Ban: UN to stay in Kosovo

"He added that the UN would remain in Kosovo in line with resolution 1244."

This comment speaks for itself!

Russia has already stated that it will not extend the mandate of the NATO court beyond 2010 so unless Putin has changed his mind, I really can't see it going beyond the end of next year.

Also, why is the stability in the North being mentioned? We rarely hear about any problems there unless the Serbians get provoked. The issue here is that Serbians are in complete control and some people don't seem to like that. I expect more provocations and stand-offs until everyone accepts the reality of Serbian control.

"He added that the UN would remain in Kosovo in line with resolution 1244. "

So Kosovo is still a UN governed Serbian province!

But we already know that!

About UNMIK in 2013...don't worry about it! Albanian politicians is useless in Kosovo anyway,no one listen or gives a damn about them there. That statement would make more sense, Mr/Mrs commonense, don't you agree?

Ron:

Well said! Some albans just don't seem to get it.

Genti: "Ron,
I'll educate you...
Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244."

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

Is your argument that 1244 was made with Yugoslavia and not Serbia? If so, it has been securely established that Serbia is the legal successor state.

What other argument do you have? That Res. 1244 allows for self determination? That is only within the overall framework of 1244 which states explicitly that under international law Serbia retains sovereignty over Kosovo. Therefore any independence has to be in agreement with Serbia and the UN.

So what's left? Perhaps that after the events 10 years ago, the Kosovo Albanian population can no longer live under a Serbian government? But this was a totally different government, not to mention how much baseless spin was used by the 'international community' at the time which can now be easily disproved.

Yes there were atrocities, but nowhere near the numbers used to get public support. And the atrocities by the KLA were disgracefully labelled as 'revenge attacks' and just overlooked.

And couldn't the Serbian and Roma and other populations in Kosovo say that they are not prepared to live under the Kosovo Albanian government when they are still today victimised and marginalised?

Have I missed an argument here? Please enlighten.

It's OK Ban,we understand your situation there at the UN,knowing your surrounding there...!Ban,as the head of the UN ,you did a very good job when it comes to Kosovo,you choose the silence on Feb./17/2008,(silence = Pro independence)! About UNMIK in 2013...don't worry about it!UNMIK is useless in Kosovo anyway,no one listen or gives a damn about them there.

Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.

Declare all you want, Albanians. It means nothing without a UN seat. Didn't you guys already go through this declaration thing 20 or 30 years ago? How far did that go? Remember, a minimum of 2 sides have to agree, to have an agreement. Otherwise, it means nothing.

"Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55) "

But 1244 clearly states that Kosovo is part of Yugoslavia, now Serbia.
If 1244 leaves room for an independent Kosovo without Serbia agreeing, then why the US tried to 'delete' 1244 five (!) times... Without success. And then they simply ignored 1244.

Well, please play by the rules. Also if the rules are not in your advantage!

Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55)
What "accordance"???? According to Resolution 1244 Kosovo is part of Serbia. So every unilateral declaration of independence is AGAINST Resolution 1244.

Genti - And I'll educate you. If you had gained independence then as an independent state you would be running your own affairs. The fact that the UN is calling the shots along with EULEX says it all.

Actions speak louder than words so it's clear for all to see that Kosovo may (at the moment) be independent of Serbia, but it's a UN state, not an Albanian one.

And a temporary state at that when Serbia wins it's case at the ICVJ in the next 12 or 18 months or so.

Welcome back to Serbia!!

"Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed. No funding = you leave. Anyway, it's best that you stay: you are irrelevant. no one asks or cares about you but you spend some money there so you help the local grocery stores.
(aRta, 9 October 2009 22:43) "

Well, UN will stay in Kosovo I guess until there is a mutual agreed deal.

And in 1999 the Albanians welcomed UN. And now the UN is irrelevant and must leave? Wow, talking about being unthankful!

What a double standards a lot of Albanians have.

You welcomed the UN in 1999. That is fine. Well, the UN is in Kosovo to stay as UN is governing this Serbian province.

