51

Wednesday, 20.05.2009.

09:18

Biden: Forge bilateral relations

The U.S. "does not expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo," nor will this affect bilateral relations, says U.S. Vice-President Joseph Biden.

Izvor: B92

Biden: Forge bilateral relations IMAGE SOURCE
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51 Komentari

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316 '

This is a list of NOMINAL (OVERALL) GDP values, not per capita.

Of course larger countries rank higher here (even if they are obviously poorer). Factoring out Kosovo would simply lower the overall total.

But it's the per capita numbers that indicate how productive a country is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

(I don't trust Wikipedia for historical interpretation, but they can copy tables efficiently.)

In the per-capita list, Slovenia ranks 30 (with $29,472) and Serbia 75 (with $10,792) for 2008. For example.

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Denis

pre 14 godina

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.
(Jovan, 20 May 2009 22:06)

Why is Serbia a more reliable nation to the US than the Albanians? Is it because Serbia is a Russian satelite, even though it received billions from the US and the west?

Is it because Albanians are a NATO member now, the youngest, and most dinamic nation in Europe, and have always been part of the pro-american block in Europe?

Serbia's natural ally has always been and will always be Russia. It was Tito & communism who separated you from your beloved Russia, and from being their representative in the heart of Europe, but Tito is long gone.

And as long as Russia's influence is unfavorable for the west, Serbia will of course be positioned eastward.

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - do You remember constitution of Yugoslavia and constitution of Socialist Republic of Serbia? Was Kosovo one of republic of Yugoslavia or was Kosovo part of Serbia?
Do you remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo is a part of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " - from 1974 constitution.
Do You remember UN Security Council Resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independent" Kosovo but is about "territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia" which Serbia is now the recognized successor state.

So - unilateral declaration of independence was ILLEGAL. Is against international law, and countries who recognized Kosovo - break international law.

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - according to pre-war constitution of Serbia - Kosovo was "autonomous province of Serbia" - not Federal Republic like Croatia or Bosna.
Do You remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo IS A PART of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " (pre-Milosevic constitution). And do You remember UN SC resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independence" for Kosovo - but lot about territorial INTEGRITY of Yugoslavia.

So - Kosovo according to international law - is integral part of Yugoslavia succesor - Republic of Serbia ant their unilateral declaration of indepence is ILLEGAL.
American nad Albanian hypoctrites break international law.

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DimTuc

pre 14 godina

“Washington strong support a united Bosnia, united Georgia, united Azerbaijan, so why they don't support united Serbia?
(Milan, 20 May 2009 23:18)”

Washington does support a united Serbia, in fact that’s why it supported your troops flushing the UCMP (???) whatever extension of the KLA out of Presevo back in 2001. Of course, the US also supports a united Kosovo/a, that’s what you didn’t add.

In fact further, the contradiction is the other way around. You say Washington supports a united Bosnia, but in fact it gave Bosnia Dayton, ie, a Bosnia permanently divided into ethnic-based republics, in opposition to the original ethnic mix of the country. In other words, Washington gave Karadzic what he and his boss in Belgrade had been fighting for, indeed far more than was Serb majority “ethnic territory.” So how would you like it if support for “unity of Serbia” took the same form as “unity of Bosnia,” with a Bosniak confederal republic in Sanjak, and Albanian confederal republic in Presevo and a Hungarian confederal republic in northern Vojvodina? Yeh, you wouldn’t. Kosova, of course, is different, as it was a unit of the Yugoslav federation. But even there, if you see independence as breaking unity of Serbia, then tell me: were you prepared to offer Kosovo what RS has in Bosnia – a fully fledged “Repuiblica Albania”, with an equal voice in a new Belgrade based federation, where the other equal unit is the Serb republic in the rest? No you were not.

“I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. (elz, 20 May 2009 19:38)”

Thank you very much for that research.

“Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:
"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening.”

I’ve no intention of being a lawyer for Biden, as anyone reading my comments knows. However, let’s be clear for clarity sake – what he is saying here is that Serbia should be occupied by NATO in the same way as Germany and Japan were after WWII. Personally I abhor that kind of imperial arrogance, but it is ridiculous to twist this to mean he was advocating a Nazi-type occupation of Serbia, let alone stretching that to suggest he wants “all Serbs” in Nazi concentration camps.

“Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.
Respectfully to your stance and your comments,
(miri, 20 May 2009 21:13)”

Respectfully to your too miri, but I’m talking principles. Yes I know the winners and the powerful make the rules in practice. That’s why Serbia will never get reparations from the NATO, and also why Bosnia and Kosova will never get reparations from Serbia.

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robert Burns

pre 14 godina

Bottom line is that yesterday may prove to be an historic day. It may be the end of isolation and the beginning of influence. I cannot believe there are more comments on Bahrain and whatever that other place was. That is insignificant if yesterday heralds a new era of co operation. The US ain't going to change it's primary position on Kosovo but expect, in the future, to feel lots of pressure to come up with a lasting and durable compromise on certain issues.

Yesterday was not a sign of weakness but of a stronger Serbia. A country who has maintained and reinforced it's claims but is set to be given more credence on the world stage.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms...
Tony UK

Don't you have the same hospitality for visiting politicians from Germany?

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tim

pre 14 godina

Next time one of these from the USA comes, they should be met with a general strike. Park all cars, stop pedestrian traffic and all commerce for one hour. Then after that principled peaceful protest, you can go back to having your government pimp you out to the West.
Or maybe mass protests can only be organised by the CIA for you?

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HE WHO SPEAKS THE TRUTH

pre 14 godina

Does not matter how large of the reception you recieve it is what is acheieved. Now i guess since Pristina is going all out to show the world how much it appreciated VP Biden and US. Where is all of this money coming from to put on this show? Where are all of these jobs that the current government has promised the people? Still corruption runs rampant and no end in site. Instead of putting on a show of unimaginable pagentry invest that money in the companies so they can hire people and put them to work. I guess the Kosovo Air Force will fly and meet Air Force 2. Come on folks is this rhectoric is worth the time to write. My god folks

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lowe

pre 14 godina

"('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")
(Amer, 20 May 2009 20:24) "

Well, the Russians would tell Obama the same thing too -- don't expect us to recognize Kosovo's UDI which we consider illegal!

Actually I kinda suspect Obama doesn't even know where is Kosovo should you give him an atlas!

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.


(konstantin gregovic, 20 May 2009 22:11)


Actually, Konstantian, IMF exudes Kosovo when it calculates Serbia's numbers. Check their website. I love how people go on making claims thinking nobody will check.

Saying Serbia has a significant role to play in the region is not the same as saying Serbia is a regional superpower. That's a far fetched logic. In any case, when it comes to small countries power is being measured more and more via economy. In that measurement, Serbia falls somewhere towards the bottom of the list. Serbian economy is not as stellar as you imagined. Serbia's economy is in a better shape than that of Kosovo, but lags behind most other neighbors.

