Europe shocked at Kaczynski death

Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić.
(Ilyrian, 10 April 2010, 16:21)

Leave it to an Albanian to turn a tragedy into a political debate. Disgusting.

"Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić."
Ilyrian

Have you no shame!

Whether one agrees with the views of a politician of another country is totally irrelevant when a tragedy of such magnitude strikes.

My sincere condolences to the Polish nation and our poster friend Peter.

Why goodness, what a sad and unexpected incident. RIP to all and my condolences to the Polish people.

My deepest condolences to Poles.

This is such a tragedy for the entire Polish nation.

May the victims of this tragedy rest in peace.

My God, what an unbelievable horrible thing. I mean the *entire* Polish leadership!

My sincere condolences to all Poles, and a special condolence to our resident Pole, Mr. Peter Sudyka.

Condolences to the Polish people and in particular the relatives of the deceased. This is a big tragedy for Poland. The comemoration of Katyn has brought more mourning... Fate can be so cynical...

I hope conspiracy theories' peddlers will stay away.
(Gustave, 10 April 2010 11:38)

Very horrible, really, what a sad day.
The conspiracy theories are already out there. What I did read is the plane was asked to divert to Minsk or Moscow but the pilot decided to proceed disregarding the tower. He tried to land four times, at the last attempt he struck trees. He was in hurry because the ceremony was about to begin.

It is easy to be a smartass now, but I am shocked that almost the entire government and military leadership was put on a single airplane.... while there is a Warszawa-Minsk-Smolensk-Moscow mainline rail with well over 100 kmh speed.

Condolences to the people of Poland and the families of the victims in this tragedy.

"Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!"
(louie)

-- As always louie, you don't write often, but when you do, it stands above the normal fray.

Horrible news. Polish people are our friends and brothers and we Serbs hope they overcome this fast.
May victims rest in peace.

Marko.

Horrible tragedy. Condolances to the people of Poland.

Poland and Ukraine provided an important sanctuary for refugee Serbs fleeing the islamic catastrophe.
(Rashan, 10 April 2010 17:25)

The most northern Serbian frescoes were in the Church of the Transfiguration on Kovalyovo in Novgorod in Northern Russia. The painters were Serbs in 1380 proving that not just refugees came.

http://www.360cities.net/image/inside-church-kovalyovo-russia#126.68,14.91,109.6

The entire interior was covered by frescoes. The church was totally destroyed by nazis on purpose. Some remaining frescoes were put together piece-by-piece.

http://www.360cities.net/image/church-kovalyevo-russia#0.00,-7.00,70.0

-------

As for the tragedy: Katyn seem to be a cursed ground. Hungarian TV just interviewed György Hay, one of the chief pilots of MALÉV who is familiar with the airport and the machine in question.

According him it is a military airport with only 2 km long landing stripe - BARELY enough for any major passenger plane. The airport in question is NOT equipped with anything what would assist the pilot of a passenger airplane. The plane itself was a TU-154, a versatile airplane much loved by pilots. He confirmed that the plane crashed at FIFTH landing attempt and according him the pilot was "INSANE" because he got clear instructions from the tower to divert to Moscow or Minsk. The plane was recently re-hauled and not "aging" as some technically analphabet media does claim. I trust the chief pilot of MALÉV more than CNN, sorry.

My uneducated guess: because the time was already tight, the high military brass on the plane DEMANDED the pilot to land, whatever it takes, maybe even with a little "we show them who are the bravest" motivation and did not listen. This meeting was a special because there was already one ceremony earlier but Mr. Kaczinsky did not want to attend it for political reason, i.e. he wanted to have a separate ceremony. The Russian counterpart did everything he demanded - and thus for the courtesy and for pride the Polish site felt they HAVE to keep their timing, whatever it takes. Polish pride is legendary in Russia.

With all the controversy about being "anti-Russian" (more than just "anti-Soviet") Kaczinsky twins were/are great friends of Serbia and among the very few politicians who did not made themself rich after the communism. These two things are more important than the rest. May the victims of this second Katyn tragedy rest in peace.

Please keep the decency and keep the insane conspiracy theories away.

Condolences to all Poles in the World,especially to our Peter Sudyka!

Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!

