Šešelj blames dead gangster for murder of civilians

Nice that Seselj should enlighten us about this now.

Pity that Seselj didn't say anything about this during the war. Instead he was busy propogating the myth about warlord heros...

I don't see a huge difference between Arkan and Seselj. One was a brutal mafia boss, the other, although intelligent, loved to mix with mafia bosses and was attracted by the idea of being a warlord, as well as a political leader.

Its true that Seselj is well informed. Thats another aspect of his personality, he loves to gather information on others and uses it without moral scruples.

Matthew,
If you want to blame Slobo for something that he is guilty of, blame him for drawing a border along the Drina River and abandoning the Bosnian Serbs, and blame him for abandoning the Krajina Serbs as well. For this, he is guilty of high treason.
However, to blame him for the economic problems in Serbia is ludicrous. The yanks, your country, imposed inhuman sanctions on Serbia, which caused hyperinlfation and unbelievable hardship on all Serbs. They also sent arms to Bosnian muslims, Croats, and albanians. They also trained them. They also recognized them despite their anti-Serb racist ideology and completely ignored the facts, the history, and painted the bad guys as good guys every day on western media. They also funded Otpor, which is Madeline Albright's baby.
So please, spare us. We know very well who the bad guys and the good guys are, and we know the truth, unlike Otpor members.

So any Serb who happens to believe Western allegations against a particular Serbian individual is automatically to be associated with Otpor? What kind of logic is that?

Zoran if you want Seselj as a poster boy and think anybody who criticises him hates all Serbs, you are welcome to him.

In the wonderful world of the few remaining hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil and guilty of whatever NATO claim them to be, until proven innocent.

I guess Zoran and Jim liked having their bank accounts stolen by Milosevic’s brilliant economic theories? That’s definitively a patriotic Serb type of thing to do.

Oh…
You guys live in the West then didn’t you?

Whilst people like Croatia's Tomislav Mercep remain protected from prosecution. The ICTY claims it launched several investigations, but conveniently nothing came from this. I suppose this is what the ICTY was talking about when it claimed that one of its purposes was to bring to light who did what for history. Which history indeed?

Yes Dragan I'm sure that Gazda Jezda and Dafina were created by the west to steal from Serbian citizens' bank accounts.

Just as I'm certain that printing money was an economic solution to Serbia's problems.

Just as I'm certain that its very democratic to close down / take over media that is against you.

I mean, yeah Milosevic was fantastic, wonderful and Seselj was not a criminal, thug, who has managed to destroy his own party (in the same way he tried to destroy Serbia) from the Hague. You can't use the west as an excuse when you cheat, lie and steal from your people. Well ok the naieve might be fooled by this argument.

Milosevic's record speaks for itself - a bankrupted, territorially reduced Serbia.

When I look into the mirror and don't like what I see, I don't blame the glass...

To B92
Seselj case has nothing to do with the “Crime & War crimes” block of yours ! He has killed no one or neither had he given any commands to do so. Best if you place your it in your “Politics” block. At least here in Russia we believe that he is prosecuted because he openly opposes NATO ,USA and EU. Too much for a Serb ! So placing the info here B92 looks like the Tribunal’s supporter while during 8 years they found no “Crime & War crimes” they can stick at Voislav.

To all the rest

I am proud to see how the Serbian brothers of ours behave in Hague ! Slobodan , Radoslav and Voislav showed them that Serbs prefer death to a disgrace. I like to see how Voislav is putting another nail into the coffin. All three behave or behaved like Georgy Dimitrov to say :”You fear my questions Herr Reichminister !”

Also I doubt they are really eager to have the forth Georgy Dimitrov here. So their search for Ratko may prove to be a profanation to prolong the agony of the Tribunal. And I am sure that they all will be retired this year. At least Russia will never prolong the existence for another year. We also take lessons and try not to do one mistake twice !

Cheers !

Zoran I'm not criticising him any more I'm criticising you.

You seem to think that when I question his motives that makes me anti Serb, I expect that from rare posters, but not from you.

On the other hand I have posted here many times defending Seselj's right to be tried without delay. I also freely conceeded that the Hague are (or were as SRS are finished) doing 'democratic block' a favour by keeping him in the Hague. I said the above numerous times.

