"Positive ICJ ruling will deter recognition"

"Dior",

If the ruling is in favour of unilateral declarations of independence... no problem... Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy.

Serbia can't lose - that's the whole point.

There is already a trail: in Hague- to teh ENTIRE Serbian STATE ESTABLISHMENT.

That is teh sentence with moral wight.

The freedom is moral value NOT a jurudical concept.

If there is a positive ICJ ruling in Serbia's favor it gains tremendous leverage over Kosovo. But Jatras is right: even so, the US isn't going to recognize the ruling, and continue the failed sales pitch that this parastate is some sort of democratic flower waiting to blossom. I cannot agree more with his statement of my government ever admiting that anything they do is wrong, let along flawed.

However, many have asked what would happen if the ICJ rules in favor of Kosovo's UDI? Wouldn't that pretty much end Serbia's efforts? Not really, because it still doesn't solve the divisions in Kosovo, it still doesn't nullify the Serb Assembly in Mitrovica, and it still doesn't avoid the fact that large parts of Kosovo's territory are not under Pristina's authority. Either way, there is no clear way forward for the pro-independence camp. The best they can hope for is a legitimized status quo.

We have to be realistic here. No matter what some people like to think. It’s not possible for (ICJ) to rule ageist Serbia. The law is on Serbias side,there is no ifs or buts.It will take some time, but the and will be rewording.Only then Serbia will be able to take back control of what is rightfully hers.Patents is a virtue.Serbia will prevail on this one.

The ICJ case should have been initiated on the very day the IUDI was announced as intended by the DSS however the DS prevented that and gave their partners the US time to arm twist nations into recognition.

In this case it is better late than never but I get the feeling this government will cave in to pressure at the crucial moment. However, I'd be very happy to be wrong in this instance.

Lets see what happens.

dior:
> Democracy is being abused as most of the other ethnicity's in Serbia who agree with the Kosovo recognition dont want to spend resources on a done deal, but on a better future life. Eg: the Hungarians in the north.

Just how is democracy being abused?

Serbs make up over 80% of Serbia proper (sans Kosovo). So if serbs overwhelmingly support bringing this matter before the ICJ, then the government is obliged by those very principles of democracy to do so.

The only 'abuse of democracy' I see here is your interpretation of it.

> That's a very flattering article filled wit optimism, but what will happen if the court rules on Kosovos independence as legal?

In that event, recognitions would flow, & as Serbia has stated that it would abide by the ICJ's decision (assuming that Serbia's petition to bring this before it succeeds), then K-albanian UDI would be accepted & I would probably have to stop calling entity a 'pseudo-state'.

So given this, one wonders why there is so much opposition from K-albanians, 'brussels' & the US to the very idea of this matter coming before the ICJ.

Unless of course, they are scared of a ruling in Serbia's favour.


sp:
> I think Serbia will find the biggest resistance to going before the ICJ from countries that have not recognized Kosovo because of their own separatist concerns.

Only if they think Serbia will lose. And the louder are the objections coming from those already mentioned above, the less likely they will think so.

Separatists in these countries already have the Kosovo precedent to draw upon & they will see the events in Georgia recently as nothing but further incentive. And as the Slovakian PM said so eloquently yesterday, the only real defense these small countries have against 'great power politics' is international law.

> As far as the countries that have recognized Kosovo they will not change course because of the opinion, the same as Serbia and Russia will not alter their stance.

Most maybe, but not all. Czech republic is a case in point. And ANY reversals would be a major blow to the 'pseudo-states' cause.

Limbo awaits.


Adam:
> But honestly I think the ICJ case will rule in favor of the kosovars.
Honestly, I don't think you are being quite honest with us. If you really believed this, then why all the opposition?

> But even if the case would be ruled in favor of Serbia that wouldent mean nothing.
And why this caveat on your part?

>Stop wasting time folks....
Yes 'Adam', please do.

This means nothing for Kosovo. Kosovo will work its way up and built a devolepment, democratic state wich nobody cant say no to. Most of the free world have reconice our state and have been behind us throug many sacrafices that we have gone trough.


