“Independence cannot be revoked”

What utter nonsense. It can easily be revoked. I fully expect some friendly countries such as Czech Republic and Poland to revoke, or unrecognize, the fake, illegal, and immoral state of Kosovo once they have a change in governments. It can be done quite easily Mr. Rohan, with the stroke of a pen, and you know it. I have no idea what you are blathering about. Just wait and watch, this will happen. Just as easy as an individual country can recognize, it can unrecognize. The UN, well they will never, read my lips, NEVER, recognize Kosovo. Thank you Russia.

Cheers!!

In 1941 many Germans must have had similar thoughts: The defeat of the Third Reich would be “impossible.”

Today the Americans and the EU have vastly inflated views of their military and financial strength.

The Americans and the EU are sinking into a financial cesspool of their own making. And their military prowess has been exposed to be a sham in Iraq, Afghanistan and earlier in Serbia.

The reunification of Serbia is inevitable. All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power. Rohan believes this will never happen. I am more optimistic and believe that things will change very quickly.

There is nothing to revoke because nothing was granted.

Just ask the Security Council and they'll tell you.

It doesn't need to be revoked because it never legitimately happened. At the moment, Kosovo still legally remains part of Serbia, therefore there absolutely needs to be new discussions about how things are going to work on the ground. The UN knows this, which is why there are suddenly ideas about partition etc. and placating Belgrade creeping into reports.

That is quite amusing. Independence is blocked so it does not need to be revoked.

Just ask the EU who are at the UN begging to be let in! Sorry, but the sign on the door reads "closed" and that cannot be revoked!

But hey, keep telling the Albanians, they seem to love stories.

Albert Rohan!! Please get to your senses because there is nothing to revoked because independence were NEVER granted to kosovo and As per the UN Kosovo is part of Serbia and that is the reality.. tell this to your master George W. Bush

Kate, (you said “never legitimately happened”)

I can’t really believe that some of you still believe that only “UN” can grant independence to the country! I would like to clarify some things: UN is just an organization created by the countries, and not vica-versa (meaning UN does not create countries), even though Kosova would like to become e member because of the benefices, but as stated several times before, it is not necessary (example Switzerland became a UN member only in 2002, Germany 1973 etc etc). So, you should put a question whether will Kosova become UN member or not! That’s all what UN can do, to accept Kosovas application for membership or to reject it.
Reality is that Kosova, de facto and de jure is independent country.

I can’t really believe that some of you still believe that only “UN” can grant independence to the country!
(predictor, 12 June 2008 13:23)
--
You are right, there are two places where independence can be granted. One is at the UN and the other in Disneyland.

There really isn't a problem with the Albanians pretending to be independent. If that stops them burning churches and behaving, then I'm all for it.

Dear Micheal Thomas, keep waiting.
In the meantime Belgrade should cope with the possible autonomy/independence of Vojvodina, Sandzak and Presevo valley.

Dear Kate, there is nothing illegal about the achieved Kosovo's independence. I wonder if you think that Belgrade could rule again there. What is illegal is the protection granted to Karadzic and Mladic. The ICTY is still waiting for them to be sent over.

neither can the de facto partition at the Ibar

Tymi - Interesting that you seem to follow the current media line that anyone who opposes independence must be Serbian or 'pro Serb'.

I am pro international security and law which took many decades (and wars) to put in place and is now being trampled on by various parties with their own agendas.

"Stop hangin on international laws, which Serbia broke years ago."

Why ones exactly, Tymi? And what of the complete disregard of law by Nato when it attacked Serbia?

"It is correct what is not recognised can not be revoked. This is valid for those countries who do not have recognised the independence yet. For the rest - on my opinion the most important one, the independence can´t be revoked."

Just because any number of nations recognise a Unilateral Declaration of Independence of a province by one ethnic group, it does not make it so. Regardless of whether you deem them 'important', or how many of them jump on the bandwagon, only the UN via the Security Council has the right to make such a decision. And the sovereign nation has to be involved in the process.

"It is the right time for all the Serbs to consider Albanians in Kosovo as owner of the terrritory together with rest."

