"New model for Kosovo's participation"

I think the photo says it all...

Jeremic looks confident, Moratinos looks like he's got a big headache on his hands.

Kosovo UDI is not working.

Serbia is back baby!

It's UNMIK – Kosovo! No more No less. I hope Tadic and company knows this.

Slovenian Deja vu is the MOST likely model.

I am dying to know the new model for Kosova's participation!?

You read the headline and that what is written, but you read the entire article ,and could not find anything about the model.

Jim: "It seems ever more like the way is being prepared for new discussions after the ICJ ruling."

Exactly, I agree. They are sorting out whether there can be an accepted high level of autonomy, or whether Kosovo will be partitioned.

The latter will be really hard for those Serbian and other communities not in the North - let's hope they have special status and protection granted to them.

pss - Baby steps? Utter nonsense.

In fact it shows just how deadlocked Kosovo's claim to independence is that one of your leading sponsors has to go to speak with Belgrade to work out an acceptable formula for Serbia to allow Kosovo to participate in regional meetings.

As for trying to spin this as progress for Kosovo's participation in international fora, that is also rubbish. Kosovo was free to do that before UDI. In fact all this will do is take it back to where things started 2 years ago. What progress!

As I said here a few days ago, the declaration of independence was a complete disaster for Kosovo. For the sake of a meaningless bit of paper that is not recognised by 2/3 of the world (and only grudgingly accepted by many others), Kosovo chances of making real headway have been dramatically reduced.

Also, the bit about opening the way for direct talks between Belgrade and Pristina is interesting. I can't see this as being about talks between states. Instead, this seems to confirm that pressure is building for new negotiations. It is also telling that Turkey is so involved in this. If it couldn't get independence accepted for the Turkish Cypriots, And is no advocating a solution based on less than statehood, what makes KAs think that they will press the independence agenda for them? All in all, it seems ever more like the way is being prepared for new discussions after the ICJ ruling.

It is not Kosovo's participation that is negotiated, it is Serbia's indeed. if Moratinos says "country will be left out" it is referenced to country that did not take part in Slovenia Summit. If a country was present then why comment on its upcoming. participation.

What it comes to seem strange is Turkey to negotiate for Kosovo. Kosovars must have lost their trust at Serbs totally, if they don't fuss about their 500 year occuping "ally" to "negotiate" for them. I wonder what did the Serbs do to earn that.

"Baby steps" Sometimes have to move by baby steps but at least it is progress.
(pss, 19 April 2010 12:10)
--
Sounds to me like they are being more inventive towards status negotiations. Now that would be real progress.

"It is up to Serbia to come up with a solution where it does not block Kosovo's progression."
pss

if, like you say, Kosovo is independent how come Serbia is blocking? An idependent country should not be dependent on another. The fact reamins, Kosovo is not independent and albanians need to wake up. You are as independent as you were 20 years ago. No investments, no recognitions, no UN and no development. Sounds to me that you are more dependent then ever before, dependent on aid.

I have to applaud PRN for balancing "the comments " from the opposing side.

Anyhow, the photo says it all. Mora(n)tinos: what have I got myself into.

I wonder, if Spain is adamantly opposing Kosovo, why negotiate their presence in a conference whose keys Spaniards hold? Why not just proclaim as Slovenia did on which side are you. Then let whoever comes join the summit.
Anyway, when is the last time Spaniards solved or did anything right.

"Baby steps" Sometimes have to move by baby steps but at least it is progress.

Can we be honest and realistic here, folks? If an Albanian Kosovo was truly an independent nation, there would be no discussion about how they would be represented at European summits. I don't see anyone trying to figure out how other EU countries will be represented. Let's get back to the negotiation table, without US interference, if that is possible, and get this exhausting matter settled - people's lives are at stake here.

What about COMIK-Illyria?
(Top, 19 April 2010 15:52)
--
I wouldn't be handing Illyria over to Albanians. Through genetic analysis we Serbians have just as much claim to it as other indiginous Balkan people.