So either you have a very poor memory or you just like to slam anybody who steps ever so slightly out of line with your personal opinion. Well we are used to that kind of behaviour from our politicians I suppose.

To B92
Seselj case has nothing to do with the “Crime & War crimes” block of yours ! He has killed no one or neither had he given any commands to do so. Best if you place your it in your “Politics” block. At least here in Russia we believe that he is prosecuted because he openly opposes NATO ,USA and EU. Too much for a Serb ! So placing the info here B92 looks like the Tribunal’s supporter while during 8 years they found no “Crime & War crimes” they can stick at Voislav.

To all the rest

I am proud to see how the Serbian brothers of ours behave in Hague ! Slobodan , Radoslav and Voislav showed them that Serbs prefer death to a disgrace. I like to see how Voislav is putting another nail into the coffin. All three behave or behaved like Georgy Dimitrov to say :”You fear my questions Herr Reichminister !”

Also I doubt they are really eager to have the forth Georgy Dimitrov here. So their search for Ratko may prove to be a profanation to prolong the agony of the Tribunal. And I am sure that they all will be retired this year. At least Russia will never prolong the existence for another year. We also take lessons and try not to do one mistake twice !

Cheers !

I don't have time to search around ZK but quickly I found this somewhere:

bganon Says:
February 24th, 2007 at 5:36 pm
'Anyway that isnt the real question, the real question is why Haradinaj can not only get away with being released until trial and Seselj is in jail for 4 years already'

And here 'Of course they have fixed it that Seselj was not in Serbia and that was political. '

(bganon, 22 January 2009 18:47

And with your comment to me years after I made exactly the same point above:
Don't you think it's a little strange that his trial is still continuing after such a long period whereas other non-Serbs on more serious charges have had their trials completed and released a long time ago?
(ZK, 16 December 2008 18:07)

Yeah I agree that Seselj's rights have been abused, and I don't support this. But I'm hardly going to cry about it, this is a man who doesn't give a damn about others rights...

Besides I'm much more concerned about those that will lose their jobs next year

bganon, 16 December 2008 20:24

Olli I agree and I've always said it. It was ridiculous that Seselj had to wait years before his trial started. Of course its not comfortable to defend the human rights of somebody who doesn't believe in the principle - unless its applied to himself.

However, his rights must be defended just like anybody elses.
(bganon, 27 April 2009 01:57)
Recommend (+32)

Zoran 'You obviously have no problem with his human rights being violated only because you dislike the man.'

'hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil'

ZK 'Couldn't agree more Jim'

So this Otporista Zoran, who you believe thinks every Serb is born evil, (including his own father) thinks you owe him an apology. He also thinks that you should have your memory tested.

Lets see how big a man you are.

Couldn't agree more Jim except it's the one below, not above.

When I look into the mirror and don't like what I see, I don't blame the glass...
(bganon, 14 January 2010 21:19)
--
There you go with your Milosevic rants again. Hangover from last night's New Year celebration? Get over your obsession with this man will you?

bganon,
There you go again. Try reading my post again, and this time focus. Again, I will repeat for you, Milosovic is guilty of betraying Bosnia and Krajina Serbs, and is a traitor for this. Where do you see me writing that he was wonderful?

I have news for you, and other Otpor types. Milosevic is not guilty for your economic situation - Germany, UK and US are!! Yes, wake up!! Slobo is not the one who imposed brutal sanctions on you, and bombed you for 78 days, and funded your enemies, and sponsored the genocide against Serbs with Operation Storm! No it wasn't Slobo, I hate to inform you, it was your beloved WEST!!!
So please get over your obsession of this man, no matter who was in power at the time, Russia was on its knees and Germany was determined to seize the opportunity and break up Yugoslavia and get revenge on the Serbs for destroying their empire.
Thank God things have totaly changed in our favour now and the 'civilized West' is bankrupt, and Russia is swimming in money and resources. The future looks bright.
Cheers!!

Zoran if you want Seselj as a poster boy and think anybody who criticises him hates all Serbs, you are welcome to him.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 20:22)
--
Criticise him all you want. I'm just surprised that you really expect anyone to come clean at that time. Serbia isn't the only country with skeltons in their closet but I don't expect anyone to readily admit them.