But honestly I think the ICJ case will rule in favor of the kosovars. Serbia will lose here too just like in all other cases. The (ICJ) will not close it's eyes when it comes to the new reality on the ground and the morale of mankind. Serbia did a big críme in Kosovo and have no moraly right to beg for it to come back. The (ICJ) will face the 2 million kosovars, majority ethnic albanians. Albanians who have every right to be free in a peacefull state wich belongs to the people who lives there. That is the will of the people and the right for self-governing.



But even if the case would be ruled in favor of Serbia that wouldent mean nothing. I think Kosovo status is allready closed and Serbia has no power in it's hands but war to get Kosovo back. Only war is a chance but a very little one.

Stop wasting time folks....

Having seen the opinions of many of the experts from these NGO's it is likely that the ICJ will rule in favour of Serbia...to what degree one cannot predict.

As for those who have already recognised the I- UDI there will be no turning back for the majority as they will never show that they were wrong.

What I see from one or two of the comments above is that K-Albanians back passages starting to twitch as they slowly realise they were duped by the US just so Bush could inflate his already overinflated ego.

I believe the final status of Kosovo will not be finalised until at least 2015. By which time 7 years of meagre handouts from US/EU will have taken it's toll on the poverty stricken area.

Enjoy!

The issue with the ICJ hearing on the legality of the Kosovo UDI goes beyond mere ethnic rivalry between Serbs and K-Albanians. What people, all people, in this forum fail to realize is that a ruling either for or against Serbia will have ramifications around the world and for ALL peoples.
It is all nice and tidy to say that Serbia is right and that Kosovo cannot be declared independent due to international law. However, what about the other breakaway and separtist regions of the world? Will the U.S. the "champion of freedom" abide by such a ruling? Can anyone honestly think that an ICJ ruling against the Kosovo independence will stop others from aspiring to freedom and soveirgnty? History tells us that the short answer to this dilema is a resounding NO.
On the other hand, if the court rules against the Serbians and in favor of UDI, what next? In that situation all the frozen conflicts from Europe, Asia, Middle East, even Latin America will erupt. Can you imagine the wave of independent states being declared anew? Kashmir, Tibet, Taiwan, Kurdistan, S. Ossetia, Basque, Cyprus, Republika Srpska, Palestine, Chechnya, Columbia, heck, how about Hawaii? In this scenario, the UN would cease to offer anything worthwhile or constructive as the world order that the UN is designed to support and promote; it will be left behind in the ensuing chaos of ethnic rivarly, nation building, and fragmentation.
This will be the downfall of civilization as we know it... such times would not have been seen since the Fall of the Roman Empire!
Lets face it, the Nato coalition is defunct and powerless, the EU is a sham, the UN is toothless and on it's last leg of significance, we are all headed to a great unknown of our own making, all of us. In the 60's an "atomic clock" showed the world at Zero hour when the world was dangerously close to all out nuclear war, today I think we again find ouselves close to Midnight or rather the twilight hours of civilization. God help us all!

Despite the polarity of the comments in this forum everyone here seems to agree at one thing-the ICJ will come to a decisive and clear decision that will be either pro-Serbia or pro-Kosovo. Excuse my skepticism but I don’t think ICJ has the capability of agreeing to something as divisive as the Kosovo issue has been. As I mentioned this before in another article; unfortunately, even if the resolution gets the approval of the General Assembly I am afraid to say that the ICJ ruling will be very general and vague to say the least. Each side (Serbia, Kosovo) will pick and quote parts of it that benefit their political and strategic moves. But in the end just like the world is divided on the Kosovo issue so will the ICJ ruling. UN is just not efficient and will not be able to make a clear decision on this issue. That’s why they should just not waste any time and money. However, Serbia does not want to deal with the Kosovo issue for the next year or so and they want to focus on other more important issues in their country (i.e. joining the EU). In the meantime, they will leave the Kosovo issue with the ICJ.

