31

Thursday, 08.07.2010.

16:54

"Recognize south, send army, police to north"

The National Defense University (NDU) in Washington political science professor Steven Meyer says Serbia should demand a partition of Kosovo.

Izvor: FoNet

"Recognize south, send army, police to north" IMAGE SOURCE
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31 Komentari

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Denis

pre 13 godina

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.
(pyrros, 9 July 2010 09:56)

Maybe that is why 9 out of 10 of Greek revolution leaders were chams, and you still like to sing and dance the famous Osman Taka dance, from Janina, an albanian folkloric dance.

Maybe you should explain to us why Marko Bocari spoke in albanian and even wrote an Albaina-Greek dictonary and not an Greek-Vlah one...

Maybe you should explain what did Zerva's army do in Chameria in 1944-1945....

It is not your fault, but that of Albanians who saved your behind many times in history, all the way to 50 yrs ago when they fed and sheltered some 200K greek refugees while you were killing each other...

Greece now wants to build cemeteries of WWI greek soldiers in south Albania to commemorate their heroism, but Alb can't even cry their dead that you slaughtered in Chameria.... in the end of WWII.

Beware though, what comes around goes around.

Steve JP

pre 13 godina

Everywhere that Serbia has its churches, monasteries,(even those ruined) and cemeteries in Kosovo-whether north, south, east, or west; those structures; those areas must continue to be recognized by Serbia, forever.

pirro i epirit

pre 13 godina

Chameria existed, until 1945 at least, after ww2 chameria was genocided, that is why no albanian is to be found there, and that is why it is the least densely populated area, despite of being the most fertile and optimal climate...

Bob

pre 13 godina

Serbia could unilaterally award autonomous status to Pristina and insist on dealing with it on that basis. That would be a settlement quite within the terms of 1244 and have a strong legal justification. However, I suspect that Pristina would not want to 'sit at the table'!

Even with the suggested division at the Ibar, there is no obligation for Serbia to give up its ownership of the whole of Kosovo.

Even a ruling that the udi is legal would not make it permanent. Legality itself is a transient. The deciding factor on the status at this moment is not law, it is power.

The udi has not established itself and exists not through its own strength but only by the intervention of others. The current status is not a defacto solution; it is a transient state dependent on the power of invaders. In its own terms it is also failing as it still without full resolution within the territory. The udi is incomplete and not fully effective. It fails legally in my view and the ICJ should make this clear.

Legally there is no doubt that Kosovo is Serbian territory - and Serbia legally has the right to defend that with force. However, Serbia does not have enough force against the US and other interests who have effectively invaded. 1244 itself was signed under duress and is of dubious legality in the way in which it goes against Serbian interests.

It should be seen as a positive that Serbia is going along with 1244. However, if 1244 is substantially breached (as it is by the udi) there does come a time when Serbia could legitimately reject its terms and seek to reoccupy. That may not happen as a governmental action, but is more likely to evolve north of the Ibar because of the frustration of the people living there who do not accept that the theft of Kosovo by Albanians and other foreigners is in their interest.

The ICJ should recognise that peaceful Serbs were being ethnically cleansed from Kosovo long before Milosevic and the udi is the culmination of a long term racist ambition to take over the territory from Serbs so that it can be essentially mono-ethnically occupied by Albanians. The farce of the west trying to pretend that Pristina is multi-ethnic is insulting.

There never was a country of Kosovo, and there is no need for one now. Kosovo is a shared buffer area of mixed ethnicity (at least it was until the Albanians activated the sustained process of ethnically cleansing Serbs).

Kosovo deserves a high degree of self governance, but not to be a state in its own right.

pss

pre 13 godina

One does have to remember Mr Meyer is a college professor, one of many throughout the US. He is rendering his "personal" opinion and in no way represents the views of the government. This is legal in the US, free speech, free press, etc.
Eventhough, the official position of the US govt is not partition, I am sure the thoughts are there but I can pretty much guarantee that no one in the administration advocates the sending of Serbian police and/or forces into any part of Kosovo.

Top

pre 13 godina

The proposed procedure "recognize Kosovo first and then declare the north as part of Serbia and march in with the army" is weired.
That would be another unilateral step, just like the UDI, only from the other side, this time.

But it becomes more and more obvious that the split of Kosovo will hopefully be the final (and only viable) solution for the never ending Kosovo trouble in south-eastern Europe.

pyrros

pre 13 godina

Just my cents on this:

1st it is spectacular to hear from a US official the term "serb" and "military" in the same sentence.

2nd, my alb (and not alb) friends, there is no such thing as "Cameria", "Kimeria", "Chameria".

i was born in Epiros and i know.
Greek Vlahs? yes, sure we had many. Albs? nahhhh

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.