As taken from the http://tinyurl.com/yb48f8x

"Genetic studies conclude that Serbs are of predominantly Balkan genetics (indigenous to the region)"

"Thus, most Serbs today are descendants of original inhabitants of Balkans, previously known as Illyrians and Thracians."

If it's really only about the name (Kosovo vs. UNMIK-Kosovo), maybe they should come up with an unconventional solution. What about COMIK-Illyria?

Just kidding, guys, don't panic...

"jeremic is looking his usual self-satisfied (arrogant) self"

-Roberto

Coming from the expert himself on the subject of self-satisfaction and arrogance.

To understand where the problem lies, you have to look no further than where these talks will take place, that is Serbia. Throughout the whole article there is no mention that a similar meeting will also happen in Kosovo. This is an indication that there is nothing to fix as far as Kosovo is concerned but rather it is Serbia that needs a fixing. Jeremic did not comment on the content of the meeting because he knows what is coming. He betrayed the EU and US by asking them to support Serbia's initiative to launch an ICJ hearin regarding Kosovo's independence in an effort to remove the Kosovo issue from day to day Serbian politics and into the hands of an international court. This is the exact reason why Serbia got the support of many countries to pass such a resolution in the UN. However, Serbia, instead of doing what it had promissed the EU and US it would do, it did the opposite by making Kosovo the hallmark of their foreing as well as domestic policies.

Looking forward to this snub of kosovo. I don't see the other Balkan nations risking another fiasco because of tiny kosovo. UNMIKosovo can participate in that function.

wouldn't be handing Illyria over to Albanians. Through genetic analysis we Serbians have just as much claim to it as other indiginous Balkan people.

As taken from the [link]

"Genetic studies conclude that Serbs are of predominantly Balkan genetics (indigenous to the region)"

"Thus, most Serbs today are descendants of original inhabitants of Balkans, previously known as Illyrians and Thracians."


Your link clearly states that south slavs may have mingled with thraco-illyrians, but when you say you wouldnt hand illyria over to Albanians.

I say why not?

Many historians conclude that modern Albanians are the most ethnically pure decendants of Ancient Illyrians.



IDEA: So Illyrian as say many scholars have the unique descendant left in
Albanian.



Many Illyrian names have been preserved in Albanian language: Didi=Dede,
Lalus=Lala, Dassios=Dash, Bardhyllis=Bardhan, Bardhosh, etc.
Even such names could be explained by Albanian etymology:
Bardhyllis=bardhë+yllis=white star, or Bardibalus=bardi+balus=white
forehead.

The Illyrian origins of Albanian can now be proven only with the use of
lexical similarities of modern Albanian words with what was found
of the Illyrian glossary, some Illyrian - Albanian correspondences: buris /
burrë "man"; datan / datë "place"; drenis / dreni "deer";
pupa / pupë "hill"; rera / lera "stones".

Modern Albanians still use the vigesimal numeric system of ancient
Illyrians.

if, like you say, Kosovo is independent how come Serbia is blocking? An idependent country should not be dependent on another. The fact reamins, Kosovo is not independent and albanians need to wake up. You are as independent as you were 20 years ago. No investments, no recognitions, no UN and no development. Sounds to me that you are more dependent then ever before, dependent on aid.
(Mikael C, 19 April 2010 14:57)
Using your reasoning I guess about 75% of the worlds countries are not independent including Serbia.

Using your reasoning I guess about 75% of the worlds countries are not independent including Serbia.
(pss, 19 April 2010 19:34)

Well if Kosovo is so independent why is there no foreign investment, opening up jobs for locals, why aren’t your friends the US/EU helping out. Kosovo is as independent as a prisoner in solitary confinement.

(Jim, 19 April 2010 13:04)
Denial is just another one of the processes that has to be conquered through "Baby steps"
Interesting that Serbia is working on a way for this to happen instead of the recent way of "it is our way or we do not participate".
Similar to the 6 point plan, Serbia says no EULEX, the rest of the world does, Serbia and Ban come up with 6 point plan which means nothing, has no requirements attached, and non mandatory, but it was a way for Serbia to present it as a win and welcome the EU.
The message is clear, no one places recognition as a condition on Serbia but others will not play the it is us or them game. It is up to Serbia to come up with a solution where it does not block Kosovo's progression.

