"Six-point talks with UN on Tuesday"

shq: Why would you celebrate with the flag of another country? I suggest you celebrate with the NATO flag instead, because that is what Kosovo has become. A protectorate of NATO.

Jeremić said that UN Security Council's decision to support the secretary-general's six-point plan formally put behind Ahtisaari's document, which never gained the support of the council.

Mr. Jeremic just listen to your own words "support' , therefore was never aproved. As I rember correctly during the last UNSC session the six point plan was never mentioned.
Your word "support' for six point plan was only a trick so that EULEX could land uninpeded and kick or paralize UNMIK alltogether, in which case that exactly what transpired.
The bottom line is that six point plan will never be implemented at least in your life time mr. FM of Serbia.

"There will be a big party tomorrow, and he has not been invited...many red and black flags will fly high
(shq, 16 February 2009 12:25)"

I didn't know there's going to be a party with red and black flags in north Kosovo?

TO all:

Seems that Jeremic is still asleep, and probably just woke up and talking about six point, what is he talking about ? Something that is done long time ago..

There will be a big party tomorrow, and he has not been invited...many red and black flags will fly high

"Mr. Jeremic just listen to your own words "support' , therefore was never aproved. As I rember correctly during the last UNSC session the six point plan was never mentioned.
Your word "support' for six point plan was only a trick so that EULEX could land uninpeded and kick or paralize UNMIK alltogether, in which case that exactly what transpired.
The bottom line is that six point plan will never be implemented at least in your life time mr. FM of Serbia.
(The TRUTH, 16 February 2009 11:27) "

What you wrote does not square with the meaning of your name. The 6-points were approved by the UNSC -- see for example http://www.setimes.com/cocoon/setimes/xhtml/en_GB/features/setimes/features/2008/11/27/feature-02

The UNSC presidential statement following the debate reiterated support for Ban's 23-paged report which clearly contained the 6-point plans. You can refer to the UN document archives for this statement. As for Ban's report itself, go to http://www.un.org/ga/search/view_doc.asp?symbol=S/2008/692&Lang=E

I don't know what is your background, but the EU is not made of despicable people out to trick the UN or anyone. Why would they want to tarnish their reputation? Nobody would cooperate with them in the future if that's the case. Pristina would indeed be insulting the EU (that it hopes to join in the future) if it alleges that this is a dishonorable organisation out to trick the UN and everyone else.

One more thing, Kosovo can continue to defy the UN as long as it doesn't mind to remain outside this international body of sovereign nations. Kosovo really has more to lose by not being upfront and honest with the UN!

We will celebrate with Albanian flags, Kosovar flags, NATO flags, EU flags, UN flags, American flags, German flags, Canadian flags, Italian, British, Dutch.

News that negotiations on a 6point plan are to begin tomorrow (Kosovo Independence Day) interesting. Of course there is no mention of where or who will be involved. Is Jeremic in NY because that is where Zannier is?
Sounds more like rhetoric to quell the masses. Getting a little desperate, I think.

Funny - two people who dont control anything in Kosovo "negotiating" on what should be done in Kosovo....

I don't understand how albanians and serbs are going to negotiate ? Serbs want Kosovo inside her borders and albanians dosent accept less than independence. How is it going to be a comopromise ?

lowe,

Because the host country is tolerant makes them feel it is weak. So let them be ignorant and shoot themselves in the foot again and again. The tide has already started turning and it is gaining momentum. It is just a matter of time before certain extremist elements will snap and then countries with hostile Albanian minority populations will take care of things.

One could follow lowe's link to an erroneous news article that states the UNSC adopted the 6 point plan or they could go to the UNSC website
http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs//2008/sc9512.doc.htm
and read the transcript itself and see that infact there was no such action taken.
Do follow his link to the UNSG's report and read it though in its entirety. There are a lot of interesting facts inside other than the 6point plan.