Oso Kuka

pre 13 godina

even though serbs are trrying hard to particion Kosova this thing wont be accept by Kosovar albanians unless we get preseva,medvegja,bujanovc and part of montenegro and macedonia.
I call this a deal

Lazar

pre 13 godina

This guy ignores serbian enclaves. Ranilug for example. There's the expanded novo brdo municipality. What about that? Or howabout Gracanica? There's at least 30,000 serbs in those three places alone.

roberto

pre 13 godina

This has got to be the worst suggestion i have read on this site in the past month, at least!

i HOPE this is not one of my coreligionists -- that's always what we say (or think) when we read or hear a really bad idea or action associated with a name that might suggest our particular minority group...

but anyway, i did a quick search, and sure enough he did contribute to a recent paper suggesting that we (US) should not (and i paraphrase)become re-involved in the bosnian "quagmire"...(READ: keep it de facto partitioned, apartheid style).

and to recommend the re-imposition of serbian troops, after a decade of their non-stop atrocities! yes -- we're about to see yet another mass grave opened. there are hundreds of them all thru the balkans, thank you very much, thanks to serbian forces. and yes, there have already been almost 1,000 albanian bodies found in mass graves inside SERBIA alone. hello? who put them there, mr. meyer?

meyer's suggestion needs to be thoroughly and utterly discredited, and now.

thank you.

robert-0

sj

pre 13 godina

Professor Meyer is quiet correct about Tadic but thankfully he is an insignificant individual and matters little in the scheme of things to come. What is interesting, and what seems to have been missed by the Albanians is the fact that this man, Steven Meyer from a prestigious US military establishment, is even talking about breaking up Kosovo. This is a signal that the US has begun to falter in a big way.
Make no mistake this guy would never have been allowed to make this type of comment a couple of years ago.
Why would Serbia move into Kosovo when its strategy was always the correct one – leave Kosovo hanging like a piece of fruit on a branch and not allow any progress forward or backwards.
It not naive to seek an opinion from the ICJ because that body has to rule clearly in favor of the Albanians in order from Kosovo to be “independent”, but this can never occur because it would open “Pandora’s Box” where small groups will declare independence and even the US does not want that to happen. The ICJ opinion will be neither in favor nor against what has happened in Kosovo meaning that the Albos will have to negotiate with Belgrade regardless even if 150 countries recognize them. The ICJ will give some wishy washy opinion with a leaning to “autonomy” perhaps to Kosovo. Personally, I think that if the Albos are waiting for a clear ruling in their favor they would have been better talking to the Oracle of Delphi.

Pijetro

pre 13 godina

There's just too many holes to poke in this thesis, that it isn't even worth mentioning..

Such a move jeapordizes EVERYBODY's interest.

Ideas are always welcome, but i think even the posters on this board know that it wouldn't favour anybody.....

And that's why it's only an idea, nothing more.

Pet. B

pre 13 godina

I't will be same as if USA wil give up 1/2 of Florida ,1/2 Cali.TEX.ARIZ. Is that O>K.You call your self profesor of payME and i will sing like a canary...

Henry

pre 13 godina

Well, The Us and Russia with others will give the thumb up for partition of Kosovo.The rep.srpska will never be recognized and The sandjak area will not be a part of Bosnia,The slavic moslems in the area are not in a majority.Partition of Macedonia will not be allowed-Welcome to the happy Balkanpeninsula-you`ll never get bored.

Ramiz

pre 13 godina

ZZzzzzzzz what! I fell asleep from meyers University teachings. Americans dont know and will never know what is going on around them.

Mark

pre 13 godina

According to Meyer, Serbia’s move to include the International Court of Justice (ICJ) into the Kosovo status issue was a "naive decision".

“Unless, of course, the government wanted to lose, and in that way secure an excuse for itself for the secession of Kosovo,” the American professor was quoted as saying

You are right on the money regarding this.Tadic will have the excuse that he tried but it was the ICJ decision. Although serbia it would be in a much better position if it didn't ask ICJ at all and keep using the illegality card for forever.

kufr

pre 13 godina

Sorry this is not a good solution. Making unilateral moves would make us no better than the Albanians. Even though a partition will probably take place, it is better if it is done through negotiations.

usaSERB

pre 13 godina

“According to him, Belgrade’s next move should then be to immediately declare the area north of the Ibar River a part of the Serbian territory, and send it troops and police - "not to fight a war, but to help guarantee peace and protect Serbs in the area.”

How funny, no, actually how unbalanced B92 is. I wrote a comment yesterday that was almost identical to this. But B92 chose not to publish it. Freedom of speech in modern news media at it’s best.

JohnC.

pre 13 godina

I notice a higher frequency of partition demands. It appears that some information of the coming outcome of the advisory rule has leaked out and the Serbian side is losing more and more nerves.

However, just as noted in this text, partition is no (longer) an option. It was time for that before Feb. 2008, but the Serbian side wanted put all the stakes in one card. Who gambles like that deserves full defeat. South of the Ibar all the territory is sure in Albanian hand, even when some smaller parts play insurgents. It doesn't matter since they don't have a link to Serbia. North Kosovo on the other hand experience more and more Albanian involvement. Serbs are not capable to stop that, unless they use violance, and if they do so, they expose them as being the aggressors in the eyes of the world, giving Kfor the moral support (legal support is anyway given) to clean up this area from terrorists.

This is a Win-Win situation for the Albanians. Thank you Belgrade for your chauvenistic stupidness and defiance.

RKS

pre 13 godina

Sure Mr. Meyer, we'll also open up pandoras box. Why stop there? Cameria, Macedonia, self proclaimed srpska republic, Chechnya, Basque, etc

johny

pre 13 godina

Yes, the Serbian army has always brought peace. Just ask Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia, Kosova.

