I come from the principality of Yorkshire in the UK and my question is this.
Having read the multiple comments from the posters from all the ethnic groups in this argument, how do I put forward the position of my people?
In the last 1000 years we have been invaded by Vikings, Danes, Saxons, Normans, Brigantes, Mercians and people from London.
This has clearly scarred our collective psyche so when do we start whining about stuff that happened 100's of years ago?
I think that you guys are going to have to draw a line under the past and start again.
The K-Albs have their own place now so start living like a modern nation. The Serbs don't want the Alb's so stop moaning that that you don't want to give up the thing that you don't like anyway.
Thank you. You are such a kind Greek - such a common God's birth.
You are in the same page I mentioned - but I talked on logical negation. Be happy
to find your page now.
"You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure"
Hmmm... I wouldnt say blonde, but other than that, we are at the same page :)
P.S. Dont get upset that easily. Besides, my post didnt have that much bad intentions, it could have been much worse, ask the fyromians if you dont believe me :)
We Albanians are poor, dirty, mad, filthy, crazy, what else not? Aliens, inhuman!
You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure, what else not?
All grandsons of Aristotle and Plato dude.
Are you happy with this?
Is this what you want to say? So have fun - enjoy.
"President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"? "
I am still trying to find this phrase or any relevant phrase of Papoulias in his speeches in Austria.
What comes in my mind is the usual tactic of the albanians to put words in other peoples mouths just to satisfy the lack of support to their UDI.
It is like those other announcements of Greek officials that they will recognise Kossovo bythe end of the month, or that a Kossovian embassy will open next month in Athens, or that Christoforos Colombos is albanian and that albanians were on the moon before the americans.
I think that Papoulias had a positive approche to the Kosovo UDI, based to the Greek and Albanian media.
Hellenes Abroad NewsSend | >>Talks with Chancellor Kusenbauer
Vienna, 04.07.2008
Addressing reporters earlier, during a joint press conference with Austrian Federal Chancellor Alfred Kusenbauer after their talks, Papoulias expressed “sorrow over the intransigent, almost hostile” stance adopted by the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) towards Greece.
“Greece, unfortunately, is on the receiving end of an unfounded irredentism, a hostile irredentism … despite the fact that in the Interim Agreement it was agreed that there should be a mutually acceptable name.”
Greece and FYROM signed an UN-brokered Interim Agreement in 1995, while Papoulias signed the document on behalf of the Greek side, as he was serving as foreign minister at the time.
Regarding Kosovo, the Greek president said Greece was following developments “with exceptional attention, considering that it is an extremely sensitive issue.”
The two men also agreed over their support to the European prospects of western Balkan states.
Serbian Leaders were/are terrible and by their wrongdoing they lost Kosovo long before - that's reality.
But Kosovo Albanians never did anything good too and don't have resources, knowledge and history to deserve this US gift.
Serbia will never get the grasp until the new world/regional war - not expected during our life time.Kosovo will take long time to start as separate, real country - also won't happen in our life time.
So, it will be terrible and frozen life for all people of Kosovo (Serbs, Albanians and other)and I don't know honestly what should be the best solution - partition (already reality on the ground) with outside supervision and troops forever (not good for other part of Kosovo and all their population -also reality on the ground.
Thanks for this important news. This shows again the tendency of B92 to manipulate the news. B92 will only lose credibility this way. It is a way to hide bad news and bring possibly only good news to maintain a dreamlike virtual world, which at one point is destined to collapse. What is the point of doing it?
B92 publish this constructive comment, don't censure it.
Why didn't you also put the words of President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"?
He SAID that; and this is for the first time a High Level Greek Authority says it publicly.
A nice positive message coming from Vienna. Let's hope that with the change in tone, there will also be a change in focus & a restoration of balance to the problems in the region.
PRN:
Pro-nazi regime in Albania during WWII also shared your dreams of a 'greater Albania'.
And do you really think you can enhance your 'credibility' by the self-generation of multiple recommendations? All you're doing is discrediting yourself.
Olf:
> Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end.
If this is what you believe, then does not surprise me that you find 'PRN' credible.
Joe:
Greeks & russians - yes.. but austrians? The closing line of the article is:
> It was now up to the EU to support that government, said the two officials.
While this is just rhetoric like the rest of it, may also be indicative of a new 'stance' on the part of Western Europe towards the serbs given a new pro-EU govt.
The Kosovo UDI will set a precedent to other countries with separatist problems.The WEST ignorance to international law and bypasing the UN will further create frozen conflicts.
Well, i hate to interrupt his "love-fest" but... today is our independence day, and so, i must send best wishes to free and independent people around the world. believe it or not, there is enough space for all of us to live free and decent lives, if we can cooperate rather than constantly killing each other or planning the next war. i say this in regards to my own govt, as i say it to the above posters, and to all the countries of the balkans.
it is true that i am partisan and have strongly supported kosovar independence, but i continue to support the independence and freedom of all people. when one group is miserable, it is hard for surrounding groups to be happy.
compromise is not a dirty word. it doesn't mean we have to accept some phony-baloney "more than autonomy but less than independence", but it does mean that we need to do more listening to each other, and less screaming. and needless to say, the hate speech ("i'm not going to mention organ stealing...) doesn't help. hate is so very easy, esp. in the balkans, but what has it solved so far??
yes, i do preach a bit, but then if you don't like it, you don't have to read my postings :)
“….Albanian land ……. entire Balkan…… We are PARTIALY consoled by returnig (Kosovo).”
I respect and admire your honesty. Much better to say it as it is. I’m fad up with all this propaganda about human rights, genocide and similar nonsense. You are fighting for the land, Kosovo is just beginning, you want much more.
The fact is whether Serbia wants to join the EU right now is kinda irrelevant. To move forward economically maybe the EU would be good but we need to worry about moving forward economically alone at first because just like the NGO few days ago said, we will not join before 2021. That being said to just form governments and to kinda sit and wait for the EU to arrive is just wasting time. We need to erase the EU out of our minds and just move forward economically in a positive, progressive and independent manner. This is how we can regain Kosovo since the economy there will never get better and Serbia can invest into the Serbian, Gorani, Roma enclaves in that is spread throughout the land. And then once we have taken the next step and we are ready for some "special" European standard then we contemplate joining the EU until we need to focus on Serbia, not the European Union.
