Drašković: Serbia in EU, without Kosovo

I have always hated this guy, but now he has started to come to his senses.

Of course Serbia will be in EU without Kosova, that's something everybody knows, but the question who will join first, Kosova or Serbia. The most believable are two options: both at the same time, or Kosova before Serbia, cz we all know what will Serbia do if it enters before Kosova - use it's veto power to block Kosova's entry.

It's just my opinion, and it's a logical one.

Greets from Prishtina!

Correction Mr Draskovic,Two Independent country's-two independent systems that's more like it.Nice try though.Thanks

yes the EU has experience in this... let see it detailed:

cyprus? is recognized as an independent country by all 27 EU member states and by 191 out of 192 UN member states.northern-cyprus? is recognized only by turkey no one EU member state recognize it.

oland islands? population = 25,000 hihi country = sweden and recognized as a part of sweden by all 27 EU member states and all 192 UN member states

tirol? south tirol? is a part of italy and is recognized as a part of italy by all 27 EU member states and by all 192 UN member states


Kosovo? is recognized by 23 out of 27 EU member states as an independent country including EU powers (GB,France,Germany) and by all 3 EU candidate countrys (croatia,macedonia,turkey) and by 2 out of 4 potencial eu candiate countrys (montenegro,albania) and by 51 UN member countrys total including the USA,Canada and Japan

republic of kosovo is just 7 months old and has won 51 countrys recognitions including all their neighbors (without serbia) that is much better than all ex-republics of yugoslavia in the 90s and the recognitions will continue and that is nothing that you can make to stop it so stop dreaming you have to recognize kosovo before you can enter EU 100% as turkey has to recognize cyprus to enter EU its very simple

>> He reiterated that he advocated a formula of “more than autonomy, less than independence,” or “One Serbia – two systems.

Sure he does, just the other side and plenty of powerful nations disagree. Getting rid of Albanians was preferable, but they'll take this as last choice. Too bad it's over

>> "One country-two systems is the formula we can still fight for. The EU has solved situations like ours in a special manner,” Drašković said, giving Tirol, Cyprus, and the Oland Islands as examples.

Cyprus will never happen again and EU has said that much. I don't see how the situation is relevant to Tyrol etc.

We don't have to comment much on Drašković, since we know he is an opportunist. But opportunists are sensitive to identify trends. Dear serb neighbours, look at the indikator Drašković, who by the way once found it to be right to deport Albanians from Kosovo.

If Serbia waits for Kosovo to reach the minimum standards required for the EU it will be decades. Serbia should join the EU as soon possible and wait for the balance of power to change in the world.
Bosko

Look it's very simple. Spain will never allow Kosovo in unless it works out something with Serbia. UK will never let Serbia in unless it comes to terms with Kosovo. Until both of you come to you senses neither will be an EU member. And rightly so. The last thing the EU need is two simpletons bringing their infantile dispute to the EU doorstep. Go away and don’t come back until you two find a way to coexist. Or go away and stay away if you don’t. It’s up to you.

Why waste time on Kosovo, the west has taken from Serbia and Europe is offering Serbia admission to EU. I don't think any current EU country will "Throw Serbia Under the Bus". Serbia be smart go on with life enjoy the entitlements of the EU and forget about Kosovo. Once you are in there then you will see what can be done withi the EU. Now of course when Germany decide to change the rules for Kosovo because half of Germany is occupied by Albanians.

Kosova before Serbia (snip)
It's just my opinion, and it's a logical one.

Greets from Prishtina!
(AO KS, 23 October 2008 13:48)

I did see this opinion voiced by your colleagues many times, so you are not alone who believe, it's a logical opinion. As for myself, I cannot understand why so many of you insist on this baseless scenario.

Proof/1:

Historically, Hungary and Romania were at biggest odds because of Hungarian minority and Romanian land grab in 1920. With your attitude you expect, Hungary would block Romania's entry in EU. The reality: only crazy nationalists expected it on both sides. Hungary was one of the chief promoters of Romania. Why? Precisely to remove the borders between "small-Hungary" and "great-Hungary" and make the issue automatically go away.

Result: except the idiots who probably going to riot today again (it's October 23!), the issues now are less, and Romanians were successful to attract Hungarian business and employees from Hungary. These moved from Hungary to Romania.