You can't 'own' anything without a legal right. Of course they have a right to self governance but not independence.

"Stop divide the territory from people."

But isn't the attempt to prise Kosovo away from the rest of Serbia doing just that?!

"Stop dreaming old fashion and dangerous legends "where are Serbs there is Serbia""

This is the most ludicrous statement (have you heard of the idea of 'Greater Albania'?) - the whole argument of using a majority ethnic group to annex Serbian territory is based on the numbers of people living there! You can hardly accuse in the other direction.

I am participating from time to time to this forum and I am wondering more and more how naive the majority of the Serbian and pro-Serbian participants is. Either they are not able to recognise the reality or are suffering of political daltonism.

Peggy! It is correct what is not recognised can not be revoked. This is valid for those countries who do not have recognised the independence yet. For the rest - on my opinion the most important one, the independence can´t be revoked.

It is the right time for all the Serbs to consider Albanians in Kosovo as owner of the terrritory together with rest. Stop hangin on international laws, which Serbia broke years ago. Stop divide the territory from people. Stop dreaming old fashion and dangerous legends "where are Serbs there is Serbia"

Michael you stated some great points but went a little too far I think with 'And their military prowess has been exposed to be a sham in Iraq, Afghanistan and earlier in Serbia.'

the military might is definitely not a sham.

But Kosovo is Serbia

So independence can't be revoked. Then Belgrade has to work hard to make sure Kosovo never gets independence.

Peggy,
Go ahead and ask the UNSC to make a statement that Kosovo Independence is illegal.
We will be waiting on your answer.

For all the semantic legalisms on both sides, the reality is clear. Kosovo is in no way independent since its states is maintained only through the threat of the use of NATO arms against Serbian reintegration. When and if Kosovo is able to defend itself, it will be independent regardless of legal wrangling. If Kosovo/Albania is not able to defend itself, the land will be reintegrated as soon as NATO/US looses interest or is unable to defend it. Let’s quit posturing and state the fact: a fourth Balkan War (or how ever you want to count it) is only a mater of time and can only be avoided with significant diplomatic effort from all sides. Since the Serbs are willing to continue negotiations, the chose of war or peace is in the hands of the Albanians. Good luck.

The Serbian argument does not have to be one of reality.

Reality comes from dreams - dreams like the ones the Albanians had of ethnically cleansing Serbs from Kosovo and making an essentially Albanian mono-ethnic state with the support of the EU and the US.

Art,

I can see the serbs here are in disarray but as Rohan said, there is no going back.

Some here have suggested that Kosova was not recognised by the UN (in fact it was not recognised by Russia and Serbia) and it doesn't need it simple. Kosova has the backing of most EU countries and mother USA which backs Kosova in the UN.

Kate!

I appreciate sincerely your contra-arguments to my opinion(s). I do not know you and I do not have the right to judge your political and historical abilities.

I whish you understand what I mean with political naivity. We are talking about a process which can not be revoked. You know that. Your arguments and similiar to yours, are not bringing any contribute to the dicsussion on the a.m. topic(s). You are only repeating several information already discussed here since 17th of February.

Albanians in Kosovo and beyond never devided territories from people. In all Serbian propaganda since 800 years Albanians didn´t exist in Kosovo. Therefore they have to be pushed out of this territory. In several occasions in the history - already documented by Serbs, they organised campaigns using military force to kick the Albanians out of Kosovo. The rest you can find in books and publications

"Independence cannot be revoked"

CORRECTION!!

Independence *CAN* be revoked!! Also, Independence can be stolen, manipulated, lied and cheated from whoever the US and EU feel like doing it to.

if I was pro-albanian I would say exactly the same, in order to create the impression of determination and irreversibility...but,

Mr.Rohan is talking nonsense, and Washington knows it.

UNSC 1244 instead is still there, and Washington knows it.

the K-albanians will adjust to the reality sooner or later, they just don´t know it yet.

Serbia will prevail. let´s just see what future brings...

