Statute "does not satisfy ambitions"

One thing really bothers me and that is when a minority declares not to be happy unless Vojvodina gets full autonomy. Also that only Shandors and Istvans of all minorities are the loudest when comes down to further 'pushing boundaries' of the new statute.
Where are the Serbs, where are other minorities, where is the opposition?

Well Pastor, be sure not to move "the boundaries" too far, what would be your secret dream, otherwise we may limit your "boundaries" to the extension of the walls of the local prison. Serbia surely needs no more separatists neither we will tolerate them.

Serbia is very much inn, for the introduction of constructive, qualitative and equal rights regionalisation, but not for the reestablishing by Tito's communist given privileges and so called autonomous quasi states inside the Serbian state, with the main and only communists goal to make Serbia weaker.

The wishes of "Balkan style post communist authoritarian non-democratic and populist politicians" like Pastor, with his nickname "Little Duce" or Canak or Pajtic do not have anything with effective state decetralisation, but with the primitive Balkanization where in, every populist leader will have his own little private country, per his wishes, to rule.
This process happening in Balkans can be adequatelly also called,
Djukanisation.

Pastor's statement in which he is not even grateful to Democratic Party in Belgrade, who gave up very much of its party ideas on the way how to regionalise Serbia and being noticed in a few frustrated speeches by Tadic toward Vojvodina "statute" supporters and in order to satisfy Pajtic, some Vojvodina DS politicians, Canak and ethnic Hungarian leaders, shows the extension of the major mistake they-DS have made in supporting this bill, "statute": they did not gain any ground with Vojvodina ethnic minorities voters and they will loose catastrophically in Central Serbia.
This mistake will surely cost them next election and I believe few more to come and anyhow Vojvodina "statute" will be deleted by popular democratic Referendum which will be called with the next non-DS Government on the power.

Vojvodina "statute" indicating SPECIAL "status" will not manage to happen. In modern Serbia, all Serbians will be equally very SPECIAL.

So long for the wishes of "little Duce"...communism (and fascism) is long over.

Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!

The Hungarians are hypocrites. They're saying oh we support autonomy and this doesn't go far enough, yet when Dinkic proposed the regionalization law they supported it even though autonomists viewed it as an attack on autonomy (i.e. decreasing the level and equalizing the pwoers of Vojvodina with the rest of Serbia). And if they really were autonomists as Pastor claims wouldn't they be against the bill like Canak.

Pastor is doing this for his own interests, god only knows what concession he is getting this time.

Any ways. This bill occured because it is required by law and for DS to placate the interests of Vojvodina DS.

Ones there is a new parlimanet and the regionalization law is implmeented, this law will no longer be in effect.

dean,

"mini-Duce" relates to Viktor Orban in Hungary not to Pasztor in Vojvodina.

And about this so-called autonomy: don't worry about it. Very little, if any will trickle down to the ethnic minorities. It is basically more local power to the Serbs in Novi Sad ....nothing else.

veki,

You sould realize that the Hungarians by far are the biggest minority in Vojvodina.

Ataman,

I am not crazy about Orban, little "Duce" either. I find it funny that the majority of Hungarians expect their economic salvation after his re-election sometime in April.
In a year from now some big disillusionment will surely set in.

Ataman,

I am not crazy about Orban, little "Duce" either. I find it funny that the majority of Hungarians expect their economic salvation after his re-election sometime in April.
In a year from now some big disillusionment will surely set in.
(Joe, 10 November 2009 14:54)

Yeah it is really so tragicomic to watch all those peole hoping something from top.Have not they learned in the last 20 years that the all thing is a big puppet show?All parties serve the same interests does not matter weather they wear pseudoliberal,pseudosocialist or pseudonationalistic coat.Orbán is an undisputed champion of verbal karate.
As to average folks they should know the good all saying strech your legs as far as the end of your blanket.In better times they should have economized and not bought everything but the kitchen sink on cerdit.These things are more important than hoping anything from elections and thievs ruling the country.

"Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!
(aRTa, 10 November 2009 12:54) ..."

>>> tHoUgH i KnOw ThAt It WoUlD bE yOuR gEnUinE wIsH...
I can assure you that "restoring of Tito's communists nothing" is NOT the condition for EU integration and even if it would be, we surely would care no less.

And just a few days ago, people here were saying this is the opening salvo for Vojvodina's "independence".

Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!
(aRTa, 10 November 2009 12:54)

Lol. No it isn't. And even if it is then the EU is confirming the claims of critics that it is the EUSSR.

Parties favouring pre-Slobo status (Canaks LSV and some parties with less then 1% of the vote) obtain less then 10% of the vote in Vojvodina.

More people vote for status quo parties DS and parties favouring abolishing autonomy SRS and DSS.

to bad and no statute for nobody ask the entire population what they want and not the parliment and these other people.

veki,

You sould realize that the Hungarians by far are the biggest minority in Vojvodina.
(Joe, 10 November 2009 15:58)

Yeah, but Hungarian + Serbian fat cats of Vojvodina are by far the smallest and in numbers the least significant, I would say, dwarf minority.

What damage they can do is an other question. Here I suspect, the Serbian fat cats of Vojvodina meow the loudest because they would benefit the most.

Hungarians are excellent (for these fat kitties) to get the blame if anything goes wrong. We can see, that average Serb is already pretty much scared of what going on and they already have the opinion "yes, that's for sure the work of Hungarian minority there".

In the reality, it's the work of their own local fat cats, many (ex) communists. Plus some little "help" from Viktor Orbán because he as usual needs some "visibility". IMO, the VMSZ (Union of Vojvodina Hungarians) should follow their own interests and completely ignore Viktor Orbán's FIDESZ. FIDESZ is to serve their "Mini-Duce", not some Hungarians somewhere else. If at times it looks like FIDESZ is mingling with VMSZ - that is not because of some deep patriotic feelings or because of some "Great Hungary" idea, it's because for some political reason Orbán thinks, he should play the Vojvodina-Hungarian card in his domestic (Hungarian) political poker.

I restricted myself to "Duce" and left Hungarian "Führers" ( = "Kosovo is Hungary") out intentionally. They are loud, violent but as "significant" as Serbian "Führer" Davidovic. Besides, the "Führer" got in PS and SU what deserved... ;-)

There is nothing, what would satisfy Viktorka (little Viktor) ambitions. He is nicknamed "mini-Duce" for a good reason.

With VMSZ the problem is, they are often regarded as FIDESZ "outlet" in Serbia. If that's the case, they are better off this way. Because there is only one boss in FIDESZ and István Pásztor hopefully knows that he is better off the way he is now.

We should not forget that the demographic clock in Vojvodina is ticking against fellow Hungaians,Slovaks and Croatians.
While throughout the 90s ethnic cleansings happened in the balkans through force,the Vojvodinian Serbs quietly managed to increase their share in the population from 55% to over 73% and it is growing.
In a few years 90% of the fertile Vojvodinian ground will be Serbian inhabited.
So this "minority" problem will be solved very quietly and in a natural process in our favor.

Also that only Shandors and Istvans of all minorities are the loudest when comes down to further 'pushing boundaries' of the new statute.
Where are the Serbs, where are other minorities, where is the opposition?
(veki, 10 November 2009 15:03)

This is just the question how fat is that cat. Some fat cats want to be fatter.
As already proven, from all minorities (and majorities) these "Shandors and Istvans" can shoot down the F-117-s the best.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoltan_Dani

But Dani Zoltán is not a fat cat, "just" a decent cook with excellent engineering skills.

"mini-Duce" relates to Viktor Orban in Hungary not to Pasztor in Vojvodina...

(Joe, 10 November 2009 14:46)..."


>>> No worries. Still applicable.

