Macedonian encyclopedia pulled from shelves

Soon Albanians will be the majority in Macedonia. So there will be no need to call it Macedonia anymore.

It took the Fyromian academy of propaganda two years to work out the identity of Albanians and only two days to force them to a humiliating climpdown and admit that the Albanians were not settlers ot Shiptars
(as they called them) after all.

This climpdown confirms what a number of posters have been saying for sometime-that is the days of Fyrom as a separate entity are coming to a close.

Either pull that trash from the shelvs or bye, bye Macedonia.

It is absurd how a country with no real identity provokes and questions the well established identity of others. Yes, there are those who may agree with FYROMacedonians on the content of this encyclopedia, but they are a select few comprised of people such as szemi and do so for political reasons. It would bring shame to call this encyclopedia scholarly when a majority of scholars in FYROM itself question its validity. This encyclopedia saw opposition from renowned scholars and official responses from Kosovo, Albania, Bulgaria, and Greece.

It may be easy for some to see it as absurd the Greeks' blockade of FYROM just because of its name, but we must not judge things at face value. We must pay close attention as to what FYROM is doing that essentially ticks off those around it. So yes, the Greeks do have a very good reason why they deal with FYROM in the way they do and I've come to respect that.

As the saying goes, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. And that's what FYROM is, a glass house.

Good job fyromians just keep bowing down to siptar threats.

Either pull that trash from the shelvs or bye, bye Macedonia.
(Kosova-USA, 1 October 2009 15:12)

Oh yes, we should all fear the awesome power of Arnauts everywhere... what are you without the US? Nothing.

Serbia will never recognize an independent Kosovo but if Albanians in Macedonia demand independence I hope Serbia will be the first country to recognize this new dependent albanian state.
Macedonia, you reap what you sow! Ha ha ha!

Good job fyromians just keep bowing down to siptar threats.
(Ratko, 1 October 2009 14:48)

Sad day indeed Ratko I was hoping the Fromians would stand up to these Albanians and really tell them whats on their mind and what their true intentions are. Oops looks like spilled the beans prematurely by releasing this trashopedia. This is a wake up call for the Albanians of FYROM, come together and prosper or scatter and perish.

Why do Albanians oppose the truth? Albanians are highlanders, that's where they have historically lived. As for Shiptars, they call themselves that. What is their problem?

What about those parts where greek history is falsified ? Oh sorry I have almost forgotten that in era of New World Order It is a good form to falsify greek history and a poiticly incorrect thing to say anything bad about albanians even if it is anyway true.

They pulled the encyclopedia and you have lost a huge chunk of the country to us. We are just getting started.

@svojgazda

Actually it is "Shqiptar".. or Albanian if you can't pronounce it properly.

Siptar, Shiptar, Arnaut, Albans... are all used as a derogatory term as far as I gather. It's pretty much on the same level as the term "Shkije" for Serbs.

Mike C.

Actually Mike we've got highlands, valleys and coasts. The Albanian riviera is nice this time of year especially, but you wouldn't know that being a serb because you are a land locked nation. Serbs are by far more accustomed to the highlands because of their origins in the Ural mountains. Their wide foreheads and neolithic brow are further proof of this ie. your prototype Serb
FM Vukenstein

Albanians are highlanders. There is proof. Many Albanians have huge heads and big ears. Mountainpeople usually have those characteristic. Just like southern europeans are hairier than people from northern Europe.

do you albanians really believe that secession from makedonija would be justified/executed if they didn't edit the encyclopedia?

Pathetic. Macedonia does nothing but appease Albanian extremists who hate the truth, and what have they gotten for all this appeasement? More anti-Slav racism, threats, violence, and political crises.

My heart's in the Highlands, my heart is not here,
My heart's in the Highlands a-chasing the deer
Chasing the wild deer, and following the roe;
My heart's in the Highlands, whereever I go

The entire history of Macedonia is a fiction invented to justify the return of the country within Yugoslavia. (Nobody at that time would tolerate Macedonia joining Bulgaria, while a return to Serbian rule would have beet totally unacceptable by the local residents). So there was a fertile ground for the development of a new identity. The de-Bulgarization, already in advance stage was facilitated by the relative freedom of Tito’s Yugoslavia. So two generations of Macedonians grew up within the Yugoslavian subculture. Their tragedy came with the collapse of the federation. They could not reconcile with their true history, with their brethren in Bulgaria, with Greece, who would not allow them to use the name they grew up with. If that was not enough, now they are physically threatened by a growing Albanian population. One should feel pity for them, not be angry at their frantic actions.

