24

Sunday, 08.08.2010.

10:23

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"

Germany wants Serbia in the European Union, the spokesman of the German Liberals and an expert on Southeastern Europe, Rainer Stinner stated

Izvor: Tanjug

"Germany wants Serbia in EU" IMAGE SOURCE
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24 Komentari

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Peggy

pre 13 godina

"Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance"
=====================

Oh johny, haven't you heard yet? China is on a shopping spree and is buying up a lot of Japanese companies right now. Soon China will own Japan.
UK is not having a good time at all at the moment either. Once these countries were giants but not any more.
China and India are the future and they are both on Serbia's side.

Aleks

pre 13 godina

"...
“Without meeting the political criteria, progress will be difficult. We want Serbia to get accepted into the EU, because we expect this to bring an essential stabilization of the region. There will be no softening of the criteria,” said Stinner..."

Stinner is a business man so of course he is interested. His CV here:

www.rainer-stinner.de/wcsite.php?wc_b=9618

I am glad that he recognizes that Serbia is "essential [to the] stabilization of the region..."

But I am confused. Serbia cannot apparently join the EU
without fully complying with the subjective dictats of Brussels (nowhere have they officially said Serbia must give up Kosovo - because they can't), yet on the other hand Serbia is essential to stabilization of the region (i.e. EU Balkan Stability Pact).

This sounds very much to me like having your cake and eating it. You simply can't and he implicitly recognizes that Serbia is still an very important player in the region.

So in reality, the message from this story is the opposite to which most of the commenters think it is.

Without Serbia, the Balkans are f***ed, the EU wants Serbia in to calm it down (and of course save a lot of money from EU member states) and in return for giving up their own Jerusalem, Belgrade gets to follow Brussels diktats!

Top

pre 13 godina

"2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO "
(johny, 10 August 2010 06:01)

I didn't know Johny is a Serb from Kosovo. Strange.... ;-)

Jovan

pre 13 godina

""[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.
(Amer, 9 August 2010 20:34) "

isn´t it interesting that a K-albanian is opening his mouth at all in regard to european economic support???

I mean, my dear Amer, you should be the last to start talking when it is about international support!

don´t you worry for Serbia, my friend, since Serbia will not only care for the Serbs in southern Serbia but also for you! ( although you are quite used to be supported, anyway )

always keep in mind: Serbia is a functioning state, while "kosovaah" is a joke. a temporarily existing one.

johny

pre 13 godina

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.
(Mike, 9 August 2010 23:10)

Who says we might have to get around them. Maybe just maybe we think it could be good to be in the Wets patronage for a couple of decades while Serbia is in direct conflict with them? That could be a scenario that just might happen. That would do a couple of things.

1. Missions such as EULEX and others would help strengthen the rule of law.
2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO
3. Economically that is very advantageous as companies such telecom and other are sold to western companies bringing more western capital. More western interests and money means more protection from Serbia.
4. Serbia will have to make a choice either find a way living with the solution countries such as Germany impose or join the eastern front. In case they do that is still good for us because it further isolates Serbia from the West. It turns her into a Belarus.
5. Finally, things remaining the way they are are not bad for us. Its not the best but it is definitely good especially as Serbia becomes more of an antagonist and remains in conflict with the big EU countries. Our limbo has actually so far resulted in progress. I believe it will continue to do so considering the disaster where we came from in 1999. We can only grow from that for at least another 2-3 decades even if things remain the way they are. Our limbo resulting in Serbia's limbo is not all that bad either. The more in limbo Serbia remains the worse it is for Serbia; the worse its position gets. No EU means no Western help, means Putin better be prepared spending a lot of money on Serbia. If not well very soon we might end up with the same GDP. Then maybe Serbia could be ready to live with the solution countries such as Germany impose. We can actually drag our feet. The more Serbia becomes the West's antagonist the more we can drag our feet. The question is; can Serbia deal with the consequences of its antagonism for another 2-3 decades.

Serbia doesn't even hold her own future. The West does. so all these veiled threats about eternal limbos without Serbia's blessing are not only shortsighted but ironic as well. Serbia itself is in a limbo.

