the period until 2013, according to projections and current absorption rates, Romania will receive a maximum of 2 bn Euro from the EU and will pay anouth 5,5 bn Euro as contribution (tribute?).

These are facts that anyone can check and something to keep in mind for those of you euro-enthusiasts.

Sorry to say but the Balkans will be a difficult pill to swallow for the EU. I can't see any chance of Serbia entering for at least another 10 years and by then the world will be a completely different place - with China being the dominant world power.

As wealth, power and influence shifts eastwards the fault lines of Europe, being the Balkans, will begin to tremble. That's why we need to settle unresolved issues now and in a fair manner otherwise these problems will resurface at another point, where it's certain Serbia will have the upper hand.

In a global environment, it's about the survival of the fittest, productivity and competitiveness. That's why China is way ahead of the rest. Who is willing to be as productive for such a small pay? The fat cats of the west, with big pay cheques and minimal productivity are all coming to an end my friends.

So the rush is on to get the Balkans into Euro-Atlantic structures but this is way too complicated for a bunch of lazy eurocrats to achieve. When the time is ripe, change will occur. The trend is already in Serbia's favour as the velvet revolutions begin to reverse.

Tadic and his cronies have sold the soul of Serbia for a bag of gold!
(Predrag, 15 September 2010 12:02)
--
We have been through it before and that's why there are many parallels between Tadić's regime and that of Nedić during WWII. Read this http://tinyurl.com/33zrfqz and be amazed at how history is repeating. This will come to an end sooner or later as the cycle revolves. I can see the west and Germany making the same old mistakes. They haven't learnt their lesson.

Another benefit of EU membership is that an EU Member State can adopt the Euro once it meets the conditions.
(Mircea, 15 September 2010 11:28)
--
I think the greatest benefit of EU membership is that you can easily become a non-member. Exiting the union is a simple step that was introduced as part of the Lisbon treaty.

How long before Romania takes advantage of this benefit? Who will be first, Hungary or Romania? We will see in 10 years time.

A part from all the problems equals to other countries (laws,economy and so on )+Kosovo+mladic, there are specific hurdles for Serbia in his european integration that are not discussed much here they are:
1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process
2)Not all parties have reached a deal with an european parliament group, never has happened before in the enlargement process
3)Serbia is not a Nato member or has a full peace agreement with the alliance , never has happened before in the enlargement process
So how can be a fast trak ?
(Luigi, 15 September 2010 11:03)

Luigi, I think you are a little pessimistic in your comments.

1) The ruling coalition wants EU membership. Even the main opposition party SNS wants it too. DSS are lukewarm but not openly hostile. That leaves the Radicals and they are fast becoming irrelevant

2) Those deals will happen soon

3) Who needs NATO? NATO membership is not a pre requsite into joining the EU. For example Ireland is not a NATO country and we have been in the EU since 1973.

Regarding the Kosovo-Mladic issues, these will be ironed out in time. Mladic will eventually be apprehended and held accountable for his crimes and talks between Belgrade and Pristina are scheduled to begin at the end of this year in what many are hoping to resolve the final status of the province and provide lasting peace and stability.

Once Serbia overcomes these hurdles, it's full steam ahead.

A part from all the problems equals to other countries (laws,economy and so on )+Kosovo+mladic, there are specific hurdles for Serbia in his european integration that are not discussed much here they are:
1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process
2)Not all parties have reached a deal with an european parliament group, never has happened before in the enlargement process
3)Serbia is not a Nato member or has a full peace agreement with the alliance , never has happened before in the enlargement process
So how can be a fast trak ?

Luigi there is they moved it from 5th drawer to 3rd it will be a long long time to get things all done.

Kosovo and Serbia mite be in a hurry to solve the issue but how is any Eu country bothered if its done in 2011 or 2013.

They have bigger fish to fry and not pressed by anyone.

So Serbia has ways to go and elections are not until 2012

Luigi,

Not a single one of your 3 points holds any water. What is your motive to invent all these false claims?

What Canadian Serb wrote (about Serbs as leaders) reminds me of watching Milosevic era television in Belgrade: professors and academics in TV studio discussing about the intellectual superiority of Serbs, compared to any other nation on earth. Seeing that I first thought it's a Serbian Monty Python show! But no, it was for real. And already next day some of my neighbours repeated the claims presented in TV...

Father of my son's classmate gave me a two hour lecture about facts why Serbian nation is the most potential nation...

Please! Why to harm yourself with your insane claims?

“The EU membership itself brings enormous funds, which in Serbia's case would be about EUR 2bn a year in grants.

The funds that an EU Member State receives is one of the benefits of joining the EU.