That's the stupidest move to make actually especially since Serbia would unilaterally violate the Kumanovo Agreement. Not only that but such a thing cannot even be though out loud without a change in Serbia's Constitution as it constitutes a high act of treason. If you want 1999 back thats the best way to go.
Serbia lost its chance at partition several times. First when your prime minister was killed; he was a great proponent of partition and he wanted the Kosova issue done quick. Then when Serbia unilaterally adopted a constitution, which preempted the status, in the middle of a negotiating process and which was in clear violation of the negotiating principles agreed by everyone including Serbia. Then when it wasted many many rounds of negotiations by coming up with idiot propositions that could have come only from people high on acid. Serbia squandered years when the window of opportunity for partition was wide open. The big 3 veto countries have no moved on. Its to little to late now; but that is what has always characterized Serbia. Hell all Serbia needed to do is meet with Rrugova in 1997 and 1998 and today you'd be talking about how much autonomy Kosova has, not about whether independence is legal or illegal. However when you see your opponent as inferior, unable to govern, and not worthy and/or unable to form alliances there will eventually come a time when you'll deeply regret your know-it-all attitude. I think that time is now.

Zoran

pre 13 godina

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.
(Jim, 8 July 2010 17:25)
--
Not from my point of view and many many Serbians. If we are going along the partition route then we need to extend that into BiH, Croatia and maybe even Montenegro. We'll be happen then. But then what about the Albanians in FYROM? The Bosnian Muslims in Serbia? It's a can of worms if you ask me.

Jovan

pre 13 godina

there is nothing to divide, since it is all serbian territory.

if Serbia should send the military, then in order to restore control in the whole of it´s territory.

but, it is better not to do that, the K-albanians should be given the experience that Serbia is another state today than it was under Slobo´s regime.

partition is not an option.

never ever.

it´s better not to give our dear k-albanian friends more reason for their illusions.

Serbia will prevail, and that is good.

Logic

pre 13 godina

Dear Professor, your 1+1 adds up to -5. According to you, Serbs in North and a peace should be protected by Serbian army AND police, but the Serbs in the South could be protected by some new UN Resolution? Why is that so? And after all experience of being "minority with greatest rights in the world", Serbs in the south will feel safe, protected? The usual rubbish, my Professor.This idea of yours is a perfect recipe for cleansing southern Kosovo from Serbs, you know that, don't you?K You are insulting intelligence of an entire nation, dear Professor, not nice at all!

Jim

pre 13 godina

Is there something we should know about going on in Washington? First there was the Gvosdev piece in Foreign Affairs advocating partition. Now we have this chap from the NDU, a very well respected institution promoting the same idea. Even Morton Abramowitz, hardly a friend of the Serbs even seems to be (albeit grudgingly) endorsing some of split:

http://www.nationalinterest.org/Article.aspx?id=23676

Perhaps some sense is finally creeping into the debate and figures in the US are starting to see that this has always been the most logical compromise. Serbia gets to keep a slice of the north, which is almost wholly Serbian anyway, and the rest of Kosovo gets recognition and UN membership. Problem solved, no one entirely happy with the outcome, but everyone able to live with the results.

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.

Niall O'Doherty

pre 13 godina

It sounds like the upcoming ICJ verdict may not be pleasing to the kleptocrats down in Pristina, hence the heightened talk about partition.

That said, Belgrade should not cave into demands that are unfavourable to Serbia. If a partition is to occur, it must Belgrade who is dictating the terms not the Albanians.

If partition does indeed occur then the North, Gracanica and Strpce must first be placed under Belgrade's direct control. Then the talks can focus on Pec & Decani and agreements on remaining holy sites, resettlement and compensation to all parties.

All in all, it sounds like Tadic and Jeremic will be the ones holding the aces.

Niall O'Doherty

pre 13 godina

It sounds like the upcoming ICJ verdict may not be pleasing to the kleptocrats down in Pristina, hence the heightened talk about partition.

That said, Belgrade should not cave into demands that are unfavourable to Serbia. If a partition is to occur, it must Belgrade who is dictating the terms not the Albanians.

If partition does indeed occur then the North, Gracanica and Strpce must first be placed under Belgrade's direct control. Then the talks can focus on Pec & Decani and agreements on remaining holy sites, resettlement and compensation to all parties.

All in all, it sounds like Tadic and Jeremic will be the ones holding the aces.

RKS

pre 13 godina

Sure Mr. Meyer, we'll also open up pandoras box. Why stop there? Cameria, Macedonia, self proclaimed srpska republic, Chechnya, Basque, etc

Jovan

pre 13 godina

there is nothing to divide, since it is all serbian territory.

if Serbia should send the military, then in order to restore control in the whole of it´s territory.

but, it is better not to do that, the K-albanians should be given the experience that Serbia is another state today than it was under Slobo´s regime.

partition is not an option.

never ever.

it´s better not to give our dear k-albanian friends more reason for their illusions.

Serbia will prevail, and that is good.

johny

pre 13 godina

Yes, the Serbian army has always brought peace. Just ask Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia, Kosova.