Would that be the one where 1 million armenians 'fell down the stairs' by themselves and died? Or the one that means a turkish nobel prize laureat of literature has to go to America to avoid assassination?
Yep, the Ottoman Empire was a dream come true for all the non-moslems for a good 500 years. They never had it so good. Janissaries, skull towers, slavery. Now that IS and unforgettable freedom.
With hindsight, the Serbs would have been much smarter not to oppose the Ottomans in which case they probably would have taken Vienna and a good half of Europe.
Along with standing up to the Nazis in 1941 (the Serb people, not its government) and thus delaying the invasion of the Soviet Union by a month and standing up to the Austro-Hungarian Empire in 1914, I hope the Serbs stop protecting the rest of Europe with their lives. In all these cases it clearly wasn't worth it.
Your land, my land - wah, wah, wah!
My family had several thousand acres in New York state in the 1700's. After yje US revolution they were kicked out. By Albanian reasoning, I should have all this land back or several hundred million dollars in compensation from the US government.
Sorry, it will never happen. Be happy with what you have. It's 2008 and you have no claim to earlier dynasties.
We have to realize that there are the people of Europe and European politicians. The majority of the first group, especially the ones who live in EU countries, understand and support Serbia, the Serbs and the Kosovo Serbs. The second group, also especially the ones from various (not all) EU countries, are a bunch of idiots that were extremely naive and because of a lack of historic knowledge innitially could not and later did not want to see what the US policy was doing. Of course there were many US lackies who played along well and have been rewarded. The EU has to ask itself if it still serves the people from the EU (answer NO) and whether the EU desires to become the newest state of the US (answer YES if the policies of the past 20 years will continue). (Radical) Islam is the biggest threat to Europe's future and stability (beside from US anti-Europe policies). Stop subsidizing big Islamic families, stop immigration from the Middle East and Northern Africa, stop allowing minorities who have no interest to accept European values to hijack our societies more and more. What happened in Kosovo is a glimpse into the future of other places in Europe. And we cannot say that we did not know. I would advice Serbia and the Serbian people to stay out of the EU trap and as far as I am concerned Turkey and especially Kosovo will NEVER become EU members. I have nothing against the people from these countries. I just want them to stay where the are and I do not like to be a minority in my own country. Fortunately the Irish saved us and in many EU countries similar feelings are among the majority of people.
THis is an interesting thing. I hate to break it down to many of you in this thread, but these "fake" "Illegal" states you guys call (croatia, bosnia, macedonia, kosova, and slovenia) from Yugoslavia, let me ask you is serbia the only "NATURAL" state in the region? It is non-sense. You can get historic accounts from turkish, serbian, and Roman accounts of Albanians being present in those regions. It has been documented.
As for Albanians being from the region of "Armenia," well to be honest, there has been propaganda from greek and serbian scholars about that, but yet your academic person Mr. Cubrilovic stated himself that Albanians are tied to their motherland in that case the discussion was about Kosova. So let me tell you, the maps from the ottoman empire show the ethnic lines before and after the empire. It is clear that Albanians inhabitet this land, but remember there is no such thing as 100% of an ethnic group in one place.
I am not getting it. If only 1% is true we should get one inventor, athlete, artist or any peace of art and culture from you. All we can see:geometrical progresion in natality, bessa and high walls around houses(I won't touch huge influence in modern narco projects, medical - organs transplants etc.)
Please elaborate.
Lol... With a lot of respect to your people and your origins, and even more respect to the neighbouring peoples and with even more respect to history itself, but in any case with loads of doubts about your actual origins (which very recent studies and scientific proof have shown to be of the Kaspian area and you have nothing to do with Illyrians, which by the way were nothing exeptional anyway), I would grand you as your "ancestral lands" only the - today's - districts of Elbasan and Berat as albanian homeland.
Other than that, it is a wild wild dream that not even most of your scholars believe in any more.
Now the rest is only for preserving your nationalistic feelings and irredentism, as it is known all over Europe and the rest of the civilised world that you are the "land beggars" of the Blakans of today :)
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.(Jovan, 4 July 2008 14:19)
what are you talking about, Jovan? the land, which belong to individual Serbs in Kosovo, it may be theirs forever. but a state does not belong to an ethnic group forever. even Serbs were not always there, where they are now - and this fact should give you to think, how it came like that.
concerning Serbia joining the EU: 2017 was always a realistic year for to be the earliest date. at the moment it is less the Treaty of Lisbon but Serbia itself, which shifts this date more into the future. the country better cares for to get fit economically to compete with present time and to become politically stable in future. then start to think about the EU.
Some of these messages are very meaningful in respect of Kosovo as no precedent in international relations. Why the EU is so hypocritically silent about the real Pandora-box so open? The only result of the recognition of the Kosovo's independence is the beginning of the construction of a new Greater Albania, to prejudice of Serbia, Montenegro, Macedonia, Greece, as in the second world war thanks to the Italians and the Germans. This is the madness of the EU today.
Please tell me how can you do such things ? First you offer to rely on Turkish sources as the most objective ones ! But we all know that the Turks has never lost their Ottoman mentality and they are never expected to write something positive of the Serbs.
Next thing I'd like you to explain here is how did you managed to obtain 23 recomendations for your funny stastements during 15 minutes after your joke has been positioned here ?
Jovan: "your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
It is rediculous to claim some land to be inherently "Serbian", "Albanian" or whatever. Practically all territories in the world were under different rules, often with different ethnic compositions during the different historical ages. Many ethnic groups inhabited only small territories and expanded, others lost much of their original homelands. Borders are product of wars, negotiations and treaties.
Serbia too, started its nodern existance within borders that left out more than half of tha total Serbian population on the Balkans. But Serbia expanded four times (1835, 1878, 1913, 1918) while Albania is still within its original borders, that compared with the areas populated by Albanians resembles the original Serbian borders compared with ares populated mainly by Serbs.
Obviously the Serbs were much more succesful in the territorial scrumble.