Same fate will happen with Serbia, of course. If Serbs lower the taxes - Hungarians are known to look at their wallet and refrigerator first and being good at counting the beans. Most important is the number of beans, does it say "Lei", "Forint" or "Dinar" is of lesser importance. Hei, "Lek" is good, too - just give me enough of it.

Proof/2:

This is called "self-incriminating". EU is about these "beans" and people not refusing to count foreign beans which are not foreign anymore. As long as you assume, Serbs will block you - than means, you are not ready for the EU yet... because you have problem with the Serbs and have a strong enemy picture painted on the wall.

Why don't you ask them, will they block you or not? I am 100% sure, the overwhelming majority won't. But you want to have an enemy picture, so you got the enemy.

AO KS, Why would EU care if Serbia uses its veto power , i'd say they have made Kosovo independent cause they don't want it in EU.

For Ataman:

What Romanian "land grab" in 1920? Romania did not take land from Hungary! Transylvania was, is and will always be ROMANIAN land.

(Ataman, 23 October 2008 16:14)

Good comment Ataman.
And, I believe that in the near future we will (Serbia and Kosovo) start thinking about the same thing you highlighted, financial prosperity.
Nobody wants borders, everybody wants to travel freely. And I am sure this will come soon.
The core issue is the present Ataman.
Though you might disagree though I hope you don't ( I know lots of pro-Serbian advocators will) Kosovo is a state and pre 1999 (and pre 17th Feb 2008) is not coming back.
The present Serbian actions only play negatively for both sides, slowing down Kosovo prospects and dragging Serbia further back.
As you said, it all comes down to one thing, money.
No clear minded investor will “risk” their money investing in an unstable environment and this is what both Kosovo and Serbia are at the present.
So, they go somewhere else.
And there are plenty countries that are more than happy to grab the opportunity.
Ataman, let us look at the reality: what are the chances of Kosovo being with Serbia in any real world?
I would say “ZERO”.
So why fight a lost battle?
Why not cut the losses and look forward?
Why even further destabilise a neighbour?
Why even further use Serbs in Kosovo for their political gains?
You want to help Serbs in Kosovo, discuss this with the Kosovo government.
I can assure that the only people that can guaranty Serbs the safety are the Kosovo Albanians.
We can guaranty that they will be safe, all we want in return is for Serbia not to put fuel on the fire we are trying to extinguish (trying to put the past behind us and trying to look forward).
I don’t think this is unrealistic.
Let us respect each other and the “Dollars, Euros, Ruble’s, Florint's,Lei's, Lek's etc” will come to both of us.
Meddle with us, you meddle with yourself also.
Try to destabilise us, you destabilise yourself also.
We are trying Ataman, let us see one positive move from Serbia.
Not a single positive has come from Serbia since 1912, hopefully some day somebody in Serbia will wake up and say “let us look at this differently”. Until this does not come, we (Serbia and Kosovo) will only cause obstacles for each other.

This man draskovic promised so much and delivered so little.
He has been discredited as a Milosevic stooge.
He sold his name for money.
Nobody can believe his comical statements any more.
He is a full stop.

Ataman wrote:

Proof/2:

This is called "self-incriminating". EU is about these "beans" and people not refusing to count foreign beans which are not foreign anymore. As long as you assume, Serbs will block you - than means, you are not ready for the EU yet... because you have problem with the Serbs and have a strong enemy picture painted on the wall.

Why don't you ask them, will they block you or not? I am 100% sure, the overwhelming majority won't. But you want to have an enemy picture, so you got the enemy.
(Ataman, 23 October 2008 16:14)

Look man, we Albanians in Kosova don't have a problem with Serbs, however they seem to have problem with us. Whether they like it or not Kosova is an independent state and it's being recognized quicker than any former yugoslav republic during 90's. One thing I can bet with my life is that Kosova will receive EU membership earlier than Serbia. The only thing staying on our way is Spain but I'm sure that Spain will recognize Kosova as well. We don't need to be recognized by greeks. All Kosova's neighbouring countries have recognized a new reality. It was UK, Germany, France and Italy who needed to do so and as a matter of fact they were the very first ones to go ahed and recognize the new reality in Europe. Mr Tadic accused Montenegro for interfering in serbia's affairs. Is that a ridiculous comment of his?. Let me tell you that EU is watching very closely what's going on in and around Kosova, including most recent reactions from Belgrade on behalf of Montenegro and Macedonia. Such behaviour will not get Serbia into EU or to move forward like other countries around it.

