MUP tells anti-fascists to pick another venue

I agree, Ataman. Why ban the anti-fascism march? To ban the neo-Nazis march makes sense, and to allow an anti-fascist march would underline that decision.

A neo-Nazi march is an incitement to stir up hate and violent racism, but an anti-fascism march is precisely the opposite.

I suppose that it could be argued that there could be some civil unrest if one was allowed without the other, but that would be a very sad reflection of society.

I am sure that the vast majority of people would be able to distinguish between the two.

The road to hell is paved with the best intentions (and with stupidity).
Nothing wrong is to ban neonazis even as whole. The anti-fascist ban is pure brain damage. There is no symmetry.

I would call Brussels "idiocism". EULEX looks on paper good, legally a bubble, impossible to implement even within strictest borders of KosMet, excluding Mitrovica. Good to feed some parasites. Do you what kind of work these people do for the money they earn? Restaurant-bashing and cafeteria-testing in Pristina. Indeed, Albos have some good food and drinks. That's what is EULEX for. Otherwise imagine, they try to explain the guy with long mustache and long gun, he has to disarm and give them his gun. I am not EULEX, I won't do that in person. It's a complete failure before even born. But looks nice on the paper.

I thought we'd said goodbye to the right wing relativism view (or the sitonthefencism view) that equalises the extreme with those that oppose extremism.

In other words I too think its absolutely ridiulous to ban an anti fascist march. Besides, only a complete idiot can fail to realise that if there is no fascist rally it is highly unlikely that an anti fascist rally would be held.

One is a reaction to the other. They are most certainly not equally problematic.

Happy to hear this update.

Re. the Nazi march - To those who say eg. "BUT if they engage in any kind of true hate speech" etc: the whole movement is about hate and racism.

You can't allow any such movement with ideals that are, or should be, illegal under the racism act of every European country to spread their poison and incite hatred.

There's nothing worse than a bigot or someone ignorant enough to be racist.

I have heard neo-Nazis speak and it's repulsive. They speak of children of certain peoples as being 'cockroaches'. How can that sort of comment ever be excused?

Even the most uneducated person would know that it was wrong to say such things.

But I have to add that some of the worst and most ignorant comments are frequently heard in the States.

Banning an Anti Facsist rally in Serbia could be because the "For a EUlux Serbia" government does not want to alienate some of its puppeteers in Brussells and Washington.

http://www.duhaime.org/LegalDictionary/F/Fascism.aspx

please read the exlpanation of facist foreign policy.

I agree with Dashnori actually. Let them speak, BUT if they engage in any kind of true hate speech, crack down HARD. The RICO act has been successfully used to take down the KKK here in the US WITHOUT having to silence anyone, or ban them because they *might* say something wrong. It’s a really really tough position to support, especially in this case, but Free Speech is important. There has to be other ways of dealing with the situation.

They are rarely on the streets to express their opinion peacefully. The failure of Hungarian police in 2006 was that they did precisely what our logic would suggest: "Allow free speech, but if there is some trouble, crack down hard": the trouble begun way to soon and cops were unprepared for the challenge.

In US they have right to march and the cops must protect them, something I agree with 100%. Banning is a Free speech violation. The idea is that tomorrow your group might be deemed 'dangerous' or 'despicable' by the government.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialist_Party_of_America_v._Village_of_Skokie

Kate,

If that group is engaged in illegal activities, then they should break up the group and arrest their members.

However, no one should be denied the right to state their opinions in a public forum no matter how much we disagree with those views. That’s an entirely different matter. I would not like a return to McCarthyism in the US or anything.

Did you know that under Stalin merely thinking badly about the State was punishable, and the burden of proof was on you to prove you weren’t thinking negatively?

You see, not long ago when more radical people were in power in Belgrade, they also tried to stifle dissenting views because they too found them offensive.

I also of course find Nazism or Fascism extremely offensive, I have family from the Krajina. Heard of Jasenovac? I visited there with a WWII survivor, it was a very emotional experience. I hate Nazi’s.

However, listen to their reasoning behind the ban.

“Our checks have revealed that this person has links to organizations which are alleged to be pro-fascist”

Notice how he says “alleged”? So the mere suspicion is enough to label them Nazi and Fascist by the media and ban him from public?

The problem in Serbia is they’re not very good at crowd control. I was in Belgrade when the won a World Championship in Basketball, they completely destroyed downtown Belgrade, and it was a lot of just ordinary kids, same kind of Optor type college intellectuals, not crazy “football hooligans”.

Serbia needs to learn to prevent violence and riots so it can have a truly free society. Cracking down on those we disagree with on the mere suspicion they may hold views we consider evil only serves to set a bad example and an excuse for the “other side” to do it as well.

I agree its tempting to make a knee-jerk reaction to evil Nazi headlines, but the curtailing of the what we in the US would consider basic human rights should not be taken lightly. Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Association and Freedom of Assembly are shrouded in our Bill of Rights and yes maybe you find it odd that I take those things seriously. I realize most European countries do not recognize Freedom of Speech as a right, so maybe it seems crazy to you.

