Mesić: Relations in region worsening

But... I thought an independent Kosovo would bring stability and peace to the region? Once again American politics are failing. No justice, no peace!

Mesic recognizes Kossovo but now he has problem that RS wants independence? how hypocritical

Yes, Serbians as a people are the trouble makers of Europe because we strive to be free, independent and do not bow to any wannabe master. Now tell me why Republika Srpska is prospering while Federacija is bankrupt? Federacija had the lions share of investment but still ended up dead so why should Serbians pursue a path to destruction? Sorry, but that's not what we do.

As if anyone is actually giving a damn about what Mesic has to say.

He has enough to deal with in Croatia so he should mind his own business when it comes to what Serbia should do.
Do you hear Serbian president telling Croatia what they should do? I don't support Tadic for president but at least the man has enough class to stay out of other people's business.
Mr Mesic, you could learn a thing or two from him.

Croations just can't live without Serbians!

Are Serbs supposed to be baby sitters for the entire Balkan region. I thought the west cut that umbilical cord.

Enough is enough!

No more breast feeding neighbours.

Oh and by the way, Republic Srpska should have a referendum and separate form the rest of Bosnia. The other entities of Bosnia are nothing more than a boat anchor to the future development of RS Serbs.

Kosovo is Serbian!

My point of view is that all Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone. I mean why should we give a damn about Serbia and her failed policys against it's neighbours ? Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.
(Demi, 7 October 2009 10:35)

Wanting their neighbours territory? There is a reason why there is 100s of Monasteries in Kosovo dating back to the 1300s. If it was albanian land why were Serbs allowed to build so many?
Why is the province named KiM? Why are all the towns named in Serb?
Why are you even trying to secede when you deep down know who the land belongs to, injustice never works and you should know that.
Kosovo is Serbia!

How strange, and to think we were told that Kosovan independence was essential for the stability of the region.

Mesic has always been one of the more intelligent Croat politicians, so perhaps he could work on revoking recognition of Kosovo, where Croatian interests are marginal at best, to support BiH, an issue much closer to home.

Croatian "pretensions or non-pretentions" towards BiH are entirely Craotia's matter and what is Serbia's matter in "BiH" case is entirely Serbia's matter so Mesic would be clearly asked not to expect any proclamation from Serbia's side and particulary not on his suggestion or insistance.

Legitimate Referendum in Republica Srpska calling for Independence, based on the historical "Draft Plan" by Ilija Garasanin, which will unite Serbian lands will be called soon rather then later.
Above simple note just to clear some illussions inplanted by so called EU officials.

Mesić would not object Greater Serbia (that is, BiH, FYROM, Slovenia, Croatia included) if HE would be the President of that country forever.

This is the nature of the beast called "аппаратчик".

He should team up with Sali Berisha, both are branches of the same tree and there is no such thing as "ex-commie".

Well I remember the same Mesic supporting Kosovo independence stating that relations between Serbia and Croatia etc would not be seriously affected.

To be clear that was a mistake in diplomacy - a miscalculation based on a theory that turned out not to be true.

And the connection between Kosovo and Bosnia has been made - whether western countries reject that or not, it is a reality for Bosnian politics. I might add that some Bosniak politicians forsaw what would happen and did not support Kosovo independence.

Of course this particular point isn't really about Kosovo independence, its about whether it was smart for Serbia's neighbours to do so at the time. As Mesic has now pointed out - it clearly was'nt.

Hmmm, I seem to recall the selling point for the lemon we now refer to as the so-called Republic of Kosovo was that its independence would bring stability and peace to the Balkans (at least that's what my armchair historians/politicians were saying). Now all of a sudden Mesic whips out the gusle and weaves another lamentation. Perhaps rushing in to recognize the secession of one state's territory while denying similar rights and privileges to societies in other states really isn't the way to go. Maybe Zagreb should ask itself what's more important: a meaningful strategic partnership with Serbia, it's natural partner in the Balkans, or a tacit approval of US controlled Albanian puppets in Pristina. Serbia Proper could bring more to the table than Kosovo Province ever could.

Break up Serbia? Break up Bosnia. Keep Bosnia whole? Keep Serbia whole. It's as simple as that.

And no, I really don't think any serious politician in the West is going to adopt the brilliant strategy of "Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone" as Demi seems to think. Serbia is the keystone to all of Southeastern Europe. Belgrade is poised to become the Berlin and the Frankfurt of the Balkans. Albanians and Bosnians offer little to Europe other than a chance for NGOs to promote pet projects for a seemingly naive and dependent society.

Time for a major strategic rethink of the region, including a major reorganization of Bosnia and Kosovo province. Both Western projects have clearly failed in producing what they were intended to produce.

"Otherwise Bosnia will remain forever hostage of Serbia."
ben

Everyone in the Balkans are entitled to have their own state apart from the Serbs!
No muslims shall ever again enslave the Serbs!

My point of view is that all Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone. I mean why should we give a damn about Serbia and her failed policys against it's neighbours ? Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.

To all those supporting pseudo multinational states between christians and muslims like Bosnia i will tell you one thing. This will not work in Europe...we have past experience with Cyprus and we all saw what happened. Let these people separate in peace, rather than preserving a corpse state like Bosnia. I wonder who wishes to preserve weak, multinational states that cannot stand in their own feet? hmmmm

Mesic whose nonsense books were published by sorosian Central European University is very similar to albanians that is why they like him.

# I don't think that Mesic considered the legal and justified independent of Kosovo as a impasse.
(Luis, 7 October 2009 15:36)

Legal? My friend, please! It is against Serbian constitution, against international law and against 1244.

And you call that legal?

Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.
(Demi, 7 October 2009 10:35)

let me see:

slovenia and croatia. croatia and bosnia. albania and macedonia. macedonia and greece. macedonia and bulgaria. greece and turkey. how is serbia responsible for these conflicts?

speaking of wanting to steal your neighbour's territory, that's a simplification. both croatia and serbia wanted to take parts of bosnia, but for the most part they wanted to take only parts of bosnia where serbs and croats live and serbs and croats from bosnia supported that idea. which is exactly what albanians wanted in kosovo (and macedonia). the difference is probably that albanians got a better excuse (milosevic) and i guess they still dream about serbia being isolated.

people need to agree if they believe state borders should be along the ethnic lines or the already existing ones. if you apply double standards just because you can it will cause instability. and even more so if you can only because you have support from outide the region which some people will believe can be withdrawn. and if you are going to accept the support from outside the region when it suits you then you have to accpet their decisions that don't suit you. and they want serbia to be the regional leader. and serbia's small neighbours (including "kosova") won't be able to do anything about it. isolating serbia is not an option, i'm afraid. you support big powers making decisions that affect you rather than trying to reach an agreement. it won't always go your way, you know.

i'd prefer to see an agreement, so both serbian and albanian societies can move. you can always talk about independence of kosovo (or whatever other territory) later.

Easy for Mesic to say - since his land grab. Croatia has never been bigger historically since they cleared out the 200k serbs from Krajina. Mesic is just happy no one is looking at him...and deferring attention

Lenard what kind of ground are you preaching from on Bosnia?
Perhaps you could explain about what happened to the famous bridge in Mostar or how it came to be that Bosnian Muslums were stabbed in the back by Croats, the destroyed houses, failed Herceg bosna and so on.

I know you don't like it when you think others are preaching but you spend too much time preaching yourself.

Besides the issue is about Serbo-Croatian relations - an interesting subject. Serbia and Croatia as you know are the most important countries of the region. The rest profit or lose (or live or die even) depending on our relations.

It seems that Mesic realised that recognition of Kosovo was not worth our bad relations.

As I stated previously states of the region really have to think before making such decisions as this. Perhaps Croatia really got something from the US for this, but in the cold light of day realised it was fools gold.

Poor old Stipe, crying because Serbia is not interested in propping up the failed states around it. Remember Stipe you was the last President of the old Yugoslavia.

What now? You want Serbia to again give your Croatians a good living standard. Sorry old chap but it over and Humpty Dumpty will not be glued together again.

Mesicu... We only want to recognise RS. Its only fair. While the only difference is we wont be breaking the law. Like Croatia did.

None of these problems would exists in a democratic Yugoslavia.
(Stevo, 7 October 2009 19:39)

Stevo,

Socialist Yugoslavia was destroyed because it stood in the way of Western/NATO Atlanticist agenda of imperial expansion. As for myself, well the country which I was born in is now gone and i'm now living in a country called Serbia. My parents came from Slovenia in the 1970s but I was born and grew up in Belgrade. It can feel strange at times, like a fish out of water. In saying that Belgrade is my home and I have lots of friends here.

sorry for wandering off track. I'm all nostalgic. :)

as for Mesic, maybe if he wasnt so bitter he would then realise what a mistake he made when recognising the jokeshop down in Pristina.

"Croatian President Stjepan Mesić says that relations in the region have reached a major impasse since Kosovo unilaterally declared independence."

I thought that was the whole point...hehehe....

"Serbian indignation has begun to spill over into Bosnia-Herzegovina..."

Serbian indignation??? Begun to spill over?? The last time I checked, Serbs LIVE in Bosnia. Nothing had to 'spill over' from Serbia. RIGHTEOUS indignation was there from the beginning (the beginning being April 1941, not February 2008). Double standards at their finest... Mesic, don't you have your own country to govern and a Thompson concert to attend? I hear it's being held in the ruins of the Zagreb Synagogue (STILL UNREPAIRED, since WWII).

It is amazing has little people know about the past of the Balkans.Also tired of hearing how all the Albanians want to be united, and have a right to be. Well if you have a right to be all united so do all Serbian people.
All the uneducated people on here need to have a good lesson in history before they open their mouth.If you want to really know the truth about what happen during the break up of Yugoslavia watch this truthful doc on it.
It is a BBC and US program.
Part 1
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5860186121153047571&hl=en#

Part 2
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6371060303901674397&hl=en#

Please Demi you need to watch this especially since you blame the Serbian's for all the trouble in the balkan's.

There is a always a reason for the west interfering with wars in foreign back yards, only for there own interests.

In true fact Serbia is not the cause or reason for all the trouble in the balkan as you will learn in the film.

Please all educate your selves before you think you can talk about issues that you have no idea about, apart from the stupidity that ends up on in the comments.

Serbia only want what is thiers and never asked for more as the film proves.In fact all other sides received land that was not theirs and is proven in the film.

STOP BLAMING THE SERBIANS FOR ALL THE TROUBLE

Bosnian land belongs to Bosnian citizens always has and always will.
(Ako, 8 October 2009 03:17)

do you mean bosnians of all religions and backgrounds or just muslims?

Kosovo seems far more stable too, now that it has nothing to fear from Serbia..
(shq, 8 October 2009 02:56)

serbia tried to protect kosovo from the very same narcoliticians that are 'governing' it now...

The Orthodox-Military-Political elites of Serbia want to destroy Bosnia as a nation-state because they can’t do this anymore with Croatia, today under the nuclear protection of the United States.
(Gossamer, 8 October 2009 04:47)

what in God's name have you been inhaling?

I admire Mesic’s ability to explain in simple and clear way the safety/political issues in Balkans. What we see here is the continuation of the project of Greater Serbia by breaking apart Bosnia.

One can argue that well someone desires greater Albania. Well this parallel is wrong for the simple reason: Albanian’s NEVER asked the break of Macedonia. Kosova is simply different: Albanains will NEVER allow that a huge chunk of our nation is governed by Serbs. It was the cold war that freezed that issiue and you will need that strangth and polarisation of the world to reoccupy Kosova again. We can discuss about minorities as the Presheva valley/north Kosova but a huge chunk our our nation is out of negotiations.

Regarding Bosnia: I think the best thing would be to let Bosnian Serbs join Serbia. The experiment of multiethnic states is performed ONLY on Balkans and is proven to be failed ideal.

Bosnia of course needs to play her cards as well and her legitimate rights must be respected.