One "mini-Duce" resembles the other.

This is just the question how fat is that cat. Some fat cats want to be fatter.
As already proven, from all minorities (and majorities) these "Shandors and Istvans" can shoot down the F-117-s the best.

[link]

But Dani Zoltán is not a fat cat, "just" a decent cook with excellent engineering skills.
(Ataman, 10 November 2009 18:26)

Please do not mention Sándors,Istváns and other seggfejs on the same page with Zoli.They are not in the same legue:The first ones are nobodys who care only about their pockets the letter one is a great fighter and a fascinating personality.You can simetimes bump into him at aeronautical museum(where the part of that invisible wonder can be found) next to belgrade airport when he happens not to work in bakery.Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).

"We should not forget that the demographic clock in Vojvodina is ticking against fellow Hungaians,Slovaks and Croatians.
While throughout the 90s ethnic cleansings happened in the balkans through force,the Vojvodinian Serbs quietly managed to increase their share in the population from 55% to over 73% and it is growing." CG

And conveniently you omit to mention that the percentage "quietly" changed because you sent most of your refugies from Croatia, Bosnia and Kosovo to Vojvodina to dilute the ethnic composition.
But this process of sending Serbs to Vojvodina didn't start in the nineties. It started already in the twenties.

Ataman+Joe,

Now that we write about Orbán on this forum I wonder if you have read any of his biographies.I would recommend the following one http://www.regikonyvek.hu/book.php?id=31368

Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).
(szemi, 10 November 2009 19:04)

You forgot Gurkhas from Nepal.

Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).
(szemi, 10 November 2009 19:04)

You forgot Gurkhas from Nepal.
(Ataman, 11 November 2009 14:16)

Well of course there are many other great fighters but I mentioned the 4 above because as opposed to ghurkas I myself have direct experiance with them no cultural barriers and all are somehow close to my heart and mentality.

Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!

Well Pastor, be sure not to move "the boundaries" too far, what would be your secret dream, otherwise we may limit your "boundaries" to the extension of the walls of the local prison. Serbia surely needs no more separatists neither we will tolerate them.

Serbia is very much inn, for the introduction of constructive, qualitative and equal rights regionalisation, but not for the reestablishing by Tito's communist given privileges and so called autonomous quasi states inside the Serbian state, with the main and only communists goal to make Serbia weaker.

The wishes of "Balkan style post communist authoritarian non-democratic and populist politicians" like Pastor, with his nickname "Little Duce" or Canak or Pajtic do not have anything with effective state decetralisation, but with the primitive Balkanization where in, every populist leader will have his own little private country, per his wishes, to rule.
This process happening in Balkans can be adequatelly also called,
Djukanisation.

Pastor's statement in which he is not even grateful to Democratic Party in Belgrade, who gave up very much of its party ideas on the way how to regionalise Serbia and being noticed in a few frustrated speeches by Tadic toward Vojvodina "statute" supporters and in order to satisfy Pajtic, some Vojvodina DS politicians, Canak and ethnic Hungarian leaders, shows the extension of the major mistake they-DS have made in supporting this bill, "statute": they did not gain any ground with Vojvodina ethnic minorities voters and they will loose catastrophically in Central Serbia.
This mistake will surely cost them next election and I believe few more to come and anyhow Vojvodina "statute" will be deleted by popular democratic Referendum which will be called with the next non-DS Government on the power.

Vojvodina "statute" indicating SPECIAL "status" will not manage to happen. In modern Serbia, all Serbians will be equally very SPECIAL.

So long for the wishes of "little Duce"...communism (and fascism) is long over.

"Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!
(aRTa, 10 November 2009 12:54) ..."

>>> tHoUgH i KnOw ThAt It WoUlD bE yOuR gEnUinE wIsH...
I can assure you that "restoring of Tito's communists nothing" is NOT the condition for EU integration and even if it would be, we surely would care no less.

