"Mladić betrayed Karadžić to save self"

Yeah right, Mladić didn't betray Karadžić but Tadić and his sell-outs did. That much is obvious.

Same old trick huh? Trying to get Serbs into beleiving that we are all traitors and deserters. It won't work.

This article purports that an un-named source "close to" the German Secret service (what does that even mean, is he a friend of the German secret service, is he a distant relative of the secret service- perhaps a long lost uncle??) claims that Mladic betrayed Karadzic to avoid going to the Hague Later the article goes on to tell us that Mladic will be arrested in the coming weeks and likely go to the Hague. These two points defy each other, not to mention logic.

We all know who surrendered a fellow Serb to a sham court for profit, and I think this article is trying to shift the blame.

I am surprised because the B92 used to be a voice of opposition; now it risks becoming a pro-government newspaper in the Soviet style.
I hope that never happens.

Zoran, why the hell do you even post on B92 if it's such a sell out media outlet. You seem to me like a person who has a lot of time to waste judging by your numerous posts on this site.

mladic and karadzic are WAR CRIMINALS and deserve to be in prison in the Hague.

Marko, you are right about B92 - they are beginning to sound like the Western press now and editing posts quite frequently like the thought police.

zorank@email.com

Hmm, speculation really. I could imagine that some might believe it would be an either or situation, but they got it the wrong way round.

I believe that if Mladic and Hadzic had been arrested Karadzic (and Serbia) would have been off the hook, But it was a mistake to think that the arrest of Karadzic would get Mladic off the hook. Above all its because we know that Mladic has been in (and out of) Serbia since he was indicted, whilst Karadzic was thought to be spending much time in Bosnia and Montenegro.

Anyway here is a story about medicine doctor Karadzic:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jul/24/radovankaradzic.warcrimes

B92 is nothing but a western influenced,funded propaganda machine for the U.S. and its masters. I have read many reports on Serbia here in the States. The Washington Post, Los Angeles Times and B92 are in step with their politically motivated state sponsored war on Serbia and others who oppose the New World Order. Hey, if Karadzic is guilty of ordering the deaths of civilians, then hang him, but since the Hague was formed to bully smaller states then I do not support it. He will not get a fair trial but will mysteriously end up dead in his cell just like the others. Until I see Kissinger, Blair, Bush, Clinton,or halfbright in the Hague it's nothing but a kangaroo court in many peoples eyes.

I personally do not believe this article. Why would out of everyone Mladic knows where Karadzic is?? Karadzic has such a big support network I doubt Mladic would be the only person to Karadzic's arrest. I am sure they kept the 2 away from each other since together they can be a sure target for capture.

Mladić will wait to surrender him self not until the Hague Tribunal closes down in 2010. Then he will be tried in Serbia that will be one big circus with his Serb supporters and his grandstanding pleading of innocence. I did it all for Serbia and the Serbs were are my hero medals. Pointing at other Serbs as traitors of the Serbs and of greater Serbia. That will be something to look forward to .....NOT!

I don't get it how did this suddenly turned into a trial against B92.

All what B92 did was repeat what a newspaper had written.

Have you heard the expression: "Don't shoot the messenger?"

I think the very fact that B92 did not delete your posts/rants against the station, is the best proof against your claim.

You can freely say your opinion in B92 and people with opposing views will read it and respond to it. I believe this is much better than a site where everyone has the same opinion and all they do is pat each-other on the back.

I have seen both Kosovars and Serbs badmouth B92 here. This is another sign that this news organization is on the right track.

I doubt that Mladic could make any deal. And if he did, then the question is with whom? I don’t think that our officials are that naïve to believe that by handing-over Karadzic will be the end of story when it comes to Hague. Thus I think, if Mladic made any deal with our authorities then they know his whereabouts for sure and would react by arresting him first, since Mladic is more wanted than Karadzic. Secondly, Mladic is not that naïve either to risk everything for such a small compensation, only to be tried in Belgrade. I think he is well aware that it would be impossible.