Bosnia must liberate the eastern part of her country (Srebrenica) since we cannot allow the genocide to be legitimized also legally/politically. Then, Bosnia has every right to liberate Sandzak where Bosnians live in overwhelm majority. This will:

1. establish the political and juridical legitimacy of the ethnic structure of the Bosnian nation, and;

2. will guarantee the viability of Bosnian nation and her prosperity by bordering with two friendly nations: in south-east with Albanians and in west with Croatians.

Otherwise Bosnia will remain forever hostage of Serbia.

He should team up with Sali Berisha, both are branches of the same tree and there is no such thing as "ex-commie".
(Ataman, 7 October 2009 14:28)

And angela"the angel from the hell"merkel.What a trio it would be.
http://www.ina-online.net/Upload/Content/Images/berisha%20merkel.jpg
-Wir sind gute kommunisten ,richtig sali ?
-Jawohl liebe angela !

stariVujadin: Did you hear 0ver a hundred churches and mosques destroyed in Srpska entity. Have the Serbs figured who done it yet? Also thousands of homes destroyed and towns villages emptied and they are finding many mass graves all over Srpska. You know something nobody even heard of a Srpska strange only of a Bosnia i Hezergovina. You know what a lot of the corpses have their hands tide and bullet holes and shrapnel on them. Can the Serbs give the world any clues how such appalling horrendous thing happened and what happened to the poor Serb neighbors? I have heard of the Zagreb Synagogue its been rebuilt with state funds thank you for your concern. Try to figure out what happened to the Serb neighbors and who would do such a cruel thing any clues yet?
(Lenard, 7 October 2009 22:56)

Ok, first of all, I made the Thompson performing at a synagogue joke to illustrate the double standards of Mesic... secondly, i know and won't deny that bad things happened during the war, TO ALL SIDES *nb*nb*nb

The fact is, however, that all these things started happening AFTER Croatia and Bosnia ILLEGALLY seceeded from Yugoslavia.

And despite what you have heard, the synagogue in zagreb was never rebuilt, there is a parking lot there now... wiki: Zagreb Synagogue

The truth is Croatia's coast line didn't see too many tourists this past summer. I actually see some regret on the Croatian side and it would have been best for all countries in the Balkans to take the Bosnian approach on Kosovo and stay status quo.

What is "Kosova" going to give to Croatia? Croatia shares a border with Serbia that can open even greater trade relations. The war was tragic but the Balkans need to work together and build each others economy together. Eventually "Yugoslavia" needs to be some what restored, because in the end these countries are too small too not function without each other.

Well, if all three sides want to split Bosnia, why not?

Croats can join Croatia. Serbs can join Serbia.

If this is what all (!) sides want, please let them do so!

I think the west rushed to recognize Bosnia as a state (though it never actually was a state in history) to prevent the war. this was a mistake that was admitted by them selves and it didnt stopped the war. And it will bring more war in the future if international community does not realize this. Bosnia is not like Serbia (no etnic group has the majority in population to claim the land and state), so all protectors of Bosnian sovereignty here should not compare it with illegal succession of Kosovo or with Cyprus. RS has every right to succeed and muslims have no right to claim the state as theirs.

I have always enjoyed a good debate, but what part do the fanatical supports of Bosnia don't understand that its is not united – there are 2 separate entities with a thin veneer of so called central government to mask over the cracks the size of the Grand Canyon.

Bosnia is not one country no matter how hard you wish for that to happen.

What we see here is the continuation of the project of Greater Serbia by breaking apart Bosnia.
One can argue that well someone desires greater Albania. Well this parallel is wrong for the simple reason: Albanian’s NEVER asked the break of Macedonia. Kosova is simply different: Albanains will NEVER allow that a huge chunk of our nation is governed by Serbs.
(ben, 7 October 2009 12:27)

A huge chunk of YOUR land that is full of Serbian monasteries older than the Albanian's national identity? And a huge chunk of YOUR land called Kosovo i Metohija? That doesn't sound very Albanian to me. Elbasan, Shkoder, Tirana- those are Albanian.
And no, Albania never ASKED the break of Macedonia, but they sure supported the Albanian terrorists inside Macedonia that did.

slovenia and croatia. croatia and bosnia. albania and macedonia. macedonia and greece. macedonia and bulgaria. greece and turkey. how is serbia responsible for these conflicts?
(malcolm x, 7 October 2009 13:47)

None of these problems would exists in a democratic Yugoslavia.

Nikos:
"To all those supporting pseudo multinational states between christians and muslims like Bosnia i will tell you one thing. This will not work in Europe...we have past experience with Cyprus"

OK Niko, so what you are saying is that you are opposed to any eventual settlement of the kypriako, you prefer the partition of Cyprus to be formalised as two separate countries, the Denktash/Karadzic plan ... well, I don't, not for Cyprus, nit for Bosnia, but whatever, you cannot have one without the other.

Mesic is still bitter that he's so called 'Prokleta' Yugoslavia doesn't exist anymore. This champagne left wing sipping socialist would love a return to Communism where those in power were no more educated then the peasants from Montenegro. Are these balkan communists ever going to go away, they are the ones who keep causing the friction in the region. For the record Croatia and Bosnia didn't secede from Yugoslavia..You can't secede from something that never really existed.It only really existed for the Serbs.

Dim Tuc
OK Niko, so what you are saying is that you are opposed to any eventual settlement of the kypriako, you prefer the partition of Cyprus to be formalised as two separate countries, the Denktash/Karadzic plan

Of course i support partition! let them in again and we will lose 60% of Cyprus this time. it is obvious you dont have a clue about what happened in Cyprus during 1955-1974, only wishful thinking about creating "multinational" states between where they cant work. Its very sad to see people not learning from history and repeating the same mistakes. No multinational states where they cant work! one last thing, ask the people in the RS if they want partition or not and then speak

Nik
i dont think the multi-ethnic parliament of Bosnia was really working at the time. for example, the first three countries Izetbegovic visited after being inaugurated as president were Libya, Iran and Turkey. During a trip to Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Turkey in July 1991, he conveyed the impression that he was looking to conclude an Islamic alliance. I think the war could not be avoided except if partition would come first (difficult since Bosnia intermixing of communities looked like the leopard's skin). also the Muslisms wanted independence, the Serbs wanted to stay in Yugoslavia or partition. I dont know how easy could be your call for sense when situation is so confusing and interests cannot coincide. dont get me wrong i am not supporting war but i think in Bosnia it was really difficult to avoid it.
i also believe multi-ethnic states in the Balkans are the recipe for destruction because Balkans are not like Belgium where they could separate in an easy and bloodless way.