There is nothing, what would satisfy Viktorka (little Viktor) ambitions. He is nicknamed "mini-Duce" for a good reason.

With VMSZ the problem is, they are often regarded as FIDESZ "outlet" in Serbia. If that's the case, they are better off this way. Because there is only one boss in FIDESZ and István Pásztor hopefully knows that he is better off the way he is now.

to bad and no statute for nobody ask the entire population what they want and not the parliment and these other people.

One thing really bothers me and that is when a minority declares not to be happy unless Vojvodina gets full autonomy. Also that only Shandors and Istvans of all minorities are the loudest when comes down to further 'pushing boundaries' of the new statute.
Where are the Serbs, where are other minorities, where is the opposition?

veki,

You sould realize that the Hungarians by far are the biggest minority in Vojvodina.

And just a few days ago, people here were saying this is the opening salvo for Vojvodina's "independence".

Ataman,

I am not crazy about Orban, little "Duce" either. I find it funny that the majority of Hungarians expect their economic salvation after his re-election sometime in April.
In a year from now some big disillusionment will surely set in.
(Joe, 10 November 2009 14:54)

Yeah it is really so tragicomic to watch all those peole hoping something from top.Have not they learned in the last 20 years that the all thing is a big puppet show?All parties serve the same interests does not matter weather they wear pseudoliberal,pseudosocialist or pseudonationalistic coat.Orbán is an undisputed champion of verbal karate.
As to average folks they should know the good all saying strech your legs as far as the end of your blanket.In better times they should have economized and not bought everything but the kitchen sink on cerdit.These things are more important than hoping anything from elections and thievs ruling the country.

We should not forget that the demographic clock in Vojvodina is ticking against fellow Hungaians,Slovaks and Croatians.
While throughout the 90s ethnic cleansings happened in the balkans through force,the Vojvodinian Serbs quietly managed to increase their share in the population from 55% to over 73% and it is growing.
In a few years 90% of the fertile Vojvodinian ground will be Serbian inhabited.
So this "minority" problem will be solved very quietly and in a natural process in our favor.

dean,

"mini-Duce" relates to Viktor Orban in Hungary not to Pasztor in Vojvodina.

And about this so-called autonomy: don't worry about it. Very little, if any will trickle down to the ethnic minorities. It is basically more local power to the Serbs in Novi Sad ....nothing else.

Also that only Shandors and Istvans of all minorities are the loudest when comes down to further 'pushing boundaries' of the new statute.
Where are the Serbs, where are other minorities, where is the opposition?
(veki, 10 November 2009 15:03)

This is just the question how fat is that cat. Some fat cats want to be fatter.
As already proven, from all minorities (and majorities) these "Shandors and Istvans" can shoot down the F-117-s the best.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoltan_Dani

But Dani Zoltán is not a fat cat, "just" a decent cook with excellent engineering skills.

Restoring the same exact status Vojvodina had before Slobo unfairly took away is a condition for EU integration. Soon or later Serbia must do this!
(aRTa, 10 November 2009 12:54)

Lol. No it isn't. And even if it is then the EU is confirming the claims of critics that it is the EUSSR.

Parties favouring pre-Slobo status (Canaks LSV and some parties with less then 1% of the vote) obtain less then 10% of the vote in Vojvodina.

More people vote for status quo parties DS and parties favouring abolishing autonomy SRS and DSS.

"mini-Duce" relates to Viktor Orban in Hungary not to Pasztor in Vojvodina...

(Joe, 10 November 2009 14:46)..."


>>> No worries. Still applicable.

One "mini-Duce" resembles the other.

The Hungarians are hypocrites. They're saying oh we support autonomy and this doesn't go far enough, yet when Dinkic proposed the regionalization law they supported it even though autonomists viewed it as an attack on autonomy (i.e. decreasing the level and equalizing the pwoers of Vojvodina with the rest of Serbia). And if they really were autonomists as Pastor claims wouldn't they be against the bill like Canak.