Shkije is not used in Albania as far as I know.

I've only heard it used by Kosovar Albanians and they weren't paying compliments to the Serbs on those occasions that's for sure.

I have no idea of its origins and as far as I know there's no real meaning of it in Albanian either. Some folks claim that it stands for "scythian" or some other latin name for "slav" though it's exclusively used to describe Serbs.

Even though it's a meaningless word,the point is that context matters. Shkije is clearly used to insult.

Now, if you read the comments by the likes of szemi or ratko, and a few others in here, you'll notice right away that terms 'siptar', 'alban' aren't used in e neutral manner. According to 'casual_visitor', Serb politicians also have used it in a pejorative way and that's what makes the difference.

In one thing you're right though. This is small peanuts when compared to the bigger problems between Serbs and Albanians.

we´ve had this many times now, and no matter how often our dear k-albanian friends are repeating it, there is nothing derogatory about using the word "Šiptar", or if you want to see it written in the albanian way Shqiptar.

I personally use "Albanians" here, since we are writing in english here, otherwise I´d say Šiptari, since that is the name they call themselves. fullstop.

please, my dear albanian friends, FACE the truth and stop spreading propaganda.

the reason why the Germans or English are called Nemci and Englezi is simply that we do not have any direct contact with those nations, with Hungarians and Albanians on the other hand, we do have contact and that´s the way why there exist terms like "Mađar" or "Šiptar", simply saying it like our neighbours do say it - nothing more.

so, if some Albanian here persists in saying the use of "Šiptar" is derogatory, then he is only prolonging the own humiliation of being left with an egg on their faces...

for simply not getting it that nobody falls for this rather naive try to make the Serbs look bad...

last but not least, and that´s an important point here: the Albanians in Albania are called Albanians ( Albanci ) and those Albanians in our southern province are called Šiptari, there is a quite clear and for every sound person quite understandable difference that has nothing to do with racism or derogatory use.


last sentence is for Ment, who writes rather reasonable here, compared with his other buddies...: if you say that the Albanian identity is well established, I´d say no.
why?
because, if it were ESTABLISHED, in the true meaning of that term - the Albanians wouldn´t feel the need to claim being the descendants of the illyrians, and all those other illusions they are eagerly willing to accept in order to give themselves a good feeling...

an established identity doesn´t need illusions...

Shiqiptar,Albanian,Arbero-Higlanaders;this last terminology used from the author does not surprise me how worried of their identity are the academics in Makedonia of Albanian history and heritage.Poor academics have been working hard to come up with some new revelation in order to give a Makedonia some history.Well, Albanian are not ashamed of been Highlanders if the Academics thinks so.The are just proud of their heritage,history and culture.

SAMU = MAMU

Anything "academic" sponsored by a slav state will be complete propaganda.

Yes, there are those who may agree with FYROMacedonians on the content of this encyclopedia, but they are a select few comprised of people such as szemi and do so for political reasons
(Ptoleme, 1 October 2009 19:53)

Man next time read texts more carefully.(Although I have noticed that albanians and reading(or comprehension) are a far cry)).I was also critical because that book falsifies greek history and did not side with FYROM opinion at all.And as we know greece has a rich history of which they can be very proud as opposed to albanian which can be summerized in an SMS .So it is very funny when albanians start complaining about others falsifing history when they themselves are great masters of that trade besides organ trafficking and narco business.

szemi you're a pseudointellectual whose common sense is surmised of bigotry and when you actually try to put down people by your derogatory comments, you just lose the respect of those around you. Soon everyone will start ignoring you altogether. But just keep in mind that things aren't so just because someone (as you) with no expertise on a subject attempts to bend the truth. But maybe you can't help it. Perhaps you're the "fool" who always has to say something.