Another benefit is that an EU Member State can join the Schengen Area.

My country, Romania, will join the Schengen Area on 27 March 2011.

Another benefit of EU membership is that an EU Member State can adopt the Euro once it meets the conditions.

@Kujon
No polish party was openly against ..there were and there are some EURO-skeptics over "broader Eu integration" but is the same also here in Italy (lega nord)AND IN ALL Eu countries for what i read the situation in Serbia is a bit different (DSS has no agreement in Eu but has in Russia with Edinaia Russia)
@Nial o'doherty
Ireland has a full peace agreement with Nato and allow Nato's airplanes to fly over his territory for example ...

Zoran,

I think that all the countries of the Western Balkans will join the EU in the future.

The countries of the Western Balkans have no alternative to the EU.

I agree with you that Serbia has no chance of joining the EU before 2020.

the entire EU structure is a fraud-everybody knows this. there are a few nations within the EU which will benefit (germany in particular) but the rest will see no long term benefits. what they will learn within a few years is just how much of thier national independence and economic independence they will lose and how much resentment will arise amongst the perpective populaces when foreign commisars begin dictating all aspects of national life. the economic benefits of the union are even more bleak - unless you consider gordon to be a fair minded, long sighted economic genius. the bubble has burst

as for NATO memebership-thats laughable! once again nobody but a very few nations (US in particular) will find any positive aspects in belonging to the outdated military alliance. NATO's corpse already lies in the deserts of afghanistan-and a five day war in georgia proved NATO to be mostly bluff and bluster.

the future for serbia is a free and independent serbia-with its own manufacturing base, a truly free media not owned and manipulated by the neo-lib beurocrats of the eu.what possible benefit can the serbs find in once again being under the same roof as croatia, slovenia - or even worse - albania. the age of artificial states and superalliances will fade into history with yugoslavia and the soviet union.

serbia has its own great potential, an educated capable work force, resilience in the face of unimaginable odds and vast foes, and we have many, many great friends in the world whos economies (unlike the economies of most of our western enemies) would be perfectly suited to equitable and fair trade.

Mr Tadic sees nothing beyond the EU because he has made so many personal promises and gained so much personal wealth from the eurocrats that he cant turn his back on them-or else hell end up like that other CIA stooge milosevic in the docket in a cold norther city. Milosevic was promised all of Yugoaslavia, he was not a serb patriot but wanted to be the next tito----when his latent serbian nationalism manifested itself in the form of a serb flag tie it was to late---he was at the hague. Tadic has been promised a place underneath the EU table and a few scraps and only after many, many more years-but he cant change course now. Just a few days before he capitulated at the UN, his western friends made some very serious threats towards Tadic if he didnt do what his friends wanted him to-he did what his friends wanted perfectly. Tadics' friends are serbias greatest enemies.

serbia needs to be patient and stay tough for the remainder of the Tadic term. Serbia also needs a real party-one that will not be hopping to washington every few weeks for "advice" wink, wink------we need a party that will make regular trips to moscow, beijing, delhi, and many other places where live true friends whos economies are on the rise-not decling (as is much of europe and certainly the states)

cccc / kosovo=serbia / 4ever

...draws parallels with the Serbian government under Nedic, led by another war veteran.
(Jugoslavija, 15 September 2010 21:13)
--
Nedic and Tadic are both puppet governments led by Germany and their "axis" partners.

Both were/are here apparently to save Serbia. One from Ustasha control and the other from isolation.

The parallels are pretty obvious. Destroy Yugoslavia and make Serbia as small and weak as possible. Install puppet governments to do as Germany and "axis" partners say.

Serbia was pretty small under German occupation. It consisted of Northern Kosovo, Central Serbia and Banat (Vojvodina). Sounds familiar?

The old plan that failed during WWII is revisted. It will fail once again as the cycle repeats. Yin and Yang.

RE:
We have been through it before and that's why there are many parallels between Tadić's regime and that of Nedić during WWII. Read this [link] and be amazed at how history is repeating. This will come to an end sooner or later as the cycle revolves. I can see the west and Germany making the same old mistakes. They haven't learnt their lesson.
(Zoran, 15 September 2010 13:30)

There is absolutely no parallel between the Milan Nedic government during WWII-1941-1944. This government was formed as the National Salvation Government headed by General Nedic who fought with distinguishment in both Balkan wars as well as WWI under Field Marshal Putnik. General Nedic saved the Serbian nation as Germany was considering allowing the Nazi Ustasha regime to control central Serbia which would have meant the expansion of the genocide perpotrated by the Ustasha regime led by Ante Pavelic.

General Milan Nedic never wanted the job, but he did it to save the Serbian people from certain anniliation.