Oh well, B92 cut my comment in half, in the middle of a phrase, so you got a distorted message. Anyway, to everybody, don't drink too much, and drive responsibly.

To all pro-independence:

Please read 1244. It is still valid! We should all be very happy it is still valid.

Come on. Start real negotiations!

We will celebrate with Albanian flags, Kosovar flags, NATO flags, EU flags, UN flags, American flags, German flags, Canadian flags, Italian, British, Dutch.
(laluc, 16 February 2009 14:44)

And dream to live in America, Germany, Canada, Italy, UK, NL. Because according the statistics, Kosovars are the most optimistic people on the planet regarding their future - but according the same statistics, barely if any see their future in Kosovo.

OK,

1) under such conditions it's easy to be an optimist.
2) to all who is optimist like that: take my word, if you are younger than 35-40 go for USA, maybe Canada, USA being probably better. With all it's controversies and hypocrisy. And take everyone with you you can afford - because if you go back home often, it will tax you $100000 or more over 10-year period in airplane tickets. I know, I did it. Wish, I would buy a home instead.

... "there is pressure on some 30 countries, which have not recognized Kosovo and Metohija as an independent state, to do so on the anniversary of the unilateral proclamation."

I think Jeremic is FEELING THE HIT which is worring. By the way just to clarify the matter Serbia's understanding of Security Council mean Russia veto. Secondly. The Serbian "six points plan" was given a green light purely to let EULEX in Kosova without embarrasing Serbian government in front of its people further.

don't drink too much, and drive responsibly.
(shq, 16 February 2009 19:26)

You got a "+" from me, which is an achievement. I deeply disagree with B92 policy about these "+" and "-", even if they probably boost the readership. I almost never use "-" or "+". For instance, the "Hand of Moscow" even with his very offensive last comment #6

http://tinyurl.com/bg3p2j

(basically saying, I am Lavrentiy Pavlovich Beria, more about Beria here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavrenty_Beria)

got away without "-". No hard feelings, but this is an interesting example about big diversities within "Serbian Gang" - later about it.

But yours is a very good posting, even if I strongly disagree (politically) with the celebration. How many times was I swearing north and south of Ibar driving after dark and noticing happy+careless teenagers just in front of my car. It is very dangerous after the dark and you can kill people easily just with speed. I was driving mostly on weekends and met many happy disco visitors. Tomorrow will be probably a similar thing.

Most remembered moment: driving from Pec to KM. Good road, somewhat challenging. At one point you are in the mountains and see the lights of entire K. Mitrovica in the valley. Luckily, I did not drive fast - that was the moment I noticed half a dozen or so Albanian teenagers returning from disco and walking in the middle of the road.

Safe speed and zero alkohol is crucial.

As for other posting, an interesting observation: the biggest accusations and quarrel is not between "Serbian gang" and "Albanian gang" - but within "Serbian gang". That creates a question... Obviously, people from "Serbian gang" are for real and behave ( = quarrel) with each other as expected on forums. Ten members of "Serbian gang" would have 20 different opinions and argue, is sky green or pink. This is normal.

Albanians seem to have a pretty uniform stance on everything. Which is somewhat strange for me.

"One could follow lowe's link to an erroneous news article that states the UNSC adopted the 6 point plan or they could go to the UNSC website
[link]
and read the transcript itself and see that infact there was no such action taken.
Do follow his link to the UNSG's report and read it though in its entirety. There are a lot of interesting facts inside other than the 6point plan.
(pss, 16 February 2009 18:45)"

Your link was a transcript of the main points mentioned by the UNSC. It is not a document of unanimous decision taken by the UNSC. Even this transcript itself made several references to the validity of 1244.

You conveniently skirted the UNSC presidential statement S/PRST/2008/44 which can be found in the link http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N08/622/50/PDF/N0862250.pdf?OpenElement welcoming (UNSC terminology for acceptance) Ban's report which, as I wrote, contained the 6 points.

