Hague: Karadžić begins defense

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.
(Another Canadian Serb, 1 March 2010 14:18

Another Canadian Serb

You're right.Justice is not blind in Karadzic.He's prosecuted not for his alleged crimes but because he is a Serb.

Karadzic's trial by the Hague inquisition has nothing to do with justice but everything to do with politics.By prosecuting Karadzic they're prosecuting Serbia.

I will disagree with you on your point that US is defending today against islamic fundamentalism or terrorism.The US is defending its own geopolitical interests being
Iraq Or Afganistan or anywhere else in the world.
Remember that todays Taliban in Afganistan were yestrdays
freedom fighters.

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.

let's hope an unfornate accident does'n't happen to him, as it did to Milosevic. Too many people getting exposed is the fear roaming around the West. If Karadzic is going down, he should be taking everyone else down with him.

I am sure that the evidence will be well presented and that a reasoned judgement will be made.

He is not on trial because he is a Serb. He is on trial because of a lot of disgusting murders which have tainted the name of Serbia.

He has the chance to make a defense - let's see if it is any good.

Mladic should hand himself in too - I would be interested to hear if he has a defense against the charge of multiple cold-blooded murders. Probably not, otherwise he would not need to hide.....

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.
(Another Canadian Serb,

-- Careful mate, I agree the charges against him are inflated, and that they are other politicians running free who are WAY more guilty than him. BUT please do not deny completly what he did. he is guilty on many factors, just not the ones being laid against him in this kangaroo court.

Were there, or were there not, war crimes committed by Serbs?

Let's forget, for a moment, the morality of the Serbian decision to wage war and look instead at the events that occurred and those responsible for managing the conduct of the BSA.

Why were civilians fired upon in Sarajevo? Why were many Muslim towns brutally cleansed in eastern BiH in the spring of 1992?

If the Serbs had such a mighty and glorious military, why were so many innocent people raped, pillaged, plundered, tortured and slaughtered?

Blame it on paramilitaries? A real army wouldn't give thugs like Arkan and Lukic free reign.

Blame it on the fact that the Muslims fired the first shot? Do we know that to be true? And in any event, is it responsible to allow an isolated event -- however tragic and unjust -- to propel a nation forward into full-scale war?

Awful things happen in war, no matter what effort is made to keep civilians out of the cross hairs. However, Karadzic appears to have made NO effort whatsoever to spare innocent people from the brutalities of war. Events such as the horrific siege of Sarajevo and the Srebrenica massacre provide more than enough evidence for a life sentence -- no matter where the trial is conducted.

We all know Muslims committed atrocities, too, and in a truly just world, their leaders would be tried and convicted as well.

And no doubt that foreign leaders bear some degree of culpability, and again, if the world were fair, they, too, would face justice.

But the world isn't fair, nor has it ever been, and after every war ever waged we have always had victors' justtice.

What would have happened had the Serbs won the wars? Would Milosevic, Karadzic, Babic and Martic ever have gone to the Hague? Would Mladic and Hadzic be in hiding? Of course not. But there would still be lots of blood on their hands, and people the world over would be outraged. Serbian politicians would be regarded the same was El-Bashir in Sudan, or as Mugabe in Zimbabwe.

Or for that matter, as George Bush and Dick Cheney in the US. That's unfair, too.

But did Stalin ever pay for the millions of people he persecuted and murdered in the USSR? Did the Founding Fathers in the US ever pay the price for enslaving Africans? Did Andrew Jackson ever face trial for marching the Cherokee nation on a long Trail of Tears? Is China's government paying for their occupation of Tibet? Who is waging war against the Burmese Junta?

The Serbs lost in Bosnia and Croatia and now they're paying the price. They should never have gone so quickly to war -- and certainly not in such brutal fashion.

Unfortunately, this Serb will not be hanged for his dispicable crimes. He himself wanted and called this "a holy war". Well, at least in the afterlife he will burn along all other dishonorable we-Serb-are-victim flamers.