Deep down, I htink Serbian government is scared of countries reversing recognition and having Belgrade to reassert control in Kosovo.
(Dino, 21 August 2008 02:10)


You are totally missing the point, as rest of K-Albanians are.
Serbia only wants Kosovo to remain within her borders. Serbia has clearly stated long time go, that Albanians can run there own affairs. There own government. Including becoming members of most worlds organizations. But that was not enough for K-Albanians. Living in uncertainty must be frustrating. Get used to it. It’s not going to change until Serbia is totally satisfied.
As far as Serbia being scared and reasserting control over Kosovo,if I can remember lest time Serbian solders ware in Kosovo most Albanian men fled to Albania and Macedonia.So what is your point?

If the ICJ rules in favor Serbia (against Kosovar DOI), the recognitions will come at a slower rate. If the ICJ rules in favor of Kosova (against Serbia), the recognitions will come at a faster rate. Either way, nothing will stop Kosova from making more and more allies and Serbia regaining control over Kosova. For Kosova even if we get 1 recognition a month, no a year, we will get 192 sooner or later. Time is on our side.

That's a very flattering article filled wit optimism, but what will happen if the court rules on Kosovos independence as legal?
Did this kind sir explain the consequences and that Serbian dollars invested in him wont be returned?
Democracy is being abused as most of the other ethnicity's in Serbia who agree with the Kosovo recognition dont want to spend resources on a done deal, but on a better future life. Eg: the Hungarians in the north.

I think Serbia will find the biggest resistance to going before the ICJ from countries that have not recognized Kosovo because of their own separatist concerns. They are the ones who will have big problems should there be an opinion in favor of Kosovo and I think most of them will take a "don't stir the pot approach"
As far as the countries that have recognized Kosovo they will not change course because of the opinion, the same as Serbia and Russia will not alter their stance.

Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy."

And the Albanian Presevo, THE (Islamic?) Sandzak, the Hungarian part of Vojvodina will follow. Serbia does not to go down that path!!!
(Dashnori i Ceces, 20 August 2008 23:09)

Again with this Vojvodina fantasy. Where do you get this rubbish from? It's only your wishful thinking. There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen.

Mike-"However, many have asked what would happen if the ICJ rules in favor of Kosovo's UDI? Wouldn't that pretty much end Serbia's efforts? Not really, because it still doesn't solve the divisions in Kosovo, it still doesn't nullify the Serb Assembly in Mitrovica, and it still doesn't avoid the fact that large parts of Kosovo's territory are not under Pristina's authority."

Then perhaps Serbia will launch another ruling at ICJ for Mitrovica to partition Kosova.
And if that fails, it will launch another ruling to appeal the decisions on the first two rulings. And if that fails, then Serbia will not be allowed to launch any more ruling at ICJ since it will have completed its quota for the next century.
But, of course, that "Wouldn't pretty much end Serbia's efforts" (to quote the commentator) since Serbia will wait for the next century to start its rulings again.

"Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy."

And the Albanian Presevo, THE (Islamic?) Sandzak, the Hungarian part of Vojvodina will follow. Serbia does not to go down that path!!!

He goes on Christian TV shows to say how Albanians are like the Taliban and how Al Qaeda has taken over Kosova and help make propaganda films. See http://www.offoffoff.com/film/2002/yugoslavia.php3

A waste of money for Serbs, and shows why Kosova cannot trust the Serbian government

On 20 August 2008, 21:19, Leonidas wrote:

"(..) those missils are a just a step towards the shift of balance in the favour of the USA. So Poland becomes a part in the potential conflict...."

And exactly how do you propose Russia should handle this shift of the nuclear deterrent?

Launch a pre-emptive strike against Poland, Europe, USA and NATO? That would be really mature.

Balance out the NATO/US advantage by building and installing even more ICBM's? The Soviet Union tried that route in the late 1970, when NATO decided to deploy a large number of Pershing missiles (I think it was Pershings) in Europe. But the economic strain on the SU economic was yet another straw that a few years later finally broke the camels back, and ended up bringing down the Berlin wall.