This news is full of holes, gives no explanation.

I wouldn't believe this or any German source, frankly. Logically Mladic would have been the only person who can be guaranteed to not have known where Karadzic was hiding. If Mladic's location had been known as well he would have been rounded up at the same time. Even if he felt safe in his location he will have dropped out of sight now.

Thank you, bganon, 1 million times for that pathetic link about "dr. david." he is one creepy nightmare, and shall never see his freedom again (they don't fry em in now-civilized europe), but you have to admit he is complicated and "fascinating" but also very, very evil. i will not rest until he and his pal mladic are put away forever, nor should you!

as for this tempest "in a teapot" -- i love that old phrase -- censoring "ignorance is bliss" is ridiculous and undemocratic, however extremist is the poster. many, many posters have gone much worse, including that one named after the serbian hero-assassin, who goes on and on so that i can hardly get from one end to the other, and yet each post sounds the same... never mind.

the kind of posts that need to be censored: "i'd rather have an albanian eat my liver than vote for one of those US presidential candidates..." do i need to explain why this is so offensive and an example of hate speech? because i will, i'll give a whole friggin seminar if need be, just to make it clear.

but cute little sayings like "ignorance is bliss" is not hate speech...

can you imagine, i found one thing that the nationalists and i agree on: perhaps heck has frozen over :))

roberto/frisco
robertoruss@yahoo.com

Good to have people like Marko, ZKUK etc., who do not let us go gaga.

B92 et al. these US marionettes! Karadzic, even in underground couldn't stop help serb people. Unselfish and generous he sacrified himself during all the years he had to dissapear.
I'm sure it would be easier for Mladic to surrender, instead he is choosing the devotional way.. I guess he's working as a journalist.

Simon asked Why ZK comments on B92 articles- A basic tenet of Democracy is that the media should serve to watch the authorities and the people should serve to watch the Media.

Just because the b92 is not doing its part, it is no reason for ZK not to do his.

I'm amazed how people who purport to be western minded would immeadiatly question why someone would voice an oppinion that contradicts their own.

C'mon people, B92 is only highlighting London's Daily Telegraph story obviously planted by the German intelligence agency. Mladic is in no position to make deals with anyone, but probably he is close to being nabbed himself. Who knows what deals politicians are making behind our back.

If I had to guess, I would say its most likely that SPS were the ones to turn over Karadzic. They most likely had the inside information.

Yes Simon, I have begun to ask that question myself. At one stage I thought B92 was OK but it is beginning to expose itself. Perhaps I'll look for another source shortly - where I can express my view relatively freely.

@ZK UK
I don’t think a report in regard of Karadzic (Karadzic was arrested by Serbian Government) or any other reports like the return of Serbian Ambassadors to the countries that recognized Kosovo will qualify B92 as West press alike.
You should blame the Serbian Government not B92.
I posted a link showing Cooperation of Nazis with Serbs and B92 removed it.
B92 has along road ahead for being a real press.

Respect
ALB_MCSE

Reuben,
The problem is the media is into selling and it has become tabloidish. Der Spiegel Balkans "Bin Laden caught", give me a break. You call that credible Reuben? Comparing Karazich with Bin Laden for god sakes! If you keep spreading filth and trash the common person starts to believe it.The guy has not even had a trial and he is already being trashed by every paper in the world.

I must say I find B92 excellent. I also like the way they are moderating the comments.

However, I question the sources of this article. the British press is generally such that you can't take anything like this really serious.

C' mon B92, why did you "kill" my Hare Krishna?

To Karadzic-pilgrims I'd like to reccomend: Do not attac B92 etc., try it with alternative positive energy!
Lets go to the courthouse take each others hand and sing in harmony: Hare Hare..
Come on, what's there left to loose?!