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Tony UK

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms and with highest security measures! Who is the puppet now? God bless America, the beacon of peace and freedom

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Agim

pre 14 godina

"Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here?"

Why is Obama talking to Iran, Cuba, and other rogue states? Different approach to reach the same goals! Keep your friends close and your enemies closer

--"Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it. "

Bwhahahaha! If Putin says jump how many Serbs would say how high? That's how reliable you are. Albania is a NATO member and you can't even say that size matters, they are 6-7 million Albanians in the Balkans (average age under 30!)

I hate to see serbs getting so excited over a visit after being neglected for so lo00ong. As Biden said some nice words: see what he'll say tomorrow in Kosova or look at Bahrain's recognition, IMF membership and so on. Consider Biden's visit as "another victory," more states will recognize Kosova tomorrow and it will join World Bank in June--all thanks to Biden and Obama, your "friends."

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.
(miri, 20 May 2009 15:17)

no, miri, once again you don´t get it.

before, there was the Bush-regime which was lead by a more or less naive "leader" who even let some simple thieves steal his wrist-watch.

there was nothing to discuss with this person, he was good enough to give the K-albanian the feeling of "being important" while actually you´re just the backlight of Europe. that´s reality, my dear.

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.

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konstantin gregovic

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.

Take the billions out in NATO bombing done to the economy and Serbia would be close to Belarus @ 59 in the world.



PPP takes in account costs of living and rates of inflation to deriver a much more relavent GDP number.

Serbia is the regional power in the region and will only get stronger. Kosovo is the albatross on its back.

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miri

pre 14 godina

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"
(Dim Tuc, 20 May 2009 17:51)

Dim Tuc

Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.

Respectfully to your stance and your comments,

miri.

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Jan, Poland

pre 14 godina

"The United States does not, I emphasize, does not expect Serbia to recognize the independence of Kosovo,"

Why?? Becouse they know, that this is wrong decision.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Tunxh

Albania for sure is and never will be a power to count on. And it doesn't matter how many NATOS you join.

"Serbia has a central role in the region, which cannot prosper without Serbia playing a constructive leading role,” the U.S. vice president stated."

Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here? Albanians say "Biden will come to Belgrade and tell the Serbs to accept this and that" but what happend? I guess Bidens visit to the Balkans could perhaps get you up to date with reality.

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elz

pre 14 godina

Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:

"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening. It's the only thing that will ultimately work. But that's not what anyone, but the three of us, have been talking about from the beginning. So when the president says he's not for total victory, he's not what we're for, but he never was, nor was NATO, nor was anybody but the three of us."

But those other name-calling comments, I cannot find anywhere.

However, I do not think that is why he has come to Belgrade today and I believe that he deserves to be heard out.

I think that lots of things have been said in the past on all sides that we regret.

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden. '

That second one must be when Biden is saying something like 'so you're the guy who caused all the problems' - Sutanovic at least looks highly amused.

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JohnBoy

pre 14 godina

This was a good outcome. The ds oppressed public demonstrations. If Serbia does not get into the eu before the next election or in two years, the Radicals come to power!

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
[link]
[link]
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 17:34)

Ok, so he wasn’t hiding apparently. Looks like Tadic inserted him in the “greeters” line at the airport because Biden refused to have a bilateral meeting with him. Notice how Biden had an individual meeting with FM of Bosnia Alkalaj and has already a scheduled meeting with FM of Kosovo Hyseni, but not with your boy Jeremic. You think this is a coincidence. I think not. Before you respond with “ Jeremic is doing a good job because Albanians hate him”, answer why he didn’t meet Jeremic? He is supposed to be the chief conductor of foreign relations for Serbia. Or is he just DS’s PR boy for the population of Serbia?

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Jovan Z

pre 14 godina

I love it how Albanians a better reception Kosmet than in Beograd. Really? Good for you ,you can have him. Show him the meaning of bootlicking.
It would be uncomfortable visiting a country which I talked so much vile garbage about. As for the person above who doubts what Biden stated
In 1999, it is true I watched it with my own eyes and heard with my ears. You think Serbs are making this up ? That would be silly wouldn’t it?

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.'

Not really. Bush put Balkan policy on auto-pilot and this did suit Banja Luka, especially, just fine. The new administration said from the beginning that changes had to be made and intended to send a high-level representative to check things out, but finally decided that things were worse than expected and that Biden himself should go and see for himself. With all the extra costs and annoyances associated with a White House visit this entails, for both sides.

('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")

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elz

pre 14 godina

I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. Unfortunately this site does not allow the upload of documents, but an in-depth search, using lexus nexus provides the entire transcript of the interview and Vice President Biden did not state that "Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists."

I will lexus nexus the MTP as well and check it, although I would be surprised if he said that.

Also it is interesting that all these transcripts go back to dates that are no longer archived and that require special search engines such as lexus nexus to retrieve them. This makes it easy to spread false information.

This is not to say that I agree with policies, but I definitely agree that it is inappropriate to go about quoting Vice President Biden for comments that he did not make.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"I heard all journalists had to take their shoes off just in case he got the same treatment as Bush in Iraq."
Zoran


Ha ha ha! Priceless comment!

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Tunxh

pre 14 godina

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 15:19)


Keep thinking that. Serbia is the regional power? No my friend, that honor goes to the countries surrounding it, like Croatia, Romania, Bulgaria, and Slovenia, which have a much much much higher standard of living than Serbia, who along with Croatia and Albania are NATO members, and the majority of whose populations have unfavorable dispositions towards the Serbia. Serbia is a landlocked country surrounded by NATO members.

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Lenard

pre 14 godina

Biden said that he was coming to the region with a clear message: to reinforce the U.S.’s long-term commitment to Europe. Yes of course the American Biden view. I wonder what he sees is it the natives dresst in their old native close waiting for the Americans to pat them on the heads. While America and its puppet the British go around the world bopping the heads of subversive nations to the Anglo-American dream of world domination. In politics resources any thing else they feel that their greed should control. Where they go in the world theirs are trails of countless misery and of murders. I guess Serbian President Boris Tadić is signing up to the same Anglo-American dream aren't they irresistible.

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

So Tadic and the yellows decided to ban all public gatherings and demonstrations as the NATO bombardier and anti-Serb hate monger comes to vist. I thought these were supposed to be 'democrats', not totalitarians. But the truth comes out, they do what they are told by Washington. This whole thing stinks, stinks to high heaven. Tadic is a truly pathetic figure who does not represent the views of his citizens. New elections please!!

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Dim Tuc

pre 14 godina

"(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” "

Could someone please provide a reference for these wild assertions? I have no love for the guy, but severaltimes posters have sent an urlclaiming Biden said these things, I watched the youtube, and these words weren't there. If this is what he said, it is appalling. If not, you will have ore credibility if you criticise him for what he actually did or said.

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"The U.S. "does not expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo," nor will this affect bilateral relations, says U.S. Vice-President Joseph Biden."