It is you who chose to be less than fortright in your posts, not me!

"lowe I would suggest you go to official UN website go to webcast and hit archives go to Nov 26th session on Kosovo and see what you come up with.
I too am not Serbian, Albanian etc. I am in the Balkans for 3 years now.
But the next time I enter someones home and they say "welcome" I will ask if that means they plan to "adopt" me.
Cheers
(pss, 17 February 2009 13:57) "

I have gone to the UN archives. Unlike you however, I was able to differentiate between a formal UNSC document and a mere media info sheet.

I couldn't care less which home you enter. But I know is that in the UNSC, a presidential statement welcoming a formal report is equivalent to accepting it. You will only be able to change this standard practice if you yourself successfully apply for Ban's job.

Finally no matter how you twist and turn, Kosovo remains unrecognized by the UN as a state. That is the reality.

Amen, Ron you are 100% right.
The UN and EU can fulfill their mandate of developing and transferring authority to the democratic institutions of Kosovo.
While individual countries exercise their right (as Ban as stated) to recognize Kosovo as independent. Leaving Serbia powerless to revoke 1244 and interfere.

"6 POINT Really what is that!!!????
(enie, 17 February 2009 03:00) "

you really should not be posting until you become much less ignorant of the issue.

"lowe,
We have a saying, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. I have done all I can.
But the bottom line is "if" it were adopted, I am sure the UNSC would have made sure it was rolled out. Even your own politicians admit it has never been implemented--against the Kosovo govts wishes, so nothing else really matters.

Personally I think the 6point plan is a good plan. But the whole basis is that it states that discussions must take place between Pristina and Belgrade on all the subjects but as seen by last weeks attempt by UNMIK to schedule what they thought could be a "safe" talk Serbia would not show because they had to discuss status first. Who creates a plan and constantly rants about it to the whole world and then openly refuses to participate.
(pss, 17 February 2009 04:20) "

yes, you have done all you can indeed. You have tried your level best to pass off a UN media information sheet in your link as an formal UNSC document. And which I have exposed in post #23 as not being a UNSC official record.

Just to set the record straight. I am not a Serb. In fact, I am not even in the Balkans.

lowe I would suggest you go to official UN website go to webcast and hit archives go to Nov 26th session on Kosovo and see what you come up with.
I too am not Serbian, Albanian etc. I am in the Balkans for 3 years now.
But the next time I enter someones home and they say "welcome" I will ask if that means they plan to "adopt" me.
Cheers

6 POINT Really what is that!!!????

lowe,
We have a saying, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. I have done all I can.
But the bottom line is "if" it were adopted, I am sure the UNSC would have made sure it was rolled out. Even your own politicians admit it has never been implemented--against the Kosovo govts wishes, so nothing else really matters.

Personally I think the 6point plan is a good plan. But the whole basis is that it states that discussions must take place between Pristina and Belgrade on all the subjects but as seen by last weeks attempt by UNMIK to schedule what they thought could be a "safe" talk Serbia would not show because they had to discuss status first. Who creates a plan and constantly rants about it to the whole world and then openly refuses to participate.

pss (post #12)

One more thing, why don't you scroll down to the very end of your link and read the last words there?

Let me do that for you and everyone here. The words stated in the last line of your transcript is "For information media - NOT an official record".

So please do not try to fool all of us by passing your link off as an official UNSC formal document. It is NOT.

The fact is that Ban's 23-paged report containing the 6-points was accepted earlier by UNSC Presidential Statement S/PRST/2008/44 on behalf of the UNSC members. Anyone can go into the UN website archive via any search engine to read the entire statement there. Just remember to type its correct reference ie. S/PRST/2008/44 .