Both sodes have to realize that the age of land grabs is over in much of the world, and must end in the Balkans too.
Serbia had a very strong case for keeping Kosovo under its formal sovereignity but gambled it away in the wars in Croatia and Bosnia, when they supported the principle of ethnic selfdetermination and tried to sever chunks of those countries, often trying to ethnicly cleans them so that the territorial revision become final. The wars were lost, Serbs were ethnically cleansed, the international reputation of Serbia deteriorated, key traditional Serbian alies turned into enemies, Serbian citizens were placed under a humiliating visa curtain!
Nice one PRN. You made a great comment, just on time to refresh memories of those that use them. Justice got here finally but late for millions of Albanians..
Jovan-"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
Jovan, Albanians is written with capital “A” and you don’t need to be so funny and undermine yourself with such a comment.
“last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.”
Jovan, I certainly hope so. Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end. That is what all the Europeans are hoping too.
Greeks and Russians were always unconditional supportes of the Serbs, so they would label anything not entirely favorable to them as "mistakes". For this reason statements coming from them - in this case from this greek president - can not be taken seriously.
Unfortunately the Greek president is right and him with the rest of western europe realize that very late.
Europe allowed the irresponsible policy of the USA to be loaded on her shoulder.
They destroyed Yugoslavia and they created artificial states that could only offer instability and criminallity to Europe, with no future. Countries like Bosnia, Kossovo, Montenegro, Fyrom and others are artificially made, and of course can never offer anything else to Europe rather than instabillity and organized crime and of course they could not survive in the future.
The americans just wanted to separate Yugoslavia into little artificial puppet-states like the above, so they can weaken and control Europe, having her as hostage to their own will.
Unfortunately Europe realizes that now. Of course there is always time to correct things, at least some of them. The initiative taken by Spain and Greece into the EU, to prevent in any possible way the reckognition of the illegal state of Kossovo could lead to serious result, considering the help of Russia.
Kossovo, will be never be reckognised as a country by the international organizations. It will never be a member of the UN. It will never be a member of the World Trade Organization (so inports - exports cannot be done, vital to the survival of any country). It will never actually operate as a normal country, no matter how many countries reckognise it in billateral agreements. This is something that will be done. Let's see for how long the EU will manage to have fake-artificial state entities onto her shoulders..
"The Greek president pointed out that both the U.S. and Russia had an interest in the Balkans, adding that “Europe has made big mistakes in the Balkans.”
Here I have to ste :
1. Two days ago the same thing in a less diplomatic form said our Miniputin. And this is just a common thing that EU members realize well but do not dare to say aloud. They made much more of vital mistakes and are demoralized today. Look how good behaved himself their main Masson Maestro J.M.Barroso while in Russia !
2. The quality of Russian and American interests here is essentially different ! The US is interested mostly in exporting problems to Europe and thus being involved in the Continental affairs. While Russia to my private regret follows mostly economical targets. Sure as the leader of the anti-American majority of the world we are interested to settle down the situation on the Balkanes to withdraw the American precence here but I hate the cautious way we do it.
it´s almost unbelievable that some albanian kids can still write about serbian territory being "their" land without being deleted!
PRN, I am convinced that you really believe what you have written, but that doesn´t change a bit... you´re simply wrong. mislead by your propaganda-masters...
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.
Dear mr PRN
can you please let me know what do you mean when you say that albanian land was chopped into pieces and which are these pieces?I wonder what kind of history they teach you in Albania or there in not such lesson as history in school?How do you explain that from all the countries in the region Albania and the areas that albanians live are the poorest?
The ones from my countrymen (greeks) who think that USA/Russia are the bad guys, while the good europe is the nice warm and loving mama, are at least delusional.
Where was the good mama when her child got bombed?
Exactly, she threw some bombs more.
Even if a Pro-EU government is formed, Serbia cannot join the EU until the Lisbon Treaty comes into force. This may take some time. Therefore, the door of the EU is closed for Croatia,Macedonia,Bosnia,
Kosovo,Montenegro and Serbia.
The ones from my countrymen (greeks) who think that USA/Russia are the bad guys, while the good europe is the nice warm and loving mama, are at least delusional.
Where was the good mama when her child got bombed?
Exactly, she threw some bombs more.
it´s almost unbelievable that some albanian kids can still write about serbian territory being "their" land without being deleted!
PRN, I am convinced that you really believe what you have written, but that doesn´t change a bit... you´re simply wrong. mislead by your propaganda-masters...
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.
Dear mr PRN
can you please let me know what do you mean when you say that albanian land was chopped into pieces and which are these pieces?I wonder what kind of history they teach you in Albania or there in not such lesson as history in school?How do you explain that from all the countries in the region Albania and the areas that albanians live are the poorest?
"The Greek president pointed out that both the U.S. and Russia had an interest in the Balkans, adding that “Europe has made big mistakes in the Balkans.”
Here I have to ste :
1. Two days ago the same thing in a less diplomatic form said our Miniputin. And this is just a common thing that EU members realize well but do not dare to say aloud. They made much more of vital mistakes and are demoralized today. Look how good behaved himself their main Masson Maestro J.M.Barroso while in Russia !
2. The quality of Russian and American interests here is essentially different ! The US is interested mostly in exporting problems to Europe and thus being involved in the Continental affairs. While Russia to my private regret follows mostly economical targets. Sure as the leader of the anti-American majority of the world we are interested to settle down the situation on the Balkanes to withdraw the American precence here but I hate the cautious way we do it.
Please tell me how can you do such things ? First you offer to rely on Turkish sources as the most objective ones ! But we all know that the Turks has never lost their Ottoman mentality and they are never expected to write something positive of the Serbs.
Next thing I'd like you to explain here is how did you managed to obtain 23 recomendations for your funny stastements during 15 minutes after your joke has been positioned here ?