The Vichy government in France led by Marshal Petain, another WWI heroe draws parallels with the Serbian government under Nedic, led by another war veteran.

"Globally, NATO has been a failure and ineffective. Had Milosevic not surrendered and waited a few more days, NATO would have capitulated to Serbia's terms."

What have you been reading and where were you in 1999? Haven't we learned that rewriting history does not help us solve our problems?

The old plan that failed during WWII is revisted. It will fail once again as the cycle repeats. Yin and Yang.
(Zoran, 16 September 2010 14:17)

Prince Pavle signed a non-agression pact with Nazi Germany in 1939 which was a good pact. It never infringed on the sovereignty of Yugoslavia, the only stipulation was to occasionally allow transfers of Nazi Troops through Serbia. There was no "plan" by Germany to break up Yugoslavia in 1941.

General Simovic with the help of British Intelligence overthrew Prince Paul which in hindsight was a grave mistake. At that point in time, Yugoslavia hammered out a deal with the Croatian Peasant Party leader Macek for a loose confederation.

Yugoslavia was invaded and destroyed by Germany due to poor policy decisions from the Serbian opposition and military leadership. That is one similarily in today's Serbia, lack of vision and leadership.

“The EU membership itself brings enormous funds, which in Serbia's case would be about EUR 2bn a year in grants.

The funds that an EU Member State receives is one of the benefits of joining the EU.

Another benefit is that an EU Member State can join the Schengen Area.

My country, Romania, will join the Schengen Area on 27 March 2011.

Another benefit of EU membership is that an EU Member State can adopt the Euro once it meets the conditions.

Luigi,

Not a single one of your 3 points holds any water. What is your motive to invent all these false claims?

What Canadian Serb wrote (about Serbs as leaders) reminds me of watching Milosevic era television in Belgrade: professors and academics in TV studio discussing about the intellectual superiority of Serbs, compared to any other nation on earth. Seeing that I first thought it's a Serbian Monty Python show! But no, it was for real. And already next day some of my neighbours repeated the claims presented in TV...

Father of my son's classmate gave me a two hour lecture about facts why Serbian nation is the most potential nation...

Please! Why to harm yourself with your insane claims?

A part from all the problems equals to other countries (laws,economy and so on )+Kosovo+mladic, there are specific hurdles for Serbia in his european integration that are not discussed much here they are:
1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process
2)Not all parties have reached a deal with an european parliament group, never has happened before in the enlargement process
3)Serbia is not a Nato member or has a full peace agreement with the alliance , never has happened before in the enlargement process
So how can be a fast trak ?

Zoran,

I think that all the countries of the Western Balkans will join the EU in the future.

The countries of the Western Balkans have no alternative to the EU.

I agree with you that Serbia has no chance of joining the EU before 2020.

A part from all the problems equals to other countries (laws,economy and so on )+Kosovo+mladic, there are specific hurdles for Serbia in his european integration that are not discussed much here they are:
1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process
2)Not all parties have reached a deal with an european parliament group, never has happened before in the enlargement process
3)Serbia is not a Nato member or has a full peace agreement with the alliance , never has happened before in the enlargement process
So how can be a fast trak ?
(Luigi, 15 September 2010 11:03)

Luigi, I think you are a little pessimistic in your comments.

1) The ruling coalition wants EU membership. Even the main opposition party SNS wants it too. DSS are lukewarm but not openly hostile. That leaves the Radicals and they are fast becoming irrelevant

2) Those deals will happen soon

3) Who needs NATO? NATO membership is not a pre requsite into joining the EU. For example Ireland is not a NATO country and we have been in the EU since 1973.

Regarding the Kosovo-Mladic issues, these will be ironed out in time. Mladic will eventually be apprehended and held accountable for his crimes and talks between Belgrade and Pristina are scheduled to begin at the end of this year in what many are hoping to resolve the final status of the province and provide lasting peace and stability.

Once Serbia overcomes these hurdles, it's full steam ahead.

Luigi!

Yes, i totally agree with your post. However, Serbia is the only European country that fought against NATO and then walked away with 98% percent of it's military capabilities.

Globally, NATO has been a failure and ineffective. Had Milosevic not surrendered and waited a few more days, NATO would have capitulated to Serbia's terms.

Therefore, why would Serbia want to join NATO.

I believe that Serbia's EU aspirations are totally moot, in that Serbia will never be allowed to join.

For example let's look at european sports. Serbia is an adversary and totally dominates it's european neighbours. How can a small country like Serbia cause so much interest?

I believe the Serbian people are leaders and are a threat to the west...

