Turkey's role in Balkans explored

Peter - great post,
Turkey are not welcome in the Balkans, and should keep their nose out of our affairs. They have caused enough damage over the centuries, and the last thing we need is more Turks. However, I would encourage all Turks to flood their beloved Germany. The Turks and Germans deserve each other, and I hope this love affair grows and grows.
Cheers!!

It is good to see the Turkish power rising. It is necessary to have a powerful and laicistic Turkish state. Of course, some hardliners in Belgrade and Athens will not like that at all, but they will have to face that their bankrupt and weak systems are even more declining. With the current development we can expect in 30-40 years a completed powershift in that region to the advantage of Turkey and its allies, with over 100 Mio inhabitants in Turkey and at least 20 Mio Albanians.
(J.C., 21 July 2010 12:05)

Yes, fantastic. I am very optimistic about a strong Turkey in Europe. I hope they expand and build their mosques and fill our European lands with millions of immigrants from their 5-6 children in each family over the next 30-40 years, as you say. With their glorious history in the Balkans and Caucasus, not to mention their human rights record over the centuries, I hope that Europe can see a little more of that in the future.

We can always shun the memories of our ancestors who gave their blood in stopping the Ottoman advance in Europe and driving them out after 600 years of invasion, forced conversion, oppression and genocide in some cases (Armenians and Greeks come to mind), no big deal at all. I would love to see more Constantinople to Istanbul situations across the whole of Europe.

BTW Hardliners in Belgrade and Athens only? Why do you think Turkey is not in the EU, despite being a candidate for over a decade? What does it tell you that even the most ultra-liberal governments of France and Germany don't want Turkey are part of the EU?

Turkey is not Europe, never was, never will be. No sane European would ever accept them, since the only thing that you seem to be complementing them and Albanians for is that they can shoot out vast numbers of babies when their economies are no different to any other in Africa, Asia and the Middle East. Outbreeding local populations is hardly anything to be proud of. I'd hate to think that Europe will turn into Turkey or Albania in the next 40-50 years, with nothing more than mosques, overpopulation and poverty to show in place of thousands of years of European culture, history and progression.

Regards!

Turkey's attempts to regain its influence in Middle east by introducing Erdogan's much publicised 'zero problems' policy with its neighbours has been a flop.

All of Erdogan's actions are determined by public opinion.

When public opinion is pointing fingers to Erdogan's incompetence at economic governance, they wag the dog by deflecting public attention through killing a few so called " Kurd separatists".Needless to say that all his announcements on the "Kurdish Question"ie autonomy,language,education have been only cosmetic with no real changes.

When Erdogan's party clashed with the military in the recent"ergenicon"consiracy his immediate reaction was to send few military airplanes to fly over greek islands.

When Erdogan's attempts th broker a deal between Iran and the US on the nuclear issue failed he decided to send the naval flotilla to Gaza which resulted in nine people losing their lives.

What Erdogan has managed to achieve while in power is the total control of Turkey by Islamists.But he is deluding himself of restoring
"Ottoman" influence in the Middle East because such an attempt will be in conflict with Ahmadinejad's planned domination of the Islamic world and also with Arab nationalism.

Here is another reason for Serbia to stay out of the leacherous EU, Turkey. They (the Tuukos), are trying to become international players, mainly representing muslims - their recent criminal attempts in breaking the Gaza blockade, as an example. The Turkos have an evil history, and it will take decades to change. Just ask the Aremanians.

To John C

You either ignorant or you conveniently ommitt any reference to Turkey's past.

Turkey is recognised as a country with a horrible human rights record. Their treatment of the Kurds would make the most jingoistic Israelis baulk in horror.

When will Turkey withdraw its 40,000 occupation troops and 250,000 settlers from northern Cyprus and allow the 200,000 Greek Cypriots ethnically cleansed during Turkey's invasion of the island in 1974 to return to their homes? Turkey has been engaged in a systematic campaign to wipe out all signs of Greek and Christian civilisation.
For Turks to cast themselves as the good guys in the balkans is an insult to our intelligence.

Then again i don't expect an Albanian to criticise his muslim brothers.Muslims follow the same policies everywhere.Their motto is " lets breed and then take over somebodyelse's country".You've done the same thing in Kosovo and the Turks in Cyprus.