Go to Hell, Radovan!

let's hope an unfornate accident does'n't happen to him, as it did to Milosevic. Too many people getting exposed is the fear roaming around the West. If Karadzic is going down, he should be taking everyone else down with him.
(trudsaam, 1 March 2010 15:15)
Who was the benfactor of Milosevic not being found guilty at the Hague???
Only Serbia!!! A guilty verdict which was inevitable would have been a guilty verdict for Serbia since he was Head of State.
So if there was foul play in his death, I would look to his own defense team first.
It is highly unlikely he would have uncovered anything at his trial that the world would have believed, same as Karadzic's claims.

pss-

You are quite un-aware of what occured during this time. Do you the witness line-up Milosevic had ready, to cross-examin? If not, read up on that and then you will understand. Good day :)

I hope K's defense calls Fikret Abdic to testify. That Abdic gave up presidency of the SDA (that he won comfortably in elections against Izetbegovic) on the promise by Izetbegovic that he would not deliberately risk war for the sake of 'independence'.

If the ICTY does not demand those documents that NATO/allied countries claim 'don't exist' or that are being with held on grounds of 'national security' then they shouldn't bother to hold a trial at all.

Bring on ALL the dirt.

The use of nationalist, religious-based and anti-American rhetoric by Radovan Karadzic puts him closer to the criminals behind Hamas and Hezbollah than to the Christian principles he alleges to defend.

pss I am no supporter of Milosevic but its is factually wrong to think that Milosevic would have been found guilty on the serious charges.

It is entirely possible that he would have been found guilty of minor charges. That is not a Serb talking, I speak as an observer of international legal analysis, and of regional and world media that covered the trial. Even IWPR and that ICJ report (the latter barely more than operating arm not of the Hague, but of the Hague prosecution) conceded this.

However, on the topic I must say that I don't recognise Karadzic as representing me. I don't wish to be associated with the type of inhuman treatment used by forces under his command. Of course that is not to say that Bosnian Serbs did not suffer, they clearly did, but two wrongs have never made a right for me.

Besides, those Serbs in the know realise that Karadzic had criminal tendancies, or at least he surrounded himself with those who made financial gain from his rule. Say what you like about Mladic, but he was not corrupt in this way.

What is most regrettable is that impartial, local courts are not operational. I would like to see all those accused get a fair trial and not convicted in advance.

Another Canadian Serb...

You are filled with Serbian Propaganda and I can see that you have hatred within you.

Radovan Karidzic IS guilty.
Ratko Mladic IS guilty.
Goran Hadzic IS guilty.
Ejup Ganic IS guilty.

It is often said, that the winning side writes the history. The Bosnians were often identified as the victors of the Balkan wars because the Serbs had failed to achieve a Bosnian entity and state within the state of Serbia. And that is why, history writes that Alija Izetbegovic was not a guilty person, but rather a hero. This is often highlighted by his nickname, given to him by the west: "The wise King". Why do they call him this, I do not know?

Josip Broz Tito was a short term peace plan for Jugoslavija. He bought the people together and united them. It was only a matter of time when it would all blow up. That time was the late 80's and early 90's. You cannot blame the west for the fall of Jugoslavija. Communism was on the decline, thus meaning that the world was getting used to and adapted to the ways of Democracy.

One often wonders, why is Serbia identified as Yugoslavia? It WAS of been Croatia/Bosnia/Serbia etc.

You cannot use the principles of the fact that the people of Bosnia had decided to leave the "Serbian Jugoslavija". Jugoslavija was everyones country. But the failure of the Serbs to identify this led to the horrible war.

I should know this, I was 17 in Tuzla when the war broke out. We had Serbs Croats and Bosnians fighting together for Bosnia. I remember when the trucks with the assault rifles came into Tuzla, every man for himself. Taking a rifle to guard your family and yourself.

Serbians, you might disagree with me, but that is natural. Yugoslavia was NOT your country. It was all of ours.

The only shame was that, you identified Bosnia and Croatia and soon Kosovo as YOUR country.

