19

Wednesday, 06.01.2010.

17:10

B. Croat politician likens Dodik to Milošević

Bosnia-Herzegovina Presidency member Željko Komšić said that the international community is being too lenient with Milorad Dodik.

Izvor: FoNet

B. Croat politician likens Dodik to Miloševiæ IMAGE SOURCE
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19 Komentari

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Peggy

pre 14 godina

"Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now."
(Amer, 6 January 2010 21:26)
=========================

I don't think so.

They are never desperate to stop the killing. If they valued human life they wouldn't be stirring trouble all over the world and bombing the hell out of anything that moved. Just ask Iraq. How many lives did they manage to "save" there?

Supporting Izetbegovic was the mistake which I'm sure they are aware of now.
Keep in mind that the woman is Obama's life is Michelle and he doesn't need a diversion, while the woman in Clinton's life was Monica and he desperately needed a diversion.

I know, thier names both start with M but that's where similarities end.

Amer

pre 14 godina

'Tell me who is going to stop RS leaving Bosnia? And how?
(sj, 7 January 2010 22:54)'

Where is the RF going to go to? They can't become independent under international law (see the oral statements in the ICJ case), and Serbia can't annex it (same comment). When other countries have tried this, the UN called on its members to refuse to have any dealings with it: not good for business. Does Serbia really want to deal with all this?

CG

pre 14 godina

FairPlay,

again,you are hoping that Dodik will do something that stupid like an independence referendum to get the international community against the Serbs.
Forget it,it is not going to happen,and if he does a step towards that he will be removed by the OHR and the RS will continue to function normally.
I know that you secretly wish for a war ,with the help of the US and Belgrade passively looking to establish what Mustafa Ceric openly stated(and Silajdzic and co dream about although babbling democratic nonsense)"a muslim national state of Bosnia".
This is a serious miscalculation,don`t try it,it would disastrous for the Bosniaks who are encircled by enemies and in a very weak position.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Please pay close attention to what the High Representative Mr. Inzko is saying. He is specifically naming Dodik and his political party as those who are engaged in anti-Dayton activities and he has clearly stated that any form of referendum would be a breach of the Dayton Accords. If the Bosnian Serbs breach the Dayton Accords then they will become null and void. What will remain? The state of Bosnia and Herzegovina without a constitution. A new constituion can be drawn up in a few months time with international help and suppervision and believe me there will never be anohter Serb eneity in Bosnia-Herzegovina again. Once bitten twice shy is the expression that will come to mind to both the Bosnians and the International Community. The Bosnian Serbs will never have more in Bosnia then they have now. That is simply a fact of which most of them are aware. If they try to push for independence then the entity they were unjustly granted in the Dayton Accords will be dissolved. I've stated it before and I'll state it again, Dodik is pursuing a foolish and very self-destructive policy that will be disasterous for the Bosnian Serbs. You can ask the Croatian Serb and Kosovo Serb refugees living in Serbia if they think their adventurism was worth it. They had big homes, good paying jobs, and a lot of power both in Croatia and in Kosovo. Then came Milosevic with his promises of a "Greater Serbian" state and they fell for it. In a few years time all that they had was lost and they ended up poor and homeless. Was it worth it for them? Maybe now is the time that they remind the Bosnian Serbs of how hard their lives have become because they listened to a charismatic delusional leader called Milosevic. The Bosnians want desperetely to get rid of the unjust and dysfunctional Dayton Accords and so the the Bosnian Serbs it seems. Let's all hope that this crisis can be overcome in a rational and peaceful manner that will result in the country becoming more stable and the lives of all Bosnian citizens improving.

CG

pre 14 godina

Fair play,

while I agree with you that Dodik is an irresponsible idiot who sometimes stires up flames to mask his corrupt government under a dosis of "patriotism"(like giving his son a credit of 3 million KM and others) Silajdzic and Mesic and other Croat and Muslim radicals are working towards a radicalization and violence systematically by not letting off of the RS.
And they are corrupt too ,but desperately want a new conflict(unlike Dodik)because they think they will have international protection like in the 90s.

Now this is a serious mistake,the US made crystal clear statements that "the RS will stay until the end of times" Daniel Fried(secretary for the Balkans in the State Department).

