Barroso: Kosovo no precedent

Please, don't take this guy seriously. We know him very well here.

I'm afraid that South Ossetia and Abkhazia are gone not because of the number of recognitions but due to the fact that Russia borders them and the reality on the ground says so. They now live in their own country and are free to travel the world with their Russian passports. Who on earth will attempt to intervene against Russia? The fact that references are contstantly made between Kosovo, South Ossetia and Abkhazia means the precedent is alive and well.

Oh and we all know NATO didn't come to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing because before NATO's intervention practically all Albanians were still in Kosovo and they fled only when the bombing started but upon their return, they decided to ethnically cleanse hundreds of thousands of Serbians and other non-Albanians. After almost a decade, that situation still remains so who is Barroso trying to fool?

The new world disorder is about "might is right" and since might is shifting Eastwards, I'm afraid the Albanians will sooner or later have to face up to their unpunished crimes. It is very sad indeed that they thought right to murder and remove so many people from their home.

How can Jose Manuel Barroso keep a straight face? How can you apply international law in a selective manner? Saying that 'Kosovo cannot create a precedent' isn't enough. Just like Munich in 1938, history will savage those involved in Serbia's dismemberment in 2008.

Mr.Barroso, let me tell you this. No matter what you say, if Kosovo is allowed to be independent against the rules of international law, then it is a precedent.

On the other hand if international law is followed then it is no precedent. It may already be too late, not only does this precedent apply to places in the former Soviet union, but also in many places in western Europe. Like Scotland, Northern Ireland, Basque county, Flanders, Catalonia and so on.

"NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing"
nato did do nothing to prevent ethnic cleansing, they where supporting the KLA with ethnic cleansing, and stealing of organs with illegal nato bombardments because USa wants to have a serbian province.
saakashvili if you where a man you would say to your western friends that they are wrong with trying to steal a serbian province and that they have created the precedent of the problems in you country.
mr barosso the representer of western arrogance who do you think you are? you think the EU can control the world?
you and the USA will be out of the game very soon and the eastern world will have the power.
you think you can tell others that a independence province kosovo is legal because western countries are reconizing it and nobody the georgian provinces?
well, all the countries who are reconizing the province kosovo as independence are under USA control and will not reconizing the georgian provinces.
all the countries who supporting serbia, they are respecting international law.
so that's the reason why almost nobody is reconizing the georgian provinces.

Who decides whose
"territorial integrity and sovereignty" is to be respected?

"no-one important in the world has recognized the Georgian regions"

So is Barroso saying that Russia isnt important?
Russia is FAR more important than Portugal will have be.

“NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“

The Georgians were the ones who invaded and killed 1200 South Osetian civilians within 24hrs.
If thats not genocide and ethnic cleansing, tell me what is?

Sorry Barroso
the "Red" has already been crossed
south osetia & apkasia are no longer part of the puppet state of Georgia.

Why is B92 reporting this?

Blah, blah, blah, same old they've been spewing for a while now. Why is it sooo important that they keep repeating the same line over and over again. I guess if you say it long and loud enough, it'll be true...or maybe not!

>Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“<
This sentence says it all. Well said Saakashvili. Nothing more to add.

yeah, no one important except that russia that you lick their shoes for a new eu-russia treaty ....

no problem, then kosovo isn´t the precedent for the 2 youngest states in the world.

and: if us-puppets keep yelling and crying, then abkhazia and s-ossetia will become part of russian federation and maybe a osset new un-ambassador with veto-power.

get over it and face reality ....

it is truly right what Mr. Barroso is interpreting. Kosova became independent because of the crimes that the Serbian state has commited against the citizens of this former province of his. I would love to know the opinion of Serbs if they were in the position of its neighbors, Kosovars how would they feel if someone would ask them to live together with the butchers who just eight years ago killed their families, friends and relatives, burned down all their wealth and destroyed for almost 15 years all what was built earlier. I do not believe they would agree to live together again. Kosovars had the right to become independent and everyone should learn that if the state does not respect the rights of its citizens to live freely then thei nternational community should make that happen. For Kosova it meant independence and as such this case will remain "sui generis" forever.

Anybody with a shred of common sense can see through this statement and no additional comment is needed.

My advice to you guys is not to waste your time commenting this. (I know I have just contradicted myself...)

So why did the EU countries abstain?

If EU is so sure about its decision, then why did you abstain at the General Assembly?