Like I said before, Tito was the short term peacemaker and for the last half of the 20th century, it worked.

All of these so called politicians had their say in the war. But the victors are often regarded as the Heros.

So therefore, many people would argue that Izetbegovic was a Hero, but considering that the Bosnian forces did commit atrocities that means someone high up the pecking order had ordered it. Who was it? Was it Izetbegovic, we don't know.

But I do know one thing, If the Serbians had won the war. Radovan Karidzic would be a Hero. Unfortunately for Serbia, its the other way around.

bgagnon,
how can you rally for justice, when there is no level playing field.

The Hague Court was set up to only try and convict Serbs.

The former KLA masters, who were once wanted for criminal activities, have now been propped up by the same so called WESTERN engineers of the Jugoslav wars.

Under the circumstances there are no Serbian war criminals, but rather war heros.

How can you admit an ounce of guilt, when all intervening parties have exempted themselves from prosecution.

"Two wrongs don't make a right"!!!!

bgagnon,
let me try this from a different angle.

If the Croatia, Slovenia and Bosnia didn't separate from Jugoslavia, then the wars would have never happened.

But, they all did secede and did so by killing civilians and JNA. ALl the while being helped by Germany and the Americans.

If somebody enters your home with the intent to rape, rob and kill you, what would you do.

Initiate a fair fight?

Karadzic was protecting Serbs, while the Germans and Americans were raping the Serbian economy.

End of story!

General Mike Rose, UNPROFOR commander at the time of the Markale mortar attack, ultimately blamed the Serbs. He was a huge hater of Ejup Ganic (and as an aside, I'm forced to wonder if he personally put a phone call into the British authorities over the weekend to see to it that Ganic not be allowed to return to BiH) and remarked a number of times in his book that the Muslims appeared to be firing on their own people -- but not on 5 February 1994.

Anyone who says that Serbs weren't killing civilians from the hills surrounding Sarajevo needs to see a psychiatrist (preferrably one other than Karadzic). Say what you will about mortar attacks, but how do you explain the sniping?

No rational UN soldier serving on the ground -- even Serbian ones such as Milos Stankovic -- would agree with the assessment that the Muslims and Americans were responsible for for siege of Sarajevo.

Read the books by Rose and Stankovic. Listen to the tapped phone conversations between Milosevic and Karadzic from 1991, read Karadzic's "dazzling" poetry from before the war -- it's all there. People like Milosevic, Karadzic, Krajisnik and Stanisic were criminals and nothing else. One need only look at how they robbed their own kind to see that. Let's not forget that Karadzic served nearly a year in jail for embezzlement in the mid 80s.

The Serb leadership were not professionals. Milosevic and Karadzic were observed many times to show up to negotiations drunk/hungover. Lets face it, the Serbs allowed themselves to be led by a bunch of psychos and you see what happened.

Tudjman, Izetbegovic and Ganic weren't any better, but they, were after all, Yugoslav politicians. The important thing to remember is that they lacked the military might in 1991 to challenge Milosevic, and had they been allowed to secede peacefully, they probably could have been bullied into treating their Serbian minority respectfully. Might have taken a couple of years of intense negotiations to work out the details, but isn't that what politicians are supposed to do? I can assure you that things would have been a helluva lot better for the ordinary folks residing in those republics while they waited for things to be worked out by their elected (or not, in the case of Izetbegovic) leaders.

As I indicated in a separate post the other day, had Tudjman and/or Izetbegovic reneged on any agreement, Milosevic could have declared war and settled differences on the battlefield -- without the paramilitaries who went around terrorizing civilians in Bijeljina, Vlasenica and so on. Or for that matter, the drunken Montenegrin reservists who attacked Dubrovnik (how many Montenegrins lived there before the war?).