That's the stupidest move to make actually especially since Serbia would unilaterally violate the Kumanovo Agreement. Not only that but such a thing cannot even be though out loud without a change in Serbia's Constitution as it constitutes a high act of treason. If you want 1999 back thats the best way to go.
Serbia lost its chance at partition several times. First when your prime minister was killed; he was a great proponent of partition and he wanted the Kosova issue done quick. Then when Serbia unilaterally adopted a constitution, which preempted the status, in the middle of a negotiating process and which was in clear violation of the negotiating principles agreed by everyone including Serbia. Then when it wasted many many rounds of negotiations by coming up with idiot propositions that could have come only from people high on acid. Serbia squandered years when the window of opportunity for partition was wide open. The big 3 veto countries have no moved on. Its to little to late now; but that is what has always characterized Serbia. Hell all Serbia needed to do is meet with Rrugova in 1997 and 1998 and today you'd be talking about how much autonomy Kosova has, not about whether independence is legal or illegal. However when you see your opponent as inferior, unable to govern, and not worthy and/or unable to form alliances there will eventually come a time when you'll deeply regret your know-it-all attitude. I think that time is now.

Zoran

pre 13 godina

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.
(Jim, 8 July 2010 17:25)
--
Not from my point of view and many many Serbians. If we are going along the partition route then we need to extend that into BiH, Croatia and maybe even Montenegro. We'll be happen then. But then what about the Albanians in FYROM? The Bosnian Muslims in Serbia? It's a can of worms if you ask me.

usaSERB

pre 13 godina

“According to him, Belgrade’s next move should then be to immediately declare the area north of the Ibar River a part of the Serbian territory, and send it troops and police - "not to fight a war, but to help guarantee peace and protect Serbs in the area.”

How funny, no, actually how unbalanced B92 is. I wrote a comment yesterday that was almost identical to this. But B92 chose not to publish it. Freedom of speech in modern news media at it’s best.

Logic

pre 13 godina

Dear Professor, your 1+1 adds up to -5. According to you, Serbs in North and a peace should be protected by Serbian army AND police, but the Serbs in the South could be protected by some new UN Resolution? Why is that so? And after all experience of being "minority with greatest rights in the world", Serbs in the south will feel safe, protected? The usual rubbish, my Professor.This idea of yours is a perfect recipe for cleansing southern Kosovo from Serbs, you know that, don't you?K You are insulting intelligence of an entire nation, dear Professor, not nice at all!

JohnC.

pre 13 godina

I notice a higher frequency of partition demands. It appears that some information of the coming outcome of the advisory rule has leaked out and the Serbian side is losing more and more nerves.

However, just as noted in this text, partition is no (longer) an option. It was time for that before Feb. 2008, but the Serbian side wanted put all the stakes in one card. Who gambles like that deserves full defeat. South of the Ibar all the territory is sure in Albanian hand, even when some smaller parts play insurgents. It doesn't matter since they don't have a link to Serbia. North Kosovo on the other hand experience more and more Albanian involvement. Serbs are not capable to stop that, unless they use violance, and if they do so, they expose them as being the aggressors in the eyes of the world, giving Kfor the moral support (legal support is anyway given) to clean up this area from terrorists.

This is a Win-Win situation for the Albanians. Thank you Belgrade for your chauvenistic stupidness and defiance.

Jim

pre 13 godina

Is there something we should know about going on in Washington? First there was the Gvosdev piece in Foreign Affairs advocating partition. Now we have this chap from the NDU, a very well respected institution promoting the same idea. Even Morton Abramowitz, hardly a friend of the Serbs even seems to be (albeit grudgingly) endorsing some of split:

http://www.nationalinterest.org/Article.aspx?id=23676

Perhaps some sense is finally creeping into the debate and figures in the US are starting to see that this has always been the most logical compromise. Serbia gets to keep a slice of the north, which is almost wholly Serbian anyway, and the rest of Kosovo gets recognition and UN membership. Problem solved, no one entirely happy with the outcome, but everyone able to live with the results.

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.

Lazar

pre 13 godina

This guy ignores serbian enclaves. Ranilug for example. There's the expanded novo brdo municipality. What about that? Or howabout Gracanica? There's at least 30,000 serbs in those three places alone.

pyrros

pre 13 godina

Just my cents on this:

1st it is spectacular to hear from a US official the term "serb" and "military" in the same sentence.

2nd, my alb (and not alb) friends, there is no such thing as "Cameria", "Kimeria", "Chameria".

i was born in Epiros and i know.
Greek Vlahs? yes, sure we had many. Albs? nahhhh

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.

kufr

pre 13 godina

Sorry this is not a good solution. Making unilateral moves would make us no better than the Albanians. Even though a partition will probably take place, it is better if it is done through negotiations.

Mark

pre 13 godina

According to Meyer, Serbia’s move to include the International Court of Justice (ICJ) into the Kosovo status issue was a "naive decision".

“Unless, of course, the government wanted to lose, and in that way secure an excuse for itself for the secession of Kosovo,” the American professor was quoted as saying

You are right on the money regarding this.Tadic will have the excuse that he tried but it was the ICJ decision. Although serbia it would be in a much better position if it didn't ask ICJ at all and keep using the illegality card for forever.

Oso Kuka

pre 13 godina

even though serbs are trrying hard to particion Kosova this thing wont be accept by Kosovar albanians unless we get preseva,medvegja,bujanovc and part of montenegro and macedonia.
I call this a deal

Steve JP

pre 13 godina

Everywhere that Serbia has its churches, monasteries,(even those ruined) and cemeteries in Kosovo-whether north, south, east, or west; those structures; those areas must continue to be recognized by Serbia, forever.