Not a single positive has come from Serbia since 1912, hopefully some day somebody in Serbia will wake up and say “let us look at this differently”.
(blero, 24 October 2008 11:51)
and what makes you think that this isn't the case with present serbian government? they seem fairly reasonable. of course, if you want to see serbia as an enemy noone can help that. and i guess since albanians this time around have support of the world's most powerful and wealthiest nations (which they proudly say here all the time) it's time for them to act in an opportunist way.

To Ataman and malcolm x:

We will always consider and see Serbia as our enemy as long as they continue acting as such. Are we asking an opinion from the ICJ for what Serbia has done to Kosova during the last century? NO! Is Serbia asking from the ICJ for a legal opinion about Kosova's independence? YES! Do you see who's trying to break someone's leg here?

So, as long as Serbia tries to block Kosova from being free, as it is, we will consider it as an ENEMY, as we have always considered it!

So Ataman, stop making comparisons cz they don't make any good or bad. Let's talk about the real condition between Kosova and Serbia.

And to all of you who said Kosova will never be part of IMF and WB (World Bank), I have a bad news: Spring is the latest period when Kosova will enter these institutions, and this is said by Bruce Courtney, coordinator of World Bank Program for Kosova.

Regardless of your arguments Ataman, those two options I mentioned above are still the most believable ones! And if you want a comparison, see Cyprus since you failed to mention it!

Greets from Prishtina!

Danny, maybe they, the EU and others, made Kosova independent to bring her into the EU without Serbia! This is an option, don't you think?

Draskovic is right! Serbia could enter EU long before Kosovo! As Bosko sais:"If Serbia waits for Kosovo to reach the minimum standards required for the EU it will be decades."
But the idea of one country two systems is absurd! Joining EU means: 27 countries - one system!

yes the EU has experience in this... let see it detailed:

cyprus? is recognized as an independent country by all 27 EU member states and by 191 out of 192 UN member states.northern-cyprus? is recognized only by turkey no one EU member state recognize it.

oland islands? population = 25,000 hihi country = sweden and recognized as a part of sweden by all 27 EU member states and all 192 UN member states

tirol? south tirol? is a part of italy and is recognized as a part of italy by all 27 EU member states and by all 192 UN member states


Kosovo? is recognized by 23 out of 27 EU member states as an independent country including EU powers (GB,France,Germany) and by all 3 EU candidate countrys (croatia,macedonia,turkey) and by 2 out of 4 potencial eu candiate countrys (montenegro,albania) and by 51 UN member countrys total including the USA,Canada and Japan

republic of kosovo is just 7 months old and has won 51 countrys recognitions including all their neighbors (without serbia) that is much better than all ex-republics of yugoslavia in the 90s and the recognitions will continue and that is nothing that you can make to stop it so stop dreaming you have to recognize kosovo before you can enter EU 100% as turkey has to recognize cyprus to enter EU its very simple

Correction Mr Draskovic,Two Independent country's-two independent systems that's more like it.Nice try though.Thanks

I have always hated this guy, but now he has started to come to his senses.

Of course Serbia will be in EU without Kosova, that's something everybody knows, but the question who will join first, Kosova or Serbia. The most believable are two options: both at the same time, or Kosova before Serbia, cz we all know what will Serbia do if it enters before Kosova - use it's veto power to block Kosova's entry.

It's just my opinion, and it's a logical one.

Greets from Prishtina!

>> He reiterated that he advocated a formula of “more than autonomy, less than independence,” or “One Serbia – two systems.

Sure he does, just the other side and plenty of powerful nations disagree. Getting rid of Albanians was preferable, but they'll take this as last choice. Too bad it's over

>> "One country-two systems is the formula we can still fight for. The EU has solved situations like ours in a special manner,” Drašković said, giving Tirol, Cyprus, and the Oland Islands as examples.