--

On 20 August 2008, 21:19, Leonidas wrote:

"Neither the Iranians nor the Koreans possess any intercontinental
missiles."

You really need to follow current events more closely Leonidas. This is from last week I believe:

http://www.iran-daily.com/1387/3200/html/science.htm#s326196

Quote: " Iran Achieves
Satellite Technology
Iran has achieved the technology to design, build and launch satellites.
Head of Iran’s Space Organization (ISO) Reza Taqipour said mammoth Iranian communications networks supported the launch of the satellite carrier, dubbed Safir-e Omid (Ambassador of Hope), without any foreign help, Alalam said.
The Safir-e Omid satellite carrier was successfully launched on Sunday with President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad ordering the launching."

http://www.thehindu.com/2008/08/19/stories/2008081955671300.htm

Quote: " Iran tests satellite launch rocket (...) The Iranians launched the Safir-e Omid rocket on Sunday. (...)
Footage aired on Irinn (Islamic Republic of Iran News Network) showed the Safir-e Omid rocket was launched at night. Iran’s Press TV said the firing of the new rocket would lead to the launch of the lightweight telecommunications satellite, Omid (meaning ‘hope’ in Persian), in the near future."

If the Iranians has the technology to put a satellite in space, they surely also have to technology to drop a "satellite" anywhere on our dear little planet.

Or are you suggestion that it was a fake, that the Iranians are lying?

Failures in Iraq and Afphanistan and Kosovo? Just because something was not a complete domination, doesnt make it a failure.

This Kosovo/ICJ thing will be a waste of time because at high level of world law/politics, its a different ballgame to your local court. But I'd say everyone let Kosovo be part of Serbia and then let them sort it out. If America is having issues in Iraq/Afghanistan etc with local population, then I would love to see what Serbia would do differently to make same kosovo control "successful".

Deep down, I htink Serbian government is scared of countries reversing recognition and having Belgrade to reassert control in Kosovo.

"Some other solution has to be founded"
how great,serbia is doing the job for us!
The solution is kosovo joigning Albania ,of course!

ps:Before discussing kosovo independance,the icj will have to find on which ground Serbia claimes kosovo as her:in this case,we will need to go deep in history,and the only country that can claim kosovo is the ottoman empire!It is from its demembrering that we had the modern serbia,by the treaty of london.But serbian autorithes ,who in that time wanted to have access to the see,wanted Durres too as serbian,and refused to sign the treaty of London.Furthemore,albanian population refused than and today to be part of serbian state,it is a proven fact.
so there is no legal legitimity to serbian claims over kosovo

"There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen."
They aren't enough Serbs for Kosova either but they are enough for N Mitrovica. Vojvodina has a North part too, no?

There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen."
They aren't enough Serbs for Kosova either but they are enough for N Mitrovica. Vojvodina has a North part too, no?
(Dashnori i Satam, 21 August 2008 21:57)

That's thanks to some ethnic cleansing on your part. How else do you explain so few Serbs remaining in Kosovo. How do you explain more Albanians after the war than before?
In any case, the subject was Vojvodina not Kosovo.
Did you even read what you wrote before you sent it?
Mate, it's a joke. Constantly wishing for Hungarian to declare independence from Serbia. Look at the numbers and who lives there first.
Now go and ask the Hungarians if they are going anywhere before you presume to speak for them.

I hope kosovar government and own citizens are taking all of this times notes about serbians for trying to stop a freedom of nation and ther recognation, other thing! how in the world someone can like or feel good or being friend whith a neighbour as is serbia, as I say'd before the best solution for albanians is fence around serbian border exsept presheva and bujanovc and ignore serbia till the time it's right,if ever comes!!!????

serbs wasting money on trash.

Look what we have invested on for 25 years. Senator Joe Biden. Now, Vice Presidential Candidate of Obama.

Look what we have invested in 20 years. John McCain, Now Presidential Candidate of US.

