No mass grave in N. Montenegro

Dear Zoran,

wanna know where the worlds largest and most recent mass graves are-they are along a road nicknamed "the road of death" north of Kuwait. American air forces bombed disarmed and retreating Iraqi soldiers and civilians with impunity after they had promised those same people free passage.

Racist, Serb-hating commentators here will be disappointed that a mass grace containing Albanians was not found. It would have been such a great thing to pin on the Serbs. I still want to know, were are the bodies of abducted and murdered Serbs, Roma, and non-agreeable Albanians, that the KLA murdered? What did they do with the organs they harvested from these tragically unfortunate individuals? I guess Albanian corpses are more important to some racists here, than other nationalities.

I know where there are mass graves. Who is responsible? Check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dasht-i-Leili_massacre

"The Dasht-i-Leili massacre occurred in December 2001 during the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan where between 250 and 3,000 (depending on sources) Taliban prisoners were shot and/or suffocated to death in metal truck containers, while being transferred by U.S. and Northern Alliance soldiers from Kunduz to Sheberghan prison through the Dasht-i-Leili desert in Afghanistan."

Also, how about the hundred thousand reports exposed by wikileaks? The unreported massacre of so many innocent civilians? I wonder how many genocides were committed by NATO?

Zoran, Milan, you guys just don't comprehend the "might is right" way of controlling the world. If your opponent commits and alleged war crime, you set up an international court and throw their butt in jail. If powerful nations commit war crimes, they are pronounced "collateral damage", and end of story. Welcome to the new "free-world" of America and the EU.

The unreported massacre of so many innocent civilians? I wonder how many genocides were committed by NATO?
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 10:31)

Not sure about it because "war crime" or "genocide" is nothing more than "collateral damage" committed by the losing side.

So far, NATO is not (at least officially) lost the war in Afghanistan, so it's an open question.

Unique case is NATO's ex-friend Turkey. As long as they were "important friends" the question of Armenian genocide was avoided. Now it's near-official.

Otherwise think about "collateral damage" of Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki. It wasn't a war crime.

Okay, I wonder if "roberto" is going to chime in on this. He went on and on when there was a CLAIM of a mass grave which now shows to be PHONY - as actually several other claims have proven to be empty, much smaller, or of different ethnicity than the original claim.

Remember how in the claim it even had a story of how they were allegedly killed - it just shows how EASY it is to make these claims and for them to be news as if it is already proven.

I'm still waiting on them to even find ONE body in the alleged mass grave claim in Serbia a few months ago.

The most recent report said they haven't even started digging and were going to take soil samples.

If only they'd wait until they actually find bodies - or better yet - get at least a few identities, if so - then it wouldn't be propaganda.

Why is there the delay on the claim of the mass grave from months ago? I think it is another phony one and some don't want it proven as such and are delaying the truth.

Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict.

The ICTY's definition of a 'mass grave' is one with more than two bodies in it. I'm sure if pressed. Thaci could provide (like Racak) some and the ICTY could issue and indicitment. After all, the ICTY sees no difference between civilians, soldiers, non-combatants etc.

Okay, I wonder if "roberto" is going to chime in on this.
(ida, 28 July 2010 13:06)
--
Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.

Gladko, same goes for Albanians, Croats, Serb muslims in Bosnia. What is your point? Are you just looking at others, and not yourself? Turn your finger 180 degrees, and then real reconciliation can start in the balkans.

Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict.
(Gladko, 28 July 2010 12:55)
=====================

Are you saying that this is a mass grave and someone is covering it up?

roberto... "i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly".

YOU wanted it checked?

No first hand knowledge and yet you do your best to appear as if YOU are an expert on the Balkans, someone in a position of authority?

If you want to even appear credible, you really need to give up your middle school position, stop working temp jobs in the summer and apply for a clerkship with Christiane Amanpour.

but pls keep up the libels. you guys are the top of the mark :)
(roberto, 29 July 2010 06:22)
--
Bwhahaha, who are you roberto? If you are suggesting "libel" then it would have to be against a real person with a real name. Not someone hiding behind an alias who lives in "frisco".

