EULEX wants access to Kosovo police files

ben - Serbia would no doubt send any requests to EULEX and vice versa, and EULEX would deal with Pristina. There would be no need for Serbia to make any direct requests or for Pristina to deal with Belgrade until proper communication channels are in place (ie. a proper solution is reached).

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate.

Of course this should be shared openly with EULEX and MUP. It would be to everyone's benefit in tackling crime.

•
Of course this should be shared openly with EULEX and MUP. It would be to everyone's benefit in tackling crime.
(kate, 17 September 2009, 14:47)

Very true, Kate.

Ben, it is not so much to do with Serbia as has to do with EULEX executive department making arrests and dealing with internal corruption of KPS and Pristina authorities... monitoring is not the only part of the mission.

Belgrade should never have to ask anything of Pristina's puppet institutions. Serbia does not recognize it's Southern province as independent of Belgrade's authority. EULEX will be the go-between for all matters in Kosovo. The Albanians welcomed the EU mission there, now they must obey. Did they (K_Albanians) really think that they would get real independence, just because they received recognitions of independence? This was the West's plan for control of the area from the start.

“EULEX wants to establish a permanent system that would allow it to make non-stop, ad hoc requests for access to the Kosovo police’s information,”

“European officials have confirmed the news, adding that they would not be divulging any information without Priština’s prior consent.”

This is all fine to me!

You are monitoring mission so you cannot stay blind- you should have access. I have always been pro-EULEX deployment btw.

The only thing that bothers me and it seriously annoys me is that you go far beyond the monitoring mission and take attributes of effective and sole authorities also representing Kosova a broad.

You are not intermediary mission and neither our governors.

If Serbia needs information (concerning their legitimate interest in fighting the organized crime) she should send her request to the Govt of Kosova MoI as Kosova’s MoI should send her requests to MUP.

If Serbia doesn’t want to communicate with legitimate democratic Govt of Kosova – it’s HER problem NOT ours.

So don’t twist my arm for something that doesn’t depend on my good will but on others. Moreover, since it’s in their interest to get this deal not in mine: they will get visa liberalisation not me.

And it’s utterly rude to twist arms of legitimate and democratically elected governors moreover if they consider you as friends. You don’t twist arm to a friend this is something that even a child of 5 knows. However it’s your shame not ours.! You could have at least speared us with the ‘peanuts agreement’ the day after it would have been more elegant in my opinion.

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate."

hehehehe...grasping at straws. So, what's the UN's postion on:
Kosova's Security Force?
Merdare Highway?
Removal of the border with Albania?
And finally what's the UN position on Kosova's declaration of independence? Did the UN condemn it?

Truth is that once the West said yes, it is yes. 2 Million people will not take it laying down a reversal. EU will be there for a while, but then they control Serbia, Albania, MN and everyone hoping to join EU. Like making Serbia sign a document that states to patrol the "border" with Kosovo.

"European officials have confirmed the news, adding that they would not be divulging any information without Prishtina’s prior consent."

I wouldnt count on that, either the current Government respond NO or start pushing for early elections. Ppl have had enough of lies, and someone will have to pay the price, either the Government or EULEX, I would personally see both kicked out.

Which is fine with me. The same they should ask from MUP Serbia too.

It is very simple.

If Serbia doesn’t want to it doesn’t have to. We cannot care less.

The issue is why is EU doing the dirty job for Serbia???

Did we look to you keen or willing to sign a protocol with you??? It doesn’t result to me. We cannot care less for you! You are history for us and will remain so for ever.

You are out of the picture for us, you are done.

What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???

But for Serbia and having any relations with you, we cannot care less this is for sure.

So now EULEX wants oversight of KPS? Another alleged "independent" apparatus of an alleged "independent" state which is subjected to scrutiny by an alleged "mediating advisor"?

It's certainly one way for Belgrade (read as MUP) to access KPS files since Belgrade works with EULEX. But put another way, no allegedly "sovereign" state should open their files to anyone else. But in the end, what is Pristina going to do other than protest for the cameras, but acquiesce behind closed doors.

This is looking like an international protectorate more and more every day.

Hey KPS watch out!! There are some real police officers coming your way. Get out the burn bags and shredders out. Also download a few more porn sites onto the computers so they are even more virus ridden then the nasty EULUX boys and girls won’t realise how incompetent you all are.