Pastor is doing this for his own interests, god only knows what concession he is getting this time.

Any ways. This bill occured because it is required by law and for DS to placate the interests of Vojvodina DS.

Ones there is a new parlimanet and the regionalization law is implmeented, this law will no longer be in effect.

veki,

You sould realize that the Hungarians by far are the biggest minority in Vojvodina.
(Joe, 10 November 2009 15:58)

Yeah, but Hungarian + Serbian fat cats of Vojvodina are by far the smallest and in numbers the least significant, I would say, dwarf minority.

What damage they can do is an other question. Here I suspect, the Serbian fat cats of Vojvodina meow the loudest because they would benefit the most.

Hungarians are excellent (for these fat kitties) to get the blame if anything goes wrong. We can see, that average Serb is already pretty much scared of what going on and they already have the opinion "yes, that's for sure the work of Hungarian minority there".

In the reality, it's the work of their own local fat cats, many (ex) communists. Plus some little "help" from Viktor Orbán because he as usual needs some "visibility". IMO, the VMSZ (Union of Vojvodina Hungarians) should follow their own interests and completely ignore Viktor Orbán's FIDESZ. FIDESZ is to serve their "Mini-Duce", not some Hungarians somewhere else. If at times it looks like FIDESZ is mingling with VMSZ - that is not because of some deep patriotic feelings or because of some "Great Hungary" idea, it's because for some political reason Orbán thinks, he should play the Vojvodina-Hungarian card in his domestic (Hungarian) political poker.

I restricted myself to "Duce" and left Hungarian "Führers" ( = "Kosovo is Hungary") out intentionally. They are loud, violent but as "significant" as Serbian "Führer" Davidovic. Besides, the "Führer" got in PS and SU what deserved... ;-)

Ataman,

I am not crazy about Orban, little "Duce" either. I find it funny that the majority of Hungarians expect their economic salvation after his re-election sometime in April.
In a year from now some big disillusionment will surely set in.

This is just the question how fat is that cat. Some fat cats want to be fatter.
As already proven, from all minorities (and majorities) these "Shandors and Istvans" can shoot down the F-117-s the best.

[link]

But Dani Zoltán is not a fat cat, "just" a decent cook with excellent engineering skills.
(Ataman, 10 November 2009 18:26)

Please do not mention Sándors,Istváns and other seggfejs on the same page with Zoli.They are not in the same legue:The first ones are nobodys who care only about their pockets the letter one is a great fighter and a fascinating personality.You can simetimes bump into him at aeronautical museum(where the part of that invisible wonder can be found) next to belgrade airport when he happens not to work in bakery.Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).

Ataman+Joe,

Now that we write about Orbán on this forum I wonder if you have read any of his biographies.I would recommend the following one http://www.regikonyvek.hu/book.php?id=31368

Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).
(szemi, 10 November 2009 19:04)

You forgot Gurkhas from Nepal.

Otherwise if I had to set up an effective army I would base it on serbs,székelys, cossacks and górals(polish highlanders).
(szemi, 10 November 2009 19:04)

You forgot Gurkhas from Nepal.
(Ataman, 11 November 2009 14:16)

Well of course there are many other great fighters but I mentioned the 4 above because as opposed to ghurkas I myself have direct experiance with them no cultural barriers and all are somehow close to my heart and mentality.

"We should not forget that the demographic clock in Vojvodina is ticking against fellow Hungaians,Slovaks and Croatians.
While throughout the 90s ethnic cleansings happened in the balkans through force,the Vojvodinian Serbs quietly managed to increase their share in the population from 55% to over 73% and it is growing." CG

And conveniently you omit to mention that the percentage "quietly" changed because you sent most of your refugies from Croatia, Bosnia and Kosovo to Vojvodina to dilute the ethnic composition.
But this process of sending Serbs to Vojvodina didn't start in the nineties. It started already in the twenties.