BTW If Turkey was such a nice
place to live your compatriots will move there en masse and not to Greece-a bankrupt country as you call it.Still our GDP/head is 5 times higher of Turkey's one.

Keep cool, Peter. Where did I lose word about the EU? According to your radical Serb and Greek friends here, EU is anyway doomed, so what's the fuss?

Turkey will increase power, no matter if EU will come or not. It is simply natural that this is going to happen and the growth rates prove me right. This has also nothing to do with mosques or any other silly attempt of you to put words in my mouth I didn't say. In the contrary, I explicitely hailed the laicistic approach which started under Atatürk and has been, unfortunately, turned down by the current Turkish administration. But I'm sure that this is only a political episode. Turkey will be the regional power of the Middle East, bridging West and East. Just go to Istambul and see how European this city is, while also see that Anatolia is Asia. Turkey is simply both and it is going to be even more. Keep watching!

But it interesting to see how the reaction fell when somebody correctly states that Turkey is a rising star in the region. Haven't you read the news, lately? I mean not the Greek fakelaki news where journalists live a dangerous life when they try to expose fakelakis and got murdered for that.
(JohnC., 21 July 2010 21:10

I agree with you that Turkey is the rising star but of the
"Midnight Express" type.If you mention the Armenian genocide,the Greek progroms or the Kurds you disappear and not seen again.

I did read about the murder of the journalist but i also saw that a gang of twelve Albanians responsible for thirty six armed robberies and three murders were broken up.

Peter S.
--------

Do you mind telling me how the Ottoman empire was any different from other empires of its time and others before it?

Also, how are any of the violations it commits today any different from what Russia and China commit every day...or what so called Christian Balkan nations perpetrated on their minorities as recently as a few years ago?

You know, a couple of weeks ago, you were whining how European national teams were looking a little too "mixed" in the world cup.

You then took issue when I implied that you were a bigoted racist.

But post after post, that's exactly what you display.

At least be man enough to own up to it. Folks like you are a burden to the countries they live in.

Some really try to compare crime which can be found in every country with the disgusting murder in a manner of a execution (15 bullets hit the journalist)? Serious question, don't feel not even a little bit ashamed when your only response is only pointing the finger on others?

Now I understand how it was possible that Greece was capable to cheat on that unmeasurable scale. That journalist died because he wanted to expose some of those (criminal) elements and got murdered for it.

To John C
...
(Leonidas, 21 July 2010 18:04)

You clearly have reading problems, aren`t you? Well if that would have been the only flaw, ...

But it interesting to see how the reaction fell when somebody correctly states that Turkey is a rising star in the region. Haven't you read the news, lately? I mean not the Greek fakelaki news where journalists live a dangerous life when they try to expose fakelakis and got murdered for that.

Tryning to compare a common crime in Greece with the rising power of Turkey is simply out of logic. These two thing are totally irrelevant.

Turkey clearly has strong potential of being a stronger country in the next decades but it also has strong potential of being much worse. Big steps come with big problems. Turkey has a civil war with the 10 million Kurds inside Turkey (a huge minority that don't consider themselves Turks), that could reach devastating levels.

Nowdays this war has intensified with Turkish troops killed almost on a daily basis, and Turkey being absolutely incapable of solving the issue militarily. It has failed completely to defeat the Kurds separatists, and after 20 years of war and billions of dolllars spend for the war effort and military, Kurds nowdays are even stronger than before. They are hiting towns and cities inside Turkey (something that they never did before) and they even attack whole military camps - killing dozens of soldiers in one attack. The war there has already gone to other levels, with Turkey being totally desperate and incapable of solving the issue. That's why "mr" Ertogan has started "political dialogue" with the Kurds...

Those of you who bet on a strong Turkey consider the possibility that the western powers (with "Israeli" help) might decide to create a Kurdish state in the region finally. If that happens, Turkey will simply break apart in a worse way than Yugoslavia did, as 60% of Kursish land is being captrured by Turkey today... and Turkey is damn teriffied of that...

It is good to see the Turkish power rising. It is necessary to have a powerful and laicistic Turkish state. Of course, some hardliners in Belgrade and Athens will not like that at all, but they will have to face that their bankrupt and weak systems are even more declining. With the current development we can expect in 30-40 years a completed powershift in that region to the advantage of Turkey and its allies, with over 100 Mio inhabitants in Turkey and at least 20 Mio Albanians.