I think tragically that the Albanian posters may be correct in their comments here, Macedonians have chosen a path which is "lets be friends" with Albanians when in fact they are slowly losing their country to their new found "friends". The most embaressing thing of all here is that they stand to gain very little from pleasing the Albanians because they will not be satisfied without their own state, they are just making it easier and easier. Do they get support from the US in return? Not really, Macedonia is marginally richer than Albania with very few prospects.
In a best case scenario Macedonians should embrace their Slavic brothers in the north to be united against a comman enemy and settle any disputes with the Greeks. With this Macedonia could find itself with access to Greek ports and trade routes to Europe through Serbia, right now they seem isolated and divided.

You're amazed Albanians can read?

You aren't the brightest bulb in this room are you?

To Ratko:
Yes ,you can call "Albanians" with that terms which you like non stop how much you like ,even you can sleep and dream with that terms and to don't forget to teach and your nieces about this term,but at the end the result of this is: Albanians are Albanian or "Albanci" ....

To Ace:
You are free to try again WAR with Kosovo Albanians but first you must recognize their Independente then start real war between two independent states.
Ratko enjoy sleeping with that term and Ace after February 2008 you must think two times before you make any step against Kosovo.

To Ment
I never understood all the hype about the word ‘Šiptar’ (or for the sake of using western phonetics ‘Shiptar’). For, one, Serbians are writing down sounds as they hear them, and two, just as they do not call English – ‘English’ but ‘Englez’, or German ‘Nemac’ the same applies to you. It is not derogatory term, it is an attempt to address you using the same name you use for yourselves – the way you pronounce it, only the spelling is different, since there is no ‘q’ in Serbian language, and the letter ‘š’ is ‘Sh’. I have never heard of the word ‘Shkije’ before, but if that is your word for Serbians, who cares? The only problem is, when you use it, someone you are addressing might not know what you are talking about, whereas if you were to use some form of ‘Srbin’, even mispronounced (or misspelled) you will be understood.
There is honestly no pun intended in my comment here, and I hope you will not get the impression there is. I just feel that latching on to things like this, without asking what could be the reason is petty, and clouds the broader picture that could, eventually, lead to some sort of dialog and conclusion.

Albanians called themselved as "Shqiptarët". So what problem with "Shiptars"??

Just to clear something up here and dispel confusion. Naimely, the word "Siptar" which everybody used in former Yugoslavia is not a derogatory one, it is simlply a corruption of a Albanian word which denotes themselves! It does not mean anything, full stop.
To claim otherwise is just malicious propaganda.
On the other hand the Albanian word Shkije is purposly insulting word even if many great Serbs have no idea what it means. Actually it means Pig or Pigs which you would agree is not a nice way to call somebody. I suppose it denotes everything dirty and unholy which is what the Serbs are...in the minds of extreme Albanians.

@ Bekim

WE...are getting started at doing what exactly?

WE have Kosovo because Serbia pissed off the West one too many times.

Alone, all WE we would have done was to pick a fight that could have emptied Kosovo of Albanians for quite some time to come. Like it almost did.

In Macedonia, WE are quite right in insisting that the government there work to improve ethnic relations and not discriminate but that's as far as WE go....if WE are sane and would like to earn the respect and goodwill of the nations we mean to join one day.

Don't confuse well being of Albanians with notions of "Greater Albania." Last time I checked, Albania was not a penis.

As Germany in WWII and a couple of Balkan countries have found out the hard way, "Greater" anything is a pretty sure way to national disaster.

Dear casual_visitor,

Word ‘Šiptar’(Shiptar) has no meaning in Serbian language (as far as I know) apart from being the Serbian way of writing down the sounds Albanians make when they pronounce the name they call themselves (unlike the parallel French-frog). Therefore it does not have and it can not have any derogatory meaning. I would presume the same goes for the word ‘Madjar’ – again the way Serbians hear and write down Hungarians’ name for themselves. I would like to know is this equally ‘insulting’ to Hungarians on this site?

The reason I used mix of Serbian and English names is, obviously, because that is the essence of my question. Otherwise, I am perfectly aware of the name in English language.

To summarise it all, I tried to explain that the word in question could have meaning perfectly devoid of any derogatory connotations, just as you could, I presume, explain the origins of the word ‘Shka’?

I have no doubt that certain people on this board are 15 years or below.

Anyone who ''threatens'' war with another nation has evidently never been in a war zone, never seen a war zone and has no concept of war zone.
Threatening violent reaction because of a book is a chilling thought and a unpleasant demonstration of characters of those who threaten, and not those who are threatened.