That was the deal back in 1999. So don't complain now!

"Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55)"

Genti,

You should not pretend to be smart and think that you have the wisdom to educate a person like Ron. Please check out the following link (and actually read it once for Pete's sake) and transcripts out of it.

http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N99/172/89/PDF/N9917289.pdf?OpenElement

"Reaffirming the commitment of all Member States to the sovereignty and territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia and the other States of the region, as set out in the Helsinki Final Act and annex 2, Reaffirming the call in previous resolutions for substantial autonomy and
meaningful self-administration for Kosovo,"

"(a) Promoting the establishment, pending a final settlement, of
substantial autonomy and self-government in Kosovo, taking full account of
annex 2 and of the Rambouillet accords (S/1999/648);"

All countries that have accepted the illegal UDI know this and they will withdraw their support once the ICJ has decided that the UID is not in accordance with UNSC 1244. Final settlements are made between the two parties involved, not by one party not willing to do anything because they have the temporarily support of an economic and military power that has (self)interest in the region and tells one party not to do anything (we all know which party I am referring to and it is not Serbia). If Obama is really serious about his undeserved Nobel Peace Prize he will accept the decision of the ICJ and withdraw the US support for Kosovo. If not, he should give back his Nobel Peace Prize immediately, because he chose to ignore International Law (and he has a law degree from Harvard Law School and so he should know better if he has some intelligence) and has decide to continue a frozen conflict in a volatile region of Europe.

I suppose that if the UDI meant something and 1244 meant nothing, the 'government' of Kosovo could prove it by kicking out EULEX, NATO and the UN as being superfluous to requirements.

... try it !

“There is no set deadline for withdrawal. We have a Security Council mandate,“ Ban stressed.

Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed. No funding = you leave. Anyway, it's best that you stay: you are irrelevant. no one asks or cares about you but you spend some money there so you help the local grocery stores.

Tani (Kosovo) wrote:
[quote]Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)[unquote]


Strange. I've been to Kosovo about 10 times in the past 3 years, 6 of them since February 2008. Not once have I had to obtain a visa - unless you count the arrival stamp at Belgrade or Skopje airport and/or Tabanovce BCP.

aRta:
> "Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed.

No, wrong 'aRta' (yet again). Funding is approved (or otherwise) by the UN GA - SC has nothing to do with it.


KOSOVARi:
> Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.

That's nice.. & also pretty meaningless.


"I will say it again that UN at this time has only paper pushers in Mitro and small office in Prishtina, which everybody ignores them like they do not exist.
(Kosova-USA, 10 October 2009 13:13) "

Well there you have.. straight from the 'four-legged animal's mouth.

ps: general saying is 'straight from the horse's mouth', but feel free to substitute.


pss:
>..and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?

Joking right?

US's 'uniqueness' rationale is nothing but spin, as is their 'interpretation' of 1244. May have been useful 'sound-bytes' for the toadying western-press, but 'spinning' in front of the ICJ panel will only make their 'legal-eagle's look silly.

I would like to ask Ban Ki moon , what UN forces is he talking about. You got some paper pushers in the north and you call that UN Forces!? What a joke.

pss: "Very curious as to where you got your information?? None of the legal arguments have been released for public scutiny, and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?"

I read. Plus there are only limited arguments to use, all of which have been aired numerous times.

Name me one which I haven't included.

Kosovo-USA asked:
Please, tell me when? What is UN function, really?

Answer:
To determine whether the world recognises Kosovo as a sovereign and independent state or NOT.

So far, both the Security Council and the General Assembly have decided Kosovo is not.

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)
(Tani (Kosova), 11 October 2009 08:08)

I promise you. If I ever visit Serbia I will also try to visit the province of Kosovo.

We will have a drink then in the provincial capital. And hopefully your country Serbia is number 2 at world cup then!

We got a deal?

As long as there is a UN office in Kosovo and of course NATO troops there to enforce, Serbia cannot enter or control Kosovo again!

Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.
(KOSOVARi, 10 October 2009 07:30)

At least they are STATES. While Kosovo is a PROVINCE!

And again: UN is ruling Kosovo!

Off topic: to all in Kosovo: hope your team Serbia wins tonight against Romania! Hope everyone in Pristhina will party on the streets when their team Serbia has won!

There is no military force to speak of, but its their administration. They run Kosovo or is this something new to the Kosovars?
(sj, 10 October 2009 14:14)


When was the last time SRSG Zanier said that this or that legislation that was approved by Kosova Parlament is null and void???
Please, tell me when? He can't even make an appointment to meet PM Thaqi or President Sejdiu. What is UN function, really?

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)
(Tani (Kosova), 11 October 2009 08:08)

It's very good that kosovo's footbal teams (like FK Partizan Kosovska Mitrovica, FK Mokra Gora Zubin Potok, FK Ibar Leposavić or FK Brezovica) play in serbian football League :) It's very good that KiM basketball clubs play in serbian league. These clubs play in one of strongest balkan leagues (mayby only Greek leagues are strongest).

I would like to tell Kosovo-USA that the UN force that Ban Ki Moon is talking about is the one sent by the United Nations whose headquarters is in New York.

It is the same United Nations that has a Security Council that has not decided to accept Kosovo as a sovereign and independent state.

It is the same United Nations with a General Assembly that recently had their yearly get-together. The same Assembly that didn't invite any Kosovo representative to speak at. An Assembly that ALL sovereign states and members are invited to speak at.

It is the same United Nations that provides the EULEX mission and the Pristina authorities with international legitimacy.

Do you now know which UN force it is?

What a joke!

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

(kate, 9 October 2009 20:10)

Very curious as to where you got your information?? None of the legal arguments have been released for public scutiny, and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?

Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.

To all in Kosovo:

Congratulations with the victory of your team Serbia in the WC football match!

Serbia, that means YOU!, goes to the World Championship!

Hope everyone from Nis to Belgrade to Prishina will support the national Serbian team!

To all the Albanian contriubtors to this debate, the UN will remain in Kosovo with the full approval of your US, UK and EU friends. Seeing is believing, just keep watching.

By the way the days of wine and roses are over and harder times are arriving for your Kosovars.

Do you now know which UN force it is?

What a joke!
(Bob's Your Uncle, 10 October 2009 02:04)


I don't think you undestood my coment. UN has offices in many countries as we speak, but having UN ground forces it does not on in few countries. UN does not have ground forces like it use to.

I will say it again that UN at this time has only paper pushers in Mitro and small office in Prishtina, which everybody ignores them like they do not exist.

pss:
> The US argument will prove sound at the ICJ, however for those who "can't see the forest, for the trees" it will never be clear.

So funny & yet so tragic.

My personal opinion is that the ICJ will probably rule that the K-albanian UDI was illegal, but will qualify that judgement in that there were extenuating circumstances in this particular case (rightly or wrongly depending on your viewpoint/allegiance).

But I also think they will go on to say that even though there were 'extenuating circumstances', these circumstances cannot by themselves be enough to justify the UDI - as they simply cannot afford to set this particular precedent.

To use your analogy, all you are seeing is a 'thicket or copse' of trees, & not the whole 'forest'.

So your words are 'funny' in that they apply so aptly to you, & 'tragic' in that you cannot allow yourself to see it.

There is no military force to speak of, but its their administration. They run Kosovo or is this something new to the Kosovars?

kate, peter,
The US argument will prove sound at the ICJ, however for those who "can't see the forest, for the trees" it will never be clear.

To all in Kosovo:

Congratulations with the victory of your team Serbia in the WC football match!

Serbia, that means YOU!, goes to the World Championship!

Hope everyone from Nis to Belgrade to Prishina will support the national Serbian team!
(Ron, 11 October 2009 00:55)

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)

I promise you. If I ever visit Serbia I will also try to visit the province of Kosovo.