J.C.

Well, not exactly doomed, but most certainly not as popular as it was years ago with Euroscepism rising in the political and general scene of even its members.

Turkey can do whatever it likes, it can become the richest and most prosperous country in the world, and I wish them well, but they must stay out of Europe at all costs, that is all that I was saying earlier.

Ment

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. More judgement and more ad hominem from you rather than rationally looking at my argument from another perspective. Again.

Best example, Ottoman Empire mass-murdered 1,5 million Armenians and another 500,000 Greeks and other Ottoman Christians in 1915. They to this day deny it and it is even considered a criminal offense to challenge this as an "insult to Turkishness".

Comparing this to Russia (BTW USSR is can not be called the same thing as Russia, since millions of Russians died under communism also) and Christian Balkan nations is quite simply ridiculous.

China I am not interested in this regard, they do not claim to be a European nation and want to join the EU, like Turkey does, when European morals and values are directly opposite to Turkey's historical behaviour and even current behaviours towards Kurds, Greeks (violating their airspace, invasion of Cyprus etc.) or Armenians (refusing to accept that they came close to wiping them off the face of the earth).

For hundreds of years of cruel conquest, occupation, islamization, slavery, kidnapping and other crimes against Europe, we thank them very much for further role in the Balkans/Europe.

I'm sorry that as a proud European who knows his history and is aware of the damage that both communism and islam has caused Europe and its people that you think I am a bigotted racist or whatever, but I understand that you are simply too ignorant to consider the fact that there are people who exist who have open minds and speak them, rather than conforming to typical brainless NWO drone thought like you do.

You want bigotted racists? Here they are:

http://eaglespearlsofwisdom.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/islam-marchers.jpg

PS. How can you possibly have the audacity to formulate an opinion of me being a "burden" to my country when you don't know the first thing about me? It truly shows the ground zero level of your argumentative skills and strength thereof.

Dragan, The Greek, winston and my man Leonidas, thank you for not being robots. Thank you for having your own independent thinking, opinions and perceptions about the world we live in.

Pity you are so few.

Keep cool, Peter. Where did I lose word about the EU? According to your radical Serb and Greek friends here, EU is anyway doomed, so what's the fuss?

Turkey will increase power, no matter if EU will come or not. It is simply natural that this is going to happen and the growth rates prove me right. This has also nothing to do with mosques or any other silly attempt of you to put words in my mouth I didn't say. In the contrary, I explicitely hailed the laicistic approach which started under Atatürk and has been, unfortunately, turned down by the current Turkish administration. But I'm sure that this is only a political episode. Turkey will be the regional power of the Middle East, bridging West and East. Just go to Istambul and see how European this city is, while also see that Anatolia is Asia. Turkey is simply both and it is going to be even more. Keep watching!

Here is another reason for Serbia to stay out of the leacherous EU, Turkey. They (the Tuukos), are trying to become international players, mainly representing muslims - their recent criminal attempts in breaking the Gaza blockade, as an example. The Turkos have an evil history, and it will take decades to change. Just ask the Aremanians.

It is good to see the Turkish power rising. It is necessary to have a powerful and laicistic Turkish state. Of course, some hardliners in Belgrade and Athens will not like that at all, but they will have to face that their bankrupt and weak systems are even more declining. With the current development we can expect in 30-40 years a completed powershift in that region to the advantage of Turkey and its allies, with over 100 Mio inhabitants in Turkey and at least 20 Mio Albanians.

It is good to see the Turkish power rising. It is necessary to have a powerful and laicistic Turkish state. Of course, some hardliners in Belgrade and Athens will not like that at all, but they will have to face that their bankrupt and weak systems are even more declining. With the current development we can expect in 30-40 years a completed powershift in that region to the advantage of Turkey and its allies, with over 100 Mio inhabitants in Turkey and at least 20 Mio Albanians.
(J.C., 21 July 2010 12:05)

Yes, fantastic. I am very optimistic about a strong Turkey in Europe. I hope they expand and build their mosques and fill our European lands with millions of immigrants from their 5-6 children in each family over the next 30-40 years, as you say. With their glorious history in the Balkans and Caucasus, not to mention their human rights record over the centuries, I hope that Europe can see a little more of that in the future.

