Spain working on changes to Kosovo resolution

Stop talking, EU. Serbia wanted the Resolution and they shall have it on the 9th September. Not more is needed to be said.

EU has shown one more time with this kosovo failure their weekness and inability to persue their own non US policy!
There isn't any unity but rather a half hand full of countries that are dictating or trying to dictate their wishes to the the rest of the 'crowd'
I always have been pro EU and was always upset when we, french part, were outvoted in Switzerland by the 'german part'!
We have a new referendum coming up in regards to our EU membership and this time, without any hesitation, I will vote against it and so will do certainly more that 60% of the Swiss population.
Yes to an economic union with some political harmony, but NO to this trio of liars running it's own agenda at the expense of the others!!

Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?

Spain better give basque people the authonomy,before getting involve in Kosova-Serbia issue.
If Spain wants to be a honist broker better start recignising Kosovo as a fisrt step.This will give albanians some security, while serbs already know that Spain is in their side.
Anyway,since the scum countries of EU are Serbia's ally I am not worry about the outcome of the resulotion.
I have predicted 80 in favour of Kosova and 30-40 in favour of Serbia.
I am curious to see want is going to be the next step for serbs.Or propably they will say that "they won" like they did say the next day of IJC ruling.
14 days till the next autogol for Serbia.

"This UN resolution will turn out to be another circus like the ICJ.
Zoran

most likely yes but who initiated both actions?

"Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?"
(pyrros, 2 September 2010 10:57)

So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime, and at the same time to be against the independence of some split-off wannabe country lead by ex-far criminals (the goal is very similar, i.e. a mono-ethnic Kosovo)

What would be easier for the Serbian government? Give up kosovo for a long, deliberately dragged-out, bureaucratic process of joining the eu where success is not guaranteed OR give up joining the eu because of its pig-headed, no status negotiations, kosovo policy? I am willing to bet that if the Serbian government told the eu to go to hell and withdrew its membership application, status negotiations would begin tomorrow. Eventually, Tadic and the DS will have to do that if it wants to stay in power because the Serbian people have long memories and they hate people who bombed them and continue to oppress and lie to them.

Anti-UDI state behind the Res is a big victory for Serbia. 'Tadic will recognize KiM' ' We dont need the UN' 'the ICJ will bring new recognitions' 'our Western masters new Res will save us' - it was all Albanian wishful thinking to avoid the ugly reality of UDI FAILURE and its implicit inevitable result.

I would add a different slant to Top's point.

What were other NATO countries doing including Greece about NATO bombing? Did Russia make it known it would consider an attack on Serbia as if it were an attack on Russia?

In other words all countries were complicit, including Milosevic's Serbia, as Milosevic knew full well that NATO would bomb, but he could not climb down for fear of being labled a coward by the opposition (as well as incompetent, disasterous economic, social policies etc etc etc) losing Kosovo.

There is no question in my mind that Russia could have prevented the bombing or had Milosevic persued different policies that the bombing would not have taken place. There is no question that this was a crusade led by the UK and US and that other countries felt they had to fall into line.

Do I blame Spain for NATO bombardment? Actually they are one of the least to blame.

This isn't the point anyway. Spain is welcome to put their view accross.

"The bombing triggered the mass exodus of ethnic Albanians from Kosovo. So if the bombing started it, how could it be against it?"
(Zoran, 2 September 2010 17:38)

Some people confuse things that happened concurrently with a trigger, it seems.

Notice how when Spain, Greece, etc steps in it's fine but if it's US, Britain, France, or any other country that has recognized an independent Kosovo they are ousted by Serb Camp as meddling in "serbian affairs"?

If spain wants a solution to be found, they should lead by example and recognize the DOI asap.

Thanks!

"So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime..."

Bite your tongue, Milosevic only wanted to rescue Serbian people from "Kosovar dictatorship"!!

"Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?
pyrros

Yes but that was a humanitarian action to stop madman Milosevic.

This UN resolution will turn out to be another circus like the ICJ.

'Spain better give basque people the authonomy,before getting involve in Kosova-Serbia issue.'

The Basque province does have autonomy.