The comment: All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power. brings to mind the early 90's Slobodan Milosevic's reaction to sanctions against Yugoslavia by saying that Serbia and Serbian people will eat grass and not give in to US and Europe's pressure to stop the oppression in Kosova. As far as I remember no Serb has eaten grass but Yugoslavia does not exist anymore and hopefully never will and Milosevic has signeg his defeat. Kosova was I repeat was part of Yugoslavia and then revoked the authonomy by Serbia (who is claiming that according to Serbian constitution Kososvo is part of Serbia, the constitution rewriten early 90's by Millosevic's government. While Kosovo was part of Serbia, treated very badly and was left the poorest part of Yugoslavia pusposly. Now Serbia and some of serbians judging from comments I am reading, are just embarrasing themselfs by thinking that the clock will be turned back. I am sorry to say (well i am not), but Kosova will never be Serbia.

Kosova is INDEPENDENT and can be revoked only if the majority of inhabitants of Kosova ask for that.

SP. The UNSC doesn't have to declare that Kosovo is not independent. They have to declare that it IS. So I will be waiting for that one.

Tymi, You want Serbia to stop deviding territories from people. This is a typical anti Serbs statement that only Albanians would make. Serbia has not taken any territories. On the contrary it's the Albanians who want to separate. How is this Serbia taking territories?

EA, You say that SC means Russia veto. Wrong, it means Russia and China veto. You know China will never approve it either.

Art, Your independence was not recognized by many, many more countries besides Serbia. You have about a third of the UN and that's it. How can you make such a ridiculous statement?

It's about time you started to see reality here. You don't have the numbers to be independent. Just becasue US and it's lackies have said yes, doesn't mean the rest of the world will.

You do need the majority to make it happen.

The reality is that the majority of the world is on Serbia's side. If you don't believe it, just take the number of countries in the world and minus the ones who are willing to go your way.
What's left will be clarly a majority of the world.

NOTHING TO REVOKE. NOTHING WAS GRANTED. How many more ways do you need to be told?

Just ask the Security Council and they'll tell you.
(Peggy, 12 June 2008 11:52)

That statement puts a smile in my face and do you know why?

Because for Serbian understanding of Security Council means Russia veto. That is one of the problem.
What about the will of overall majority of the Security Council?
Peggy answer me that. Russia can not block Kosova recognition for ever, it can only delay though to be very honest.

'the law' - sounds a bit too much like Judge Dredd!

Actually, I do understand the workings of the UN Security Council, General Assembly and Resolution 1244.

Despite your attempt to patronise I'm afraid that you have shown your own lack of understanding of procedure with your comment.

What's your own point? Rather than just being pompous perhaps you should express your own thoughts.

Kate, Kate
Rewriting international law again, I notice you have a tendency ot do that. If you read the charter of the UN specifically those dealing with the Security Council, chapters V,VI,VII,VIII you will not find any such authority. They do have to recommend membership of a state to the General Assembly for a vote on membership. But the UN recognizes states that are not members. I would recommend that you hire an attorney to represent you in legal matters and stick to giving biased opinions online.

Kosovans fully deserve what theyve got...its a done deal now, noone beleives that Kosovo will be back with Serbia, even most serbs themselves...now the best for Serbia would be to look forward and build good relationships with all its neighbours

Ok, so here is my 2 cents: from the ultra nationalist extremists there is just a basic lack of understanding about international law. they think if serbia, russia (and b92) don't officially recognize the independence of kosovo/a, then the independence does not exist. this is just a bizarre notion and has absolutely no basis in reality, except in their minds. as for most of the civilized world (and growing every week) the recognition is there. so, short of a complete global cataclysm-- which is always possible-- that ain't going to change, no matter how many temper tantrums the belgrade politicians throw, no matter how many ridiculous and condescending postings the extremists send in. yes, you're entitled to your opinions, vulgar as i may find them, but they don't revoke any of the recognitions, much less all of them.

the truth is this is not about international law, which belgrade, not to mention russia/soviet union, has consistently flaunted (and yes, the bush administration in iraq, as well.) during the 90s, what serbia did to and with the united nations forces and its decisions was an absolute and disgusting disgrace and mockery. now, suddenly, "democratic" serbia worships the UN (security council) so long as their trouble-making ally can block progress. it is a sickening spectacle.

but anyway, despite all of the problems, and hate against Kosovars, it is now a republic. we did declare and win independence, and while it might not be world-shattering, it was a great victory for human rights and for progress in the balkans, in the world. for all of our frnds and allies, thank you, i salute you!

roberto/frisco

" Russia can not block Kosova recognition for ever, it can only delay though to be very honest.
(EA, 12 June 2008 19:34) "

Russia can block as long as they want to. Its so easy, beliece me. They just veto. Again and again whenever the issue comes up in UN. And if you don't believe me, just ask the Taiwanese.