@Kujon
No polish party was openly against ..there were and there are some EURO-skeptics over "broader Eu integration" but is the same also here in Italy (lega nord)AND IN ALL Eu countries for what i read the situation in Serbia is a bit different (DSS has no agreement in Eu but has in Russia with Edinaia Russia)
@Nial o'doherty
Ireland has a full peace agreement with Nato and allow Nato's airplanes to fly over his territory for example ...

Sorry to say but the Balkans will be a difficult pill to swallow for the EU. I can't see any chance of Serbia entering for at least another 10 years and by then the world will be a completely different place - with China being the dominant world power.

As wealth, power and influence shifts eastwards the fault lines of Europe, being the Balkans, will begin to tremble. That's why we need to settle unresolved issues now and in a fair manner otherwise these problems will resurface at another point, where it's certain Serbia will have the upper hand.

In a global environment, it's about the survival of the fittest, productivity and competitiveness. That's why China is way ahead of the rest. Who is willing to be as productive for such a small pay? The fat cats of the west, with big pay cheques and minimal productivity are all coming to an end my friends.

So the rush is on to get the Balkans into Euro-Atlantic structures but this is way too complicated for a bunch of lazy eurocrats to achieve. When the time is ripe, change will occur. The trend is already in Serbia's favour as the velvet revolutions begin to reverse.

Indeed, give them Sandžak & Vojvodina too, join NATO and let them transform Serbia to a military bunker and a torture-gulag and the "climate" will be tropical in terms of abandon our nation and sovereignity as we know it....

When i read about that self-humiltationg letter to Bush he wrote http://original.antiwar.com/malic/2005/09/29/laughable-sycophancy/, i knew what to expect from him and his regime.

Luigi there is they moved it from 5th drawer to 3rd it will be a long long time to get things all done.

Kosovo and Serbia mite be in a hurry to solve the issue but how is any Eu country bothered if its done in 2011 or 2013.

They have bigger fish to fry and not pressed by anyone.

So Serbia has ways to go and elections are not until 2012

Tadic and his cronies have sold the soul of Serbia for a bag of gold!
(Predrag, 15 September 2010 12:02)
--
We have been through it before and that's why there are many parallels between Tadić's regime and that of Nedić during WWII. Read this http://tinyurl.com/33zrfqz and be amazed at how history is repeating. This will come to an end sooner or later as the cycle revolves. I can see the west and Germany making the same old mistakes. They haven't learnt their lesson.

Another benefit of EU membership is that an EU Member State can adopt the Euro once it meets the conditions.
(Mircea, 15 September 2010 11:28)
--
I think the greatest benefit of EU membership is that you can easily become a non-member. Exiting the union is a simple step that was introduced as part of the Lisbon treaty.

How long before Romania takes advantage of this benefit? Who will be first, Hungary or Romania? We will see in 10 years time.

Just a few facts about the 'enormous funds' available from the EU, because this is utterly misleading in other words, a lie). In the case of Romania, as of August 2010:

- 2,18 bn Euro arrived in the country (less than 7% of the total amount 'available' to the country until 2013)

- 4,53 bn Euro were paid by the country to the budget of the EU (around 45% to be paid as contribution for the interval 2007 - 2013)

In short, the net contribution of the country to the EU budget to date is of 2,35 bn Euro (which is around one quarter of the total contraction of the economy in 2009). For those who don't understand: we pay more to the EU than we receive for 'development'.

Interestingly enough, the amount equivalent to the net contribution returned to the country over the last year and a half in the form of a loan 'granted' by the European Commission with an interest based on Euribor rate (which is continuously increasing).

For the remainder of the period until 2013, according to projections and current absorption rates, Romania will receive a maximum of 2 bn Euro from the EU and will pay anouth 5,5 bn Euro as contribution (tribute?).

These are facts that anyone can check and something to keep in mind for those of you euro-enthusiasts.

Of course there is a very favorable climate in the EU for Serbia's candidacy!

All that sucking up is bound to get you some favours!

Tadic and his cronies have sold the soul of Serbia for a bag of gold!
They have given away Serbias holy land and have been deceiving the Serbian people!

Congratulations!

RE:
We have been through it before and that's why there are many parallels between Tadić's regime and that of Nedić during WWII. Read this [link] and be amazed at how history is repeating. This will come to an end sooner or later as the cycle revolves. I can see the west and Germany making the same old mistakes. They haven't learnt their lesson.
(Zoran, 15 September 2010 13:30)

There is absolutely no parallel between the Milan Nedic government during WWII-1941-1944. This government was formed as the National Salvation Government headed by General Nedic who fought with distinguishment in both Balkan wars as well as WWI under Field Marshal Putnik. General Nedic saved the Serbian nation as Germany was considering allowing the Nazi Ustasha regime to control central Serbia which would have meant the expansion of the genocide perpotrated by the Ustasha regime led by Ante Pavelic.