But...I thought Biden came with the message for Serbia to recognize Kosovo or DIE!!!
Well dear Albanians I guess you couldn't trust Kosova Press after all. I guess that's why you get your news about the world here at B92.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98830
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98802

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Agim

pre 14 godina

Trap has been set: In Bosnia Biden said "We don't expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo any time soon," in his notes "any time soon" was not in.

First, get serbia to lower rhetoric, to stop the illegal and immoral parallel structures...and when Serbia is ready to get in EU tell them. By then Kosova will have consolidated everything and with the lower serb volume it will be easier to accept the reality.

Great welcome for Serbs: I know no one usually visits you so I hope you enjoyed it.

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lowe

pre 14 godina

Read between the lines -- Biden is really telling the Balkans not to rock the boat, America has enough troubles at home already as it is and can do with one less problem abroad. Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.

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David, Toronto

pre 14 godina

Wow. I guess you need to shake hands with everyone even your enemies sometimes. Kosovo has been ethnically cleansed of Serbs and 300,000 have been ethnically cleansed from Croatia - with Mr. Biden's support and encouragement. And yet Albania and Croatia are welcomed into NATO. If this is Mr. Biden's type of model to follow- I don't think Serbia should want any part of it. A stoic, just, democratic and Orthodox path is the only one to follow.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

blero

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".

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miri

pre 14 godina

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

(Jovan, 20 May 2009 14:05)

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.

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vesna

pre 14 godina

It is a good idea that schools and general population get reminded on this 'statement' coming from Biden:
(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” and other equally unforgivable outbursts of hatred and malice.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"Biden arrived in Belgrade this morning in Air Force 2, which was met in Serbian airspace by a squadron of Serbian Army MIG fighters."

I heard that a similar thing is waiting for Biden in Kosovo. However, instead of MIG fighters the Albanians will send up balloons!

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

It really is disgusting to see Biden, the chief Serb hater and albanian lobbyist in the US, get the red carpet treatment by Tadic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQINoX2wJfQ
Biden is one of the main culprits who is responsible for the illegal bombing and occupation of Serbia, which makes him a war criminal. War criminals belong in jail, not on the red carpet Mr. Tadic.
Oh wait, I forgot, Tadic only sends his own people to jail, and treats the imperialist war mongers like guests of honour.

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

right so, Mike.

he´s a tragic figure, I´d say.

only a few years ago, agitating in the worst manner against Serbia - and today travelling to Serbia and being hosted as a visitor...

and then speaking about "reinforcing the US-comittment in Europe..."

especially after the South-Stream-alliance crushed US-american visions of strong US-influence in the region.

empty words spoken by a tragic figure.

nothing more.

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

so, show this tragic figure what serbian hospitality means. ( thousands of US-visitors per year learn it anyway )

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blero

pre 14 godina

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 12:39)

MikeC, please tell me you are joking.
Who’s got the tail between the legs?
1. The one that comes to you and tells you what he thinks (and what you should do)!
2. The one that accepts Albanians best friend and the biggest pro-Kosovo supporter with open arms!

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Kosova-USA

pre 14 godina

After all badmouthing , he received a red carpet treatment including honor guards+escorted by military jets. I said this all along ,but some said otherwise. The most extravagant welcome will happened tomorrow in Prishtina.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Looking at the image of Mr Tadic and Mr Biden walking down the red carpet I just can't get my eyes off the flag behind Mr Biden. It's simply the most beautiful flag in the world :)

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"..and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."
Oud

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?

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Oud

pre 14 godina

Greated with MIG´s by the Serbian obedient puppet regime, this is the man that called Serbians in Larry King live "illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists." And during the 1999 NATO attack on Serbia, he appeared on Meet the Press (May 9, 1999) and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."

Can Serbia sink any further into the imperial slime-barrel?

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Oud

pre 14 godina

Greated with MIG´s by the Serbian obedient puppet regime, this is the man that called Serbians in Larry King live "illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists." And during the 1999 NATO attack on Serbia, he appeared on Meet the Press (May 9, 1999) and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."

Can Serbia sink any further into the imperial slime-barrel?

Preporučujem 95 Ne preporučujem 43
MikeC

pre 14 godina

"..and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."
Oud

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Looking at the image of Mr Tadic and Mr Biden walking down the red carpet I just can't get my eyes off the flag behind Mr Biden. It's simply the most beautiful flag in the world :)

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"Biden arrived in Belgrade this morning in Air Force 2, which was met in Serbian airspace by a squadron of Serbian Army MIG fighters."

I heard that a similar thing is waiting for Biden in Kosovo. However, instead of MIG fighters the Albanians will send up balloons!

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blero

pre 14 godina

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 12:39)

MikeC, please tell me you are joking.
Who’s got the tail between the legs?
1. The one that comes to you and tells you what he thinks (and what you should do)!
2. The one that accepts Albanians best friend and the biggest pro-Kosovo supporter with open arms!

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

It really is disgusting to see Biden, the chief Serb hater and albanian lobbyist in the US, get the red carpet treatment by Tadic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQINoX2wJfQ
Biden is one of the main culprits who is responsible for the illegal bombing and occupation of Serbia, which makes him a war criminal. War criminals belong in jail, not on the red carpet Mr. Tadic.
Oh wait, I forgot, Tadic only sends his own people to jail, and treats the imperialist war mongers like guests of honour.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

blero

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".

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vesna

pre 14 godina

It is a good idea that schools and general population get reminded on this 'statement' coming from Biden:
(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” and other equally unforgivable outbursts of hatred and malice.

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Jan, Poland

pre 14 godina

"The United States does not, I emphasize, does not expect Serbia to recognize the independence of Kosovo,"

Why?? Becouse they know, that this is wrong decision.

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

right so, Mike.

he´s a tragic figure, I´d say.

only a few years ago, agitating in the worst manner against Serbia - and today travelling to Serbia and being hosted as a visitor...

and then speaking about "reinforcing the US-comittment in Europe..."

especially after the South-Stream-alliance crushed US-american visions of strong US-influence in the region.

empty words spoken by a tragic figure.

nothing more.

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

so, show this tragic figure what serbian hospitality means. ( thousands of US-visitors per year learn it anyway )

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lowe

pre 14 godina

Read between the lines -- Biden is really telling the Balkans not to rock the boat, America has enough troubles at home already as it is and can do with one less problem abroad. Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.

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David, Toronto

pre 14 godina

Wow. I guess you need to shake hands with everyone even your enemies sometimes. Kosovo has been ethnically cleansed of Serbs and 300,000 have been ethnically cleansed from Croatia - with Mr. Biden's support and encouragement. And yet Albania and Croatia are welcomed into NATO. If this is Mr. Biden's type of model to follow- I don't think Serbia should want any part of it. A stoic, just, democratic and Orthodox path is the only one to follow.

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Agim

pre 14 godina

Trap has been set: In Bosnia Biden said "We don't expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo any time soon," in his notes "any time soon" was not in.