We have to realize that there are the people of Europe and European politicians. The majority of the first group, especially the ones who live in EU countries, understand and support Serbia, the Serbs and the Kosovo Serbs. The second group, also especially the ones from various (not all) EU countries, are a bunch of idiots that were extremely naive and because of a lack of historic knowledge innitially could not and later did not want to see what the US policy was doing. Of course there were many US lackies who played along well and have been rewarded. The EU has to ask itself if it still serves the people from the EU (answer NO) and whether the EU desires to become the newest state of the US (answer YES if the policies of the past 20 years will continue). (Radical) Islam is the biggest threat to Europe's future and stability (beside from US anti-Europe policies). Stop subsidizing big Islamic families, stop immigration from the Middle East and Northern Africa, stop allowing minorities who have no interest to accept European values to hijack our societies more and more. What happened in Kosovo is a glimpse into the future of other places in Europe. And we cannot say that we did not know. I would advice Serbia and the Serbian people to stay out of the EU trap and as far as I am concerned Turkey and especially Kosovo will NEVER become EU members. I have nothing against the people from these countries. I just want them to stay where the are and I do not like to be a minority in my own country. Fortunately the Irish saved us and in many EU countries similar feelings are among the majority of people.
I am not getting it. If only 1% is true we should get one inventor, athlete, artist or any peace of art and culture from you. All we can see:geometrical progresion in natality, bessa and high walls around houses(I won't touch huge influence in modern narco projects, medical - organs transplants etc.)
Please elaborate.
Lol... With a lot of respect to your people and your origins, and even more respect to the neighbouring peoples and with even more respect to history itself, but in any case with loads of doubts about your actual origins (which very recent studies and scientific proof have shown to be of the Kaspian area and you have nothing to do with Illyrians, which by the way were nothing exeptional anyway), I would grand you as your "ancestral lands" only the - today's - districts of Elbasan and Berat as albanian homeland.
Other than that, it is a wild wild dream that not even most of your scholars believe in any more.
Now the rest is only for preserving your nationalistic feelings and irredentism, as it is known all over Europe and the rest of the civilised world that you are the "land beggars" of the Blakans of today :)
Unfortunately the Greek president is right and him with the rest of western europe realize that very late.
Europe allowed the irresponsible policy of the USA to be loaded on her shoulder.
They destroyed Yugoslavia and they created artificial states that could only offer instability and criminallity to Europe, with no future. Countries like Bosnia, Kossovo, Montenegro, Fyrom and others are artificially made, and of course can never offer anything else to Europe rather than instabillity and organized crime and of course they could not survive in the future.
The americans just wanted to separate Yugoslavia into little artificial puppet-states like the above, so they can weaken and control Europe, having her as hostage to their own will.
Unfortunately Europe realizes that now. Of course there is always time to correct things, at least some of them. The initiative taken by Spain and Greece into the EU, to prevent in any possible way the reckognition of the illegal state of Kossovo could lead to serious result, considering the help of Russia.
Kossovo, will be never be reckognised as a country by the international organizations. It will never be a member of the UN. It will never be a member of the World Trade Organization (so inports - exports cannot be done, vital to the survival of any country). It will never actually operate as a normal country, no matter how many countries reckognise it in billateral agreements. This is something that will be done. Let's see for how long the EU will manage to have fake-artificial state entities onto her shoulders..
Would that be the one where 1 million armenians 'fell down the stairs' by themselves and died? Or the one that means a turkish nobel prize laureat of literature has to go to America to avoid assassination?
Yep, the Ottoman Empire was a dream come true for all the non-moslems for a good 500 years. They never had it so good. Janissaries, skull towers, slavery. Now that IS and unforgettable freedom.
With hindsight, the Serbs would have been much smarter not to oppose the Ottomans in which case they probably would have taken Vienna and a good half of Europe.
Along with standing up to the Nazis in 1941 (the Serb people, not its government) and thus delaying the invasion of the Soviet Union by a month and standing up to the Austro-Hungarian Empire in 1914, I hope the Serbs stop protecting the rest of Europe with their lives. In all these cases it clearly wasn't worth it.
Some of these messages are very meaningful in respect of Kosovo as no precedent in international relations. Why the EU is so hypocritically silent about the real Pandora-box so open? The only result of the recognition of the Kosovo's independence is the beginning of the construction of a new Greater Albania, to prejudice of Serbia, Montenegro, Macedonia, Greece, as in the second world war thanks to the Italians and the Germans. This is the madness of the EU today.
Nice one PRN. You made a great comment, just on time to refresh memories of those that use them. Justice got here finally but late for millions of Albanians..
Jovan-"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
Jovan, Albanians is written with capital “A” and you don’t need to be so funny and undermine yourself with such a comment.
“last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.”
Jovan, I certainly hope so. Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end. That is what all the Europeans are hoping too.
Greeks and Russians were always unconditional supportes of the Serbs, so they would label anything not entirely favorable to them as "mistakes". For this reason statements coming from them - in this case from this greek president - can not be taken seriously.
"President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"? "
I am still trying to find this phrase or any relevant phrase of Papoulias in his speeches in Austria.
What comes in my mind is the usual tactic of the albanians to put words in other peoples mouths just to satisfy the lack of support to their UDI.
It is like those other announcements of Greek officials that they will recognise Kossovo bythe end of the month, or that a Kossovian embassy will open next month in Athens, or that Christoforos Colombos is albanian and that albanians were on the moon before the americans.
Jovan: "your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
It is rediculous to claim some land to be inherently "Serbian", "Albanian" or whatever. Practically all territories in the world were under different rules, often with different ethnic compositions during the different historical ages. Many ethnic groups inhabited only small territories and expanded, others lost much of their original homelands. Borders are product of wars, negotiations and treaties.
Serbia too, started its nodern existance within borders that left out more than half of tha total Serbian population on the Balkans. But Serbia expanded four times (1835, 1878, 1913, 1918) while Albania is still within its original borders, that compared with the areas populated by Albanians resembles the original Serbian borders compared with ares populated mainly by Serbs.
Obviously the Serbs were much more succesful in the territorial scrumble.
Both sodes have to realize that the age of land grabs is over in much of the world, and must end in the Balkans too.
Serbia had a very strong case for keeping Kosovo under its formal sovereignity but gambled it away in the wars in Croatia and Bosnia, when they supported the principle of ethnic selfdetermination and tried to sever chunks of those countries, often trying to ethnicly cleans them so that the territorial revision become final. The wars were lost, Serbs were ethnically cleansed, the international reputation of Serbia deteriorated, key traditional Serbian alies turned into enemies, Serbian citizens were placed under a humiliating visa curtain!