Why does'nt a journalist ask the EU the above?

If Russia had not the territorial continuity with SO and Abkhazia the recognition of Moscow would not be worth the paper on which is written- as a matter a fact not even Belarus recognised them.

Russia did NOT recognise them it simply annexed them.

Just as the sun sets on the west so too is its age long grip on power. Look to the east and not only will you see the sun rise, but also the rise in a new world order led by two new powerhouse's in Russia and China. This western system of absolute freedom in the market place has left them pouring trillions of valuable dollars in a defunct system. Why the Serb government feels the need to pursue EU membership, when all the major signs point to this "ship" goin down, I can only wonder. Such comments made by leaders of EU, US, UK and the like just reconfirm my views that Eu membership is sooo way passe.

“From the start, we’ve said that Kosovo cannot create a precedent"

Who is we?

Only the UN security council can decide such questions, not some amateur polticians in Europe.

Russia, China, India, Brazil, Argetina and 140 more countries in the world have decided otherwise Mr Barosso!

>> Who decides whose
"territorial integrity and sovereignty" is to be respected?

Nations decide whether you have the right to ask for independence. They are 192 nation now, only 50 existed in the 1950's. Serbia by committing ethnic cleansing, the massacres and burning down the houses lost the moral right to rule, the Albanians are entitled to a free and safe state (and 50 states so far agree.) You can't do whatever you want to people without any consquences

Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“

WOW well said Georgian President. We all know what happened in Kosovo and in other countries in former serbo-sllavia. What about 140000 Georgian displaced refugees, what's up with that. I know that Georgian Army went in South Ossetia to retake control of the region but Russia made big mistake. Russia should have talked to someone who could intervene and not terrorize the whole country. Remember Kosovo 1998-99 so many mediators tried to convince crazy milosevic to stop ethnic cleansing but it was worthless talk. NATO had to step up and bombing happened unfortunately. Mr Sarcozy for example could have been an amazing mediator between Georgia and Russia. Russia chose wrong path and see what happened, no one is recognizing S.O and Abkhazia. Other words Kosovo is in Europe while S.O and Abkhazia in Asian continent. However I hope for both sides to solve the problem once and for all. Peace to all.

Mr Barroso, is man of vision and integrity he is right, what precedent!! he is not going to by this Russian lies. Power is in the west, never in east,never was and will never be. So go west my friends.Thanks

Back to OZ Mr. Barroso.
Over there if you repeat yourself over and over you get back to reality. But only over there.
We are already living in a real world and you can't see it.

"Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“"

What a joke! This coming form a man who ordered an artillery strike on a city full of people and just a year ago, dispersed opposition party supporters with a high level of brutality? He is an insult to democracy and should not be supported by the West! Russia should have gone all the way and toppled him from power!

“I would love to know the opinion of Serbs if they were in the position of its neighbors… everyone should learn that if the state does not respect the rights of its citizens to live freely then thei nternational community should make that happen”

Mr. Brown, funny you should ask that. You see, we Serbs weren’t very interested in living in Tudjman’s Neo-Ustashe State after the genocide committed against us in WWII by his good friends he welcomed back with open arms in the 90’s. However, International community thought something different, so we were completely cleansed from there.

As far as Kosovo goes, clearly you must support partition? The ratio of Serbian victims to Albanian victims (1 to 10) in Kosovo per capita (percentage of the population) is IDENTICAL. The only main difference is we have a much higher percentage of ethnically cleansed. So surely you agree we should not be forced to live under your rule either. Your people have also behaved in the typical Balkan manner.

As far as Mr. Barroso goes, I think the other commentators have it covered. His arguments do not make sense.

This sentence says it all. Well said Saakashvili. Nothing more to add.
(blero, 15 October 2008 12:09)

... one more thing (as Steve Jobs uses to say)

My advice to you guys is not to waste your time commenting this. (I know I have just contradicted myself...)
(bganon, 15 October 2008 13:03)

Yes, but I can't resist the "necktie lunch".

Blero, here is the "thing". Listening to anyone who feeds on own neckties does not make sense. Kebaptore is a place to eating, necktie is not served there. Dont' do that in a kebaptore:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IMg7fB-KMY&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBh9D2WIGsE

bon appetite, mr. president!