Spain does have reason to be worried with Kosovo though. There are lots of parallels between Kosovo under Milosevic and the Basque province and Catalunya under Franco, and Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.

Regardless of the claims of the leadership in Prishtina and Belgrade, both parties are coming to terms with the fact that negotiations are a must

A territorial exchange would pave the way for mutual recognition.

An independent Kosovo without Serbia's recognition would block future international memberships - as it has so far.

Similarly, a hardline version of Serbia on Kosovo will delay its accession into the EU.

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!

So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime...
(Top, 2 September 2010 14:04)
--
The bombing triggered the mass exodus of ethnic Albanians from Kosovo. So if the bombing started it, how could it be against it?

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!
(chesney, 2 September 2010 17:08)
=======================

They should. They produced it.

JohnBoy,

here here - to hell with EU integartion if it is as Germany and now UK insist guving up the heart of Serbia and all that is Serbian - Kosovo & Metohija!

D yeS to all that EUSSR demand can no longer lie that this is not being indecently proposed!

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!
(chesney, 2 September 2010 17:08)
===…==

They should. They produced it.
(Peggy, 2 September 2010 23:18)

That's irrelevant... They can do whatever they want. Serbia can't tell EU what it SHOULD or SHOULD NOT do. It's the EU which approves the membership applications, not to applicant.

If Serbia is not happy, it is free not to join. Nobody is forcing it to join the EU.

Zoran,

regardless of your stance on the Kosovo issue I must say I agree with you in that the General Assembly opinion will be another circus.

It is the time both parties sat down to resolve the issue themselves.

Serbia needs to understand that this has to be done on equal levels. PM to PM, however this does not imply recognition - but it does pave the way.

Kosovo, on the other hand, needs to seriously consider it's stance on the North. Kosovar Albanians feel that they have done their part by adopting the Ahtisaari plan and no further compromise should be made. But, Kosovo has to agree on a one last compromise - THE NORTH!

Internationals should be facilitators of the negotiations, but there interference in a potential Kosovo-Serbia agreement should be kept at minimum.

Oh Miri, there you are! I am still waiting for your reply here:
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=69406

@ Peggy,
They should. They produced it.
(Peggy, 2 September 2010 23:18)

True, but how else would have you solved it? How would you integrate 2 million people who hate you? 2 million people who hate a regime that 10 years ago executed violence on its own citizens?

And the same applies to North Kosovo Serbs too! How do you integrate a region that hates Prishtina?

What Serbia is to Kosovo, Kosovo is to North Kosovo.

But, 1999 and 2010 are nowhere near comparable.

Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.
(Sam, UK, 2 September 2010 22:49)

Long after is not correct here. Also unpopular dictatorship is not correct either. He was very popular and had the popular support of the Serb people when it comes to Kosova. Notice how the vast majority of Serbs here only blame him for his failure to finish Kosova not because he started it. Stop making stuff up. Even if that was the case that would be wrong how? Or should Kosova be used as a case where the actions of a dictator are rewarded; meaning that killing thousands of people and ethnically cleansing a million of them ends up with the reward of eternal subjugation of these people.

If Serbia is not happy, it is free not to join. Nobody is forcing it to join the EU.
(Mark)
-
The circumstances are quite different as you put it. The EU is pushing Serbia hard to join their club, while the people are extremely against it.

Spain does have reason to be worried with Kosovo though. There are lots of parallels between Kosovo under Milosevic and the Basque province and Catalunya under Franco, and Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.
(Sam, UK, 2 September 2010 22:49)
The key has been that Serbia needs to show that it was due to Milosevic and not Serbia. So far they have not done that in regards to the people of Kosovo.

Mark- Why dont you get it?

The Serbian people do NOT want to belong to any organization, they want to remain neutral.

Stop trying to pretend you understand the will of the Serbian people. You really do not know at all.

Any governemnt would do something to protect their citizens from KLA.
(Peggy, 6 September 2010 01:16)

Including what Milosevic did?!

The circumstances are quite different as you put it. The EU is pushing Serbia hard to join their club, while the people are extremely against it.
(trudsaam, 4 September 2010 01:53)

Yeah, Serbia likes to feel important, but that does not mean it really is important. Shouting and causing trouble does not show importance but impotence.

