I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of ENGLAND for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington.
UK......Whilst I respect your comments I have capitalised your only mistake. ENGLAND. Not a very UNITED comment is it? There are other countries part of the Kingdom.
Please be a bit more considerate of your neighbours, that is until we break free.
The crisis has hit the UK that hard that they can no longer afford to keep their forces in Kosovo?
EA
NATO standards means F-16/Eurofighter/Grippen fighters and Abrams/Leopard/Challenger tanks. Where do you think Kosovo would get the money for this type of machinery? In fact, I think that the latest F-16 is probably worth more than Kosovo's entire GDP.
Demi
It was many, many more countries than just Russia and Serbia. Do you read the articles on B92 or just the title before you comment?
Bob, I agree with you about Milosevic and understand your argument for intervention. But, apart from the shocking one-sided control of the media, I also think that the bombing was unnecessary and avoidable.
So much damage was done and so many innocents killed, maimed and displaced, not to mention the horrendous damage to civilian infrastructure and heritage.
The Serbian delegation would have agreed to UN intervention (they already signed the Paris agreement before Rambouillet) but not the sign or be bombed diktat by the US. No country could have allowed free access to their territory by Nato as set out in Appendix B of Rambouillet.
It had already been decided to launch the attack before Rambouillet and I believe there were many other agendas apart from humanitarian intervention.
In fact, I don't think that humanitarianism was high up the agenda at all.
Diplomacy had by no means been exhausted, and the UK government said at the start of 1999 that both sides (Albanian and Serbian) were killing the same numbers of people to put it crudely.
That was before the attack by Nato and if the UK, US and team were going to take a side it was obvious which one it would choose.
In Bosnia as well there was a real bias against the Serbs and a painting of them as the only bad guys. That was clearly not true. Horrendous crimes were carried out by all sides.
Kosovo diden't declare it's independence ulitarely. It was declared with consultation with every country in the world beside Russia and Serbia.
On the other side Russia unilaterly blocked the Ahtisaari-plan wich every nation accepted as the long-term soulution for the status of Kosovo.
(Demi, 5 March 2009 18:07)
OMG Demi, are you serious?
Every country in the world besides Russi and Serbia!!!
Do you realize that you only have 1/3 of the world recognizing you? What happened to the other 2/3?
You are obvioysly not counting them as countries.
BTW, Kosovo Albanians will never get up to NATO standard. NATO will not allow that. A master will never see his servant as equal.
Thanks to those who liked my comments - however please note that I think that Milosevic and his policies were the biggest disaster possible for Serbia.
The problem with the west is not that they intervened - the case for humanitarian intervention was strong after the atrocities in Bosnia - but that they have gone for such a bigoted view against Serbia. The behavioiur of ALL the sides in the conflicts was abysmal and unfortunately a lot of innocent people died because of greed and disgusting ambition. The sad thing is that the west has decided to reward the greed and disgusting ambition of one side with an immoral UDI.
The Albanians suckered the west - and a lot of EU politicians still live with the same set of prejudices.
However, the west was right to stop the possibility of a repeat of Bosnia - Serbia did not handle the politics well; we all saw what was coming but Milosevic played it very badly.
I don't go along with the narrow nationalists who say 'West bad', 'Russia good', etc., because they generally show zero awareness the meaning of the word 'humanitarian'. The west did not act without good reason.
The countries of the Balkans all have a lot to face up to about what was wrong in the local thinking.
Well said, 'UK'! As an English person I totally agree with your comment. And that of Bob and ZK.
During the attack in 1999 a D Notice was slapped on the British press for the first time in many decades, to stop the media from publishing anything other than the government line.
There was also Campbell in charge of not only the British media but also the Nato press machine. He and Jamie Shea would have put Geobbels to shame (although the latter wasn't up to Campbell's 'standards').
The atrocious demonisation and dehumanisation of the Serbs by the British government made me feel quite sick.
Nobody, including some fluff head Blairite MPs, even knew their history as our allies through two world wars.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
(lowe, 5 March 2009 10:28)
I couldn't agree with you more.The country is potentially bust with £ trillions of debts.