Don`t illude yourself that you Bosniaks can start a war ,have the support of the US and have Belgrade looking what is happening and do nothing to protect its people.
Don`t do this,it would be a terrible mistake for the Bosniaks.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

If violence breaks out in Bosnia due to the anti-Dayton policies of the Bosnian Serb politicians then Dodik will realize the big mistake he made in his gamble. Dodik does not have the economic or military resources to fight a sustained war and he has very little support in the international community. Do people think that NATO will aid a man who is rabidly opposed to it? Do people think that the EU will back a man that is behind closed doors referred to as a corrupt dictator, a Milosevic in the making? Let's not forget that the genocide that the Bosnian Serb military committed in Bosnia is recognized by the international court and all major countries and that the entity has no moral justification for existing. What can Serbia do to help the Bosnian Serbs in the case of a conflict? Next to nothing! They can't ship weapons into the country since sanctions would be placed on them and the goal of joining the EU would be postponed for another 20-30 years. They can't send money since sanctions would be placed on them seriously hurting the economy in a time of financial crisis. They can't even symbolically support the Bosnian Serbs since Serbian officials have been traveling the globe the last two years trying to convince countries that Serbia respects international law and the territorial integrity of UN member states. The Bosnian Serbs would lose the military conflict, would lose the moral conflict, and would lose their entity forever. Many of them would flee to Serbia as refugees but the majority would remain in Bosnia. Their rights as Bosnian citizens would be protected by a new democratic constitution and peace would prevail. Dodik can not win the war he is trying to start he is acting very foolishly and is very close to overplaying his hand to the detriment of all Bosnians but especially the Bosnian Serbs. Milosevic promised the Serbians pie in the sky but only delivered them economic hardship, a terrible image, a territorially truncated country, and destruction. Milosevic is the main reason that Kosovo gained partially recognized independence. The Serbian people have a habit of falling behind delusional leaders that make foolish political miscalculations. If Dodik continues his unwise policies then he will simply become one of the many Serbian "tragic heroes" that led his followers to disaster. Dodik only wants personal power, wealth, and glory. He has lost touch with reality and if he starts another Balkan conflict then he will end up like Milosevic (behind bars) and the Bosnian Serbs' will end up like the Serbs that used to live in Croatia and Kosovo and are now unwanted refugees in Serbia and scattered around the world.

Demi

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.
(Mike, 6 January 2010 21:22)


One reson is that Bosnia diden't commit genocide against the residents of ''RS'' and ''RS'' dident exist before 1991 and is built on ethnic cleansning of bosnian muslims.

gajo

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, [link]/



there is 1,711,576 serbs in republica srpska including refugees and in Bosnia as a whole there is 1,900,000 thats what i said and those are real facts all that your 1,500,000 shows is with out refugees. but anyway independence is on the way soon

Amer

pre 14 godina

'But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.
(sj, 6 January 2010 23:01) '

So RS is going to field an army? Supported by whom - the bigger RS?

I don't think so.

As far as opposing whatever home guard they field, the Croatians and Albanians can help out the Federal forces, if needed. As a matter of fact, I bet the Dutch would also be glad to send a contingent.

sj

pre 14 godina

roberto
back in US of A
(roberto, 6 January 2010 20:08)

Here is message from the RS – bye, bye Bosnia!!
But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.

Amer

pre 14 godina

Ok, so say Dodik holds a referendum and declares independence. As we have all learned from the ICJ proceedings, one of the few times a declaration of independence is illegal is when it breaks an international agreement (as in the case of North Cyprus). Since Russia is one of the guarantors of the Dayton agreement, it would probably go along with a Security Council resolution calling on all states not to recognize the RS as a sovereign state, perhaps impose sanctions (as in the case of Rhodesia). In this case, what would "independence" for RS mean?

Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Komsic is exactly right in his assessment of Dodik and his policies. Dodik is the main reason that instability in the Balkans persists and it is him and his unwise policies that are preventing the region from moving forward towards joining NATO and the EU. It is becoming clear however that Dodik's time at the podium is coming to an end. Serbia has applied for EU membership and Bosnia will join NATO in a year or two. Both of these facts tell us that the support that Dodik gets from Belgrade will diminish as the Serbians look out for their own interests and leave the Bosnian Serbs to work out their own problems. Bosnia becoming a NATO member will discourage a repeat of the military aid that Serbia has given the Bosnian Serbs in the 90s. Once Dodik is cut off from Serbian support and the international community singles him out as the main problem for regional stability he will be weak and alone just the way Milosevic was in 2000 and we all know what happened to Milosevic after that. Enjoy your time at the podium Dodik it's quickly going to come to an end and then a new peaceful and truly democratic Bosnian state will emerge in which all of its citizens will feel safe, secure, and see their quality of life improve.

Mike

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.