There is already a trail: in Hague- to teh ENTIRE Serbian STATE ESTABLISHMENT.

That is teh sentence with moral wight.

The freedom is moral value NOT a jurudical concept.

That's a very flattering article filled wit optimism, but what will happen if the court rules on Kosovos independence as legal?
Did this kind sir explain the consequences and that Serbian dollars invested in him wont be returned?
Democracy is being abused as most of the other ethnicity's in Serbia who agree with the Kosovo recognition dont want to spend resources on a done deal, but on a better future life. Eg: the Hungarians in the north.

This means nothing for Kosovo. Kosovo will work its way up and built a devolepment, democratic state wich nobody cant say no to. Most of the free world have reconice our state and have been behind us throug many sacrafices that we have gone trough.


But honestly I think the ICJ case will rule in favor of the kosovars. Serbia will lose here too just like in all other cases. The (ICJ) will not close it's eyes when it comes to the new reality on the ground and the morale of mankind. Serbia did a big críme in Kosovo and have no moraly right to beg for it to come back. The (ICJ) will face the 2 million kosovars, majority ethnic albanians. Albanians who have every right to be free in a peacefull state wich belongs to the people who lives there. That is the will of the people and the right for self-governing.



But even if the case would be ruled in favor of Serbia that wouldent mean nothing. I think Kosovo status is allready closed and Serbia has no power in it's hands but war to get Kosovo back. Only war is a chance but a very little one.

Stop wasting time folks....

Mike-"However, many have asked what would happen if the ICJ rules in favor of Kosovo's UDI? Wouldn't that pretty much end Serbia's efforts? Not really, because it still doesn't solve the divisions in Kosovo, it still doesn't nullify the Serb Assembly in Mitrovica, and it still doesn't avoid the fact that large parts of Kosovo's territory are not under Pristina's authority."

Then perhaps Serbia will launch another ruling at ICJ for Mitrovica to partition Kosova.
And if that fails, it will launch another ruling to appeal the decisions on the first two rulings. And if that fails, then Serbia will not be allowed to launch any more ruling at ICJ since it will have completed its quota for the next century.
But, of course, that "Wouldn't pretty much end Serbia's efforts" (to quote the commentator) since Serbia will wait for the next century to start its rulings again.

He goes on Christian TV shows to say how Albanians are like the Taliban and how Al Qaeda has taken over Kosova and help make propaganda films. See http://www.offoffoff.com/film/2002/yugoslavia.php3

A waste of money for Serbs, and shows why Kosova cannot trust the Serbian government

If the ICJ rules in favor Serbia (against Kosovar DOI), the recognitions will come at a slower rate. If the ICJ rules in favor of Kosova (against Serbia), the recognitions will come at a faster rate. Either way, nothing will stop Kosova from making more and more allies and Serbia regaining control over Kosova. For Kosova even if we get 1 recognition a month, no a year, we will get 192 sooner or later. Time is on our side.

Failures in Iraq and Afphanistan and Kosovo? Just because something was not a complete domination, doesnt make it a failure.

This Kosovo/ICJ thing will be a waste of time because at high level of world law/politics, its a different ballgame to your local court. But I'd say everyone let Kosovo be part of Serbia and then let them sort it out. If America is having issues in Iraq/Afghanistan etc with local population, then I would love to see what Serbia would do differently to make same kosovo control "successful".

Deep down, I htink Serbian government is scared of countries reversing recognition and having Belgrade to reassert control in Kosovo.

I think Serbia will find the biggest resistance to going before the ICJ from countries that have not recognized Kosovo because of their own separatist concerns. They are the ones who will have big problems should there be an opinion in favor of Kosovo and I think most of them will take a "don't stir the pot approach"
As far as the countries that have recognized Kosovo they will not change course because of the opinion, the same as Serbia and Russia will not alter their stance.