As you might have seen the news today, the bank of England reduced its interest rates to 0.5%.In addition they interoduced a new term called "quantitative Easing"-
another term for printing money with no value attached to them.The future inflationary pressures of such acttions will make all the Brits paper Millionaires.
Another banana republic in the making.
scuderia.....
if the threat from Serbia is so great why, in your opinion, do so many mixes of ethnicities live peacefully and happily in Serbia and why so few Serbs live in Kosovo and those that do have to be protected by barbed wire compounds and UN security when the y leave those compounds. In addition, please dont shout out about "God Bless the Queen" as if you are somehow linked in a friendly way to England and our queen. The truth is that the vast majority of people in England are not even aware of the situation in Kosovo and those that are aware, I venture to suggest, are in no way happy or supportive of the way Albania has muscled in on Kosovo and imposed its will with no regard for the equalities that are so freely quoted as being in existence in Kosovo. I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of England for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington. Its about time the voice the voters of the western countries was heard. I feel there may be a different view emerging on Kosovo if that were to happen.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Russian troops return to Kosovo soon. Russian forces are expanding throughout the world right now while NATO/US withdraws, so why not?
As this is just the beginning of the western economic collapse, I doubt they will have the resources to spend on current misguided missions. As for Albania joining NATO (if it ever does) will have absolutely no influence over Kosovo. Why should it?
The US/NATO are trying to improve relations with Russia. That should be clear while the Albanians are nothing more than expendable pawns in this game. They may have a use as cannon fodder in Afghanistan.
Momentum is gathering and we are getting stronger by the day. Keep the faith my friends and victory is ours. Just keep watching the cracks of this "Kosova" dream get larger and larger.
The UK has taken too prejudiced a line against Serbia's view of Kosovo. The fashion of blaming Milosevic for everything acted as a brilliant cover for ignoring all the ethnic cleansing that the Albanians had been conducting for years before.
It was wrong to reward that with a UDI particularly when there were better solutions available.
Surely the UK should feel obliged to stay to project it's immoral creation - certainly the UDI does not deserve to sustain by itself. In fact, the UDI will not sustain by itself, so I doubt the US will be able to leave.
I have as much distaste for the Albanian ethnic cleansing of Serbs as I do for the ethnic cleansing of Albanians. However, the UDI was not a multi-sided solution - it was a clumsy imposition.
1244 is still in force, but EULEX may well not sustain unless Serbia is given reason to believe that the EU is acting in good faith.
The UK should either stay to defend its policy - or leave as an indication of a rethink of the mistake it has made. Leaving does not represent any measure of 'success'.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
US will pull out by September as well. With Kosova's Sec Forces and EULEX there is no need for more than 7000-8000 KFOR, and that's mostly to placate the Serbs. Also Albania joins NATO in April so peace is guaranteed.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
scuderia.....
if the threat from Serbia is so great why, in your opinion, do so many mixes of ethnicities live peacefully and happily in Serbia and why so few Serbs live in Kosovo and those that do have to be protected by barbed wire compounds and UN security when the y leave those compounds. In addition, please dont shout out about "God Bless the Queen" as if you are somehow linked in a friendly way to England and our queen. The truth is that the vast majority of people in England are not even aware of the situation in Kosovo and those that are aware, I venture to suggest, are in no way happy or supportive of the way Albania has muscled in on Kosovo and imposed its will with no regard for the equalities that are so freely quoted as being in existence in Kosovo. I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of England for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington. Its about time the voice the voters of the western countries was heard. I feel there may be a different view emerging on Kosovo if that were to happen.
The UK has taken too prejudiced a line against Serbia's view of Kosovo. The fashion of blaming Milosevic for everything acted as a brilliant cover for ignoring all the ethnic cleansing that the Albanians had been conducting for years before.
It was wrong to reward that with a UDI particularly when there were better solutions available.
Surely the UK should feel obliged to stay to project it's immoral creation - certainly the UDI does not deserve to sustain by itself. In fact, the UDI will not sustain by itself, so I doubt the US will be able to leave.
I have as much distaste for the Albanian ethnic cleansing of Serbs as I do for the ethnic cleansing of Albanians. However, the UDI was not a multi-sided solution - it was a clumsy imposition.
1244 is still in force, but EULEX may well not sustain unless Serbia is given reason to believe that the EU is acting in good faith.