Dragan

pre 14 godina

Roberto - stick to San Francisco politics, and worry about your own country which is bankrupt and sinking fast.
Don't worry about my people and my country, leave it to us. Your country's meddling is the reason for thousands of unnecessary deaths. Blame Clinton/Albright and their gang.

Lazar

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, http://www.rzs.rs.ba/

roberto

pre 14 godina

Željko Komšić is perfectly correct, and repeating exactly what we have been saying for at least the past 2 years. dodik is a big-mouthed, foul-mouthed, bad-tempered milosevic wanna-be, and the intl comm (s0 called), esp the eu, coddles and sweet-talks him, exactly as they did slobo. because they fear him, and because they show "respect" for brutal power. it will backfire of course, and has already helped push bosnia into a hole, from which people generally feel great pessimism, hopelessness, resentment. across the board.

the great "successes" of RS that are always trumpeted here translate to big $$ and influence for the few and poverty and joblessness for the masses. recipe for disaster all the way round.

so i appreciate such lectures to the intrnls (us) about who is of greatest danger, and who needs not coddling, but appropriate sanctions, prosecution, and hopefully long and severe jail terms.

we -- the intls -- are not helpless in these matters, no what the extremists threaten. not so different as in the 90s. perhaps we acted with some good intentions, but inevitably became paralyzed, full of fear and contradictions, giving off the worst possible messages to the serbian radicals. thus the great success of the karadzic/mladic team and their many, many willing executioners, all just proxies of slobo and of serbia.

it is all unforgivable, and we are again headed for disaster. world, wake up!

roberto
back in US of A

Lazar

pre 14 godina

Komsic is just worried because he is not going to be re-elected. HDZ is not divided so now he wants to get even more muslim votes... afterall, croatians did not vote for him. But, the sad thing about him is that he does not know what he is talking about - Milosevic was a socialist while Dodik seems to be in bed with the big corporations. Dodik is so supportive of capitalist development that the West likes him more, from an economic standpoint, than the Federation entity.

Gajo, stop claiming exact numbers about how much there is who in R.S. It can be 90%, it can be 92% as you say, but we do not know for sure.

gajo

pre 14 godina

I guess mesic has been talking to you but in the real world of today its the people that talk and decide what they want and if republica srpska leaves that's their choice and not yours and the republics is over 92% Serbs so its going to be a done deal and stop using the milosevic era already its getting old and the people will vote and will separate this years some time and you croats well your the third in population so you have no say in anything because in the entire country as a whole Serbs are a majority with 1,900,000 and in republica srpska is 1,700,000 alone and then its the bosniaks with about 1,700,000 in the federation and then croats with only about 499,0000 if that so you just stay in your federation and not worry about Serbian affairs are anybody's affairs for that matter your a tiny population with large mouths and that's it you cry very well but the year is 2010 not 1990 . majority rules nowadays not talking its the populations.

gajo

pre 14 godina

I guess mesic has been talking to you but in the real world of today its the people that talk and decide what they want and if republica srpska leaves that's their choice and not yours and the republics is over 92% Serbs so its going to be a done deal and stop using the milosevic era already its getting old and the people will vote and will separate this years some time and you croats well your the third in population so you have no say in anything because in the entire country as a whole Serbs are a majority with 1,900,000 and in republica srpska is 1,700,000 alone and then its the bosniaks with about 1,700,000 in the federation and then croats with only about 499,0000 if that so you just stay in your federation and not worry about Serbian affairs are anybody's affairs for that matter your a tiny population with large mouths and that's it you cry very well but the year is 2010 not 1990 . majority rules nowadays not talking its the populations.

Lazar

pre 14 godina

Komsic is just worried because he is not going to be re-elected. HDZ is not divided so now he wants to get even more muslim votes... afterall, croatians did not vote for him. But, the sad thing about him is that he does not know what he is talking about - Milosevic was a socialist while Dodik seems to be in bed with the big corporations. Dodik is so supportive of capitalist development that the West likes him more, from an economic standpoint, than the Federation entity.

Gajo, stop claiming exact numbers about how much there is who in R.S. It can be 90%, it can be 92% as you say, but we do not know for sure.