Despite the polarity of the comments in this forum everyone here seems to agree at one thing-the ICJ will come to a decisive and clear decision that will be either pro-Serbia or pro-Kosovo. Excuse my skepticism but I don’t think ICJ has the capability of agreeing to something as divisive as the Kosovo issue has been. As I mentioned this before in another article; unfortunately, even if the resolution gets the approval of the General Assembly I am afraid to say that the ICJ ruling will be very general and vague to say the least. Each side (Serbia, Kosovo) will pick and quote parts of it that benefit their political and strategic moves. But in the end just like the world is divided on the Kosovo issue so will the ICJ ruling. UN is just not efficient and will not be able to make a clear decision on this issue. That’s why they should just not waste any time and money. However, Serbia does not want to deal with the Kosovo issue for the next year or so and they want to focus on other more important issues in their country (i.e. joining the EU). In the meantime, they will leave the Kosovo issue with the ICJ.

On 20 August 2008, 21:19, Leonidas wrote:

"(..) those missils are a just a step towards the shift of balance in the favour of the USA. So Poland becomes a part in the potential conflict...."

And exactly how do you propose Russia should handle this shift of the nuclear deterrent?

Launch a pre-emptive strike against Poland, Europe, USA and NATO? That would be really mature.

Balance out the NATO/US advantage by building and installing even more ICBM's? The Soviet Union tried that route in the late 1970, when NATO decided to deploy a large number of Pershing missiles (I think it was Pershings) in Europe. But the economic strain on the SU economic was yet another straw that a few years later finally broke the camels back, and ended up bringing down the Berlin wall.

--

On 20 August 2008, 21:19, Leonidas wrote:

"Neither the Iranians nor the Koreans possess any intercontinental
missiles."

You really need to follow current events more closely Leonidas. This is from last week I believe:

http://www.iran-daily.com/1387/3200/html/science.htm#s326196

Quote: " Iran Achieves
Satellite Technology
Iran has achieved the technology to design, build and launch satellites.
Head of Iran’s Space Organization (ISO) Reza Taqipour said mammoth Iranian communications networks supported the launch of the satellite carrier, dubbed Safir-e Omid (Ambassador of Hope), without any foreign help, Alalam said.
The Safir-e Omid satellite carrier was successfully launched on Sunday with President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad ordering the launching."

http://www.thehindu.com/2008/08/19/stories/2008081955671300.htm

Quote: " Iran tests satellite launch rocket (...) The Iranians launched the Safir-e Omid rocket on Sunday. (...)
Footage aired on Irinn (Islamic Republic of Iran News Network) showed the Safir-e Omid rocket was launched at night. Iran’s Press TV said the firing of the new rocket would lead to the launch of the lightweight telecommunications satellite, Omid (meaning ‘hope’ in Persian), in the near future."

If the Iranians has the technology to put a satellite in space, they surely also have to technology to drop a "satellite" anywhere on our dear little planet.

Or are you suggestion that it was a fake, that the Iranians are lying?

"Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy."

And the Albanian Presevo, THE (Islamic?) Sandzak, the Hungarian part of Vojvodina will follow. Serbia does not to go down that path!!!

"Some other solution has to be founded"
how great,serbia is doing the job for us!
The solution is kosovo joigning Albania ,of course!

ps:Before discussing kosovo independance,the icj will have to find on which ground Serbia claimes kosovo as her:in this case,we will need to go deep in history,and the only country that can claim kosovo is the ottoman empire!It is from its demembrering that we had the modern serbia,by the treaty of london.But serbian autorithes ,who in that time wanted to have access to the see,wanted Durres too as serbian,and refused to sign the treaty of London.Furthemore,albanian population refused than and today to be part of serbian state,it is a proven fact.
so there is no legal legitimity to serbian claims over kosovo

The ICJ case should have been initiated on the very day the IUDI was announced as intended by the DSS however the DS prevented that and gave their partners the US time to arm twist nations into recognition.

In this case it is better late than never but I get the feeling this government will cave in to pressure at the crucial moment. However, I'd be very happy to be wrong in this instance.

Lets see what happens.

"Dior",

If the ruling is in favour of unilateral declarations of independence... no problem... Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy.