Ben,
"The issue is why is EU doing the dirty job for Serbia???"

Maybe because the EU did the dirtiest job ever for supporting Kosovo UDI, and now can't sleep in the night because it has a very bad conscience.

Just guessing.

'If Serbia needs information (concerning their legitimate interest in fighting the organized crime) she should send her request to the Govt of Kosova MoI as Kosova’s MoI should send her requests to MUP.'

If this had been possible, then there would have been no need for the protocol. This is a temporary agreement, until Prishtina and Belgrade are talking to each other. In the meantime, not being able to go after cross-border crime benefits only the criminals.

See the lead article in today's Danas, an interview with Kostunica ( http://www.danas.rs/vesti/naslovna.1.html ) - "Srbija formalno priznala granice nezavisnog Kosova" - he doesn't like the agreement either, and obviously sees it as being in Kosovo's interest. Even the Bgd politicians who were crowing over this being evidence of EULEX "ruling" Kosovo on behalf of Serbia have fallen silent.

I think Kostunica exaggerates the importance of the terminology used, but he's right that the document doesn't use a translation of the Serb-preferred expression "administrativna linija." It's hardly because English is defective and has no way of expressing the concept - "administrative line" would have worked just fine, if they'd wanted to use it. So they end up with "border/boundary" - "border" is the Kosovar interpretation of the line, "boundary" is as neutral as you can get. So, who won that one?

Ben - becouse Serbia is pivotal country on Balkan Peninsula and pseudoindependent Kosovo with no chance for EU/UN membership - is nothing.

"Which is fine with me. The same they should ask from MUP Serbia too."
Olf

I agree! Eulex ask southern part of Serbia for access but not the norther part.

Ben wrote: "What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???"

Why is the U.S. pushing for this? Because it's in your long-term interest as a free and independent country, that's why. The only problem is that the agreement is with Serbia, which allowed Serbian politicians to put their spin on it initially. Why didn't anybody in Prishtina complain when Eulex signed agreements "on its own behalf" with Albania etc? Because Albanian etc. politicians didn't start taunting you with claims that this was a national humiliation.

More than any bilateral agreements, Kosovo needs foreign investment, but that's not going to come, even from the diaspora, until your country has a decent record on fighting corruption and providing transparent administration and a trustworthy judicial system. It's nothing particular about Kosovo, it's just the way things are in the Balkans. This protocol is supposed to help in combating cross-border (note: not "cross-administrative-line") crime. You can't wait until you've got a healthy economy and are in the EU to deal with this - waiting means that these things won't happen. This is one of those times when you have to be practical rather than proud. Every country experiences them, including my own.

Why is the U.S. pushing for this? Because it's in your long-term interest as a free and independent country, that's why. The only problem is that the agreement is with Serbia, which allowed Serbian politicians to put their spin on it initially. Why didn't anybody in Prishtina complain when Eulex signed agreements "on its own behalf" with Albania etc? Because Albanian etc. politicians didn't start taunting you with claims that this was a national humiliation.

(Amer, 18 September 2009 02:11)

Firstly I am basing my judgment on information released in press. Thus I as most of the people have limited information therefore the possibility to make wrong assessment is high.

Amer: may we decide in our own what is good or bad for us?? Or am I too arrogant??

The pragmatism doesn’t come before the principles in my opinion.

Moreover since in this case it was in Serbia’s interest to be pragmatic not Kosova’s. While you saved their ego.

Why you didn’t say to Serbia well you will have to find some language with Prishtina and sign this technical (you could have emphasised this TECHNICAL stuff to them instead of doing that to US) agreement otherwise we will not be able to give you visa-free regime?? With this protocol it is Serbia that is getting something concrete while Kosova a promise that will never be kept. Thus it was in Serbias interest to be pragmatic and not proud. This is the POINT.

Almost all politicians in EU/US are repeating that Kosova is reality. Well this was one very good chance to start making Serbia get used to the reality: find an agreement with Kosova and you will get visa-free regime.

But instead of doing that you preferred to let Serbia still hope that it can circumvent the Govt of Kosova. Yesterday they were saying that UNMIK is in charge in Kosova today they say EULEX is in charge and so one. You allow Serbia to ignore what you continuously repeat: Kosova’s independence is a reality and there is no way back.

It dousen’t look to you like a bit contradictory??

