"After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature."
I would like you to further elaborate your thesis. Including prewar time.
lili, you wrote:
"un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes?"
I don't try to predict anything here, but just suggest you to prepare yourself for any outcome in this case. I know a Serbian woman who today is in a kind of mental coma. During the war time she swore to me that not a single Serbian man holding a gun will carry out any atrocities against his enemies. That his Serbian honour will not accept him acting a wrong way. Then news came over, such evidences that she couldn't deny. But neither accept without falling in mental coma. Today she is only interested of what she shall put in her mouth for breakfast, for lunch, for dinner, for breakfast, for lunch...
For those who are trying to connect Djindjic's murder with this shameful political murders between Albanians in Kosovo.
Djondjic, as a Serb prime minister, was shot by criminals!
In Kosovo, Thaci, as a acting Albanian prime minister is ordering killings of his opponents. Therefore he is a criminal.
That is a huge difference.
# I guess the current government mandate will be over soon. It's time for Kosova to join Albania as one inseparable nation.
(Black Eagle, 1 December 2009 00:42)
If that happened, hell will have officially frozen over. Furthermore, if people like you tried that you would have many internationals like myself take up arms against nationalist bigots like yourself.
Unfortunately these kind of crimes happen mostly in the Balkan region(not only to Serbs and Albanians but others as well).
We know that Djindjic killers are in prison, we'll wait and see what's going to unfold in Kosovo.
Hopefully the truth and nothing but the truth.
Hopefully Mr.Geci is going to tell us the truth on the killing of Ahmet Krasniqi in 1997 Tirana. Another case that I'm curious is that of former KLA Commander who was gunned down after the war. Those who have commited crimes belong behind bars and the stolen money must be brought back to the people of Kosovo.
Hope Thaci's name doesn't come up because he was in Tirana between 1997-1999 when a few horrible crimes took place.
Also I hope that this DVD is not a fabricated one because this is what I'm hearing in the last 2 days or so.
I'm sure that all Albanians are proud that KLA achieved the goal towards Independence but I'm also sure that majority of Albanians feel bad that some stupid people wore the KLA uniform.
Peace to everyone because the end of the world might come in 2012 as predicted by some scientists. I'm not saying this because I just saw that new Movie a week ago:)
The reason why he told all of this is because he wasn't paid so he made it to the journalists and the MP's. I sure do cherish his courage and the will to testify and acknowledge what he and his collaborators have been doing since before the war in Kosova in the name of SHIK (Thaci?!)
I am an Albanian and I simply adore this guy and believe every word that he says. Of course, I am also ashamed by the acts they committed because killing is a crime, also giving an order to kill is a crime too, as you all probably know!
One thing that surprised is this part that B92, as a very reliable? source of information, failed to clarify:
"DSK official Gani Geci accused the DPK on Thursday during an assembly session of having committed serious crimes, and claimed that he had evidence."
DSK stand for the Demokratska Stranka Kosova, but Gani Geci isn't from this party, he is a member of the Dardanian League of Kosovo, so this has to be clarified (maybe in Serbian it's the same, but not here in Kosova).
Please people, adore this guy for his courage to let the truth be told, and of course, he and everyone connected to the crimes he mentions should be tried for the crimes committed!
leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
(Kosova-USA, 30 November 2009 15:13)
Vendeta, criminals in the govnt, you must be kidding, were you not the one that said so many times that those things do not exist in kosovo...!
The only surprising thing in this story is that there's a person who dared to testify and who survived so far - unlike in many others cases where politicians of the democratic (pseudo-)country of Kosovo have been envolved.
This is one thing Kosovo and Serbia has in common, killing politicians, professors, journalists and other intellectuals. Criminals belong in jail.
(kosovaman, 30 November 2009 15:43)
Interesting. Until today the Albanians were saying that only Serbia is corrupt and "Kosova" is a beacon of democracy.
A I certainly was not making this a Serbian vs Albanian thing. I thought I made that clear.
The motive so far as Legija was concerned was to remove Djindjic because Djindjic had decided to close down the criminal element. Yes Legija surely went to some political parties to muster up support, and who knows who knew what. However, its quite another thing to allege that Legija was ordered by a politician to murder Djindjic.
Thats why 'politically motivated' murder and a politician that murders, cannot be considered the same thing.