Marko, ZKUK

I don't get why you feel such loyalty to Karadzic. Regardless of whether The Hague Tribunal is partisan (and I think it's quite clear that its partisan), if I were you I would try to distance myself as far as possible from people like Karadzic. No one has done more than him to smear the name of Serbia in the world. He is a war criminal who presided over the sieges of Sarajevo and Tuzla, who ordered or approved the ethnic cleansing of eastern Bosnia and who by force of his political position was supremely responsible for the genocide in Srebrenica. He is a primitive, narrow-minded demagogue who bases his world view on 19th-century Serbian mythology made out of thin air and bluster. Sure, there were others too responsible for the war and the destruction - Tudjman should have been put on trial, Oric should have been condemned - but their unjust acquittal doesn't make Karadzic any less guilty.

The point isn't if Karadzic and Mladic are guilty or not. They should not be taken to foreign countries to face these charges. If they were international terrorists going around blowing up buildings with innocent people, then maybe it would be a good idea to have them tried somewhere else, perhaps where the crimses were committed. You are not a traitor for turning him in, you are a traitor for sending him to the Hague. If indeed crimes were committed, then let Serbia put him in jail for the rest of his life, as he would deserve. The unfair trial that awaits makes most Serbs want him released.

If the Serb President Tadic would give karadzic, then why Mladic wouldnt give him up to save his own self.
This is the brave Mladic giving up his comrade Karadzic who as a very brave serb "hero" was hiding under a different name.

we would not be discussing this if they had not committed crimes now would we. No one was sold out just got what is coming to them.

Martin, you have already prejudged Karadzic and found him guilty. This is the whole point of Serbs being upset about him being sent to Hague.

He is already guilty before he steps foot in that court.

You sound like you know all about his guilt. You got your information from not so impartial news warehouses like CNN and BBC. People like Richard Holbrook have said that he will not be coming out of Hague. How on earth can he predict that without knowing for sure that he has already been sentenced before he even had a trial?

All his horrible deeds he is alleged to have done are reported by corrupt governments and their media. Many people have written about how the media has a role to play when propaganda is to be spread.

Please spare us your "knowledge" of his guilt.

mladic and karadzic are WAR CRIMINALS and deserve to be in prison in the Hague.

Zoran, why the hell do you even post on B92 if it's such a sell out media outlet. You seem to me like a person who has a lot of time to waste judging by your numerous posts on this site.

Yeah right, Mladić didn't betray Karadžić but Tadić and his sell-outs did. That much is obvious.

@ZK UK
I don’t think a report in regard of Karadzic (Karadzic was arrested by Serbian Government) or any other reports like the return of Serbian Ambassadors to the countries that recognized Kosovo will qualify B92 as West press alike.
You should blame the Serbian Government not B92.
I posted a link showing Cooperation of Nazis with Serbs and B92 removed it.
B92 has along road ahead for being a real press.

Respect
ALB_MCSE

Hmm, speculation really. I could imagine that some might believe it would be an either or situation, but they got it the wrong way round.

I believe that if Mladic and Hadzic had been arrested Karadzic (and Serbia) would have been off the hook, But it was a mistake to think that the arrest of Karadzic would get Mladic off the hook. Above all its because we know that Mladic has been in (and out of) Serbia since he was indicted, whilst Karadzic was thought to be spending much time in Bosnia and Montenegro.

Anyway here is a story about medicine doctor Karadzic:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jul/24/radovankaradzic.warcrimes

I personally do not believe this article. Why would out of everyone Mladic knows where Karadzic is?? Karadzic has such a big support network I doubt Mladic would be the only person to Karadzic's arrest. I am sure they kept the 2 away from each other since together they can be a sure target for capture.

Marko, you are right about B92 - they are beginning to sound like the Western press now and editing posts quite frequently like the thought police.

zorank@email.com

B92 is nothing but a western influenced,funded propaganda machine for the U.S. and its masters. I have read many reports on Serbia here in the States. The Washington Post, Los Angeles Times and B92 are in step with their politically motivated state sponsored war on Serbia and others who oppose the New World Order. Hey, if Karadzic is guilty of ordering the deaths of civilians, then hang him, but since the Hague was formed to bully smaller states then I do not support it. He will not get a fair trial but will mysteriously end up dead in his cell just like the others. Until I see Kissinger, Blair, Bush, Clinton,or halfbright in the Hague it's nothing but a kangaroo court in many peoples eyes.