We will have a drink then in the provincial capital. And hopefully your country Serbia is number 2 at world cup then!

We got a deal?
(Ron, 11 October 2009 16:59)

Sure Ron, we got the deal. Once you come in Kosova, we will even make a trip to Tirana which is only 2 hours driving. You'll see with your eyes how much have progressed Albania and Kosova together. :)

peter, I too think your response is amusing and tragic. To those who think that property rights outweigh human rights are doomed to live in a very tragic existence.
I also believe there will be a very complicated opinion given at the ICJ, but it would not matter to some. I mean the UN created a document that severs all control of Serbia over Kosovo and some believe it is a pro Serbian resolution--go figure!

peter, a prime example would be those who see that Resolution 1244 says Reaffirming the commitment of all Member States to the sovereignty and
territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia and the other States
of the region, as set out in the Helsinki Final Act and annex 2, as a permanent guarantee that Kosovo will forever be a part of Serbia (the tree)
and ignores the rest of the resolution that demands the withdrawal of all Serbian forces and police, turns all control of Kosovo over to the UN and protected by NATO which bombed Serbia to bring about the withdrawal. Gave the UN the mandate to establish a democratically elected self govt of Kosovo and turn over powers to them. Insuring that Serbia would never again control Kosovo. (the forest)

Sure Ron, we got the deal. Once you come in Kosova, we will even make a trip to Tirana which is only 2 hours driving. You'll see with your eyes how much have progressed Albania and Kosova together. :)
(Tani (Kosova), 12 October 2009 08:02)

Fine! I hope I can ever visit the Serbian province of Kosovo.

It's OK Ban,we understand your situation there at the UN,knowing your surrounding there...!Ban,as the head of the UN ,you did a very good job when it comes to Kosovo,you choose the silence on Feb./17/2008,(silence = Pro independence)! About UNMIK in 2013...don't worry about it!UNMIK is useless in Kosovo anyway,no one listen or gives a damn about them there.

Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.

I would like to ask Ban Ki moon , what UN forces is he talking about. You got some paper pushers in the north and you call that UN Forces!? What a joke.

“There is no set deadline for withdrawal. We have a Security Council mandate,“ Ban stressed.

Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed. No funding = you leave. Anyway, it's best that you stay: you are irrelevant. no one asks or cares about you but you spend some money there so you help the local grocery stores.

Russia has already stated that it will not extend the mandate of the NATO court beyond 2010 so unless Putin has changed his mind, I really can't see it going beyond the end of next year.

Also, why is the stability in the North being mentioned? We rarely hear about any problems there unless the Serbians get provoked. The issue here is that Serbians are in complete control and some people don't seem to like that. I expect more provocations and stand-offs until everyone accepts the reality of Serbian control.

"He added that the UN would remain in Kosovo in line with resolution 1244. "

So Kosovo is still a UN governed Serbian province!

But we already know that!

"He added that the UN would remain in Kosovo in line with resolution 1244."

This comment speaks for itself!

Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.

Ron:

Well said! Some albans just don't seem to get it.

As long as there is a UN office in Kosovo and of course NATO troops there to enforce, Serbia cannot enter or control Kosovo again!

Do you now know which UN force it is?

What a joke!
(Bob's Your Uncle, 10 October 2009 02:04)


I don't think you undestood my coment. UN has offices in many countries as we speak, but having UN ground forces it does not on in few countries. UN does not have ground forces like it use to.

I will say it again that UN at this time has only paper pushers in Mitro and small office in Prishtina, which everybody ignores them like they do not exist.

About UNMIK in 2013...don't worry about it! Albanian politicians is useless in Kosovo anyway,no one listen or gives a damn about them there. That statement would make more sense, Mr/Mrs commonense, don't you agree?

"Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55) "

But 1244 clearly states that Kosovo is part of Yugoslavia, now Serbia.
If 1244 leaves room for an independent Kosovo without Serbia agreeing, then why the US tried to 'delete' 1244 five (!) times... Without success. And then they simply ignored 1244.