So tell me, exactly what did Seselj do to deserve being in the Hague for so many years? I'm not a big supporter of him and I wouldn't vote for him but as far as I'm concered he certainly doesn't deserve to be there.

You obviously have no problem with his human rights being violated only because you dislike the man.

I also freely conceeded that the Hague are (or were as SRS are finished) doing 'democratic block' a favour by keeping him in the Hague. I said the above numerous times.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 23:12)
--
I've never heard you say that but it's more like the Hague is doing it on purpose. It is just an extension of the attack on Serbia. That should be fairly obvious.
==
So either you have a very poor memory or you just like to slam anybody who steps ever so slightly out of line with your personal opinion. Well we are used to that kind of behaviour from our politicians I suppose.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 23:12)
--
You are entitled to your opinion by all means. I do agree with many of your points but you seem obsessed with Milosevic and Seselj. You "forget" that Serbia was in a difficult position at that time while they were no different to many of the leaders in the region.

How is Šešelj's association with Arkan different to NATO's association with Mladic? NATO generals were having regular meetings with Mladic even though they accused him of killing 6000 people in Srebrenica? The political situation of the time was dirty and Šešelj was no different to other politicians all over the Balkans. Why would anyone expect Šešelj to admit anything when everyone had skeletons in their closet? NATO, US, UK, Germany, ethnic Albanians, Croatians, Bosnian Muslims and the lot.

Matthew, I don't understand how anyone can support Otpor today when it is clear they were trained and sponsored by the very people destroying Serbia? Even today former members are in the DS following the West's agenda.

In the wonderful world of the few remaining hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil and guilty of whatever NATO claim them to be, until proven innocent.
(Jim, 14 January 2010 15:49)
--
bganon, this part referred to every Serb in the NATO court (or accused by NATO of something), not every Serb in general. Has NATO accused your father of doing something evil? I don't think so!

Even though the NATO court is serving selective justice, you do support it do you not?

Look I'm not afraid to apologise but I can't see one due here. If it makes you feel any better, I'll buy you a drink this weekend if you're up for it. Cheers!

I was wondering when someone was going to mention this thug. He got away clean (so to speak) and he was the real culprit. A nasty piece of work.

In the wonderful world of the few remaining hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil and guilty of whatever NATO claim them to be, until proven innocent.

To B92
Seselj case has nothing to do with the “Crime & War crimes” block of yours ! He has killed no one or neither had he given any commands to do so. Best if you place your it in your “Politics” block. At least here in Russia we believe that he is prosecuted because he openly opposes NATO ,USA and EU. Too much for a Serb ! So placing the info here B92 looks like the Tribunal’s supporter while during 8 years they found no “Crime & War crimes” they can stick at Voislav.

To all the rest

I am proud to see how the Serbian brothers of ours behave in Hague ! Slobodan , Radoslav and Voislav showed them that Serbs prefer death to a disgrace. I like to see how Voislav is putting another nail into the coffin. All three behave or behaved like Georgy Dimitrov to say :”You fear my questions Herr Reichminister !”

Also I doubt they are really eager to have the forth Georgy Dimitrov here. So their search for Ratko may prove to be a profanation to prolong the agony of the Tribunal. And I am sure that they all will be retired this year. At least Russia will never prolong the existence for another year. We also take lessons and try not to do one mistake twice !

Cheers !

Matthew,
If you want to blame Slobo for something that he is guilty of, blame him for drawing a border along the Drina River and abandoning the Bosnian Serbs, and blame him for abandoning the Krajina Serbs as well. For this, he is guilty of high treason.
However, to blame him for the economic problems in Serbia is ludicrous. The yanks, your country, imposed inhuman sanctions on Serbia, which caused hyperinlfation and unbelievable hardship on all Serbs. They also sent arms to Bosnian muslims, Croats, and albanians. They also trained them. They also recognized them despite their anti-Serb racist ideology and completely ignored the facts, the history, and painted the bad guys as good guys every day on western media. They also funded Otpor, which is Madeline Albright's baby.
So please, spare us. We know very well who the bad guys and the good guys are, and we know the truth, unlike Otpor members.

To B92
Seselj case has nothing to do with the “Crime & War crimes” block of yours ! He has killed no one or neither had he given any commands to do so. Best if you place your it in your “Politics” block. At least here in Russia we believe that he is prosecuted because he openly opposes NATO ,USA and EU. Too much for a Serb ! So placing the info here B92 looks like the Tribunal’s supporter while during 8 years they found no “Crime & War crimes” they can stick at Voislav.