Radovan Karadjic is prepared for spilling the “beans” on the US and its partner in crime the EU. I can’t wait to hear it all and if you think this will be swept under the “carpet” I strongly suggest that you revise that thought. The people that matter will be listening to all he has to say.
I have repeated ad nauseam that the great Sarajevo massacre was a set up by the Bosniak Government and the US to blame the Serbs and then place the toughest sanction in history on Serbia proper. Let me also repeat, the UN categorically stated after its investigation that the trajectory for these mortars were wrong to be Serbian gunners. In fact they said that the shells could only have come from the centre of Sarajevo itself i.e Bosniak held territory at the time. This report was suppressed by the US for obvious reasons.
Milosevoc, Karadjic and others are in the Hague because they made the only superpower in the world at the time look stupid, impotent and incapable of settling the Balkans matter even with “the best equipped army in the world”. Can you imagine that after the US ordered its diplomats to avoid Karadjic they were hiding in hallways not to run into him accidently – the representatives of the only power on earth hiding from a “non entity like Radovan”. It was like scenes out of that famous Monty Python comedy series.
Considering what has gone on in the middle east for 60 years now was the chance for the US to help the Bosniaks and show the Muslim world that they did not hate their kind, but little did they know the real agenda of Alia Izetbegovic and that was to create an Islamic state. He played the US “off a break” and the dopes fell “hook line and sinker”. If you don’t believe the level of US ignorance then look at their brilliance in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Had Serbs remained peaceful they would have been annihilated in Croatia and Bosnia, and Serbia would have been a little place surrounding Belgrade, while the rest would have been either divided into small regions or hived off to neighboring countries. The Germans were very willing partners in this crime and they relished the idea of payback to Serbs for destroying the Austro Hungarian Empire and Germany in WW1. They tried again during WW2 and failed, and both times they ended up paying dearly for their adventurism.
Croatia is not settled yet. Borders need to be agreed upon as well as refugee reparation. Think and believe what you like but these are still on the agenda. The new President has stated that Croatia has no money to repair the damaged homes of Serbs – I wonder what is going to happen here! mmm?
I initially believed that Karadjic is in danger of getting the same “medicine” as Milosevic – a maximum security prison where you can’t scratch yourself without being seen on CCTV and Milosevic over medicated himself. But now I think it would be too dangerous for the lovers of freedom and democracy to arrange such an accident. Whichever way you look at it the US is stuffed big time. Karadjic has ruined the US reputation and North Korea no longer takes any notice of the US negotiators.

Canadian Serb it would be much better if Karadzic would be tried in an impartial local court.

But knowing our region that sounds a little like a fantasy doesn't it?

Let me examine your argument here. If somebody is accused of murder but they are not receiving a fair trial - they automatically become heros?

I don't get the logic; regardless of whether somebody is receiving a fair trial or not it doesn't change the fact that they are guilty (or not). That fact is fixed so they cannot automatically become heros.

The 'let everybody go unless they can get a fair trial' theory would mean a crime wave of biblical proportions and anarchy too.

Much better don't you think, to demand that local courts provide a fair trial and to call on the international community to let countries like Serbia handle war crimes cases?

Orthodox and Muslim Serbs should unite.

Sandro,
i must say that you are wrong in saying that Serbia felt that Jugoslavia was all Serbian.

You forget that it was Serbia that prevailed in World War II. Serbians were then forced to live without reprisals, with their ethnic cleansing and genocidal neighbours.

Now i do know that Serbia should have drawn the borders at that time, but the west never allowed it.

But, the greatest tragedy off all was TITO.

For Tito, a mixed Croat and Slovenian,was the begining factor in the demise of the Serbs. Tito culturally dismantled Serbian shrines and shifted manufacturing to the northern parts of Jugoslavia, therefore creating a superficially superior economy for the likes of Slovenia and Croatia.

So you see Sandro, the Serbs had never benefited at all under Jugoslavia. It was because of Jugoslavia that they have less territory and a smaller economy today.

All the Serbs ever wanted was to prosper and be self ruled, like it had done for soo many centuries. But instead was subjugated to living with it's enemies.

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.