Yesterday 4 policemen were gunned down in Washington state. The investigation was hampered by two people who individually called the authorities and falsely claimed to be the shooter, wasting who knows how many man-hours and dollars. People are strange, no matter what the country.
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
(aRta, 30 November 2009 18:33)
So its okay as long as an Albanian does it but is wrong if a Serb does? Sounds hypocritical to me.
This coming from the same person who said civilian casualties inflicted civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were just part of war. How ironic that the far fewer civilian casualties committed by Serbs during the fighting in Kosovo did not fall into that same category. Always a double-standard.
Political violence occures everywhere. That was my point. However, some of your countrymen tried to deny this fact by bringing up the Djindic assassination over and over while at the same time suggest that it didn't take place in albanian politics.
he killed for pdk?and just when the icj is gathering ,this guy suddely remenbered that he has killed for..Thaci? how strange that it took him so long to disclose that!!!
un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes??
.I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo.
----
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
"BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better." (A)
-- That may very well be true, but I guess Albanians can't use the "at least we don't kill our prime minister card" anymore. This is unfortunately the reality that hits when international forces take what is essentially warlords and organized crime gangs, give them a shave and a political party, and expect them to be good democratic leaders. We get the same problems in Afghanistan and Iraq too.
Now I wonder whether or nor Hash knew of these killings, or whether he even ordered some of them?
But....I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo. Oh well, I guess that albanian lie did not work either.
(MikeC, 30 November 2009 15:29)
MikeC, For many Albanians this has been news as much as rest of the world. But the truth is we new that some manipulation was happening behind closed Doors.
Its sad and shameful for this to happen. there is a need to clean house and make peoples life better instead of chasing recognitions.
But hope it will get better. And no need to compare with other Balkan Nations since just it happens there we should not allow it in Kosovo.
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
(A, 30 November 2009 13:57)
Indeed - and these people are responsible for the bad image of the area. It won't make you feel much better, but the top of Hungarian FIDESZ is rumored to be involved in bloodbath of Mór (stealing discriminating papers from the safe disguised as bank robbery and killing most employees and customers present). So Kosovo is not unique, unfortunately. But it's not an excuse.
--------
Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
(bganon, 30 November 2009 13:33)
Well, as the example above: Hungary is maybe more "advanced". What happened at Mór is without precedent. And (are you surprised?) the investigation was botched.
The (very incomplete) article on Wiki - but there is almost nothing about Mór massacre in English:
http://tinyurl.com/4hrxx4
What is missing: people say, there were papers in the bank safe revealing some dubious activity of some top FIDESZ guys ( corruption, etc.). These papers were gone. The amount of stolen money is roughly what you pay for a middle class Toyota car, without much extras but better engine. But since it's not official - this is just food for some thoughts.
--------
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
In Serbian areas and protecting Serbian cultural heritage: sure. For Albanian areas the presence of Serb or Russian police won't do any good because the locals won't trust them. The goal is to have a police which is not corrupt and is trusted by locals because otherwise they will conspire against the "intruders" - thus potentially cooperating with criminals. This is why Albanian police is no good for Serbian areas: the criminals would get the backing of locals.
If this is what you mind saying "Western-Russian backed Serbian Police" than I agree. Germans and County Mounties for Albanian area, MUP + Russians for Serb areas and around monasteries/churches. Or why not the Greek police?
To allthose that beleive this guy;
I assume none of you watched his self made video sitting in his living room on the old ragy couch and walls were filthy. This guy is trying to make some money , which most likely has been paid by Gani Geci and Adem Salihaj(both members of parlament and belonging to the same party). Find me a person in right mind that comes out and says I killed so and so, knowing that he/she will get at leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better.
So the western cowards have painted themselves into a corner and still knows nothing about the mess they have created to get camp bondsteel (and obviously nothing about albanians).
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
At last the veil of secrecy about what goes on behind the scenes within kosovo albanian politics is lifted.
I take no joy in this because I'm Serbian, rather I'm happy on behalf of those in Kosovo who know what goes on but are afraid to speak out. And yes there are plenty of dirty tactics in Serbian politics but party members use blackmail and secrets but not murder to keep their positions. Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
I'm not surprised that EULEX have been sitting on this for a month. It highlights the fact that they are afraid to take real action against this type of problem in Kosovo. I mean how do you go about it - I suppose you can play favourites with local political leaders but to go after all the criminal element in Kosovo politics they would join up and run you out of town.