Dragan

pre 14 godina

Roberto - stick to San Francisco politics, and worry about your own country which is bankrupt and sinking fast.
Don't worry about my people and my country, leave it to us. Your country's meddling is the reason for thousands of unnecessary deaths. Blame Clinton/Albright and their gang.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Komsic is exactly right in his assessment of Dodik and his policies. Dodik is the main reason that instability in the Balkans persists and it is him and his unwise policies that are preventing the region from moving forward towards joining NATO and the EU. It is becoming clear however that Dodik's time at the podium is coming to an end. Serbia has applied for EU membership and Bosnia will join NATO in a year or two. Both of these facts tell us that the support that Dodik gets from Belgrade will diminish as the Serbians look out for their own interests and leave the Bosnian Serbs to work out their own problems. Bosnia becoming a NATO member will discourage a repeat of the military aid that Serbia has given the Bosnian Serbs in the 90s. Once Dodik is cut off from Serbian support and the international community singles him out as the main problem for regional stability he will be weak and alone just the way Milosevic was in 2000 and we all know what happened to Milosevic after that. Enjoy your time at the podium Dodik it's quickly going to come to an end and then a new peaceful and truly democratic Bosnian state will emerge in which all of its citizens will feel safe, secure, and see their quality of life improve.

Mike

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.

sj

pre 14 godina

roberto
back in US of A
(roberto, 6 January 2010 20:08)

Here is message from the RS – bye, bye Bosnia!!
But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.

roberto

pre 14 godina

Željko Komšić is perfectly correct, and repeating exactly what we have been saying for at least the past 2 years. dodik is a big-mouthed, foul-mouthed, bad-tempered milosevic wanna-be, and the intl comm (s0 called), esp the eu, coddles and sweet-talks him, exactly as they did slobo. because they fear him, and because they show "respect" for brutal power. it will backfire of course, and has already helped push bosnia into a hole, from which people generally feel great pessimism, hopelessness, resentment. across the board.

the great "successes" of RS that are always trumpeted here translate to big $$ and influence for the few and poverty and joblessness for the masses. recipe for disaster all the way round.

so i appreciate such lectures to the intrnls (us) about who is of greatest danger, and who needs not coddling, but appropriate sanctions, prosecution, and hopefully long and severe jail terms.

we -- the intls -- are not helpless in these matters, no what the extremists threaten. not so different as in the 90s. perhaps we acted with some good intentions, but inevitably became paralyzed, full of fear and contradictions, giving off the worst possible messages to the serbian radicals. thus the great success of the karadzic/mladic team and their many, many willing executioners, all just proxies of slobo and of serbia.

it is all unforgivable, and we are again headed for disaster. world, wake up!

roberto
back in US of A

Amer

pre 14 godina

Ok, so say Dodik holds a referendum and declares independence. As we have all learned from the ICJ proceedings, one of the few times a declaration of independence is illegal is when it breaks an international agreement (as in the case of North Cyprus). Since Russia is one of the guarantors of the Dayton agreement, it would probably go along with a Security Council resolution calling on all states not to recognize the RS as a sovereign state, perhaps impose sanctions (as in the case of Rhodesia). In this case, what would "independence" for RS mean?

Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now.

Lazar

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, http://www.rzs.rs.ba/

gajo

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, [link]/



there is 1,711,576 serbs in republica srpska including refugees and in Bosnia as a whole there is 1,900,000 thats what i said and those are real facts all that your 1,500,000 shows is with out refugees. but anyway independence is on the way soon

Demi

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.
(Mike, 6 January 2010 21:22)


One reson is that Bosnia diden't commit genocide against the residents of ''RS'' and ''RS'' dident exist before 1991 and is built on ethnic cleansning of bosnian muslims.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

If violence breaks out in Bosnia due to the anti-Dayton policies of the Bosnian Serb politicians then Dodik will realize the big mistake he made in his gamble. Dodik does not have the economic or military resources to fight a sustained war and he has very little support in the international community. Do people think that NATO will aid a man who is rabidly opposed to it? Do people think that the EU will back a man that is behind closed doors referred to as a corrupt dictator, a Milosevic in the making? Let's not forget that the genocide that the Bosnian Serb military committed in Bosnia is recognized by the international court and all major countries and that the entity has no moral justification for existing. What can Serbia do to help the Bosnian Serbs in the case of a conflict? Next to nothing! They can't ship weapons into the country since sanctions would be placed on them and the goal of joining the EU would be postponed for another 20-30 years. They can't send money since sanctions would be placed on them seriously hurting the economy in a time of financial crisis. They can't even symbolically support the Bosnian Serbs since Serbian officials have been traveling the globe the last two years trying to convince countries that Serbia respects international law and the territorial integrity of UN member states. The Bosnian Serbs would lose the military conflict, would lose the moral conflict, and would lose their entity forever. Many of them would flee to Serbia as refugees but the majority would remain in Bosnia. Their rights as Bosnian citizens would be protected by a new democratic constitution and peace would prevail. Dodik can not win the war he is trying to start he is acting very foolishly and is very close to overplaying his hand to the detriment of all Bosnians but especially the Bosnian Serbs. Milosevic promised the Serbians pie in the sky but only delivered them economic hardship, a terrible image, a territorially truncated country, and destruction. Milosevic is the main reason that Kosovo gained partially recognized independence. The Serbian people have a habit of falling behind delusional leaders that make foolish political miscalculations. If Dodik continues his unwise policies then he will simply become one of the many Serbian "tragic heroes" that led his followers to disaster. Dodik only wants personal power, wealth, and glory. He has lost touch with reality and if he starts another Balkan conflict then he will end up like Milosevic (behind bars) and the Bosnian Serbs' will end up like the Serbs that used to live in Croatia and Kosovo and are now unwanted refugees in Serbia and scattered around the world.