And regarding the same protocol signed with Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro:

1. I am not saying the Thaci’s incompetence has nothing to do here quite on contrary and
2. it’s slightly different: if the Govt or any ministry of Kosova needs to get in touch with the any ministry of Albania, Macedonia or MN all it needs is send a fax or give a ring: reciprocity.

With Serbia it has to go via EULEX. So again: if Serbia doesn’t want to communicate with the legitimate and democratically elected Govt of Kosova than it’s HER problem not ours. So don’t twist my arm to please Serbian EGO (not to use some other euphemism thought much deserved).

It is very simple you humiliated us to save Serbian ego- to save Serbian racism of we don’t have nothing to do with that so called state of Kosova. PERIOD.

But as far as you get 1,000 people protesting against it in Prishtina, as far as you won’t find anyone else except me being critical but anything that comes from EU/US is accept always as the best thing for them it means that: you can do it- you are right and I'm wrong.

What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???

@ Amer

Don't you understand that the US do not care about their "friends" they care about their interest. All this was written on the wall, just accept, no choice!

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate.
(kate, 17 September 2009 15:43)

Kate, pro-forma it is UN protectorate, but the reality is a bit different. Here is what would happen with a traveller entering-exiting Kosovo from the north as of September 17, 2009:

- Slightly after Raska there is a Serbian MUP checkpoint. These guys do not joke, they are all very serious and not friendly at all. They mean business in strictest way.

- You drive several miles south and see the FORMER UNMIK Gate#1. It's a FORMER gate, there is absolutely no UNMIK there anymore.
Instead, OCCASIONALLY you will see EULEX, but they seem to do nothing. You will be greeted by Kosovska Mitrovica Police Unit. They are/were in much more friendly mood than their colleagues - maybe because they noticed some funny detail inside of my USA passport. No other question asked, only smiles and "Srecan Put".

- South of Zvecan there was a "mysterious" police force. I did drive with 10 mph though their post ignoring them. I did think, they were Albanians, but it turned out (driving back) they are not.

- Shortly after you see the Serbian flags and Cyrillic writings magically disappear there is the first and only Albanian checkpoint. They asked me where I am going from ("USA" was good enough) and where ("Pristina and than Skopje" was good enough). No more questions asked.

Going back:

- There is no one on Albanian side checking anything
- The guys I did ignore at first driving through their checkpoint turned out to be the same Kosovska Mitrovica police unit, which has nothing to do with Albanians - but pro forma they aren't the MUP unit either. Here the procedure was reverse. Their face was not the happiest at first seeing a US passport, but it changed quickly for some magic reason
- The exit was a no-event
- The last checkpoint of MUP is nothing more, than the checking the car plates and serial number against known stolen vehicles in their database. It takes about 5, but no more than 10 minutes for foreign cars, in particular if car seem to be expensive (it's not, but they do not know it).

The lession: Serbs are fully in charge with everything north of Mitrovica and my guess is, that while I can easily "smuggle" even Seselj to the South, the opposite (i.e. any known Kosovo "government" representative going North) is 100% impossible. I mean, it is of course possible, but most would stay in North well over 10 years. ;-)

Things may change any time of course, but this is the way of life at this moment. For me it did look, Serbs took the role of UNMIK in their hands entirely in the North, EULEX does nothing just watches the Serbs and Albanians can't even come close to the "Gate 1".


Otherwise - kudos to friendly KPS people who DID STOP - but DID NOT FINE me for a minor offense (headlights). And KPS was 100% right because it was my fault. Booo-booo to a MUP guy just before Cacak who stopped me for what I believe a BOGUS reason and wanted first 30000 (!!!) Dinars, than 3000 Dinars, later settled on 1000. Made me really angry because he knew where I am originally from and still played the "usual" game. I don't want to know, what would happen if I am not Ivan Ivanovich Ivanov but Arben Berisha, regardless of the passport. MUP should get rid of such people. "Thanks" to him I had to drive all over the night because no money was left for hotel. And usually upset and tired drivers are the most dangerous. Helloooooo.

I see arta made a very very valid point.
2 mil. people this time wount be giving up it Internationaly accepted Indipendent Kosovo. this time around, they have more to loose than in 1999.
(Olf, 17 September 2009 18:38)

Outdated info, certainly more than 2 mio by now.. :) and if you take the half mio "have not intention to go back" golden expats, then this is a real force! And then what??

becouse Serbia is pivotal country on Balkan"

Because of the wars you started. Now you can't anymore.