I was thinking the same initially - but after I exchange e-mails with him, it does look he believes what he says and he is not paid for doing that. That I deeply disagree with what he says and often it makes me mad - that's a different question.
(Ataman, 28 July 2010 23:19)
Indeed there are two types of SZDSZ( a failed party similar to Ceda's LDP) minded people:those who get good sorosian saleries and those who say and write stupidities out of endless hatred.The latter one is even more destructive.

Dresden bombing was murder in "cold blood". Period!

Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings helped to save lives.
(Bubba Lee Bob, 28 July 2010 16:16)

All of them qualify as "War Crime" at it's finest. Who ordered, should be hanged, period.

But not in this world.

BTW: a large part of my family perished in Auschwitz, my grandma was in Mauthausen and my grandpa was taken to Serbia (Bor), same KZ where Miklós Radnóti was.

But despite this - no double standards.

Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 14:48)

I was thinking the same initially - but after I exchange e-mails with him, it does look he believes what he says and he is not paid for doing that. That I deeply disagree with what he says and often it makes me mad - that's a different question.

«Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs »

I was talking about the Serbs on this forum. Using all the time the same arguments and pointing at others while they should turn their fingers 180 degrees as one forumist so well said, I recognize that crimes were committed by all but not in the same proportions. Numbers are there to shhow the evidence.
(Gladko, 29 July 2010 12:54)

That's not what you wrote. You made a general accusation against serbs. But hey, don't let your subjective opinion (without links or quotations) get in the way of proven facts, not the famous guesstimates peddled by the ICTY and others. After all, your opinion is more important and more correct than everyone else's, no? If only the real world was black and white as some would want us to believe.

Speaking of 'numbers', do you know what the ICRC refugee statistics are for Serbia in the 1990s? It seems some 'numbers' are relevant and others aren't...

"Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict."
(Gladko, 28 July 2010 12:55)

Come on Gladko, can't you do any better than putting up straw man arguments?

Completely misrepresenting what most Serbs believe is not going to win you any credit.

Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs but point out that:

a) Everyone committed crimes;

b) Those that the serbs were accused of were either made up or massively inflated (250,000 bosnian moslems killed, 60,000 bosnian women raped, systematic death and rape camps, 10,000 albanians killed etc.);

c) that the 'winning' side seems to get very lightly treated by the ICTY because they are supported by most of the big powers.

That is quite a more sophisticated view than your claim that the serbs say they did nothing.

Or do you think it reasonable that the media and everyone else should continue to repeat the proven false lies and propaganda of the wars?

BTW, is your interpretation of 'too many serbs' more or less than (lets take an arbitrary number) 10? Sounds like serbophobic subjectivity to me.

«Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs »

I was talking about the Serbs on this forum. Using all the time the same arguments and pointing at others while they should turn their fingers 180 degrees as one forumist so well said, I recognize that crimes were committed by all but not in the same proportions. Numbers are there to shhow the evidence.

i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly
=================

Why don't you take a trip down there and see if it has been checked out properly.
Seems you don't believe the west now either.

Otherwise think about "collateral damage" of Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki. It wasn't a war crime.
(Ataman, 28 July 2010 11:30)

Dresden bombing was murder in "cold blood". Period!

Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings helped to save lives.

Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 14:48)

a very special thank you to my very best frnds at b-92. they print every ugly libel ag. me and then censor all of my postings. in other words, every side is guilty... right?

i really do love the part about "paid" lobbyist. pls, someone, anyone, fix me up w a pay-er and i'll consider. i've just been slaving at a (temp) 12 hour-a day job, yes, 12, and it is a tad brutal... pls be on the look-out for paid, interesting gigs for me :) we're on summer vacation, or in my case staycation.

i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly.

as for raska, that one has been known for some time. only recently has eulex put the um pressure on yr beloved blgd regime. but not too much pressure. so far they've just scooped up a few samples. i love! yr "post" milosevic regime.

in serbia alone, they found over 800 albanian bodies, in every (mis)shape of burn, bloat, shot in the head, tortured, whatever. thank you dear Serbia!

and to yr loyal media -- i just love you guys. can we please interview yr veran matic again this spring. i have a few more questions to ask him...

but pls keep up the libels. you guys are the top of the mark :)

roberto
in \the (relativey) civilized west

Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict.

Otherwise think about "collateral damage" of Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki. It wasn't a war crime.
(Ataman, 28 July 2010 11:30)

Dresden bombing was murder in "cold blood". Period!

Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings helped to save lives.

Racist, Serb-hating commentators here will be disappointed that a mass grace containing Albanians was not found. It would have been such a great thing to pin on the Serbs. I still want to know, were are the bodies of abducted and murdered Serbs, Roma, and non-agreeable Albanians, that the KLA murdered? What did they do with the organs they harvested from these tragically unfortunate individuals? I guess Albanian corpses are more important to some racists here, than other nationalities.

Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 14:48)

a very special thank you to my very best frnds at b-92. they print every ugly libel ag. me and then censor all of my postings. in other words, every side is guilty... right?

i really do love the part about "paid" lobbyist. pls, someone, anyone, fix me up w a pay-er and i'll consider. i've just been slaving at a (temp) 12 hour-a day job, yes, 12, and it is a tad brutal... pls be on the look-out for paid, interesting gigs for me :) we're on summer vacation, or in my case staycation.

i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly.

as for raska, that one has been known for some time. only recently has eulex put the um pressure on yr beloved blgd regime. but not too much pressure. so far they've just scooped up a few samples. i love! yr "post" milosevic regime.

in serbia alone, they found over 800 albanian bodies, in every (mis)shape of burn, bloat, shot in the head, tortured, whatever. thank you dear Serbia!

and to yr loyal media -- i just love you guys. can we please interview yr veran matic again this spring. i have a few more questions to ask him...

but pls keep up the libels. you guys are the top of the mark :)

roberto
in \the (relativey) civilized west

Zoran, Milan, you guys just don't comprehend the "might is right" way of controlling the world. If your opponent commits and alleged war crime, you set up an international court and throw their butt in jail. If powerful nations commit war crimes, they are pronounced "collateral damage", and end of story. Welcome to the new "free-world" of America and the EU.

The ICTY's definition of a 'mass grave' is one with more than two bodies in it. I'm sure if pressed. Thaci could provide (like Racak) some and the ICTY could issue and indicitment. After all, the ICTY sees no difference between civilians, soldiers, non-combatants etc.

«Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs »

I was talking about the Serbs on this forum. Using all the time the same arguments and pointing at others while they should turn their fingers 180 degrees as one forumist so well said, I recognize that crimes were committed by all but not in the same proportions. Numbers are there to shhow the evidence.

I know where there are mass graves. Who is responsible? Check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dasht-i-Leili_massacre

"The Dasht-i-Leili massacre occurred in December 2001 during the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan where between 250 and 3,000 (depending on sources) Taliban prisoners were shot and/or suffocated to death in metal truck containers, while being transferred by U.S. and Northern Alliance soldiers from Kunduz to Sheberghan prison through the Dasht-i-Leili desert in Afghanistan."

Also, how about the hundred thousand reports exposed by wikileaks? The unreported massacre of so many innocent civilians? I wonder how many genocides were committed by NATO?

Dear Zoran,

wanna know where the worlds largest and most recent mass graves are-they are along a road nicknamed "the road of death" north of Kuwait. American air forces bombed disarmed and retreating Iraqi soldiers and civilians with impunity after they had promised those same people free passage.

The unreported massacre of so many innocent civilians? I wonder how many genocides were committed by NATO?
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 10:31)

Not sure about it because "war crime" or "genocide" is nothing more than "collateral damage" committed by the losing side.

So far, NATO is not (at least officially) lost the war in Afghanistan, so it's an open question.

Unique case is NATO's ex-friend Turkey. As long as they were "important friends" the question of Armenian genocide was avoided. Now it's near-official.

Otherwise think about "collateral damage" of Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki. It wasn't a war crime.

Okay, I wonder if "roberto" is going to chime in on this. He went on and on when there was a CLAIM of a mass grave which now shows to be PHONY - as actually several other claims have proven to be empty, much smaller, or of different ethnicity than the original claim.

Remember how in the claim it even had a story of how they were allegedly killed - it just shows how EASY it is to make these claims and for them to be news as if it is already proven.

I'm still waiting on them to even find ONE body in the alleged mass grave claim in Serbia a few months ago.

The most recent report said they haven't even started digging and were going to take soil samples.

If only they'd wait until they actually find bodies - or better yet - get at least a few identities, if so - then it wouldn't be propaganda.