In US they have right to march and the cops must protect them, something I agree with 100%. Banning is a Free speech violation. The idea is that tomorrow your group might be deemed 'dangerous' or 'despicable' by the government.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialist_Party_of_America_v._Village_of_Skokie

The road to hell is paved with the best intentions (and with stupidity).
Nothing wrong is to ban neonazis even as whole. The anti-fascist ban is pure brain damage. There is no symmetry.

Banning an Anti Facsist rally in Serbia could be because the "For a EUlux Serbia" government does not want to alienate some of its puppeteers in Brussells and Washington.

http://www.duhaime.org/LegalDictionary/F/Fascism.aspx

please read the exlpanation of facist foreign policy.

I agree, Ataman. Why ban the anti-fascism march? To ban the neo-Nazis march makes sense, and to allow an anti-fascist march would underline that decision.

A neo-Nazi march is an incitement to stir up hate and violent racism, but an anti-fascism march is precisely the opposite.

I suppose that it could be argued that there could be some civil unrest if one was allowed without the other, but that would be a very sad reflection of society.

I am sure that the vast majority of people would be able to distinguish between the two.

I would call Brussels "idiocism". EULEX looks on paper good, legally a bubble, impossible to implement even within strictest borders of KosMet, excluding Mitrovica. Good to feed some parasites. Do you what kind of work these people do for the money they earn? Restaurant-bashing and cafeteria-testing in Pristina. Indeed, Albos have some good food and drinks. That's what is EULEX for. Otherwise imagine, they try to explain the guy with long mustache and long gun, he has to disarm and give them his gun. I am not EULEX, I won't do that in person. It's a complete failure before even born. But looks nice on the paper.

I thought we'd said goodbye to the right wing relativism view (or the sitonthefencism view) that equalises the extreme with those that oppose extremism.

In other words I too think its absolutely ridiulous to ban an anti fascist march. Besides, only a complete idiot can fail to realise that if there is no fascist rally it is highly unlikely that an anti fascist rally would be held.

One is a reaction to the other. They are most certainly not equally problematic.

I agree with Dashnori actually. Let them speak, BUT if they engage in any kind of true hate speech, crack down HARD. The RICO act has been successfully used to take down the KKK here in the US WITHOUT having to silence anyone, or ban them because they *might* say something wrong. It’s a really really tough position to support, especially in this case, but Free Speech is important. There has to be other ways of dealing with the situation.

Happy to hear this update.

Re. the Nazi march - To those who say eg. "BUT if they engage in any kind of true hate speech" etc: the whole movement is about hate and racism.

You can't allow any such movement with ideals that are, or should be, illegal under the racism act of every European country to spread their poison and incite hatred.

There's nothing worse than a bigot or someone ignorant enough to be racist.

I have heard neo-Nazis speak and it's repulsive. They speak of children of certain peoples as being 'cockroaches'. How can that sort of comment ever be excused?

Even the most uneducated person would know that it was wrong to say such things.

But I have to add that some of the worst and most ignorant comments are frequently heard in the States.

They are rarely on the streets to express their opinion peacefully. The failure of Hungarian police in 2006 was that they did precisely what our logic would suggest: "Allow free speech, but if there is some trouble, crack down hard": the trouble begun way to soon and cops were unprepared for the challenge.

Kate,

If that group is engaged in illegal activities, then they should break up the group and arrest their members.

However, no one should be denied the right to state their opinions in a public forum no matter how much we disagree with those views. That’s an entirely different matter. I would not like a return to McCarthyism in the US or anything.

Did you know that under Stalin merely thinking badly about the State was punishable, and the burden of proof was on you to prove you weren’t thinking negatively?

You see, not long ago when more radical people were in power in Belgrade, they also tried to stifle dissenting views because they too found them offensive.

I also of course find Nazism or Fascism extremely offensive, I have family from the Krajina. Heard of Jasenovac? I visited there with a WWII survivor, it was a very emotional experience. I hate Nazi’s.

However, listen to their reasoning behind the ban.

“Our checks have revealed that this person has links to organizations which are alleged to be pro-fascist”

Notice how he says “alleged”? So the mere suspicion is enough to label them Nazi and Fascist by the media and ban him from public?

The problem in Serbia is they’re not very good at crowd control. I was in Belgrade when the won a World Championship in Basketball, they completely destroyed downtown Belgrade, and it was a lot of just ordinary kids, same kind of Optor type college intellectuals, not crazy “football hooligans”.

Serbia needs to learn to prevent violence and riots so it can have a truly free society. Cracking down on those we disagree with on the mere suspicion they may hold views we consider evil only serves to set a bad example and an excuse for the “other side” to do it as well.

I agree its tempting to make a knee-jerk reaction to evil Nazi headlines, but the curtailing of the what we in the US would consider basic human rights should not be taken lightly. Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Association and Freedom of Assembly are shrouded in our Bill of Rights and yes maybe you find it odd that I take those things seriously. I realize most European countries do not recognize Freedom of Speech as a right, so maybe it seems crazy to you.