Kosova EULEX Serbia

so both countries talk but through EULEX. Get it now? EULEX has access to MUP and now wants access to KP.

I see arta made a very very valid point.
2 mil. people this time wount be giving up it Internationaly accepted Indipendent Kosovo. this time around, they have more to loose than in 1999.

ohoh!!!!!whatfun they will have with our information!I know a splendid new game:furnishing our police with false info,so that eulex get them and sent them to MUP! so,let begin the game,eulex!

All want to enter EU, but some don´t understand its basic principles.

Some countries will enter soon, others needs decades.

What a sick joke. Every Tom, Dick and Harry who worked in Kosovo knows that when all the police files were handed over by UNMIK to the KPS most were destroyed as certain files did not look favourably on certain members, their families and the politicians who run Kosovo today. Will EULEX ever wise up?

it's just the way things are in the Balkans.
(Amer, 18 September 2009 02:11)

Yes - and it's where I usually freak out if I hear it. :-(

"Why did I have to pay 5 Euro to FYROM-maniac policeman in Tabanovci?"
"Why did ask FYROM-maniac for 50 Euro first than lowered the price as he seen, I was born in Russia?"
"Why Grachanica Monastery has no power?"
"Why did ask the MUP policeman near Chachak 30000 Dinars for nothing, than I had to spend half an hour arguing with him and paying 1000 Dinars instead of 30000 - again, for nothing? just because my car has US plates and is pretty big, does not mean it's expensive and does not mean, he can extort 30000 Dinars for "foglights being on". And if yes, than either the law is crazy or he has no right to lower the 30000 to 1000 just because there is a "birthplace Russia" comment in my US passport.

If I complain about all this, the answer is usually "please forgive us, this is Balkan mentality" - and I freak out because as long as "Balkan mentality" is an excuse to forgive, Grachanica will be without power and other bad things above will happen on all sides.

Anyway, except the "border" versus "administrative line" thing you are 100% right.

By the way: the sister of "please forgive (AL/KS/SRB/MK/etc) - this is our silly Balkan mentality" is the "please forgive that poor Hungary, we are light years behind America" excuse I hear every day in Hungary. They say that, sigh once.... and continue the same chaos they just stopped to do talking to me. And I freak out at that as well. As long as "poor Hungary" as excuse does exist... guess what, Hungary will stay poor as it is.

Anyway, today woke up with my American feet, not Russian or Hungarian first. Apologies to ones who is offended. Not everything what is coming from the States is evil.

Amer: may we decide in our own what is good or bad for us?? Or am I too arrogant??

(ben, 18 September 2009 11:52)

No, you can't. To a large degree the (rest of) Serbia can't either, neither any smaller East European country. That won't make you happier, but this is the case in my opinion.

I do not think, you are arrogant on that - good part of the blame is on "West" for pursuing it's own interest.

Let me be now very arrogant and sorry for that.

Even if I am American: a pro-American kindergarten versus a pro-Russian kindergarten is still basically a kindergarten at first. And sometimes the kids in that kindergarten can turn pretty violent for apparently no reason.

If kids in the pro-Russian part of the kindergarten look a bit more mature, than I rather try to talk to them first.


In the old YU together all you had the combined power. Instead of working out a better union everyone was busy cutting the branches they were sitting on and the "West" realizing they will benefit provided you all the tools to cut these branches quicker.

And of course, the bogus religion + ethnic reasons turned out to be the best tool.

It is good to see that EULEX is still in control of Kosovo.

It is very sad to see that a lot of Albanians here use every thing to 'prove' that Kosovo is an independent counrty.

While it is so simple: is 1244 still valid? Yes! So we all know Kosovo is just a Serbian province!

Learn to live togehter and stop wasting our tax money!

Truth is that once the West said yes, it is yes. 2 Million people will not take it laying down a reversal. EU will be there for a while, but then they control Serbia, Albania, MN and everyone hoping to join EU. Like making Serbia sign a document that states to patrol the "border" with Kosovo.
(aRta, 17 September 2009 17:20)

Why do you Albanians always keep referring to this magical number of 2 million?

Who are these two million who are going to take to the streets? Are you including women and children and elderly in this? Is this your force?

Which is fine with me. The same they should ask from MUP Serbia too.