Mike

pre 13 godina

johny, maybe you have a difficult time reading my posts. Maybe you should refrain from reading them altogether since they tend to irk you - but then again you've been somewhat of an angry individual of late on your own. I was simply saying that for Germany calling what they see as an open and shut case is more than premature. Yes, Germany is a powerful country, I'm not denying that. But guess what? There's *other* countries in the region too. And most of them are in favor of some form of dialogue between Belgrade and Pristina because they, unlike some in Berlin, see nothing but a frozen conflict in its absence. Why is this so hard to understand?

I mean I guess it's better to be an ass-kisser instead of a nuiscance, but Pristina's no closer to Brussels than it was two years ago, right?

Remember when Russia shut off the gas last time? Germany was the first to cave and cut a deal with Putin. Funny isn't it?

Mike

pre 13 godina

"So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia." (johny)

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.

Amer

pre 13 godina

"[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.

Top

pre 13 godina

"Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia."
(johny, 9 August 2010 18:40)

It's more like you (==Kosovo) is in a limbo to become an internationally recognized state (==UN member) at all. I don't see this happen in the near future, with the current unsolved situation.

johny

pre 13 godina

Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.
(Mike, 8 August 2010 18:55)

Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance. These countries do have the lives of the average Serb in their hands. It takes only one little action and Serbia's inflation skyrockets. Lets not talk about all the other mechanisms they have in their hands. These countries are very important for the well being of the average Serb. It is them that every winter prevent the average Serb from freezing from the cold. Go ask Tadic who he begged for warmth last winter. It was Germany. Being a nuisance does result in negative actions. So what that shows is a resolve to make Serbia as a nuisance go away. What that means is that a lasting solution passes through the word powers not through the hallways of government buildings in Serbia. That has always been the case. Powers have always created the lasting solutions.

Also you should worry about Serbia being in limbo for the indefinite future. I mean this guy was very direct and spelled it out. Serbia will not be allowed to join the clubs of the West, such as EU, NATO or any other political, military and economic alliances until it stops being a nuisance. Now for those who want to be an active part of the Western alliance and civilization that is being in a limbo. Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia.

Jovan

pre 13 godina

Germany will have to learn that Serbia will join the EU only as a whole.

if Stinner thinks there is no need for discussion, he´s terribly wrong.

but the Germans will learn their lesson. they have learnt it twice in the last century.

they will learn that Serbia will not give in.

Luke Buyenovich

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"
The question is why.I will give you my take on this subject,that is as follow:Germany,economically dominant Country in EU do not want to deal with possibility
of Serbia being outside of EU with increasingly ever closer tie with Russia.Mr.Stinner is very clever politician,he knows very well by both countries Russia and Serbia outside of EU it could create unfavorable dynamics which could be costly to Germany and EU.At the present time Germany has cozy economic relationship with Russia worth more then 15 billions annually.Germany is manufacturing country,Russia with abundance of natural resources can supply all row material needed.Germany has already demonstrated they are not going to work with anyone against Russia's interest.As a result there is a RESET in USA relations with Russia.Mr.Stinner recognize Kosovo independence even with out international recognition
The position he takes is similar to ICJ.Serbia can live with it providing the Independent Kosovo is under Serbia's sovereignty Gentlemen there shall be no compromise Serbia's Orthodox Churches and Monasteries are in Serbia for ever-was is and always will be.Serbia should not be in rush to join EU or NATO.We should join those institutions right after Russia does.Yes we must stick close to Russia no matter what.From my perspective that's only way to go for us Serbs

szemi

pre 13 godina

..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say
(Luigi, 8 August 2010 20:44)
Have not known so far that Angela is male.But after all it is not a surprising mistake from a confused albanian who thinks that he is italian.

Luigi

pre 13 godina

i repeat ..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say in front of a German audience yes to Serbia ..everything else is mere PROPAGANDA

Mike

pre 13 godina

"Stinner said that official Berlin has recognized Kosovo and that is why he does not see that there are any outstanding issues that need to be discussed and solved in the UN."

-- Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.

Dragan

pre 13 godina

If Germany wants Serbia in the EU, then it's a good reason for Serbia to stay out. Nothing good will come from Germany my friends, nothing, as history has proven. So let's do the opposite of what they want.
Cheers!!

Top

pre 13 godina

"So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU."
(Rick, 8 August 2010 16:46)

Yes, totally desperately! Even more, Germany founded the EU many years ago, only with the goal to finally integrate Serbia in it.

Somehow strage how the EU survived so long without Serbia.