First, let's get something straight, ALBANIANS ARE ONLY 25% OF THE POPULATION of Macedonia, not 50%, and the population growth of albanians and macedonians is about the same right now and isn't changing any time soon.

Another thing, Macedonian people that are not in the parliament building in Skopje do not support the independence of Kosovo. So Serbs on here that for some reason have it out for Macedonia, go to Ohrid next summer and see how many Serbs there are enjoying themselves next to Macedonians without regard for politics.

Another thing, we have no problems with anyone, Bulgars, Albananians, Greeks, they all have a problem with us. I can tell you from experience, it's hard to be friendly with people that hate you.

Another thing, HIGHLANDER in the encyclopedia comes from the fact that maybe Albanians have always been in Macedonia, but on the hills bordering Albania. When Macedonia was part of Yugoslavia Albanians began coming down into the cities close to the border of Albania to work and make a living. This is evident from the fact that the cities in Macedonia with Albanian majorities have names like TETOVO, STRUGA, GOSTIVAR, KUMANOVO - All of these are slavic names and the Albanians call them TETOVE, STRUGE, GOSTIVARI - still slavic with an Albanian twist at the end.

Also, I met Albanians in Macedonia who were great people. They study in Macedonia's best universities and get away from their villages or towns to see that Macedonians are good people. They are liberalized and westernized and consider themsevles Macedonians, Albanians yes, but Macedonians as well. It is like in California, many Mexicans come and consider themselves Americans and become an integral part of society. But the ones that come to the U.S. and don't learn English and only consider themsevles Mexicans, well, no one likes them and they have no business in trying to be part of a place they don't want to be a part of.

Lastly, the only reason our corrupt VMRO government is bowing to extremist scumbags like Menduh Taci is to get into the European Union. If we don't get into the EU, which may be likely because of Greece, the government will stop listening to those Albanians who really want nothing to do with Macedonia and just want to create tensions. And then Menduh Taci will try to start a war and at least half the Albanian population won't even support them and they will end up having to run away for good, leaving behind only those Albanians that actually care about the place they live in.

Good job fyromians just keep bowing down to siptar threats.

Why do Albanians oppose the truth? Albanians are highlanders, that's where they have historically lived. As for Shiptars, they call themselves that. What is their problem?

Either pull that trash from the shelvs or bye, bye Macedonia.
(Kosova-USA, 1 October 2009 15:12)

Oh yes, we should all fear the awesome power of Arnauts everywhere... what are you without the US? Nothing.

They pulled the encyclopedia and you have lost a huge chunk of the country to us. We are just getting started.

Yes, there are those who may agree with FYROMacedonians on the content of this encyclopedia, but they are a select few comprised of people such as szemi and do so for political reasons
(Ptoleme, 1 October 2009 19:53)

Man next time read texts more carefully.(Although I have noticed that albanians and reading(or comprehension) are a far cry)).I was also critical because that book falsifies greek history and did not side with FYROM opinion at all.And as we know greece has a rich history of which they can be very proud as opposed to albanian which can be summerized in an SMS .So it is very funny when albanians start complaining about others falsifing history when they themselves are great masters of that trade besides organ trafficking and narco business.

Either pull that trash from the shelvs or bye, bye Macedonia.

Serbia will never recognize an independent Kosovo but if Albanians in Macedonia demand independence I hope Serbia will be the first country to recognize this new dependent albanian state.
Macedonia, you reap what you sow! Ha ha ha!

My heart's in the Highlands, my heart is not here,
My heart's in the Highlands a-chasing the deer
Chasing the wild deer, and following the roe;
My heart's in the Highlands, whereever I go

Good job fyromians just keep bowing down to siptar threats.
(Ratko, 1 October 2009 14:48)

Sad day indeed Ratko I was hoping the Fromians would stand up to these Albanians and really tell them whats on their mind and what their true intentions are. Oops looks like spilled the beans prematurely by releasing this trashopedia. This is a wake up call for the Albanians of FYROM, come together and prosper or scatter and perish.

Albanians are highlanders. There is proof. Many Albanians have huge heads and big ears. Mountainpeople usually have those characteristic. Just like southern europeans are hairier than people from northern Europe.