Serbia can't lose - that's the whole point.

Having seen the opinions of many of the experts from these NGO's it is likely that the ICJ will rule in favour of Serbia...to what degree one cannot predict.

As for those who have already recognised the I- UDI there will be no turning back for the majority as they will never show that they were wrong.

What I see from one or two of the comments above is that K-Albanians back passages starting to twitch as they slowly realise they were duped by the US just so Bush could inflate his already overinflated ego.

I believe the final status of Kosovo will not be finalised until at least 2015. By which time 7 years of meagre handouts from US/EU will have taken it's toll on the poverty stricken area.

Enjoy!

dior:
> Democracy is being abused as most of the other ethnicity's in Serbia who agree with the Kosovo recognition dont want to spend resources on a done deal, but on a better future life. Eg: the Hungarians in the north.

Just how is democracy being abused?

Serbs make up over 80% of Serbia proper (sans Kosovo). So if serbs overwhelmingly support bringing this matter before the ICJ, then the government is obliged by those very principles of democracy to do so.

The only 'abuse of democracy' I see here is your interpretation of it.

> That's a very flattering article filled wit optimism, but what will happen if the court rules on Kosovos independence as legal?

In that event, recognitions would flow, & as Serbia has stated that it would abide by the ICJ's decision (assuming that Serbia's petition to bring this before it succeeds), then K-albanian UDI would be accepted & I would probably have to stop calling entity a 'pseudo-state'.

So given this, one wonders why there is so much opposition from K-albanians, 'brussels' & the US to the very idea of this matter coming before the ICJ.

Unless of course, they are scared of a ruling in Serbia's favour.


sp:
> I think Serbia will find the biggest resistance to going before the ICJ from countries that have not recognized Kosovo because of their own separatist concerns.

Only if they think Serbia will lose. And the louder are the objections coming from those already mentioned above, the less likely they will think so.

Separatists in these countries already have the Kosovo precedent to draw upon & they will see the events in Georgia recently as nothing but further incentive. And as the Slovakian PM said so eloquently yesterday, the only real defense these small countries have against 'great power politics' is international law.

> As far as the countries that have recognized Kosovo they will not change course because of the opinion, the same as Serbia and Russia will not alter their stance.

Most maybe, but not all. Czech republic is a case in point. And ANY reversals would be a major blow to the 'pseudo-states' cause.

Limbo awaits.


Adam:
> But honestly I think the ICJ case will rule in favor of the kosovars.
Honestly, I don't think you are being quite honest with us. If you really believed this, then why all the opposition?

> But even if the case would be ruled in favor of Serbia that wouldent mean nothing.
And why this caveat on your part?

>Stop wasting time folks....
Yes 'Adam', please do.

The issue with the ICJ hearing on the legality of the Kosovo UDI goes beyond mere ethnic rivalry between Serbs and K-Albanians. What people, all people, in this forum fail to realize is that a ruling either for or against Serbia will have ramifications around the world and for ALL peoples.
It is all nice and tidy to say that Serbia is right and that Kosovo cannot be declared independent due to international law. However, what about the other breakaway and separtist regions of the world? Will the U.S. the "champion of freedom" abide by such a ruling? Can anyone honestly think that an ICJ ruling against the Kosovo independence will stop others from aspiring to freedom and soveirgnty? History tells us that the short answer to this dilema is a resounding NO.
On the other hand, if the court rules against the Serbians and in favor of UDI, what next? In that situation all the frozen conflicts from Europe, Asia, Middle East, even Latin America will erupt. Can you imagine the wave of independent states being declared anew? Kashmir, Tibet, Taiwan, Kurdistan, S. Ossetia, Basque, Cyprus, Republika Srpska, Palestine, Chechnya, Columbia, heck, how about Hawaii? In this scenario, the UN would cease to offer anything worthwhile or constructive as the world order that the UN is designed to support and promote; it will be left behind in the ensuing chaos of ethnic rivarly, nation building, and fragmentation.
This will be the downfall of civilization as we know it... such times would not have been seen since the Fall of the Roman Empire!
Lets face it, the Nato coalition is defunct and powerless, the EU is a sham, the UN is toothless and on it's last leg of significance, we are all headed to a great unknown of our own making, all of us. In the 60's an "atomic clock" showed the world at Zero hour when the world was dangerously close to all out nuclear war, today I think we again find ouselves close to Midnight or rather the twilight hours of civilization. God help us all!