Rick

pre 13 godina

So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU. Germany's history over the last century is that they've ALWAYS wanted domination over Serbia- trying first militarily, now economically. But they've always been denied by those "pesky and ungrateful" Serbs. But don't worry- Serbia won't subjugate themselves to Germany this time either....time is on our side....and it's driving Germany crazy! Realistically, the EU is the only "card" that Germany has to bring Serbia under it's control- and the days of the EU are truthfully numbered with the European debt and banking crises. The Serbian spirit of independence and freedom has never been extinguished over the last eight centuries....nor will it now. And it might just be our stubborness about not giving up on Kosovo (time being on our side) that will actually save us as a nation!

pss

pre 13 godina

(Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija, 8 August 2010 11:03)
You really think this is some sort of earth shattering revelation?? It is more of we want you to come in and the door is open "but" it is open to Serbia as we recognize it and to the Germans that is Serbia separate from Kosovo.

justhetruth

pre 13 godina

Serbia has to meet the political and economic criteria. It also has to regulate its relations with all of its neighbors, including Kosovo,” said Stinner, adding that this does not necessarily mean international and legal recognition of Kosovo............. oppssss....does this make sense !!!!??? My Answer is ...YES

lowe

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"

This statement is grossly incomplete! Lets get real. Let me complete it for B92!

-- Germany wants Serbia in EU so that it will one more lackey to boss around.

PS: The same, by the way, applies to Croatia, Montenegro, Macedonia etc. Just add them in and change the number of lackeys accordingly.

Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija

pre 13 godina

So quite clearly and loudly a German politician is now stating Germany wants Serbia without Kosovo in the EU.

This was a message that until now was obvious but continually denied by the EUcrats and by D yeS to all that EU demands.

Its now out in the open and clear what EUSSR means by its "political" criteria - Serbia in EU only without Kosovo - no need for explicit recognition just your acceptance!

In the next set of elections there will be no hiding of the obviuos by D yeS to all that EU demands.

The choice will be submit to all that EUSSR demands - DS Co. or
ALL of Serbia in EU or not at all - DSS & Co.

Serbian election can and will won by the parties that state quite openly ALL of Serbia in the EU or not at all.

Kosovo principles defined the Serb and when faced with submission over principle to freedom we all know how to be accounted for.

Kosovo is and always will be Serbia - the EU needs to know that Serbians will never deviate from this and will rather go their own way even if its harder - was this not the true message from Kosovo 1389???

Serbia outwith the EU will be tougher (materially) but would one rather follow the path of that of Judas in persuit of his 30 pieces of silver and betrayal to all that one is or stand to Principa and all that you are?

Which is the better spiritual and non-self destructing path and which in reality brings greater wealth to oneself and nation?

Kosovo is and will always be Serbia.

Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija

pre 13 godina

So quite clearly and loudly a German politician is now stating Germany wants Serbia without Kosovo in the EU.

This was a message that until now was obvious but continually denied by the EUcrats and by D yeS to all that EU demands.

Its now out in the open and clear what EUSSR means by its "political" criteria - Serbia in EU only without Kosovo - no need for explicit recognition just your acceptance!

In the next set of elections there will be no hiding of the obviuos by D yeS to all that EU demands.

The choice will be submit to all that EUSSR demands - DS Co. or
ALL of Serbia in EU or not at all - DSS & Co.

Serbian election can and will won by the parties that state quite openly ALL of Serbia in the EU or not at all.

Kosovo principles defined the Serb and when faced with submission over principle to freedom we all know how to be accounted for.

Kosovo is and always will be Serbia - the EU needs to know that Serbians will never deviate from this and will rather go their own way even if its harder - was this not the true message from Kosovo 1389???

Serbia outwith the EU will be tougher (materially) but would one rather follow the path of that of Judas in persuit of his 30 pieces of silver and betrayal to all that one is or stand to Principa and all that you are?

Which is the better spiritual and non-self destructing path and which in reality brings greater wealth to oneself and nation?

Kosovo is and will always be Serbia.

lowe

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"

This statement is grossly incomplete! Lets get real. Let me complete it for B92!

-- Germany wants Serbia in EU so that it will one more lackey to boss around.

PS: The same, by the way, applies to Croatia, Montenegro, Macedonia etc. Just add them in and change the number of lackeys accordingly.