“EULEX wants to establish a permanent system that would allow it to make non-stop, ad hoc requests for access to the Kosovo police’s information,”

“European officials have confirmed the news, adding that they would not be divulging any information without Priština’s prior consent.”

This is all fine to me!

You are monitoring mission so you cannot stay blind- you should have access. I have always been pro-EULEX deployment btw.

The only thing that bothers me and it seriously annoys me is that you go far beyond the monitoring mission and take attributes of effective and sole authorities also representing Kosova a broad.

You are not intermediary mission and neither our governors.

If Serbia needs information (concerning their legitimate interest in fighting the organized crime) she should send her request to the Govt of Kosova MoI as Kosova’s MoI should send her requests to MUP.

If Serbia doesn’t want to communicate with legitimate democratic Govt of Kosova – it’s HER problem NOT ours.

So don’t twist my arm for something that doesn’t depend on my good will but on others. Moreover, since it’s in their interest to get this deal not in mine: they will get visa liberalisation not me.

And it’s utterly rude to twist arms of legitimate and democratically elected governors moreover if they consider you as friends. You don’t twist arm to a friend this is something that even a child of 5 knows. However it’s your shame not ours.! You could have at least speared us with the ‘peanuts agreement’ the day after it would have been more elegant in my opinion.

"European officials have confirmed the news, adding that they would not be divulging any information without Prishtina’s prior consent."

I wouldnt count on that, either the current Government respond NO or start pushing for early elections. Ppl have had enough of lies, and someone will have to pay the price, either the Government or EULEX, I would personally see both kicked out.

ben - Serbia would no doubt send any requests to EULEX and vice versa, and EULEX would deal with Pristina. There would be no need for Serbia to make any direct requests or for Pristina to deal with Belgrade until proper communication channels are in place (ie. a proper solution is reached).

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate.

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate."

hehehehe...grasping at straws. So, what's the UN's postion on:
Kosova's Security Force?
Merdare Highway?
Removal of the border with Albania?
And finally what's the UN position on Kosova's declaration of independence? Did the UN condemn it?

Truth is that once the West said yes, it is yes. 2 Million people will not take it laying down a reversal. EU will be there for a while, but then they control Serbia, Albania, MN and everyone hoping to join EU. Like making Serbia sign a document that states to patrol the "border" with Kosovo.

It is very simple.

If Serbia doesn’t want to it doesn’t have to. We cannot care less.

The issue is why is EU doing the dirty job for Serbia???

Did we look to you keen or willing to sign a protocol with you??? It doesn’t result to me. We cannot care less for you! You are history for us and will remain so for ever.

You are out of the picture for us, you are done.

What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???

But for Serbia and having any relations with you, we cannot care less this is for sure.

Belgrade should never have to ask anything of Pristina's puppet institutions. Serbia does not recognize it's Southern province as independent of Belgrade's authority. EULEX will be the go-between for all matters in Kosovo. The Albanians welcomed the EU mission there, now they must obey. Did they (K_Albanians) really think that they would get real independence, just because they received recognitions of independence? This was the West's plan for control of the area from the start.

•
Of course this should be shared openly with EULEX and MUP. It would be to everyone's benefit in tackling crime.
(kate, 17 September 2009, 14:47)

Very true, Kate.

Ben, it is not so much to do with Serbia as has to do with EULEX executive department making arrests and dealing with internal corruption of KPS and Pristina authorities... monitoring is not the only part of the mission.

'If Serbia needs information (concerning their legitimate interest in fighting the organized crime) she should send her request to the Govt of Kosova MoI as Kosova’s MoI should send her requests to MUP.'

If this had been possible, then there would have been no need for the protocol. This is a temporary agreement, until Prishtina and Belgrade are talking to each other. In the meantime, not being able to go after cross-border crime benefits only the criminals.

See the lead article in today's Danas, an interview with Kostunica ( http://www.danas.rs/vesti/naslovna.1.html ) - "Srbija formalno priznala granice nezavisnog Kosova" - he doesn't like the agreement either, and obviously sees it as being in Kosovo's interest. Even the Bgd politicians who were crowing over this being evidence of EULEX "ruling" Kosovo on behalf of Serbia have fallen silent.

