"Serbia could borrow from China and Russia"

Both Russia and China have been able to weather this economic storm/depression far better and wiser than the so-called western elitist regimes (so much for Ahtisarri and his babble about nations that hold 60% of earths wealth). Further, China as one of the top two holders of diminishing in true value, U.S. treasuries, will come out of this American-led international economic mess far stronger, as will Russia. No wonder Iceland attempted to borrow from Russia, before the IMF and World Bank (institutions with clandestine intentions upon signing for loans)months ago. It will be better for Serbia to access loans from these far friendlier and wealthier nations, as they would come on far greater terms and intentions.

It's great to have true friends like Russia and China.

As a Russian I would prefer our currency funds kept in friendly states but not support our strategic rival's economy. Moreover I believe Serbia is also a safer place for them cause no one knows what's gonna happen to the Dollar.

I believe that China is also searching for new financial instruments. Both Russia and China are interested in conducting business in their national currencies. So Serbia can gain twice if it loans not only "hard" curency but also roubles and yuanes. In this case the summs loaned and invested will be much bigger.

Anyway I am surprised Tadic had not loaned money from Russia yet. After all when retired he will become just an ordinary Serb. If he still believes that Sam will take care of the "democrats" worldwide I have nothing more to say ...

No loan from the IMF. The IMF has had no success since the mid-50s and the most succeful economies do not listen to IMF diktats.

The IMF formula brought us Argentine crises of 80s, 90s and 00s, the Russian economy under Yeltsin, Brazil in the 80s, Yugoslavia in the 80s and a whole list of other failures.

The most succesful recent economic successes have been those who have not listened to the IMF. Japan and Western Europe post-WWII did not follow the IMF, South Korea didn't (in fact for the breif time in the mid-90s that it did it's economy contracted -10%), Chile did (far more developed then the rest of Latin America as a result), Russia under Putin and China haven't (know the IMF begs them for money).

Anyeays. The government policy should be "No confirmation of IMF deal until we see the Russian or Chinese offer." Accept the loan with the best terms.

oh boy berkley, your touching story nearly broke my heart.

so you seriously tell us the chinese behave in africa like the western hordes?

2 reasons i cannot believe it: they are part of worlds most important (and 5000 year old) culture&therefore don't behave like your kind AND they (and the russians) just pay better, which makes some guys bitter... :-)

that's like our occupators propaganda, that they protect serbs in kosovo by ethnically cleansing southserbia of serbs.

old saying: a good dog follows his master...
and we all know where billary clintons first trip went, china&russia.

but the question remains: why now, much too late&why after buying russian and chinese money from imf, at much worse conditions(economically&politically)???

There would be less strings attached if Serbia borrows from Russia and China. Borrowing from the IMF and other western controlled institutions only leads to colossal debt for future generations and too many conditions.

Money talks.

Berkeeley, lets be fair now....

Most of America's debt is held by....China and the middle east...

America needs China to buy their debt in order to fund their stimulus...

If China drops these T-bills on the open market, America has a problem on its hands.

Furthermore, China has been buying shorter Treasury securites lately....

my point is that its not only African countries who are at the mercy of the Chinese.

What happens with countries under Chinese "mercy" can be easily oberserved in Africa. BBC aired an documentary which refered China as the new Empire who conquers financially the developing states in a way, the empires of the 19th century did before. It was pointing out that the Chinese put a foot into foreign economies in order to exploit them, with desastrous situation in the labor market. Cheap loans for those countries are subsidized by the Chinese government and an easy bait for those desperate countries. Side effects are no safety standards at all, very small income and heavily damaged environment. In many areas, Chinese workers are also used, like in construction. Serbia already has a high proportion of Chinese, mentioned in no Serbian statistics.

Its funny that a lot of critics to WESTERN countries economic woes etc comment here. But as I see most of you have emigrated and reside to those WESTERN countries.

"What happens with countries under Chinese "mercy" can be easily observed in Africa."

And the track record of the West in Africa is:

A) Give billions $$$ directly to dictators and thieves;

B) Not really bother with conditions nor standards;

C) Not actually require proof that any of said money has gone to building hospitals, schools etc.

Criticize the Chinese as much as you want, but before they went in, neither the IMF or almost any financial institution nor government would touch most of Africa with a barge pole.

Too risky you see.

So, the Chinese are actually building roads, schools and all sorts of infrastructure that IMF and western money singularly failed to do over 5 decades.

Should the Chinese be held up to fulfilling their end? Certainly. As for why a number of these african countries/politicians are voicing their disquiet about these contracts, the West really did do all the ground work for mistrust of rich, foreign 'benefactors' offering milk and honey.

Or is it better just to deny developing countries the finance and means that they need to drag themselves up by their bootlaces? Must have a health return on our investments old chap. Too risky etc. etc.

What of the Nigerians who refused Western, World Bank and IMF advice to deregulate financial services in the 1990s? Bad advice is cheap, but the results are still disasterous.

Curiously, where's the criticizm of those other large investors in Africa who have followed in China's footsteps, namely Japan and India? I suppose that relative silence is golden.....