Well, please play by the rules. Also if the rules are not in your advantage!

Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55)
What "accordance"???? According to Resolution 1244 Kosovo is part of Serbia. So every unilateral declaration of independence is AGAINST Resolution 1244.

Genti: "Ron,
I'll educate you...
Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244."

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

Is your argument that 1244 was made with Yugoslavia and not Serbia? If so, it has been securely established that Serbia is the legal successor state.

What other argument do you have? That Res. 1244 allows for self determination? That is only within the overall framework of 1244 which states explicitly that under international law Serbia retains sovereignty over Kosovo. Therefore any independence has to be in agreement with Serbia and the UN.

So what's left? Perhaps that after the events 10 years ago, the Kosovo Albanian population can no longer live under a Serbian government? But this was a totally different government, not to mention how much baseless spin was used by the 'international community' at the time which can now be easily disproved.

Yes there were atrocities, but nowhere near the numbers used to get public support. And the atrocities by the KLA were disgracefully labelled as 'revenge attacks' and just overlooked.

And couldn't the Serbian and Roma and other populations in Kosovo say that they are not prepared to live under the Kosovo Albanian government when they are still today victimised and marginalised?

Have I missed an argument here? Please enlighten.

I would like to tell Kosovo-USA that the UN force that Ban Ki Moon is talking about is the one sent by the United Nations whose headquarters is in New York.

It is the same United Nations that has a Security Council that has not decided to accept Kosovo as a sovereign and independent state.

It is the same United Nations with a General Assembly that recently had their yearly get-together. The same Assembly that didn't invite any Kosovo representative to speak at. An Assembly that ALL sovereign states and members are invited to speak at.

It is the same United Nations that provides the EULEX mission and the Pristina authorities with international legitimacy.

Do you now know which UN force it is?

What a joke!

"Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed. No funding = you leave. Anyway, it's best that you stay: you are irrelevant. no one asks or cares about you but you spend some money there so you help the local grocery stores.
(aRta, 9 October 2009 22:43) "

Well, UN will stay in Kosovo I guess until there is a mutual agreed deal.

And in 1999 the Albanians welcomed UN. And now the UN is irrelevant and must leave? Wow, talking about being unthankful!

What a double standards a lot of Albanians have.

You welcomed the UN in 1999. That is fine. Well, the UN is in Kosovo to stay as UN is governing this Serbian province.

That was the deal back in 1999. So don't complain now!

To all in Kosovo:

Congratulations with the victory of your team Serbia in the WC football match!

Serbia, that means YOU!, goes to the World Championship!

Hope everyone from Nis to Belgrade to Prishina will support the national Serbian team!
(Ron, 11 October 2009 00:55)

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)

"Ron,

I'll educate you...

Kosovo has declared independence in accordance to resolution 1244.
(genti, 9 October 2009 16:55)"

Genti,

You should not pretend to be smart and think that you have the wisdom to educate a person like Ron. Please check out the following link (and actually read it once for Pete's sake) and transcripts out of it.

http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N99/172/89/PDF/N9917289.pdf?OpenElement

"Reaffirming the commitment of all Member States to the sovereignty and territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia and the other States of the region, as set out in the Helsinki Final Act and annex 2, Reaffirming the call in previous resolutions for substantial autonomy and
meaningful self-administration for Kosovo,"

"(a) Promoting the establishment, pending a final settlement, of
substantial autonomy and self-government in Kosovo, taking full account of
annex 2 and of the Rambouillet accords (S/1999/648);"

All countries that have accepted the illegal UDI know this and they will withdraw their support once the ICJ has decided that the UID is not in accordance with UNSC 1244. Final settlements are made between the two parties involved, not by one party not willing to do anything because they have the temporarily support of an economic and military power that has (self)interest in the region and tells one party not to do anything (we all know which party I am referring to and it is not Serbia). If Obama is really serious about his undeserved Nobel Peace Prize he will accept the decision of the ICJ and withdraw the US support for Kosovo. If not, he should give back his Nobel Peace Prize immediately, because he chose to ignore International Law (and he has a law degree from Harvard Law School and so he should know better if he has some intelligence) and has decide to continue a frozen conflict in a volatile region of Europe.