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.(Jovan, 4 July 2008 14:19)
what are you talking about, Jovan? the land, which belong to individual Serbs in Kosovo, it may be theirs forever. but a state does not belong to an ethnic group forever. even Serbs were not always there, where they are now - and this fact should give you to think, how it came like that.
concerning Serbia joining the EU: 2017 was always a realistic year for to be the earliest date. at the moment it is less the Treaty of Lisbon but Serbia itself, which shifts this date more into the future. the country better cares for to get fit economically to compete with present time and to become politically stable in future. then start to think about the EU.
THis is an interesting thing. I hate to break it down to many of you in this thread, but these "fake" "Illegal" states you guys call (croatia, bosnia, macedonia, kosova, and slovenia) from Yugoslavia, let me ask you is serbia the only "NATURAL" state in the region? It is non-sense. You can get historic accounts from turkish, serbian, and Roman accounts of Albanians being present in those regions. It has been documented.
As for Albanians being from the region of "Armenia," well to be honest, there has been propaganda from greek and serbian scholars about that, but yet your academic person Mr. Cubrilovic stated himself that Albanians are tied to their motherland in that case the discussion was about Kosova. So let me tell you, the maps from the ottoman empire show the ethnic lines before and after the empire. It is clear that Albanians inhabitet this land, but remember there is no such thing as 100% of an ethnic group in one place.
Why didn't you also put the words of President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"?
He SAID that; and this is for the first time a High Level Greek Authority says it publicly.
The fact is whether Serbia wants to join the EU right now is kinda irrelevant. To move forward economically maybe the EU would be good but we need to worry about moving forward economically alone at first because just like the NGO few days ago said, we will not join before 2021. That being said to just form governments and to kinda sit and wait for the EU to arrive is just wasting time. We need to erase the EU out of our minds and just move forward economically in a positive, progressive and independent manner. This is how we can regain Kosovo since the economy there will never get better and Serbia can invest into the Serbian, Gorani, Roma enclaves in that is spread throughout the land. And then once we have taken the next step and we are ready for some "special" European standard then we contemplate joining the EU until we need to focus on Serbia, not the European Union.
Even if a Pro-EU government is formed, Serbia cannot join the EU until the Lisbon Treaty comes into force. This may take some time. Therefore, the door of the EU is closed for Croatia,Macedonia,Bosnia,
Kosovo,Montenegro and Serbia.
Thanks for this important news. This shows again the tendency of B92 to manipulate the news. B92 will only lose credibility this way. It is a way to hide bad news and bring possibly only good news to maintain a dreamlike virtual world, which at one point is destined to collapse. What is the point of doing it?
B92 publish this constructive comment, don't censure it.
Your land, my land - wah, wah, wah!
My family had several thousand acres in New York state in the 1700's. After yje US revolution they were kicked out. By Albanian reasoning, I should have all this land back or several hundred million dollars in compensation from the US government.
Sorry, it will never happen. Be happy with what you have. It's 2008 and you have no claim to earlier dynasties.
“….Albanian land ……. entire Balkan…… We are PARTIALY consoled by returnig (Kosovo).”
I respect and admire your honesty. Much better to say it as it is. I’m fad up with all this propaganda about human rights, genocide and similar nonsense. You are fighting for the land, Kosovo is just beginning, you want much more.
The Kosovo UDI will set a precedent to other countries with separatist problems.The WEST ignorance to international law and bypasing the UN will further create frozen conflicts.
Serbian Leaders were/are terrible and by their wrongdoing they lost Kosovo long before - that's reality.
But Kosovo Albanians never did anything good too and don't have resources, knowledge and history to deserve this US gift.
Serbia will never get the grasp until the new world/regional war - not expected during our life time.Kosovo will take long time to start as separate, real country - also won't happen in our life time.
So, it will be terrible and frozen life for all people of Kosovo (Serbs, Albanians and other)and I don't know honestly what should be the best solution - partition (already reality on the ground) with outside supervision and troops forever (not good for other part of Kosovo and all their population -also reality on the ground.
A nice positive message coming from Vienna. Let's hope that with the change in tone, there will also be a change in focus & a restoration of balance to the problems in the region.
PRN:
Pro-nazi regime in Albania during WWII also shared your dreams of a 'greater Albania'.
And do you really think you can enhance your 'credibility' by the self-generation of multiple recommendations? All you're doing is discrediting yourself.
Olf:
> Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end.
If this is what you believe, then does not surprise me that you find 'PRN' credible.
Joe:
Greeks & russians - yes.. but austrians? The closing line of the article is:
> It was now up to the EU to support that government, said the two officials.
While this is just rhetoric like the rest of it, may also be indicative of a new 'stance' on the part of Western Europe towards the serbs given a new pro-EU govt.
"You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure"
Hmmm... I wouldnt say blonde, but other than that, we are at the same page :)
P.S. Dont get upset that easily. Besides, my post didnt have that much bad intentions, it could have been much worse, ask the fyromians if you dont believe me :)
Well, i hate to interrupt his "love-fest" but... today is our independence day, and so, i must send best wishes to free and independent people around the world. believe it or not, there is enough space for all of us to live free and decent lives, if we can cooperate rather than constantly killing each other or planning the next war. i say this in regards to my own govt, as i say it to the above posters, and to all the countries of the balkans.
it is true that i am partisan and have strongly supported kosovar independence, but i continue to support the independence and freedom of all people. when one group is miserable, it is hard for surrounding groups to be happy.
compromise is not a dirty word. it doesn't mean we have to accept some phony-baloney "more than autonomy but less than independence", but it does mean that we need to do more listening to each other, and less screaming. and needless to say, the hate speech ("i'm not going to mention organ stealing...) doesn't help. hate is so very easy, esp. in the balkans, but what has it solved so far??
yes, i do preach a bit, but then if you don't like it, you don't have to read my postings :)
We Albanians are poor, dirty, mad, filthy, crazy, what else not? Aliens, inhuman!
You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure, what else not?