What happens with countries under Chinese "mercy" can be easily oberserved in Africa. BBC aired an documentary which refered China as the new Empire who conquers financially the developing states in a way, the empires of the 19th century did before. It was pointing out that the Chinese put a foot into foreign economies in order to exploit them, with desastrous situation in the labor market. Cheap loans for those countries are subsidized by the Chinese government and an easy bait for those desperate countries. Side effects are no safety standards at all, very small income and heavily damaged environment. In many areas, Chinese workers are also used, like in construction. Serbia already has a high proportion of Chinese, mentioned in no Serbian statistics.

Money talks.

Its funny that a lot of critics to WESTERN countries economic woes etc comment here. But as I see most of you have emigrated and reside to those WESTERN countries.

It's great to have true friends like Russia and China.

Both Russia and China have been able to weather this economic storm/depression far better and wiser than the so-called western elitist regimes (so much for Ahtisarri and his babble about nations that hold 60% of earths wealth). Further, China as one of the top two holders of diminishing in true value, U.S. treasuries, will come out of this American-led international economic mess far stronger, as will Russia. No wonder Iceland attempted to borrow from Russia, before the IMF and World Bank (institutions with clandestine intentions upon signing for loans)months ago. It will be better for Serbia to access loans from these far friendlier and wealthier nations, as they would come on far greater terms and intentions.

No loan from the IMF. The IMF has had no success since the mid-50s and the most succeful economies do not listen to IMF diktats.

The IMF formula brought us Argentine crises of 80s, 90s and 00s, the Russian economy under Yeltsin, Brazil in the 80s, Yugoslavia in the 80s and a whole list of other failures.

The most succesful recent economic successes have been those who have not listened to the IMF. Japan and Western Europe post-WWII did not follow the IMF, South Korea didn't (in fact for the breif time in the mid-90s that it did it's economy contracted -10%), Chile did (far more developed then the rest of Latin America as a result), Russia under Putin and China haven't (know the IMF begs them for money).

Anyeays. The government policy should be "No confirmation of IMF deal until we see the Russian or Chinese offer." Accept the loan with the best terms.

As a Russian I would prefer our currency funds kept in friendly states but not support our strategic rival's economy. Moreover I believe Serbia is also a safer place for them cause no one knows what's gonna happen to the Dollar.

I believe that China is also searching for new financial instruments. Both Russia and China are interested in conducting business in their national currencies. So Serbia can gain twice if it loans not only "hard" curency but also roubles and yuanes. In this case the summs loaned and invested will be much bigger.

Anyway I am surprised Tadic had not loaned money from Russia yet. After all when retired he will become just an ordinary Serb. If he still believes that Sam will take care of the "democrats" worldwide I have nothing more to say ...

oh boy berkley, your touching story nearly broke my heart.

so you seriously tell us the chinese behave in africa like the western hordes?

2 reasons i cannot believe it: they are part of worlds most important (and 5000 year old) culture&therefore don't behave like your kind AND they (and the russians) just pay better, which makes some guys bitter... :-)

that's like our occupators propaganda, that they protect serbs in kosovo by ethnically cleansing southserbia of serbs.

old saying: a good dog follows his master...
and we all know where billary clintons first trip went, china&russia.

but the question remains: why now, much too late&why after buying russian and chinese money from imf, at much worse conditions(economically&politically)???

There would be less strings attached if Serbia borrows from Russia and China. Borrowing from the IMF and other western controlled institutions only leads to colossal debt for future generations and too many conditions.

Berkeeley, lets be fair now....

Most of America's debt is held by....China and the middle east...

America needs China to buy their debt in order to fund their stimulus...

If China drops these T-bills on the open market, America has a problem on its hands.

Furthermore, China has been buying shorter Treasury securites lately....

my point is that its not only African countries who are at the mercy of the Chinese.

"What happens with countries under Chinese "mercy" can be easily observed in Africa."

And the track record of the West in Africa is:

A) Give billions $$$ directly to dictators and thieves;

B) Not really bother with conditions nor standards;

C) Not actually require proof that any of said money has gone to building hospitals, schools etc.

Criticize the Chinese as much as you want, but before they went in, neither the IMF or almost any financial institution nor government would touch most of Africa with a barge pole.

Too risky you see.

So, the Chinese are actually building roads, schools and all sorts of infrastructure that IMF and western money singularly failed to do over 5 decades.

Should the Chinese be held up to fulfilling their end? Certainly. As for why a number of these african countries/politicians are voicing their disquiet about these contracts, the West really did do all the ground work for mistrust of rich, foreign 'benefactors' offering milk and honey.

Or is it better just to deny developing countries the finance and means that they need to drag themselves up by their bootlaces? Must have a health return on our investments old chap. Too risky etc. etc.

What of the Nigerians who refused Western, World Bank and IMF advice to deregulate financial services in the 1990s? Bad advice is cheap, but the results are still disasterous.

Curiously, where's the criticizm of those other large investors in Africa who have followed in China's footsteps, namely Japan and India? I suppose that relative silence is golden.....