Just few facts to show Serbia’s insignificance for the EU: Serbia’s population is 1.5% of the EU, Serbia’s territory is 2% of the EU’s, and Serbia’s economic weight (GDP) would easily be considered a rounding error by Eurostat (0.3% of the EU).

However, if you still want to feel important, by all means continue to do so. That does not change the fact that if Serbia does not like the EU, it’s free not to join. It’s also free to join any other organization, for example, the African Union since Jeremic really likes Africa and the model that those countries offer. Serbia can also create a new organization with its friends which don’t recognize Kosovo; prosperous, democratic and rule of law champions like Russia, Venezuela, Iran, Belarus, Cuba, Libya, Sudan, Syria, etc. That, of course, would be a great club to be part of. The model those countries offer would really help Serbia's future.

But, 1999 and 2010 are nowhere near comparable.
(chesney, 2 September 2010 23:44)
=========================
Only because of the peacekeepers. They leave and watch the Albanians move north. They want all Serbs and non Albanians out and that's very obvious even to children.

Albanians were provoking unrest in Serbia for decades. They saw a golden opportunity to step up their effors when Yugoslavia began to break up. Any governemnt would do something to protect their citizens from KLA.

The Serbian people do NOT want to belong to any organization, they want to remain neutral.

Stop trying to pretend you understand the will of the Serbian people. You really do not know at all.
(trudsaam, 5 September 2010 02:59)

You are correct, I don't know that. That's why I did not say Serbia should do this or that. I just laid down few options Serbian people can choose from:

1. Not join the EU (i.e. remain neutral if they still have Yugo nostalgia);

2. Join another existing Union (the preferred one appears to be the African Union considering that Jeremic spends most of his time there);

3. If no adequate Union exists, create one with the countries considered the strongest supporters of Serbia like Russia, Venezuela, Iran, Belarus, Cuba, Libya, Sudan, Syria, etc. That would be a club the whole world will envy.

Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?

EU has shown one more time with this kosovo failure their weekness and inability to persue their own non US policy!
There isn't any unity but rather a half hand full of countries that are dictating or trying to dictate their wishes to the the rest of the 'crowd'
I always have been pro EU and was always upset when we, french part, were outvoted in Switzerland by the 'german part'!
We have a new referendum coming up in regards to our EU membership and this time, without any hesitation, I will vote against it and so will do certainly more that 60% of the Swiss population.
Yes to an economic union with some political harmony, but NO to this trio of liars running it's own agenda at the expense of the others!!

"Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?"
(pyrros, 2 September 2010 10:57)

So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime, and at the same time to be against the independence of some split-off wannabe country lead by ex-far criminals (the goal is very similar, i.e. a mono-ethnic Kosovo)

"So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime..."

Bite your tongue, Milosevic only wanted to rescue Serbian people from "Kosovar dictatorship"!!

Stop talking, EU. Serbia wanted the Resolution and they shall have it on the 9th September. Not more is needed to be said.

Spain better give basque people the authonomy,before getting involve in Kosova-Serbia issue.
If Spain wants to be a honist broker better start recignising Kosovo as a fisrt step.This will give albanians some security, while serbs already know that Spain is in their side.
Anyway,since the scum countries of EU are Serbia's ally I am not worry about the outcome of the resulotion.
I have predicted 80 in favour of Kosova and 30-40 in favour of Serbia.
I am curious to see want is going to be the next step for serbs.Or propably they will say that "they won" like they did say the next day of IJC ruling.
14 days till the next autogol for Serbia.

JohnBoy,

here here - to hell with EU integartion if it is as Germany and now UK insist guving up the heart of Serbia and all that is Serbian - Kosovo & Metohija!

D yeS to all that EUSSR demand can no longer lie that this is not being indecently proposed!

"Wasn't Spain among the brave bombers back in 1999?
pyrros

Yes but that was a humanitarian action to stop madman Milosevic.

Anti-UDI state behind the Res is a big victory for Serbia. 'Tadic will recognize KiM' ' We dont need the UN' 'the ICJ will bring new recognitions' 'our Western masters new Res will save us' - it was all Albanian wishful thinking to avoid the ugly reality of UDI FAILURE and its implicit inevitable result.