I don't think that Mesic considered the legal and justified independent of Kosovo as a impasse.

stariVujadin: Did you hear 0ver a hundred churches and mosques destroyed in Srpska entity. Have the Serbs figured who done it yet? Also thousands of homes destroyed and towns villages emptied and they are finding many mass graves all over Srpska. You know something nobody even heard of a Srpska strange only of a Bosnia i Hezergovina. You know what a lot of the corpses have their hands tide and bullet holes and shrapnel on them. Can the Serbs give the world any clues how such appalling horrendous thing happened and what happened to the poor Serb neighbors? I have heard of the Zagreb Synagogue its been rebuilt with state funds thank you for your concern. Try to figure out what happened to the Serb neighbors and who would do such a cruel thing any clues yet?

Mesic is right, Serbia wants a new war and new waves of refuges just to protect Dodik's corruption and criminal activities. He is about to be arrested and in order to avoid it he is trying to create own state!! No way, Bosnians will NOT allow this to happen.

Dodik is already history like Karadzic, Mladic etc. Bosnia will continue to exist undivided simply because it is unbreakable. Many, many had tried it before,...

The Bosnian Serbs and Croats who don't want to live in Bosnia can immigrate to Serbia or Croatia and live there. Bosnian land belongs to Bosnian citizens always has and always will.

Nicos, first of all Bosnia was a state in the Middle Ages, it had its king Tvrdko who even set a peculiar church, probably influenced by the Bogomils. You are right, no ethnic group had the majority in population to claim the land and state and that is exactly the reason why when recognized it had a chance to survive. No ethnic group could be under the suppression of another. Indeed the Christians, Orthodox and Catholics together were more than the Muslims. The war between Serbs and Croats was raging for month while Bosnia had a working multiethnic parliament. A little common sense would have driven the three communities to stay independent and neutral – “equidistant” from both Serbia and Croatia. The separation of the ethno-religious communities was done at a very high price for all of them. But it is now a fait accompli. As for Kosovo’s independence, it was the only painful as it was way Serbia to avoid the fate of becoming a by-national state. Look at Macedonia!

i also believe multi-ethnic states in the Balkans are the recipe for destruction ...

That is why I strongly supported a trade off Kosovo for Srpska. I hope only it is not too late. If the course of utter refusal of any discussion that could lead to recognition of Kosovo continues the self-determination of Srpska may be connected to the same of Sandjak, Northern Vojvodina...

Once again Stipe Mesic is right on what he says. No wonder Serb dictator Slobodan Milosevic hated him so much.

The Orthodox-Military-Political elites of Serbia want to destroy Bosnia as a nation-state because they can’t do this anymore with Croatia, today under the nuclear protection of the United States.

@Nikos

wait a second here... Iran and Libya are very Serbian friendly countries... You can't complain if Bosnia is developing good relations with them, please... You should be happy with that.

Szemi,

The Merkel-Mesic-Berisha trio looks indeed good. But we have to say, not just her country being the strongest - but Angela is by far the smartest (and thus potentially more dangerous) than the other two. Her luck is, she does not sit on a barrel filled with the gunpowder like Balkan still is.

Otherwise as said, there is no such thing as ex-communist. Some (like Tácsi Bácsi) have less brain power than others (Angela). No wonder, others are clowns - but Angela is essentially our colleague, who went down the path to hell.
:-(

"As I stated previously states of the region really have to think before making such decisions as this. Perhaps Croatia really got something from the US for this, but in the cold light of day realised it was fools gold."
(bganon, 8 October 2009 00:16)

So, according to you bganon Mesic thinks that Croatia's entry in the NATO, was not worth the worsened relations with Serbia? Did I get it right?

Ataman, Mike et al..
Serbia seems far more stable to me now than when the Kosovo issue was poisoning its society. Here is a nice experiment:

http://blog.b92.net/text/1126/%E2%80%9CKOSOVO%E2%80%9D/

...Kosovo seems far more stable too, now that it has nothing to fear from Serbia..

...by the way, Republic Srpska should have a referendum and separate form the rest of Bosnia. The other entities of Bosnia are nothing more than a boat anchor to the future development of RS Serbs.
Kosovo is Serbian!


Canadian Serb, can't you realize that those doulbe standards ruined Serbia's obvious chances for a better outcome after the collapse of Yugoslavia! In the early 90's it was the supposed difference between the :minorities" and Serbia and the Serbian 'People" in the other republics. Now you say Srpska hase MORE justification to secede than Kosovo, despite of the fact that 60 countries think the opporite.
I firmly believe that in the circumstances BOTH Kosovo and Srpska have no option but independence and forging close ties with Serbia and Albania respectively. Serbia had all the time in the World, between 1995 -2006 to persuade the "international community" that both should be recognised simultaniously. In the proces the bombardment of 1999 and the separation of Montenegro might have been avoided.

As for democratic Yugoslavia it was imposibile because it never had a common public opinion. But it stood some chances of survival as loose confederation, like Benelux.

MikeC wrote: "Once again American politics are failing".
What a statement! it was enough for you bombing campaigns 1995 + 1999?

Why now and what purpose do these comments serve?

What is it in particular that has happened in Croatia to make Mesic squeak on this subject, and even then to make accusations against Serbia?

Is his popularity or government's policies particularly unpopular at the moment? Is it the usual political trick that when things are turning bad at home the politician picks a fight abroad?

Does anyone have background on this?

My point of view is that all Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone. I mean why should we give a damn about Serbia and her failed policys against it's neighbours ? Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.