It seems that the US, UK, Some EU states & Albanians are continuing their fishing expedition to gather more countries to recognize the fake state of Kosovo. Well boys!! As long as you dont have Russia & China and other big states such as India, Brazil, Argentina, Spain, Greece , Ukraine, Kazakhstan and others . The UN aspiration of Kosovo is very much DEAD

Peggy,

Do you really think that Serbia will be allowed in the EU club without recognising Kosova independence first?

What will you say when the majority of the world's independent coutries will recognise Kosova's independence?

Let's be REALISTIC. Tell me one thing what is stopping Serbia exercising its "authority" of sovereignity in Kosova?

MichaelThomas wrote: " In 1941 many Germans must have had similar thoughts: The defeat of the Third Reich would be “impossible" The reunification of Serbia is inevitable. All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power."

Your model of thinking is understandable, but very dangerous.
Understandable, because we make predictions based on past experience.
The Serbian repeated experience was:
Standing up to a far superior force - heavi losses - miraculous victory - territorial expansion.

To fail to understand that such a developnments in the past were purely circumstantial and not the natural way the history works is very dangerous!

You know the saying: "Onec you get lucky, twice you gety lucky... the third time...!

The longer Serbs sit and wait for the tide to turn, the most expensive will be their return into the raks of the EUropean nations where they belong.

Anything is possible. What the person is saying is that "for us, it's a done deal." However, for Serbs and thier allies, it's not a done deal. Unforunately ,there will be no solution for many years. Nobody wants war, neither the Serbs nor the West.

I am participating from time to time to this forum and I am wondering more and more how naive the majority of the Serbian and pro-Serbian participants is. Either they are not able to recognise the reality or are suffering of political daltonism.

Peggy! It is correct what is not recognised can not be revoked. This is valid for those countries who do not have recognised the independence yet. For the rest - on my opinion the most important one, the independence can´t be revoked.

It is the right time for all the Serbs to consider Albanians in Kosovo as owner of the terrritory together with rest. Stop hangin on international laws, which Serbia broke years ago. Stop divide the territory from people. Stop dreaming old fashion and dangerous legends "where are Serbs there is Serbia"

Dear Micheal Thomas, keep waiting.
In the meantime Belgrade should cope with the possible autonomy/independence of Vojvodina, Sandzak and Presevo valley.

Dear Kate, there is nothing illegal about the achieved Kosovo's independence. I wonder if you think that Belgrade could rule again there. What is illegal is the protection granted to Karadzic and Mladic. The ICTY is still waiting for them to be sent over.

Kate, (you said “never legitimately happened”)

I can’t really believe that some of you still believe that only “UN” can grant independence to the country! I would like to clarify some things: UN is just an organization created by the countries, and not vica-versa (meaning UN does not create countries), even though Kosova would like to become e member because of the benefices, but as stated several times before, it is not necessary (example Switzerland became a UN member only in 2002, Germany 1973 etc etc). So, you should put a question whether will Kosova become UN member or not! That’s all what UN can do, to accept Kosovas application for membership or to reject it.
Reality is that Kosova, de facto and de jure is independent country.

What utter nonsense. It can easily be revoked. I fully expect some friendly countries such as Czech Republic and Poland to revoke, or unrecognize, the fake, illegal, and immoral state of Kosovo once they have a change in governments. It can be done quite easily Mr. Rohan, with the stroke of a pen, and you know it. I have no idea what you are blathering about. Just wait and watch, this will happen. Just as easy as an individual country can recognize, it can unrecognize. The UN, well they will never, read my lips, NEVER, recognize Kosovo. Thank you Russia.