CG

pre 14 godina

Fair play,

while I agree with you that Dodik is an irresponsible idiot who sometimes stires up flames to mask his corrupt government under a dosis of "patriotism"(like giving his son a credit of 3 million KM and others) Silajdzic and Mesic and other Croat and Muslim radicals are working towards a radicalization and violence systematically by not letting off of the RS.
And they are corrupt too ,but desperately want a new conflict(unlike Dodik)because they think they will have international protection like in the 90s.

Now this is a serious mistake,the US made crystal clear statements that "the RS will stay until the end of times" Daniel Fried(secretary for the Balkans in the State Department).

Don`t illude yourself that you Bosniaks can start a war ,have the support of the US and have Belgrade looking what is happening and do nothing to protect its people.
Don`t do this,it would be a terrible mistake for the Bosniaks.

CG

pre 14 godina

FairPlay,

again,you are hoping that Dodik will do something that stupid like an independence referendum to get the international community against the Serbs.
Forget it,it is not going to happen,and if he does a step towards that he will be removed by the OHR and the RS will continue to function normally.
I know that you secretly wish for a war ,with the help of the US and Belgrade passively looking to establish what Mustafa Ceric openly stated(and Silajdzic and co dream about although babbling democratic nonsense)"a muslim national state of Bosnia".
This is a serious miscalculation,don`t try it,it would disastrous for the Bosniaks who are encircled by enemies and in a very weak position.

Amer

pre 14 godina

'But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.
(sj, 6 January 2010 23:01) '

So RS is going to field an army? Supported by whom - the bigger RS?

I don't think so.

As far as opposing whatever home guard they field, the Croatians and Albanians can help out the Federal forces, if needed. As a matter of fact, I bet the Dutch would also be glad to send a contingent.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Please pay close attention to what the High Representative Mr. Inzko is saying. He is specifically naming Dodik and his political party as those who are engaged in anti-Dayton activities and he has clearly stated that any form of referendum would be a breach of the Dayton Accords. If the Bosnian Serbs breach the Dayton Accords then they will become null and void. What will remain? The state of Bosnia and Herzegovina without a constitution. A new constituion can be drawn up in a few months time with international help and suppervision and believe me there will never be anohter Serb eneity in Bosnia-Herzegovina again. Once bitten twice shy is the expression that will come to mind to both the Bosnians and the International Community. The Bosnian Serbs will never have more in Bosnia then they have now. That is simply a fact of which most of them are aware. If they try to push for independence then the entity they were unjustly granted in the Dayton Accords will be dissolved. I've stated it before and I'll state it again, Dodik is pursuing a foolish and very self-destructive policy that will be disasterous for the Bosnian Serbs. You can ask the Croatian Serb and Kosovo Serb refugees living in Serbia if they think their adventurism was worth it. They had big homes, good paying jobs, and a lot of power both in Croatia and in Kosovo. Then came Milosevic with his promises of a "Greater Serbian" state and they fell for it. In a few years time all that they had was lost and they ended up poor and homeless. Was it worth it for them? Maybe now is the time that they remind the Bosnian Serbs of how hard their lives have become because they listened to a charismatic delusional leader called Milosevic. The Bosnians want desperetely to get rid of the unjust and dysfunctional Dayton Accords and so the the Bosnian Serbs it seems. Let's all hope that this crisis can be overcome in a rational and peaceful manner that will result in the country becoming more stable and the lives of all Bosnian citizens improving.