In ther words Kosovo is in Europe while S.O and Abkhazia in Asian continent?-Albo» Albo, I hope you have a map.If Abhazia and Ossetia are in Asia...than Canada is in South America!Hmm. And NATO only helped the UCK,KLA to continue the ethnic cleansing up to this day even if the albanians started the ethnic cleansing!Sooner or later tre truth wiil come over.Watch the documentary movie «Stolen Kosovo» made by czehs.

One of the best analysis I ever seen about Georgian conflict (in Russian) is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfdBEoVAfmw

Bottom line: all are criminals, including putin, saakashvili and who has the upper hand in Ossetia and Abkhazia.

What he does not say (but true): putin's actions were a mirror of 1999 "humanitarian bombing". The parallels are really scary.

Who knows the language, enjoy the very balanced explanation.

Russia should have gone all the way and toppled him from power!
(Peter Sudyka, 16 October 2008 08:13)

And replace a criminal with a villain? :(

BTW: it is well-known, our "Beslan-friend" (царство ему небесное - NOT!) shamil basayev gained much of his "expertise" while being on Russian side and fighting Georgians in early 90-s. Later he decided to apply his "experience" to theatre, school, and high-rise homes in Moscow.

Imagine, what he did to Georgians before turning his back to Russia.

Mr.Barroso a precedent was set in February 2008. Further, Georgia thought by crossing the red line they scored on the green line - they obviosuly didn't. In ending, Mr. Barroso as of August 2008 - the world has become multi-polar, so your comments and orders are no longer valid or warranted.

On 15 October 2008 22:21, James wrote:

"Only the UN security council can decide such questions, not some amateur polticians in Europe.

Russia, China, India, Brazil, Argetina and 140 more countries in the world have decided otherwise Mr Barosso!"

See? This is why I read the comments here. I learn so much new stuff!!!

1) I didn't know that the question of Kosovo UDI had been put on the table at the UNSC for approval.

2) I did not know that the UNSC had 140 members.

But now I know! Thanks James.

For Kosovo to be compared with Abkhazia and South Ossetia, it should be occupied by Albanian troops, with the Albanian government issuing Albanian passports to Kosovar residents.

So, Kosovo and the other two caucasian regions cannot be put on the same “precedent” basket.

it is truly right what Mr. Barroso is interpreting. Kosova became independent because of the crimes that the Serbian state has commited against the citizens of this former province of his. I would love to know the opinion of Serbs if they were in the position of its neighbors, Kosovars how would they feel if someone would ask them to live together with the butchers who just eight years ago killed their families, friends and relatives, burned down all their wealth and destroyed for almost 15 years all what was built earlier. I do not believe they would agree to live together again. Kosovars had the right to become independent and everyone should learn that if the state does not respect the rights of its citizens to live freely then thei nternational community should make that happen. For Kosova it meant independence and as such this case will remain "sui generis" forever.

Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“

WOW well said Georgian President. We all know what happened in Kosovo and in other countries in former serbo-sllavia. What about 140000 Georgian displaced refugees, what's up with that. I know that Georgian Army went in South Ossetia to retake control of the region but Russia made big mistake. Russia should have talked to someone who could intervene and not terrorize the whole country. Remember Kosovo 1998-99 so many mediators tried to convince crazy milosevic to stop ethnic cleansing but it was worthless talk. NATO had to step up and bombing happened unfortunately. Mr Sarcozy for example could have been an amazing mediator between Georgia and Russia. Russia chose wrong path and see what happened, no one is recognizing S.O and Abkhazia. Other words Kosovo is in Europe while S.O and Abkhazia in Asian continent. However I hope for both sides to solve the problem once and for all. Peace to all.

"no-one important in the world has recognized the Georgian regions"

So is Barroso saying that Russia isnt important?
Russia is FAR more important than Portugal will have be.

“NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“

The Georgians were the ones who invaded and killed 1200 South Osetian civilians within 24hrs.
If thats not genocide and ethnic cleansing, tell me what is?

Sorry Barroso
the "Red" has already been crossed
south osetia & apkasia are no longer part of the puppet state of Georgia.

Why is B92 reporting this?

"NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing"
nato did do nothing to prevent ethnic cleansing, they where supporting the KLA with ethnic cleansing, and stealing of organs with illegal nato bombardments because USa wants to have a serbian province.
saakashvili if you where a man you would say to your western friends that they are wrong with trying to steal a serbian province and that they have created the precedent of the problems in you country.
mr barosso the representer of western arrogance who do you think you are? you think the EU can control the world?
you and the USA will be out of the game very soon and the eastern world will have the power.
you think you can tell others that a independence province kosovo is legal because western countries are reconizing it and nobody the georgian provinces?
well, all the countries who are reconizing the province kosovo as independence are under USA control and will not reconizing the georgian provinces.
all the countries who supporting serbia, they are respecting international law.
so that's the reason why almost nobody is reconizing the georgian provinces.

>Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“<
This sentence says it all. Well said Saakashvili. Nothing more to add.

Mr.Barroso, let me tell you this. No matter what you say, if Kosovo is allowed to be independent against the rules of international law, then it is a precedent.

On the other hand if international law is followed then it is no precedent. It may already be too late, not only does this precedent apply to places in the former Soviet union, but also in many places in western Europe. Like Scotland, Northern Ireland, Basque county, Flanders, Catalonia and so on.

I'm afraid that South Ossetia and Abkhazia are gone not because of the number of recognitions but due to the fact that Russia borders them and the reality on the ground says so. They now live in their own country and are free to travel the world with their Russian passports. Who on earth will attempt to intervene against Russia? The fact that references are contstantly made between Kosovo, South Ossetia and Abkhazia means the precedent is alive and well.

Oh and we all know NATO didn't come to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing because before NATO's intervention practically all Albanians were still in Kosovo and they fled only when the bombing started but upon their return, they decided to ethnically cleanse hundreds of thousands of Serbians and other non-Albanians. After almost a decade, that situation still remains so who is Barroso trying to fool?

The new world disorder is about "might is right" and since might is shifting Eastwards, I'm afraid the Albanians will sooner or later have to face up to their unpunished crimes. It is very sad indeed that they thought right to murder and remove so many people from their home.

Mr Barroso, is man of vision and integrity he is right, what precedent!! he is not going to by this Russian lies. Power is in the west, never in east,never was and will never be. So go west my friends.Thanks

>> Who decides whose
"territorial integrity and sovereignty" is to be respected?

Nations decide whether you have the right to ask for independence. They are 192 nation now, only 50 existed in the 1950's. Serbia by committing ethnic cleansing, the massacres and burning down the houses lost the moral right to rule, the Albanians are entitled to a free and safe state (and 50 states so far agree.) You can't do whatever you want to people without any consquences

How can Jose Manuel Barroso keep a straight face? How can you apply international law in a selective manner? Saying that 'Kosovo cannot create a precedent' isn't enough. Just like Munich in 1938, history will savage those involved in Serbia's dismemberment in 2008.

If Russia had not the territorial continuity with SO and Abkhazia the recognition of Moscow would not be worth the paper on which is written- as a matter a fact not even Belarus recognised them.

Russia did NOT recognise them it simply annexed them.

“From the start, we’ve said that Kosovo cannot create a precedent"

Who is we?

Only the UN security council can decide such questions, not some amateur polticians in Europe.

Russia, China, India, Brazil, Argetina and 140 more countries in the world have decided otherwise Mr Barosso!

Who decides whose
"territorial integrity and sovereignty" is to be respected?

Please, don't take this guy seriously. We know him very well here.

Blah, blah, blah, same old they've been spewing for a while now. Why is it sooo important that they keep repeating the same line over and over again. I guess if you say it long and loud enough, it'll be true...or maybe not!

On 15 October 2008 22:21, James wrote:

"Only the UN security council can decide such questions, not some amateur polticians in Europe.

Russia, China, India, Brazil, Argetina and 140 more countries in the world have decided otherwise Mr Barosso!"

See? This is why I read the comments here. I learn so much new stuff!!!

1) I didn't know that the question of Kosovo UDI had been put on the table at the UNSC for approval.

2) I did not know that the UNSC had 140 members.

But now I know! Thanks James.

For Kosovo to be compared with Abkhazia and South Ossetia, it should be occupied by Albanian troops, with the Albanian government issuing Albanian passports to Kosovar residents.

So, Kosovo and the other two caucasian regions cannot be put on the same “precedent” basket.

yeah, no one important except that russia that you lick their shoes for a new eu-russia treaty ....

no problem, then kosovo isn´t the precedent for the 2 youngest states in the world.

and: if us-puppets keep yelling and crying, then abkhazia and s-ossetia will become part of russian federation and maybe a osset new un-ambassador with veto-power.

get over it and face reality ....