Dragan

pre 13 godina

If Germany wants Serbia in the EU, then it's a good reason for Serbia to stay out. Nothing good will come from Germany my friends, nothing, as history has proven. So let's do the opposite of what they want.
Cheers!!

Rick

pre 13 godina

So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU. Germany's history over the last century is that they've ALWAYS wanted domination over Serbia- trying first militarily, now economically. But they've always been denied by those "pesky and ungrateful" Serbs. But don't worry- Serbia won't subjugate themselves to Germany this time either....time is on our side....and it's driving Germany crazy! Realistically, the EU is the only "card" that Germany has to bring Serbia under it's control- and the days of the EU are truthfully numbered with the European debt and banking crises. The Serbian spirit of independence and freedom has never been extinguished over the last eight centuries....nor will it now. And it might just be our stubborness about not giving up on Kosovo (time being on our side) that will actually save us as a nation!

Mike

pre 13 godina

"Stinner said that official Berlin has recognized Kosovo and that is why he does not see that there are any outstanding issues that need to be discussed and solved in the UN."

-- Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.

Top

pre 13 godina

"So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU."
(Rick, 8 August 2010 16:46)

Yes, totally desperately! Even more, Germany founded the EU many years ago, only with the goal to finally integrate Serbia in it.

Somehow strage how the EU survived so long without Serbia.

szemi

pre 13 godina

..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say
(Luigi, 8 August 2010 20:44)
Have not known so far that Angela is male.But after all it is not a surprising mistake from a confused albanian who thinks that he is italian.

Luke Buyenovich

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"
The question is why.I will give you my take on this subject,that is as follow:Germany,economically dominant Country in EU do not want to deal with possibility
of Serbia being outside of EU with increasingly ever closer tie with Russia.Mr.Stinner is very clever politician,he knows very well by both countries Russia and Serbia outside of EU it could create unfavorable dynamics which could be costly to Germany and EU.At the present time Germany has cozy economic relationship with Russia worth more then 15 billions annually.Germany is manufacturing country,Russia with abundance of natural resources can supply all row material needed.Germany has already demonstrated they are not going to work with anyone against Russia's interest.As a result there is a RESET in USA relations with Russia.Mr.Stinner recognize Kosovo independence even with out international recognition
The position he takes is similar to ICJ.Serbia can live with it providing the Independent Kosovo is under Serbia's sovereignty Gentlemen there shall be no compromise Serbia's Orthodox Churches and Monasteries are in Serbia for ever-was is and always will be.Serbia should not be in rush to join EU or NATO.We should join those institutions right after Russia does.Yes we must stick close to Russia no matter what.From my perspective that's only way to go for us Serbs

pss

pre 13 godina

(Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija, 8 August 2010 11:03)
You really think this is some sort of earth shattering revelation?? It is more of we want you to come in and the door is open "but" it is open to Serbia as we recognize it and to the Germans that is Serbia separate from Kosovo.

justhetruth

pre 13 godina

Serbia has to meet the political and economic criteria. It also has to regulate its relations with all of its neighbors, including Kosovo,” said Stinner, adding that this does not necessarily mean international and legal recognition of Kosovo............. oppssss....does this make sense !!!!??? My Answer is ...YES

Jovan

pre 13 godina

Germany will have to learn that Serbia will join the EU only as a whole.

if Stinner thinks there is no need for discussion, he´s terribly wrong.

but the Germans will learn their lesson. they have learnt it twice in the last century.

they will learn that Serbia will not give in.

Mike

pre 13 godina

johny, maybe you have a difficult time reading my posts. Maybe you should refrain from reading them altogether since they tend to irk you - but then again you've been somewhat of an angry individual of late on your own. I was simply saying that for Germany calling what they see as an open and shut case is more than premature. Yes, Germany is a powerful country, I'm not denying that. But guess what? There's *other* countries in the region too. And most of them are in favor of some form of dialogue between Belgrade and Pristina because they, unlike some in Berlin, see nothing but a frozen conflict in its absence. Why is this so hard to understand?

I mean I guess it's better to be an ass-kisser instead of a nuiscance, but Pristina's no closer to Brussels than it was two years ago, right?

Remember when Russia shut off the gas last time? Germany was the first to cave and cut a deal with Putin. Funny isn't it?

Mike

pre 13 godina

"So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia." (johny)

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.