Amer

pre 14 godina

'Tell me who is going to stop RS leaving Bosnia? And how?
(sj, 7 January 2010 22:54)'

Where is the RF going to go to? They can't become independent under international law (see the oral statements in the ICJ case), and Serbia can't annex it (same comment). When other countries have tried this, the UN called on its members to refuse to have any dealings with it: not good for business. Does Serbia really want to deal with all this?

Peggy

pre 14 godina

"Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now."
(Amer, 6 January 2010 21:26)
=========================

I don't think so.

They are never desperate to stop the killing. If they valued human life they wouldn't be stirring trouble all over the world and bombing the hell out of anything that moved. Just ask Iraq. How many lives did they manage to "save" there?

Supporting Izetbegovic was the mistake which I'm sure they are aware of now.
Keep in mind that the woman is Obama's life is Michelle and he doesn't need a diversion, while the woman in Clinton's life was Monica and he desperately needed a diversion.

I know, thier names both start with M but that's where similarities end.

roberto

pre 14 godina

Željko Komšić is perfectly correct, and repeating exactly what we have been saying for at least the past 2 years. dodik is a big-mouthed, foul-mouthed, bad-tempered milosevic wanna-be, and the intl comm (s0 called), esp the eu, coddles and sweet-talks him, exactly as they did slobo. because they fear him, and because they show "respect" for brutal power. it will backfire of course, and has already helped push bosnia into a hole, from which people generally feel great pessimism, hopelessness, resentment. across the board.

the great "successes" of RS that are always trumpeted here translate to big $$ and influence for the few and poverty and joblessness for the masses. recipe for disaster all the way round.

so i appreciate such lectures to the intrnls (us) about who is of greatest danger, and who needs not coddling, but appropriate sanctions, prosecution, and hopefully long and severe jail terms.

we -- the intls -- are not helpless in these matters, no what the extremists threaten. not so different as in the 90s. perhaps we acted with some good intentions, but inevitably became paralyzed, full of fear and contradictions, giving off the worst possible messages to the serbian radicals. thus the great success of the karadzic/mladic team and their many, many willing executioners, all just proxies of slobo and of serbia.

it is all unforgivable, and we are again headed for disaster. world, wake up!

roberto
back in US of A

gajo

pre 14 godina

I guess mesic has been talking to you but in the real world of today its the people that talk and decide what they want and if republica srpska leaves that's their choice and not yours and the republics is over 92% Serbs so its going to be a done deal and stop using the milosevic era already its getting old and the people will vote and will separate this years some time and you croats well your the third in population so you have no say in anything because in the entire country as a whole Serbs are a majority with 1,900,000 and in republica srpska is 1,700,000 alone and then its the bosniaks with about 1,700,000 in the federation and then croats with only about 499,0000 if that so you just stay in your federation and not worry about Serbian affairs are anybody's affairs for that matter your a tiny population with large mouths and that's it you cry very well but the year is 2010 not 1990 . majority rules nowadays not talking its the populations.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Komsic is exactly right in his assessment of Dodik and his policies. Dodik is the main reason that instability in the Balkans persists and it is him and his unwise policies that are preventing the region from moving forward towards joining NATO and the EU. It is becoming clear however that Dodik's time at the podium is coming to an end. Serbia has applied for EU membership and Bosnia will join NATO in a year or two. Both of these facts tell us that the support that Dodik gets from Belgrade will diminish as the Serbians look out for their own interests and leave the Bosnian Serbs to work out their own problems. Bosnia becoming a NATO member will discourage a repeat of the military aid that Serbia has given the Bosnian Serbs in the 90s. Once Dodik is cut off from Serbian support and the international community singles him out as the main problem for regional stability he will be weak and alone just the way Milosevic was in 2000 and we all know what happened to Milosevic after that. Enjoy your time at the podium Dodik it's quickly going to come to an end and then a new peaceful and truly democratic Bosnian state will emerge in which all of its citizens will feel safe, secure, and see their quality of life improve.

Lazar

pre 14 godina

Komsic is just worried because he is not going to be re-elected. HDZ is not divided so now he wants to get even more muslim votes... afterall, croatians did not vote for him. But, the sad thing about him is that he does not know what he is talking about - Milosevic was a socialist while Dodik seems to be in bed with the big corporations. Dodik is so supportive of capitalist development that the West likes him more, from an economic standpoint, than the Federation entity.

Gajo, stop claiming exact numbers about how much there is who in R.S. It can be 90%, it can be 92% as you say, but we do not know for sure.