First, get serbia to lower rhetoric, to stop the illegal and immoral parallel structures...and when Serbia is ready to get in EU tell them. By then Kosova will have consolidated everything and with the lower serb volume it will be easier to accept the reality.

Great welcome for Serbs: I know no one usually visits you so I hope you enjoyed it.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"The U.S. "does not expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo," nor will this affect bilateral relations, says U.S. Vice-President Joseph Biden."

But...I thought Biden came with the message for Serbia to recognize Kosovo or DIE!!!
Well dear Albanians I guess you couldn't trust Kosova Press after all. I guess that's why you get your news about the world here at B92.

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

So Tadic and the yellows decided to ban all public gatherings and demonstrations as the NATO bombardier and anti-Serb hate monger comes to vist. I thought these were supposed to be 'democrats', not totalitarians. But the truth comes out, they do what they are told by Washington. This whole thing stinks, stinks to high heaven. Tadic is a truly pathetic figure who does not represent the views of his citizens. New elections please!!

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Kosova-USA

pre 14 godina

After all badmouthing , he received a red carpet treatment including honor guards+escorted by military jets. I said this all along ,but some said otherwise. The most extravagant welcome will happened tomorrow in Prishtina.

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konstantin gregovic

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.

Take the billions out in NATO bombing done to the economy and Serbia would be close to Belarus @ 59 in the world.



PPP takes in account costs of living and rates of inflation to deriver a much more relavent GDP number.

Serbia is the regional power in the region and will only get stronger. Kosovo is the albatross on its back.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"I heard all journalists had to take their shoes off just in case he got the same treatment as Bush in Iraq."
Zoran


Ha ha ha! Priceless comment!

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98830
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98802

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miri

pre 14 godina

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

(Jovan, 20 May 2009 14:05)

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.

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Dim Tuc

pre 14 godina

"(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” "

Could someone please provide a reference for these wild assertions? I have no love for the guy, but severaltimes posters have sent an urlclaiming Biden said these things, I watched the youtube, and these words weren't there. If this is what he said, it is appalling. If not, you will have ore credibility if you criticise him for what he actually did or said.

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.
(miri, 20 May 2009 15:17)

no, miri, once again you don´t get it.

before, there was the Bush-regime which was lead by a more or less naive "leader" who even let some simple thieves steal his wrist-watch.

there was nothing to discuss with this person, he was good enough to give the K-albanian the feeling of "being important" while actually you´re just the backlight of Europe. that´s reality, my dear.

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.

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Tunxh

pre 14 godina

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 15:19)


Keep thinking that. Serbia is the regional power? No my friend, that honor goes to the countries surrounding it, like Croatia, Romania, Bulgaria, and Slovenia, which have a much much much higher standard of living than Serbia, who along with Croatia and Albania are NATO members, and the majority of whose populations have unfavorable dispositions towards the Serbia. Serbia is a landlocked country surrounded by NATO members.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Tunxh

Albania for sure is and never will be a power to count on. And it doesn't matter how many NATOS you join.

"Serbia has a central role in the region, which cannot prosper without Serbia playing a constructive leading role,” the U.S. vice president stated."

Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here? Albanians say "Biden will come to Belgrade and tell the Serbs to accept this and that" but what happend? I guess Bidens visit to the Balkans could perhaps get you up to date with reality.

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lowe

pre 14 godina

"('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")
(Amer, 20 May 2009 20:24) "

Well, the Russians would tell Obama the same thing too -- don't expect us to recognize Kosovo's UDI which we consider illegal!

Actually I kinda suspect Obama doesn't even know where is Kosovo should you give him an atlas!

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robert Burns

pre 14 godina

Bottom line is that yesterday may prove to be an historic day. It may be the end of isolation and the beginning of influence. I cannot believe there are more comments on Bahrain and whatever that other place was. That is insignificant if yesterday heralds a new era of co operation. The US ain't going to change it's primary position on Kosovo but expect, in the future, to feel lots of pressure to come up with a lasting and durable compromise on certain issues.

Yesterday was not a sign of weakness but of a stronger Serbia. A country who has maintained and reinforced it's claims but is set to be given more credence on the world stage.

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elz

pre 14 godina

I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. Unfortunately this site does not allow the upload of documents, but an in-depth search, using lexus nexus provides the entire transcript of the interview and Vice President Biden did not state that "Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists."

I will lexus nexus the MTP as well and check it, although I would be surprised if he said that.

Also it is interesting that all these transcripts go back to dates that are no longer archived and that require special search engines such as lexus nexus to retrieve them. This makes it easy to spread false information.

This is not to say that I agree with policies, but I definitely agree that it is inappropriate to go about quoting Vice President Biden for comments that he did not make.

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HE WHO SPEAKS THE TRUTH

pre 14 godina

Does not matter how large of the reception you recieve it is what is acheieved. Now i guess since Pristina is going all out to show the world how much it appreciated VP Biden and US. Where is all of this money coming from to put on this show? Where are all of these jobs that the current government has promised the people? Still corruption runs rampant and no end in site. Instead of putting on a show of unimaginable pagentry invest that money in the companies so they can hire people and put them to work. I guess the Kosovo Air Force will fly and meet Air Force 2. Come on folks is this rhectoric is worth the time to write. My god folks

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Lenard

pre 14 godina

Biden said that he was coming to the region with a clear message: to reinforce the U.S.’s long-term commitment to Europe. Yes of course the American Biden view. I wonder what he sees is it the natives dresst in their old native close waiting for the Americans to pat them on the heads. While America and its puppet the British go around the world bopping the heads of subversive nations to the Anglo-American dream of world domination. In politics resources any thing else they feel that their greed should control. Where they go in the world theirs are trails of countless misery and of murders. I guess Serbian President Boris Tadić is signing up to the same Anglo-American dream aren't they irresistible.

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Jovan Z

pre 14 godina

I love it how Albanians a better reception Kosmet than in Beograd. Really? Good for you ,you can have him. Show him the meaning of bootlicking.
It would be uncomfortable visiting a country which I talked so much vile garbage about. As for the person above who doubts what Biden stated
In 1999, it is true I watched it with my own eyes and heard with my ears. You think Serbs are making this up ? That would be silly wouldn’t it?

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JohnBoy

pre 14 godina

This was a good outcome. The ds oppressed public demonstrations. If Serbia does not get into the eu before the next election or in two years, the Radicals come to power!

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elz

pre 14 godina

Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:

"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening. It's the only thing that will ultimately work. But that's not what anyone, but the three of us, have been talking about from the beginning. So when the president says he's not for total victory, he's not what we're for, but he never was, nor was NATO, nor was anybody but the three of us."

But those other name-calling comments, I cannot find anywhere.

However, I do not think that is why he has come to Belgrade today and I believe that he deserves to be heard out.

I think that lots of things have been said in the past on all sides that we regret.

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tim

pre 14 godina

Next time one of these from the USA comes, they should be met with a general strike. Park all cars, stop pedestrian traffic and all commerce for one hour. Then after that principled peaceful protest, you can go back to having your government pimp you out to the West.
Or maybe mass protests can only be organised by the CIA for you?