First I send my condolences to the Polish people who have suffered a great loss this saturday.

And a message to those who insinuate Russia is behind this tragic event:

First of all it looks like it was an accident. But even if it was not an accident, what would Russia gain? Poland and Russia were in a process of reconciliation. The only ones who gain from this is those who don't want Poland and Russia to have good relations.

Condolences to the Polish people and in particular the relatives of the deceased. This is a big tragedy for Poland. The comemoration of Katyn has brought more mourning... Fate can be so cynical...

I hope conspiracy theories' peddlers will stay away.

Joe : “in Zakarpatske Oblast too the Russians were the good guys...”

Those were Benderasts i.e. Ukrainian nationalists. Though you're right cause Ukrainians are a sort of the Russians. But in Volin region both sides were equal guilty. Anyway it’s not the right time to go far from the condolence.

Ataman : “he was a great friend of Serbia.”

Strange as you are Ata-man ! How can someone be a true friend of Serbia and harming Serbia’s best friend ? Serbia’s friends visit Moscow during their lifetime … He backed Serbs as a good Catholic but not as a President of a state. All Polish leaders were and are US puppets so don’t you blame Tusk. At least it’s not the right time.

Ilyrian : ” Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders”

Russia is the second suffered side of the tragedy and only a blind can not see it. As for the scenario it was predicted one month ago when IMEDI TV of Georgia organized a provocation about a Russian invasion. Then they said as if the plane of Leh Kachinski had “ blasted in the air. So please leave your Russo phobia for at least few days.

Jason - Thank you !

Rashan - Thank you !

The Truth - Thank you !

Joe : “he was NOT INVITED to the earlier ceremony by Putin.”

According to the Diplomatic Protocol Putin cannot invite other than another PM while Medvedev was missing there and thus he also could not invite Leh. If you knew that the first time Leh went to Moscow was today you would not be surprised why no invitation came for him. If you knew about the relations he had with Donald you would guess who initiated the formalities. So please stop poisoning the forum !

Conspiratory albanians and bosnians are sying russia is behind this. Why? This polish president was against the independence of Kosovo even though his parliment voted for. Perhaps the guilty ones are albanians and bosnjaks.


R.I.P

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 11:11)

Instead of compassion there is only negativity from our resident Albanian and Muslim trolls. And Joe.

Disgusting.

"Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić."
Ilyrian


At least they werent kidnapped to have their organs removed and then sold on the black market.
What do you know about what happend? The pilot decided to land even thought the controltower suggested anothor airport. There was a heavy fog which caused the accident. I guess the russians were responsible for the fog. Ridiculous!

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 11:11)

Is negative IQ score possible?

After starring in “Lolek and Bolek” film this man devoted himself to fighting the Russians. And I respect him cause he was very persistent in his hatred and had never missed a chance to harm us as much as he could.
(Rote Kapelle, 10 April 2010 11:05)

And at the same time he was a great friend of Serbia. He did everything possible to resist the pressure regarding Kosovo recognition - I can't say the same about U.S. puppet Donald Duck Tusk.

http://www.warsawvoice.pl/view/17345

R.I.P.

Kaczynski is supposed to be dead and it disappoints me more than I could imagine. After starring in “Lolek and Bolek” film this man devoted himself to fighting the Russians. And I respect him cause he was very persistent in his hatred and had never missed a chance to harm us as much as he could. We’ll be missing him for such people like him like Saakashvili like Basaev and Yushenko help us not to relax and keep up the tonus. Even the way he has died is a big strike at Russia. Anyway I keep no black heart for him and forgive him for everything he has done. We are no more to judge him any longer. My special regrets for those who left with him. Let them all rest in peace.

Finally I believe the tragedy of Katyn is to be stopped once and forever. I guess the crush is a sign to stop exploiting it in our current interests. We do not remind the Poles of the much bigger quantity of the Russians tortured to death 19 years before Katyn and expect that they will also return to the common sense. All Russian leaders have apologized for the murders in 3 camps but we are not going to become another Germans with Complex of Inferiority implants. At least all murders were sanctioned by a Georgian and executions took place mostly in Belarus and the Ukraine. 80% of the captured Poles were sent to Siberia where none of them was killed and where lately they formed 1 Arrmy of Voisko Polskoe.