Dragan

pre 14 godina

Roberto - stick to San Francisco politics, and worry about your own country which is bankrupt and sinking fast.
Don't worry about my people and my country, leave it to us. Your country's meddling is the reason for thousands of unnecessary deaths. Blame Clinton/Albright and their gang.

Amer

pre 14 godina

Ok, so say Dodik holds a referendum and declares independence. As we have all learned from the ICJ proceedings, one of the few times a declaration of independence is illegal is when it breaks an international agreement (as in the case of North Cyprus). Since Russia is one of the guarantors of the Dayton agreement, it would probably go along with a Security Council resolution calling on all states not to recognize the RS as a sovereign state, perhaps impose sanctions (as in the case of Rhodesia). In this case, what would "independence" for RS mean?

Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now.

Lazar

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, http://www.rzs.rs.ba/

Mike

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.

sj

pre 14 godina

roberto
back in US of A
(roberto, 6 January 2010 20:08)

Here is message from the RS – bye, bye Bosnia!!
But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

Please pay close attention to what the High Representative Mr. Inzko is saying. He is specifically naming Dodik and his political party as those who are engaged in anti-Dayton activities and he has clearly stated that any form of referendum would be a breach of the Dayton Accords. If the Bosnian Serbs breach the Dayton Accords then they will become null and void. What will remain? The state of Bosnia and Herzegovina without a constitution. A new constituion can be drawn up in a few months time with international help and suppervision and believe me there will never be anohter Serb eneity in Bosnia-Herzegovina again. Once bitten twice shy is the expression that will come to mind to both the Bosnians and the International Community. The Bosnian Serbs will never have more in Bosnia then they have now. That is simply a fact of which most of them are aware. If they try to push for independence then the entity they were unjustly granted in the Dayton Accords will be dissolved. I've stated it before and I'll state it again, Dodik is pursuing a foolish and very self-destructive policy that will be disasterous for the Bosnian Serbs. You can ask the Croatian Serb and Kosovo Serb refugees living in Serbia if they think their adventurism was worth it. They had big homes, good paying jobs, and a lot of power both in Croatia and in Kosovo. Then came Milosevic with his promises of a "Greater Serbian" state and they fell for it. In a few years time all that they had was lost and they ended up poor and homeless. Was it worth it for them? Maybe now is the time that they remind the Bosnian Serbs of how hard their lives have become because they listened to a charismatic delusional leader called Milosevic. The Bosnians want desperetely to get rid of the unjust and dysfunctional Dayton Accords and so the the Bosnian Serbs it seems. Let's all hope that this crisis can be overcome in a rational and peaceful manner that will result in the country becoming more stable and the lives of all Bosnian citizens improving.

FairPlay

pre 14 godina

If violence breaks out in Bosnia due to the anti-Dayton policies of the Bosnian Serb politicians then Dodik will realize the big mistake he made in his gamble. Dodik does not have the economic or military resources to fight a sustained war and he has very little support in the international community. Do people think that NATO will aid a man who is rabidly opposed to it? Do people think that the EU will back a man that is behind closed doors referred to as a corrupt dictator, a Milosevic in the making? Let's not forget that the genocide that the Bosnian Serb military committed in Bosnia is recognized by the international court and all major countries and that the entity has no moral justification for existing. What can Serbia do to help the Bosnian Serbs in the case of a conflict? Next to nothing! They can't ship weapons into the country since sanctions would be placed on them and the goal of joining the EU would be postponed for another 20-30 years. They can't send money since sanctions would be placed on them seriously hurting the economy in a time of financial crisis. They can't even symbolically support the Bosnian Serbs since Serbian officials have been traveling the globe the last two years trying to convince countries that Serbia respects international law and the territorial integrity of UN member states. The Bosnian Serbs would lose the military conflict, would lose the moral conflict, and would lose their entity forever. Many of them would flee to Serbia as refugees but the majority would remain in Bosnia. Their rights as Bosnian citizens would be protected by a new democratic constitution and peace would prevail. Dodik can not win the war he is trying to start he is acting very foolishly and is very close to overplaying his hand to the detriment of all Bosnians but especially the Bosnian Serbs. Milosevic promised the Serbians pie in the sky but only delivered them economic hardship, a terrible image, a territorially truncated country, and destruction. Milosevic is the main reason that Kosovo gained partially recognized independence. The Serbian people have a habit of falling behind delusional leaders that make foolish political miscalculations. If Dodik continues his unwise policies then he will simply become one of the many Serbian "tragic heroes" that led his followers to disaster. Dodik only wants personal power, wealth, and glory. He has lost touch with reality and if he starts another Balkan conflict then he will end up like Milosevic (behind bars) and the Bosnian Serbs' will end up like the Serbs that used to live in Croatia and Kosovo and are now unwanted refugees in Serbia and scattered around the world.