I admire Mesic’s ability to explain in simple and clear way the safety/political issues in Balkans. What we see here is the continuation of the project of Greater Serbia by breaking apart Bosnia.

One can argue that well someone desires greater Albania. Well this parallel is wrong for the simple reason: Albanian’s NEVER asked the break of Macedonia. Kosova is simply different: Albanains will NEVER allow that a huge chunk of our nation is governed by Serbs. It was the cold war that freezed that issiue and you will need that strangth and polarisation of the world to reoccupy Kosova again. We can discuss about minorities as the Presheva valley/north Kosova but a huge chunk our our nation is out of negotiations.

Regarding Bosnia: I think the best thing would be to let Bosnian Serbs join Serbia. The experiment of multiethnic states is performed ONLY on Balkans and is proven to be failed ideal.

Bosnia of course needs to play her cards as well and her legitimate rights must be respected.

Bosnia must liberate the eastern part of her country (Srebrenica) since we cannot allow the genocide to be legitimized also legally/politically. Then, Bosnia has every right to liberate Sandzak where Bosnians live in overwhelm majority. This will:

1. establish the political and juridical legitimacy of the ethnic structure of the Bosnian nation, and;

2. will guarantee the viability of Bosnian nation and her prosperity by bordering with two friendly nations: in south-east with Albanians and in west with Croatians.

Otherwise Bosnia will remain forever hostage of Serbia.

How strange, and to think we were told that Kosovan independence was essential for the stability of the region.

Mesic has always been one of the more intelligent Croat politicians, so perhaps he could work on revoking recognition of Kosovo, where Croatian interests are marginal at best, to support BiH, an issue much closer to home.

But... I thought an independent Kosovo would bring stability and peace to the region? Once again American politics are failing. No justice, no peace!

Mesic is right, Serbia wants a new war and new waves of refuges just to protect Dodik's corruption and criminal activities. He is about to be arrested and in order to avoid it he is trying to create own state!! No way, Bosnians will NOT allow this to happen.

Dodik is already history like Karadzic, Mladic etc. Bosnia will continue to exist undivided simply because it is unbreakable. Many, many had tried it before,...

The Bosnian Serbs and Croats who don't want to live in Bosnia can immigrate to Serbia or Croatia and live there. Bosnian land belongs to Bosnian citizens always has and always will.

Croatian "pretensions or non-pretentions" towards BiH are entirely Craotia's matter and what is Serbia's matter in "BiH" case is entirely Serbia's matter so Mesic would be clearly asked not to expect any proclamation from Serbia's side and particulary not on his suggestion or insistance.

Legitimate Referendum in Republica Srpska calling for Independence, based on the historical "Draft Plan" by Ilija Garasanin, which will unite Serbian lands will be called soon rather then later.
Above simple note just to clear some illussions inplanted by so called EU officials.

Once again Stipe Mesic is right on what he says. No wonder Serb dictator Slobodan Milosevic hated him so much.

The Orthodox-Military-Political elites of Serbia want to destroy Bosnia as a nation-state because they can’t do this anymore with Croatia, today under the nuclear protection of the United States.

stariVujadin: Did you hear 0ver a hundred churches and mosques destroyed in Srpska entity. Have the Serbs figured who done it yet? Also thousands of homes destroyed and towns villages emptied and they are finding many mass graves all over Srpska. You know something nobody even heard of a Srpska strange only of a Bosnia i Hezergovina. You know what a lot of the corpses have their hands tide and bullet holes and shrapnel on them. Can the Serbs give the world any clues how such appalling horrendous thing happened and what happened to the poor Serb neighbors? I have heard of the Zagreb Synagogue its been rebuilt with state funds thank you for your concern. Try to figure out what happened to the Serb neighbors and who would do such a cruel thing any clues yet?

"As I stated previously states of the region really have to think before making such decisions as this. Perhaps Croatia really got something from the US for this, but in the cold light of day realised it was fools gold."
(bganon, 8 October 2009 00:16)

So, according to you bganon Mesic thinks that Croatia's entry in the NATO, was not worth the worsened relations with Serbia? Did I get it right?

Ataman, Mike et al..
Serbia seems far more stable to me now than when the Kosovo issue was poisoning its society. Here is a nice experiment:

http://blog.b92.net/text/1126/%E2%80%9CKOSOVO%E2%80%9D/

...Kosovo seems far more stable too, now that it has nothing to fear from Serbia..

"Otherwise Bosnia will remain forever hostage of Serbia."
ben

Everyone in the Balkans are entitled to have their own state apart from the Serbs!
No muslims shall ever again enslave the Serbs!

I don't think that Mesic considered the legal and justified independent of Kosovo as a impasse.

Croations just can't live without Serbians!

Are Serbs supposed to be baby sitters for the entire Balkan region. I thought the west cut that umbilical cord.

Enough is enough!

No more breast feeding neighbours.

Oh and by the way, Republic Srpska should have a referendum and separate form the rest of Bosnia. The other entities of Bosnia are nothing more than a boat anchor to the future development of RS Serbs.

Kosovo is Serbian!

Mesic whose nonsense books were published by sorosian Central European University is very similar to albanians that is why they like him.

MikeC wrote: "Once again American politics are failing".
What a statement! it was enough for you bombing campaigns 1995 + 1999?

Mesic is still bitter that he's so called 'Prokleta' Yugoslavia doesn't exist anymore. This champagne left wing sipping socialist would love a return to Communism where those in power were no more educated then the peasants from Montenegro. Are these balkan communists ever going to go away, they are the ones who keep causing the friction in the region. For the record Croatia and Bosnia didn't secede from Yugoslavia..You can't secede from something that never really existed.It only really existed for the Serbs.

My point of view is that all Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone. I mean why should we give a damn about Serbia and her failed policys against it's neighbours ? Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.
(Demi, 7 October 2009 10:35)

Wanting their neighbours territory? There is a reason why there is 100s of Monasteries in Kosovo dating back to the 1300s. If it was albanian land why were Serbs allowed to build so many?
Why is the province named KiM? Why are all the towns named in Serb?
Why are you even trying to secede when you deep down know who the land belongs to, injustice never works and you should know that.
Kosovo is Serbia!