Luigi

pre 13 godina

i repeat ..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say in front of a German audience yes to Serbia ..everything else is mere PROPAGANDA

Top

pre 13 godina

"Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia."
(johny, 9 August 2010 18:40)

It's more like you (==Kosovo) is in a limbo to become an internationally recognized state (==UN member) at all. I don't see this happen in the near future, with the current unsolved situation.

johny

pre 13 godina

Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.
(Mike, 8 August 2010 18:55)

Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance. These countries do have the lives of the average Serb in their hands. It takes only one little action and Serbia's inflation skyrockets. Lets not talk about all the other mechanisms they have in their hands. These countries are very important for the well being of the average Serb. It is them that every winter prevent the average Serb from freezing from the cold. Go ask Tadic who he begged for warmth last winter. It was Germany. Being a nuisance does result in negative actions. So what that shows is a resolve to make Serbia as a nuisance go away. What that means is that a lasting solution passes through the word powers not through the hallways of government buildings in Serbia. That has always been the case. Powers have always created the lasting solutions.

Also you should worry about Serbia being in limbo for the indefinite future. I mean this guy was very direct and spelled it out. Serbia will not be allowed to join the clubs of the West, such as EU, NATO or any other political, military and economic alliances until it stops being a nuisance. Now for those who want to be an active part of the Western alliance and civilization that is being in a limbo. Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia.

Jovan

pre 13 godina

""[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.
(Amer, 9 August 2010 20:34) "

isn´t it interesting that a K-albanian is opening his mouth at all in regard to european economic support???

I mean, my dear Amer, you should be the last to start talking when it is about international support!

don´t you worry for Serbia, my friend, since Serbia will not only care for the Serbs in southern Serbia but also for you! ( although you are quite used to be supported, anyway )

always keep in mind: Serbia is a functioning state, while "kosovaah" is a joke. a temporarily existing one.

Top

pre 13 godina

"2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO "
(johny, 10 August 2010 06:01)

I didn't know Johny is a Serb from Kosovo. Strange.... ;-)

Aleks

pre 13 godina

"...
“Without meeting the political criteria, progress will be difficult. We want Serbia to get accepted into the EU, because we expect this to bring an essential stabilization of the region. There will be no softening of the criteria,” said Stinner..."

Stinner is a business man so of course he is interested. His CV here:

www.rainer-stinner.de/wcsite.php?wc_b=9618

I am glad that he recognizes that Serbia is "essential [to the] stabilization of the region..."

But I am confused. Serbia cannot apparently join the EU
without fully complying with the subjective dictats of Brussels (nowhere have they officially said Serbia must give up Kosovo - because they can't), yet on the other hand Serbia is essential to stabilization of the region (i.e. EU Balkan Stability Pact).

This sounds very much to me like having your cake and eating it. You simply can't and he implicitly recognizes that Serbia is still an very important player in the region.

So in reality, the message from this story is the opposite to which most of the commenters think it is.

Without Serbia, the Balkans are f***ed, the EU wants Serbia in to calm it down (and of course save a lot of money from EU member states) and in return for giving up their own Jerusalem, Belgrade gets to follow Brussels diktats!

Peggy

pre 13 godina

"Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance"
=====================

Oh johny, haven't you heard yet? China is on a shopping spree and is buying up a lot of Japanese companies right now. Soon China will own Japan.
UK is not having a good time at all at the moment either. Once these countries were giants but not any more.
China and India are the future and they are both on Serbia's side.

Amer

pre 13 godina

"[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.

johny

pre 13 godina

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.
(Mike, 9 August 2010 23:10)

Who says we might have to get around them. Maybe just maybe we think it could be good to be in the Wets patronage for a couple of decades while Serbia is in direct conflict with them? That could be a scenario that just might happen. That would do a couple of things.

1. Missions such as EULEX and others would help strengthen the rule of law.
2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO
3. Economically that is very advantageous as companies such telecom and other are sold to western companies bringing more western capital. More western interests and money means more protection from Serbia.
4. Serbia will have to make a choice either find a way living with the solution countries such as Germany impose or join the eastern front. In case they do that is still good for us because it further isolates Serbia from the West. It turns her into a Belarus.
5. Finally, things remaining the way they are are not bad for us. Its not the best but it is definitely good especially as Serbia becomes more of an antagonist and remains in conflict with the big EU countries. Our limbo has actually so far resulted in progress. I believe it will continue to do so considering the disaster where we came from in 1999. We can only grow from that for at least another 2-3 decades even if things remain the way they are. Our limbo resulting in Serbia's limbo is not all that bad either. The more in limbo Serbia remains the worse it is for Serbia; the worse its position gets. No EU means no Western help, means Putin better be prepared spending a lot of money on Serbia. If not well very soon we might end up with the same GDP. Then maybe Serbia could be ready to live with the solution countries such as Germany impose. We can actually drag our feet. The more Serbia becomes the West's antagonist the more we can drag our feet. The question is; can Serbia deal with the consequences of its antagonism for another 2-3 decades.