All grandsons of Aristotle and Plato dude.
Are you happy with this?
Is this what you want to say? So have fun - enjoy.
Thank you. You are such a kind Greek - such a common God's birth.
You are in the same page I mentioned - but I talked on logical negation. Be happy
to find your page now.
I come from the principality of Yorkshire in the UK and my question is this.
Having read the multiple comments from the posters from all the ethnic groups in this argument, how do I put forward the position of my people?
In the last 1000 years we have been invaded by Vikings, Danes, Saxons, Normans, Brigantes, Mercians and people from London.
This has clearly scarred our collective psyche so when do we start whining about stuff that happened 100's of years ago?
I think that you guys are going to have to draw a line under the past and start again.
The K-Albs have their own place now so start living like a modern nation. The Serbs don't want the Alb's so stop moaning that that you don't want to give up the thing that you don't like anyway.
I think that Papoulias had a positive approche to the Kosovo UDI, based to the Greek and Albanian media.
Hellenes Abroad NewsSend | >>Talks with Chancellor Kusenbauer
Vienna, 04.07.2008
Addressing reporters earlier, during a joint press conference with Austrian Federal Chancellor Alfred Kusenbauer after their talks, Papoulias expressed “sorrow over the intransigent, almost hostile” stance adopted by the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) towards Greece.
“Greece, unfortunately, is on the receiving end of an unfounded irredentism, a hostile irredentism … despite the fact that in the Interim Agreement it was agreed that there should be a mutually acceptable name.”
Greece and FYROM signed an UN-brokered Interim Agreement in 1995, while Papoulias signed the document on behalf of the Greek side, as he was serving as foreign minister at the time.
Regarding Kosovo, the Greek president said Greece was following developments “with exceptional attention, considering that it is an extremely sensitive issue.”
The two men also agreed over their support to the European prospects of western Balkan states.
Greeks and Russians were always unconditional supportes of the Serbs, so they would label anything not entirely favorable to them as "mistakes". For this reason statements coming from them - in this case from this greek president - can not be taken seriously.
Nice one PRN. You made a great comment, just on time to refresh memories of those that use them. Justice got here finally but late for millions of Albanians..
Jovan-"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
Jovan, Albanians is written with capital “A” and you don’t need to be so funny and undermine yourself with such a comment.
“last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.”
Jovan, I certainly hope so. Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end. That is what all the Europeans are hoping too.
THis is an interesting thing. I hate to break it down to many of you in this thread, but these "fake" "Illegal" states you guys call (croatia, bosnia, macedonia, kosova, and slovenia) from Yugoslavia, let me ask you is serbia the only "NATURAL" state in the region? It is non-sense. You can get historic accounts from turkish, serbian, and Roman accounts of Albanians being present in those regions. It has been documented.
As for Albanians being from the region of "Armenia," well to be honest, there has been propaganda from greek and serbian scholars about that, but yet your academic person Mr. Cubrilovic stated himself that Albanians are tied to their motherland in that case the discussion was about Kosova. So let me tell you, the maps from the ottoman empire show the ethnic lines before and after the empire. It is clear that Albanians inhabitet this land, but remember there is no such thing as 100% of an ethnic group in one place.
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.(Jovan, 4 July 2008 14:19)
what are you talking about, Jovan? the land, which belong to individual Serbs in Kosovo, it may be theirs forever. but a state does not belong to an ethnic group forever. even Serbs were not always there, where they are now - and this fact should give you to think, how it came like that.
concerning Serbia joining the EU: 2017 was always a realistic year for to be the earliest date. at the moment it is less the Treaty of Lisbon but Serbia itself, which shifts this date more into the future. the country better cares for to get fit economically to compete with present time and to become politically stable in future. then start to think about the EU.
I am not getting it. If only 1% is true we should get one inventor, athlete, artist or any peace of art and culture from you. All we can see:geometrical progresion in natality, bessa and high walls around houses(I won't touch huge influence in modern narco projects, medical - organs transplants etc.)
Please elaborate.
Jovan: "your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
It is rediculous to claim some land to be inherently "Serbian", "Albanian" or whatever. Practically all territories in the world were under different rules, often with different ethnic compositions during the different historical ages. Many ethnic groups inhabited only small territories and expanded, others lost much of their original homelands. Borders are product of wars, negotiations and treaties.
Serbia too, started its nodern existance within borders that left out more than half of tha total Serbian population on the Balkans. But Serbia expanded four times (1835, 1878, 1913, 1918) while Albania is still within its original borders, that compared with the areas populated by Albanians resembles the original Serbian borders compared with ares populated mainly by Serbs.
Obviously the Serbs were much more succesful in the territorial scrumble.
Both sodes have to realize that the age of land grabs is over in much of the world, and must end in the Balkans too.
Serbia had a very strong case for keeping Kosovo under its formal sovereignity but gambled it away in the wars in Croatia and Bosnia, when they supported the principle of ethnic selfdetermination and tried to sever chunks of those countries, often trying to ethnicly cleans them so that the territorial revision become final. The wars were lost, Serbs were ethnically cleansed, the international reputation of Serbia deteriorated, key traditional Serbian alies turned into enemies, Serbian citizens were placed under a humiliating visa curtain!
Dear mr PRN
can you please let me know what do you mean when you say that albanian land was chopped into pieces and which are these pieces?I wonder what kind of history they teach you in Albania or there in not such lesson as history in school?How do you explain that from all the countries in the region Albania and the areas that albanians live are the poorest?
it´s almost unbelievable that some albanian kids can still write about serbian territory being "their" land without being deleted!
PRN, I am convinced that you really believe what you have written, but that doesn´t change a bit... you´re simply wrong. mislead by your propaganda-masters...
"your land" is in the albanian mountains, where you originally come from!
last but not least, don´t worry, justice will prevail and Serbia will re-integrate what is serbian by history, culture, heritage, truth and moral.
Unfortunately the Greek president is right and him with the rest of western europe realize that very late.
Europe allowed the irresponsible policy of the USA to be loaded on her shoulder.