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
--
Personally, I wouldn't like to see Serbian police in any Albanian areas and I am happy for UN controlled forces to do that job. As can be seen from this article, crime in this sphere goes all the way to the top and if a conflict was ever to occur, it would be far better to see this happen against international forces than Serbian police.
Having said that, I would still like to see Serbian police protecting Serbian areas plus our cultural heritage and religious sites.
Kosovo Albanian Prime Minister Hashim Thaci’s party stood behind the crimes, that included murder, Blaca said.
--
You know, I don't think this should come as a surprise to most. We all know how quickly the West can drop an "ally" and Thaci's use-by date is approaching soon. I can detect a shift in policy towards Kosovo with recent statements by Western officials - such as stating Russia and Serbia should find a solution.
It seems the West is finally realising what they've got themselves into. Personally, I'm glad they are the ones attempting to control ethnic Albanians but it seems they themselves are finding the task difficult and are now more sympathetic towards Serbians. Two NATO soldiers have also committed suicide in as many weeks so what's going on there?
Anyway, I've always expected Thaci to end up in the same boat as Hussein and Bin Laden.
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
--
Personally, I wouldn't like to see Serbian police in any Albanian areas and I am happy for UN controlled forces to do that job. As can be seen from this article, crime in this sphere goes all the way to the top and if a conflict was ever to occur, it would be far better to see this happen against international forces than Serbian police.
Having said that, I would still like to see Serbian police protecting Serbian areas plus our cultural heritage and religious sites.
At last the veil of secrecy about what goes on behind the scenes within kosovo albanian politics is lifted.
I take no joy in this because I'm Serbian, rather I'm happy on behalf of those in Kosovo who know what goes on but are afraid to speak out. And yes there are plenty of dirty tactics in Serbian politics but party members use blackmail and secrets but not murder to keep their positions. Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
I'm not surprised that EULEX have been sitting on this for a month. It highlights the fact that they are afraid to take real action against this type of problem in Kosovo. I mean how do you go about it - I suppose you can play favourites with local political leaders but to go after all the criminal element in Kosovo politics they would join up and run you out of town.
Kosovo Albanian Prime Minister Hashim Thaci’s party stood behind the crimes, that included murder, Blaca said.
--
You know, I don't think this should come as a surprise to most. We all know how quickly the West can drop an "ally" and Thaci's use-by date is approaching soon. I can detect a shift in policy towards Kosovo with recent statements by Western officials - such as stating Russia and Serbia should find a solution.
It seems the West is finally realising what they've got themselves into. Personally, I'm glad they are the ones attempting to control ethnic Albanians but it seems they themselves are finding the task difficult and are now more sympathetic towards Serbians. Two NATO soldiers have also committed suicide in as many weeks so what's going on there?
Anyway, I've always expected Thaci to end up in the same boat as Hussein and Bin Laden.
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better.
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
(aRta, 30 November 2009 18:33)
So its okay as long as an Albanian does it but is wrong if a Serb does? Sounds hypocritical to me.
This coming from the same person who said civilian casualties inflicted civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were just part of war. How ironic that the far fewer civilian casualties committed by Serbs during the fighting in Kosovo did not fall into that same category. Always a double-standard.
So the western cowards have painted themselves into a corner and still knows nothing about the mess they have created to get camp bondsteel (and obviously nothing about albanians).
This is one thing Kosovo and Serbia has in common, killing politicians, professors, journalists and other intellectuals. Criminals belong in jail.
(kosovaman, 30 November 2009 15:43)
Interesting. Until today the Albanians were saying that only Serbia is corrupt and "Kosova" is a beacon of democracy.
leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
(Kosova-USA, 30 November 2009 15:13)
Vendeta, criminals in the govnt, you must be kidding, were you not the one that said so many times that those things do not exist in kosovo...!
# I guess the current government mandate will be over soon. It's time for Kosova to join Albania as one inseparable nation.
(Black Eagle, 1 December 2009 00:42)
If that happened, hell will have officially frozen over. Furthermore, if people like you tried that you would have many internationals like myself take up arms against nationalist bigots like yourself.