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms...
Tony UK

Don't you have the same hospitality for visiting politicians from Germany?

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden. '

That second one must be when Biden is saying something like 'so you're the guy who caused all the problems' - Sutanovic at least looks highly amused.

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
[link]
[link]
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 17:34)

Ok, so he wasn’t hiding apparently. Looks like Tadic inserted him in the “greeters” line at the airport because Biden refused to have a bilateral meeting with him. Notice how Biden had an individual meeting with FM of Bosnia Alkalaj and has already a scheduled meeting with FM of Kosovo Hyseni, but not with your boy Jeremic. You think this is a coincidence. I think not. Before you respond with “ Jeremic is doing a good job because Albanians hate him”, answer why he didn’t meet Jeremic? He is supposed to be the chief conductor of foreign relations for Serbia. Or is he just DS’s PR boy for the population of Serbia?

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - according to pre-war constitution of Serbia - Kosovo was "autonomous province of Serbia" - not Federal Republic like Croatia or Bosna.
Do You remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo IS A PART of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " (pre-Milosevic constitution). And do You remember UN SC resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independence" for Kosovo - but lot about territorial INTEGRITY of Yugoslavia.

So - Kosovo according to international law - is integral part of Yugoslavia succesor - Republic of Serbia ant their unilateral declaration of indepence is ILLEGAL.
American nad Albanian hypoctrites break international law.

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Tony UK

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms and with highest security measures! Who is the puppet now? God bless America, the beacon of peace and freedom

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miri

pre 14 godina

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"
(Dim Tuc, 20 May 2009 17:51)

Dim Tuc

Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.

Respectfully to your stance and your comments,

miri.

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - do You remember constitution of Yugoslavia and constitution of Socialist Republic of Serbia? Was Kosovo one of republic of Yugoslavia or was Kosovo part of Serbia?
Do you remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo is a part of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " - from 1974 constitution.
Do You remember UN Security Council Resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independent" Kosovo but is about "territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia" which Serbia is now the recognized successor state.

So - unilateral declaration of independence was ILLEGAL. Is against international law, and countries who recognized Kosovo - break international law.

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DimTuc

pre 14 godina

“Washington strong support a united Bosnia, united Georgia, united Azerbaijan, so why they don't support united Serbia?
(Milan, 20 May 2009 23:18)”

Washington does support a united Serbia, in fact that’s why it supported your troops flushing the UCMP (???) whatever extension of the KLA out of Presevo back in 2001. Of course, the US also supports a united Kosovo/a, that’s what you didn’t add.

In fact further, the contradiction is the other way around. You say Washington supports a united Bosnia, but in fact it gave Bosnia Dayton, ie, a Bosnia permanently divided into ethnic-based republics, in opposition to the original ethnic mix of the country. In other words, Washington gave Karadzic what he and his boss in Belgrade had been fighting for, indeed far more than was Serb majority “ethnic territory.” So how would you like it if support for “unity of Serbia” took the same form as “unity of Bosnia,” with a Bosniak confederal republic in Sanjak, and Albanian confederal republic in Presevo and a Hungarian confederal republic in northern Vojvodina? Yeh, you wouldn’t. Kosova, of course, is different, as it was a unit of the Yugoslav federation. But even there, if you see independence as breaking unity of Serbia, then tell me: were you prepared to offer Kosovo what RS has in Bosnia – a fully fledged “Repuiblica Albania”, with an equal voice in a new Belgrade based federation, where the other equal unit is the Serb republic in the rest? No you were not.

“I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. (elz, 20 May 2009 19:38)”

Thank you very much for that research.

“Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:
"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening.”

I’ve no intention of being a lawyer for Biden, as anyone reading my comments knows. However, let’s be clear for clarity sake – what he is saying here is that Serbia should be occupied by NATO in the same way as Germany and Japan were after WWII. Personally I abhor that kind of imperial arrogance, but it is ridiculous to twist this to mean he was advocating a Nazi-type occupation of Serbia, let alone stretching that to suggest he wants “all Serbs” in Nazi concentration camps.

“Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.
Respectfully to your stance and your comments,
(miri, 20 May 2009 21:13)”

Respectfully to your too miri, but I’m talking principles. Yes I know the winners and the powerful make the rules in practice. That’s why Serbia will never get reparations from the NATO, and also why Bosnia and Kosova will never get reparations from Serbia.

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.


(konstantin gregovic, 20 May 2009 22:11)


Actually, Konstantian, IMF exudes Kosovo when it calculates Serbia's numbers. Check their website. I love how people go on making claims thinking nobody will check.

Saying Serbia has a significant role to play in the region is not the same as saying Serbia is a regional superpower. That's a far fetched logic. In any case, when it comes to small countries power is being measured more and more via economy. In that measurement, Serbia falls somewhere towards the bottom of the list. Serbian economy is not as stellar as you imagined. Serbia's economy is in a better shape than that of Kosovo, but lags behind most other neighbors.

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Agim

pre 14 godina

"Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here?"

Why is Obama talking to Iran, Cuba, and other rogue states? Different approach to reach the same goals! Keep your friends close and your enemies closer

--"Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it. "

Bwhahahaha! If Putin says jump how many Serbs would say how high? That's how reliable you are. Albania is a NATO member and you can't even say that size matters, they are 6-7 million Albanians in the Balkans (average age under 30!)

I hate to see serbs getting so excited over a visit after being neglected for so lo00ong. As Biden said some nice words: see what he'll say tomorrow in Kosova or look at Bahrain's recognition, IMF membership and so on. Consider Biden's visit as "another victory," more states will recognize Kosova tomorrow and it will join World Bank in June--all thanks to Biden and Obama, your "friends."

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.'

Not really. Bush put Balkan policy on auto-pilot and this did suit Banja Luka, especially, just fine. The new administration said from the beginning that changes had to be made and intended to send a high-level representative to check things out, but finally decided that things were worse than expected and that Biden himself should go and see for himself. With all the extra costs and annoyances associated with a White House visit this entails, for both sides.

('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")

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Denis

pre 14 godina

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.
(Jovan, 20 May 2009 22:06)

Why is Serbia a more reliable nation to the US than the Albanians? Is it because Serbia is a Russian satelite, even though it received billions from the US and the west?

Is it because Albanians are a NATO member now, the youngest, and most dinamic nation in Europe, and have always been part of the pro-american block in Europe?

Serbia's natural ally has always been and will always be Russia. It was Tito & communism who separated you from your beloved Russia, and from being their representative in the heart of Europe, but Tito is long gone.

And as long as Russia's influence is unfavorable for the west, Serbia will of course be positioned eastward.

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316 '

This is a list of NOMINAL (OVERALL) GDP values, not per capita.

Of course larger countries rank higher here (even if they are obviously poorer). Factoring out Kosovo would simply lower the overall total.

But it's the per capita numbers that indicate how productive a country is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

(I don't trust Wikipedia for historical interpretation, but they can copy tables efficiently.)