One last thought--If the UNSC had adopted the 6. Serbia created it Pristina rejected it, no one implements, leaves no question as to who actually is in control. That would be a huge defeat for Serbia. But that would be in line with 1244

There will be a big party tomorrow, and he has not been invited...many red and black flags will fly high

Jeremić said that UN Security Council's decision to support the secretary-general's six-point plan formally put behind Ahtisaari's document, which never gained the support of the council.

Mr. Jeremic just listen to your own words "support' , therefore was never aproved. As I rember correctly during the last UNSC session the six point plan was never mentioned.
Your word "support' for six point plan was only a trick so that EULEX could land uninpeded and kick or paralize UNMIK alltogether, in which case that exactly what transpired.
The bottom line is that six point plan will never be implemented at least in your life time mr. FM of Serbia.

TO all:

Seems that Jeremic is still asleep, and probably just woke up and talking about six point, what is he talking about ? Something that is done long time ago..

News that negotiations on a 6point plan are to begin tomorrow (Kosovo Independence Day) interesting. Of course there is no mention of where or who will be involved. Is Jeremic in NY because that is where Zannier is?
Sounds more like rhetoric to quell the masses. Getting a little desperate, I think.

We will celebrate with Albanian flags, Kosovar flags, NATO flags, EU flags, UN flags, American flags, German flags, Canadian flags, Italian, British, Dutch.

shq: Why would you celebrate with the flag of another country? I suggest you celebrate with the NATO flag instead, because that is what Kosovo has become. A protectorate of NATO.

"There will be a big party tomorrow, and he has not been invited...many red and black flags will fly high
(shq, 16 February 2009 12:25)"

I didn't know there's going to be a party with red and black flags in north Kosovo?

"Mr. Jeremic just listen to your own words "support' , therefore was never aproved. As I rember correctly during the last UNSC session the six point plan was never mentioned.
Your word "support' for six point plan was only a trick so that EULEX could land uninpeded and kick or paralize UNMIK alltogether, in which case that exactly what transpired.
The bottom line is that six point plan will never be implemented at least in your life time mr. FM of Serbia.
(The TRUTH, 16 February 2009 11:27) "

What you wrote does not square with the meaning of your name. The 6-points were approved by the UNSC -- see for example http://www.setimes.com/cocoon/setimes/xhtml/en_GB/features/setimes/features/2008/11/27/feature-02

The UNSC presidential statement following the debate reiterated support for Ban's 23-paged report which clearly contained the 6-point plans. You can refer to the UN document archives for this statement. As for Ban's report itself, go to http://www.un.org/ga/search/view_doc.asp?symbol=S/2008/692&Lang=E

I don't know what is your background, but the EU is not made of despicable people out to trick the UN or anyone. Why would they want to tarnish their reputation? Nobody would cooperate with them in the future if that's the case. Pristina would indeed be insulting the EU (that it hopes to join in the future) if it alleges that this is a dishonorable organisation out to trick the UN and everyone else.

One more thing, Kosovo can continue to defy the UN as long as it doesn't mind to remain outside this international body of sovereign nations. Kosovo really has more to lose by not being upfront and honest with the UN!

Funny - two people who dont control anything in Kosovo "negotiating" on what should be done in Kosovo....

To all pro-independence:

Please read 1244. It is still valid! We should all be very happy it is still valid.

Come on. Start real negotiations!

I don't understand how albanians and serbs are going to negotiate ? Serbs want Kosovo inside her borders and albanians dosent accept less than independence. How is it going to be a comopromise ?

lowe,

Because the host country is tolerant makes them feel it is weak. So let them be ignorant and shoot themselves in the foot again and again. The tide has already started turning and it is gaining momentum. It is just a matter of time before certain extremist elements will snap and then countries with hostile Albanian minority populations will take care of things.

... "there is pressure on some 30 countries, which have not recognized Kosovo and Metohija as an independent state, to do so on the anniversary of the unilateral proclamation."