What about those parts where greek history is falsified ? Oh sorry I have almost forgotten that in era of New World Order It is a good form to falsify greek history and a poiticly incorrect thing to say anything bad about albanians even if it is anyway true.

Pathetic. Macedonia does nothing but appease Albanian extremists who hate the truth, and what have they gotten for all this appeasement? More anti-Slav racism, threats, violence, and political crises.

do you albanians really believe that secession from makedonija would be justified/executed if they didn't edit the encyclopedia?

Mike C.

Actually Mike we've got highlands, valleys and coasts. The Albanian riviera is nice this time of year especially, but you wouldn't know that being a serb because you are a land locked nation. Serbs are by far more accustomed to the highlands because of their origins in the Ural mountains. Their wide foreheads and neolithic brow are further proof of this ie. your prototype Serb
FM Vukenstein

@svojgazda

Actually it is "Shqiptar".. or Albanian if you can't pronounce it properly.

Siptar, Shiptar, Arnaut, Albans... are all used as a derogatory term as far as I gather. It's pretty much on the same level as the term "Shkije" for Serbs.

I think tragically that the Albanian posters may be correct in their comments here, Macedonians have chosen a path which is "lets be friends" with Albanians when in fact they are slowly losing their country to their new found "friends". The most embaressing thing of all here is that they stand to gain very little from pleasing the Albanians because they will not be satisfied without their own state, they are just making it easier and easier. Do they get support from the US in return? Not really, Macedonia is marginally richer than Albania with very few prospects.
In a best case scenario Macedonians should embrace their Slavic brothers in the north to be united against a comman enemy and settle any disputes with the Greeks. With this Macedonia could find itself with access to Greek ports and trade routes to Europe through Serbia, right now they seem isolated and divided.

SAMU = MAMU

Anything "academic" sponsored by a slav state will be complete propaganda.

Just to clear something up here and dispel confusion. Naimely, the word "Siptar" which everybody used in former Yugoslavia is not a derogatory one, it is simlply a corruption of a Albanian word which denotes themselves! It does not mean anything, full stop.
To claim otherwise is just malicious propaganda.
On the other hand the Albanian word Shkije is purposly insulting word even if many great Serbs have no idea what it means. Actually it means Pig or Pigs which you would agree is not a nice way to call somebody. I suppose it denotes everything dirty and unholy which is what the Serbs are...in the minds of extreme Albanians.

To Ratko:
Yes ,you can call "Albanians" with that terms which you like non stop how much you like ,even you can sleep and dream with that terms and to don't forget to teach and your nieces about this term,but at the end the result of this is: Albanians are Albanian or "Albanci" ....

To Ace:
You are free to try again WAR with Kosovo Albanians but first you must recognize their Independente then start real war between two independent states.
Ratko enjoy sleeping with that term and Ace after February 2008 you must think two times before you make any step against Kosovo.

You're amazed Albanians can read?

You aren't the brightest bulb in this room are you?

@ Bekim

WE...are getting started at doing what exactly?

WE have Kosovo because Serbia pissed off the West one too many times.

Alone, all WE we would have done was to pick a fight that could have emptied Kosovo of Albanians for quite some time to come. Like it almost did.

In Macedonia, WE are quite right in insisting that the government there work to improve ethnic relations and not discriminate but that's as far as WE go....if WE are sane and would like to earn the respect and goodwill of the nations we mean to join one day.

Don't confuse well being of Albanians with notions of "Greater Albania." Last time I checked, Albania was not a penis.

As Germany in WWII and a couple of Balkan countries have found out the hard way, "Greater" anything is a pretty sure way to national disaster.

szemi you're a pseudointellectual whose common sense is surmised of bigotry and when you actually try to put down people by your derogatory comments, you just lose the respect of those around you. Soon everyone will start ignoring you altogether. But just keep in mind that things aren't so just because someone (as you) with no expertise on a subject attempts to bend the truth. But maybe you can't help it. Perhaps you're the "fool" who always has to say something.

Albanians called themselved as "Shqiptarët". So what problem with "Shiptars"??

we´ve had this many times now, and no matter how often our dear k-albanian friends are repeating it, there is nothing derogatory about using the word "Šiptar", or if you want to see it written in the albanian way Shqiptar.