As if anyone is actually giving a damn about what Mesic has to say.

He has enough to deal with in Croatia so he should mind his own business when it comes to what Serbia should do.
Do you hear Serbian president telling Croatia what they should do? I don't support Tadic for president but at least the man has enough class to stay out of other people's business.
Mr Mesic, you could learn a thing or two from him.

Well I remember the same Mesic supporting Kosovo independence stating that relations between Serbia and Croatia etc would not be seriously affected.

To be clear that was a mistake in diplomacy - a miscalculation based on a theory that turned out not to be true.

And the connection between Kosovo and Bosnia has been made - whether western countries reject that or not, it is a reality for Bosnian politics. I might add that some Bosniak politicians forsaw what would happen and did not support Kosovo independence.

Of course this particular point isn't really about Kosovo independence, its about whether it was smart for Serbia's neighbours to do so at the time. As Mesic has now pointed out - it clearly was'nt.

Mesicu... We only want to recognise RS. Its only fair. While the only difference is we wont be breaking the law. Like Croatia did.

Mesic recognizes Kossovo but now he has problem that RS wants independence? how hypocritical

Mesić would not object Greater Serbia (that is, BiH, FYROM, Slovenia, Croatia included) if HE would be the President of that country forever.

This is the nature of the beast called "аппаратчик".

He should team up with Sali Berisha, both are branches of the same tree and there is no such thing as "ex-commie".

# I don't think that Mesic considered the legal and justified independent of Kosovo as a impasse.
(Luis, 7 October 2009 15:36)

Legal? My friend, please! It is against Serbian constitution, against international law and against 1244.

And you call that legal?

It is amazing has little people know about the past of the Balkans.Also tired of hearing how all the Albanians want to be united, and have a right to be. Well if you have a right to be all united so do all Serbian people.
All the uneducated people on here need to have a good lesson in history before they open their mouth.If you want to really know the truth about what happen during the break up of Yugoslavia watch this truthful doc on it.
It is a BBC and US program.
Part 1
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5860186121153047571&hl=en#

Part 2
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6371060303901674397&hl=en#

Please Demi you need to watch this especially since you blame the Serbian's for all the trouble in the balkan's.

There is a always a reason for the west interfering with wars in foreign back yards, only for there own interests.

In true fact Serbia is not the cause or reason for all the trouble in the balkan as you will learn in the film.

Please all educate your selves before you think you can talk about issues that you have no idea about, apart from the stupidity that ends up on in the comments.

Serbia only want what is thiers and never asked for more as the film proves.In fact all other sides received land that was not theirs and is proven in the film.

STOP BLAMING THE SERBIANS FOR ALL THE TROUBLE

None of these problems would exists in a democratic Yugoslavia.
(Stevo, 7 October 2009 19:39)

Stevo,

Socialist Yugoslavia was destroyed because it stood in the way of Western/NATO Atlanticist agenda of imperial expansion. As for myself, well the country which I was born in is now gone and i'm now living in a country called Serbia. My parents came from Slovenia in the 1970s but I was born and grew up in Belgrade. It can feel strange at times, like a fish out of water. In saying that Belgrade is my home and I have lots of friends here.

sorry for wandering off track. I'm all nostalgic. :)

as for Mesic, maybe if he wasnt so bitter he would then realise what a mistake he made when recognising the jokeshop down in Pristina.

Hmmm, I seem to recall the selling point for the lemon we now refer to as the so-called Republic of Kosovo was that its independence would bring stability and peace to the Balkans (at least that's what my armchair historians/politicians were saying). Now all of a sudden Mesic whips out the gusle and weaves another lamentation. Perhaps rushing in to recognize the secession of one state's territory while denying similar rights and privileges to societies in other states really isn't the way to go. Maybe Zagreb should ask itself what's more important: a meaningful strategic partnership with Serbia, it's natural partner in the Balkans, or a tacit approval of US controlled Albanian puppets in Pristina. Serbia Proper could bring more to the table than Kosovo Province ever could.

Break up Serbia? Break up Bosnia. Keep Bosnia whole? Keep Serbia whole. It's as simple as that.

And no, I really don't think any serious politician in the West is going to adopt the brilliant strategy of "Balkan countrys shoult stop their relations with Serbia and isolate Serbia until she recognize Kosovo and leaves Bosnia alone" as Demi seems to think. Serbia is the keystone to all of Southeastern Europe. Belgrade is poised to become the Berlin and the Frankfurt of the Balkans. Albanians and Bosnians offer little to Europe other than a chance for NGOs to promote pet projects for a seemingly naive and dependent society.

Time for a major strategic rethink of the region, including a major reorganization of Bosnia and Kosovo province. Both Western projects have clearly failed in producing what they were intended to produce.

Well, if all three sides want to split Bosnia, why not?

Croats can join Croatia. Serbs can join Serbia.

If this is what all (!) sides want, please let them do so!

"Serbian indignation has begun to spill over into Bosnia-Herzegovina..."

Serbian indignation??? Begun to spill over?? The last time I checked, Serbs LIVE in Bosnia. Nothing had to 'spill over' from Serbia. RIGHTEOUS indignation was there from the beginning (the beginning being April 1941, not February 2008). Double standards at their finest... Mesic, don't you have your own country to govern and a Thompson concert to attend? I hear it's being held in the ruins of the Zagreb Synagogue (STILL UNREPAIRED, since WWII).

I think the west rushed to recognize Bosnia as a state (though it never actually was a state in history) to prevent the war. this was a mistake that was admitted by them selves and it didnt stopped the war. And it will bring more war in the future if international community does not realize this. Bosnia is not like Serbia (no etnic group has the majority in population to claim the land and state), so all protectors of Bosnian sovereignty here should not compare it with illegal succession of Kosovo or with Cyprus. RS has every right to succeed and muslims have no right to claim the state as theirs.