Good to have people like Marko, ZKUK etc., who do not let us go gaga.

B92 et al. these US marionettes! Karadzic, even in underground couldn't stop help serb people. Unselfish and generous he sacrified himself during all the years he had to dissapear.
I'm sure it would be easier for Mladic to surrender, instead he is choosing the devotional way.. I guess he's working as a journalist.

Mladić will wait to surrender him self not until the Hague Tribunal closes down in 2010. Then he will be tried in Serbia that will be one big circus with his Serb supporters and his grandstanding pleading of innocence. I did it all for Serbia and the Serbs were are my hero medals. Pointing at other Serbs as traitors of the Serbs and of greater Serbia. That will be something to look forward to .....NOT!

I don't get it how did this suddenly turned into a trial against B92.

All what B92 did was repeat what a newspaper had written.

Have you heard the expression: "Don't shoot the messenger?"

I think the very fact that B92 did not delete your posts/rants against the station, is the best proof against your claim.

You can freely say your opinion in B92 and people with opposing views will read it and respond to it. I believe this is much better than a site where everyone has the same opinion and all they do is pat each-other on the back.

I have seen both Kosovars and Serbs badmouth B92 here. This is another sign that this news organization is on the right track.

I must say I find B92 excellent. I also like the way they are moderating the comments.

However, I question the sources of this article. the British press is generally such that you can't take anything like this really serious.

Thank you, bganon, 1 million times for that pathetic link about "dr. david." he is one creepy nightmare, and shall never see his freedom again (they don't fry em in now-civilized europe), but you have to admit he is complicated and "fascinating" but also very, very evil. i will not rest until he and his pal mladic are put away forever, nor should you!

as for this tempest "in a teapot" -- i love that old phrase -- censoring "ignorance is bliss" is ridiculous and undemocratic, however extremist is the poster. many, many posters have gone much worse, including that one named after the serbian hero-assassin, who goes on and on so that i can hardly get from one end to the other, and yet each post sounds the same... never mind.

the kind of posts that need to be censored: "i'd rather have an albanian eat my liver than vote for one of those US presidential candidates..." do i need to explain why this is so offensive and an example of hate speech? because i will, i'll give a whole friggin seminar if need be, just to make it clear.

but cute little sayings like "ignorance is bliss" is not hate speech...

can you imagine, i found one thing that the nationalists and i agree on: perhaps heck has frozen over :))

roberto/frisco
robertoruss@yahoo.com

Same old trick huh? Trying to get Serbs into beleiving that we are all traitors and deserters. It won't work.

This article purports that an un-named source "close to" the German Secret service (what does that even mean, is he a friend of the German secret service, is he a distant relative of the secret service- perhaps a long lost uncle??) claims that Mladic betrayed Karadzic to avoid going to the Hague Later the article goes on to tell us that Mladic will be arrested in the coming weeks and likely go to the Hague. These two points defy each other, not to mention logic.

We all know who surrendered a fellow Serb to a sham court for profit, and I think this article is trying to shift the blame.

I am surprised because the B92 used to be a voice of opposition; now it risks becoming a pro-government newspaper in the Soviet style.
I hope that never happens.

I doubt that Mladic could make any deal. And if he did, then the question is with whom? I don’t think that our officials are that naïve to believe that by handing-over Karadzic will be the end of story when it comes to Hague. Thus I think, if Mladic made any deal with our authorities then they know his whereabouts for sure and would react by arresting him first, since Mladic is more wanted than Karadzic. Secondly, Mladic is not that naïve either to risk everything for such a small compensation, only to be tried in Belgrade. I think he is well aware that it would be impossible.