Lamberto Zannier is the only representative of UNMIK. If they want to sit with the real representatives, (Thaci and Sejdiu)then they must be represented as Kosovo. If Kosovo does not show up, than the summit will be a failure.

i agree, looking again, that it's all in the foto -- jeremic is looking his usual self-satisfied (arrogant) self; miguel angel is like: how many more seconds can i stand this torment? sad eh, the glamorous life of these leaders...

i don't see this as an issue for Kosova, i see it as an issue for serbia, or more specifically for the current blgd regime. either attend the conference as one of the (civilized) countries of the region, or don't. we want you (and everyone else) to be there, but you ain't in any position to dictate the terms. attend or not, but stop with all the high drama, get it?

thank you.

roberto
frisco

Serbia could give Pristina autonomous status and let them attend on that basis.

I wonder if Pristina would turn up if that were the stated basis however!

This could be done for an experimental period to test reaction.

How about it?

Jeremic and Moratinos:
One step forward, two steps back. How can that help you make progres?

I think the new model for Kosovo represents the Taiwanese model. Recognized by some with China still claiming sovereignty over Taiwan. Deadlocked for decades with no end in sight. As I said before, the Hong Kong model would have worked better.

I support Kosovo independence. But I do understand Sebria's disapproval too. So I think Kosovo should be represented in EU, UN etc as the KOSOVAN AUTHORITY or AUTHORITY OF KOSOVO. It doesn't suggest its a country so they can participate like Palestine

I think that comparisons to Taiwan are good and too often ignored.

Taiwan has far fewer countries that recognize it than recognize Kosovo, but no one really disputes that Taiwan is "really" a country.

Difference is, China actually has the clout to force international organizations to represent Taiwan as "China-Taipei", or whatever.

It's UNMIK – Kosovo! No more No less. I hope Tadic and company knows this.

Lamberto Zannier is the only representative of UNMIK. If they want to sit with the real representatives, (Thaci and Sejdiu)then they must be represented as Kosovo. If Kosovo does not show up, than the summit will be a failure.

I have to applaud PRN for balancing "the comments " from the opposing side.

Anyhow, the photo says it all. Mora(n)tinos: what have I got myself into.

I wonder, if Spain is adamantly opposing Kosovo, why negotiate their presence in a conference whose keys Spaniards hold? Why not just proclaim as Slovenia did on which side are you. Then let whoever comes join the summit.
Anyway, when is the last time Spaniards solved or did anything right.

(Jim, 19 April 2010 13:04)
Denial is just another one of the processes that has to be conquered through "Baby steps"
Interesting that Serbia is working on a way for this to happen instead of the recent way of "it is our way or we do not participate".
Similar to the 6 point plan, Serbia says no EULEX, the rest of the world does, Serbia and Ban come up with 6 point plan which means nothing, has no requirements attached, and non mandatory, but it was a way for Serbia to present it as a win and welcome the EU.
The message is clear, no one places recognition as a condition on Serbia but others will not play the it is us or them game. It is up to Serbia to come up with a solution where it does not block Kosovo's progression.

I am dying to know the new model for Kosova's participation!?

You read the headline and that what is written, but you read the entire article ,and could not find anything about the model.

"Baby steps" Sometimes have to move by baby steps but at least it is progress.

Slovenian Deja vu is the MOST likely model.

Jim: "It seems ever more like the way is being prepared for new discussions after the ICJ ruling."

Exactly, I agree. They are sorting out whether there can be an accepted high level of autonomy, or whether Kosovo will be partitioned.

The latter will be really hard for those Serbian and other communities not in the North - let's hope they have special status and protection granted to them.