What we see here is the continuation of the project of Greater Serbia by breaking apart Bosnia.
One can argue that well someone desires greater Albania. Well this parallel is wrong for the simple reason: Albanian’s NEVER asked the break of Macedonia. Kosova is simply different: Albanains will NEVER allow that a huge chunk of our nation is governed by Serbs.
(ben, 7 October 2009 12:27)

A huge chunk of YOUR land that is full of Serbian monasteries older than the Albanian's national identity? And a huge chunk of YOUR land called Kosovo i Metohija? That doesn't sound very Albanian to me. Elbasan, Shkoder, Tirana- those are Albanian.
And no, Albania never ASKED the break of Macedonia, but they sure supported the Albanian terrorists inside Macedonia that did.

slovenia and croatia. croatia and bosnia. albania and macedonia. macedonia and greece. macedonia and bulgaria. greece and turkey. how is serbia responsible for these conflicts?
(malcolm x, 7 October 2009 13:47)

None of these problems would exists in a democratic Yugoslavia.

Yes, Serbians as a people are the trouble makers of Europe because we strive to be free, independent and do not bow to any wannabe master. Now tell me why Republika Srpska is prospering while Federacija is bankrupt? Federacija had the lions share of investment but still ended up dead so why should Serbians pursue a path to destruction? Sorry, but that's not what we do.

Lenard what kind of ground are you preaching from on Bosnia?
Perhaps you could explain about what happened to the famous bridge in Mostar or how it came to be that Bosnian Muslums were stabbed in the back by Croats, the destroyed houses, failed Herceg bosna and so on.

I know you don't like it when you think others are preaching but you spend too much time preaching yourself.

Besides the issue is about Serbo-Croatian relations - an interesting subject. Serbia and Croatia as you know are the most important countries of the region. The rest profit or lose (or live or die even) depending on our relations.

It seems that Mesic realised that recognition of Kosovo was not worth our bad relations.

As I stated previously states of the region really have to think before making such decisions as this. Perhaps Croatia really got something from the US for this, but in the cold light of day realised it was fools gold.

To all those supporting pseudo multinational states between christians and muslims like Bosnia i will tell you one thing. This will not work in Europe...we have past experience with Cyprus and we all saw what happened. Let these people separate in peace, rather than preserving a corpse state like Bosnia. I wonder who wishes to preserve weak, multinational states that cannot stand in their own feet? hmmmm

stariVujadin: Did you hear 0ver a hundred churches and mosques destroyed in Srpska entity. Have the Serbs figured who done it yet? Also thousands of homes destroyed and towns villages emptied and they are finding many mass graves all over Srpska. You know something nobody even heard of a Srpska strange only of a Bosnia i Hezergovina. You know what a lot of the corpses have their hands tide and bullet holes and shrapnel on them. Can the Serbs give the world any clues how such appalling horrendous thing happened and what happened to the poor Serb neighbors? I have heard of the Zagreb Synagogue its been rebuilt with state funds thank you for your concern. Try to figure out what happened to the Serb neighbors and who would do such a cruel thing any clues yet?
(Lenard, 7 October 2009 22:56)

Ok, first of all, I made the Thompson performing at a synagogue joke to illustrate the double standards of Mesic... secondly, i know and won't deny that bad things happened during the war, TO ALL SIDES *nb*nb*nb

The fact is, however, that all these things started happening AFTER Croatia and Bosnia ILLEGALLY seceeded from Yugoslavia.

And despite what you have heard, the synagogue in zagreb was never rebuilt, there is a parking lot there now... wiki: Zagreb Synagogue

Poor old Stipe, crying because Serbia is not interested in propping up the failed states around it. Remember Stipe you was the last President of the old Yugoslavia.

What now? You want Serbia to again give your Croatians a good living standard. Sorry old chap but it over and Humpty Dumpty will not be glued together again.

...by the way, Republic Srpska should have a referendum and separate form the rest of Bosnia. The other entities of Bosnia are nothing more than a boat anchor to the future development of RS Serbs.
Kosovo is Serbian!


Canadian Serb, can't you realize that those doulbe standards ruined Serbia's obvious chances for a better outcome after the collapse of Yugoslavia! In the early 90's it was the supposed difference between the :minorities" and Serbia and the Serbian 'People" in the other republics. Now you say Srpska hase MORE justification to secede than Kosovo, despite of the fact that 60 countries think the opporite.
I firmly believe that in the circumstances BOTH Kosovo and Srpska have no option but independence and forging close ties with Serbia and Albania respectively. Serbia had all the time in the World, between 1995 -2006 to persuade the "international community" that both should be recognised simultaniously. In the proces the bombardment of 1999 and the separation of Montenegro might have been avoided.

As for democratic Yugoslavia it was imposibile because it never had a common public opinion. But it stood some chances of survival as loose confederation, like Benelux.

@Nikos

wait a second here... Iran and Libya are very Serbian friendly countries... You can't complain if Bosnia is developing good relations with them, please... You should be happy with that.

Easy for Mesic to say - since his land grab. Croatia has never been bigger historically since they cleared out the 200k serbs from Krajina. Mesic is just happy no one is looking at him...and deferring attention

Nicos, first of all Bosnia was a state in the Middle Ages, it had its king Tvrdko who even set a peculiar church, probably influenced by the Bogomils. You are right, no ethnic group had the majority in population to claim the land and state and that is exactly the reason why when recognized it had a chance to survive. No ethnic group could be under the suppression of another. Indeed the Christians, Orthodox and Catholics together were more than the Muslims. The war between Serbs and Croats was raging for month while Bosnia had a working multiethnic parliament. A little common sense would have driven the three communities to stay independent and neutral – “equidistant” from both Serbia and Croatia. The separation of the ethno-religious communities was done at a very high price for all of them. But it is now a fait accompli. As for Kosovo’s independence, it was the only painful as it was way Serbia to avoid the fate of becoming a by-national state. Look at Macedonia!