Notice how when Spain, Greece, etc steps in it's fine but if it's US, Britain, France, or any other country that has recognized an independent Kosovo they are ousted by Serb Camp as meddling in "serbian affairs"?

If spain wants a solution to be found, they should lead by example and recognize the DOI asap.

Thanks!

So what? You cannot imagine that it's possible to be against ethnic cleansing by the Milosevic regime...
(Top, 2 September 2010 14:04)
--
The bombing triggered the mass exodus of ethnic Albanians from Kosovo. So if the bombing started it, how could it be against it?

"This UN resolution will turn out to be another circus like the ICJ.
Zoran

most likely yes but who initiated both actions?

Regardless of the claims of the leadership in Prishtina and Belgrade, both parties are coming to terms with the fact that negotiations are a must

A territorial exchange would pave the way for mutual recognition.

An independent Kosovo without Serbia's recognition would block future international memberships - as it has so far.

Similarly, a hardline version of Serbia on Kosovo will delay its accession into the EU.

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!

I would add a different slant to Top's point.

What were other NATO countries doing including Greece about NATO bombing? Did Russia make it known it would consider an attack on Serbia as if it were an attack on Russia?

In other words all countries were complicit, including Milosevic's Serbia, as Milosevic knew full well that NATO would bomb, but he could not climb down for fear of being labled a coward by the opposition (as well as incompetent, disasterous economic, social policies etc etc etc) losing Kosovo.

There is no question in my mind that Russia could have prevented the bombing or had Milosevic persued different policies that the bombing would not have taken place. There is no question that this was a crusade led by the UK and US and that other countries felt they had to fall into line.

Do I blame Spain for NATO bombardment? Actually they are one of the least to blame.

This isn't the point anyway. Spain is welcome to put their view accross.

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!
(chesney, 2 September 2010 17:08)
=======================

They should. They produced it.

Oh Miri, there you are! I am still waiting for your reply here:
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=69406

What would be easier for the Serbian government? Give up kosovo for a long, deliberately dragged-out, bureaucratic process of joining the eu where success is not guaranteed OR give up joining the eu because of its pig-headed, no status negotiations, kosovo policy? I am willing to bet that if the Serbian government told the eu to go to hell and withdrew its membership application, status negotiations would begin tomorrow. Eventually, Tadic and the DS will have to do that if it wants to stay in power because the Serbian people have long memories and they hate people who bombed them and continue to oppress and lie to them.

This UN resolution will turn out to be another circus like the ICJ.

Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.
(Sam, UK, 2 September 2010 22:49)

Long after is not correct here. Also unpopular dictatorship is not correct either. He was very popular and had the popular support of the Serb people when it comes to Kosova. Notice how the vast majority of Serbs here only blame him for his failure to finish Kosova not because he started it. Stop making stuff up. Even if that was the case that would be wrong how? Or should Kosova be used as a case where the actions of a dictator are rewarded; meaning that killing thousands of people and ethnically cleansing a million of them ends up with the reward of eternal subjugation of these people.

Spain does have reason to be worried with Kosovo though. There are lots of parallels between Kosovo under Milosevic and the Basque province and Catalunya under Franco, and Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.
(Sam, UK, 2 September 2010 22:49)
The key has been that Serbia needs to show that it was due to Milosevic and not Serbia. So far they have not done that in regards to the people of Kosovo.

Zoran,

regardless of your stance on the Kosovo issue I must say I agree with you in that the General Assembly opinion will be another circus.

It is the time both parties sat down to resolve the issue themselves.

Serbia needs to understand that this has to be done on equal levels. PM to PM, however this does not imply recognition - but it does pave the way.

Kosovo, on the other hand, needs to seriously consider it's stance on the North. Kosovar Albanians feel that they have done their part by adopting the Ahtisaari plan and no further compromise should be made. But, Kosovo has to agree on a one last compromise - THE NORTH!

Internationals should be facilitators of the negotiations, but there interference in a potential Kosovo-Serbia agreement should be kept at minimum.

'Spain better give basque people the authonomy,before getting involve in Kosova-Serbia issue.'