Unfortunately, this Serb will not be hanged for his dispicable crimes. He himself wanted and called this "a holy war". Well, at least in the afterlife he will burn along all other dishonorable we-Serb-are-victim flamers.

Go to Hell, Radovan!

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.
(Another Canadian Serb,

-- Careful mate, I agree the charges against him are inflated, and that they are other politicians running free who are WAY more guilty than him. BUT please do not deny completly what he did. he is guilty on many factors, just not the ones being laid against him in this kangaroo court.

I am sure that the evidence will be well presented and that a reasoned judgement will be made.

He is not on trial because he is a Serb. He is on trial because of a lot of disgusting murders which have tainted the name of Serbia.

He has the chance to make a defense - let's see if it is any good.

Mladic should hand himself in too - I would be interested to hear if he has a defense against the charge of multiple cold-blooded murders. Probably not, otherwise he would not need to hide.....

let's hope an unfornate accident does'n't happen to him, as it did to Milosevic. Too many people getting exposed is the fear roaming around the West. If Karadzic is going down, he should be taking everyone else down with him.

Karadzic's only crime is that he is a Serbian.

All the charges against him are bogus. He defended a Serbian nation against Islam and terrorism, just as the USA is defending today.
(Another Canadian Serb, 1 March 2010 14:18

Another Canadian Serb

You're right.Justice is not blind in Karadzic.He's prosecuted not for his alleged crimes but because he is a Serb.

Karadzic's trial by the Hague inquisition has nothing to do with justice but everything to do with politics.By prosecuting Karadzic they're prosecuting Serbia.

I will disagree with you on your point that US is defending today against islamic fundamentalism or terrorism.The US is defending its own geopolitical interests being
Iraq Or Afganistan or anywhere else in the world.
Remember that todays Taliban in Afganistan were yestrdays
freedom fighters.

Were there, or were there not, war crimes committed by Serbs?

Let's forget, for a moment, the morality of the Serbian decision to wage war and look instead at the events that occurred and those responsible for managing the conduct of the BSA.

Why were civilians fired upon in Sarajevo? Why were many Muslim towns brutally cleansed in eastern BiH in the spring of 1992?

If the Serbs had such a mighty and glorious military, why were so many innocent people raped, pillaged, plundered, tortured and slaughtered?

Blame it on paramilitaries? A real army wouldn't give thugs like Arkan and Lukic free reign.

Blame it on the fact that the Muslims fired the first shot? Do we know that to be true? And in any event, is it responsible to allow an isolated event -- however tragic and unjust -- to propel a nation forward into full-scale war?

Awful things happen in war, no matter what effort is made to keep civilians out of the cross hairs. However, Karadzic appears to have made NO effort whatsoever to spare innocent people from the brutalities of war. Events such as the horrific siege of Sarajevo and the Srebrenica massacre provide more than enough evidence for a life sentence -- no matter where the trial is conducted.

We all know Muslims committed atrocities, too, and in a truly just world, their leaders would be tried and convicted as well.

And no doubt that foreign leaders bear some degree of culpability, and again, if the world were fair, they, too, would face justice.

But the world isn't fair, nor has it ever been, and after every war ever waged we have always had victors' justtice.

What would have happened had the Serbs won the wars? Would Milosevic, Karadzic, Babic and Martic ever have gone to the Hague? Would Mladic and Hadzic be in hiding? Of course not. But there would still be lots of blood on their hands, and people the world over would be outraged. Serbian politicians would be regarded the same was El-Bashir in Sudan, or as Mugabe in Zimbabwe.

Or for that matter, as George Bush and Dick Cheney in the US. That's unfair, too.

But did Stalin ever pay for the millions of people he persecuted and murdered in the USSR? Did the Founding Fathers in the US ever pay the price for enslaving Africans? Did Andrew Jackson ever face trial for marching the Cherokee nation on a long Trail of Tears? Is China's government paying for their occupation of Tibet? Who is waging war against the Burmese Junta?