Serbia doesn't even hold her own future. The West does. so all these veiled threats about eternal limbos without Serbia's blessing are not only shortsighted but ironic as well. Serbia itself is in a limbo.

lowe

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"

This statement is grossly incomplete! Lets get real. Let me complete it for B92!

-- Germany wants Serbia in EU so that it will one more lackey to boss around.

PS: The same, by the way, applies to Croatia, Montenegro, Macedonia etc. Just add them in and change the number of lackeys accordingly.

Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija

pre 13 godina

So quite clearly and loudly a German politician is now stating Germany wants Serbia without Kosovo in the EU.

This was a message that until now was obvious but continually denied by the EUcrats and by D yeS to all that EU demands.

Its now out in the open and clear what EUSSR means by its "political" criteria - Serbia in EU only without Kosovo - no need for explicit recognition just your acceptance!

In the next set of elections there will be no hiding of the obviuos by D yeS to all that EU demands.

The choice will be submit to all that EUSSR demands - DS Co. or
ALL of Serbia in EU or not at all - DSS & Co.

Serbian election can and will won by the parties that state quite openly ALL of Serbia in the EU or not at all.

Kosovo principles defined the Serb and when faced with submission over principle to freedom we all know how to be accounted for.

Kosovo is and always will be Serbia - the EU needs to know that Serbians will never deviate from this and will rather go their own way even if its harder - was this not the true message from Kosovo 1389???

Serbia outwith the EU will be tougher (materially) but would one rather follow the path of that of Judas in persuit of his 30 pieces of silver and betrayal to all that one is or stand to Principa and all that you are?

Which is the better spiritual and non-self destructing path and which in reality brings greater wealth to oneself and nation?

Kosovo is and will always be Serbia.

pss

pre 13 godina

(Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Srbija, 8 August 2010 11:03)
You really think this is some sort of earth shattering revelation?? It is more of we want you to come in and the door is open "but" it is open to Serbia as we recognize it and to the Germans that is Serbia separate from Kosovo.

Rick

pre 13 godina

So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU. Germany's history over the last century is that they've ALWAYS wanted domination over Serbia- trying first militarily, now economically. But they've always been denied by those "pesky and ungrateful" Serbs. But don't worry- Serbia won't subjugate themselves to Germany this time either....time is on our side....and it's driving Germany crazy! Realistically, the EU is the only "card" that Germany has to bring Serbia under it's control- and the days of the EU are truthfully numbered with the European debt and banking crises. The Serbian spirit of independence and freedom has never been extinguished over the last eight centuries....nor will it now. And it might just be our stubborness about not giving up on Kosovo (time being on our side) that will actually save us as a nation!

Luigi

pre 13 godina

i repeat ..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say in front of a German audience yes to Serbia ..everything else is mere PROPAGANDA

johny

pre 13 godina

Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.
(Mike, 8 August 2010 18:55)

Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance. These countries do have the lives of the average Serb in their hands. It takes only one little action and Serbia's inflation skyrockets. Lets not talk about all the other mechanisms they have in their hands. These countries are very important for the well being of the average Serb. It is them that every winter prevent the average Serb from freezing from the cold. Go ask Tadic who he begged for warmth last winter. It was Germany. Being a nuisance does result in negative actions. So what that shows is a resolve to make Serbia as a nuisance go away. What that means is that a lasting solution passes through the word powers not through the hallways of government buildings in Serbia. That has always been the case. Powers have always created the lasting solutions.

Also you should worry about Serbia being in limbo for the indefinite future. I mean this guy was very direct and spelled it out. Serbia will not be allowed to join the clubs of the West, such as EU, NATO or any other political, military and economic alliances until it stops being a nuisance. Now for those who want to be an active part of the Western alliance and civilization that is being in a limbo. Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia.