In the per-capita list, Slovenia ranks 30 (with $29,472) and Serbia 75 (with $10,792) for 2008. For example.

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blero

pre 14 godina

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 12:39)

MikeC, please tell me you are joking.
Who’s got the tail between the legs?
1. The one that comes to you and tells you what he thinks (and what you should do)!
2. The one that accepts Albanians best friend and the biggest pro-Kosovo supporter with open arms!

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Agim

pre 14 godina

Trap has been set: In Bosnia Biden said "We don't expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo any time soon," in his notes "any time soon" was not in.

First, get serbia to lower rhetoric, to stop the illegal and immoral parallel structures...and when Serbia is ready to get in EU tell them. By then Kosova will have consolidated everything and with the lower serb volume it will be easier to accept the reality.

Great welcome for Serbs: I know no one usually visits you so I hope you enjoyed it.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"Biden arrived in Belgrade this morning in Air Force 2, which was met in Serbian airspace by a squadron of Serbian Army MIG fighters."

I heard that a similar thing is waiting for Biden in Kosovo. However, instead of MIG fighters the Albanians will send up balloons!

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Oud

pre 14 godina

Greated with MIG´s by the Serbian obedient puppet regime, this is the man that called Serbians in Larry King live "illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists." And during the 1999 NATO attack on Serbia, he appeared on Meet the Press (May 9, 1999) and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."

Can Serbia sink any further into the imperial slime-barrel?

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Kosova-USA

pre 14 godina

After all badmouthing , he received a red carpet treatment including honor guards+escorted by military jets. I said this all along ,but some said otherwise. The most extravagant welcome will happened tomorrow in Prishtina.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"..and called for "a Japanese-German style occupation of that country."
Oud

And now he comes to Serbia with his tail between his legs and wants cooperation. You must be proud of your masters?

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David, Toronto

pre 14 godina

Wow. I guess you need to shake hands with everyone even your enemies sometimes. Kosovo has been ethnically cleansed of Serbs and 300,000 have been ethnically cleansed from Croatia - with Mr. Biden's support and encouragement. And yet Albania and Croatia are welcomed into NATO. If this is Mr. Biden's type of model to follow- I don't think Serbia should want any part of it. A stoic, just, democratic and Orthodox path is the only one to follow.

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

It really is disgusting to see Biden, the chief Serb hater and albanian lobbyist in the US, get the red carpet treatment by Tadic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQINoX2wJfQ
Biden is one of the main culprits who is responsible for the illegal bombing and occupation of Serbia, which makes him a war criminal. War criminals belong in jail, not on the red carpet Mr. Tadic.
Oh wait, I forgot, Tadic only sends his own people to jail, and treats the imperialist war mongers like guests of honour.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"The U.S. "does not expect Serbia to recognize Kosovo," nor will this affect bilateral relations, says U.S. Vice-President Joseph Biden."

But...I thought Biden came with the message for Serbia to recognize Kosovo or DIE!!!
Well dear Albanians I guess you couldn't trust Kosova Press after all. I guess that's why you get your news about the world here at B92.

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Tunxh

pre 14 godina

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 15:19)


Keep thinking that. Serbia is the regional power? No my friend, that honor goes to the countries surrounding it, like Croatia, Romania, Bulgaria, and Slovenia, which have a much much much higher standard of living than Serbia, who along with Croatia and Albania are NATO members, and the majority of whose populations have unfavorable dispositions towards the Serbia. Serbia is a landlocked country surrounded by NATO members.

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Dragan

pre 14 godina

So Tadic and the yellows decided to ban all public gatherings and demonstrations as the NATO bombardier and anti-Serb hate monger comes to vist. I thought these were supposed to be 'democrats', not totalitarians. But the truth comes out, they do what they are told by Washington. This whole thing stinks, stinks to high heaven. Tadic is a truly pathetic figure who does not represent the views of his citizens. New elections please!!

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miri

pre 14 godina

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"
(Dim Tuc, 20 May 2009 17:51)

Dim Tuc

Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.

Respectfully to your stance and your comments,

miri.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

blero

Did Biden come to us or did Tadic go to him? Like Biden you should realize that Serbia is the regional power and no lasting peace is possible without a compromise with Serbia.
Those are "the facts on the ground".

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Looking at the image of Mr Tadic and Mr Biden walking down the red carpet I just can't get my eyes off the flag behind Mr Biden. It's simply the most beautiful flag in the world :)

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Jovan Z

pre 14 godina

I love it how Albanians a better reception Kosmet than in Beograd. Really? Good for you ,you can have him. Show him the meaning of bootlicking.
It would be uncomfortable visiting a country which I talked so much vile garbage about. As for the person above who doubts what Biden stated
In 1999, it is true I watched it with my own eyes and heard with my ears. You think Serbs are making this up ? That would be silly wouldn’t it?

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

right so, Mike.

he´s a tragic figure, I´d say.

only a few years ago, agitating in the worst manner against Serbia - and today travelling to Serbia and being hosted as a visitor...

and then speaking about "reinforcing the US-comittment in Europe..."

especially after the South-Stream-alliance crushed US-american visions of strong US-influence in the region.

empty words spoken by a tragic figure.

nothing more.

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

so, show this tragic figure what serbian hospitality means. ( thousands of US-visitors per year learn it anyway )

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miri

pre 14 godina

ps: nevertheless, improving relations with the US is the best way to weaken the albanian separatists.

(Jovan, 20 May 2009 14:05)

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.

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lowe

pre 14 godina

Read between the lines -- Biden is really telling the Balkans not to rock the boat, America has enough troubles at home already as it is and can do with one less problem abroad. Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.

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Tony UK

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms and with highest security measures! Who is the puppet now? God bless America, the beacon of peace and freedom

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vesna

pre 14 godina

It is a good idea that schools and general population get reminded on this 'statement' coming from Biden:
(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” and other equally unforgivable outbursts of hatred and malice.

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
[link]
[link]
(MikeC, 20 May 2009 17:34)

Ok, so he wasn’t hiding apparently. Looks like Tadic inserted him in the “greeters” line at the airport because Biden refused to have a bilateral meeting with him. Notice how Biden had an individual meeting with FM of Bosnia Alkalaj and has already a scheduled meeting with FM of Kosovo Hyseni, but not with your boy Jeremic. You think this is a coincidence. I think not. Before you respond with “ Jeremic is doing a good job because Albanians hate him”, answer why he didn’t meet Jeremic? He is supposed to be the chief conductor of foreign relations for Serbia. Or is he just DS’s PR boy for the population of Serbia?

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

Tunxh

Albania for sure is and never will be a power to count on. And it doesn't matter how many NATOS you join.

"Serbia has a central role in the region, which cannot prosper without Serbia playing a constructive leading role,” the U.S. vice president stated."

Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here? Albanians say "Biden will come to Belgrade and tell the Serbs to accept this and that" but what happend? I guess Bidens visit to the Balkans could perhaps get you up to date with reality.