Bob

pre 13 godina

Serbia could unilaterally award autonomous status to Pristina and insist on dealing with it on that basis. That would be a settlement quite within the terms of 1244 and have a strong legal justification. However, I suspect that Pristina would not want to 'sit at the table'!

Even with the suggested division at the Ibar, there is no obligation for Serbia to give up its ownership of the whole of Kosovo.

Even a ruling that the udi is legal would not make it permanent. Legality itself is a transient. The deciding factor on the status at this moment is not law, it is power.

The udi has not established itself and exists not through its own strength but only by the intervention of others. The current status is not a defacto solution; it is a transient state dependent on the power of invaders. In its own terms it is also failing as it still without full resolution within the territory. The udi is incomplete and not fully effective. It fails legally in my view and the ICJ should make this clear.

Legally there is no doubt that Kosovo is Serbian territory - and Serbia legally has the right to defend that with force. However, Serbia does not have enough force against the US and other interests who have effectively invaded. 1244 itself was signed under duress and is of dubious legality in the way in which it goes against Serbian interests.

It should be seen as a positive that Serbia is going along with 1244. However, if 1244 is substantially breached (as it is by the udi) there does come a time when Serbia could legitimately reject its terms and seek to reoccupy. That may not happen as a governmental action, but is more likely to evolve north of the Ibar because of the frustration of the people living there who do not accept that the theft of Kosovo by Albanians and other foreigners is in their interest.

The ICJ should recognise that peaceful Serbs were being ethnically cleansed from Kosovo long before Milosevic and the udi is the culmination of a long term racist ambition to take over the territory from Serbs so that it can be essentially mono-ethnically occupied by Albanians. The farce of the west trying to pretend that Pristina is multi-ethnic is insulting.

There never was a country of Kosovo, and there is no need for one now. Kosovo is a shared buffer area of mixed ethnicity (at least it was until the Albanians activated the sustained process of ethnically cleansing Serbs).

Kosovo deserves a high degree of self governance, but not to be a state in its own right.

pirro i epirit

pre 13 godina

Chameria existed, until 1945 at least, after ww2 chameria was genocided, that is why no albanian is to be found there, and that is why it is the least densely populated area, despite of being the most fertile and optimal climate...

sj

pre 13 godina

Professor Meyer is quiet correct about Tadic but thankfully he is an insignificant individual and matters little in the scheme of things to come. What is interesting, and what seems to have been missed by the Albanians is the fact that this man, Steven Meyer from a prestigious US military establishment, is even talking about breaking up Kosovo. This is a signal that the US has begun to falter in a big way.
Make no mistake this guy would never have been allowed to make this type of comment a couple of years ago.
Why would Serbia move into Kosovo when its strategy was always the correct one – leave Kosovo hanging like a piece of fruit on a branch and not allow any progress forward or backwards.
It not naive to seek an opinion from the ICJ because that body has to rule clearly in favor of the Albanians in order from Kosovo to be “independent”, but this can never occur because it would open “Pandora’s Box” where small groups will declare independence and even the US does not want that to happen. The ICJ opinion will be neither in favor nor against what has happened in Kosovo meaning that the Albos will have to negotiate with Belgrade regardless even if 150 countries recognize them. The ICJ will give some wishy washy opinion with a leaning to “autonomy” perhaps to Kosovo. Personally, I think that if the Albos are waiting for a clear ruling in their favor they would have been better talking to the Oracle of Delphi.

Top

pre 13 godina

The proposed procedure "recognize Kosovo first and then declare the north as part of Serbia and march in with the army" is weired.
That would be another unilateral step, just like the UDI, only from the other side, this time.

But it becomes more and more obvious that the split of Kosovo will hopefully be the final (and only viable) solution for the never ending Kosovo trouble in south-eastern Europe.

Denis

pre 13 godina

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.
(pyrros, 9 July 2010 09:56)

Maybe that is why 9 out of 10 of Greek revolution leaders were chams, and you still like to sing and dance the famous Osman Taka dance, from Janina, an albanian folkloric dance.

Maybe you should explain to us why Marko Bocari spoke in albanian and even wrote an Albaina-Greek dictonary and not an Greek-Vlah one...

Maybe you should explain what did Zerva's army do in Chameria in 1944-1945....

It is not your fault, but that of Albanians who saved your behind many times in history, all the way to 50 yrs ago when they fed and sheltered some 200K greek refugees while you were killing each other...

Greece now wants to build cemeteries of WWI greek soldiers in south Albania to commemorate their heroism, but Alb can't even cry their dead that you slaughtered in Chameria.... in the end of WWII.