The UK should either stay to defend its policy - or leave as an indication of a rethink of the mistake it has made. Leaving does not represent any measure of 'success'.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Russian troops return to Kosovo soon. Russian forces are expanding throughout the world right now while NATO/US withdraws, so why not?
As this is just the beginning of the western economic collapse, I doubt they will have the resources to spend on current misguided missions. As for Albania joining NATO (if it ever does) will have absolutely no influence over Kosovo. Why should it?
The US/NATO are trying to improve relations with Russia. That should be clear while the Albanians are nothing more than expendable pawns in this game. They may have a use as cannon fodder in Afghanistan.
Momentum is gathering and we are getting stronger by the day. Keep the faith my friends and victory is ours. Just keep watching the cracks of this "Kosova" dream get larger and larger.
Well said, 'UK'! As an English person I totally agree with your comment. And that of Bob and ZK.
During the attack in 1999 a D Notice was slapped on the British press for the first time in many decades, to stop the media from publishing anything other than the government line.
There was also Campbell in charge of not only the British media but also the Nato press machine. He and Jamie Shea would have put Geobbels to shame (although the latter wasn't up to Campbell's 'standards').
The atrocious demonisation and dehumanisation of the Serbs by the British government made me feel quite sick.
Nobody, including some fluff head Blairite MPs, even knew their history as our allies through two world wars.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
(lowe, 5 March 2009 10:28)
I couldn't agree with you more.The country is potentially bust with £ trillions of debts.
As you might have seen the news today, the bank of England reduced its interest rates to 0.5%.In addition they interoduced a new term called "quantitative Easing"-
another term for printing money with no value attached to them.The future inflationary pressures of such acttions will make all the Brits paper Millionaires.
Another banana republic in the making.
US will pull out by September as well. With Kosova's Sec Forces and EULEX there is no need for more than 7000-8000 KFOR, and that's mostly to placate the Serbs. Also Albania joins NATO in April so peace is guaranteed.
I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of ENGLAND for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington.
UK......Whilst I respect your comments I have capitalised your only mistake. ENGLAND. Not a very UNITED comment is it? There are other countries part of the Kingdom.
Please be a bit more considerate of your neighbours, that is until we break free.
Thanks to those who liked my comments - however please note that I think that Milosevic and his policies were the biggest disaster possible for Serbia.
The problem with the west is not that they intervened - the case for humanitarian intervention was strong after the atrocities in Bosnia - but that they have gone for such a bigoted view against Serbia. The behavioiur of ALL the sides in the conflicts was abysmal and unfortunately a lot of innocent people died because of greed and disgusting ambition. The sad thing is that the west has decided to reward the greed and disgusting ambition of one side with an immoral UDI.
The Albanians suckered the west - and a lot of EU politicians still live with the same set of prejudices.
However, the west was right to stop the possibility of a repeat of Bosnia - Serbia did not handle the politics well; we all saw what was coming but Milosevic played it very badly.
I don't go along with the narrow nationalists who say 'West bad', 'Russia good', etc., because they generally show zero awareness the meaning of the word 'humanitarian'. The west did not act without good reason.
The countries of the Balkans all have a lot to face up to about what was wrong in the local thinking.
Kosovo diden't declare it's independence ulitarely. It was declared with consultation with every country in the world beside Russia and Serbia.
On the other side Russia unilaterly blocked the Ahtisaari-plan wich every nation accepted as the long-term soulution for the status of Kosovo.
(Demi, 5 March 2009 18:07)
OMG Demi, are you serious?
Every country in the world besides Russi and Serbia!!!
Do you realize that you only have 1/3 of the world recognizing you? What happened to the other 2/3?
You are obvioysly not counting them as countries.
BTW, Kosovo Albanians will never get up to NATO standard. NATO will not allow that. A master will never see his servant as equal.
Bob, I agree with you about Milosevic and understand your argument for intervention. But, apart from the shocking one-sided control of the media, I also think that the bombing was unnecessary and avoidable.
So much damage was done and so many innocents killed, maimed and displaced, not to mention the horrendous damage to civilian infrastructure and heritage.