What about COMIK-Illyria?
(Top, 19 April 2010 15:52)
--
I wouldn't be handing Illyria over to Albanians. Through genetic analysis we Serbians have just as much claim to it as other indiginous Balkan people.

As taken from the http://tinyurl.com/yb48f8x

"Genetic studies conclude that Serbs are of predominantly Balkan genetics (indigenous to the region)"

"Thus, most Serbs today are descendants of original inhabitants of Balkans, previously known as Illyrians and Thracians."

It is not Kosovo's participation that is negotiated, it is Serbia's indeed. if Moratinos says "country will be left out" it is referenced to country that did not take part in Slovenia Summit. If a country was present then why comment on its upcoming. participation.

What it comes to seem strange is Turkey to negotiate for Kosovo. Kosovars must have lost their trust at Serbs totally, if they don't fuss about their 500 year occuping "ally" to "negotiate" for them. I wonder what did the Serbs do to earn that.

"Baby steps" Sometimes have to move by baby steps but at least it is progress.
(pss, 19 April 2010 12:10)
--
Sounds to me like they are being more inventive towards status negotiations. Now that would be real progress.

To understand where the problem lies, you have to look no further than where these talks will take place, that is Serbia. Throughout the whole article there is no mention that a similar meeting will also happen in Kosovo. This is an indication that there is nothing to fix as far as Kosovo is concerned but rather it is Serbia that needs a fixing. Jeremic did not comment on the content of the meeting because he knows what is coming. He betrayed the EU and US by asking them to support Serbia's initiative to launch an ICJ hearin regarding Kosovo's independence in an effort to remove the Kosovo issue from day to day Serbian politics and into the hands of an international court. This is the exact reason why Serbia got the support of many countries to pass such a resolution in the UN. However, Serbia, instead of doing what it had promissed the EU and US it would do, it did the opposite by making Kosovo the hallmark of their foreing as well as domestic policies.

i agree, looking again, that it's all in the foto -- jeremic is looking his usual self-satisfied (arrogant) self; miguel angel is like: how many more seconds can i stand this torment? sad eh, the glamorous life of these leaders...

i don't see this as an issue for Kosova, i see it as an issue for serbia, or more specifically for the current blgd regime. either attend the conference as one of the (civilized) countries of the region, or don't. we want you (and everyone else) to be there, but you ain't in any position to dictate the terms. attend or not, but stop with all the high drama, get it?

thank you.

roberto
frisco

pss - Baby steps? Utter nonsense.

In fact it shows just how deadlocked Kosovo's claim to independence is that one of your leading sponsors has to go to speak with Belgrade to work out an acceptable formula for Serbia to allow Kosovo to participate in regional meetings.

As for trying to spin this as progress for Kosovo's participation in international fora, that is also rubbish. Kosovo was free to do that before UDI. In fact all this will do is take it back to where things started 2 years ago. What progress!

As I said here a few days ago, the declaration of independence was a complete disaster for Kosovo. For the sake of a meaningless bit of paper that is not recognised by 2/3 of the world (and only grudgingly accepted by many others), Kosovo chances of making real headway have been dramatically reduced.

Also, the bit about opening the way for direct talks between Belgrade and Pristina is interesting. I can't see this as being about talks between states. Instead, this seems to confirm that pressure is building for new negotiations. It is also telling that Turkey is so involved in this. If it couldn't get independence accepted for the Turkish Cypriots, And is no advocating a solution based on less than statehood, what makes KAs think that they will press the independence agenda for them? All in all, it seems ever more like the way is being prepared for new discussions after the ICJ ruling.

I think the photo says it all...

Jeremic looks confident, Moratinos looks like he's got a big headache on his hands.

Kosovo UDI is not working.

Serbia is back baby!

Looking forward to this snub of kosovo. I don't see the other Balkan nations risking another fiasco because of tiny kosovo. UNMIKosovo can participate in that function.