They destroyed Yugoslavia and they created artificial states that could only offer instability and criminallity to Europe, with no future. Countries like Bosnia, Kossovo, Montenegro, Fyrom and others are artificially made, and of course can never offer anything else to Europe rather than instabillity and organized crime and of course they could not survive in the future.
The americans just wanted to separate Yugoslavia into little artificial puppet-states like the above, so they can weaken and control Europe, having her as hostage to their own will.
Unfortunately Europe realizes that now. Of course there is always time to correct things, at least some of them. The initiative taken by Spain and Greece into the EU, to prevent in any possible way the reckognition of the illegal state of Kossovo could lead to serious result, considering the help of Russia.
Kossovo, will be never be reckognised as a country by the international organizations. It will never be a member of the UN. It will never be a member of the World Trade Organization (so inports - exports cannot be done, vital to the survival of any country). It will never actually operate as a normal country, no matter how many countries reckognise it in billateral agreements. This is something that will be done. Let's see for how long the EU will manage to have fake-artificial state entities onto her shoulders..
Lol... With a lot of respect to your people and your origins, and even more respect to the neighbouring peoples and with even more respect to history itself, but in any case with loads of doubts about your actual origins (which very recent studies and scientific proof have shown to be of the Kaspian area and you have nothing to do with Illyrians, which by the way were nothing exeptional anyway), I would grand you as your "ancestral lands" only the - today's - districts of Elbasan and Berat as albanian homeland.
Other than that, it is a wild wild dream that not even most of your scholars believe in any more.
Now the rest is only for preserving your nationalistic feelings and irredentism, as it is known all over Europe and the rest of the civilised world that you are the "land beggars" of the Blakans of today :)
We have to realize that there are the people of Europe and European politicians. The majority of the first group, especially the ones who live in EU countries, understand and support Serbia, the Serbs and the Kosovo Serbs. The second group, also especially the ones from various (not all) EU countries, are a bunch of idiots that were extremely naive and because of a lack of historic knowledge innitially could not and later did not want to see what the US policy was doing. Of course there were many US lackies who played along well and have been rewarded. The EU has to ask itself if it still serves the people from the EU (answer NO) and whether the EU desires to become the newest state of the US (answer YES if the policies of the past 20 years will continue). (Radical) Islam is the biggest threat to Europe's future and stability (beside from US anti-Europe policies). Stop subsidizing big Islamic families, stop immigration from the Middle East and Northern Africa, stop allowing minorities who have no interest to accept European values to hijack our societies more and more. What happened in Kosovo is a glimpse into the future of other places in Europe. And we cannot say that we did not know. I would advice Serbia and the Serbian people to stay out of the EU trap and as far as I am concerned Turkey and especially Kosovo will NEVER become EU members. I have nothing against the people from these countries. I just want them to stay where the are and I do not like to be a minority in my own country. Fortunately the Irish saved us and in many EU countries similar feelings are among the majority of people.
Well, i hate to interrupt his "love-fest" but... today is our independence day, and so, i must send best wishes to free and independent people around the world. believe it or not, there is enough space for all of us to live free and decent lives, if we can cooperate rather than constantly killing each other or planning the next war. i say this in regards to my own govt, as i say it to the above posters, and to all the countries of the balkans.
it is true that i am partisan and have strongly supported kosovar independence, but i continue to support the independence and freedom of all people. when one group is miserable, it is hard for surrounding groups to be happy.
compromise is not a dirty word. it doesn't mean we have to accept some phony-baloney "more than autonomy but less than independence", but it does mean that we need to do more listening to each other, and less screaming. and needless to say, the hate speech ("i'm not going to mention organ stealing...) doesn't help. hate is so very easy, esp. in the balkans, but what has it solved so far??
yes, i do preach a bit, but then if you don't like it, you don't have to read my postings :)
Why didn't you also put the words of President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"?
He SAID that; and this is for the first time a High Level Greek Authority says it publicly.
Some of these messages are very meaningful in respect of Kosovo as no precedent in international relations. Why the EU is so hypocritically silent about the real Pandora-box so open? The only result of the recognition of the Kosovo's independence is the beginning of the construction of a new Greater Albania, to prejudice of Serbia, Montenegro, Macedonia, Greece, as in the second world war thanks to the Italians and the Germans. This is the madness of the EU today.
Would that be the one where 1 million armenians 'fell down the stairs' by themselves and died? Or the one that means a turkish nobel prize laureat of literature has to go to America to avoid assassination?
Yep, the Ottoman Empire was a dream come true for all the non-moslems for a good 500 years. They never had it so good. Janissaries, skull towers, slavery. Now that IS and unforgettable freedom.
With hindsight, the Serbs would have been much smarter not to oppose the Ottomans in which case they probably would have taken Vienna and a good half of Europe.
Along with standing up to the Nazis in 1941 (the Serb people, not its government) and thus delaying the invasion of the Soviet Union by a month and standing up to the Austro-Hungarian Empire in 1914, I hope the Serbs stop protecting the rest of Europe with their lives. In all these cases it clearly wasn't worth it.
Thanks for this important news. This shows again the tendency of B92 to manipulate the news. B92 will only lose credibility this way. It is a way to hide bad news and bring possibly only good news to maintain a dreamlike virtual world, which at one point is destined to collapse. What is the point of doing it?
B92 publish this constructive comment, don't censure it.
The ones from my countrymen (greeks) who think that USA/Russia are the bad guys, while the good europe is the nice warm and loving mama, are at least delusional.
Where was the good mama when her child got bombed?
Exactly, she threw some bombs more.
"The Greek president pointed out that both the U.S. and Russia had an interest in the Balkans, adding that “Europe has made big mistakes in the Balkans.”
Here I have to ste :
1. Two days ago the same thing in a less diplomatic form said our Miniputin. And this is just a common thing that EU members realize well but do not dare to say aloud. They made much more of vital mistakes and are demoralized today. Look how good behaved himself their main Masson Maestro J.M.Barroso while in Russia !
2. The quality of Russian and American interests here is essentially different ! The US is interested mostly in exporting problems to Europe and thus being involved in the Continental affairs. While Russia to my private regret follows mostly economical targets. Sure as the leader of the anti-American majority of the world we are interested to settle down the situation on the Balkanes to withdraw the American precence here but I hate the cautious way we do it.