Cyprus will never happen again and EU has said that much. I don't see how the situation is relevant to Tyrol etc.

We don't have to comment much on Drašković, since we know he is an opportunist. But opportunists are sensitive to identify trends. Dear serb neighbours, look at the indikator Drašković, who by the way once found it to be right to deport Albanians from Kosovo.

Why waste time on Kosovo, the west has taken from Serbia and Europe is offering Serbia admission to EU. I don't think any current EU country will "Throw Serbia Under the Bus". Serbia be smart go on with life enjoy the entitlements of the EU and forget about Kosovo. Once you are in there then you will see what can be done withi the EU. Now of course when Germany decide to change the rules for Kosovo because half of Germany is occupied by Albanians.

Look it's very simple. Spain will never allow Kosovo in unless it works out something with Serbia. UK will never let Serbia in unless it comes to terms with Kosovo. Until both of you come to you senses neither will be an EU member. And rightly so. The last thing the EU need is two simpletons bringing their infantile dispute to the EU doorstep. Go away and don’t come back until you two find a way to coexist. Or go away and stay away if you don’t. It’s up to you.

If Serbia waits for Kosovo to reach the minimum standards required for the EU it will be decades. Serbia should join the EU as soon possible and wait for the balance of power to change in the world.
Bosko

Kosova before Serbia (snip)
It's just my opinion, and it's a logical one.

Greets from Prishtina!
(AO KS, 23 October 2008 13:48)

I did see this opinion voiced by your colleagues many times, so you are not alone who believe, it's a logical opinion. As for myself, I cannot understand why so many of you insist on this baseless scenario.

Proof/1:

Historically, Hungary and Romania were at biggest odds because of Hungarian minority and Romanian land grab in 1920. With your attitude you expect, Hungary would block Romania's entry in EU. The reality: only crazy nationalists expected it on both sides. Hungary was one of the chief promoters of Romania. Why? Precisely to remove the borders between "small-Hungary" and "great-Hungary" and make the issue automatically go away.

Result: except the idiots who probably going to riot today again (it's October 23!), the issues now are less, and Romanians were successful to attract Hungarian business and employees from Hungary. These moved from Hungary to Romania.

Same fate will happen with Serbia, of course. If Serbs lower the taxes - Hungarians are known to look at their wallet and refrigerator first and being good at counting the beans. Most important is the number of beans, does it say "Lei", "Forint" or "Dinar" is of lesser importance. Hei, "Lek" is good, too - just give me enough of it.

Proof/2:

This is called "self-incriminating". EU is about these "beans" and people not refusing to count foreign beans which are not foreign anymore. As long as you assume, Serbs will block you - than means, you are not ready for the EU yet... because you have problem with the Serbs and have a strong enemy picture painted on the wall.

Why don't you ask them, will they block you or not? I am 100% sure, the overwhelming majority won't. But you want to have an enemy picture, so you got the enemy.

For Ataman:

What Romanian "land grab" in 1920? Romania did not take land from Hungary! Transylvania was, is and will always be ROMANIAN land.

(Ataman, 23 October 2008 16:14)

Good comment Ataman.
And, I believe that in the near future we will (Serbia and Kosovo) start thinking about the same thing you highlighted, financial prosperity.
Nobody wants borders, everybody wants to travel freely. And I am sure this will come soon.
The core issue is the present Ataman.
Though you might disagree though I hope you don't ( I know lots of pro-Serbian advocators will) Kosovo is a state and pre 1999 (and pre 17th Feb 2008) is not coming back.
The present Serbian actions only play negatively for both sides, slowing down Kosovo prospects and dragging Serbia further back.
As you said, it all comes down to one thing, money.
No clear minded investor will “risk” their money investing in an unstable environment and this is what both Kosovo and Serbia are at the present.
So, they go somewhere else.
And there are plenty countries that are more than happy to grab the opportunity.
Ataman, let us look at the reality: what are the chances of Kosovo being with Serbia in any real world?
I would say “ZERO”.
So why fight a lost battle?
Why not cut the losses and look forward?
Why even further destabilise a neighbour?
Why even further use Serbs in Kosovo for their political gains?
You want to help Serbs in Kosovo, discuss this with the Kosovo government.
I can assure that the only people that can guaranty Serbs the safety are the Kosovo Albanians.
We can guaranty that they will be safe, all we want in return is for Serbia not to put fuel on the fire we are trying to extinguish (trying to put the past behind us and trying to look forward).
I don’t think this is unrealistic.
Let us respect each other and the “Dollars, Euros, Ruble’s, Florint's,Lei's, Lek's etc” will come to both of us.
Meddle with us, you meddle with yourself also.
Try to destabilise us, you destabilise yourself also.
We are trying Ataman, let us see one positive move from Serbia.
Not a single positive has come from Serbia since 1912, hopefully some day somebody in Serbia will wake up and say “let us look at this differently”. Until this does not come, we (Serbia and Kosovo) will only cause obstacles for each other.