Just red this from AZ:

http://en.trend.az/regions/world/russia/1667523.html

Please note that back in 2008:

"Air traffic control told the pilot of Kaczynski's plane to turn back because it was too dangerous to land in Tbilisi, but the president -- who also is commander in chief under Poland's law -- ordered the pilot to land anyway"

My guessing about the tragic event could be right - under Polish law Kaczynski could order anything he wanted from the pilot and pilot had to obey the command. In 2008 the pilot was given the command to disregard the order of the tower in Tbilisi and yesterday the pilot disregarded the order of the tower in Smolensk.

And only few weeks ago the Iveri TV station aired the hoax about the Russian invasion of Georgia and Polish president being killed.

Rest in peace.

Rote

I saw the film "Burnt by the Sun" and it moved me terribly about the very sad period of Stalin's terror and murder of most of his officer core. This effectively killed any chance of wiping out the Germans alot earlier. The very officers that were superior to the Nazis and trained them in tactics and provided equipment.

We can't go into all the tradegies that had fallen on our Russian brothers over the 20th Century as the blackness would drive me to despair.

However, although Kacsynski was not right in supporting Saks in his war adventure he was visiting to mend fences for a brighter future.

Tragedy has also fallen on Poland and Serbia in familiar circumstances in the 20th century. The murder of Poland's officer core was profound for Poland and should be commemorated as a tragedy too.

Condolences to the families of the victims of the plane crash.

Serbs are very grateful to Russia and Poland for providing a sanctuary in troubled times and helping us throughout our history. Poland and Ukraine provided an important sanctuary for refugee Serbs fleeing the islamic catastrophe.

The support and sometimes direct help during the historical German campaign of genocide right through to the Nazi/Ustasha death camps and islamic catastrophies will never be forgotten by Serbs.

At the moment, opinion in Poland is, that the catastrophe in Smolensk will change bilateral relations. And will change for better relations, because very friendly russian reactions.

"This meeting was a special because there was already one ceremony earlier but Mr. Kaczinsky did not want to attend it for political reason".
Ataman

Not true. AS I read on a German web site he was NOT INVITED to the earlier ceremony by Putin.

Condolences to all Poles in the World,especially to our Peter Sudyka!

Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!
(louie, 10 April 2010 22:49)

Thats a lovely tribute louie, so true about it being a tragic day. My deepest condolences as well to the Polish nation. RIP

Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić.

to (Jason, 11 April 2010 15:14)

This is a news site buddy not a consolation club. Get over it.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 18:04)

------

Is negative IQ score possible?
(Ataman, 11 April 2010 17:40)

-----

Thanks for providing the answer to my question.

http://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neandertalac

Very sad and tragic and i will refrain from commenting here on some of the others...

yes, ataman, that's what i thought -- why all together on one plane?... it is hard not to raise one's eyebrows knowing the troubled history of these 2 neighbors but i just can't imagine something so sordid as that at this point in time. in the past, absolutely -- but now, why??

rip

roberto frisco

Very sad and tragic and i will refrain from commenting here on some of the others...

yes, ataman, that's what i thought -- why all together on one plane?... it is hard not to raise one's eyebrows knowing the troubled history of these 2 neighbors but i just can't imagine something so sordid as that at this point in time. in the past, absolutely -- but now, why??

rip

roberto frisco
(roberto, 10 April 2010 18:57)

The senior pilot of MALÉV explained it in the interview, I just wrote about it. Otherwise -indeed - why? Because of our East European carelessness and bravery and pride.

A while ago the East German (DDR) pilots "made" it - before eyes of their wives, with an intercontinental long-range IL-62. This was a famous landing... totally unimaginable in the "West", pilots would be never allowed this kind of bravery. Totally crazy. If the wife you see would beat her husband at home after such landing - that would be well-deserved.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c5a_1258754885

More of similar braveries (ended up in tragedy):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_593

Again, I can well imagine, the high military brass on the plane demanded the pilot to show his skills. This is question of pride :-(

The pilot was trying to land four times before crashing during the fifth attempt. As the MALÉV pilot said: "örültség" = "insanity".