To all the rest

I am proud to see how the Serbian brothers of ours behave in Hague ! Slobodan , Radoslav and Voislav showed them that Serbs prefer death to a disgrace. I like to see how Voislav is putting another nail into the coffin. All three behave or behaved like Georgy Dimitrov to say :”You fear my questions Herr Reichminister !”

Also I doubt they are really eager to have the forth Georgy Dimitrov here. So their search for Ratko may prove to be a profanation to prolong the agony of the Tribunal. And I am sure that they all will be retired this year. At least Russia will never prolong the existence for another year. We also take lessons and try not to do one mistake twice !

Cheers !

Zoran if you want Seselj as a poster boy and think anybody who criticises him hates all Serbs, you are welcome to him.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 20:22)
--
Criticise him all you want. I'm just surprised that you really expect anyone to come clean at that time. Serbia isn't the only country with skeltons in their closet but I don't expect anyone to readily admit them.

So tell me, exactly what did Seselj do to deserve being in the Hague for so many years? I'm not a big supporter of him and I wouldn't vote for him but as far as I'm concered he certainly doesn't deserve to be there.

You obviously have no problem with his human rights being violated only because you dislike the man.

When I look into the mirror and don't like what I see, I don't blame the glass...
(bganon, 14 January 2010 21:19)
--
There you go with your Milosevic rants again. Hangover from last night's New Year celebration? Get over your obsession with this man will you?

Couldn't agree more Jim except it's the one below, not above.

I guess Zoran and Jim liked having their bank accounts stolen by Milosevic’s brilliant economic theories? That’s definitively a patriotic Serb type of thing to do.

Oh…
You guys live in the West then didn’t you?

Yes Dragan I'm sure that Gazda Jezda and Dafina were created by the west to steal from Serbian citizens' bank accounts.

Just as I'm certain that printing money was an economic solution to Serbia's problems.

Just as I'm certain that its very democratic to close down / take over media that is against you.

I mean, yeah Milosevic was fantastic, wonderful and Seselj was not a criminal, thug, who has managed to destroy his own party (in the same way he tried to destroy Serbia) from the Hague. You can't use the west as an excuse when you cheat, lie and steal from your people. Well ok the naieve might be fooled by this argument.

Milosevic's record speaks for itself - a bankrupted, territorially reduced Serbia.

When I look into the mirror and don't like what I see, I don't blame the glass...

Whilst people like Croatia's Tomislav Mercep remain protected from prosecution. The ICTY claims it launched several investigations, but conveniently nothing came from this. I suppose this is what the ICTY was talking about when it claimed that one of its purposes was to bring to light who did what for history. Which history indeed?

Zoran if you want Seselj as a poster boy and think anybody who criticises him hates all Serbs, you are welcome to him.

Nice that Seselj should enlighten us about this now.

Pity that Seselj didn't say anything about this during the war. Instead he was busy propogating the myth about warlord heros...

I don't see a huge difference between Arkan and Seselj. One was a brutal mafia boss, the other, although intelligent, loved to mix with mafia bosses and was attracted by the idea of being a warlord, as well as a political leader.

Its true that Seselj is well informed. Thats another aspect of his personality, he loves to gather information on others and uses it without moral scruples.

How is Šešelj's association with Arkan different to NATO's association with Mladic? NATO generals were having regular meetings with Mladic even though they accused him of killing 6000 people in Srebrenica? The political situation of the time was dirty and Šešelj was no different to other politicians all over the Balkans. Why would anyone expect Šešelj to admit anything when everyone had skeletons in their closet? NATO, US, UK, Germany, ethnic Albanians, Croatians, Bosnian Muslims and the lot.

Matthew, I don't understand how anyone can support Otpor today when it is clear they were trained and sponsored by the very people destroying Serbia? Even today former members are in the DS following the West's agenda.

Zoran I'm not criticising him any more I'm criticising you.

You seem to think that when I question his motives that makes me anti Serb, I expect that from rare posters, but not from you.