General Milan Nedic never wanted the job, but he did it to save the Serbian people from certain anniliation.

The Vichy government in France led by Marshal Petain, another WWI heroe draws parallels with the Serbian government under Nedic, led by another war veteran.

The old plan that failed during WWII is revisted. It will fail once again as the cycle repeats. Yin and Yang.
(Zoran, 16 September 2010 14:17)

Prince Pavle signed a non-agression pact with Nazi Germany in 1939 which was a good pact. It never infringed on the sovereignty of Yugoslavia, the only stipulation was to occasionally allow transfers of Nazi Troops through Serbia. There was no "plan" by Germany to break up Yugoslavia in 1941.

General Simovic with the help of British Intelligence overthrew Prince Paul which in hindsight was a grave mistake. At that point in time, Yugoslavia hammered out a deal with the Croatian Peasant Party leader Macek for a loose confederation.

Yugoslavia was invaded and destroyed by Germany due to poor policy decisions from the Serbian opposition and military leadership. That is one similarily in today's Serbia, lack of vision and leadership.

the entire EU structure is a fraud-everybody knows this. there are a few nations within the EU which will benefit (germany in particular) but the rest will see no long term benefits. what they will learn within a few years is just how much of thier national independence and economic independence they will lose and how much resentment will arise amongst the perpective populaces when foreign commisars begin dictating all aspects of national life. the economic benefits of the union are even more bleak - unless you consider gordon to be a fair minded, long sighted economic genius. the bubble has burst

as for NATO memebership-thats laughable! once again nobody but a very few nations (US in particular) will find any positive aspects in belonging to the outdated military alliance. NATO's corpse already lies in the deserts of afghanistan-and a five day war in georgia proved NATO to be mostly bluff and bluster.

the future for serbia is a free and independent serbia-with its own manufacturing base, a truly free media not owned and manipulated by the neo-lib beurocrats of the eu.what possible benefit can the serbs find in once again being under the same roof as croatia, slovenia - or even worse - albania. the age of artificial states and superalliances will fade into history with yugoslavia and the soviet union.

serbia has its own great potential, an educated capable work force, resilience in the face of unimaginable odds and vast foes, and we have many, many great friends in the world whos economies (unlike the economies of most of our western enemies) would be perfectly suited to equitable and fair trade.

Mr Tadic sees nothing beyond the EU because he has made so many personal promises and gained so much personal wealth from the eurocrats that he cant turn his back on them-or else hell end up like that other CIA stooge milosevic in the docket in a cold norther city. Milosevic was promised all of Yugoaslavia, he was not a serb patriot but wanted to be the next tito----when his latent serbian nationalism manifested itself in the form of a serb flag tie it was to late---he was at the hague. Tadic has been promised a place underneath the EU table and a few scraps and only after many, many more years-but he cant change course now. Just a few days before he capitulated at the UN, his western friends made some very serious threats towards Tadic if he didnt do what his friends wanted him to-he did what his friends wanted perfectly. Tadics' friends are serbias greatest enemies.

serbia needs to be patient and stay tough for the remainder of the Tadic term. Serbia also needs a real party-one that will not be hopping to washington every few weeks for "advice" wink, wink------we need a party that will make regular trips to moscow, beijing, delhi, and many other places where live true friends whos economies are on the rise-not decling (as is much of europe and certainly the states)

cccc / kosovo=serbia / 4ever

"Globally, NATO has been a failure and ineffective. Had Milosevic not surrendered and waited a few more days, NATO would have capitulated to Serbia's terms."

What have you been reading and where were you in 1999? Haven't we learned that rewriting history does not help us solve our problems?

""1)Not all political parties are pro-EU , never has happened this before in the enlargement process"" -- Poland had several parties opposed.

...draws parallels with the Serbian government under Nedic, led by another war veteran.
(Jugoslavija, 15 September 2010 21:13)
--
Nedic and Tadic are both puppet governments led by Germany and their "axis" partners.

Both were/are here apparently to save Serbia. One from Ustasha control and the other from isolation.

The parallels are pretty obvious. Destroy Yugoslavia and make Serbia as small and weak as possible. Install puppet governments to do as Germany and "axis" partners say.

Serbia was pretty small under German occupation. It consisted of Northern Kosovo, Central Serbia and Banat (Vojvodina). Sounds familiar?

The old plan that failed during WWII is revisted. It will fail once again as the cycle repeats. Yin and Yang.