But it was precisely MALÉV which bravely flew an other TU-154 across Lebanese rocket fire during the conflict:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malev_Flight_240

Don't worry about Russians and pride:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/tu-114-service.htm

Can you imagine that Nikita Hruschyov was put on an EXPERIMENTAL airplane to attend a UN session?

Luckily for him that experimental airplane turned out to be one of the best and safest airplanes ever made, with only one crash due pilot error.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-114

I still remember ads I seen as a kid about that airplane operating with joined JAL crew to Tokyo. And it had sleeping cabins, not "fish conserve" seats where we have to suffer in 2010. Flying time was the same. We were promised different technical progress in 1960-s than what we have in 2010. That thing flew every day over our house and the sound of engines was unmistakable.

Thanks everybody for the kind words.

Yes, it was a big shock to hear the news of his death.

While I didn't agree with all his policies (while some I did), he had Poland on his mind first and foremost and its people, which is something admirable and rare in the world today.

About some of the conspiracy theories below, I don't believe there was an attempt on his life and that of other members of PiS. It appeared to have been a pilot error and I doubt anybody disliked him that much as to want him dead.

Condollences to his family, especially to his poor daughter who is now unfortunately an orphan.

Hopefully the Polish government will invest in some modern airliners (Boeing or Airbus) and replace that fleet of those Soviet museum pieces that they are still using.

to (Jason, 11 April 2010 15:14)

This is a news site buddy not a consolation club. Get over it.

Is negative IQ score possible?
(Ataman, 11 April 2010 17:40)

Donno.But I have already written one test where I had no score out of 50 questions.

I feel terrible for those effected by this disaster.

But something is hinting this wasnt such an "accident", I am curious what future plans he really had for Poland that would have effected the East and West relations...

Rote Kapelle,

Yes, in Zakarpatske Oblast too the Russians were the good guys...

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.

BTW Rote Kapelle, could you please give the Комсомол propaganda a rest in this case please, many families in Poland have lost their loved ones and are now in mourning. I would never have the audacity to say something like you did after the Moscow terror bombings.

Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić.

"This meeting was a special because there was already one ceremony earlier but Mr. Kaczinsky did not want to attend it for political reason".
Ataman

Not true. AS I read on a German web site he was NOT INVITED to the earlier ceremony by Putin.

Kaczynski is supposed to be dead and it disappoints me more than I could imagine. After starring in “Lolek and Bolek” film this man devoted himself to fighting the Russians. And I respect him cause he was very persistent in his hatred and had never missed a chance to harm us as much as he could. We’ll be missing him for such people like him like Saakashvili like Basaev and Yushenko help us not to relax and keep up the tonus. Even the way he has died is a big strike at Russia. Anyway I keep no black heart for him and forgive him for everything he has done. We are no more to judge him any longer. My special regrets for those who left with him. Let them all rest in peace.

Finally I believe the tragedy of Katyn is to be stopped once and forever. I guess the crush is a sign to stop exploiting it in our current interests. We do not remind the Poles of the much bigger quantity of the Russians tortured to death 19 years before Katyn and expect that they will also return to the common sense. All Russian leaders have apologized for the murders in 3 camps but we are not going to become another Germans with Complex of Inferiority implants. At least all murders were sanctioned by a Georgian and executions took place mostly in Belarus and the Ukraine. 80% of the captured Poles were sent to Siberia where none of them was killed and where lately they formed 1 Arrmy of Voisko Polskoe.

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.

Rote Kapelle,

Yes, in Zakarpatske Oblast too the Russians were the good guys...

to (Jason, 11 April 2010 15:14)

This is a news site buddy not a consolation club. Get over it.

Very sad and tragic and i will refrain from commenting here on some of the others...

yes, ataman, that's what i thought -- why all together on one plane?... it is hard not to raise one's eyebrows knowing the troubled history of these 2 neighbors but i just can't imagine something so sordid as that at this point in time. in the past, absolutely -- but now, why??

rip

roberto frisco

Whether one agrees with the views of a politician of another country is totally irrelevant when a tragedy of such magnitude strikes.

My sincere condolences to the Polish nation and our poster friend Peter.

Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić.
(Ilyrian, 10 April 2010, 16:21)

Leave it to an Albanian to turn a tragedy into a political debate. Disgusting.

"Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić."
Ilyrian

Have you no shame!

Rote

I saw the film "Burnt by the Sun" and it moved me terribly about the very sad period of Stalin's terror and murder of most of his officer core. This effectively killed any chance of wiping out the Germans alot earlier. The very officers that were superior to the Nazis and trained them in tactics and provided equipment.

We can't go into all the tradegies that had fallen on our Russian brothers over the 20th Century as the blackness would drive me to despair.

However, although Kacsynski was not right in supporting Saks in his war adventure he was visiting to mend fences for a brighter future.

Tragedy has also fallen on Poland and Serbia in familiar circumstances in the 20th century. The murder of Poland's officer core was profound for Poland and should be commemorated as a tragedy too.

Condolences to the families of the victims of the plane crash.

Serbs are very grateful to Russia and Poland for providing a sanctuary in troubled times and helping us throughout our history. Poland and Ukraine provided an important sanctuary for refugee Serbs fleeing the islamic catastrophe.

The support and sometimes direct help during the historical German campaign of genocide right through to the Nazi/Ustasha death camps and islamic catastrophies will never be forgotten by Serbs.

Poland and Ukraine provided an important sanctuary for refugee Serbs fleeing the islamic catastrophe.
(Rashan, 10 April 2010 17:25)

The most northern Serbian frescoes were in the Church of the Transfiguration on Kovalyovo in Novgorod in Northern Russia. The painters were Serbs in 1380 proving that not just refugees came.

http://www.360cities.net/image/inside-church-kovalyovo-russia#126.68,14.91,109.6

The entire interior was covered by frescoes. The church was totally destroyed by nazis on purpose. Some remaining frescoes were put together piece-by-piece.

http://www.360cities.net/image/church-kovalyevo-russia#0.00,-7.00,70.0

-------

As for the tragedy: Katyn seem to be a cursed ground. Hungarian TV just interviewed György Hay, one of the chief pilots of MALÉV who is familiar with the airport and the machine in question.

According him it is a military airport with only 2 km long landing stripe - BARELY enough for any major passenger plane. The airport in question is NOT equipped with anything what would assist the pilot of a passenger airplane. The plane itself was a TU-154, a versatile airplane much loved by pilots. He confirmed that the plane crashed at FIFTH landing attempt and according him the pilot was "INSANE" because he got clear instructions from the tower to divert to Moscow or Minsk. The plane was recently re-hauled and not "aging" as some technically analphabet media does claim. I trust the chief pilot of MALÉV more than CNN, sorry.

My uneducated guess: because the time was already tight, the high military brass on the plane DEMANDED the pilot to land, whatever it takes, maybe even with a little "we show them who are the bravest" motivation and did not listen. This meeting was a special because there was already one ceremony earlier but Mr. Kaczinsky did not want to attend it for political reason, i.e. he wanted to have a separate ceremony. The Russian counterpart did everything he demanded - and thus for the courtesy and for pride the Polish site felt they HAVE to keep their timing, whatever it takes. Polish pride is legendary in Russia.

With all the controversy about being "anti-Russian" (more than just "anti-Soviet") Kaczinsky twins were/are great friends of Serbia and among the very few politicians who did not made themself rich after the communism. These two things are more important than the rest. May the victims of this second Katyn tragedy rest in peace.

Please keep the decency and keep the insane conspiracy theories away.

After starring in “Lolek and Bolek” film this man devoted himself to fighting the Russians. And I respect him cause he was very persistent in his hatred and had never missed a chance to harm us as much as he could.
(Rote Kapelle, 10 April 2010 11:05)

And at the same time he was a great friend of Serbia. He did everything possible to resist the pressure regarding Kosovo recognition - I can't say the same about U.S. puppet Donald Duck Tusk.

http://www.warsawvoice.pl/view/17345

R.I.P.

Conspiratory albanians and bosnians are sying russia is behind this. Why? This polish president was against the independence of Kosovo even though his parliment voted for. Perhaps the guilty ones are albanians and bosnjaks.


R.I.P

"Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders. Same style was used by pro russians in ex Yu to kill Džemal Bijedić."
Ilyrian


At least they werent kidnapped to have their organs removed and then sold on the black market.
What do you know about what happend? The pilot decided to land even thought the controltower suggested anothor airport. There was a heavy fog which caused the accident. I guess the russians were responsible for the fog. Ridiculous!