Cheers!!

Art,

I can see the serbs here are in disarray but as Rohan said, there is no going back.

Some here have suggested that Kosova was not recognised by the UN (in fact it was not recognised by Russia and Serbia) and it doesn't need it simple. Kosova has the backing of most EU countries and mother USA which backs Kosova in the UN.

The comment: All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power. brings to mind the early 90's Slobodan Milosevic's reaction to sanctions against Yugoslavia by saying that Serbia and Serbian people will eat grass and not give in to US and Europe's pressure to stop the oppression in Kosova. As far as I remember no Serb has eaten grass but Yugoslavia does not exist anymore and hopefully never will and Milosevic has signeg his defeat. Kosova was I repeat was part of Yugoslavia and then revoked the authonomy by Serbia (who is claiming that according to Serbian constitution Kososvo is part of Serbia, the constitution rewriten early 90's by Millosevic's government. While Kosovo was part of Serbia, treated very badly and was left the poorest part of Yugoslavia pusposly. Now Serbia and some of serbians judging from comments I am reading, are just embarrasing themselfs by thinking that the clock will be turned back. I am sorry to say (well i am not), but Kosova will never be Serbia.

Kosovans fully deserve what theyve got...its a done deal now, noone beleives that Kosovo will be back with Serbia, even most serbs themselves...now the best for Serbia would be to look forward and build good relationships with all its neighbours

Kosova is INDEPENDENT and can be revoked only if the majority of inhabitants of Kosova ask for that.

In 1941 many Germans must have had similar thoughts: The defeat of the Third Reich would be “impossible.”

Today the Americans and the EU have vastly inflated views of their military and financial strength.

The Americans and the EU are sinking into a financial cesspool of their own making. And their military prowess has been exposed to be a sham in Iraq, Afghanistan and earlier in Serbia.

The reunification of Serbia is inevitable. All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power. Rohan believes this will never happen. I am more optimistic and believe that things will change very quickly.

Michael you stated some great points but went a little too far I think with 'And their military prowess has been exposed to be a sham in Iraq, Afghanistan and earlier in Serbia.'

the military might is definitely not a sham.

But Kosovo is Serbia

Kate!

I appreciate sincerely your contra-arguments to my opinion(s). I do not know you and I do not have the right to judge your political and historical abilities.

I whish you understand what I mean with political naivity. We are talking about a process which can not be revoked. You know that. Your arguments and similiar to yours, are not bringing any contribute to the dicsussion on the a.m. topic(s). You are only repeating several information already discussed here since 17th of February.

Albanians in Kosovo and beyond never devided territories from people. In all Serbian propaganda since 800 years Albanians didn´t exist in Kosovo. Therefore they have to be pushed out of this territory. In several occasions in the history - already documented by Serbs, they organised campaigns using military force to kick the Albanians out of Kosovo. The rest you can find in books and publications

Kate, Kate
Rewriting international law again, I notice you have a tendency ot do that. If you read the charter of the UN specifically those dealing with the Security Council, chapters V,VI,VII,VIII you will not find any such authority. They do have to recommend membership of a state to the General Assembly for a vote on membership. But the UN recognizes states that are not members. I would recommend that you hire an attorney to represent you in legal matters and stick to giving biased opinions online.

SP. The UNSC doesn't have to declare that Kosovo is not independent. They have to declare that it IS. So I will be waiting for that one.

Tymi, You want Serbia to stop deviding territories from people. This is a typical anti Serbs statement that only Albanians would make. Serbia has not taken any territories. On the contrary it's the Albanians who want to separate. How is this Serbia taking territories?

EA, You say that SC means Russia veto. Wrong, it means Russia and China veto. You know China will never approve it either.

Art, Your independence was not recognized by many, many more countries besides Serbia. You have about a third of the UN and that's it. How can you make such a ridiculous statement?

It's about time you started to see reality here. You don't have the numbers to be independent. Just becasue US and it's lackies have said yes, doesn't mean the rest of the world will.

You do need the majority to make it happen.

The reality is that the majority of the world is on Serbia's side. If you don't believe it, just take the number of countries in the world and minus the ones who are willing to go your way.
What's left will be clarly a majority of the world.