Dragan

pre 13 godina

If Germany wants Serbia in the EU, then it's a good reason for Serbia to stay out. Nothing good will come from Germany my friends, nothing, as history has proven. So let's do the opposite of what they want.
Cheers!!

Top

pre 13 godina

"So Germany desperately wants Serbia in "their" EU."
(Rick, 8 August 2010 16:46)

Yes, totally desperately! Even more, Germany founded the EU many years ago, only with the goal to finally integrate Serbia in it.

Somehow strage how the EU survived so long without Serbia.

szemi

pre 13 godina

..until you listen Bundeskanzelier Angela Merkel with his own mouth say
(Luigi, 8 August 2010 20:44)
Have not known so far that Angela is male.But after all it is not a surprising mistake from a confused albanian who thinks that he is italian.

justhetruth

pre 13 godina

Serbia has to meet the political and economic criteria. It also has to regulate its relations with all of its neighbors, including Kosovo,” said Stinner, adding that this does not necessarily mean international and legal recognition of Kosovo............. oppssss....does this make sense !!!!??? My Answer is ...YES

Mike

pre 13 godina

"Stinner said that official Berlin has recognized Kosovo and that is why he does not see that there are any outstanding issues that need to be discussed and solved in the UN."

-- Well that's nice for Germany, but there's dozens of other countries that have not recognized, and even some that have are calling for substantial dialog between the two sides. That Berlin and a few other powers think such negotiations are unecessary not only shows a lack of resolve or interest in finding a lasting solution, it also perpetuates a frozen conflict that will keep Kosovo in limbo for the indefinite future.

johny

pre 13 godina

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.
(Mike, 9 August 2010 23:10)

Who says we might have to get around them. Maybe just maybe we think it could be good to be in the Wets patronage for a couple of decades while Serbia is in direct conflict with them? That could be a scenario that just might happen. That would do a couple of things.

1. Missions such as EULEX and others would help strengthen the rule of law.
2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO
3. Economically that is very advantageous as companies such telecom and other are sold to western companies bringing more western capital. More western interests and money means more protection from Serbia.
4. Serbia will have to make a choice either find a way living with the solution countries such as Germany impose or join the eastern front. In case they do that is still good for us because it further isolates Serbia from the West. It turns her into a Belarus.
5. Finally, things remaining the way they are are not bad for us. Its not the best but it is definitely good especially as Serbia becomes more of an antagonist and remains in conflict with the big EU countries. Our limbo has actually so far resulted in progress. I believe it will continue to do so considering the disaster where we came from in 1999. We can only grow from that for at least another 2-3 decades even if things remain the way they are. Our limbo resulting in Serbia's limbo is not all that bad either. The more in limbo Serbia remains the worse it is for Serbia; the worse its position gets. No EU means no Western help, means Putin better be prepared spending a lot of money on Serbia. If not well very soon we might end up with the same GDP. Then maybe Serbia could be ready to live with the solution countries such as Germany impose. We can actually drag our feet. The more Serbia becomes the West's antagonist the more we can drag our feet. The question is; can Serbia deal with the consequences of its antagonism for another 2-3 decades.

Serbia doesn't even hold her own future. The West does. so all these veiled threats about eternal limbos without Serbia's blessing are not only shortsighted but ironic as well. Serbia itself is in a limbo.

Luke Buyenovich

pre 13 godina

"Germany wants Serbia in EU"
The question is why.I will give you my take on this subject,that is as follow:Germany,economically dominant Country in EU do not want to deal with possibility
of Serbia being outside of EU with increasingly ever closer tie with Russia.Mr.Stinner is very clever politician,he knows very well by both countries Russia and Serbia outside of EU it could create unfavorable dynamics which could be costly to Germany and EU.At the present time Germany has cozy economic relationship with Russia worth more then 15 billions annually.Germany is manufacturing country,Russia with abundance of natural resources can supply all row material needed.Germany has already demonstrated they are not going to work with anyone against Russia's interest.As a result there is a RESET in USA relations with Russia.Mr.Stinner recognize Kosovo independence even with out international recognition
The position he takes is similar to ICJ.Serbia can live with it providing the Independent Kosovo is under Serbia's sovereignty Gentlemen there shall be no compromise Serbia's Orthodox Churches and Monasteries are in Serbia for ever-was is and always will be.Serbia should not be in rush to join EU or NATO.We should join those institutions right after Russia does.Yes we must stick close to Russia no matter what.From my perspective that's only way to go for us Serbs

Jovan

pre 13 godina

Germany will have to learn that Serbia will join the EU only as a whole.

if Stinner thinks there is no need for discussion, he´s terribly wrong.

but the Germans will learn their lesson. they have learnt it twice in the last century.

they will learn that Serbia will not give in.