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 11:11)

Instead of compassion there is only negativity from our resident Albanian and Muslim trolls. And Joe.

Disgusting.

Joe : “in Zakarpatske Oblast too the Russians were the good guys...”

Those were Benderasts i.e. Ukrainian nationalists. Though you're right cause Ukrainians are a sort of the Russians. But in Volin region both sides were equal guilty. Anyway it’s not the right time to go far from the condolence.

Ataman : “he was a great friend of Serbia.”

Strange as you are Ata-man ! How can someone be a true friend of Serbia and harming Serbia’s best friend ? Serbia’s friends visit Moscow during their lifetime … He backed Serbs as a good Catholic but not as a President of a state. All Polish leaders were and are US puppets so don’t you blame Tusk. At least it’s not the right time.

Ilyrian : ” Again a Russian style scenario for elimination of foreign leaders”

Russia is the second suffered side of the tragedy and only a blind can not see it. As for the scenario it was predicted one month ago when IMEDI TV of Georgia organized a provocation about a Russian invasion. Then they said as if the plane of Leh Kachinski had “ blasted in the air. So please leave your Russo phobia for at least few days.

Jason - Thank you !

Rashan - Thank you !

The Truth - Thank you !

Joe : “he was NOT INVITED to the earlier ceremony by Putin.”

According to the Diplomatic Protocol Putin cannot invite other than another PM while Medvedev was missing there and thus he also could not invite Leh. If you knew that the first time Leh went to Moscow was today you would not be surprised why no invitation came for him. If you knew about the relations he had with Donald you would guess who initiated the formalities. So please stop poisoning the forum !

Why goodness, what a sad and unexpected incident. RIP to all and my condolences to the Polish people.

Condolences to the Polish people and in particular the relatives of the deceased. This is a big tragedy for Poland. The comemoration of Katyn has brought more mourning... Fate can be so cynical...

I hope conspiracy theories' peddlers will stay away.
(Gustave, 10 April 2010 11:38)

Very horrible, really, what a sad day.
The conspiracy theories are already out there. What I did read is the plane was asked to divert to Minsk or Moscow but the pilot decided to proceed disregarding the tower. He tried to land four times, at the last attempt he struck trees. He was in hurry because the ceremony was about to begin.

It is easy to be a smartass now, but I am shocked that almost the entire government and military leadership was put on a single airplane.... while there is a Warszawa-Minsk-Smolensk-Moscow mainline rail with well over 100 kmh speed.

Condolences to all Poles in the World,especially to our Peter Sudyka!

Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!

Rest in peace.

Very sad and tragic and i will refrain from commenting here on some of the others...

yes, ataman, that's what i thought -- why all together on one plane?... it is hard not to raise one's eyebrows knowing the troubled history of these 2 neighbors but i just can't imagine something so sordid as that at this point in time. in the past, absolutely -- but now, why??

rip

roberto frisco
(roberto, 10 April 2010 18:57)

The senior pilot of MALÉV explained it in the interview, I just wrote about it. Otherwise -indeed - why? Because of our East European carelessness and bravery and pride.

A while ago the East German (DDR) pilots "made" it - before eyes of their wives, with an intercontinental long-range IL-62. This was a famous landing... totally unimaginable in the "West", pilots would be never allowed this kind of bravery. Totally crazy. If the wife you see would beat her husband at home after such landing - that would be well-deserved.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c5a_1258754885

More of similar braveries (ended up in tragedy):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_593

Again, I can well imagine, the high military brass on the plane demanded the pilot to show his skills. This is question of pride :-(

The pilot was trying to land four times before crashing during the fifth attempt. As the MALÉV pilot said: "örültség" = "insanity".

But it was precisely MALÉV which bravely flew an other TU-154 across Lebanese rocket fire during the conflict:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malev_Flight_240

Don't worry about Russians and pride:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/tu-114-service.htm

Can you imagine that Nikita Hruschyov was put on an EXPERIMENTAL airplane to attend a UN session?