If there is a positive ICJ ruling in Serbia's favor it gains tremendous leverage over Kosovo. But Jatras is right: even so, the US isn't going to recognize the ruling, and continue the failed sales pitch that this parastate is some sort of democratic flower waiting to blossom. I cannot agree more with his statement of my government ever admiting that anything they do is wrong, let along flawed.

However, many have asked what would happen if the ICJ rules in favor of Kosovo's UDI? Wouldn't that pretty much end Serbia's efforts? Not really, because it still doesn't solve the divisions in Kosovo, it still doesn't nullify the Serb Assembly in Mitrovica, and it still doesn't avoid the fact that large parts of Kosovo's territory are not under Pristina's authority. Either way, there is no clear way forward for the pro-independence camp. The best they can hope for is a legitimized status quo.

We have to be realistic here. No matter what some people like to think. It’s not possible for (ICJ) to rule ageist Serbia. The law is on Serbias side,there is no ifs or buts.It will take some time, but the and will be rewording.Only then Serbia will be able to take back control of what is rightfully hers.Patents is a virtue.Serbia will prevail on this one.

Deep down, I htink Serbian government is scared of countries reversing recognition and having Belgrade to reassert control in Kosovo.
(Dino, 21 August 2008 02:10)


You are totally missing the point, as rest of K-Albanians are.
Serbia only wants Kosovo to remain within her borders. Serbia has clearly stated long time go, that Albanians can run there own affairs. There own government. Including becoming members of most worlds organizations. But that was not enough for K-Albanians. Living in uncertainty must be frustrating. Get used to it. It’s not going to change until Serbia is totally satisfied.
As far as Serbia being scared and reasserting control over Kosovo,if I can remember lest time Serbian solders ware in Kosovo most Albanian men fled to Albania and Macedonia.So what is your point?

Serbian Kosovo will declare independence from "Kosova" - easy."

And the Albanian Presevo, THE (Islamic?) Sandzak, the Hungarian part of Vojvodina will follow. Serbia does not to go down that path!!!
(Dashnori i Ceces, 20 August 2008 23:09)

Again with this Vojvodina fantasy. Where do you get this rubbish from? It's only your wishful thinking. There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen.

"There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen."
They aren't enough Serbs for Kosova either but they are enough for N Mitrovica. Vojvodina has a North part too, no?

There aren't enough Hungarians there to make this happen."
They aren't enough Serbs for Kosova either but they are enough for N Mitrovica. Vojvodina has a North part too, no?
(Dashnori i Satam, 21 August 2008 21:57)

That's thanks to some ethnic cleansing on your part. How else do you explain so few Serbs remaining in Kosovo. How do you explain more Albanians after the war than before?
In any case, the subject was Vojvodina not Kosovo.
Did you even read what you wrote before you sent it?
Mate, it's a joke. Constantly wishing for Hungarian to declare independence from Serbia. Look at the numbers and who lives there first.
Now go and ask the Hungarians if they are going anywhere before you presume to speak for them.

I hope kosovar government and own citizens are taking all of this times notes about serbians for trying to stop a freedom of nation and ther recognation, other thing! how in the world someone can like or feel good or being friend whith a neighbour as is serbia, as I say'd before the best solution for albanians is fence around serbian border exsept presheva and bujanovc and ignore serbia till the time it's right,if ever comes!!!????

serbs wasting money on trash.

Look what we have invested on for 25 years. Senator Joe Biden. Now, Vice Presidential Candidate of Obama.

Look what we have invested in 20 years. John McCain, Now Presidential Candidate of US.