The Serbian delegation would have agreed to UN intervention (they already signed the Paris agreement before Rambouillet) but not the sign or be bombed diktat by the US. No country could have allowed free access to their territory by Nato as set out in Appendix B of Rambouillet.
It had already been decided to launch the attack before Rambouillet and I believe there were many other agendas apart from humanitarian intervention.
In fact, I don't think that humanitarianism was high up the agenda at all.
Diplomacy had by no means been exhausted, and the UK government said at the start of 1999 that both sides (Albanian and Serbian) were killing the same numbers of people to put it crudely.
That was before the attack by Nato and if the UK, US and team were going to take a side it was obvious which one it would choose.
In Bosnia as well there was a real bias against the Serbs and a painting of them as the only bad guys. That was clearly not true. Horrendous crimes were carried out by all sides.
The crisis has hit the UK that hard that they can no longer afford to keep their forces in Kosovo?
EA
NATO standards means F-16/Eurofighter/Grippen fighters and Abrams/Leopard/Challenger tanks. Where do you think Kosovo would get the money for this type of machinery? In fact, I think that the latest F-16 is probably worth more than Kosovo's entire GDP.
Demi
It was many, many more countries than just Russia and Serbia. Do you read the articles on B92 or just the title before you comment?
US will pull out by September as well. With Kosova's Sec Forces and EULEX there is no need for more than 7000-8000 KFOR, and that's mostly to placate the Serbs. Also Albania joins NATO in April so peace is guaranteed.
The UK has taken too prejudiced a line against Serbia's view of Kosovo. The fashion of blaming Milosevic for everything acted as a brilliant cover for ignoring all the ethnic cleansing that the Albanians had been conducting for years before.
It was wrong to reward that with a UDI particularly when there were better solutions available.
Surely the UK should feel obliged to stay to project it's immoral creation - certainly the UDI does not deserve to sustain by itself. In fact, the UDI will not sustain by itself, so I doubt the US will be able to leave.
I have as much distaste for the Albanian ethnic cleansing of Serbs as I do for the ethnic cleansing of Albanians. However, the UDI was not a multi-sided solution - it was a clumsy imposition.
1244 is still in force, but EULEX may well not sustain unless Serbia is given reason to believe that the EU is acting in good faith.
The UK should either stay to defend its policy - or leave as an indication of a rethink of the mistake it has made. Leaving does not represent any measure of 'success'.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Russian troops return to Kosovo soon. Russian forces are expanding throughout the world right now while NATO/US withdraws, so why not?
As this is just the beginning of the western economic collapse, I doubt they will have the resources to spend on current misguided missions. As for Albania joining NATO (if it ever does) will have absolutely no influence over Kosovo. Why should it?
The US/NATO are trying to improve relations with Russia. That should be clear while the Albanians are nothing more than expendable pawns in this game. They may have a use as cannon fodder in Afghanistan.
Momentum is gathering and we are getting stronger by the day. Keep the faith my friends and victory is ours. Just keep watching the cracks of this "Kosova" dream get larger and larger.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
scuderia.....
if the threat from Serbia is so great why, in your opinion, do so many mixes of ethnicities live peacefully and happily in Serbia and why so few Serbs live in Kosovo and those that do have to be protected by barbed wire compounds and UN security when the y leave those compounds. In addition, please dont shout out about "God Bless the Queen" as if you are somehow linked in a friendly way to England and our queen. The truth is that the vast majority of people in England are not even aware of the situation in Kosovo and those that are aware, I venture to suggest, are in no way happy or supportive of the way Albania has muscled in on Kosovo and imposed its will with no regard for the equalities that are so freely quoted as being in existence in Kosovo. I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of England for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington. Its about time the voice the voters of the western countries was heard. I feel there may be a different view emerging on Kosovo if that were to happen.
who is London kidding but itself? The truth is that, like the US, London can no longer afford the expensive, wasteful and, ultimately futile, military expenditures abroad.
(lowe, 5 March 2009 10:28)
I couldn't agree with you more.The country is potentially bust with £ trillions of debts.
As you might have seen the news today, the bank of England reduced its interest rates to 0.5%.In addition they interoduced a new term called "quantitative Easing"-
another term for printing money with no value attached to them.The future inflationary pressures of such acttions will make all the Brits paper Millionaires.