We can always shun the memories of our ancestors who gave their blood in stopping the Ottoman advance in Europe and driving them out after 600 years of invasion, forced conversion, oppression and genocide in some cases (Armenians and Greeks come to mind), no big deal at all. I would love to see more Constantinople to Istanbul situations across the whole of Europe.

BTW Hardliners in Belgrade and Athens only? Why do you think Turkey is not in the EU, despite being a candidate for over a decade? What does it tell you that even the most ultra-liberal governments of France and Germany don't want Turkey are part of the EU?

Turkey is not Europe, never was, never will be. No sane European would ever accept them, since the only thing that you seem to be complementing them and Albanians for is that they can shoot out vast numbers of babies when their economies are no different to any other in Africa, Asia and the Middle East. Outbreeding local populations is hardly anything to be proud of. I'd hate to think that Europe will turn into Turkey or Albania in the next 40-50 years, with nothing more than mosques, overpopulation and poverty to show in place of thousands of years of European culture, history and progression.

Regards!

Turkey's attempts to regain its influence in Middle east by introducing Erdogan's much publicised 'zero problems' policy with its neighbours has been a flop.

All of Erdogan's actions are determined by public opinion.

When public opinion is pointing fingers to Erdogan's incompetence at economic governance, they wag the dog by deflecting public attention through killing a few so called " Kurd separatists".Needless to say that all his announcements on the "Kurdish Question"ie autonomy,language,education have been only cosmetic with no real changes.

When Erdogan's party clashed with the military in the recent"ergenicon"consiracy his immediate reaction was to send few military airplanes to fly over greek islands.

When Erdogan's attempts th broker a deal between Iran and the US on the nuclear issue failed he decided to send the naval flotilla to Gaza which resulted in nine people losing their lives.

What Erdogan has managed to achieve while in power is the total control of Turkey by Islamists.But he is deluding himself of restoring
"Ottoman" influence in the Middle East because such an attempt will be in conflict with Ahmadinejad's planned domination of the Islamic world and also with Arab nationalism.

Peter - great post,
Turkey are not welcome in the Balkans, and should keep their nose out of our affairs. They have caused enough damage over the centuries, and the last thing we need is more Turks. However, I would encourage all Turks to flood their beloved Germany. The Turks and Germans deserve each other, and I hope this love affair grows and grows.
Cheers!!

Peter S.
--------

Do you mind telling me how the Ottoman empire was any different from other empires of its time and others before it?

Also, how are any of the violations it commits today any different from what Russia and China commit every day...or what so called Christian Balkan nations perpetrated on their minorities as recently as a few years ago?

You know, a couple of weeks ago, you were whining how European national teams were looking a little too "mixed" in the world cup.

You then took issue when I implied that you were a bigoted racist.

But post after post, that's exactly what you display.

At least be man enough to own up to it. Folks like you are a burden to the countries they live in.

To John C
...
(Leonidas, 21 July 2010 18:04)

You clearly have reading problems, aren`t you? Well if that would have been the only flaw, ...

But it interesting to see how the reaction fell when somebody correctly states that Turkey is a rising star in the region. Haven't you read the news, lately? I mean not the Greek fakelaki news where journalists live a dangerous life when they try to expose fakelakis and got murdered for that.

To John C

You either ignorant or you conveniently ommitt any reference to Turkey's past.

Turkey is recognised as a country with a horrible human rights record. Their treatment of the Kurds would make the most jingoistic Israelis baulk in horror.

When will Turkey withdraw its 40,000 occupation troops and 250,000 settlers from northern Cyprus and allow the 200,000 Greek Cypriots ethnically cleansed during Turkey's invasion of the island in 1974 to return to their homes? Turkey has been engaged in a systematic campaign to wipe out all signs of Greek and Christian civilisation.
For Turks to cast themselves as the good guys in the balkans is an insult to our intelligence.

Then again i don't expect an Albanian to criticise his muslim brothers.Muslims follow the same policies everywhere.Their motto is " lets breed and then take over somebodyelse's country".You've done the same thing in Kosovo and the Turks in Cyprus.

BTW If Turkey was such a nice
place to live your compatriots will move there en masse and not to Greece-a bankrupt country as you call it.Still our GDP/head is 5 times higher of Turkey's one.