To allthose that beleive this guy;
I assume none of you watched his self made video sitting in his living room on the old ragy couch and walls were filthy. This guy is trying to make some money , which most likely has been paid by Gani Geci and Adem Salihaj(both members of parlament and belonging to the same party). Find me a person in right mind that comes out and says I killed so and so, knowing that he/she will get at leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
"BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better." (A)
-- That may very well be true, but I guess Albanians can't use the "at least we don't kill our prime minister card" anymore. This is unfortunately the reality that hits when international forces take what is essentially warlords and organized crime gangs, give them a shave and a political party, and expect them to be good democratic leaders. We get the same problems in Afghanistan and Iraq too.
Now I wonder whether or nor Hash knew of these killings, or whether he even ordered some of them?
For those who are trying to connect Djindjic's murder with this shameful political murders between Albanians in Kosovo.
Djondjic, as a Serb prime minister, was shot by criminals!
In Kosovo, Thaci, as a acting Albanian prime minister is ordering killings of his opponents. Therefore he is a criminal.
That is a huge difference.
The only surprising thing in this story is that there's a person who dared to testify and who survived so far - unlike in many others cases where politicians of the democratic (pseudo-)country of Kosovo have been envolved.
The reason why he told all of this is because he wasn't paid so he made it to the journalists and the MP's. I sure do cherish his courage and the will to testify and acknowledge what he and his collaborators have been doing since before the war in Kosova in the name of SHIK (Thaci?!)
I am an Albanian and I simply adore this guy and believe every word that he says. Of course, I am also ashamed by the acts they committed because killing is a crime, also giving an order to kill is a crime too, as you all probably know!
One thing that surprised is this part that B92, as a very reliable? source of information, failed to clarify:
"DSK official Gani Geci accused the DPK on Thursday during an assembly session of having committed serious crimes, and claimed that he had evidence."
DSK stand for the Demokratska Stranka Kosova, but Gani Geci isn't from this party, he is a member of the Dardanian League of Kosovo, so this has to be clarified (maybe in Serbian it's the same, but not here in Kosova).
Please people, adore this guy for his courage to let the truth be told, and of course, he and everyone connected to the crimes he mentions should be tried for the crimes committed!
A I certainly was not making this a Serbian vs Albanian thing. I thought I made that clear.
The motive so far as Legija was concerned was to remove Djindjic because Djindjic had decided to close down the criminal element. Yes Legija surely went to some political parties to muster up support, and who knows who knew what. However, its quite another thing to allege that Legija was ordered by a politician to murder Djindjic.
Thats why 'politically motivated' murder and a politician that murders, cannot be considered the same thing.
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
(A, 30 November 2009 13:57)
Indeed - and these people are responsible for the bad image of the area. It won't make you feel much better, but the top of Hungarian FIDESZ is rumored to be involved in bloodbath of Mór (stealing discriminating papers from the safe disguised as bank robbery and killing most employees and customers present). So Kosovo is not unique, unfortunately. But it's not an excuse.
--------
Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
(bganon, 30 November 2009 13:33)
Well, as the example above: Hungary is maybe more "advanced". What happened at Mór is without precedent. And (are you surprised?) the investigation was botched.
The (very incomplete) article on Wiki - but there is almost nothing about Mór massacre in English:
http://tinyurl.com/4hrxx4
What is missing: people say, there were papers in the bank safe revealing some dubious activity of some top FIDESZ guys ( corruption, etc.). These papers were gone. The amount of stolen money is roughly what you pay for a middle class Toyota car, without much extras but better engine. But since it's not official - this is just food for some thoughts.
--------
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
In Serbian areas and protecting Serbian cultural heritage: sure. For Albanian areas the presence of Serb or Russian police won't do any good because the locals won't trust them. The goal is to have a police which is not corrupt and is trusted by locals because otherwise they will conspire against the "intruders" - thus potentially cooperating with criminals. This is why Albanian police is no good for Serbian areas: the criminals would get the backing of locals.
If this is what you mind saying "Western-Russian backed Serbian Police" than I agree. Germans and County Mounties for Albanian area, MUP + Russians for Serb areas and around monasteries/churches. Or why not the Greek police?
.I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo.
----
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
Yesterday 4 policemen were gunned down in Washington state. The investigation was hampered by two people who individually called the authorities and falsely claimed to be the shooter, wasting who knows how many man-hours and dollars. People are strange, no matter what the country.
But....I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo. Oh well, I guess that albanian lie did not work either.
(MikeC, 30 November 2009 15:29)
MikeC, For many Albanians this has been news as much as rest of the world. But the truth is we new that some manipulation was happening behind closed Doors.