I think Kostunica exaggerates the importance of the terminology used, but he's right that the document doesn't use a translation of the Serb-preferred expression "administrativna linija." It's hardly because English is defective and has no way of expressing the concept - "administrative line" would have worked just fine, if they'd wanted to use it. So they end up with "border/boundary" - "border" is the Kosovar interpretation of the line, "boundary" is as neutral as you can get. So, who won that one?

I see arta made a very very valid point.
2 mil. people this time wount be giving up it Internationaly accepted Indipendent Kosovo. this time around, they have more to loose than in 1999.

Of course this should be shared openly with EULEX and MUP. It would be to everyone's benefit in tackling crime.

Amer: may we decide in our own what is good or bad for us?? Or am I too arrogant??

(ben, 18 September 2009 11:52)

No, you can't. To a large degree the (rest of) Serbia can't either, neither any smaller East European country. That won't make you happier, but this is the case in my opinion.

I do not think, you are arrogant on that - good part of the blame is on "West" for pursuing it's own interest.

Let me be now very arrogant and sorry for that.

Even if I am American: a pro-American kindergarten versus a pro-Russian kindergarten is still basically a kindergarten at first. And sometimes the kids in that kindergarten can turn pretty violent for apparently no reason.

If kids in the pro-Russian part of the kindergarten look a bit more mature, than I rather try to talk to them first.


In the old YU together all you had the combined power. Instead of working out a better union everyone was busy cutting the branches they were sitting on and the "West" realizing they will benefit provided you all the tools to cut these branches quicker.

And of course, the bogus religion + ethnic reasons turned out to be the best tool.

ohoh!!!!!whatfun they will have with our information!I know a splendid new game:furnishing our police with false info,so that eulex get them and sent them to MUP! so,let begin the game,eulex!

becouse Serbia is pivotal country on Balkan"

Because of the wars you started. Now you can't anymore.

Kosova EULEX Serbia

so both countries talk but through EULEX. Get it now? EULEX has access to MUP and now wants access to KP.

Hey KPS watch out!! There are some real police officers coming your way. Get out the burn bags and shredders out. Also download a few more porn sites onto the computers so they are even more virus ridden then the nasty EULUX boys and girls won’t realise how incompetent you all are.

So now EULEX wants oversight of KPS? Another alleged "independent" apparatus of an alleged "independent" state which is subjected to scrutiny by an alleged "mediating advisor"?

It's certainly one way for Belgrade (read as MUP) to access KPS files since Belgrade works with EULEX. But put another way, no allegedly "sovereign" state should open their files to anyone else. But in the end, what is Pristina going to do other than protest for the cameras, but acquiesce behind closed doors.

This is looking like an international protectorate more and more every day.

Ben,
"The issue is why is EU doing the dirty job for Serbia???"

Maybe because the EU did the dirtiest job ever for supporting Kosovo UDI, and now can't sleep in the night because it has a very bad conscience.

Just guessing.

Ben - becouse Serbia is pivotal country on Balkan Peninsula and pseudoindependent Kosovo with no chance for EU/UN membership - is nothing.

What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???

@ Amer

Don't you understand that the US do not care about their "friends" they care about their interest. All this was written on the wall, just accept, no choice!

"Which is fine with me. The same they should ask from MUP Serbia too."
Olf

I agree! Eulex ask southern part of Serbia for access but not the norther part.

Ben wrote: "What I am arguing here is why the one that we consider as friends and who themselves repeat continuously to be our friends are actually bulling us to make you a favours??? Why US are humiliating perhaps the most pro-American nation on earth???"

Why is the U.S. pushing for this? Because it's in your long-term interest as a free and independent country, that's why. The only problem is that the agreement is with Serbia, which allowed Serbian politicians to put their spin on it initially. Why didn't anybody in Prishtina complain when Eulex signed agreements "on its own behalf" with Albania etc? Because Albanian etc. politicians didn't start taunting you with claims that this was a national humiliation.

More than any bilateral agreements, Kosovo needs foreign investment, but that's not going to come, even from the diaspora, until your country has a decent record on fighting corruption and providing transparent administration and a trustworthy judicial system. It's nothing particular about Kosovo, it's just the way things are in the Balkans. This protocol is supposed to help in combating cross-border (note: not "cross-administrative-line") crime. You can't wait until you've got a healthy economy and are in the EU to deal with this - waiting means that these things won't happen. This is one of those times when you have to be practical rather than proud. Every country experiences them, including my own.

All want to enter EU, but some don´t understand its basic principles.

Some countries will enter soon, others needs decades.