Amer

pre 14 godina

'But if your “intls” are so concerned they can send in an army to stop those nasty Serbs! Opps! they tooooo busy in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and now Yemen.
(sj, 6 January 2010 23:01) '

So RS is going to field an army? Supported by whom - the bigger RS?

I don't think so.

As far as opposing whatever home guard they field, the Croatians and Albanians can help out the Federal forces, if needed. As a matter of fact, I bet the Dutch would also be glad to send a contingent.

Demi

pre 14 godina

You know one of the arguments against reincorporating Kosovo into the rest of Serbia is that it would be next to impossible to reincorporate over 1 million K Albanians into Belgrade's political framework. With roughly the same number of Serbs living in RS, how can they be reincorporated into Sarajevo's political framework? Both B Serbs and K Albanians have been living separate for over a decade, right?

So if we argue the impracticality in Kosovo, why are we wasting our time in Bosnia? The West may very well throw Bosnia under the bus in order to save Kosovo.

One can't help but vaingloriously bask in the warm glow of Schadenfreude.
(Mike, 6 January 2010 21:22)


One reson is that Bosnia diden't commit genocide against the residents of ''RS'' and ''RS'' dident exist before 1991 and is built on ethnic cleansning of bosnian muslims.

CG

pre 14 godina

Fair play,

while I agree with you that Dodik is an irresponsible idiot who sometimes stires up flames to mask his corrupt government under a dosis of "patriotism"(like giving his son a credit of 3 million KM and others) Silajdzic and Mesic and other Croat and Muslim radicals are working towards a radicalization and violence systematically by not letting off of the RS.
And they are corrupt too ,but desperately want a new conflict(unlike Dodik)because they think they will have international protection like in the 90s.

Now this is a serious mistake,the US made crystal clear statements that "the RS will stay until the end of times" Daniel Fried(secretary for the Balkans in the State Department).

Don`t illude yourself that you Bosniaks can start a war ,have the support of the US and have Belgrade looking what is happening and do nothing to protect its people.
Don`t do this,it would be a terrible mistake for the Bosniaks.

gajo

pre 14 godina

And Gajo, there is at most 1500,000 in R.S., not 1,900,000. Leave your nationalism. If you do not believe me here is the link to the Republika Srpska statistics office, [link]/



there is 1,711,576 serbs in republica srpska including refugees and in Bosnia as a whole there is 1,900,000 thats what i said and those are real facts all that your 1,500,000 shows is with out refugees. but anyway independence is on the way soon

CG

pre 14 godina

FairPlay,

again,you are hoping that Dodik will do something that stupid like an independence referendum to get the international community against the Serbs.
Forget it,it is not going to happen,and if he does a step towards that he will be removed by the OHR and the RS will continue to function normally.
I know that you secretly wish for a war ,with the help of the US and Belgrade passively looking to establish what Mustafa Ceric openly stated(and Silajdzic and co dream about although babbling democratic nonsense)"a muslim national state of Bosnia".
This is a serious miscalculation,don`t try it,it would disastrous for the Bosniaks who are encircled by enemies and in a very weak position.

Amer

pre 14 godina

'Tell me who is going to stop RS leaving Bosnia? And how?
(sj, 7 January 2010 22:54)'

Where is the RF going to go to? They can't become independent under international law (see the oral statements in the ICJ case), and Serbia can't annex it (same comment). When other countries have tried this, the UN called on its members to refuse to have any dealings with it: not good for business. Does Serbia really want to deal with all this?

Peggy

pre 14 godina

"Since the Dayton agreement would have been shattered, it would have to be rewritten - no more entities (Holbrooke said RS was a mistake, but they were desperate to stop the killing). This time the negotiators will hold out for a unified state with a mixed population - that makes a lot more sense than the situation they have now."
(Amer, 6 January 2010 21:26)
=========================

I don't think so.

They are never desperate to stop the killing. If they valued human life they wouldn't be stirring trouble all over the world and bombing the hell out of anything that moved. Just ask Iraq. How many lives did they manage to "save" there?

Supporting Izetbegovic was the mistake which I'm sure they are aware of now.
Keep in mind that the woman is Obama's life is Michelle and he doesn't need a diversion, while the woman in Clinton's life was Monica and he desperately needed a diversion.

I know, thier names both start with M but that's where similarities end.