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konstantin gregovic

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.

Take the billions out in NATO bombing done to the economy and Serbia would be close to Belarus @ 59 in the world.



PPP takes in account costs of living and rates of inflation to deriver a much more relavent GDP number.

Serbia is the regional power in the region and will only get stronger. Kosovo is the albatross on its back.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"I heard all journalists had to take their shoes off just in case he got the same treatment as Bush in Iraq."
Zoran


Ha ha ha! Priceless comment!

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Jan, Poland

pre 14 godina

"The United States does not, I emphasize, does not expect Serbia to recognize the independence of Kosovo,"

Why?? Becouse they know, that this is wrong decision.

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Agim

pre 14 godina

"Those are the words of your suggar daddy, not me. If Serbia is so insignificant why is Biden coming here?"

Why is Obama talking to Iran, Cuba, and other rogue states? Different approach to reach the same goals! Keep your friends close and your enemies closer

--"Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it. "

Bwhahahaha! If Putin says jump how many Serbs would say how high? That's how reliable you are. Albania is a NATO member and you can't even say that size matters, they are 6-7 million Albanians in the Balkans (average age under 30!)

I hate to see serbs getting so excited over a visit after being neglected for so lo00ong. As Biden said some nice words: see what he'll say tomorrow in Kosova or look at Bahrain's recognition, IMF membership and so on. Consider Biden's visit as "another victory," more states will recognize Kosova tomorrow and it will join World Bank in June--all thanks to Biden and Obama, your "friends."

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

"It is interesting that Jeremic was nowhere to be found today.Is he hiding from Biden?"
BalkanUpdate

I guess you are not as updated as you might think. Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden.
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98830
http://www.b92.net/eng/gallery/zoom.php?nav_category=99&image_id=98802

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Bottom line implied is that the US wants some breathing space in exchange for tolerating the status quo. Which should suit Belgrade and Banja Luka just fine.'

Not really. Bush put Balkan policy on auto-pilot and this did suit Banja Luka, especially, just fine. The new administration said from the beginning that changes had to be made and intended to send a high-level representative to check things out, but finally decided that things were worse than expected and that Biden himself should go and see for himself. With all the extra costs and annoyances associated with a White House visit this entails, for both sides.

('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")

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Jovan

pre 14 godina

He, he..., apparently it took you 10 years to finally realize this.
(miri, 20 May 2009 15:17)

no, miri, once again you don´t get it.

before, there was the Bush-regime which was lead by a more or less naive "leader" who even let some simple thieves steal his wrist-watch.

there was nothing to discuss with this person, he was good enough to give the K-albanian the feeling of "being important" while actually you´re just the backlight of Europe. that´s reality, my dear.

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.

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BalkanUpdate

pre 14 godina

RE:

2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316
110 Albania 21,828
119 Republic of Macedonia 18,818
145 Montenegro 6,944


Serbia is in the middle of the pack, take out Kosovo from the equation where Serbia is incurring costs and not collecting revenue and it will surpass both Bulgaria and Croatia and be be right behind Romania.


(konstantin gregovic, 20 May 2009 22:11)


Actually, Konstantian, IMF exudes Kosovo when it calculates Serbia's numbers. Check their website. I love how people go on making claims thinking nobody will check.

Saying Serbia has a significant role to play in the region is not the same as saying Serbia is a regional superpower. That's a far fetched logic. In any case, when it comes to small countries power is being measured more and more via economy. In that measurement, Serbia falls somewhere towards the bottom of the list. Serbian economy is not as stellar as you imagined. Serbia's economy is in a better shape than that of Kosovo, but lags behind most other neighbors.

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Dim Tuc

pre 14 godina

"(unforgettable appearance on CNN’s Larry King Live) when he said that “Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers and rapists”, his assertion during Senatorial deliberations in 1999 over NATO aggression against Serbia that “all Serbs should be placed in Nazi-style concentration camps” "

Could someone please provide a reference for these wild assertions? I have no love for the guy, but severaltimes posters have sent an urlclaiming Biden said these things, I watched the youtube, and these words weren't there. If this is what he said, it is appalling. If not, you will have ore credibility if you criticise him for what he actually did or said.

I abhor Milosevic and what he did and support Kosova's independence, but that does not stop me, as someone thinking independently of ethnic category thinking, that Tadic has the right to demand reparations for the bombing. Focusing on that is enough without crazy "quotes"

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Lenard

pre 14 godina

Biden said that he was coming to the region with a clear message: to reinforce the U.S.’s long-term commitment to Europe. Yes of course the American Biden view. I wonder what he sees is it the natives dresst in their old native close waiting for the Americans to pat them on the heads. While America and its puppet the British go around the world bopping the heads of subversive nations to the Anglo-American dream of world domination. In politics resources any thing else they feel that their greed should control. Where they go in the world theirs are trails of countless misery and of murders. I guess Serbian President Boris Tadić is signing up to the same Anglo-American dream aren't they irresistible.

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'Here are pictures of Jeremic meeting Biden. '

That second one must be when Biden is saying something like 'so you're the guy who caused all the problems' - Sutanovic at least looks highly amused.

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elz

pre 14 godina

Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:

"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening. It's the only thing that will ultimately work. But that's not what anyone, but the three of us, have been talking about from the beginning. So when the president says he's not for total victory, he's not what we're for, but he never was, nor was NATO, nor was anybody but the three of us."

But those other name-calling comments, I cannot find anywhere.

However, I do not think that is why he has come to Belgrade today and I believe that he deserves to be heard out.

I think that lots of things have been said in the past on all sides that we regret.

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MikeC

pre 14 godina

They bomb you, burn you to the ground, and in the end you still welcome him with smile, open arms...
Tony UK

Don't you have the same hospitality for visiting politicians from Germany?

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elz

pre 14 godina

I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. Unfortunately this site does not allow the upload of documents, but an in-depth search, using lexus nexus provides the entire transcript of the interview and Vice President Biden did not state that "Serbs are illiterate degenerates, baby killers, butchers, and rapists."

I will lexus nexus the MTP as well and check it, although I would be surprised if he said that.

Also it is interesting that all these transcripts go back to dates that are no longer archived and that require special search engines such as lexus nexus to retrieve them. This makes it easy to spread false information.

This is not to say that I agree with policies, but I definitely agree that it is inappropriate to go about quoting Vice President Biden for comments that he did not make.

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JohnBoy

pre 14 godina

This was a good outcome. The ds oppressed public demonstrations. If Serbia does not get into the eu before the next election or in two years, the Radicals come to power!

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tim

pre 14 godina

Next time one of these from the USA comes, they should be met with a general strike. Park all cars, stop pedestrian traffic and all commerce for one hour. Then after that principled peaceful protest, you can go back to having your government pimp you out to the West.
Or maybe mass protests can only be organised by the CIA for you?