Beware though, what comes around goes around.

roberto

pre 13 godina

This has got to be the worst suggestion i have read on this site in the past month, at least!

i HOPE this is not one of my coreligionists -- that's always what we say (or think) when we read or hear a really bad idea or action associated with a name that might suggest our particular minority group...

but anyway, i did a quick search, and sure enough he did contribute to a recent paper suggesting that we (US) should not (and i paraphrase)become re-involved in the bosnian "quagmire"...(READ: keep it de facto partitioned, apartheid style).

and to recommend the re-imposition of serbian troops, after a decade of their non-stop atrocities! yes -- we're about to see yet another mass grave opened. there are hundreds of them all thru the balkans, thank you very much, thanks to serbian forces. and yes, there have already been almost 1,000 albanian bodies found in mass graves inside SERBIA alone. hello? who put them there, mr. meyer?

meyer's suggestion needs to be thoroughly and utterly discredited, and now.

thank you.

robert-0

Pet. B

pre 13 godina

I't will be same as if USA wil give up 1/2 of Florida ,1/2 Cali.TEX.ARIZ. Is that O>K.You call your self profesor of payME and i will sing like a canary...

Henry

pre 13 godina

Well, The Us and Russia with others will give the thumb up for partition of Kosovo.The rep.srpska will never be recognized and The sandjak area will not be a part of Bosnia,The slavic moslems in the area are not in a majority.Partition of Macedonia will not be allowed-Welcome to the happy Balkanpeninsula-you`ll never get bored.

Pijetro

pre 13 godina

There's just too many holes to poke in this thesis, that it isn't even worth mentioning..

Such a move jeapordizes EVERYBODY's interest.

Ideas are always welcome, but i think even the posters on this board know that it wouldn't favour anybody.....

And that's why it's only an idea, nothing more.

pss

pre 13 godina

One does have to remember Mr Meyer is a college professor, one of many throughout the US. He is rendering his "personal" opinion and in no way represents the views of the government. This is legal in the US, free speech, free press, etc.
Eventhough, the official position of the US govt is not partition, I am sure the thoughts are there but I can pretty much guarantee that no one in the administration advocates the sending of Serbian police and/or forces into any part of Kosovo.

Ramiz

pre 13 godina

ZZzzzzzzz what! I fell asleep from meyers University teachings. Americans dont know and will never know what is going on around them.

johny

pre 13 godina

Yes, the Serbian army has always brought peace. Just ask Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia, Kosova.

That's the stupidest move to make actually especially since Serbia would unilaterally violate the Kumanovo Agreement. Not only that but such a thing cannot even be though out loud without a change in Serbia's Constitution as it constitutes a high act of treason. If you want 1999 back thats the best way to go.
Serbia lost its chance at partition several times. First when your prime minister was killed; he was a great proponent of partition and he wanted the Kosova issue done quick. Then when Serbia unilaterally adopted a constitution, which preempted the status, in the middle of a negotiating process and which was in clear violation of the negotiating principles agreed by everyone including Serbia. Then when it wasted many many rounds of negotiations by coming up with idiot propositions that could have come only from people high on acid. Serbia squandered years when the window of opportunity for partition was wide open. The big 3 veto countries have no moved on. Its to little to late now; but that is what has always characterized Serbia. Hell all Serbia needed to do is meet with Rrugova in 1997 and 1998 and today you'd be talking about how much autonomy Kosova has, not about whether independence is legal or illegal. However when you see your opponent as inferior, unable to govern, and not worthy and/or unable to form alliances there will eventually come a time when you'll deeply regret your know-it-all attitude. I think that time is now.

JohnC.

pre 13 godina

I notice a higher frequency of partition demands. It appears that some information of the coming outcome of the advisory rule has leaked out and the Serbian side is losing more and more nerves.

However, just as noted in this text, partition is no (longer) an option. It was time for that before Feb. 2008, but the Serbian side wanted put all the stakes in one card. Who gambles like that deserves full defeat. South of the Ibar all the territory is sure in Albanian hand, even when some smaller parts play insurgents. It doesn't matter since they don't have a link to Serbia. North Kosovo on the other hand experience more and more Albanian involvement. Serbs are not capable to stop that, unless they use violance, and if they do so, they expose them as being the aggressors in the eyes of the world, giving Kfor the moral support (legal support is anyway given) to clean up this area from terrorists.

This is a Win-Win situation for the Albanians. Thank you Belgrade for your chauvenistic stupidness and defiance.

Niall O'Doherty

pre 13 godina

It sounds like the upcoming ICJ verdict may not be pleasing to the kleptocrats down in Pristina, hence the heightened talk about partition.

That said, Belgrade should not cave into demands that are unfavourable to Serbia. If a partition is to occur, it must Belgrade who is dictating the terms not the Albanians.

If partition does indeed occur then the North, Gracanica and Strpce must first be placed under Belgrade's direct control. Then the talks can focus on Pec & Decani and agreements on remaining holy sites, resettlement and compensation to all parties.

All in all, it sounds like Tadic and Jeremic will be the ones holding the aces.

Jovan

pre 13 godina

there is nothing to divide, since it is all serbian territory.

if Serbia should send the military, then in order to restore control in the whole of it´s territory.

but, it is better not to do that, the K-albanians should be given the experience that Serbia is another state today than it was under Slobo´s regime.

partition is not an option.

never ever.

it´s better not to give our dear k-albanian friends more reason for their illusions.

Serbia will prevail, and that is good.

usaSERB

pre 13 godina

“According to him, Belgrade’s next move should then be to immediately declare the area north of the Ibar River a part of the Serbian territory, and send it troops and police - "not to fight a war, but to help guarantee peace and protect Serbs in the area.”

How funny, no, actually how unbalanced B92 is. I wrote a comment yesterday that was almost identical to this. But B92 chose not to publish it. Freedom of speech in modern news media at it’s best.