The Serbs lost in Bosnia and Croatia and now they're paying the price. They should never have gone so quickly to war -- and certainly not in such brutal fashion.

let's hope an unfornate accident does'n't happen to him, as it did to Milosevic. Too many people getting exposed is the fear roaming around the West. If Karadzic is going down, he should be taking everyone else down with him.
(trudsaam, 1 March 2010 15:15)
Who was the benfactor of Milosevic not being found guilty at the Hague???
Only Serbia!!! A guilty verdict which was inevitable would have been a guilty verdict for Serbia since he was Head of State.
So if there was foul play in his death, I would look to his own defense team first.
It is highly unlikely he would have uncovered anything at his trial that the world would have believed, same as Karadzic's claims.

bgagnon,
let me try this from a different angle.

If the Croatia, Slovenia and Bosnia didn't separate from Jugoslavia, then the wars would have never happened.

But, they all did secede and did so by killing civilians and JNA. ALl the while being helped by Germany and the Americans.

If somebody enters your home with the intent to rape, rob and kill you, what would you do.

Initiate a fair fight?

Karadzic was protecting Serbs, while the Germans and Americans were raping the Serbian economy.

End of story!

pss-

You are quite un-aware of what occured during this time. Do you the witness line-up Milosevic had ready, to cross-examin? If not, read up on that and then you will understand. Good day :)

The use of nationalist, religious-based and anti-American rhetoric by Radovan Karadzic puts him closer to the criminals behind Hamas and Hezbollah than to the Christian principles he alleges to defend.

Radovan Karadjic is prepared for spilling the “beans” on the US and its partner in crime the EU. I can’t wait to hear it all and if you think this will be swept under the “carpet” I strongly suggest that you revise that thought. The people that matter will be listening to all he has to say.
I have repeated ad nauseam that the great Sarajevo massacre was a set up by the Bosniak Government and the US to blame the Serbs and then place the toughest sanction in history on Serbia proper. Let me also repeat, the UN categorically stated after its investigation that the trajectory for these mortars were wrong to be Serbian gunners. In fact they said that the shells could only have come from the centre of Sarajevo itself i.e Bosniak held territory at the time. This report was suppressed by the US for obvious reasons.
Milosevoc, Karadjic and others are in the Hague because they made the only superpower in the world at the time look stupid, impotent and incapable of settling the Balkans matter even with “the best equipped army in the world”. Can you imagine that after the US ordered its diplomats to avoid Karadjic they were hiding in hallways not to run into him accidently – the representatives of the only power on earth hiding from a “non entity like Radovan”. It was like scenes out of that famous Monty Python comedy series.
Considering what has gone on in the middle east for 60 years now was the chance for the US to help the Bosniaks and show the Muslim world that they did not hate their kind, but little did they know the real agenda of Alia Izetbegovic and that was to create an Islamic state. He played the US “off a break” and the dopes fell “hook line and sinker”. If you don’t believe the level of US ignorance then look at their brilliance in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Had Serbs remained peaceful they would have been annihilated in Croatia and Bosnia, and Serbia would have been a little place surrounding Belgrade, while the rest would have been either divided into small regions or hived off to neighboring countries. The Germans were very willing partners in this crime and they relished the idea of payback to Serbs for destroying the Austro Hungarian Empire and Germany in WW1. They tried again during WW2 and failed, and both times they ended up paying dearly for their adventurism.
Croatia is not settled yet. Borders need to be agreed upon as well as refugee reparation. Think and believe what you like but these are still on the agenda. The new President has stated that Croatia has no money to repair the damaged homes of Serbs – I wonder what is going to happen here! mmm?
I initially believed that Karadjic is in danger of getting the same “medicine” as Milosevic – a maximum security prison where you can’t scratch yourself without being seen on CCTV and Milosevic over medicated himself. But now I think it would be too dangerous for the lovers of freedom and democracy to arrange such an accident. Whichever way you look at it the US is stuffed big time. Karadjic has ruined the US reputation and North Korea no longer takes any notice of the US negotiators.

pss I am no supporter of Milosevic but its is factually wrong to think that Milosevic would have been found guilty on the serious charges.