Why is there the delay on the claim of the mass grave from months ago? I think it is another phony one and some don't want it proven as such and are delaying the truth.

Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict.
(Gladko, 28 July 2010 12:55)
=====================

Are you saying that this is a mass grave and someone is covering it up?

Okay, I wonder if "roberto" is going to chime in on this.
(ida, 28 July 2010 13:06)
--
Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.

Roberto is a paid lobbyist. He earns money writing anti-Serbian rubbish.
(Zoran, 28 July 2010 14:48)

I was thinking the same initially - but after I exchange e-mails with him, it does look he believes what he says and he is not paid for doing that. That I deeply disagree with what he says and often it makes me mad - that's a different question.

"Too many Serbs point a finger at others and don't recognize the crimes committed by their own people. Such an attitude does not help the resolution of the conflict."
(Gladko, 28 July 2010 12:55)

Come on Gladko, can't you do any better than putting up straw man arguments?

Completely misrepresenting what most Serbs believe is not going to win you any credit.

Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs but point out that:

a) Everyone committed crimes;

b) Those that the serbs were accused of were either made up or massively inflated (250,000 bosnian moslems killed, 60,000 bosnian women raped, systematic death and rape camps, 10,000 albanians killed etc.);

c) that the 'winning' side seems to get very lightly treated by the ICTY because they are supported by most of the big powers.

That is quite a more sophisticated view than your claim that the serbs say they did nothing.

Or do you think it reasonable that the media and everyone else should continue to repeat the proven false lies and propaganda of the wars?

BTW, is your interpretation of 'too many serbs' more or less than (lets take an arbitrary number) 10? Sounds like serbophobic subjectivity to me.

but pls keep up the libels. you guys are the top of the mark :)
(roberto, 29 July 2010 06:22)
--
Bwhahaha, who are you roberto? If you are suggesting "libel" then it would have to be against a real person with a real name. Not someone hiding behind an alias who lives in "frisco".

roberto... "i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly".

YOU wanted it checked?

No first hand knowledge and yet you do your best to appear as if YOU are an expert on the Balkans, someone in a position of authority?

If you want to even appear credible, you really need to give up your middle school position, stop working temp jobs in the summer and apply for a clerkship with Christiane Amanpour.

«Most serbs do not say that no war crimes were committed by the serbs »

I was talking about the Serbs on this forum. Using all the time the same arguments and pointing at others while they should turn their fingers 180 degrees as one forumist so well said, I recognize that crimes were committed by all but not in the same proportions. Numbers are there to shhow the evidence.
(Gladko, 29 July 2010 12:54)

That's not what you wrote. You made a general accusation against serbs. But hey, don't let your subjective opinion (without links or quotations) get in the way of proven facts, not the famous guesstimates peddled by the ICTY and others. After all, your opinion is more important and more correct than everyone else's, no? If only the real world was black and white as some would want us to believe.

Speaking of 'numbers', do you know what the ICRC refugee statistics are for Serbia in the 1990s? It seems some 'numbers' are relevant and others aren't...

Gladko, same goes for Albanians, Croats, Serb muslims in Bosnia. What is your point? Are you just looking at others, and not yourself? Turn your finger 180 degrees, and then real reconciliation can start in the balkans.

Dresden bombing was murder in "cold blood". Period!

Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings helped to save lives.
(Bubba Lee Bob, 28 July 2010 16:16)

All of them qualify as "War Crime" at it's finest. Who ordered, should be hanged, period.

But not in this world.

BTW: a large part of my family perished in Auschwitz, my grandma was in Mauthausen and my grandpa was taken to Serbia (Bor), same KZ where Miklós Radnóti was.

But despite this - no double standards.

I was thinking the same initially - but after I exchange e-mails with him, it does look he believes what he says and he is not paid for doing that. That I deeply disagree with what he says and often it makes me mad - that's a different question.
(Ataman, 28 July 2010 23:19)
Indeed there are two types of SZDSZ( a failed party similar to Ceda's LDP) minded people:those who get good sorosian saleries and those who say and write stupidities out of endless hatred.The latter one is even more destructive.

i had no idea about this site in montenegro. we heard about it, i wanted it checked, and still not sure if it has been properly
=================

Why don't you take a trip down there and see if it has been checked out properly.
Seems you don't believe the west now either.