I personally use "Albanians" here, since we are writing in english here, otherwise I´d say Šiptari, since that is the name they call themselves. fullstop.

please, my dear albanian friends, FACE the truth and stop spreading propaganda.

the reason why the Germans or English are called Nemci and Englezi is simply that we do not have any direct contact with those nations, with Hungarians and Albanians on the other hand, we do have contact and that´s the way why there exist terms like "Mađar" or "Šiptar", simply saying it like our neighbours do say it - nothing more.

so, if some Albanian here persists in saying the use of "Šiptar" is derogatory, then he is only prolonging the own humiliation of being left with an egg on their faces...

for simply not getting it that nobody falls for this rather naive try to make the Serbs look bad...

last but not least, and that´s an important point here: the Albanians in Albania are called Albanians ( Albanci ) and those Albanians in our southern province are called Šiptari, there is a quite clear and for every sound person quite understandable difference that has nothing to do with racism or derogatory use.


last sentence is for Ment, who writes rather reasonable here, compared with his other buddies...: if you say that the Albanian identity is well established, I´d say no.
why?
because, if it were ESTABLISHED, in the true meaning of that term - the Albanians wouldn´t feel the need to claim being the descendants of the illyrians, and all those other illusions they are eagerly willing to accept in order to give themselves a good feeling...

an established identity doesn´t need illusions...

Soon Albanians will be the majority in Macedonia. So there will be no need to call it Macedonia anymore.

Shiqiptar,Albanian,Arbero-Higlanaders;this last terminology used from the author does not surprise me how worried of their identity are the academics in Makedonia of Albanian history and heritage.Poor academics have been working hard to come up with some new revelation in order to give a Makedonia some history.Well, Albanian are not ashamed of been Highlanders if the Academics thinks so.The are just proud of their heritage,history and culture.

It took the Fyromian academy of propaganda two years to work out the identity of Albanians and only two days to force them to a humiliating climpdown and admit that the Albanians were not settlers ot Shiptars
(as they called them) after all.

This climpdown confirms what a number of posters have been saying for sometime-that is the days of Fyrom as a separate entity are coming to a close.

To Ment
I never understood all the hype about the word ‘Šiptar’ (or for the sake of using western phonetics ‘Shiptar’). For, one, Serbians are writing down sounds as they hear them, and two, just as they do not call English – ‘English’ but ‘Englez’, or German ‘Nemac’ the same applies to you. It is not derogatory term, it is an attempt to address you using the same name you use for yourselves – the way you pronounce it, only the spelling is different, since there is no ‘q’ in Serbian language, and the letter ‘š’ is ‘Sh’. I have never heard of the word ‘Shkije’ before, but if that is your word for Serbians, who cares? The only problem is, when you use it, someone you are addressing might not know what you are talking about, whereas if you were to use some form of ‘Srbin’, even mispronounced (or misspelled) you will be understood.
There is honestly no pun intended in my comment here, and I hope you will not get the impression there is. I just feel that latching on to things like this, without asking what could be the reason is petty, and clouds the broader picture that could, eventually, lead to some sort of dialog and conclusion.

Dear casual_visitor,

Word ‘Šiptar’(Shiptar) has no meaning in Serbian language (as far as I know) apart from being the Serbian way of writing down the sounds Albanians make when they pronounce the name they call themselves (unlike the parallel French-frog). Therefore it does not have and it can not have any derogatory meaning. I would presume the same goes for the word ‘Madjar’ – again the way Serbians hear and write down Hungarians’ name for themselves. I would like to know is this equally ‘insulting’ to Hungarians on this site?

The reason I used mix of Serbian and English names is, obviously, because that is the essence of my question. Otherwise, I am perfectly aware of the name in English language.

To summarise it all, I tried to explain that the word in question could have meaning perfectly devoid of any derogatory connotations, just as you could, I presume, explain the origins of the word ‘Shka’?

It is absurd how a country with no real identity provokes and questions the well established identity of others. Yes, there are those who may agree with FYROMacedonians on the content of this encyclopedia, but they are a select few comprised of people such as szemi and do so for political reasons. It would bring shame to call this encyclopedia scholarly when a majority of scholars in FYROM itself question its validity. This encyclopedia saw opposition from renowned scholars and official responses from Kosovo, Albania, Bulgaria, and Greece.