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Denis

pre 14 godina

the new one, the Obama-government ist in place, and step by step we will improve relations.
perhaps you don´t understand, but Serbia is a much more reliable partner than the K-albanians are, that is so logic and natural that even the last hillbilly in the midwest would agree to it.

for you that means losing sole support in the balkans, slowly but surely.
as I have reiterated it several times, time is on Serbia´s side. and you will definitely get to feel it, sooner or later.
(Jovan, 20 May 2009 22:06)

Why is Serbia a more reliable nation to the US than the Albanians? Is it because Serbia is a Russian satelite, even though it received billions from the US and the west?

Is it because Albanians are a NATO member now, the youngest, and most dinamic nation in Europe, and have always been part of the pro-american block in Europe?

Serbia's natural ally has always been and will always be Russia. It was Tito & communism who separated you from your beloved Russia, and from being their representative in the heart of Europe, but Tito is long gone.

And as long as Russia's influence is unfavorable for the west, Serbia will of course be positioned eastward.

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lowe

pre 14 godina

"('Some changes had to be made' - in talking to Medvedev, Obama said that "everything is on the table - except Kosovo.")
(Amer, 20 May 2009 20:24) "

Well, the Russians would tell Obama the same thing too -- don't expect us to recognize Kosovo's UDI which we consider illegal!

Actually I kinda suspect Obama doesn't even know where is Kosovo should you give him an atlas!

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robert Burns

pre 14 godina

Bottom line is that yesterday may prove to be an historic day. It may be the end of isolation and the beginning of influence. I cannot believe there are more comments on Bahrain and whatever that other place was. That is insignificant if yesterday heralds a new era of co operation. The US ain't going to change it's primary position on Kosovo but expect, in the future, to feel lots of pressure to come up with a lasting and durable compromise on certain issues.

Yesterday was not a sign of weakness but of a stronger Serbia. A country who has maintained and reinforced it's claims but is set to be given more credence on the world stage.

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DimTuc

pre 14 godina

“Washington strong support a united Bosnia, united Georgia, united Azerbaijan, so why they don't support united Serbia?
(Milan, 20 May 2009 23:18)”

Washington does support a united Serbia, in fact that’s why it supported your troops flushing the UCMP (???) whatever extension of the KLA out of Presevo back in 2001. Of course, the US also supports a united Kosovo/a, that’s what you didn’t add.

In fact further, the contradiction is the other way around. You say Washington supports a united Bosnia, but in fact it gave Bosnia Dayton, ie, a Bosnia permanently divided into ethnic-based republics, in opposition to the original ethnic mix of the country. In other words, Washington gave Karadzic what he and his boss in Belgrade had been fighting for, indeed far more than was Serb majority “ethnic territory.” So how would you like it if support for “unity of Serbia” took the same form as “unity of Bosnia,” with a Bosniak confederal republic in Sanjak, and Albanian confederal republic in Presevo and a Hungarian confederal republic in northern Vojvodina? Yeh, you wouldn’t. Kosova, of course, is different, as it was a unit of the Yugoslav federation. But even there, if you see independence as breaking unity of Serbia, then tell me: were you prepared to offer Kosovo what RS has in Bosnia – a fully fledged “Repuiblica Albania”, with an equal voice in a new Belgrade based federation, where the other equal unit is the Serb republic in the rest? No you were not.

“I have a copy of the Larry King transcripts for 22 March 1999, 23 March 1999, 5 April 1999, 12 April 1999, and 20 May 1999. Vice President Biden was critical of the Serbian government, but he did not say those things. (elz, 20 May 2009 19:38)”

Thank you very much for that research.

“Biden did make that comment on Meet the Press and here is the context:
"I've been saying, we should go into the--on the ground; we should announce there's going to be American casualties. We should go to Belgrade and we should have a Japanese-German style occupation of that country. And we should have public trials in order to strike away this mask of this Serbian victimization so the people of Serbia know what's happening.”

I’ve no intention of being a lawyer for Biden, as anyone reading my comments knows. However, let’s be clear for clarity sake – what he is saying here is that Serbia should be occupied by NATO in the same way as Germany and Japan were after WWII. Personally I abhor that kind of imperial arrogance, but it is ridiculous to twist this to mean he was advocating a Nazi-type occupation of Serbia, let alone stretching that to suggest he wants “all Serbs” in Nazi concentration camps.

“Tadic has no right to ask for reparations as it's always the winner that can make such claims.
Respectfully to your stance and your comments,
(miri, 20 May 2009 21:13)”

Respectfully to your too miri, but I’m talking principles. Yes I know the winners and the powerful make the rules in practice. That’s why Serbia will never get reparations from the NATO, and also why Bosnia and Kosova will never get reparations from Serbia.

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HE WHO SPEAKS THE TRUTH

pre 14 godina

Does not matter how large of the reception you recieve it is what is acheieved. Now i guess since Pristina is going all out to show the world how much it appreciated VP Biden and US. Where is all of this money coming from to put on this show? Where are all of these jobs that the current government has promised the people? Still corruption runs rampant and no end in site. Instead of putting on a show of unimaginable pagentry invest that money in the companies so they can hire people and put them to work. I guess the Kosovo Air Force will fly and meet Air Force 2. Come on folks is this rhectoric is worth the time to write. My god folks

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - according to pre-war constitution of Serbia - Kosovo was "autonomous province of Serbia" - not Federal Republic like Croatia or Bosna.
Do You remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo IS A PART of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " (pre-Milosevic constitution). And do You remember UN SC resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independence" for Kosovo - but lot about territorial INTEGRITY of Yugoslavia.

So - Kosovo according to international law - is integral part of Yugoslavia succesor - Republic of Serbia ant their unilateral declaration of indepence is ILLEGAL.
American nad Albanian hypoctrites break international law.

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Milan

pre 14 godina

DimTuc - do You remember constitution of Yugoslavia and constitution of Socialist Republic of Serbia? Was Kosovo one of republic of Yugoslavia or was Kosovo part of Serbia?
Do you remember this: "The Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo is a part of the Socialist Republic of Serbia " - from 1974 constitution.
Do You remember UN Security Council Resolution 1244?? Is nothing about "independent" Kosovo but is about "territorial integrity of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia" which Serbia is now the recognized successor state.

So - unilateral declaration of independence was ILLEGAL. Is against international law, and countries who recognized Kosovo - break international law.

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Amer

pre 14 godina

'2008 GDP Per Capita-IMF
PPP-Purchasing Power of Parity Theory

39 Romania 270,330
59 Belarus 118,875
66 Bulgaria 93,569
70 Croatia 82,272
72 Serbia 79,662
82 Slovenia 59,316 '

This is a list of NOMINAL (OVERALL) GDP values, not per capita.

Of course larger countries rank higher here (even if they are obviously poorer). Factoring out Kosovo would simply lower the overall total.

But it's the per capita numbers that indicate how productive a country is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

(I don't trust Wikipedia for historical interpretation, but they can copy tables efficiently.)

In the per-capita list, Slovenia ranks 30 (with $29,472) and Serbia 75 (with $10,792) for 2008. For example.

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