This news is full of holes, gives no explanation.

I wouldn't believe this or any German source, frankly. Logically Mladic would have been the only person who can be guaranteed to not have known where Karadzic was hiding. If Mladic's location had been known as well he would have been rounded up at the same time. Even if he felt safe in his location he will have dropped out of sight now.

If I had to guess, I would say its most likely that SPS were the ones to turn over Karadzic. They most likely had the inside information.

Yes Simon, I have begun to ask that question myself. At one stage I thought B92 was OK but it is beginning to expose itself. Perhaps I'll look for another source shortly - where I can express my view relatively freely.

C'mon people, B92 is only highlighting London's Daily Telegraph story obviously planted by the German intelligence agency. Mladic is in no position to make deals with anyone, but probably he is close to being nabbed himself. Who knows what deals politicians are making behind our back.

Simon asked Why ZK comments on B92 articles- A basic tenet of Democracy is that the media should serve to watch the authorities and the people should serve to watch the Media.

Just because the b92 is not doing its part, it is no reason for ZK not to do his.

I'm amazed how people who purport to be western minded would immeadiatly question why someone would voice an oppinion that contradicts their own.

Reuben,
The problem is the media is into selling and it has become tabloidish. Der Spiegel Balkans "Bin Laden caught", give me a break. You call that credible Reuben? Comparing Karazich with Bin Laden for god sakes! If you keep spreading filth and trash the common person starts to believe it.The guy has not even had a trial and he is already being trashed by every paper in the world.

If the Serb President Tadic would give karadzic, then why Mladic wouldnt give him up to save his own self.
This is the brave Mladic giving up his comrade Karadzic who as a very brave serb "hero" was hiding under a different name.

we would not be discussing this if they had not committed crimes now would we. No one was sold out just got what is coming to them.

C' mon B92, why did you "kill" my Hare Krishna?

To Karadzic-pilgrims I'd like to reccomend: Do not attac B92 etc., try it with alternative positive energy!
Lets go to the courthouse take each others hand and sing in harmony: Hare Hare..
Come on, what's there left to loose?!

Marko, ZKUK

I don't get why you feel such loyalty to Karadzic. Regardless of whether The Hague Tribunal is partisan (and I think it's quite clear that its partisan), if I were you I would try to distance myself as far as possible from people like Karadzic. No one has done more than him to smear the name of Serbia in the world. He is a war criminal who presided over the sieges of Sarajevo and Tuzla, who ordered or approved the ethnic cleansing of eastern Bosnia and who by force of his political position was supremely responsible for the genocide in Srebrenica. He is a primitive, narrow-minded demagogue who bases his world view on 19th-century Serbian mythology made out of thin air and bluster. Sure, there were others too responsible for the war and the destruction - Tudjman should have been put on trial, Oric should have been condemned - but their unjust acquittal doesn't make Karadzic any less guilty.

The point isn't if Karadzic and Mladic are guilty or not. They should not be taken to foreign countries to face these charges. If they were international terrorists going around blowing up buildings with innocent people, then maybe it would be a good idea to have them tried somewhere else, perhaps where the crimses were committed. You are not a traitor for turning him in, you are a traitor for sending him to the Hague. If indeed crimes were committed, then let Serbia put him in jail for the rest of his life, as he would deserve. The unfair trial that awaits makes most Serbs want him released.

Martin, you have already prejudged Karadzic and found him guilty. This is the whole point of Serbs being upset about him being sent to Hague.

He is already guilty before he steps foot in that court.

You sound like you know all about his guilt. You got your information from not so impartial news warehouses like CNN and BBC. People like Richard Holbrook have said that he will not be coming out of Hague. How on earth can he predict that without knowing for sure that he has already been sentenced before he even had a trial?

All his horrible deeds he is alleged to have done are reported by corrupt governments and their media. Many people have written about how the media has a role to play when propaganda is to be spread.

Please spare us your "knowledge" of his guilt.