He should team up with Sali Berisha, both are branches of the same tree and there is no such thing as "ex-commie".
(Ataman, 7 October 2009 14:28)

And angela"the angel from the hell"merkel.What a trio it would be.
http://www.ina-online.net/Upload/Content/Images/berisha%20merkel.jpg
-Wir sind gute kommunisten ,richtig sali ?
-Jawohl liebe angela !

"Croatian President Stjepan Mesić says that relations in the region have reached a major impasse since Kosovo unilaterally declared independence."

I thought that was the whole point...hehehe....

Nikos:
"To all those supporting pseudo multinational states between christians and muslims like Bosnia i will tell you one thing. This will not work in Europe...we have past experience with Cyprus"

OK Niko, so what you are saying is that you are opposed to any eventual settlement of the kypriako, you prefer the partition of Cyprus to be formalised as two separate countries, the Denktash/Karadzic plan ... well, I don't, not for Cyprus, nit for Bosnia, but whatever, you cannot have one without the other.

The truth is Croatia's coast line didn't see too many tourists this past summer. I actually see some regret on the Croatian side and it would have been best for all countries in the Balkans to take the Bosnian approach on Kosovo and stay status quo.

What is "Kosova" going to give to Croatia? Croatia shares a border with Serbia that can open even greater trade relations. The war was tragic but the Balkans need to work together and build each others economy together. Eventually "Yugoslavia" needs to be some what restored, because in the end these countries are too small too not function without each other.

Bosnian land belongs to Bosnian citizens always has and always will.
(Ako, 8 October 2009 03:17)

do you mean bosnians of all religions and backgrounds or just muslims?

Kosovo seems far more stable too, now that it has nothing to fear from Serbia..
(shq, 8 October 2009 02:56)

serbia tried to protect kosovo from the very same narcoliticians that are 'governing' it now...

The Orthodox-Military-Political elites of Serbia want to destroy Bosnia as a nation-state because they can’t do this anymore with Croatia, today under the nuclear protection of the United States.
(Gossamer, 8 October 2009 04:47)

what in God's name have you been inhaling?

Dim Tuc
OK Niko, so what you are saying is that you are opposed to any eventual settlement of the kypriako, you prefer the partition of Cyprus to be formalised as two separate countries, the Denktash/Karadzic plan

Of course i support partition! let them in again and we will lose 60% of Cyprus this time. it is obvious you dont have a clue about what happened in Cyprus during 1955-1974, only wishful thinking about creating "multinational" states between where they cant work. Its very sad to see people not learning from history and repeating the same mistakes. No multinational states where they cant work! one last thing, ask the people in the RS if they want partition or not and then speak

i also believe multi-ethnic states in the Balkans are the recipe for destruction ...

That is why I strongly supported a trade off Kosovo for Srpska. I hope only it is not too late. If the course of utter refusal of any discussion that could lead to recognition of Kosovo continues the self-determination of Srpska may be connected to the same of Sandjak, Northern Vojvodina...

Every country in the Baljkan goes along very well with each other beside Serbia who only wants the neighbours territory for it's evil plans.
(Demi, 7 October 2009 10:35)

let me see:

slovenia and croatia. croatia and bosnia. albania and macedonia. macedonia and greece. macedonia and bulgaria. greece and turkey. how is serbia responsible for these conflicts?

speaking of wanting to steal your neighbour's territory, that's a simplification. both croatia and serbia wanted to take parts of bosnia, but for the most part they wanted to take only parts of bosnia where serbs and croats live and serbs and croats from bosnia supported that idea. which is exactly what albanians wanted in kosovo (and macedonia). the difference is probably that albanians got a better excuse (milosevic) and i guess they still dream about serbia being isolated.

people need to agree if they believe state borders should be along the ethnic lines or the already existing ones. if you apply double standards just because you can it will cause instability. and even more so if you can only because you have support from outide the region which some people will believe can be withdrawn. and if you are going to accept the support from outside the region when it suits you then you have to accpet their decisions that don't suit you. and they want serbia to be the regional leader. and serbia's small neighbours (including "kosova") won't be able to do anything about it. isolating serbia is not an option, i'm afraid. you support big powers making decisions that affect you rather than trying to reach an agreement. it won't always go your way, you know.

i'd prefer to see an agreement, so both serbian and albanian societies can move. you can always talk about independence of kosovo (or whatever other territory) later.

Nik
i dont think the multi-ethnic parliament of Bosnia was really working at the time. for example, the first three countries Izetbegovic visited after being inaugurated as president were Libya, Iran and Turkey. During a trip to Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Turkey in July 1991, he conveyed the impression that he was looking to conclude an Islamic alliance. I think the war could not be avoided except if partition would come first (difficult since Bosnia intermixing of communities looked like the leopard's skin). also the Muslisms wanted independence, the Serbs wanted to stay in Yugoslavia or partition. I dont know how easy could be your call for sense when situation is so confusing and interests cannot coincide. dont get me wrong i am not supporting war but i think in Bosnia it was really difficult to avoid it.
i also believe multi-ethnic states in the Balkans are the recipe for destruction because Balkans are not like Belgium where they could separate in an easy and bloodless way.

I have always enjoyed a good debate, but what part do the fanatical supports of Bosnia don't understand that its is not united – there are 2 separate entities with a thin veneer of so called central government to mask over the cracks the size of the Grand Canyon.

Bosnia is not one country no matter how hard you wish for that to happen.

Szemi,

The Merkel-Mesic-Berisha trio looks indeed good. But we have to say, not just her country being the strongest - but Angela is by far the smartest (and thus potentially more dangerous) than the other two. Her luck is, she does not sit on a barrel filled with the gunpowder like Balkan still is.

Otherwise as said, there is no such thing as ex-communist. Some (like Tácsi Bácsi) have less brain power than others (Angela). No wonder, others are clowns - but Angela is essentially our colleague, who went down the path to hell.
:-(

Why now and what purpose do these comments serve?

What is it in particular that has happened in Croatia to make Mesic squeak on this subject, and even then to make accusations against Serbia?

Is his popularity or government's policies particularly unpopular at the moment? Is it the usual political trick that when things are turning bad at home the politician picks a fight abroad?

Does anyone have background on this?