Genti - And I'll educate you. If you had gained independence then as an independent state you would be running your own affairs. The fact that the UN is calling the shots along with EULEX says it all.

Actions speak louder than words so it's clear for all to see that Kosovo may (at the moment) be independent of Serbia, but it's a UN state, not an Albanian one.

And a temporary state at that when Serbia wins it's case at the ICVJ in the next 12 or 18 months or so.

Welcome back to Serbia!!

I suppose that if the UDI meant something and 1244 meant nothing, the 'government' of Kosovo could prove it by kicking out EULEX, NATO and the UN as being superfluous to requirements.

... try it !

Declare all you want, Albanians. It means nothing without a UN seat. Didn't you guys already go through this declaration thing 20 or 30 years ago? How far did that go? Remember, a minimum of 2 sides have to agree, to have an agreement. Otherwise, it means nothing.

Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.
(KOSOVARi, 10 October 2009 07:30)

At least they are STATES. While Kosovo is a PROVINCE!

And again: UN is ruling Kosovo!

Off topic: to all in Kosovo: hope your team Serbia wins tonight against Romania! Hope everyone in Pristhina will party on the streets when their team Serbia has won!

To all the Albanian contriubtors to this debate, the UN will remain in Kosovo with the full approval of your US, UK and EU friends. Seeing is believing, just keep watching.

By the way the days of wine and roses are over and harder times are arriving for your Kosovars.

There is no military force to speak of, but its their administration. They run Kosovo or is this something new to the Kosovars?
(sj, 10 October 2009 14:14)


When was the last time SRSG Zanier said that this or that legislation that was approved by Kosova Parlament is null and void???
Please, tell me when? He can't even make an appointment to meet PM Thaqi or President Sejdiu. What is UN function, really?

kate, peter,
The US argument will prove sound at the ICJ, however for those who "can't see the forest, for the trees" it will never be clear.

There is no military force to speak of, but its their administration. They run Kosovo or is this something new to the Kosovars?

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

How on earth do you figure that? If that was the case, then why are the US and the other nations who rushed to recognise, now wheeling in the best legal people available to try and build a convincing argument? And still having problems.

Why have the countries supporting Serbia at the ICJ got masses of individual and varied legally based arguments, while the US argument is based on non existent 'exceptions' and morally based spin?

(kate, 9 October 2009 20:10)

Very curious as to where you got your information?? None of the legal arguments have been released for public scutiny, and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?

pss: "Very curious as to where you got your information?? None of the legal arguments have been released for public scutiny, and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?"

I read. Plus there are only limited arguments to use, all of which have been aired numerous times.

Name me one which I haven't included.

To all in Kosovo:

Congratulations with the victory of your team Serbia in the WC football match!

Serbia, that means YOU!, goes to the World Championship!

Hope everyone from Nis to Belgrade to Prishina will support the national Serbian team!

aRta:
> "Wrong Ban, US, UK and France must agree to the yearly funding or else you are screwed.

No, wrong 'aRta' (yet again). Funding is approved (or otherwise) by the UN GA - SC has nothing to do with it.


KOSOVARi:
> Ban is talking about UN in Kosova until 2013....who cares? For all I care you can go to a country that really needs your pathetic beuracratic garbage, like: Serbia, Iran, N Korea, Venezuela, etc.

That's nice.. & also pretty meaningless.


"I will say it again that UN at this time has only paper pushers in Mitro and small office in Prishtina, which everybody ignores them like they do not exist.
(Kosova-USA, 10 October 2009 13:13) "

Well there you have.. straight from the 'four-legged animal's mouth.

ps: general saying is 'straight from the horse's mouth', but feel free to substitute.


pss:
>..and how do you know that the US is having a problem making their argument?

Joking right?