It is entirely possible that he would have been found guilty of minor charges. That is not a Serb talking, I speak as an observer of international legal analysis, and of regional and world media that covered the trial. Even IWPR and that ICJ report (the latter barely more than operating arm not of the Hague, but of the Hague prosecution) conceded this.

However, on the topic I must say that I don't recognise Karadzic as representing me. I don't wish to be associated with the type of inhuman treatment used by forces under his command. Of course that is not to say that Bosnian Serbs did not suffer, they clearly did, but two wrongs have never made a right for me.

Besides, those Serbs in the know realise that Karadzic had criminal tendancies, or at least he surrounded himself with those who made financial gain from his rule. Say what you like about Mladic, but he was not corrupt in this way.

What is most regrettable is that impartial, local courts are not operational. I would like to see all those accused get a fair trial and not convicted in advance.

bgagnon,
how can you rally for justice, when there is no level playing field.

The Hague Court was set up to only try and convict Serbs.

The former KLA masters, who were once wanted for criminal activities, have now been propped up by the same so called WESTERN engineers of the Jugoslav wars.

Under the circumstances there are no Serbian war criminals, but rather war heros.

How can you admit an ounce of guilt, when all intervening parties have exempted themselves from prosecution.

"Two wrongs don't make a right"!!!!

Orthodox and Muslim Serbs should unite.

General Mike Rose, UNPROFOR commander at the time of the Markale mortar attack, ultimately blamed the Serbs. He was a huge hater of Ejup Ganic (and as an aside, I'm forced to wonder if he personally put a phone call into the British authorities over the weekend to see to it that Ganic not be allowed to return to BiH) and remarked a number of times in his book that the Muslims appeared to be firing on their own people -- but not on 5 February 1994.

Anyone who says that Serbs weren't killing civilians from the hills surrounding Sarajevo needs to see a psychiatrist (preferrably one other than Karadzic). Say what you will about mortar attacks, but how do you explain the sniping?

No rational UN soldier serving on the ground -- even Serbian ones such as Milos Stankovic -- would agree with the assessment that the Muslims and Americans were responsible for for siege of Sarajevo.

Read the books by Rose and Stankovic. Listen to the tapped phone conversations between Milosevic and Karadzic from 1991, read Karadzic's "dazzling" poetry from before the war -- it's all there. People like Milosevic, Karadzic, Krajisnik and Stanisic were criminals and nothing else. One need only look at how they robbed their own kind to see that. Let's not forget that Karadzic served nearly a year in jail for embezzlement in the mid 80s.

The Serb leadership were not professionals. Milosevic and Karadzic were observed many times to show up to negotiations drunk/hungover. Lets face it, the Serbs allowed themselves to be led by a bunch of psychos and you see what happened.

Tudjman, Izetbegovic and Ganic weren't any better, but they, were after all, Yugoslav politicians. The important thing to remember is that they lacked the military might in 1991 to challenge Milosevic, and had they been allowed to secede peacefully, they probably could have been bullied into treating their Serbian minority respectfully. Might have taken a couple of years of intense negotiations to work out the details, but isn't that what politicians are supposed to do? I can assure you that things would have been a helluva lot better for the ordinary folks residing in those republics while they waited for things to be worked out by their elected (or not, in the case of Izetbegovic) leaders.

As I indicated in a separate post the other day, had Tudjman and/or Izetbegovic reneged on any agreement, Milosevic could have declared war and settled differences on the battlefield -- without the paramilitaries who went around terrorizing civilians in Bijeljina, Vlasenica and so on. Or for that matter, the drunken Montenegrin reservists who attacked Dubrovnik (how many Montenegrins lived there before the war?).

Another Canadian Serb...

You are filled with Serbian Propaganda and I can see that you have hatred within you.

Radovan Karidzic IS guilty.
Ratko Mladic IS guilty.
Goran Hadzic IS guilty.
Ejup Ganic IS guilty.