Its sad and shameful for this to happen. there is a need to clean house and make peoples life better instead of chasing recognitions.
But hope it will get better. And no need to compare with other Balkan Nations since just it happens there we should not allow it in Kosovo.
Political violence occures everywhere. That was my point. However, some of your countrymen tried to deny this fact by bringing up the Djindic assassination over and over while at the same time suggest that it didn't take place in albanian politics.
he killed for pdk?and just when the icj is gathering ,this guy suddely remenbered that he has killed for..Thaci? how strange that it took him so long to disclose that!!!
un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes??
Unfortunately these kind of crimes happen mostly in the Balkan region(not only to Serbs and Albanians but others as well).
We know that Djindjic killers are in prison, we'll wait and see what's going to unfold in Kosovo.
Hopefully the truth and nothing but the truth.
Hopefully Mr.Geci is going to tell us the truth on the killing of Ahmet Krasniqi in 1997 Tirana. Another case that I'm curious is that of former KLA Commander who was gunned down after the war. Those who have commited crimes belong behind bars and the stolen money must be brought back to the people of Kosovo.
Hope Thaci's name doesn't come up because he was in Tirana between 1997-1999 when a few horrible crimes took place.
Also I hope that this DVD is not a fabricated one because this is what I'm hearing in the last 2 days or so.
I'm sure that all Albanians are proud that KLA achieved the goal towards Independence but I'm also sure that majority of Albanians feel bad that some stupid people wore the KLA uniform.
Peace to everyone because the end of the world might come in 2012 as predicted by some scientists. I'm not saying this because I just saw that new Movie a week ago:)
"After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature."
I would like you to further elaborate your thesis. Including prewar time.
lili, you wrote:
"un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes?"
I don't try to predict anything here, but just suggest you to prepare yourself for any outcome in this case. I know a Serbian woman who today is in a kind of mental coma. During the war time she swore to me that not a single Serbian man holding a gun will carry out any atrocities against his enemies. That his Serbian honour will not accept him acting a wrong way. Then news came over, such evidences that she couldn't deny. But neither accept without falling in mental coma. Today she is only interested of what she shall put in her mouth for breakfast, for lunch, for dinner, for breakfast, for lunch...
To allthose that beleive this guy;
I assume none of you watched his self made video sitting in his living room on the old ragy couch and walls were filthy. This guy is trying to make some money , which most likely has been paid by Gani Geci and Adem Salihaj(both members of parlament and belonging to the same party). Find me a person in right mind that comes out and says I killed so and so, knowing that he/she will get at leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
Kosovo Albanian Prime Minister Hashim Thaci’s party stood behind the crimes, that included murder, Blaca said.
--
You know, I don't think this should come as a surprise to most. We all know how quickly the West can drop an "ally" and Thaci's use-by date is approaching soon. I can detect a shift in policy towards Kosovo with recent statements by Western officials - such as stating Russia and Serbia should find a solution.
It seems the West is finally realising what they've got themselves into. Personally, I'm glad they are the ones attempting to control ethnic Albanians but it seems they themselves are finding the task difficult and are now more sympathetic towards Serbians. Two NATO soldiers have also committed suicide in as many weeks so what's going on there?
Anyway, I've always expected Thaci to end up in the same boat as Hussein and Bin Laden.
.I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo.
----
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
(A, 30 November 2009 13:57)
Indeed - and these people are responsible for the bad image of the area. It won't make you feel much better, but the top of Hungarian FIDESZ is rumored to be involved in bloodbath of Mór (stealing discriminating papers from the safe disguised as bank robbery and killing most employees and customers present). So Kosovo is not unique, unfortunately. But it's not an excuse.
--------
Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
(bganon, 30 November 2009 13:33)
Well, as the example above: Hungary is maybe more "advanced". What happened at Mór is without precedent. And (are you surprised?) the investigation was botched.
The (very incomplete) article on Wiki - but there is almost nothing about Mór massacre in English:
http://tinyurl.com/4hrxx4
What is missing: people say, there were papers in the bank safe revealing some dubious activity of some top FIDESZ guys ( corruption, etc.). These papers were gone. The amount of stolen money is roughly what you pay for a middle class Toyota car, without much extras but better engine. But since it's not official - this is just food for some thoughts.