Amer

pre 13 godina

"[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.

Top

pre 13 godina

"Now whether Serbia wants it or not these big guys have embraced Kosova; we do have their support. So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia."
(johny, 9 August 2010 18:40)

It's more like you (==Kosovo) is in a limbo to become an internationally recognized state (==UN member) at all. I don't see this happen in the near future, with the current unsolved situation.

Mike

pre 13 godina

johny, maybe you have a difficult time reading my posts. Maybe you should refrain from reading them altogether since they tend to irk you - but then again you've been somewhat of an angry individual of late on your own. I was simply saying that for Germany calling what they see as an open and shut case is more than premature. Yes, Germany is a powerful country, I'm not denying that. But guess what? There's *other* countries in the region too. And most of them are in favor of some form of dialogue between Belgrade and Pristina because they, unlike some in Berlin, see nothing but a frozen conflict in its absence. Why is this so hard to understand?

I mean I guess it's better to be an ass-kisser instead of a nuiscance, but Pristina's no closer to Brussels than it was two years ago, right?

Remember when Russia shut off the gas last time? Germany was the first to cave and cut a deal with Putin. Funny isn't it?

Mike

pre 13 godina

"So we're in a limbo only if we wanted to join the clubs of the countries such as Russia and China. We do not want that; we gonna leave that club to Serbia." (johny)

-- And good luck trying to get around them. Maybe you can ask Germany for help on that front too.

Jovan

pre 13 godina

""[The Germans] will learn that Serbia will not give in...
(Jovan, 9 August 2010 17:07) "

and that Germany is thereby relieved from having to support the country economically for the foreseeable future. I think they can probably live with that.
(Amer, 9 August 2010 20:34) "

isn´t it interesting that a K-albanian is opening his mouth at all in regard to european economic support???

I mean, my dear Amer, you should be the last to start talking when it is about international support!

don´t you worry for Serbia, my friend, since Serbia will not only care for the Serbs in southern Serbia but also for you! ( although you are quite used to be supported, anyway )

always keep in mind: Serbia is a functioning state, while "kosovaah" is a joke. a temporarily existing one.

Top

pre 13 godina

"2.We're under their protection with KFOR and NATO "
(johny, 10 August 2010 06:01)

I didn't know Johny is a Serb from Kosovo. Strange.... ;-)

Aleks

pre 13 godina

"...
“Without meeting the political criteria, progress will be difficult. We want Serbia to get accepted into the EU, because we expect this to bring an essential stabilization of the region. There will be no softening of the criteria,” said Stinner..."

Stinner is a business man so of course he is interested. His CV here:

www.rainer-stinner.de/wcsite.php?wc_b=9618

I am glad that he recognizes that Serbia is "essential [to the] stabilization of the region..."

But I am confused. Serbia cannot apparently join the EU
without fully complying with the subjective dictats of Brussels (nowhere have they officially said Serbia must give up Kosovo - because they can't), yet on the other hand Serbia is essential to stabilization of the region (i.e. EU Balkan Stability Pact).

This sounds very much to me like having your cake and eating it. You simply can't and he implicitly recognizes that Serbia is still an very important player in the region.

So in reality, the message from this story is the opposite to which most of the commenters think it is.

Without Serbia, the Balkans are f***ed, the EU wants Serbia in to calm it down (and of course save a lot of money from EU member states) and in return for giving up their own Jerusalem, Belgrade gets to follow Brussels diktats!

Peggy

pre 13 godina

"Ahh Mike the usual BS. Germany and a few other powers. These are no small fish Mike. You make it sound as if Germany, UK, France, US, Japan are just your average African countries that can't do anything to make you life difficult if Serbia continues to be a nuisance"
=====================

Oh johny, haven't you heard yet? China is on a shopping spree and is buying up a lot of Japanese companies right now. Soon China will own Japan.
UK is not having a good time at all at the moment either. Once these countries were giants but not any more.
China and India are the future and they are both on Serbia's side.