NOTHING TO REVOKE. NOTHING WAS GRANTED. How many more ways do you need to be told?

That is quite amusing. Independence is blocked so it does not need to be revoked.

Just ask the EU who are at the UN begging to be let in! Sorry, but the sign on the door reads "closed" and that cannot be revoked!

But hey, keep telling the Albanians, they seem to love stories.

Peggy,
Go ahead and ask the UNSC to make a statement that Kosovo Independence is illegal.
We will be waiting on your answer.

The Serbian argument does not have to be one of reality.

Reality comes from dreams - dreams like the ones the Albanians had of ethnically cleansing Serbs from Kosovo and making an essentially Albanian mono-ethnic state with the support of the EU and the US.

"Independence cannot be revoked"

CORRECTION!!

Independence *CAN* be revoked!! Also, Independence can be stolen, manipulated, lied and cheated from whoever the US and EU feel like doing it to.

For all the semantic legalisms on both sides, the reality is clear. Kosovo is in no way independent since its states is maintained only through the threat of the use of NATO arms against Serbian reintegration. When and if Kosovo is able to defend itself, it will be independent regardless of legal wrangling. If Kosovo/Albania is not able to defend itself, the land will be reintegrated as soon as NATO/US looses interest or is unable to defend it. Let’s quit posturing and state the fact: a fourth Balkan War (or how ever you want to count it) is only a mater of time and can only be avoided with significant diplomatic effort from all sides. Since the Serbs are willing to continue negotiations, the chose of war or peace is in the hands of the Albanians. Good luck.

'the law' - sounds a bit too much like Judge Dredd!

Actually, I do understand the workings of the UN Security Council, General Assembly and Resolution 1244.

Despite your attempt to patronise I'm afraid that you have shown your own lack of understanding of procedure with your comment.

What's your own point? Rather than just being pompous perhaps you should express your own thoughts.

" Russia can not block Kosova recognition for ever, it can only delay though to be very honest.
(EA, 12 June 2008 19:34) "

Russia can block as long as they want to. Its so easy, beliece me. They just veto. Again and again whenever the issue comes up in UN. And if you don't believe me, just ask the Taiwanese.

There is nothing to revoke because nothing was granted.

Just ask the Security Council and they'll tell you.

neither can the de facto partition at the Ibar

It doesn't need to be revoked because it never legitimately happened. At the moment, Kosovo still legally remains part of Serbia, therefore there absolutely needs to be new discussions about how things are going to work on the ground. The UN knows this, which is why there are suddenly ideas about partition etc. and placating Belgrade creeping into reports.

So independence can't be revoked. Then Belgrade has to work hard to make sure Kosovo never gets independence.

Albert Rohan!! Please get to your senses because there is nothing to revoked because independence were NEVER granted to kosovo and As per the UN Kosovo is part of Serbia and that is the reality.. tell this to your master George W. Bush

I can’t really believe that some of you still believe that only “UN” can grant independence to the country!
(predictor, 12 June 2008 13:23)
--
You are right, there are two places where independence can be granted. One is at the UN and the other in Disneyland.

There really isn't a problem with the Albanians pretending to be independent. If that stops them burning churches and behaving, then I'm all for it.

Tymi - Interesting that you seem to follow the current media line that anyone who opposes independence must be Serbian or 'pro Serb'.

I am pro international security and law which took many decades (and wars) to put in place and is now being trampled on by various parties with their own agendas.

"Stop hangin on international laws, which Serbia broke years ago."

Why ones exactly, Tymi? And what of the complete disregard of law by Nato when it attacked Serbia?

"It is correct what is not recognised can not be revoked. This is valid for those countries who do not have recognised the independence yet. For the rest - on my opinion the most important one, the independence can´t be revoked."

Just because any number of nations recognise a Unilateral Declaration of Independence of a province by one ethnic group, it does not make it so. Regardless of whether you deem them 'important', or how many of them jump on the bandwagon, only the UN via the Security Council has the right to make such a decision. And the sovereign nation has to be involved in the process.