Some really try to compare crime which can be found in every country with the disgusting murder in a manner of a execution (15 bullets hit the journalist)? Serious question, don't feel not even a little bit ashamed when your only response is only pointing the finger on others?

Now I understand how it was possible that Greece was capable to cheat on that unmeasurable scale. That journalist died because he wanted to expose some of those (criminal) elements and got murdered for it.

Tryning to compare a common crime in Greece with the rising power of Turkey is simply out of logic. These two thing are totally irrelevant.

Turkey clearly has strong potential of being a stronger country in the next decades but it also has strong potential of being much worse. Big steps come with big problems. Turkey has a civil war with the 10 million Kurds inside Turkey (a huge minority that don't consider themselves Turks), that could reach devastating levels.

Nowdays this war has intensified with Turkish troops killed almost on a daily basis, and Turkey being absolutely incapable of solving the issue militarily. It has failed completely to defeat the Kurds separatists, and after 20 years of war and billions of dolllars spend for the war effort and military, Kurds nowdays are even stronger than before. They are hiting towns and cities inside Turkey (something that they never did before) and they even attack whole military camps - killing dozens of soldiers in one attack. The war there has already gone to other levels, with Turkey being totally desperate and incapable of solving the issue. That's why "mr" Ertogan has started "political dialogue" with the Kurds...

Those of you who bet on a strong Turkey consider the possibility that the western powers (with "Israeli" help) might decide to create a Kurdish state in the region finally. If that happens, Turkey will simply break apart in a worse way than Yugoslavia did, as 60% of Kursish land is being captrured by Turkey today... and Turkey is damn teriffied of that...

But it interesting to see how the reaction fell when somebody correctly states that Turkey is a rising star in the region. Haven't you read the news, lately? I mean not the Greek fakelaki news where journalists live a dangerous life when they try to expose fakelakis and got murdered for that.
(JohnC., 21 July 2010 21:10

I agree with you that Turkey is the rising star but of the
"Midnight Express" type.If you mention the Armenian genocide,the Greek progroms or the Kurds you disappear and not seen again.

I did read about the murder of the journalist but i also saw that a gang of twelve Albanians responsible for thirty six armed robberies and three murders were broken up.

J.C.

Well, not exactly doomed, but most certainly not as popular as it was years ago with Euroscepism rising in the political and general scene of even its members.

Turkey can do whatever it likes, it can become the richest and most prosperous country in the world, and I wish them well, but they must stay out of Europe at all costs, that is all that I was saying earlier.

Ment

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. More judgement and more ad hominem from you rather than rationally looking at my argument from another perspective. Again.

Best example, Ottoman Empire mass-murdered 1,5 million Armenians and another 500,000 Greeks and other Ottoman Christians in 1915. They to this day deny it and it is even considered a criminal offense to challenge this as an "insult to Turkishness".

Comparing this to Russia (BTW USSR is can not be called the same thing as Russia, since millions of Russians died under communism also) and Christian Balkan nations is quite simply ridiculous.

China I am not interested in this regard, they do not claim to be a European nation and want to join the EU, like Turkey does, when European morals and values are directly opposite to Turkey's historical behaviour and even current behaviours towards Kurds, Greeks (violating their airspace, invasion of Cyprus etc.) or Armenians (refusing to accept that they came close to wiping them off the face of the earth).

For hundreds of years of cruel conquest, occupation, islamization, slavery, kidnapping and other crimes against Europe, we thank them very much for further role in the Balkans/Europe.

I'm sorry that as a proud European who knows his history and is aware of the damage that both communism and islam has caused Europe and its people that you think I am a bigotted racist or whatever, but I understand that you are simply too ignorant to consider the fact that there are people who exist who have open minds and speak them, rather than conforming to typical brainless NWO drone thought like you do.

You want bigotted racists? Here they are:

http://eaglespearlsofwisdom.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/islam-marchers.jpg

PS. How can you possibly have the audacity to formulate an opinion of me being a "burden" to my country when you don't know the first thing about me? It truly shows the ground zero level of your argumentative skills and strength thereof.

Dragan, The Greek, winston and my man Leonidas, thank you for not being robots. Thank you for having your own independent thinking, opinions and perceptions about the world we live in.

Pity you are so few.