Another banana republic in the making.
Well said, 'UK'! As an English person I totally agree with your comment. And that of Bob and ZK.
During the attack in 1999 a D Notice was slapped on the British press for the first time in many decades, to stop the media from publishing anything other than the government line.
There was also Campbell in charge of not only the British media but also the Nato press machine. He and Jamie Shea would have put Geobbels to shame (although the latter wasn't up to Campbell's 'standards').
The atrocious demonisation and dehumanisation of the Serbs by the British government made me feel quite sick.
Nobody, including some fluff head Blairite MPs, even knew their history as our allies through two world wars.
Kosovo diden't declare it's independence ulitarely. It was declared with consultation with every country in the world beside Russia and Serbia.
On the other side Russia unilaterly blocked the Ahtisaari-plan wich every nation accepted as the long-term soulution for the status of Kosovo.
(Demi, 5 March 2009 18:07)
OMG Demi, are you serious?
Every country in the world besides Russi and Serbia!!!
Do you realize that you only have 1/3 of the world recognizing you? What happened to the other 2/3?
You are obvioysly not counting them as countries.
BTW, Kosovo Albanians will never get up to NATO standard. NATO will not allow that. A master will never see his servant as equal.
Thanks to those who liked my comments - however please note that I think that Milosevic and his policies were the biggest disaster possible for Serbia.
The problem with the west is not that they intervened - the case for humanitarian intervention was strong after the atrocities in Bosnia - but that they have gone for such a bigoted view against Serbia. The behavioiur of ALL the sides in the conflicts was abysmal and unfortunately a lot of innocent people died because of greed and disgusting ambition. The sad thing is that the west has decided to reward the greed and disgusting ambition of one side with an immoral UDI.
The Albanians suckered the west - and a lot of EU politicians still live with the same set of prejudices.
However, the west was right to stop the possibility of a repeat of Bosnia - Serbia did not handle the politics well; we all saw what was coming but Milosevic played it very badly.
I don't go along with the narrow nationalists who say 'West bad', 'Russia good', etc., because they generally show zero awareness the meaning of the word 'humanitarian'. The west did not act without good reason.
The countries of the Balkans all have a lot to face up to about what was wrong in the local thinking.
Bob, I agree with you about Milosevic and understand your argument for intervention. But, apart from the shocking one-sided control of the media, I also think that the bombing was unnecessary and avoidable.
So much damage was done and so many innocents killed, maimed and displaced, not to mention the horrendous damage to civilian infrastructure and heritage.
The Serbian delegation would have agreed to UN intervention (they already signed the Paris agreement before Rambouillet) but not the sign or be bombed diktat by the US. No country could have allowed free access to their territory by Nato as set out in Appendix B of Rambouillet.
It had already been decided to launch the attack before Rambouillet and I believe there were many other agendas apart from humanitarian intervention.
In fact, I don't think that humanitarianism was high up the agenda at all.
Diplomacy had by no means been exhausted, and the UK government said at the start of 1999 that both sides (Albanian and Serbian) were killing the same numbers of people to put it crudely.
That was before the attack by Nato and if the UK, US and team were going to take a side it was obvious which one it would choose.
In Bosnia as well there was a real bias against the Serbs and a painting of them as the only bad guys. That was clearly not true. Horrendous crimes were carried out by all sides.
The crisis has hit the UK that hard that they can no longer afford to keep their forces in Kosovo?
EA
NATO standards means F-16/Eurofighter/Grippen fighters and Abrams/Leopard/Challenger tanks. Where do you think Kosovo would get the money for this type of machinery? In fact, I think that the latest F-16 is probably worth more than Kosovo's entire GDP.
Demi
It was many, many more countries than just Russia and Serbia. Do you read the articles on B92 or just the title before you comment?
I, for one, totally disagree with the way in which the West has dealt with the whole Balkan situation over the past few years and for our Government to support this "UDI" without even asking the people of ENGLAND for their opinion is further evidence of the UK Governments "puppet" relationship with Washington.
UK......Whilst I respect your comments I have capitalised your only mistake. ENGLAND. Not a very UNITED comment is it? There are other countries part of the Kingdom.
Please be a bit more considerate of your neighbours, that is until we break free.
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