On the other hand I have posted here many times defending Seselj's right to be tried without delay. I also freely conceeded that the Hague are (or were as SRS are finished) doing 'democratic block' a favour by keeping him in the Hague. I said the above numerous times.

So either you have a very poor memory or you just like to slam anybody who steps ever so slightly out of line with your personal opinion. Well we are used to that kind of behaviour from our politicians I suppose.

bganon,
There you go again. Try reading my post again, and this time focus. Again, I will repeat for you, Milosovic is guilty of betraying Bosnia and Krajina Serbs, and is a traitor for this. Where do you see me writing that he was wonderful?

I have news for you, and other Otpor types. Milosevic is not guilty for your economic situation - Germany, UK and US are!! Yes, wake up!! Slobo is not the one who imposed brutal sanctions on you, and bombed you for 78 days, and funded your enemies, and sponsored the genocide against Serbs with Operation Storm! No it wasn't Slobo, I hate to inform you, it was your beloved WEST!!!
So please get over your obsession of this man, no matter who was in power at the time, Russia was on its knees and Germany was determined to seize the opportunity and break up Yugoslavia and get revenge on the Serbs for destroying their empire.
Thank God things have totaly changed in our favour now and the 'civilized West' is bankrupt, and Russia is swimming in money and resources. The future looks bright.
Cheers!!

In the wonderful world of the few remaining hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil and guilty of whatever NATO claim them to be, until proven innocent.
(Jim, 14 January 2010 15:49)
--
bganon, this part referred to every Serb in the NATO court (or accused by NATO of something), not every Serb in general. Has NATO accused your father of doing something evil? I don't think so!

Even though the NATO court is serving selective justice, you do support it do you not?

Look I'm not afraid to apologise but I can't see one due here. If it makes you feel any better, I'll buy you a drink this weekend if you're up for it. Cheers!

I also freely conceeded that the Hague are (or were as SRS are finished) doing 'democratic block' a favour by keeping him in the Hague. I said the above numerous times.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 23:12)
--
I've never heard you say that but it's more like the Hague is doing it on purpose. It is just an extension of the attack on Serbia. That should be fairly obvious.
==
So either you have a very poor memory or you just like to slam anybody who steps ever so slightly out of line with your personal opinion. Well we are used to that kind of behaviour from our politicians I suppose.
(bganon, 14 January 2010 23:12)
--
You are entitled to your opinion by all means. I do agree with many of your points but you seem obsessed with Milosevic and Seselj. You "forget" that Serbia was in a difficult position at that time while they were no different to many of the leaders in the region.

So any Serb who happens to believe Western allegations against a particular Serbian individual is automatically to be associated with Otpor? What kind of logic is that?

I don't have time to search around ZK but quickly I found this somewhere:

bganon Says:
February 24th, 2007 at 5:36 pm
'Anyway that isnt the real question, the real question is why Haradinaj can not only get away with being released until trial and Seselj is in jail for 4 years already'

And here 'Of course they have fixed it that Seselj was not in Serbia and that was political. '

(bganon, 22 January 2009 18:47

And with your comment to me years after I made exactly the same point above:
Don't you think it's a little strange that his trial is still continuing after such a long period whereas other non-Serbs on more serious charges have had their trials completed and released a long time ago?
(ZK, 16 December 2008 18:07)

Yeah I agree that Seselj's rights have been abused, and I don't support this. But I'm hardly going to cry about it, this is a man who doesn't give a damn about others rights...

Besides I'm much more concerned about those that will lose their jobs next year

bganon, 16 December 2008 20:24

Olli I agree and I've always said it. It was ridiculous that Seselj had to wait years before his trial started. Of course its not comfortable to defend the human rights of somebody who doesn't believe in the principle - unless its applied to himself.

However, his rights must be defended just like anybody elses.
(bganon, 27 April 2009 01:57)
Recommend (+32)

Zoran 'You obviously have no problem with his human rights being violated only because you dislike the man.'

'hardcore Otporistas, like the one above, every serb is born evil'

ZK 'Couldn't agree more Jim'

So this Otporista Zoran, who you believe thinks every Serb is born evil, (including his own father) thinks you owe him an apology. He also thinks that you should have your memory tested.

Lets see how big a man you are.

I was wondering when someone was going to mention this thug. He got away clean (so to speak) and he was the real culprit. A nasty piece of work.