"It is the right time for all the Serbs to consider Albanians in Kosovo as owner of the terrritory together with rest."

You can't 'own' anything without a legal right. Of course they have a right to self governance but not independence.

"Stop divide the territory from people."

But isn't the attempt to prise Kosovo away from the rest of Serbia doing just that?!

"Stop dreaming old fashion and dangerous legends "where are Serbs there is Serbia""

This is the most ludicrous statement (have you heard of the idea of 'Greater Albania'?) - the whole argument of using a majority ethnic group to annex Serbian territory is based on the numbers of people living there! You can hardly accuse in the other direction.

if I was pro-albanian I would say exactly the same, in order to create the impression of determination and irreversibility...but,

Mr.Rohan is talking nonsense, and Washington knows it.

UNSC 1244 instead is still there, and Washington knows it.

the K-albanians will adjust to the reality sooner or later, they just don´t know it yet.

Serbia will prevail. let´s just see what future brings...

Just ask the Security Council and they'll tell you.
(Peggy, 12 June 2008 11:52)

That statement puts a smile in my face and do you know why?

Because for Serbian understanding of Security Council means Russia veto. That is one of the problem.
What about the will of overall majority of the Security Council?
Peggy answer me that. Russia can not block Kosova recognition for ever, it can only delay though to be very honest.

Ok, so here is my 2 cents: from the ultra nationalist extremists there is just a basic lack of understanding about international law. they think if serbia, russia (and b92) don't officially recognize the independence of kosovo/a, then the independence does not exist. this is just a bizarre notion and has absolutely no basis in reality, except in their minds. as for most of the civilized world (and growing every week) the recognition is there. so, short of a complete global cataclysm-- which is always possible-- that ain't going to change, no matter how many temper tantrums the belgrade politicians throw, no matter how many ridiculous and condescending postings the extremists send in. yes, you're entitled to your opinions, vulgar as i may find them, but they don't revoke any of the recognitions, much less all of them.

the truth is this is not about international law, which belgrade, not to mention russia/soviet union, has consistently flaunted (and yes, the bush administration in iraq, as well.) during the 90s, what serbia did to and with the united nations forces and its decisions was an absolute and disgusting disgrace and mockery. now, suddenly, "democratic" serbia worships the UN (security council) so long as their trouble-making ally can block progress. it is a sickening spectacle.

but anyway, despite all of the problems, and hate against Kosovars, it is now a republic. we did declare and win independence, and while it might not be world-shattering, it was a great victory for human rights and for progress in the balkans, in the world. for all of our frnds and allies, thank you, i salute you!

roberto/frisco

Anything is possible. What the person is saying is that "for us, it's a done deal." However, for Serbs and thier allies, it's not a done deal. Unforunately ,there will be no solution for many years. Nobody wants war, neither the Serbs nor the West.

It seems that the US, UK, Some EU states & Albanians are continuing their fishing expedition to gather more countries to recognize the fake state of Kosovo. Well boys!! As long as you dont have Russia & China and other big states such as India, Brazil, Argentina, Spain, Greece , Ukraine, Kazakhstan and others . The UN aspiration of Kosovo is very much DEAD

Peggy,

Do you really think that Serbia will be allowed in the EU club without recognising Kosova independence first?

What will you say when the majority of the world's independent coutries will recognise Kosova's independence?

Let's be REALISTIC. Tell me one thing what is stopping Serbia exercising its "authority" of sovereignity in Kosova?

MichaelThomas wrote: " In 1941 many Germans must have had similar thoughts: The defeat of the Third Reich would be “impossible" The reunification of Serbia is inevitable. All Serbia needs to do is wait for the collapse of American and EU power."

Your model of thinking is understandable, but very dangerous.
Understandable, because we make predictions based on past experience.
The Serbian repeated experience was:
Standing up to a far superior force - heavi losses - miraculous victory - territorial expansion.

To fail to understand that such a developnments in the past were purely circumstantial and not the natural way the history works is very dangerous!

You know the saying: "Onec you get lucky, twice you gety lucky... the third time...!

The longer Serbs sit and wait for the tide to turn, the most expensive will be their return into the raks of the EUropean nations where they belong.