I think Jeremic is FEELING THE HIT which is worring. By the way just to clarify the matter Serbia's understanding of Security Council mean Russia veto. Secondly. The Serbian "six points plan" was given a green light purely to let EULEX in Kosova without embarrasing Serbian government in front of its people further.

One could follow lowe's link to an erroneous news article that states the UNSC adopted the 6 point plan or they could go to the UNSC website
http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs//2008/sc9512.doc.htm
and read the transcript itself and see that infact there was no such action taken.
Do follow his link to the UNSG's report and read it though in its entirety. There are a lot of interesting facts inside other than the 6point plan.

We will celebrate with Albanian flags, Kosovar flags, NATO flags, EU flags, UN flags, American flags, German flags, Canadian flags, Italian, British, Dutch.
(laluc, 16 February 2009 14:44)

And dream to live in America, Germany, Canada, Italy, UK, NL. Because according the statistics, Kosovars are the most optimistic people on the planet regarding their future - but according the same statistics, barely if any see their future in Kosovo.

OK,

1) under such conditions it's easy to be an optimist.
2) to all who is optimist like that: take my word, if you are younger than 35-40 go for USA, maybe Canada, USA being probably better. With all it's controversies and hypocrisy. And take everyone with you you can afford - because if you go back home often, it will tax you $100000 or more over 10-year period in airplane tickets. I know, I did it. Wish, I would buy a home instead.

Oh well, B92 cut my comment in half, in the middle of a phrase, so you got a distorted message. Anyway, to everybody, don't drink too much, and drive responsibly.

Amen, Ron you are 100% right.
The UN and EU can fulfill their mandate of developing and transferring authority to the democratic institutions of Kosovo.
While individual countries exercise their right (as Ban as stated) to recognize Kosovo as independent. Leaving Serbia powerless to revoke 1244 and interfere.

don't drink too much, and drive responsibly.
(shq, 16 February 2009 19:26)

You got a "+" from me, which is an achievement. I deeply disagree with B92 policy about these "+" and "-", even if they probably boost the readership. I almost never use "-" or "+". For instance, the "Hand of Moscow" even with his very offensive last comment #6

http://tinyurl.com/bg3p2j

(basically saying, I am Lavrentiy Pavlovich Beria, more about Beria here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavrenty_Beria)

got away without "-". No hard feelings, but this is an interesting example about big diversities within "Serbian Gang" - later about it.

But yours is a very good posting, even if I strongly disagree (politically) with the celebration. How many times was I swearing north and south of Ibar driving after dark and noticing happy+careless teenagers just in front of my car. It is very dangerous after the dark and you can kill people easily just with speed. I was driving mostly on weekends and met many happy disco visitors. Tomorrow will be probably a similar thing.

Most remembered moment: driving from Pec to KM. Good road, somewhat challenging. At one point you are in the mountains and see the lights of entire K. Mitrovica in the valley. Luckily, I did not drive fast - that was the moment I noticed half a dozen or so Albanian teenagers returning from disco and walking in the middle of the road.

Safe speed and zero alkohol is crucial.

As for other posting, an interesting observation: the biggest accusations and quarrel is not between "Serbian gang" and "Albanian gang" - but within "Serbian gang". That creates a question... Obviously, people from "Serbian gang" are for real and behave ( = quarrel) with each other as expected on forums. Ten members of "Serbian gang" would have 20 different opinions and argue, is sky green or pink. This is normal.

Albanians seem to have a pretty uniform stance on everything. Which is somewhat strange for me.

lowe I would suggest you go to official UN website go to webcast and hit archives go to Nov 26th session on Kosovo and see what you come up with.
I too am not Serbian, Albanian etc. I am in the Balkans for 3 years now.
But the next time I enter someones home and they say "welcome" I will ask if that means they plan to "adopt" me.
Cheers

6 POINT Really what is that!!!????

lowe,
We have a saying, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. I have done all I can.
But the bottom line is "if" it were adopted, I am sure the UNSC would have made sure it was rolled out. Even your own politicians admit it has never been implemented--against the Kosovo govts wishes, so nothing else really matters.