I see arta made a very very valid point.
2 mil. people this time wount be giving up it Internationaly accepted Indipendent Kosovo. this time around, they have more to loose than in 1999.
(Olf, 17 September 2009 18:38)

Outdated info, certainly more than 2 mio by now.. :) and if you take the half mio "have not intention to go back" golden expats, then this is a real force! And then what??

Why is the U.S. pushing for this? Because it's in your long-term interest as a free and independent country, that's why. The only problem is that the agreement is with Serbia, which allowed Serbian politicians to put their spin on it initially. Why didn't anybody in Prishtina complain when Eulex signed agreements "on its own behalf" with Albania etc? Because Albanian etc. politicians didn't start taunting you with claims that this was a national humiliation.

(Amer, 18 September 2009 02:11)

Firstly I am basing my judgment on information released in press. Thus I as most of the people have limited information therefore the possibility to make wrong assessment is high.

Amer: may we decide in our own what is good or bad for us?? Or am I too arrogant??

The pragmatism doesn’t come before the principles in my opinion.

Moreover since in this case it was in Serbia’s interest to be pragmatic not Kosova’s. While you saved their ego.

Why you didn’t say to Serbia well you will have to find some language with Prishtina and sign this technical (you could have emphasised this TECHNICAL stuff to them instead of doing that to US) agreement otherwise we will not be able to give you visa-free regime?? With this protocol it is Serbia that is getting something concrete while Kosova a promise that will never be kept. Thus it was in Serbias interest to be pragmatic and not proud. This is the POINT.

Almost all politicians in EU/US are repeating that Kosova is reality. Well this was one very good chance to start making Serbia get used to the reality: find an agreement with Kosova and you will get visa-free regime.

But instead of doing that you preferred to let Serbia still hope that it can circumvent the Govt of Kosova. Yesterday they were saying that UNMIK is in charge in Kosova today they say EULEX is in charge and so one. You allow Serbia to ignore what you continuously repeat: Kosova’s independence is a reality and there is no way back.

It dousen’t look to you like a bit contradictory??

And regarding the same protocol signed with Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro:

1. I am not saying the Thaci’s incompetence has nothing to do here quite on contrary and
2. it’s slightly different: if the Govt or any ministry of Kosova needs to get in touch with the any ministry of Albania, Macedonia or MN all it needs is send a fax or give a ring: reciprocity.

With Serbia it has to go via EULEX. So again: if Serbia doesn’t want to communicate with the legitimate and democratically elected Govt of Kosova than it’s HER problem not ours. So don’t twist my arm to please Serbian EGO (not to use some other euphemism thought much deserved).

It is very simple you humiliated us to save Serbian ego- to save Serbian racism of we don’t have nothing to do with that so called state of Kosova. PERIOD.

But as far as you get 1,000 people protesting against it in Prishtina, as far as you won’t find anyone else except me being critical but anything that comes from EU/US is accept always as the best thing for them it means that: you can do it- you are right and I'm wrong.

The whole point of EULEX is to act as an intermediary while Kosovo is a UN protectorate.
(kate, 17 September 2009 15:43)

Kate, pro-forma it is UN protectorate, but the reality is a bit different. Here is what would happen with a traveller entering-exiting Kosovo from the north as of September 17, 2009:

- Slightly after Raska there is a Serbian MUP checkpoint. These guys do not joke, they are all very serious and not friendly at all. They mean business in strictest way.

- You drive several miles south and see the FORMER UNMIK Gate#1. It's a FORMER gate, there is absolutely no UNMIK there anymore.
Instead, OCCASIONALLY you will see EULEX, but they seem to do nothing. You will be greeted by Kosovska Mitrovica Police Unit. They are/were in much more friendly mood than their colleagues - maybe because they noticed some funny detail inside of my USA passport. No other question asked, only smiles and "Srecan Put".

- South of Zvecan there was a "mysterious" police force. I did drive with 10 mph though their post ignoring them. I did think, they were Albanians, but it turned out (driving back) they are not.

- Shortly after you see the Serbian flags and Cyrillic writings magically disappear there is the first and only Albanian checkpoint. They asked me where I am going from ("USA" was good enough) and where ("Pristina and than Skopje" was good enough). No more questions asked.