This man draskovic promised so much and delivered so little.
He has been discredited as a Milosevic stooge.
He sold his name for money.
Nobody can believe his comical statements any more.
He is a full stop.

Ataman wrote:

Proof/2:

This is called "self-incriminating". EU is about these "beans" and people not refusing to count foreign beans which are not foreign anymore. As long as you assume, Serbs will block you - than means, you are not ready for the EU yet... because you have problem with the Serbs and have a strong enemy picture painted on the wall.

Why don't you ask them, will they block you or not? I am 100% sure, the overwhelming majority won't. But you want to have an enemy picture, so you got the enemy.
(Ataman, 23 October 2008 16:14)

Look man, we Albanians in Kosova don't have a problem with Serbs, however they seem to have problem with us. Whether they like it or not Kosova is an independent state and it's being recognized quicker than any former yugoslav republic during 90's. One thing I can bet with my life is that Kosova will receive EU membership earlier than Serbia. The only thing staying on our way is Spain but I'm sure that Spain will recognize Kosova as well. We don't need to be recognized by greeks. All Kosova's neighbouring countries have recognized a new reality. It was UK, Germany, France and Italy who needed to do so and as a matter of fact they were the very first ones to go ahed and recognize the new reality in Europe. Mr Tadic accused Montenegro for interfering in serbia's affairs. Is that a ridiculous comment of his?. Let me tell you that EU is watching very closely what's going on in and around Kosova, including most recent reactions from Belgrade on behalf of Montenegro and Macedonia. Such behaviour will not get Serbia into EU or to move forward like other countries around it.

Not a single positive has come from Serbia since 1912, hopefully some day somebody in Serbia will wake up and say “let us look at this differently”.
(blero, 24 October 2008 11:51)
and what makes you think that this isn't the case with present serbian government? they seem fairly reasonable. of course, if you want to see serbia as an enemy noone can help that. and i guess since albanians this time around have support of the world's most powerful and wealthiest nations (which they proudly say here all the time) it's time for them to act in an opportunist way.

To Ataman and malcolm x:

We will always consider and see Serbia as our enemy as long as they continue acting as such. Are we asking an opinion from the ICJ for what Serbia has done to Kosova during the last century? NO! Is Serbia asking from the ICJ for a legal opinion about Kosova's independence? YES! Do you see who's trying to break someone's leg here?

So, as long as Serbia tries to block Kosova from being free, as it is, we will consider it as an ENEMY, as we have always considered it!

So Ataman, stop making comparisons cz they don't make any good or bad. Let's talk about the real condition between Kosova and Serbia.

And to all of you who said Kosova will never be part of IMF and WB (World Bank), I have a bad news: Spring is the latest period when Kosova will enter these institutions, and this is said by Bruce Courtney, coordinator of World Bank Program for Kosova.

Regardless of your arguments Ataman, those two options I mentioned above are still the most believable ones! And if you want a comparison, see Cyprus since you failed to mention it!

Greets from Prishtina!

AO KS, Why would EU care if Serbia uses its veto power , i'd say they have made Kosovo independent cause they don't want it in EU.

Danny, maybe they, the EU and others, made Kosova independent to bring her into the EU without Serbia! This is an option, don't you think?

Draskovic is right! Serbia could enter EU long before Kosovo! As Bosko sais:"If Serbia waits for Kosovo to reach the minimum standards required for the EU it will be decades."
But the idea of one country two systems is absurd! Joining EU means: 27 countries - one system!