Luckily for him that experimental airplane turned out to be one of the best and safest airplanes ever made, with only one crash due pilot error.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-114

I still remember ads I seen as a kid about that airplane operating with joined JAL crew to Tokyo. And it had sleeping cabins, not "fish conserve" seats where we have to suffer in 2010. Flying time was the same. We were promised different technical progress in 1960-s than what we have in 2010. That thing flew every day over our house and the sound of engines was unmistakable.

"Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!"
(louie)

-- As always louie, you don't write often, but when you do, it stands above the normal fray.

My God, what an unbelievable horrible thing. I mean the *entire* Polish leadership!

My sincere condolences to all Poles, and a special condolence to our resident Pole, Mr. Peter Sudyka.

A warning from Putin to ex-Soviet puppets.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 11:11)

Is negative IQ score possible?

Condolences to the Polish people and in particular the relatives of the deceased. This is a big tragedy for Poland. The comemoration of Katyn has brought more mourning... Fate can be so cynical...

I hope conspiracy theories' peddlers will stay away.

My deepest condolences to Poles.

This is such a tragedy for the entire Polish nation.

May the victims of this tragedy rest in peace.

Condolences to the people of Poland and the families of the victims in this tragedy.

Horrible news. Polish people are our friends and brothers and we Serbs hope they overcome this fast.
May victims rest in peace.

Marko.

Horrible tragedy. Condolances to the people of Poland.

Just red this from AZ:

http://en.trend.az/regions/world/russia/1667523.html

Please note that back in 2008:

"Air traffic control told the pilot of Kaczynski's plane to turn back because it was too dangerous to land in Tbilisi, but the president -- who also is commander in chief under Poland's law -- ordered the pilot to land anyway"

My guessing about the tragic event could be right - under Polish law Kaczynski could order anything he wanted from the pilot and pilot had to obey the command. In 2008 the pilot was given the command to disregard the order of the tower in Tbilisi and yesterday the pilot disregarded the order of the tower in Smolensk.

And only few weeks ago the Iveri TV station aired the hoax about the Russian invasion of Georgia and Polish president being killed.

First I send my condolences to the Polish people who have suffered a great loss this saturday.

And a message to those who insinuate Russia is behind this tragic event:

First of all it looks like it was an accident. But even if it was not an accident, what would Russia gain? Poland and Russia were in a process of reconciliation. The only ones who gain from this is those who don't want Poland and Russia to have good relations.

Is negative IQ score possible?
(Ataman, 11 April 2010 17:40)

Donno.But I have already written one test where I had no score out of 50 questions.

to (Jason, 11 April 2010 15:14)

This is a news site buddy not a consolation club. Get over it.
(BH_NYC, 11 April 2010 18:04)

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Is negative IQ score possible?
(Ataman, 11 April 2010 17:40)

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Thanks for providing the answer to my question.

http://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neandertalac

At the moment, opinion in Poland is, that the catastrophe in Smolensk will change bilateral relations. And will change for better relations, because very friendly russian reactions.

Condolences to all Poles in the World,especially to our Peter Sudyka!

Today we should let aside our political comments,it is a tragic day for all of us!
(louie, 10 April 2010 22:49)

Thats a lovely tribute louie, so true about it being a tragic day. My deepest condolences as well to the Polish nation. RIP

I feel terrible for those effected by this disaster.

But something is hinting this wasnt such an "accident", I am curious what future plans he really had for Poland that would have effected the East and West relations...

Thanks everybody for the kind words.

Yes, it was a big shock to hear the news of his death.

While I didn't agree with all his policies (while some I did), he had Poland on his mind first and foremost and its people, which is something admirable and rare in the world today.

About some of the conspiracy theories below, I don't believe there was an attempt on his life and that of other members of PiS. It appeared to have been a pilot error and I doubt anybody disliked him that much as to want him dead.

Condollences to his family, especially to his poor daughter who is now unfortunately an orphan.

Hopefully the Polish government will invest in some modern airliners (Boeing or Airbus) and replace that fleet of those Soviet museum pieces that they are still using.

BTW Rote Kapelle, could you please give the Комсомол propaganda a rest in this case please, many families in Poland have lost their loved ones and are now in mourning. I would never have the audacity to say something like you did after the Moscow terror bombings.