Mark

pre 13 godina

According to Meyer, Serbia’s move to include the International Court of Justice (ICJ) into the Kosovo status issue was a "naive decision".

“Unless, of course, the government wanted to lose, and in that way secure an excuse for itself for the secession of Kosovo,” the American professor was quoted as saying

You are right on the money regarding this.Tadic will have the excuse that he tried but it was the ICJ decision. Although serbia it would be in a much better position if it didn't ask ICJ at all and keep using the illegality card for forever.

RKS

pre 13 godina

Sure Mr. Meyer, we'll also open up pandoras box. Why stop there? Cameria, Macedonia, self proclaimed srpska republic, Chechnya, Basque, etc

Oso Kuka

pre 13 godina

even though serbs are trrying hard to particion Kosova this thing wont be accept by Kosovar albanians unless we get preseva,medvegja,bujanovc and part of montenegro and macedonia.
I call this a deal

pyrros

pre 13 godina

Just my cents on this:

1st it is spectacular to hear from a US official the term "serb" and "military" in the same sentence.

2nd, my alb (and not alb) friends, there is no such thing as "Cameria", "Kimeria", "Chameria".

i was born in Epiros and i know.
Greek Vlahs? yes, sure we had many. Albs? nahhhh

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.

roberto

pre 13 godina

This has got to be the worst suggestion i have read on this site in the past month, at least!

i HOPE this is not one of my coreligionists -- that's always what we say (or think) when we read or hear a really bad idea or action associated with a name that might suggest our particular minority group...

but anyway, i did a quick search, and sure enough he did contribute to a recent paper suggesting that we (US) should not (and i paraphrase)become re-involved in the bosnian "quagmire"...(READ: keep it de facto partitioned, apartheid style).

and to recommend the re-imposition of serbian troops, after a decade of their non-stop atrocities! yes -- we're about to see yet another mass grave opened. there are hundreds of them all thru the balkans, thank you very much, thanks to serbian forces. and yes, there have already been almost 1,000 albanian bodies found in mass graves inside SERBIA alone. hello? who put them there, mr. meyer?

meyer's suggestion needs to be thoroughly and utterly discredited, and now.

thank you.

robert-0

kufr

pre 13 godina

Sorry this is not a good solution. Making unilateral moves would make us no better than the Albanians. Even though a partition will probably take place, it is better if it is done through negotiations.

Logic

pre 13 godina

Dear Professor, your 1+1 adds up to -5. According to you, Serbs in North and a peace should be protected by Serbian army AND police, but the Serbs in the South could be protected by some new UN Resolution? Why is that so? And after all experience of being "minority with greatest rights in the world", Serbs in the south will feel safe, protected? The usual rubbish, my Professor.This idea of yours is a perfect recipe for cleansing southern Kosovo from Serbs, you know that, don't you?K You are insulting intelligence of an entire nation, dear Professor, not nice at all!

Jim

pre 13 godina

Is there something we should know about going on in Washington? First there was the Gvosdev piece in Foreign Affairs advocating partition. Now we have this chap from the NDU, a very well respected institution promoting the same idea. Even Morton Abramowitz, hardly a friend of the Serbs even seems to be (albeit grudgingly) endorsing some of split:

http://www.nationalinterest.org/Article.aspx?id=23676

Perhaps some sense is finally creeping into the debate and figures in the US are starting to see that this has always been the most logical compromise. Serbia gets to keep a slice of the north, which is almost wholly Serbian anyway, and the rest of Kosovo gets recognition and UN membership. Problem solved, no one entirely happy with the outcome, but everyone able to live with the results.

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.

Bob

pre 13 godina

Serbia could unilaterally award autonomous status to Pristina and insist on dealing with it on that basis. That would be a settlement quite within the terms of 1244 and have a strong legal justification. However, I suspect that Pristina would not want to 'sit at the table'!

Even with the suggested division at the Ibar, there is no obligation for Serbia to give up its ownership of the whole of Kosovo.

Even a ruling that the udi is legal would not make it permanent. Legality itself is a transient. The deciding factor on the status at this moment is not law, it is power.

The udi has not established itself and exists not through its own strength but only by the intervention of others. The current status is not a defacto solution; it is a transient state dependent on the power of invaders. In its own terms it is also failing as it still without full resolution within the territory. The udi is incomplete and not fully effective. It fails legally in my view and the ICJ should make this clear.

Legally there is no doubt that Kosovo is Serbian territory - and Serbia legally has the right to defend that with force. However, Serbia does not have enough force against the US and other interests who have effectively invaded. 1244 itself was signed under duress and is of dubious legality in the way in which it goes against Serbian interests.

It should be seen as a positive that Serbia is going along with 1244. However, if 1244 is substantially breached (as it is by the udi) there does come a time when Serbia could legitimately reject its terms and seek to reoccupy. That may not happen as a governmental action, but is more likely to evolve north of the Ibar because of the frustration of the people living there who do not accept that the theft of Kosovo by Albanians and other foreigners is in their interest.

The ICJ should recognise that peaceful Serbs were being ethnically cleansed from Kosovo long before Milosevic and the udi is the culmination of a long term racist ambition to take over the territory from Serbs so that it can be essentially mono-ethnically occupied by Albanians. The farce of the west trying to pretend that Pristina is multi-ethnic is insulting.