“….Albanian land ……. entire Balkan…… We are PARTIALY consoled by returnig (Kosovo).”
I respect and admire your honesty. Much better to say it as it is. I’m fad up with all this propaganda about human rights, genocide and similar nonsense. You are fighting for the land, Kosovo is just beginning, you want much more.
The Kosovo UDI will set a precedent to other countries with separatist problems.The WEST ignorance to international law and bypasing the UN will further create frozen conflicts.
Serbian Leaders were/are terrible and by their wrongdoing they lost Kosovo long before - that's reality.
But Kosovo Albanians never did anything good too and don't have resources, knowledge and history to deserve this US gift.
Serbia will never get the grasp until the new world/regional war - not expected during our life time.Kosovo will take long time to start as separate, real country - also won't happen in our life time.
So, it will be terrible and frozen life for all people of Kosovo (Serbs, Albanians and other)and I don't know honestly what should be the best solution - partition (already reality on the ground) with outside supervision and troops forever (not good for other part of Kosovo and all their population -also reality on the ground.
I think that Papoulias had a positive approche to the Kosovo UDI, based to the Greek and Albanian media.
Hellenes Abroad NewsSend | >>Talks with Chancellor Kusenbauer
Vienna, 04.07.2008
Addressing reporters earlier, during a joint press conference with Austrian Federal Chancellor Alfred Kusenbauer after their talks, Papoulias expressed “sorrow over the intransigent, almost hostile” stance adopted by the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) towards Greece.
“Greece, unfortunately, is on the receiving end of an unfounded irredentism, a hostile irredentism … despite the fact that in the Interim Agreement it was agreed that there should be a mutually acceptable name.”
Greece and FYROM signed an UN-brokered Interim Agreement in 1995, while Papoulias signed the document on behalf of the Greek side, as he was serving as foreign minister at the time.
Regarding Kosovo, the Greek president said Greece was following developments “with exceptional attention, considering that it is an extremely sensitive issue.”
The two men also agreed over their support to the European prospects of western Balkan states.
"President Papulias saying " We are moving slowly towards the recognition on Kosovo's Independence declaration"? "
I am still trying to find this phrase or any relevant phrase of Papoulias in his speeches in Austria.
What comes in my mind is the usual tactic of the albanians to put words in other peoples mouths just to satisfy the lack of support to their UDI.
It is like those other announcements of Greek officials that they will recognise Kossovo bythe end of the month, or that a Kossovian embassy will open next month in Athens, or that Christoforos Colombos is albanian and that albanians were on the moon before the americans.
We Albanians are poor, dirty, mad, filthy, crazy, what else not? Aliens, inhuman!
You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure, what else not?
All grandsons of Aristotle and Plato dude.
Are you happy with this?
Is this what you want to say? So have fun - enjoy.
"You Greeks are so nice, clean, blonde, rich, handsome, pure"
Hmmm... I wouldnt say blonde, but other than that, we are at the same page :)
P.S. Dont get upset that easily. Besides, my post didnt have that much bad intentions, it could have been much worse, ask the fyromians if you dont believe me :)
Thank you. You are such a kind Greek - such a common God's birth.
You are in the same page I mentioned - but I talked on logical negation. Be happy
to find your page now.
I come from the principality of Yorkshire in the UK and my question is this.
Having read the multiple comments from the posters from all the ethnic groups in this argument, how do I put forward the position of my people?
In the last 1000 years we have been invaded by Vikings, Danes, Saxons, Normans, Brigantes, Mercians and people from London.
This has clearly scarred our collective psyche so when do we start whining about stuff that happened 100's of years ago?
I think that you guys are going to have to draw a line under the past and start again.
The K-Albs have their own place now so start living like a modern nation. The Serbs don't want the Alb's so stop moaning that that you don't want to give up the thing that you don't like anyway.
Even if a Pro-EU government is formed, Serbia cannot join the EU until the Lisbon Treaty comes into force. This may take some time. Therefore, the door of the EU is closed for Croatia,Macedonia,Bosnia,
Kosovo,Montenegro and Serbia.
Please tell me how can you do such things ? First you offer to rely on Turkish sources as the most objective ones ! But we all know that the Turks has never lost their Ottoman mentality and they are never expected to write something positive of the Serbs.
Next thing I'd like you to explain here is how did you managed to obtain 23 recomendations for your funny stastements during 15 minutes after your joke has been positioned here ?
Your land, my land - wah, wah, wah!
My family had several thousand acres in New York state in the 1700's. After yje US revolution they were kicked out. By Albanian reasoning, I should have all this land back or several hundred million dollars in compensation from the US government.
Sorry, it will never happen. Be happy with what you have. It's 2008 and you have no claim to earlier dynasties.
The fact is whether Serbia wants to join the EU right now is kinda irrelevant. To move forward economically maybe the EU would be good but we need to worry about moving forward economically alone at first because just like the NGO few days ago said, we will not join before 2021. That being said to just form governments and to kinda sit and wait for the EU to arrive is just wasting time. We need to erase the EU out of our minds and just move forward economically in a positive, progressive and independent manner. This is how we can regain Kosovo since the economy there will never get better and Serbia can invest into the Serbian, Gorani, Roma enclaves in that is spread throughout the land. And then once we have taken the next step and we are ready for some "special" European standard then we contemplate joining the EU until we need to focus on Serbia, not the European Union.
A nice positive message coming from Vienna. Let's hope that with the change in tone, there will also be a change in focus & a restoration of balance to the problems in the region.
PRN:
Pro-nazi regime in Albania during WWII also shared your dreams of a 'greater Albania'.
And do you really think you can enhance your 'credibility' by the self-generation of multiple recommendations? All you're doing is discrediting yourself.
Olf:
> Serbian occupation of Europe should come to an end.
If this is what you believe, then does not surprise me that you find 'PRN' credible.
Joe:
Greeks & russians - yes.. but austrians? The closing line of the article is:
> It was now up to the EU to support that government, said the two officials.
While this is just rhetoric like the rest of it, may also be indicative of a new 'stance' on the part of Western Europe towards the serbs given a new pro-EU govt.
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