"It is up to Serbia to come up with a solution where it does not block Kosovo's progression."
pss

if, like you say, Kosovo is independent how come Serbia is blocking? An idependent country should not be dependent on another. The fact reamins, Kosovo is not independent and albanians need to wake up. You are as independent as you were 20 years ago. No investments, no recognitions, no UN and no development. Sounds to me that you are more dependent then ever before, dependent on aid.

if, like you say, Kosovo is independent how come Serbia is blocking? An idependent country should not be dependent on another. The fact reamins, Kosovo is not independent and albanians need to wake up. You are as independent as you were 20 years ago. No investments, no recognitions, no UN and no development. Sounds to me that you are more dependent then ever before, dependent on aid.
(Mikael C, 19 April 2010 14:57)
Using your reasoning I guess about 75% of the worlds countries are not independent including Serbia.

Can we be honest and realistic here, folks? If an Albanian Kosovo was truly an independent nation, there would be no discussion about how they would be represented at European summits. I don't see anyone trying to figure out how other EU countries will be represented. Let's get back to the negotiation table, without US interference, if that is possible, and get this exhausting matter settled - people's lives are at stake here.

wouldn't be handing Illyria over to Albanians. Through genetic analysis we Serbians have just as much claim to it as other indiginous Balkan people.

As taken from the [link]

"Genetic studies conclude that Serbs are of predominantly Balkan genetics (indigenous to the region)"

"Thus, most Serbs today are descendants of original inhabitants of Balkans, previously known as Illyrians and Thracians."


Your link clearly states that south slavs may have mingled with thraco-illyrians, but when you say you wouldnt hand illyria over to Albanians.

I say why not?

Many historians conclude that modern Albanians are the most ethnically pure decendants of Ancient Illyrians.



IDEA: So Illyrian as say many scholars have the unique descendant left in
Albanian.



Many Illyrian names have been preserved in Albanian language: Didi=Dede,
Lalus=Lala, Dassios=Dash, Bardhyllis=Bardhan, Bardhosh, etc.
Even such names could be explained by Albanian etymology:
Bardhyllis=bardhë+yllis=white star, or Bardibalus=bardi+balus=white
forehead.

The Illyrian origins of Albanian can now be proven only with the use of
lexical similarities of modern Albanian words with what was found
of the Illyrian glossary, some Illyrian - Albanian correspondences: buris /
burrë "man"; datan / datë "place"; drenis / dreni "deer";
pupa / pupë "hill"; rera / lera "stones".

Modern Albanians still use the vigesimal numeric system of ancient
Illyrians.

I support Kosovo independence. But I do understand Sebria's disapproval too. So I think Kosovo should be represented in EU, UN etc as the KOSOVAN AUTHORITY or AUTHORITY OF KOSOVO. It doesn't suggest its a country so they can participate like Palestine

If it's really only about the name (Kosovo vs. UNMIK-Kosovo), maybe they should come up with an unconventional solution. What about COMIK-Illyria?

Just kidding, guys, don't panic...

Jeremic and Moratinos:
One step forward, two steps back. How can that help you make progres?

Using your reasoning I guess about 75% of the worlds countries are not independent including Serbia.
(pss, 19 April 2010 19:34)

Well if Kosovo is so independent why is there no foreign investment, opening up jobs for locals, why aren’t your friends the US/EU helping out. Kosovo is as independent as a prisoner in solitary confinement.

"jeremic is looking his usual self-satisfied (arrogant) self"

-Roberto

Coming from the expert himself on the subject of self-satisfaction and arrogance.

Serbia could give Pristina autonomous status and let them attend on that basis.

I wonder if Pristina would turn up if that were the stated basis however!

This could be done for an experimental period to test reaction.

How about it?

I think the new model for Kosovo represents the Taiwanese model. Recognized by some with China still claiming sovereignty over Taiwan. Deadlocked for decades with no end in sight. As I said before, the Hong Kong model would have worked better.

I think that comparisons to Taiwan are good and too often ignored.

Taiwan has far fewer countries that recognize it than recognize Kosovo, but no one really disputes that Taiwan is "really" a country.

Difference is, China actually has the clout to force international organizations to represent Taiwan as "China-Taipei", or whatever.