US's 'uniqueness' rationale is nothing but spin, as is their 'interpretation' of 1244. May have been useful 'sound-bytes' for the toadying western-press, but 'spinning' in front of the ICJ panel will only make their 'legal-eagle's look silly.

Kosovo-USA asked:
Please, tell me when? What is UN function, really?

Answer:
To determine whether the world recognises Kosovo as a sovereign and independent state or NOT.

So far, both the Security Council and the General Assembly have decided Kosovo is not.

peter, I too think your response is amusing and tragic. To those who think that property rights outweigh human rights are doomed to live in a very tragic existence.
I also believe there will be a very complicated opinion given at the ICJ, but it would not matter to some. I mean the UN created a document that severs all control of Serbia over Kosovo and some believe it is a pro Serbian resolution--go figure!

peter, a prime example would be those who see that Resolution 1244 says Reaffirming the commitment of all Member States to the sovereignty and
territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia and the other States
of the region, as set out in the Helsinki Final Act and annex 2, as a permanent guarantee that Kosovo will forever be a part of Serbia (the tree)
and ignores the rest of the resolution that demands the withdrawal of all Serbian forces and police, turns all control of Kosovo over to the UN and protected by NATO which bombed Serbia to bring about the withdrawal. Gave the UN the mandate to establish a democratically elected self govt of Kosovo and turn over powers to them. Insuring that Serbia would never again control Kosovo. (the forest)

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)
(Tani (Kosova), 11 October 2009 08:08)

It's very good that kosovo's footbal teams (like FK Partizan Kosovska Mitrovica, FK Mokra Gora Zubin Potok, FK Ibar Leposavić or FK Brezovica) play in serbian football League :) It's very good that KiM basketball clubs play in serbian league. These clubs play in one of strongest balkan leagues (mayby only Greek leagues are strongest).

pss:
> The US argument will prove sound at the ICJ, however for those who "can't see the forest, for the trees" it will never be clear.

So funny & yet so tragic.

My personal opinion is that the ICJ will probably rule that the K-albanian UDI was illegal, but will qualify that judgement in that there were extenuating circumstances in this particular case (rightly or wrongly depending on your viewpoint/allegiance).

But I also think they will go on to say that even though there were 'extenuating circumstances', these circumstances cannot by themselves be enough to justify the UDI - as they simply cannot afford to set this particular precedent.

To use your analogy, all you are seeing is a 'thicket or copse' of trees, & not the whole 'forest'.

So your words are 'funny' in that they apply so aptly to you, & 'tragic' in that you cannot allow yourself to see it.

Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)
(Tani (Kosova), 11 October 2009 08:08)

I promise you. If I ever visit Serbia I will also try to visit the province of Kosovo.

We will have a drink then in the provincial capital. And hopefully your country Serbia is number 2 at world cup then!

We got a deal?

I promise you. If I ever visit Serbia I will also try to visit the province of Kosovo.

We will have a drink then in the provincial capital. And hopefully your country Serbia is number 2 at world cup then!

We got a deal?
(Ron, 11 October 2009 16:59)

Sure Ron, we got the deal. Once you come in Kosova, we will even make a trip to Tirana which is only 2 hours driving. You'll see with your eyes how much have progressed Albania and Kosova together. :)

Tani (Kosovo) wrote:
[quote]Come visit Kosova once in a while. I promise you that you won't be disappointed. Just make sure you get a valid visa before you enter :)[unquote]


Strange. I've been to Kosovo about 10 times in the past 3 years, 6 of them since February 2008. Not once have I had to obtain a visa - unless you count the arrival stamp at Belgrade or Skopje airport and/or Tabanovce BCP.

Sure Ron, we got the deal. Once you come in Kosova, we will even make a trip to Tirana which is only 2 hours driving. You'll see with your eyes how much have progressed Albania and Kosova together. :)
(Tani (Kosova), 12 October 2009 08:02)

Fine! I hope I can ever visit the Serbian province of Kosovo.