--------
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
In Serbian areas and protecting Serbian cultural heritage: sure. For Albanian areas the presence of Serb or Russian police won't do any good because the locals won't trust them. The goal is to have a police which is not corrupt and is trusted by locals because otherwise they will conspire against the "intruders" - thus potentially cooperating with criminals. This is why Albanian police is no good for Serbian areas: the criminals would get the backing of locals.
If this is what you mind saying "Western-Russian backed Serbian Police" than I agree. Germans and County Mounties for Albanian area, MUP + Russians for Serb areas and around monasteries/churches. Or why not the Greek police?
BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better.
Only a western-Russian backed Serbian Police would bring peace in Kosovo.
(Pyrros, 30 November 2009 11:14)
--
Personally, I wouldn't like to see Serbian police in any Albanian areas and I am happy for UN controlled forces to do that job. As can be seen from this article, crime in this sphere goes all the way to the top and if a conflict was ever to occur, it would be far better to see this happen against international forces than Serbian police.
Having said that, I would still like to see Serbian police protecting Serbian areas plus our cultural heritage and religious sites.
So the western cowards have painted themselves into a corner and still knows nothing about the mess they have created to get camp bondsteel (and obviously nothing about albanians).
he killed for pdk?and just when the icj is gathering ,this guy suddely remenbered that he has killed for..Thaci? how strange that it took him so long to disclose that!!!
un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes??
After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature
(aRta, 30 November 2009 18:33)
So its okay as long as an Albanian does it but is wrong if a Serb does? Sounds hypocritical to me.
This coming from the same person who said civilian casualties inflicted civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were just part of war. How ironic that the far fewer civilian casualties committed by Serbs during the fighting in Kosovo did not fall into that same category. Always a double-standard.
This is one thing Kosovo and Serbia has in common, killing politicians, professors, journalists and other intellectuals. Criminals belong in jail.
(kosovaman, 30 November 2009 15:43)
Interesting. Until today the Albanians were saying that only Serbia is corrupt and "Kosova" is a beacon of democracy.
"After a war, during a war and in chaotic times you always find political violence. Welcome to human nature."
I would like you to further elaborate your thesis. Including prewar time.
lili, you wrote:
"un crime peut en cacher un autre,as french say,why did he volunter for these allegated crimes?"
I don't try to predict anything here, but just suggest you to prepare yourself for any outcome in this case. I know a Serbian woman who today is in a kind of mental coma. During the war time she swore to me that not a single Serbian man holding a gun will carry out any atrocities against his enemies. That his Serbian honour will not accept him acting a wrong way. Then news came over, such evidences that she couldn't deny. But neither accept without falling in mental coma. Today she is only interested of what she shall put in her mouth for breakfast, for lunch, for dinner, for breakfast, for lunch...
"BGANON, please don't make this to another Serbians vs Albanians discussion. We know that the killing of Djindic was politically motivated. Serbian polticians are no better." (A)
-- That may very well be true, but I guess Albanians can't use the "at least we don't kill our prime minister card" anymore. This is unfortunately the reality that hits when international forces take what is essentially warlords and organized crime gangs, give them a shave and a political party, and expect them to be good democratic leaders. We get the same problems in Afghanistan and Iraq too.
Now I wonder whether or nor Hash knew of these killings, or whether he even ordered some of them?
Yesterday 4 policemen were gunned down in Washington state. The investigation was hampered by two people who individually called the authorities and falsely claimed to be the shooter, wasting who knows how many man-hours and dollars. People are strange, no matter what the country.
At last the veil of secrecy about what goes on behind the scenes within kosovo albanian politics is lifted.
I take no joy in this because I'm Serbian, rather I'm happy on behalf of those in Kosovo who know what goes on but are afraid to speak out. And yes there are plenty of dirty tactics in Serbian politics but party members use blackmail and secrets but not murder to keep their positions. Remember that Legija was not in a political party - he was a criminal.
I'm not surprised that EULEX have been sitting on this for a month. It highlights the fact that they are afraid to take real action against this type of problem in Kosovo. I mean how do you go about it - I suppose you can play favourites with local political leaders but to go after all the criminal element in Kosovo politics they would join up and run you out of town.
A very good reason for Kosovo persecutors to jail those who have blood in their hands, no matter who they are. If Thaci knew about this than put him in jail. No one is above the law. We can not have a prime minister with this kind of criminal past. I am ashamed.