It may be easy for some to see it as absurd the Greeks' blockade of FYROM just because of its name, but we must not judge things at face value. We must pay close attention as to what FYROM is doing that essentially ticks off those around it. So yes, the Greeks do have a very good reason why they deal with FYROM in the way they do and I've come to respect that.

As the saying goes, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. And that's what FYROM is, a glass house.

The entire history of Macedonia is a fiction invented to justify the return of the country within Yugoslavia. (Nobody at that time would tolerate Macedonia joining Bulgaria, while a return to Serbian rule would have beet totally unacceptable by the local residents). So there was a fertile ground for the development of a new identity. The de-Bulgarization, already in advance stage was facilitated by the relative freedom of Tito’s Yugoslavia. So two generations of Macedonians grew up within the Yugoslavian subculture. Their tragedy came with the collapse of the federation. They could not reconcile with their true history, with their brethren in Bulgaria, with Greece, who would not allow them to use the name they grew up with. If that was not enough, now they are physically threatened by a growing Albanian population. One should feel pity for them, not be angry at their frantic actions.

I have no doubt that certain people on this board are 15 years or below.

Anyone who ''threatens'' war with another nation has evidently never been in a war zone, never seen a war zone and has no concept of war zone.
Threatening violent reaction because of a book is a chilling thought and a unpleasant demonstration of characters of those who threaten, and not those who are threatened.

First, let's get something straight, ALBANIANS ARE ONLY 25% OF THE POPULATION of Macedonia, not 50%, and the population growth of albanians and macedonians is about the same right now and isn't changing any time soon.

Another thing, Macedonian people that are not in the parliament building in Skopje do not support the independence of Kosovo. So Serbs on here that for some reason have it out for Macedonia, go to Ohrid next summer and see how many Serbs there are enjoying themselves next to Macedonians without regard for politics.

Another thing, we have no problems with anyone, Bulgars, Albananians, Greeks, they all have a problem with us. I can tell you from experience, it's hard to be friendly with people that hate you.

Another thing, HIGHLANDER in the encyclopedia comes from the fact that maybe Albanians have always been in Macedonia, but on the hills bordering Albania. When Macedonia was part of Yugoslavia Albanians began coming down into the cities close to the border of Albania to work and make a living. This is evident from the fact that the cities in Macedonia with Albanian majorities have names like TETOVO, STRUGA, GOSTIVAR, KUMANOVO - All of these are slavic names and the Albanians call them TETOVE, STRUGE, GOSTIVARI - still slavic with an Albanian twist at the end.

Also, I met Albanians in Macedonia who were great people. They study in Macedonia's best universities and get away from their villages or towns to see that Macedonians are good people. They are liberalized and westernized and consider themsevles Macedonians, Albanians yes, but Macedonians as well. It is like in California, many Mexicans come and consider themselves Americans and become an integral part of society. But the ones that come to the U.S. and don't learn English and only consider themsevles Mexicans, well, no one likes them and they have no business in trying to be part of a place they don't want to be a part of.

Lastly, the only reason our corrupt VMRO government is bowing to extremist scumbags like Menduh Taci is to get into the European Union. If we don't get into the EU, which may be likely because of Greece, the government will stop listening to those Albanians who really want nothing to do with Macedonia and just want to create tensions. And then Menduh Taci will try to start a war and at least half the Albanian population won't even support them and they will end up having to run away for good, leaving behind only those Albanians that actually care about the place they live in.

Shkije is not used in Albania as far as I know.

I've only heard it used by Kosovar Albanians and they weren't paying compliments to the Serbs on those occasions that's for sure.

I have no idea of its origins and as far as I know there's no real meaning of it in Albanian either. Some folks claim that it stands for "scythian" or some other latin name for "slav" though it's exclusively used to describe Serbs.

Even though it's a meaningless word,the point is that context matters. Shkije is clearly used to insult.

Now, if you read the comments by the likes of szemi or ratko, and a few others in here, you'll notice right away that terms 'siptar', 'alban' aren't used in e neutral manner. According to 'casual_visitor', Serb politicians also have used it in a pejorative way and that's what makes the difference.

In one thing you're right though. This is small peanuts when compared to the bigger problems between Serbs and Albanians.