There never was a country of Kosovo, and there is no need for one now. Kosovo is a shared buffer area of mixed ethnicity (at least it was until the Albanians activated the sustained process of ethnically cleansing Serbs).

Kosovo deserves a high degree of self governance, but not to be a state in its own right.

Zoran

pre 13 godina

It looks like things could move in interesting ways after the ICJ decision.
(Jim, 8 July 2010 17:25)
--
Not from my point of view and many many Serbians. If we are going along the partition route then we need to extend that into BiH, Croatia and maybe even Montenegro. We'll be happen then. But then what about the Albanians in FYROM? The Bosnian Muslims in Serbia? It's a can of worms if you ask me.

pss

pre 13 godina

One does have to remember Mr Meyer is a college professor, one of many throughout the US. He is rendering his "personal" opinion and in no way represents the views of the government. This is legal in the US, free speech, free press, etc.
Eventhough, the official position of the US govt is not partition, I am sure the thoughts are there but I can pretty much guarantee that no one in the administration advocates the sending of Serbian police and/or forces into any part of Kosovo.

Steve JP

pre 13 godina

Everywhere that Serbia has its churches, monasteries,(even those ruined) and cemeteries in Kosovo-whether north, south, east, or west; those structures; those areas must continue to be recognized by Serbia, forever.

Denis

pre 13 godina

So, this whole Cameria thing is more than science fiction rather than reality.
(pyrros, 9 July 2010 09:56)

Maybe that is why 9 out of 10 of Greek revolution leaders were chams, and you still like to sing and dance the famous Osman Taka dance, from Janina, an albanian folkloric dance.

Maybe you should explain to us why Marko Bocari spoke in albanian and even wrote an Albaina-Greek dictonary and not an Greek-Vlah one...

Maybe you should explain what did Zerva's army do in Chameria in 1944-1945....

It is not your fault, but that of Albanians who saved your behind many times in history, all the way to 50 yrs ago when they fed and sheltered some 200K greek refugees while you were killing each other...

Greece now wants to build cemeteries of WWI greek soldiers in south Albania to commemorate their heroism, but Alb can't even cry their dead that you slaughtered in Chameria.... in the end of WWII.

Beware though, what comes around goes around.

Lazar

pre 13 godina

This guy ignores serbian enclaves. Ranilug for example. There's the expanded novo brdo municipality. What about that? Or howabout Gracanica? There's at least 30,000 serbs in those three places alone.

sj

pre 13 godina

Professor Meyer is quiet correct about Tadic but thankfully he is an insignificant individual and matters little in the scheme of things to come. What is interesting, and what seems to have been missed by the Albanians is the fact that this man, Steven Meyer from a prestigious US military establishment, is even talking about breaking up Kosovo. This is a signal that the US has begun to falter in a big way.
Make no mistake this guy would never have been allowed to make this type of comment a couple of years ago.
Why would Serbia move into Kosovo when its strategy was always the correct one – leave Kosovo hanging like a piece of fruit on a branch and not allow any progress forward or backwards.
It not naive to seek an opinion from the ICJ because that body has to rule clearly in favor of the Albanians in order from Kosovo to be “independent”, but this can never occur because it would open “Pandora’s Box” where small groups will declare independence and even the US does not want that to happen. The ICJ opinion will be neither in favor nor against what has happened in Kosovo meaning that the Albos will have to negotiate with Belgrade regardless even if 150 countries recognize them. The ICJ will give some wishy washy opinion with a leaning to “autonomy” perhaps to Kosovo. Personally, I think that if the Albos are waiting for a clear ruling in their favor they would have been better talking to the Oracle of Delphi.

Top

pre 13 godina

The proposed procedure "recognize Kosovo first and then declare the north as part of Serbia and march in with the army" is weired.
That would be another unilateral step, just like the UDI, only from the other side, this time.

But it becomes more and more obvious that the split of Kosovo will hopefully be the final (and only viable) solution for the never ending Kosovo trouble in south-eastern Europe.

pirro i epirit

pre 13 godina

Chameria existed, until 1945 at least, after ww2 chameria was genocided, that is why no albanian is to be found there, and that is why it is the least densely populated area, despite of being the most fertile and optimal climate...

Ramiz

pre 13 godina

ZZzzzzzzz what! I fell asleep from meyers University teachings. Americans dont know and will never know what is going on around them.

Pet. B

pre 13 godina

I't will be same as if USA wil give up 1/2 of Florida ,1/2 Cali.TEX.ARIZ. Is that O>K.You call your self profesor of payME and i will sing like a canary...

Pijetro

pre 13 godina

There's just too many holes to poke in this thesis, that it isn't even worth mentioning..

Such a move jeapordizes EVERYBODY's interest.

Ideas are always welcome, but i think even the posters on this board know that it wouldn't favour anybody.....

And that's why it's only an idea, nothing more.

Henry

pre 13 godina

Well, The Us and Russia with others will give the thumb up for partition of Kosovo.The rep.srpska will never be recognized and The sandjak area will not be a part of Bosnia,The slavic moslems in the area are not in a majority.Partition of Macedonia will not be allowed-Welcome to the happy Balkanpeninsula-you`ll never get bored.