Going back:

- There is no one on Albanian side checking anything
- The guys I did ignore at first driving through their checkpoint turned out to be the same Kosovska Mitrovica police unit, which has nothing to do with Albanians - but pro forma they aren't the MUP unit either. Here the procedure was reverse. Their face was not the happiest at first seeing a US passport, but it changed quickly for some magic reason
- The exit was a no-event
- The last checkpoint of MUP is nothing more, than the checking the car plates and serial number against known stolen vehicles in their database. It takes about 5, but no more than 10 minutes for foreign cars, in particular if car seem to be expensive (it's not, but they do not know it).

The lession: Serbs are fully in charge with everything north of Mitrovica and my guess is, that while I can easily "smuggle" even Seselj to the South, the opposite (i.e. any known Kosovo "government" representative going North) is 100% impossible. I mean, it is of course possible, but most would stay in North well over 10 years. ;-)

Things may change any time of course, but this is the way of life at this moment. For me it did look, Serbs took the role of UNMIK in their hands entirely in the North, EULEX does nothing just watches the Serbs and Albanians can't even come close to the "Gate 1".


Otherwise - kudos to friendly KPS people who DID STOP - but DID NOT FINE me for a minor offense (headlights). And KPS was 100% right because it was my fault. Booo-booo to a MUP guy just before Cacak who stopped me for what I believe a BOGUS reason and wanted first 30000 (!!!) Dinars, than 3000 Dinars, later settled on 1000. Made me really angry because he knew where I am originally from and still played the "usual" game. I don't want to know, what would happen if I am not Ivan Ivanovich Ivanov but Arben Berisha, regardless of the passport. MUP should get rid of such people. "Thanks" to him I had to drive all over the night because no money was left for hotel. And usually upset and tired drivers are the most dangerous. Helloooooo.

it's just the way things are in the Balkans.
(Amer, 18 September 2009 02:11)

Yes - and it's where I usually freak out if I hear it. :-(

"Why did I have to pay 5 Euro to FYROM-maniac policeman in Tabanovci?"
"Why did ask FYROM-maniac for 50 Euro first than lowered the price as he seen, I was born in Russia?"
"Why Grachanica Monastery has no power?"
"Why did ask the MUP policeman near Chachak 30000 Dinars for nothing, than I had to spend half an hour arguing with him and paying 1000 Dinars instead of 30000 - again, for nothing? just because my car has US plates and is pretty big, does not mean it's expensive and does not mean, he can extort 30000 Dinars for "foglights being on". And if yes, than either the law is crazy or he has no right to lower the 30000 to 1000 just because there is a "birthplace Russia" comment in my US passport.

If I complain about all this, the answer is usually "please forgive us, this is Balkan mentality" - and I freak out because as long as "Balkan mentality" is an excuse to forgive, Grachanica will be without power and other bad things above will happen on all sides.

Anyway, except the "border" versus "administrative line" thing you are 100% right.

By the way: the sister of "please forgive (AL/KS/SRB/MK/etc) - this is our silly Balkan mentality" is the "please forgive that poor Hungary, we are light years behind America" excuse I hear every day in Hungary. They say that, sigh once.... and continue the same chaos they just stopped to do talking to me. And I freak out at that as well. As long as "poor Hungary" as excuse does exist... guess what, Hungary will stay poor as it is.

Anyway, today woke up with my American feet, not Russian or Hungarian first. Apologies to ones who is offended. Not everything what is coming from the States is evil.

What a sick joke. Every Tom, Dick and Harry who worked in Kosovo knows that when all the police files were handed over by UNMIK to the KPS most were destroyed as certain files did not look favourably on certain members, their families and the politicians who run Kosovo today. Will EULEX ever wise up?

It is good to see that EULEX is still in control of Kosovo.

It is very sad to see that a lot of Albanians here use every thing to 'prove' that Kosovo is an independent counrty.

While it is so simple: is 1244 still valid? Yes! So we all know Kosovo is just a Serbian province!

Learn to live togehter and stop wasting our tax money!

Truth is that once the West said yes, it is yes. 2 Million people will not take it laying down a reversal. EU will be there for a while, but then they control Serbia, Albania, MN and everyone hoping to join EU. Like making Serbia sign a document that states to patrol the "border" with Kosovo.
(aRta, 17 September 2009 17:20)

Why do you Albanians always keep referring to this magical number of 2 million?

Who are these two million who are going to take to the streets? Are you including women and children and elderly in this? Is this your force?