It is often said, that the winning side writes the history. The Bosnians were often identified as the victors of the Balkan wars because the Serbs had failed to achieve a Bosnian entity and state within the state of Serbia. And that is why, history writes that Alija Izetbegovic was not a guilty person, but rather a hero. This is often highlighted by his nickname, given to him by the west: "The wise King". Why do they call him this, I do not know?

Josip Broz Tito was a short term peace plan for Jugoslavija. He bought the people together and united them. It was only a matter of time when it would all blow up. That time was the late 80's and early 90's. You cannot blame the west for the fall of Jugoslavija. Communism was on the decline, thus meaning that the world was getting used to and adapted to the ways of Democracy.

One often wonders, why is Serbia identified as Yugoslavia? It WAS of been Croatia/Bosnia/Serbia etc.

You cannot use the principles of the fact that the people of Bosnia had decided to leave the "Serbian Jugoslavija". Jugoslavija was everyones country. But the failure of the Serbs to identify this led to the horrible war.

I should know this, I was 17 in Tuzla when the war broke out. We had Serbs Croats and Bosnians fighting together for Bosnia. I remember when the trucks with the assault rifles came into Tuzla, every man for himself. Taking a rifle to guard your family and yourself.

Serbians, you might disagree with me, but that is natural. Yugoslavia was NOT your country. It was all of ours.

The only shame was that, you identified Bosnia and Croatia and soon Kosovo as YOUR country.

Like I said before, Tito was the short term peacemaker and for the last half of the 20th century, it worked.

All of these so called politicians had their say in the war. But the victors are often regarded as the Heros.

So therefore, many people would argue that Izetbegovic was a Hero, but considering that the Bosnian forces did commit atrocities that means someone high up the pecking order had ordered it. Who was it? Was it Izetbegovic, we don't know.

But I do know one thing, If the Serbians had won the war. Radovan Karidzic would be a Hero. Unfortunately for Serbia, its the other way around.

I hope K's defense calls Fikret Abdic to testify. That Abdic gave up presidency of the SDA (that he won comfortably in elections against Izetbegovic) on the promise by Izetbegovic that he would not deliberately risk war for the sake of 'independence'.

If the ICTY does not demand those documents that NATO/allied countries claim 'don't exist' or that are being with held on grounds of 'national security' then they shouldn't bother to hold a trial at all.

Bring on ALL the dirt.

Canadian Serb it would be much better if Karadzic would be tried in an impartial local court.

But knowing our region that sounds a little like a fantasy doesn't it?

Let me examine your argument here. If somebody is accused of murder but they are not receiving a fair trial - they automatically become heros?

I don't get the logic; regardless of whether somebody is receiving a fair trial or not it doesn't change the fact that they are guilty (or not). That fact is fixed so they cannot automatically become heros.

The 'let everybody go unless they can get a fair trial' theory would mean a crime wave of biblical proportions and anarchy too.

Much better don't you think, to demand that local courts provide a fair trial and to call on the international community to let countries like Serbia handle war crimes cases?

Sandro,
i must say that you are wrong in saying that Serbia felt that Jugoslavia was all Serbian.

You forget that it was Serbia that prevailed in World War II. Serbians were then forced to live without reprisals, with their ethnic cleansing and genocidal neighbours.

Now i do know that Serbia should have drawn the borders at that time, but the west never allowed it.

But, the greatest tragedy off all was TITO.

For Tito, a mixed Croat and Slovenian,was the begining factor in the demise of the Serbs. Tito culturally dismantled Serbian shrines and shifted manufacturing to the northern parts of Jugoslavia, therefore creating a superficially superior economy for the likes of Slovenia and Croatia.

So you see Sandro, the Serbs had never benefited at all under Jugoslavia. It was because of Jugoslavia that they have less territory and a smaller economy today.

All the Serbs ever wanted was to prosper and be self ruled, like it had done for soo many centuries. But instead was subjugated to living with it's enemies.