Unfortunately these kind of crimes happen mostly in the Balkan region(not only to Serbs and Albanians but others as well).
We know that Djindjic killers are in prison, we'll wait and see what's going to unfold in Kosovo.
Hopefully the truth and nothing but the truth.
Hopefully Mr.Geci is going to tell us the truth on the killing of Ahmet Krasniqi in 1997 Tirana. Another case that I'm curious is that of former KLA Commander who was gunned down after the war. Those who have commited crimes belong behind bars and the stolen money must be brought back to the people of Kosovo.
Hope Thaci's name doesn't come up because he was in Tirana between 1997-1999 when a few horrible crimes took place.
Also I hope that this DVD is not a fabricated one because this is what I'm hearing in the last 2 days or so.
I'm sure that all Albanians are proud that KLA achieved the goal towards Independence but I'm also sure that majority of Albanians feel bad that some stupid people wore the KLA uniform.
Peace to everyone because the end of the world might come in 2012 as predicted by some scientists. I'm not saying this because I just saw that new Movie a week ago:)
The reason why he told all of this is because he wasn't paid so he made it to the journalists and the MP's. I sure do cherish his courage and the will to testify and acknowledge what he and his collaborators have been doing since before the war in Kosova in the name of SHIK (Thaci?!)
I am an Albanian and I simply adore this guy and believe every word that he says. Of course, I am also ashamed by the acts they committed because killing is a crime, also giving an order to kill is a crime too, as you all probably know!
One thing that surprised is this part that B92, as a very reliable? source of information, failed to clarify:
"DSK official Gani Geci accused the DPK on Thursday during an assembly session of having committed serious crimes, and claimed that he had evidence."
DSK stand for the Demokratska Stranka Kosova, but Gani Geci isn't from this party, he is a member of the Dardanian League of Kosovo, so this has to be clarified (maybe in Serbian it's the same, but not here in Kosova).
Please people, adore this guy for his courage to let the truth be told, and of course, he and everyone connected to the crimes he mentions should be tried for the crimes committed!
Political violence occures everywhere. That was my point. However, some of your countrymen tried to deny this fact by bringing up the Djindic assassination over and over while at the same time suggest that it didn't take place in albanian politics.
The only surprising thing in this story is that there's a person who dared to testify and who survived so far - unlike in many others cases where politicians of the democratic (pseudo-)country of Kosovo have been envolved.
But....I thought albanians were saying there weren't any political violence in Kosovo. Oh well, I guess that albanian lie did not work either.
(MikeC, 30 November 2009 15:29)
MikeC, For many Albanians this has been news as much as rest of the world. But the truth is we new that some manipulation was happening behind closed Doors.
Its sad and shameful for this to happen. there is a need to clean house and make peoples life better instead of chasing recognitions.
But hope it will get better. And no need to compare with other Balkan Nations since just it happens there we should not allow it in Kosovo.
A I certainly was not making this a Serbian vs Albanian thing. I thought I made that clear.
The motive so far as Legija was concerned was to remove Djindjic because Djindjic had decided to close down the criminal element. Yes Legija surely went to some political parties to muster up support, and who knows who knew what. However, its quite another thing to allege that Legija was ordered by a politician to murder Djindjic.
Thats why 'politically motivated' murder and a politician that murders, cannot be considered the same thing.
leats 20 years of prison time +his family will be in danger of getting killed from victim's families (vendeta). I personally think that Geci and Salihaj belong in prison cell. They are the criminals sitting in Kosova Parlament.
Please , gentelmen hold your horses and wait for the end of the movie.
(Kosova-USA, 30 November 2009 15:13)
Vendeta, criminals in the govnt, you must be kidding, were you not the one that said so many times that those things do not exist in kosovo...!
# I guess the current government mandate will be over soon. It's time for Kosova to join Albania as one inseparable nation.
(Black Eagle, 1 December 2009 00:42)
If that happened, hell will have officially frozen over. Furthermore, if people like you tried that you would have many internationals like myself take up arms against nationalist bigots like yourself.
For those who are trying to connect Djindjic's murder with this shameful political murders between Albanians in Kosovo.
Djondjic, as a Serb prime minister, was shot by criminals!
In Kosovo, Thaci, as a acting Albanian prime minister is ordering killings of his opponents. Therefore he is a criminal.
That is a huge difference.
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