Personally I think the 6point plan is a good plan. But the whole basis is that it states that discussions must take place between Pristina and Belgrade on all the subjects but as seen by last weeks attempt by UNMIK to schedule what they thought could be a "safe" talk Serbia would not show because they had to discuss status first. Who creates a plan and constantly rants about it to the whole world and then openly refuses to participate.

One last thought--If the UNSC had adopted the 6. Serbia created it Pristina rejected it, no one implements, leaves no question as to who actually is in control. That would be a huge defeat for Serbia. But that would be in line with 1244

"6 POINT Really what is that!!!????
(enie, 17 February 2009 03:00) "

you really should not be posting until you become much less ignorant of the issue.

"lowe I would suggest you go to official UN website go to webcast and hit archives go to Nov 26th session on Kosovo and see what you come up with.
I too am not Serbian, Albanian etc. I am in the Balkans for 3 years now.
But the next time I enter someones home and they say "welcome" I will ask if that means they plan to "adopt" me.
Cheers
(pss, 17 February 2009 13:57) "

I have gone to the UN archives. Unlike you however, I was able to differentiate between a formal UNSC document and a mere media info sheet.

I couldn't care less which home you enter. But I know is that in the UNSC, a presidential statement welcoming a formal report is equivalent to accepting it. You will only be able to change this standard practice if you yourself successfully apply for Ban's job.

Finally no matter how you twist and turn, Kosovo remains unrecognized by the UN as a state. That is the reality.

"One could follow lowe's link to an erroneous news article that states the UNSC adopted the 6 point plan or they could go to the UNSC website
[link]
and read the transcript itself and see that infact there was no such action taken.
Do follow his link to the UNSG's report and read it though in its entirety. There are a lot of interesting facts inside other than the 6point plan.
(pss, 16 February 2009 18:45)"

Your link was a transcript of the main points mentioned by the UNSC. It is not a document of unanimous decision taken by the UNSC. Even this transcript itself made several references to the validity of 1244.

You conveniently skirted the UNSC presidential statement S/PRST/2008/44 which can be found in the link http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N08/622/50/PDF/N0862250.pdf?OpenElement welcoming (UNSC terminology for acceptance) Ban's report which, as I wrote, contained the 6 points.

It is you who chose to be less than fortright in your posts, not me!

pss (post #12)

One more thing, why don't you scroll down to the very end of your link and read the last words there?

Let me do that for you and everyone here. The words stated in the last line of your transcript is "For information media - NOT an official record".

So please do not try to fool all of us by passing your link off as an official UNSC formal document. It is NOT.

The fact is that Ban's 23-paged report containing the 6-points was accepted earlier by UNSC Presidential Statement S/PRST/2008/44 on behalf of the UNSC members. Anyone can go into the UN website archive via any search engine to read the entire statement there. Just remember to type its correct reference ie. S/PRST/2008/44 .

"lowe,
We have a saying, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. I have done all I can.
But the bottom line is "if" it were adopted, I am sure the UNSC would have made sure it was rolled out. Even your own politicians admit it has never been implemented--against the Kosovo govts wishes, so nothing else really matters.

Personally I think the 6point plan is a good plan. But the whole basis is that it states that discussions must take place between Pristina and Belgrade on all the subjects but as seen by last weeks attempt by UNMIK to schedule what they thought could be a "safe" talk Serbia would not show because they had to discuss status first. Who creates a plan and constantly rants about it to the whole world and then openly refuses to participate.
(pss, 17 February 2009 04:20) "

yes, you have done all you can indeed. You have tried your level best to pass off a UN media information sheet in your link as an formal UNSC document. And which I have exposed in post #23 as not being a UNSC official record.

Just to set the record straight. I am not a Serb. In fact, I am not even in the Balkans.