Just as the sun sets on the west so too is its age long grip on power. Look to the east and not only will you see the sun rise, but also the rise in a new world order led by two new powerhouse's in Russia and China. This western system of absolute freedom in the market place has left them pouring trillions of valuable dollars in a defunct system. Why the Serb government feels the need to pursue EU membership, when all the major signs point to this "ship" goin down, I can only wonder. Such comments made by leaders of EU, US, UK and the like just reconfirm my views that Eu membership is sooo way passe.

So why did the EU countries abstain?

If EU is so sure about its decision, then why did you abstain at the General Assembly?

Why does'nt a journalist ask the EU the above?

Anybody with a shred of common sense can see through this statement and no additional comment is needed.

My advice to you guys is not to waste your time commenting this. (I know I have just contradicted myself...)

“I would love to know the opinion of Serbs if they were in the position of its neighbors… everyone should learn that if the state does not respect the rights of its citizens to live freely then thei nternational community should make that happen”

Mr. Brown, funny you should ask that. You see, we Serbs weren’t very interested in living in Tudjman’s Neo-Ustashe State after the genocide committed against us in WWII by his good friends he welcomed back with open arms in the 90’s. However, International community thought something different, so we were completely cleansed from there.

As far as Kosovo goes, clearly you must support partition? The ratio of Serbian victims to Albanian victims (1 to 10) in Kosovo per capita (percentage of the population) is IDENTICAL. The only main difference is we have a much higher percentage of ethnically cleansed. So surely you agree we should not be forced to live under your rule either. Your people have also behaved in the typical Balkan manner.

As far as Mr. Barroso goes, I think the other commentators have it covered. His arguments do not make sense.

This sentence says it all. Well said Saakashvili. Nothing more to add.
(blero, 15 October 2008 12:09)

... one more thing (as Steve Jobs uses to say)

My advice to you guys is not to waste your time commenting this. (I know I have just contradicted myself...)
(bganon, 15 October 2008 13:03)

Yes, but I can't resist the "necktie lunch".

Blero, here is the "thing". Listening to anyone who feeds on own neckties does not make sense. Kebaptore is a place to eating, necktie is not served there. Dont' do that in a kebaptore:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IMg7fB-KMY&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBh9D2WIGsE

bon appetite, mr. president!

Back to OZ Mr. Barroso.
Over there if you repeat yourself over and over you get back to reality. But only over there.
We are already living in a real world and you can't see it.

One of the best analysis I ever seen about Georgian conflict (in Russian) is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfdBEoVAfmw

Bottom line: all are criminals, including putin, saakashvili and who has the upper hand in Ossetia and Abkhazia.

What he does not say (but true): putin's actions were a mirror of 1999 "humanitarian bombing". The parallels are really scary.

Who knows the language, enjoy the very balanced explanation.

"Saakashvili said that the difference between the two cases was that “NATO came to Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing, while Russia came to Georgia to commit ethnic cleansing.“"

What a joke! This coming form a man who ordered an artillery strike on a city full of people and just a year ago, dispersed opposition party supporters with a high level of brutality? He is an insult to democracy and should not be supported by the West! Russia should have gone all the way and toppled him from power!

In ther words Kosovo is in Europe while S.O and Abkhazia in Asian continent?-Albo» Albo, I hope you have a map.If Abhazia and Ossetia are in Asia...than Canada is in South America!Hmm. And NATO only helped the UCK,KLA to continue the ethnic cleansing up to this day even if the albanians started the ethnic cleansing!Sooner or later tre truth wiil come over.Watch the documentary movie «Stolen Kosovo» made by czehs.

Russia should have gone all the way and toppled him from power!
(Peter Sudyka, 16 October 2008 08:13)

And replace a criminal with a villain? :(

BTW: it is well-known, our "Beslan-friend" (царство ему небесное - NOT!) shamil basayev gained much of his "expertise" while being on Russian side and fighting Georgians in early 90-s. Later he decided to apply his "experience" to theatre, school, and high-rise homes in Moscow.

Imagine, what he did to Georgians before turning his back to Russia.

Mr.Barroso a precedent was set in February 2008. Further, Georgia thought by crossing the red line they scored on the green line - they obviosuly didn't. In ending, Mr. Barroso as of August 2008 - the world has become multi-polar, so your comments and orders are no longer valid or warranted.