The Basque province does have autonomy.

Spain does have reason to be worried with Kosovo though. There are lots of parallels between Kosovo under Milosevic and the Basque province and Catalunya under Franco, and Kosovo has taught us that a country can still be punished for the actions of an unpopular dictatorship long after its gone.

The bottom line: the EU will not want to inherit another Cyprus!
(chesney, 2 September 2010 17:08)
===…==

They should. They produced it.
(Peggy, 2 September 2010 23:18)

That's irrelevant... They can do whatever they want. Serbia can't tell EU what it SHOULD or SHOULD NOT do. It's the EU which approves the membership applications, not to applicant.

If Serbia is not happy, it is free not to join. Nobody is forcing it to join the EU.

The circumstances are quite different as you put it. The EU is pushing Serbia hard to join their club, while the people are extremely against it.
(trudsaam, 4 September 2010 01:53)

Yeah, Serbia likes to feel important, but that does not mean it really is important. Shouting and causing trouble does not show importance but impotence.

Just few facts to show Serbia’s insignificance for the EU: Serbia’s population is 1.5% of the EU, Serbia’s territory is 2% of the EU’s, and Serbia’s economic weight (GDP) would easily be considered a rounding error by Eurostat (0.3% of the EU).

However, if you still want to feel important, by all means continue to do so. That does not change the fact that if Serbia does not like the EU, it’s free not to join. It’s also free to join any other organization, for example, the African Union since Jeremic really likes Africa and the model that those countries offer. Serbia can also create a new organization with its friends which don’t recognize Kosovo; prosperous, democratic and rule of law champions like Russia, Venezuela, Iran, Belarus, Cuba, Libya, Sudan, Syria, etc. That, of course, would be a great club to be part of. The model those countries offer would really help Serbia's future.

"The bombing triggered the mass exodus of ethnic Albanians from Kosovo. So if the bombing started it, how could it be against it?"
(Zoran, 2 September 2010 17:38)

Some people confuse things that happened concurrently with a trigger, it seems.

@ Peggy,
They should. They produced it.
(Peggy, 2 September 2010 23:18)

True, but how else would have you solved it? How would you integrate 2 million people who hate you? 2 million people who hate a regime that 10 years ago executed violence on its own citizens?

And the same applies to North Kosovo Serbs too! How do you integrate a region that hates Prishtina?

What Serbia is to Kosovo, Kosovo is to North Kosovo.

But, 1999 and 2010 are nowhere near comparable.

But, 1999 and 2010 are nowhere near comparable.
(chesney, 2 September 2010 23:44)
=========================
Only because of the peacekeepers. They leave and watch the Albanians move north. They want all Serbs and non Albanians out and that's very obvious even to children.

Albanians were provoking unrest in Serbia for decades. They saw a golden opportunity to step up their effors when Yugoslavia began to break up. Any governemnt would do something to protect their citizens from KLA.

If Serbia is not happy, it is free not to join. Nobody is forcing it to join the EU.
(Mark)
-
The circumstances are quite different as you put it. The EU is pushing Serbia hard to join their club, while the people are extremely against it.

Mark- Why dont you get it?

The Serbian people do NOT want to belong to any organization, they want to remain neutral.

Stop trying to pretend you understand the will of the Serbian people. You really do not know at all.

The Serbian people do NOT want to belong to any organization, they want to remain neutral.

Stop trying to pretend you understand the will of the Serbian people. You really do not know at all.
(trudsaam, 5 September 2010 02:59)

You are correct, I don't know that. That's why I did not say Serbia should do this or that. I just laid down few options Serbian people can choose from:

1. Not join the EU (i.e. remain neutral if they still have Yugo nostalgia);

2. Join another existing Union (the preferred one appears to be the African Union considering that Jeremic spends most of his time there);

3. If no adequate Union exists, create one with the countries considered the strongest supporters of Serbia like Russia, Venezuela, Iran, Belarus, Cuba, Libya, Sudan, Syria, etc. That would be a club the whole world will envy.

Any governemnt would do something to protect their citizens from KLA.
(Peggy, 6 September 2010 01:16)

Including what Milosevic did?!